Brakes: Zees vs Guide Rs

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Brakes: Zees vs Guide Rs
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flag el-nombre
FL
Posted: Jul 3, 2015 at 13:23 Quote
I have Zees on on my current bike but have just put an order in for the new Capra which comes with the Guide Rs. I like the Zees although they've always seemed a little squishy but was wondering whether to swap them on to the new bike or just stick with the Guides. My old Avid Juicys were a bag of shit so I don't have the greatest confidence in the Sram brakes but most things I've heard (which isn't a lot to be honest) say they've got their shit together with the Guides. What do you guys reckon?
flag brianl
Posted: Jul 4, 2015 at 13:20 Quote
el-nombre wrote:
I have Zees on on my current bike but have just put an order in for the new Capra which comes with the Guide Rs. I like the Zees although they've always seemed a little squishy but was wondering whether to swap them on to the new bike or just stick with the Guides. My old Avid Juicys were a bag of shit so I don't have the greatest confidence in the Sram brakes but most things I've heard (which isn't a lot to be honest) say they've got their shit together with the Guides. What do you guys reckon?
My previous bike had XTs, my new bike came with Guide RS, so far they seem fine, in fact modulation is a bit better than the XTs, and power seems about equal. I haven't had it long enough to say anything about durability or maintenance yet though.
flag skerby
Posted: Jul 6, 2015 at 9:39 Quote
I have Guide RSC's. Best brake for the money IMO. They are a liittle squishy but there so strong that it doesn't really matter.

I've heard that the zee's have plastic pistons that occasionally fail.
flag TheRaven
Posted: Jul 6, 2015 at 10:39 Quote
el-nombre wrote:
I have Zees on on my current bike but have just put an order in for the new Capra which comes with the Guide Rs. I like the Zees although they've always seemed a little squishy but was wondering whether to swap them on to the new bike or just stick with the Guides. My old Avid Juicys were a bag of shit so I don't have the greatest confidence in the Sram brakes but most things I've heard (which isn't a lot to be honest) say they've got their shit together with the Guides. What do you guys reckon?

From my experience, it depends on what you like. I found the Zee's to be more powerful (haven't found anything more powerful than the Zee/Saint brakes actually), however they modulate very differently.

I've found that there are two schools of opinion on brakes and they both focus almost completely on feel, as opposed to actual power, despite both sides complaining about "power". There's the "hair trigger brake" school, and the "smooth, long-throw" school. The hair trigger guys will complain that Zee/Saint/XTR race have no power, while the smooth-brake lovers will complain that XT (trail) and XTR trail are too "On/Off". In reality they are simply noticing the difference in the modulation curve of the different brakes. Zee's will be more agreeable to the smooth operators, just like XTR race brakes. The Guide R's will please the hair-trigger guys, as they are most comparable to the XT (trail) and XTR trail brakesets. So that's what it comes down to...do you prefer to have less initial bite and use the full throw of your lever, or do you want your brakes to practically lock up when a stiff breeze blows at your bars?
flag Rusty-Russ
O+
Posted: Jul 6, 2015 at 11:31 Quote
Raven is spot on. I went from XT to Zee and really enjoy the modulation change. I can squarely put myself in the
smooth, long throw club, now that I know the difference. The Zees give you a powerful one finger pull with lots more lever throw. I think these brakes make me faster because I have better control of lockup and complete confidence.
flag skerby
Posted: Jul 6, 2015 at 18:47 Quote
Does anyone else feel like their guides are inconsistent? Mine have been actuating in pretty random lever locations recently. I had a set of juicy's that did this, maybe its a bad bleed?
flag The-White-CON
O+
Posted: Jul 15, 2015 at 9:14 Quote
The shimanos are always going to have a longer service life due to mineral oil being far less carrosive than dot fluid also has a higher boiling point so less fade. The pistons on the zee's arent plastic (that would melt) they are ceramic a much better material than the steel pistons on the guides. The only way to destroy them is to pull the lever with the pads out like any brake the pistons can come out, on the zees you are screwd becaus the ceramic pistons can get damaged forcing them back in whereas the steel pistons wont get damaged. Lets be real this probably wont happen to you. Overall the shimanos have way more tech in them vs the guides being a slightly master cylinder disign that gives them "unique" modulation. Who cares about that when basically everything else is unchanged old shit that hasnt changed since you had your old juciys same basic design. Oh wait the centerline rotor makes all things better.(still a one piece rotor)
flag nakos
Posted: Jul 16, 2015 at 7:06 Quote
I have only used Shimano brakes in the past few years, so I can't compare the SRAM Guide brakes to my XT/SLX brakes. However, I have heard great things about them. Many people have stated that the Guides are a huge improvement over many of SRAM's Avid and Juicy brakes, so that seems promising.

Although I don't know much about their breaking performance, another thing to keep in mind with the Guide brakes is cockpit layout. Since all of the Capra models use SRAM drivetrains and SRAM (Rockshox) dropper posts, the shifters and dropper post remotes come mounted directly on the brake lever. If you wanted to switch over to Shimano brakes you will need to get separate clamps for the shifters/dropper post, so instead of having just one clamp on each end of your bars you will now need to have two or three.

Not a huge deal either way, but if the Guide brakes live up to the hype I'd take a clean cockpit IMO.
flag clemsi
Posted: Jul 17, 2015 at 1:15 Quote
I've owned a Avid Juicy Seven, a Elixir 7, Shimano Saint 810 and now the actual Zee.
Juicy worked well, but the bleeding was pain in the ass; Elixir was aweful in every way.

I would say the saint 810 (on my freerider) is slightly better relating to modulation than the Zee (AM bike), but once I fell in love with the zee levers the old saint levers feel a bit odd. So I've swapped only the levers from saint to Zee but this combi leads to less modulation and the pressure point is also too close to the bar (for my taste).

Can anyone compare the Zee to the actual Saints?
flag TheRaven
Posted: Jul 19, 2015 at 18:30 Quote
clemsi wrote:
I've owned a Avid Juicy Seven, a Elixir 7, Shimano Saint 810 and now the actual Zee.
Juicy worked well, but the bleeding was pain in the ass; Elixir was aweful in every way.

I would say the saint 810 (on my freerider) is slightly better relating to modulation than the Zee (AM bike), but once I fell in love with the zee levers the old saint levers feel a bit odd. So I've swapped only the levers from saint to Zee but this combi leads to less modulation and the pressure point is also too close to the bar (for my taste).

Can anyone compare the Zee to the actual Saints?

Did you try the "remove the wheel and pump" method? I have the race XTRs which had a little too much free travel in the lever for my happiness (really it was just being fussy but they are XTRs so they need to be perfect in my mind), so I remove the wheel and give the lever two full, slow, pumps. That brings the friction point further up in the lever travel.
flag skerby
Posted: Jul 30, 2015 at 13:31 Quote
Properly bled my guides. Took a while to do this right, 50ml syringe is soo much better than a 5.

Brakes work like they did when they were new and its awesome!
flag nakos
Posted: Jul 31, 2015 at 8:36 Quote
skerby wrote:
Properly bled my guides. Took a while to do this right, 50ml syringe is soo much better than a 5.

Brakes work like they did when they were new and its awesome!

How did you manage to bleed brakes with only a 5ml syringe? lol
flag Grumposaur
Posted: Jul 31, 2015 at 9:23 Quote
I have a Capra AL1 with Guide R (thus not the RS) brakes. I still have them on the bike, although I already had some Zee's from my previous DH bike lying around. Before next trip I'm going to change at least the front brake, to see if they are better. But the fact that I used the Guide R throughout some trips to bike parks with various trail types/surfaces means that they are at least decent enough to stop me from directly switching them.

BTW Guide RS has different internals and should have more modulation and should have better performance.

My advice: I would first wait if you like them instead of ordering different brakes already.

Edit: just realised you also have the brakes already just like me haha....Madder
flag skerby
Posted: Aug 3, 2015 at 23:28 Quote
How did you manage to bleed brakes with only a 5ml syringe? lol[/Quote]

Have to refill the syringe a few times lol.
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