United KF22 - 22" Complete BMX opinion?

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United KF22 - 22" Complete BMX opinion?
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flag alexthekid
Posted: Aug 1, 2016 at 13:08 Quote
Looking at getting one of these. I'm now 30 and do get back / neck pain from time to time. Looks good!

I was gonna wait for the 2017 WTP Atlas to come out but it sounds like they're pretty much impossible to get hold in the UK.

But what are peoples opinions of the KF22? I'm very tempted but it's only just come out so opinions are scarce at the moment.

I'll be riding pump tracks, BMX tracks & trails - everything dirt basically.

Thanks
flag cmc4130
Posted: Aug 2, 2016 at 14:34 Quote
alexthekid wrote:
Looking at getting one of these. I'm now 30 and do get back / neck pain from time to time. Looks good!

I was gonna wait for the 2017 WTP Atlas to come out but it sounds like they're pretty much impossible to get hold in the UK.

But what are peoples opinions of the KF22? I'm very tempted but it's only just come out so opinions are scarce at the moment.

I'll be riding pump tracks, BMX tracks & trails - everything dirt basically.

Thanks

Here's a long thread about 22"s if you want to get more info.

22"s go here
http://bmxmuseum.com/forums/viewtopic.php?id=492296

Other companies have had 22"s out for a while. The KF22 looks great, except for the tires. You'll want to replace those with S&M Mainline 22" tires or Faction F22 tires.

Faction has been doing 22"s in the UK since 2008.
flag core-macneil-rider
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 4:38 Quote
alexthekid wrote:
Looking at getting one of these. I'm now 30 and do get back / neck pain from time to time. Looks good!

I was gonna wait for the 2017 WTP Atlas to come out but it sounds like they're pretty much impossible to get hold in the UK.

But what are peoples opinions of the KF22? I'm very tempted but it's only just come out so opinions are scarce at the moment.

I'll be riding pump tracks, BMX tracks & trails - everything dirt basically.

Thanks
the 22 inch thing seems cool except for the limited options on rims and tires. Personally I'd build a 24 inch s&m or buy a 24 inch complete just due to more rim and tire choices. Also seeing as hazard lites come in 24 inch models and that's a popular go to rim for bmx and odyssey is one of thew few companies still offering chrome rims, and chrome rims offer the best braking performance next to a surfaced rim.
flag BigDaddyRatt
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 8:24 Quote
Rim and tire options are definitely limited and it kinda blows but so far my Revenge wheels are holding up really well. On my phone so I can't post pics right now but check out my ATF I just built a few months ago. FBM has a 22" wheeled Steadfast frame that just came out...it's frickin' nice! Love my ATF but if that Steadfast was out...things probably would have went different. I'm 5'9", 44 this Friday, got the 21.625" top tube with a front load stem and 9" bars. By far the most stable and comfortable bike for my age and aging skills. Flows nice, not heavy by any means, still flickable, stable and pretty fast rolling. Ramblin' on...early day buzz...lol
flag cmc4130
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 13:37 Quote
BigDaddyRatt wrote:
Rim and tire options are definitely limited and it kinda blows but so far my Revenge wheels are holding up really well. On my phone so I can't post pics right now but check out my ATF I just built a few months ago. FBM has a 22" wheeled Steadfast frame that just came out...it's frickin' nice! Love my ATF but if that Steadfast was out...things probably would have went different. I'm 5'9", 44 this Friday, got the 21.625" top tube with a front load stem and 9" bars. By far the most stable and comfortable bike for my age and aging skills. Flows nice, not heavy by any means, still flickable, stable and pretty fast rolling. Ramblin' on...early day buzz...lol

Sounds great.

I personally think the "rim and tire choice" criticism is a little unfair or misplaced--yeah that was true back in 2008 when 22"s first came out and the tires were not good. But after S&M got into the game, there are two different S&M tires (park or dirt) and both in either slimmer or fatter. And the Faction F22 tires are out there as well. Plus the Revenge rims are excellent. So more choices might be cool, but I don't think it should hold anyone back if they're interested in 22"s.
; )
flag BigDaddyRatt
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 14:52 Quote
cmc4130 wrote:
BigDaddyRatt wrote:
Rim and tire options are definitely limited and it kinda blows but so far my Revenge wheels are holding up really well. On my phone so I can't post pics right now but check out my ATF I just built a few months ago. FBM has a 22" wheeled Steadfast frame that just came out...it's frickin' nice! Love my ATF but if that Steadfast was out...things probably would have went different. I'm 5'9", 44 this Friday, got the 21.625" top tube with a front load stem and 9" bars. By far the most stable and comfortable bike for my age and aging skills. Flows nice, not heavy by any means, still flickable, stable and pretty fast rolling. Ramblin' on...early day buzz...lol

Sounds great.

I personally think the "rim and tire choice" criticism is a little unfair or misplaced--yeah that was true back in 2008 when 22"s first came out and the tires were not good. But after S&M got into the game, there are two different S&M tires (park or dirt) and both in either slimmer or fatter. And the Faction F22 tires are out there as well. Plus the Revenge rims are excellent. So more choices might be cool, but I don't think it should hold anyone back if they're interested in 22"s.
; )

Nah...didn't hold me back at all. Not gonna lie, it's still a small concern. Not like I can run down to my lbs and pick up a tire or tube if I need it. Not sure of the S&M tires you're talking about...I got the Mainlines...think that's the only 22 they have and Faction is outta the country so pretty much double the price!
flag BigDaddyRatt
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 14:53 Quote
Happy to see FBM in the mix now though. Means more options and availability for 22's!
flag core-macneil-rider
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 16:10 Quote
BigDaddyRatt wrote:
cmc4130 wrote:
BigDaddyRatt wrote:
Rim and tire options are definitely limited and it kinda blows but so far my Revenge wheels are holding up really well. On my phone so I can't post pics right now but check out my ATF I just built a few months ago. FBM has a 22" wheeled Steadfast frame that just came out...it's frickin' nice! Love my ATF but if that Steadfast was out...things probably would have went different. I'm 5'9", 44 this Friday, got the 21.625" top tube with a front load stem and 9" bars. By far the most stable and comfortable bike for my age and aging skills. Flows nice, not heavy by any means, still flickable, stable and pretty fast rolling. Ramblin' on...early day buzz...lol

Sounds great.

I personally think the "rim and tire choice" criticism is a little unfair or misplaced--yeah that was true back in 2008 when 22"s first came out and the tires were not good. But after S&M got into the game, there are two different S&M tires (park or dirt) and both in either slimmer or fatter. And the Faction F22 tires are out there as well. Plus the Revenge rims are excellent. So more choices might be cool, but I don't think it should hold anyone back if they're interested in 22"s.
; )

Nah...didn't hold me back at all. Not gonna lie, it's still a small concern. Not like I can run down to my lbs and pick up a tire or tube if I need it. Not sure of the S&M tires you're talking about...I got the Mainlines...think that's the only 22 they have and Faction is outta the country so pretty much double the price!
you could use a regular 20 inch tube it's tricky but you can do it I ran an 18 inch tube in my 20 inch in a pinch on a street ride it worked for a good while too. Also the revenge rims may be good but there are better rims out there and for some people those revenge rims might not be enough and getting tires or replacements could take awhile if you have a crappy shop. I don't think it's an unfair criticism at all, also You can't deny that options are always good for the customer and 3 tires and a few rim options is pretty slim pickings.

Edit: whoops replied to the wrong person but either way still my thoughts on the matter. I'm sure I wouldn't have any issues with the revenge rims, but I'm picky about tires I also really like being able to run folding tires so I can always carry an extra on street missions.
flag BigDaddyRatt
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 16:26 Quote
So who's got one? Let's throw out some pics. Pretty sure there is a forum for it already...but while we're here why not. Anyone interested?
flag BigDaddyRatt
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 16:28 Quote
Ha...just realized it's four of us...lmfao. Oh well...post it if you got it!
flag cmc4130
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 20:58 Quote
BigDaddyRatt wrote:
cmc4130 wrote:
BigDaddyRatt wrote:
Rim and tire options are definitely limited and it kinda blows but so far my Revenge wheels are holding up really well. On my phone so I can't post pics right now but check out my ATF I just built a few months ago. FBM has a 22" wheeled Steadfast frame that just came out...it's frickin' nice! Love my ATF but if that Steadfast was out...things probably would have went different. I'm 5'9", 44 this Friday, got the 21.625" top tube with a front load stem and 9" bars. By far the most stable and comfortable bike for my age and aging skills. Flows nice, not heavy by any means, still flickable, stable and pretty fast rolling. Ramblin' on...early day buzz...lol

Sounds great.

I personally think the "rim and tire choice" criticism is a little unfair or misplaced--yeah that was true back in 2008 when 22"s first came out and the tires were not good. But after S&M got into the game, there are two different S&M tires (park or dirt) and both in either slimmer or fatter. And the Faction F22 tires are out there as well. Plus the Revenge rims are excellent. So more choices might be cool, but I don't think it should hold anyone back if they're interested in 22"s.
; )

Nah...didn't hold me back at all. Not gonna lie, it's still a small concern. Not like I can run down to my lbs and pick up a tire or tube if I need it. Not sure of the S&M tires you're talking about...I got the Mainlines...think that's the only 22 they have and Faction is outta the country so pretty much double the price!

Sorry, you're right. The S&M Speedball 22" tire is only in testing and is not actually available yet: https://bigandtallbmx.com/tag/22-sm-speedball-tires/
flag cmc4130
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 21:07 Quote
core-macneil-rider wrote:

Edit: whoops replied to the wrong person but either way still my thoughts on the matter. I'm sure I wouldn't have any issues with the revenge rims, but I'm picky about tires I also really like being able to run folding tires so I can always carry an extra on street missions.

yeah, i mean your point is correct. i guess it just feels unfair, because I was one of the first people to get a 22" in the USA and I've been trying to push and promote them since then. (I don't have a personal stake. i just think it's a great concept). so, whenever someone posts something to dampen enthusiasm, it's just kinda blah. but, yeah, you're right.

for example, if you go way back to this thread http://www.bmxboard.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=041335 you can see the haters . . . and me ("flavorzine") defending the concept.

Same over here: http://www.bikeguide.org/forum/index.php?topic=171835.0, you can see people kinda being haters in the beginning. "G" aka G-Sport George, who I do respect in general, unfortunately chimed in with some negative stuff. he's closely related to the R&D of Odyssey. and honestly i think his opinions are not neutral, because Sunday was trying to promote the Sunday Model C 24" (and Sunday is also related to Odyssey).

this is G-Sport back in 2011: "Isnt the problem that the tyres are all terrible? Until someone is prepared to invest in a mold and machine for a really good tyre then that isnt going to change. Hell it took years to get the tyre manufacturers to make the better machines for doing kevlar 20" tyres.
We were asked if we fancied doing 22" tyres and there was just no way to justify the costs on our side and even if we did the factories dont have the better machines for this size, its a catch 22, no decent tyres so poor take up, poor take up so no tyres... Its not like 29" where there are huge numbers of people used to spending lots of money and you can already make it on existing road bike equipment...
G." http://www.bikeguide.org/forum/index.php/topic,171835.msg3505827.html#msg3505827

i've been in the BMX world for way too long to let a good idea go unpromoted. certain companies (Odyssey) stood on the sidelines and were happy to watch 22"s die.

S&M wasn't. Moeller built a proto for himself and took some risks. I respect that.

So, if anyone is saying, well I'm not gonna ride 22"s until Odyssey buys in, well . . . screw that.
flag core-macneil-rider
Posted: Aug 16, 2016 at 21:12 Quote
cmc4130 wrote:
core-macneil-rider wrote:

Edit: whoops replied to the wrong person but either way still my thoughts on the matter. I'm sure I wouldn't have any issues with the revenge rims, but I'm picky about tires I also really like being able to run folding tires so I can always carry an extra on street missions.

yeah, i mean your point is correct. i guess it just feels unfair, because I was one of the first people to get a 22" in the USA and I've been trying to push and promote them since then. (I don't have a personal stake. i just think it's a great concept). so, whenever someone posts something to dampen enthusiasm, it's just kinda blah. but, yeah, you're right.

for example, if you go way back to this thread http://www.bikeguide.org/forum/index.php?topic=171835.0, you can see people kinda being haters in the beginning. "G" aka G-Sport George, who I do respect in general, unfortunately chimed in with some negative stuff. he's closely related to the R&D of Odyssey. and honestly i think his opinions are not neutral, because Sunday was trying to promote the Sunday Model C 24" (and Sunday is also related to Odyssey).

this is G-Sport back in 2011: "Isnt the problem that the tyres are all terrible? Until someone is prepared to invest in a mold and machine for a really good tyre then that isnt going to change. Hell it took years to get the tyre manufacturers to make the better machines for doing kevlar 20" tyres.
We were asked if we fancied doing 22" tyres and there was just no way to justify the costs on our side and even if we did the factories dont have the better machines for this size, its a catch 22, no decent tyres so poor take up, poor take up so no tyres... Its not like 29" where there are huge numbers of people used to spending lots of money and you can already make it on existing road bike equipment...
G." http://www.bikeguide.org/forum/index.php/topic,171835.msg3505827.html#msg3505827

i've been in the BMX world for way too long and let a good idea go unpromoted. certain companies (Odyssey) stood on the sidelines and were happy to watch 22"s die.

S&M wasn't. Moeller built a proto for himself and took some risks. I respect that.

So, if anyone is saying, well I'm not gonna ride 22"s until Odyssey buys in, well . . . screw that.
oh trust I'm not saying I'm waiting for odyssey I prefer S&M to odyssey g sport or Sunday any day now odyssey and g sport do happen to make some products I really like, but I have the over hype on alot of their stuff personally if my specific rim choice was still around I'd recommend them all day to an odyssey rim cause it was better material better chrome same exact good design as a specific odyssey rim and was cheaper. I'm just not content with 3 tire choices and 2 rim choices however they do look interesting and I want to try one. Also what the f happened with folding tires in bmx I've seen like maybe 4 or 5 when every company used to have folding options.
flag alexthekid
Posted: Aug 19, 2016 at 6:53 Quote
Ok well i went with my gut and today i received my KF22 in the post.

Will build it up and post pics later Smile I'll get some mainline tyres and possibly some other extras as i go on. This bike is just for shredding pump tracks & trails - well as much as a 30 year old with a bad neck / back can do! I think i made the right decision ..we'll soon find out.
flag cmc4130
Posted: Aug 19, 2016 at 8:04 Quote
BigDaddyRatt wrote:
So who's got one? Let's throw out some pics. Pretty sure there is a forum for it already...but while we're here why not. Anyone interested?

I don't have a United KF22, but I have had several 22"s.

The first one was the Faction Zeitgeist back in Dec 2008. (Pictured here, on the right).
Unsecure image, only https images allowed: http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh138/upsetbmx/LiquidFeedback24andFactionZeitgeist22-CMC.jpg
Indust Cuatro 24" and Indust 2ton 22":
Unsecure image, only https images allowed: http://bmxmuseum.com/image/indust_cuatro_and_indust_2ton_blowup.jpg
Fly Micromachine flatland 20" next to STOUT SPF(custom) 22"
Unsecure image, only https images allowed: http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh138/upsetbmx/FLY-Micromachine20_STOUT-SPF22_zpsciyjptsx.jpg
Hoffman Taj next to STOUT:
Unsecure image, only https images allowed: http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh138/upsetbmx/STOUT22-and-96HoffmanTaj004_zpsc52632d4.jpg
Not a real 22", but this is what a 24" We The People Avenger looks like with 22" fork and 22" wheels:
Unsecure image, only https images allowed: http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh138/upsetbmx/WTP_Avenger_with_22inchwheels_and_Pitchfork002.jpg
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