Healthcare for the US

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Healthcare for the US
Author Message
flag haydendmorrison
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 5:43 Quote
Run properly, national health care is excellent. You can't have a country as affluent as the USA and have a huge number of poor people left without basic healthcare. It's fine for lots of people who have the money to pay but lots of people can't.

I'm not saying the UK's NHS is perfect because it really isn't. It's run badly and everyone complains about it but I'd rather have it than not. Plus there is always the option of private health care if you have the money.
flag gibson19
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 8:22 Quote
haydendmorrison wrote:
Run properly, national health care is excellent.

I'll agree... but I've never seen it run properly...
flag haydendmorrison
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 9:22 Quote
The UK's has been there when I've needed it but it's more politicians arguing about what to do on a bigger scale that makes badly run.

I don't know much about the US system but I'm guessing asthma and things like that would have cost my parents a lot while I was growing up but what ever politicians have decided I still get a free prescription and flu jabs and such. I can't really complain
flag gibson19
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 9:30 Quote
haydendmorrison wrote:
The UK's has been there when I've needed it but it's more politicians arguing about what to do on a bigger scale that makes badly run.

I don't know much about the US system but I'm guessing asthma and things like that would have cost my parents a lot while I was growing up but what ever politicians have decided I still get a free prescription and flu jabs and such. I can't really complain

In the US you get private insurance which I will admit is quite pricey... Not sure of exact figures cause I'm still on my parents plan but at least a grand a year in just insurance premiums... There are all sorts of ways it pays out but for regular visits you usually just pay a small fee (20 bucks), so while your healthy it sucks but when you get sick they will cover most of your costs assuming you go the right hospitals... The more you pay the less likely you'll have to pay for anything in the future.... They also do prescriptions and stuff like that...

Theres more to it then that but thats the just of it... The thing is people think its soo much money but the difference is the taxes in the US are substantially lower than any other nation that has national healthcare... When my dad moved from Canada to the US his income tax went down by 10%... and not like 10% of his taxes I mean it went from say 30 percent to 20 percent... which easily makes up for having to pay for insurance privately... There are still many many issues with private insurance but none I believe the government taking over could fix...

We have medicare and medicaid which is government healthcare for the elderly and those who can't afford it but both of those systems are majorly in debt and still aren't giving access to the people who need it because we are too busy wasting money on a war and other nonsensical government spending...
flag haydendmorrison
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 10:38 Quote
That makes perfect sense, I never thought of the tax part. Everything seems cheaper in the US too, like fuel. It's almost half the price it is here and half of the price we pay is tax. Same with most other things like alcohol, we pay loads in tax and then standard tax on earnings that is high.

Also, capital gains and inheritance tax are high which means that when your poor nan dies with money she has been saving all her life to give to you, being taxed on it as its earned, the government take a large slice of it from you. I'm sure in the USA it's not nearly as much.

We'd have more money for the NHS if our government wasn't such a giant pussy and go to war with the USA all the time/did something to stop wars instead of lying to create them. ha Razz
flag harriieee
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 10:46 Quote
I'd happily pay more tax for better services.

The NHS' problems are not fundamental to its structure or ethos, they are created by a business-driven attitude towards the system, and the fact that the entire operation is target-driven and impersonal. And I should probably know - my parents have a combined experience of working in the NHS lasting probably about 65 years between them, and my dad was head of Bath's public hospital.

Once Cameron gets into power over here, the public service cuts he'll wreak on Britain, all whilst pretending he's 'saving us' from the deficit, will drive the NHS further into the ground and make services worse across the board. There'll be a corresponding spike in crime as mental health centres close. Then those in favour of private healthcare will misinterpret this as a failure of the public system and say the NHS is unworkable.

Long story short - we're f*cked.
flag haydendmorrison
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 10:52 Quote
To tell the truth I've been almost converted by Gibson19 so I would rather pay barely any tax and pay for my own health care. That way I'll probably be paying about the same for healthcare but I'd have a choice between competative health car providers with the drive to be more personal and generally better.

I don't know if that is entirely the way it works but it sounds good

Oh, and if the bloody conservatives think they are getting my vote they can go sit on a pineapple. Smile
flag gibson19
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 10:53 Quote
I stand by that health care can not be run efficiently until there is profit... The government could do it but will create enormous debt for itself...

I'd have no problem paying taxes to cover healthcare for everyone... Its just I know and have experience first hand that this means I get sub par health care...
flag haydendmorrison
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 10:56 Quote
It's a bit like comunism, which I know the USA ins't fond of. If you get one group with a 'monopoly' controlling whatever then they don't have to compete to be the best. Nationalisation is crap if it's just going to lose the gorvenment money
flag harriieee
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 10:57 Quote
A pretty rapid conversion. Welcome to the life of a socialist - always on the losing team lol


Sure, it might work out better for you. You're most likely affluent and well-educated. A private system would almost certainly benefit myself and my family, as we're very well off. But the cost to society as a whole would be far higher. In a state where everyone's out for themselves, it ends up like the USA - massive social problems.

In terms of private healthcare, I'll tell you where exclusively private care will fail dreadfully, and that's mental health provision.
flag haydendmorrison
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 11:03 Quote
Yeah, I think if the USA gets the standard free healthcare for people who can't afford it and keeps taxes down they are on to a winner. I think we are at the other end of the scale and I generaly dislike taxes like most.

Who'd have thought it, a sensible discussion on Pinkbike Smile
flag harriieee
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 11:05 Quote
I love taxes. They are second only to my love of forcible income/land redistribution.

I'd be massively in favour of a giant progressive tax, say 80% or more on money earned over £500,000. It would do Britain a world of good.
flag gibson19
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 11:09 Quote
harriieee wrote:
I love taxes. They are second only to my love of forcible income/land redistribution.

I'd be massively in favour of a giant progressive tax, say 80% or more on money earned over £500,000. It would do Britain a world of good.

IT HURTS MY EYES TO READ THIS!! Razz

I have nothing against trying to solve the social problems we have... but when you tax that much it takes away incentive... If I were losing 80% of my income I wouldn't bother going through school to get a good paying job... I'd just be one of the people reaping the benefits of your tax money...

I'll add... whether we like it or not money runs the world...
flag harriieee
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 11:14 Quote
Not really Josh, only one person in a thousand will ever reach such a salary... and if they leave, that's fine by me.
flag gibson19
Posted: Dec 31, 2009 at 11:21 Quote
harriieee wrote:
Not really Josh, only one person in a thousand will ever reach such a salary... and if they leave, that's fine by me.

Then how will you have investment into business... The rich people in the world create jobs... Sure they have way to much money... But we need those people... I mean I'm hoping to eventually be making six figures... I wouldn't say thats greedy at all... and even if I were getting taxed 50 percent on my income I'd be outraged...


I just really don't trust the government... They get us into all sorts of messes, are full of corruption and allocate resources very poorly..

 


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