Inside SRAM's 11-speed rear hub and XD Driver

Sep 20, 2012 at 6:17

Sep 20, 2012

by Richard Cunningham

SRAM had its XX1 rear hub with the XD ratchet driver on display at Interbike and we were allowed to field-strip it to show Pinkbike readers what was inside the eleven-speed-only assembly. DT Swiss and SRAM teamed up to produce the patented XD cassette driver. Now, says SRAM, the XD driver will be made under an open-license agreement by Mavic, American Classic and Crankbrothers, with more hub and wheel makers coming on board next season. The XD driver is necessary to provide clearance for the 11-speed 'X-Dome' cassette's tiny ten-tooth sprocket, which is too small to adapt to a conventional freehub. Presently, DT Swiss makes the XD driver and hub for SRAM, which means that it can be assembled without tools.

SRAM XX1 XD freehub and 142 12mm Maxle lite through axle

SRAM's rear hub can be adapted for standard quick release or a 142/12-millimeter through axle by simply interchanging endcaps. We asked SRAM to walk us through the 142/12 version. Begin by sliding the rear axle from the hub.

SRAM XX1 XD hub can be pulled apart without tools

Pull off the endcaps and the XD driver can be slid off the hub's stub axle. The pawls will fall off the XD's ratchet mech, so watch out for loose parts. The ratchet ring and stub axle are shown on the left. SRAM uses oil instead of grease to lubricate the ratchet to maintain operation in freezing conditions. The protruding axle sleeve supports the outboard bearing of the XD driver.

A look at the XD driver's three-pawl ratchet shows the stiff, flat springs and the unique, three-tooth engagement on each pawl. Threads on the driver (right) engage a sleeve inside the eleven-speed cassette. The driver has two sealed bearings. The outboard bearing protrudes about four millimeters and indexes the driver into a sleeve beneath the cassette's smallest cogs.

SRAM XX1 XD freehub and 11speed cassette

The black-anodized sleeve can be seen inside the XD eleven-speed X-Dome cassette. Normally, the XD driver will be installed on the hub's stub shaft before the cassette is installed, but we wanted to show how the driver fits into the cassette (right). Like the X.0 cassette, all pedaling loads are carried by the splines of the largest cog. In the case of the XD drive, however, the larger indexing spline that is used on conventional freehubs has been eliminated, because the remaining ten cogs are machined from a single piece of stainless steel and it is not necessary.

A close-up look at the X-Dome cassette(left) reveals the black-anodized splines of its inner sleeve. The cassette simply spins onto the threads of the XD driver using a Shimano-type freehub lock-ring tool. The XD driver's outboard bearing is visible inside the cassette. In real life, you'll need to install the driver first (right). Slide the XD driver over the axle stub and then turn it counter-clockwise to engage the ratchet. The endcap then snaps onto the axle stub.

We discovered that SRAM's XD driver and hub system is quite simple to take apart and reassemble. Each part either slides into place, or snaps together. The threaded cassette sleeve is the only component that requires a tool and none are needed to switch the hub from one axle standard to another. This should be a plus for XX1 owners who ride in inclement weather, as regular maintenance of the driver and hub will be a painless process. The XD system is an elegant solution to adapt smaller cassette sprockets to a conventional hub design.

More info at SRAM

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98 Comments

Score Time Who Faved

+ 62

fritzman21 (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:27)

Ill stick with my 6 speed

- 89

rejean (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:32) (Below Threshold) show comment

I'll stick to my fixie

+ 20

MiloXC3 (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:55)

It's a great design and all, but 11-speed...who actually needs all of that!? I'm no pro rider but I don't even use all of my 9 gears. I'm not really complaining though, it's great to see another advancement in bike tech!

- 10

HellslayeR (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:06) (Below Threshold) show comment

You mean sell almost the same for twice the price with a weaker chain that you must change more regularly?

+ 17

Rippinp1 (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:43)

I thought the same until my friend told me that extra gear over the 10 speed is a granny gear apparently. It's for hardcore Enduro guys that normally run a 1x10.

S3tigoHide (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:47)

IIRC they're saying their new 11 speed chain is stronger than their old 8 speed chains

togood2die (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:49)

I love my 1x10 on my Ragley, and I don't think this would improve much... But on some rides I think I see the benefit.
Maybe?

It LOOKS trick, but that's not why I buy stuff...

+ 18

jimeg (Sep 20, 2012 at 8:41)

Looks great. I'll be stoked to gain a few teeth in the climbing gear, higher top end, and quieter drivetrain compared to my 1X10. And, the cost will come down.

Every time a new drivetrain comes out, the critics come out about how their current drivetrain is "fine". I remember the 8 speed whiners - "there is no mud clearance in their like my 7 speed!". Those riders are probably on 10 speed today.

Fortunately the manufacturers shine on these luddites and keep pushing the technology forward.

I'd rather see a gear box that is light and works more than anything though.

johniedamn (Sep 20, 2012 at 9:44)

Guys don't be so negative on a product and a company that pushes everything forward. Everyone has a story of reliability for

their drive train. Me too, and i stick with a company that builds derailleurs and not fishing equipment but so what!? You have to ride

the XX1 and feel the real difference. Its not about the +1 gear! Its about a simple drive train working with absolutely NO NOISE &

FAULTLESSLY. I ride 1x10, tried it and i choose to buy it no matter the cost because the feeling in the roots is like riding your

single-speed DJ bike in the pavement. I love mountain biking and i choose to follow new technologies.

p.s cheaper editions ox the XX1 will for sure follow.

- 11

alazamanza (Sep 20, 2012 at 10:32) (Below Threshold) show comment

1x11.... yes good idea

big ring that large WTF whos stupid idea was that 38t max.. no need for a 42 t cassette even with a 36/38t chainring!!

with the small ring being a 10t rather than the standard 11 you could get away with a 34 chainring and still have the same downhill gearing as a 36

i rode my old 17 kg enduro style rig up xc climbs with a 36 chainring and a 9spd11-34 cassette, im no fitness fanatic!!! most downhill bikes these days weigh that !!!!

best options would be:
36 ring up front with 10-38
34 ring at front and squeze a 9-36 in with some narrower ratios than a standard 10 spd

if hope can fit a 9t small ring in im pretty sure sram could find a way to do it!!

good idea ruined by small niggles

RANT OVER!!

fredgrillet (Sep 20, 2012 at 16:09)

That's what I thought untill I left the uk and moved to Canada!

radrider (Sep 20, 2012 at 16:13)

Im exited for this, I run a 1x9 and im constantly wishing for a higher and lower gear.

L-train (Sep 20, 2012 at 23:29)

Looks cool, but I'm disappointed they didn't just do a 10 speed 11-42.
Why all the new hubs, derailleurs, chains and chainrings for a 10 tooth cog? I love my 10 speed setup but could run a slightly bigger chainring if I had a 42 in the back.

Nic688 (Sep 21, 2012 at 6:43)

the whole new hub isn't for the 10 tooth, they needed to remove the lock ring in order to fit the extra cog in, the 42 tooth also curves out to follow the spokes. So the hub had to be re designed anyway, so making a 10 tooth fit was barely any extra effort.

[Reply]

+ 20

jimmybuffet (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:31)

the key with the eleven speed is that you can run a single ring up front and still have all the gears of a 2 x10. not for everyone but for guys like me who want an all mountain bc bike that can go uphill and downhill its a rad. ill be getting it asap for my slash

[Reply]

clunchpowers (Sep 20, 2012 at 9:38)

All the people that flip their lid over this just blow my mind. It's options people. Get over it. If your not into tinkering with your bike, don't look at new products. If you think it'll work for you, cool. If not, cool. No need to fly off the handle.

[Reply]

ReformedRoadie (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:48)

Obviously this was done just so they could say "This one goes to 11".
I am hoping they or someone puts out 10spd compatible rings with the fancy teeth so I can ditch the MRP 1.x and just get on with a Shadow Plus RD.

groghunter (Sep 20, 2012 at 10:03)

as soon as I can find one for a reasonable price, I'm going to give the chain ring a shot with 9 speed. Even if it's not as tight a tolerance with the 11 speed chain, it should still provide some benefit. Hopefully enough to go without the chain guide if you use a type 2 der.

[Reply]

scratchbum (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:26)

Anyone at SRAM ever worked on an older freewheel style bike? Once you've pedalled hard on cassette it tightens itself onto the hub... a lot! So match that with a stiff set of sprockets and a set of aluminium threads and you'll probably have a wrecked set of threads and a very hard to remove cassette. You've also got to have your rear wheel re-built onto the hub to accomodate it!

Good luck those who spend loads on first generation SRAM and realise when they need to replace the cassette they have either a warranty claim on their hands and time off the trail, or a big bill form their bike shop. (Which if they bought it in the first place, they wouldn't be unused to!)

I would guess that's all been thought of, however there's nothing to suggest otherwise. I've got 10 speed XT and after 2 years I've had to change a rear gear cable, I have SRAM X9 on my downhill bike which also works well. I just can't see the point in paying loads to compromise on tried and tested methods, when they don't seem to have a marked advantage.

Rant over!..... Each to their own... it does look very nice though etc etc.

S3tigoHide (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:56)

That caught me too, but then the article says the pedaling loads are carried by the splines under the largest cog. What I don't get is how something can be threaded and splined. Is the 42t cog not attached to the rest of the cassette?

seraph (Sep 20, 2012 at 12:46)

I wish they had explained how it is both splined and threaded. In my mind, in order for it to work the splined part of the cassette would need to spin independently of the rest of the cassette, since once it goes on the splined portion of the freehub body it would need to stay stationary while the rest of the cassette spins in order to thread on...

RichardCunningham Mod Plus (Sep 20, 2012 at 12:52)

The first ten cogs are machined in one piece and then attached permanently to the aluminum 42-tooth inner cog. Think of the driver as a standard splined freehub, but with short splines that only engage the inner sprocket of the cassette. The XD lock ring is internal to make room for the ten-tooth outer cog, but it serves the exact same function on the cassette body as an external lock ring does. SRAM's X.0 ten-speed cassette also only engages the freehub splines with the largest cog. The rest of the cassette rides on a bushing over the freehub body. RC

seraph (Sep 20, 2012 at 13:05)

Oh ok I get it. So the lock ring is integrated into the cassette and driven by a Shimano-type splined freehub tool. It spins independently of the cassette and threads onto the freehub body to tighten the cassette.

S3tigoHide (Sep 20, 2012 at 16:45)

Ahh, I see it now. Thanks Richard.

[Reply]

wakaba (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:59)

Three pawl engagement. Less meat on each, many radiuses where there shouldn`t be. Cast item and thus not precise. Pawlnotches won`t engage ratchet at the same time. First gets full load and will wear. Ratchets dont like uneven wear. Uneven wear is something to avoid. Not proper design. Hub will sound broken after a short while.

Springs look like made of stainless steel. Springsteel is correct material and weakens a 100x slower than ss. If they went for beefy ss: Lots of heat generated and power wasted.

Bearing looks good, like the axle release. Various axle dimensions not needed unless there is new 20mm back and 30mm front...downgrading not fun.

forkbrayker (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:49)

you sound like you know more than most...how on earth do you tell the difference between stainless and spring steel????

wakaba (Sep 20, 2012 at 9:36)

color

radrider (Sep 20, 2012 at 16:17)

lots of talk...pretty damn amazing you can tell that the teeth will not make contact at the same time from a picture showing them fully extended.

wakaba (Sep 20, 2012 at 22:59)

Initially they will, depends on how precise the cast are. This size thingy would be hard to machine, so cast, not precise enough. Engagement - uneven after very few miles.

The rule of the game is: reduce cost and liveexpectancy of part, cover up with bling.

If you look at bike parts the way I do - I drool over great engineering not marketized product phantasies. 11 flimsy cogs and a (dare to be different for the sake of beeing different) ratchet mechanism doesn`t exite me. The production process to create a really strong Boobar handlebar - very inventive and much cleverer than the "more is better" approach of the gear department of sram. I like.

psyickphuk (Sep 21, 2012 at 3:40)

Think you are wanting to see problems here.

Hope use the spring pawl method & has worked fine for years. Other companies use multi tooth pawls to allow finer pickup. Again, works fine. Worst case they wear & you need to replace the pawls, looks like a 5 minute job. Even with typical spare parts rip off pricing I doubt would be very expensive.

Flimsy cogs? If you say so. No more than 10% thinner than 10 speed. Again, works fine, you don't hear of people ripping cogs off due to their massive leg power.

I actually really like the idea of 11 speed. I am running 2 x 9 and just couldn't see the point - or expense - of switching to 2 x 10. I would like to lose the granny & front mech/shifter but 1 x 10 doesn't give enough range(for me).

Whereas 11 speed could be the answer here. Granted it is a shame you need to buy like half a bike to swap everything over. But whatever, that's the price of progress, noone is insisting you do it.

You buy a new bike in 2013 you'll likely get this for the same price as the 2012 version anyway!

Nic688 (Sep 21, 2012 at 6:46)

the cogs are the same size as 10 speed, they lost the lock ring and curved the last cog along the spoke line to make room for the 11th cog.

[Reply]

safety (Sep 20, 2012 at 14:44)

I find it hilarious that the same people that are complaining about this new 'standard' are the same ones that are running 10 speeds now. Unlike 10 speed, there are actual advantages to an 11 speed system with a new cassette and derailleur. You get a wider range of gears and new chain design that might actually work better.

Whereas 10 gives you the same spread, is more fickle, has a weaker chain, and costs a lot move for nothing. The only real advantage to 10 speed was that manufacturers could consolidate production with their road lines and save some costs, we haven't seen that passed on the consumer yet though, and likely never will.

Say what you will about 11 speed setups, at least it's something different and not a cash grab financed by the sheeple who upgrade because they're told to (or, granted, in many cases forced to because they purchase complete bikes and the manufacturers drank the kool aid).

[Reply]

The-Medic (Sep 20, 2012 at 13:51)

I think we need to work on the Gear-box and other drivetrain alternatives more then just adding one more cog every so often. Looks really nice, but I think kiling the deraileur all together would be a bigger victory.

[Reply]

c25porter (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:37)

I have a 36 up front and 36 as my biggest in back and that is good for most things, but I find in some Enduro races, I spin out (Ashland Enduro) Would have been Nice to have a 38 up front and 10-42 in the back, wouldn't have spun out and still would have climbed the same. I like XX1 a lot and hope it sticks around, I can't afford to be a first adopter, but I look forward to adopting it next year!.

[Reply]

iamamodel (Sep 20, 2012 at 14:25)

That mechanism is EXACTLY the same as I9's.

I9's fit your standard casettes - they are splined the entire length of the cassette body

I9 have six pawls, with one set offset so they are not engaged while the other set is engaged. This is why I9 has 120 POE, or if you remove one set of three pawls (ending up like the picture above) you'll get only 60 POE. Only.

dutchct (Sep 20, 2012 at 20:42)

Yup, industry 9's are virtually the same. It's a decent design.

[Reply]

taletotell (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:34)

I'm obviously not the target audience since this seems stupid to me. Then again,10 seemed like a waste too. The big cog in the back has too many down sides for now. I am hoping the same benefit will be incorporated into the next idea without needing a bunch of extra cogs. In the meantime I will keep the left shifter. Extra weight on the bb is less of a problem than extra weight on the rear hub.

[Reply]

Trail-Gnome (Sep 20, 2012 at 10:18)

How about a version that would use a standard hub and only 10 speed 11/42 Tooth. Seems like a lot more sales if people could use their existing hubs and shifters.

As far a the strength of an 11 speed chain; your only shortening the pin length and the plates remain the same. So in theory, it should be stronger.

[Reply]

tyson56 (Sep 20, 2012 at 11:30)

Well I was deciding between a 2x10 and a 1x10 for my next bike, was concerned about climbing with the 1x10. Also, I want to get a chainguide either way, and I assume a 1x chainguide will work better than a 2x chainguide. This makes my decision easy, doesn't it?

[Reply]

scratchbum (Sep 26, 2012 at 8:46)

^^i-ride-on-dirt and hampsteadbandit

Just an extra though to the chain issue, and i know it seems simple, but not all mechanics know and if between a load of them they can't set up a 10 speed gearset they could just be setting the chain up too short to accomodate chain growth under compression, which will then usually bend or break your mech hanger (you'll normally be in a low or 1st gear for this to happen) which may in turn put your mech into your back wheel and tear your mech off and bend some spokes or snap your chain.... can cause lots of problems.

May be worth checking. Shift into your lowest gear (on your biggest chain ring if you have more than one) and release all air from your shock / remove the coil and compress the rear end to the max. That'll tell you i your chain is long enough.

May sound like I'm teaching you to suck eggs, but given the other advice above it's the only other thing not on there.

PS I really like riding bikes. Smile

[Reply]

spol (Sep 20, 2012 at 15:04)

Pink bike logic = I don't need it, therefore I don't see why anybody else would

[Reply]

throttlemire (Sep 20, 2012 at 12:52)

This setup has two great ideas and two retarded ones. No FD and no chainguide - hell yeah! New hub "standard" and 11 gears - WTF? No one is going to use a 10-tooth gear. I don't even use my 11 now. 38t in the back should be the limit. Good luck early adopters...

[Reply]

seraph (Sep 20, 2012 at 12:43)

Shut up and take my money!

[Reply]

bikelikemadd (Sep 20, 2012 at 21:56)

The 11 speeds were intended a lot for 29ers. So they they could go from a double up front to just a single and save weight and have fewer gears. The 11th gear is actually the largest and goes up to like a 36t now I believe.

[Reply]

cmdrvoodoo (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:58)

I'm all over this xx1 as soon as I can get my hands on it. No need to have a front derailleur/shifter. Love it!

I'm not too stoked that I need to buy a different hub or freehub for it however. I don't see the need for that 10 tooth anyway. Oh well it is what it is.

groghunter (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:27)

you must be well funded then: I'm interested, but at the price they're asking for the XX version, not gonna happen. Hopefully we'll see a working man's X9 or X7 version soon, though.

Helm72 (Sep 20, 2012 at 8:37)

i lost my front derailleur & shifter back when 7spd was the standard, only went to a 9 because 8s were becoming difficult to find

groghunter (Sep 20, 2012 at 9:57)

this is true for me as well, on most of my bikes now. BTW, if you're willing to live with X-5 and X-7, you can easily find the parts to go back to 8 or 7.

cmdrvoodoo (Sep 20, 2012 at 12:29)

I'd actually like a X9 version myself. I don't like the idea of a $350 rear derailleur hanging off the back of my frame picking up sticks! I've broken enough $100 X9s to know it happens more often than you'd like.

...and I'm not super well funded, but since I don't race MX anymore, the cost of mountain biking seems manageable even when buying all the best stuff.

groghunter (Sep 20, 2012 at 18:17)

yea, ripping that off would be expensive. derailleurs in general are just a stopgap for me until I can get a competent, affordable bike with a gearbox: derailleurs are a decades old solution intended for road bikes, they don't make sense on MTB.

[Reply]

DHBIGHITTER (Sep 20, 2012 at 9:47)

you can fit a full meal(bread, main course and dessert) on the last cog... xD

[Reply]

natedizzle (Oct 5, 2012 at 21:24)

I don't know if I'm sold on the 11 speed thing but from an engineering aspect the three tooth pawl is brilliant. Increased contact area should make them near indestructible. Why was this not thought of before?

[Reply]

godfried (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:30)

This is more like a software inside a hardware in a PC if you will.....I wonder how durable they are...Kind of skeptical about it...more gadgets means more ways to breakdown for a bike.

[Reply]

b1k35c13nt15t (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:33)

It is 11 speed with the same spacing as 10 speed. The derailleur runs parallel to the cassette. Does this mean I can run XX1 without that ridiculous cassette. I live/ride in UT/CO and my 34T cassette is plenty for my 30lbs bike. 42T is for people that need to ride more. The enduro scene was just fine with 36T, I never saw anyone walking their bikes.

forkbrayker (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:48)

too true...but until they bring out an 11 cog with a 36t top cog you would be stuck with the 42t version....but then whats the point.. though i might be interested if they brought out a 38t version.

personally i'm quite happy for this kind of development in bikes...thats progress....... but the wheel size thing is doing my head in, at least with a 29er you can say i gain this big advantage and lose out on another....whereas 650b....best of both worlds or worst of both worlds? and will it be an nth degrees of f'k all difference to one or the other previous sizes

paulskibum (Sep 20, 2012 at 10:12)

I think you may be missing the point - with the 42t at the back you can have a bigger front cog for the same granny gear ratio for the ups as you are indicating you already have but then you have a (say) 38t at the front and a 10t at the rear for the downs meaning you have a higher gearing and a potential to go faster.

OR - you have a lower granny for people who need it for high alpine riding or whatever - run a 34t and the 42t to be able to climb steeper terrain for longer than with a 334 36 setup - but still have a 34t to 10t for the downs.

System isn't needed by everyone but will be needed by some - the first showing of it at Crankworks it was used to win the enduro event there - maybe the guy would have won on a 1x10 but maybe it helped swing it for him - who knows.

[Reply]

Antron (Sep 20, 2012 at 23:01)

Aw, I got excited thinking this was going to be an internal geared up. "Finally!", I was thinking... but nooOOooo

woodsroller Plus (Sep 21, 2012 at 4:24)

Exactly. I read the title and then saw the size of the hub and got all fired up, only to see the cassette. Eventually the cassettes and derailleurs need to go.

chugachjed (Sep 21, 2012 at 17:24)

X 1,000,000 derailleurs suck. And they're tough to spell.

[Reply]

nfa2005 (Sep 22, 2012 at 8:36)

Great new stuff, love it. It seems thetes options now but i tryed to get a 9 speed rear deralleur downtown here in shitario and no shops really carry them now.

[Reply]

nfa2005 (Sep 22, 2012 at 7:54)

Great new stuff, love it. It seems thetes options now but i tryed to get a 9 speed rear deralleur downtown here in shitario and no shops really carry them now.

[Reply]

davehayz93 (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:23)

That cassette is like art! I wouldnt buy it 1. because I wouldnt want to get dirt on it, 2. because its going to cost £100000

skawt-1 (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:44)

Tweeks have all the xx1 stuff on their website now...

11spd cassette
Rear Derailleur
Shifter

The cranks and chain are on the site too, I am sure 11spd prices will come down fairly quickly by the end of next year when more budget options come out.

kovaldesign (Oct 16, 2012 at 8:45)

Haaa! Just looked at the prices of the above products (skawt-1, thanks for those links) - totally unreasonable. Screw that! ...
... my 9sp drive-train is still going strong Smile

skawt-1 (Oct 17, 2012 at 6:05)

Haha exactly, 9spd till it dies. Hopefully by them 11spd will have filtered into more budget ranges.

[Reply]

kovaldesign (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:50)

you will be quicker walking than spinning with the 42t ring Smile

don't see to much point with the ten-tooth sprocket either, looks like they had to change the freehub body for the sake of it (?!)

El-Warpo (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:24)

Campagnolo already packs 11sp on a standard hub. However, to cover approximately the same gear range than a comparable 2-chainring drivetrain with only 1 chainring, they had to use those extreme ranges (42t max, 10t min). To do that, they needed the 10t cog and hence, to make the freehub shorter. Simply put, the freehub diameter can't take a 10t cog and needs a redesign one way or the other.

You can choose from 20-something tooth to 36t chainrings on XXI groups.
I'm not very warm to the whole idea of just one chainring as I don't have the legs for it and 1 chainring would make me get short at either side of the gear range, but I can see it working for racing applications.

Then, I vaguely remember from my engineering days that less than 11t was not very good for roller chain systems, but I guess I should have put more attention to my teachers.

kovaldesign (Sep 21, 2012 at 6:54)

It's not I do not understand the concept (you have nicely summarized it above - thank you for that), but moves like i.e. new freehub body design have got potential to stay around and supersede the traditional system even if there is absolutely nothing wrong with it (well, it can not take this bloody 10t cog Smile

). Eventually marketing people will start saying 'the new, threaded system is much better and you be able to remove the cassette 1 second faster' Wink

and that would mean a new generation of hubs... you see where I'm going? Smile

If I was an inventor I would put the money into different areas.
10t sprocket will not make anyone better biker. Keep the freehub body unchanged, stick with 11t and use slightly larger chainring on the front if you worry about your top speed and bus chase - much simpler and cheaper Smile

El-Warpo (Oct 16, 2012 at 5:21)

kovaldesign... I agree with you. Going 10t was unnecessary and I could see someone (like Shimano?) coming with a 11sp system on a normal hub.

kovaldesign (Oct 19, 2012 at 4:31)

El-Warpo, changing the topic just a bit, I have found something like that: (see pages 3-4)
www.oldmountainbikes.com/catalogs/ritchey/1997/1997RitcheyComponents.pdf
Seems like the 2x9 'revolotion' which still slowly in my opinion (at least in the low budget category) takes over the 3 ring setup, have been around since ... 1997, when most of us was still riding with the stabilizers Smile

[Reply]

ka0t1c07 (Dec 31, 2012 at 22:43)

Stop complaining and buy it. It's already been made to fit a variety of riders. Not just a single person.

[Reply]

i-ride-on-dirt (Sep 20, 2012 at 21:55)

My 9-Speed worked flawlessly for years, from the moment i started on 10-speed I have had nothing but problems. I would love to see the old 9-speed drivetrain re-introduced.

Willie1 (Sep 20, 2012 at 22:05)

you have a BAD mechanic.

i-ride-on-dirt (Sep 20, 2012 at 22:14)

I am not the only person to have issues with 10-speed, my LBS also could not get it running smoothly...

Willie1 (Sep 21, 2012 at 11:43)

You need a better mechanic I said. 10 speed is no different from 9 in terms of setup. I have both, and the precision of the 10 speed shifting is awesome. It is way more crisp than the 9 speed it replaced. The mechanically inept blame their equipment. The skillful enjoy their bikes.

hampsteadbandit (Sep 21, 2012 at 12:25)

you definitely need a good mechanic to work on your bike

to give you the viewpoint of a professional workshop manager in a high turnover bike store, my customers have had no more issue with 10 speed (in 3 x 10, 2 x 10 and 1 x 10 formats) here in the mudbath we call the UK, than with previous 9 speed systems

personally running SRAM X-0 in 1 x 10 on my 29er and no issues to speak of, feels just like my previous X-0 and X-9 in 1 x 9 setups in terms of durability

i-ride-on-dirt (Sep 21, 2012 at 17:40)

The fact is that I worked on it, and I have taken it to two bike shops, neither were able to get full range of the gears, and it has never ran smoothly. On my AM bike, I have broken 3 chain in 8 rides and it has never shifted smoothly. Did I manage to get the lemons of the batch? Possibly. But saying I am a bad bike mechanic is also saying there is not 1 good mechanic in 2 bike shops, which is not true.

hampsteadbandit (Sep 22, 2012 at 12:23)

@i-ride-on-dirt

no offence was intended.

I would ask your mechanic take a serious look at your frame alignment, if you are having on going issues, 10 speed is no more difficult to set up than 9 speed. gear problems are often caused by poor frame alignment, crank installation spacing issues and slightly bent derailleur hangers (we get new bikes with slightly bent hangers!)

ask your LBS to run a Park dropout end alignment gauge over your dropouts, and also use the Park frame alignment gauge to check fore / aft frame alignment. Also, have them use the Park derailleur hanger alignment tool to check your mech hanger for up/down and left/right alignment (it can be slightly twisted as well as bent inwards)

if you are constantly braking chains, there is something wrong with either your drivetrain (have them carefully check your cassette, derailleur pulley wheels, chainrings for any abnormal damage (like a twisted tooth). Also, each time your broke your chain, was the new chain (or the broken chain fixed) using the same chain tool?

Often, a mechanic may use a chain tool without realising the driving pin is actually damaged, which causes the chain plates to flare during installation, soon leading to chain failure. The modern chains are extremely strong when fitted properly (braking strain of 850 kgf is typical), its usually drivetrain component damage or faulty fitting that will cause chains to keep breaking Smile

finally, have a look at your cabling, for problematic gearing systems I always go for Shimano SP-41 cable outer and genuine Shimano inner gear cables with Shimano SP sealed gear caps, not cheap but worth every $$ as 90% of the time it cures shifting lag or mis-shifting that Jagwire, Clarkes, etc. cheaper cables will cause

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sousathiago (Sep 20, 2012 at 22:02)

This would be awesome on my steel hardtail! Too bad it probably will cost more than the whole bike Frown

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alazamanza (Sep 20, 2012 at 10:42)

HOLY F!!!!!!!!!! 220 quid a derrailer!!!!!! sram you can go forth and fornicate by yourself!!!!

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t1000 (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:24)

11 Speed! Exactly what I needed! Sick!

gavlaa (Sep 20, 2012 at 7:25)

How did you 'need' 11 spd? I doubt it'll give you anything you need- you'll just gain a new gear that sits imbetween 2 gears you already had before. Wow.

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Borgschulze (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:18)

Looks like a nice buzzy hub.

Maybe Chris King will adapt this so I can upgrade Smile

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llarrggee (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:18)

Beautifully made kit that.

marzocchidjiii (Sep 21, 2012 at 3:03)

Although I'm a fan of the XX1, I have to disagree if you're saying Sram have a reputation for making good kit???

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Bmxerch (Sep 22, 2012 at 12:45)

Oh hey Profile. When did you make three pawl hubs for SRAM ?

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shishka (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:27)

Have fun going uphill. What if they used 4-6 pawl design instead of old fashion 3 pawl bs?

Rethonal (Sep 20, 2012 at 6:34)

I talked to e-thirteen about why they only had 3 pawls, their hub is similar to this. They said it builds unnecessary heat and adds hub drag as well as weight, while even with only 3 pawls, there is only a 6 degree tolerance.

Helm72 (Sep 20, 2012 at 8:40)

why not just put a multi gear assembly on a BMX driver hub, super easy to rebuild & service. Wont cost u your 1st born child to afford either...

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beeboo (Nov 6, 2012 at 18:44)

This is crazy! First the upgrade to 9 speed, then 10 and now 11

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cimmarron (Sep 22, 2012 at 12:40)

I'm a DH rider but that makes me want to ride uphill... Hahaha

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mudmandhbrazil (Sep 20, 2012 at 9:13)

this huge cassette is so strange! it can be good but is fuking strange to see a big cassete on any bike. ugly.

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alazamanza (Sep 20, 2012 at 10:40)

1x11.... yes good idea

big ring that large WTF whos stupid idea was that 38t max.. no need for a 42 t cassette even with a 36/38t chainring!!

with the small ring being a 10t rather than the standard 11 you could get away with a 34 chainring and still have the same downhill gearing as a 36 i mean best options would be:

36 ring up front with 10-38
34 ring at front and squeze a 9-36 in with some narrower ratios than a standard 10 spd

if hope can fit a 9t small ring in im pretty sure sram could find a way to do it!!

good idea ruined by small niggles

RANT OVER!!

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boberinoe (Sep 20, 2012 at 16:28)

Industry rules the sport, rider input rules the industry

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markbe (Sep 23, 2012 at 3:24)

OH!

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boo86 (Sep 21, 2012 at 2:03)

8 speed FTW !!!!

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slamman (Sep 20, 2012 at 12:13)

Stupid idea. Mech will get hit even easier now. Butthats ok, coz it won't cost much to replace will it!!!! Crazy

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alazamanza (Sep 20, 2012 at 10:39)

no casette should ever be bigger than the rotor that's on the same wheel!!!!

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