Manitou Dorado: Preview of a Review!

Feb 12, 2009 at 0:09
Feb 12, 2009
by Mike Levy  
 
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Take a look at what showed up at Pinkbike HQ today!

2009 Manitou Dorado

You know its serious when the delivery truck has a police escort and the signing for the package includes a retina scan! Ok, that didn't happen and we're not that important, but maybe the brand new Manitou Dorado is? The full review is a ways off, but I could not resist giving you guys a look at what's coming up.

Read on for lots of pictures, more info, and an HD video...

Judging by the amount of readers views and comments on our Interbike coverage on the new Dorado it is safe to say that you guys want to see more of it. Reading those comments made it abundantly clear that there are a lot of opinions about the new DH fork from Manitou, ranging from the good, to the bad, to the just plain mistaken. Everyone seems to be able to tell how it's going to perform just by looking at some pictures! Don't get me wrong, I'm guilty as well. The new Dorado looks every bit the part of a super fork, and it is easy to believe once you've simply held it, let alone actually ridden it in anger. Soon enough we'll know more about how the Dorado performs under duress, but for now we are going to tease you with even more pictures and some initial impressions. This is not a test, just a preview.

Manitou Dorado

First, let's get an important fact straight. The new Dorado is an entirely new fork, loosely based on the original TPC+ Dorado, but a completely and wholly new beast altogether. Think of it as a distant cousin of the earlier model, albeit a somewhat hot cousin that you are attracted to. It is an inverted design, which is clear to see, and putting the front wheel between your legs and twisting is not in any way a measure of how torsionally stiff it will be on the trail, so let's just forget that thought altogether. Moving on....

2009 Manitou Dorado installed on our Rocky Mountain Flatline Pro test bike



What's on the outside?

Out of the box and into my hands my first thought was not how light it is (although it is relatively light), or even how quickly I could manage to get it on my current test bike, but instead how nicely it was finished. The made in the U.S.A. fork is just beautiful. As you would expect, the carbon legs are stunning with the cosmetic weave easy to see. My heart always beats a few beats faster when I am holding anything made of the black wonder material. Carbon has its detractors, but it is hard to argue that it doesn't look stunning. The upper tubes bulge slightly at the lower crown and continue down at the same diameter. The upper and lower crowns each clamp onto anodized gold aluminum sleeves that have been bonded to the carbon tubes, increasing clamp diameter and protecting the carbon at the same time.

Aluminum sleeves give the crowns a strong place to clamp while protecting the carbon




Upper and lower fork crown detail

The crowns look up the task, the lower crown itself is massive. Tolerances seem to be just right, as in you don't need a hammer to get your top crown on and in position. The top crown fits an integrated stem and uses the same standard that you will find on Boxxers or Fox 40s. All crown pinch bolts are drilled A270 rust resistant bolts, details. There is a smart hose guide on the lower crown which uses a single 2.5 mm allen bolt, nice to see they didn't decided to use anything smaller like some other rather cheesy hose guides. The aluminum steerer tube is butted as well.

36 mm stanchion tubes

The decals themselves are a step above what we usually see in the bicycle industry. The thick vinyl graphics don't look like they will be separating themselves from the legs anytime soon, which is nice because I think they look pretty damn sharp. It is great to see the MRD (Manitou Racing Development) logo make a return to the range, signifying that this fork sits at the top of the fork hierarchy.

Manitou Racing Development





The stanchions are 36 mm across and are protected via sturdy plastic guards. The original Dorado leg guards were quite brittle, having a tendency to crack before bending. These are thick and flexible so they should last much longer. They also have aluminum sleeves in each bolt hole to prevent cracking due to over tightening or an accident. Three 2.5 mm bolts hold each guard in its place and the left has a built in hose guide.

The HexLock axle




HexLock axle and steel pinch bolt inserts

The Dorado accepts standard 20 mm x 110 mm thru-axle hubs and uses Manitou's 6 sided HexLock axle system. Two pinch bolts per side hold the axle in place, and they thread into replaceable steel inserts that prevent any permanent damage from over tightening. The fork uses a modular brake adapter and comes with both 8" post mount and I.S. mount.

Modular brake mount




8" post mount adapter and 8" I.S. adapter

Made in the USA, possibly by the same group of people who made the Mars Rover? Nah, but it may as well have been!




Frame bumper, clean and simple hose guide



What's on the inside?

Ha! I've only had it for a single day, what makes you think I took it apart already? I wanted to, but I didn't. The Dorado is an open-bath cartridge-style fork, as opposed to a sealed cartridge system. This means that the damping oil is shared between the cartridge that sits inside the right leg and the space above the cartridge. Damping oil lubricates the bushings and fills the large-volume hydraulic bottom-out ciucuit at the top of the cartridge. There’s no bleeding necessary prior to installing the cartridge, which keeps things simple for oil changes.

Manitou Dorado TPC+ damping cartridge

Besides a forgettable foray into some platform based designs, Manitou has long used their TPC+ shim based damping system. There have been, and still are, some funny designs out there, but one thing is proven: steel shims have always been used on the highest performing suspension out there. From Bubba's Supercross bike, to Rossi's MotoGP rocket ship, the answer has always been shims and oil. TPC+ is an acronym for Twin Piston Chamber, and is exactly that. The 'Chamber' refers to the damper body itself, while 'Twin Piston' is in reference to both the compression and rebound pistons. The '+' at the end denotes a third floating piston that creates a position sensitive damping system. All that is held within the cartridge or 'chamber'.

[PI=1125691 size=m align=c]From left to right: Rebound piston, floating compression piston, fixed compression piston[/PI]
This TPC+ assembly is out of a Manitou Travis, but it gives you an idea as to what is going on. The new Dorado uses a similar system, but not an exact copy

As the fork cycles through the first of its travel or on more low speed hits the third piston is free to float up or down. On harder/faster impacts or deeper into the travel the piston will rise up, closing an oil path and forcing the oil through more shims thus creating more damping force. What all that jumble means for the rider is a fork that is both sensitive to smaller bumps but still manages to keep from bottoming its travel needlessly hard. Hidden deep inside is also a hydraulic bottom and top out circuits that smooth out the transitions at both ends of travel. For now you'll have to use your imagination, but we'll have pictures of the internals come the full review!



How many knobs are there to turn and what do they do?

There are four main adjustments you can make on the Dorado to adapt the fork's performance to your needs. The Dorado is an air sprung fork, so the first order of duty would be to find the correct spring rate for your weight and riding style. Fatties and hacks need more air, obviously, but less than you may think. The massive size of the air chamber means that the pressure range should be somewhere between 50 psi and 90 psi, with a max of 110 psi. The negative air chamber is self adjusting and sits at the bottom of the fork, always pump at the top and bleed air off at the bottom when adjusting the pressure.

Under this aluminum cap sits the air filler valve



Air is put in at the top of the fork, and removed at the bottom. The directions are pretty clear!


Both air caps thread in and have sealing o-rings

Rebound (LSR) is dialed in via the anodized blue aluminum knob atop the right leg. There is only 2 1/4 (19 clicks) turns to make but it affects a wide range of damping. Each click at the dial is very well defined and loud, no making mistakes here. It is also clearly marked as to which direction does what.

Aluminum rebound knob

Both low speed compression (LSC) and high speed compression (HSC) adjustments are made at the bottom of the right leg by the way of concentric dials, both aluminum. The outer anodized black dial is your HSC adjuster. It has 2.5 (21 clicks) turns of adjustment and again, each click is very well defined. The inner red dial is your LSC adjuster and has 2.5 turns (21 clicks) or adjustment.

LSC and HSC are located at the bottom of the right leg, they are clearly marked



The black aluminum outer dial is your HSC, the inner red aluminum dial is your LSC



Watch the HD video and listen to Denny Yunk in 'Vegas explaining the new Manitou Dorado




Overview

Manitou Dorado Key Features

-Dual layer carbon outer legs
-36mm hard anodized stanchions
-Internally adjustable travel between 180mm and 203mm
-Self regulating positive and negative air springs
-Advanced TPC+ damping
-Hydraulic Bottom out and top out
-20mm HexLock Thru-axle
-International Standard integrated stem mounting
-6.4 lbs (2902g) claimed - 6.7 lbs w/ uncut steerer on my scale

External Adjustments

-Self regulating positive and negative air spring
-Rebound adj. (blue knob, top left)
-Low-speed damping (red knob, bottom left)
-High-speed damping (black dial, bottom left)






So there it is, a preview of the '09 Manitou Dorado. Overall I am impressed with what I have seen. The finish is amazing, the damping has been proven in past forks and I have high expectations for it in the new Dorado, and the weight is competitive with the competition. Throw in a low axle to crown height and adjustable travel (internally) and things are looking promising. Two questions remain: performance and reliability. The two are intertwined and only time will tell us what the outcome will be. Lucky for me I hope to be putting loads of time in on the new Dorado.


All findings will be reported back so stay tuned!

Head on over HERE to see the entire Manitou Dorado photo album!

Mike "Kakah" Levy
Must Read This Week









197 Comments

  • + 4
 DrSanchez, I agree with you entirely. Lately I have gotten out of the mtb world due to this fact. You pay a small fortune for this stuff that ends up feeling like the R&D is done by you because it only lasts a month...

I always found it interesting that all MX forks are inverted but no MTB forks are. It has been proven on MX bikes that an inverted fork is stiffer where you want the stiffness to be. But in that application weight is not as much of a factor. In the end it is still way to expensive for me to put on a bike that I will beat up anyways. I already found it hard enough to justify the price of my Totem...that lasted 3 months before spewing the oil all over the leg...
That is definately the one glaring difference between mx and mtb. Mx stuff is tried and true and just works....
  • + 0
 same with bmx parts, tried & tested! - mtb will get there eventually, its a mere infant sport at the moment... doesn't mean that I don't get pi$$ed off at all the crap suspension and disc brake systems that are out there at the moment - they are definitely letting the whole side down! As sexy as these forks look, they will flop, period! - The price is too high, the weight is too high, and the performance is just gonna be the same as anything else out there...Frown
  • + 2
 I don't think you can compare BMX to MTB. BMX bikes are so much simpler then MTBs. Compared to getting a suspension fork dialed building a rigid 20" fork is a joke.
  • + 1
 weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee [pertinent point fly's over your head] - you just missed the point totally! you can compare mx to mtb, and bmx's are still very much bicycles!
  • - 1
 you can't compare mx to dh mtb. Just like you can't compare bmx to dh mtb. They are all totally different elements with one small thing in common...2 wheels. It's like comparing cats and dogs. that only thing they have in common is 4 legs. They don't feel the same, act the same, sound the same ect.

"performance is just gonna be the same as anything else out there"...how can you say that? Theres nothing else recently made out there with the same damping system. Performance will not be the same as all the other forks. It will do the same thing (absorb bumps, keep wheels in contact with the ground), but it will do it differently.
  • + 2
 I dpn't wanna clutter the comments, but... the pertinent point was that faulty/untested products aren't tolerated in the mx industry, riders simply wouldn't stand for it, the same is the case in bmx as the sport has properly established itself, mtb however is full of companies 'trying it on' with poorly designed 'test' products; that's what I'm getting at!Rolleyes
  • + 2
 "It has been proven on MX bikes that an inverted fork is stiffer where you want the stiffness to be"

please explain...i'm a mechanical engineering major, and would be interested to see how you justify this "proven" statement
  • + 1
 "you can't compare mx to dh mtb. Just like you can't compare bmx to dh mtb. They are all totally different elements with one small thing in common...2 wheels"

very untrue. inertia, couples, moments, and reactant forces are very much the same for the two. it is true to say that just because it works on a mx, doesnt mean it will work for dh. but saying they're like cats and dogs is simply ignorant. open up an mx rear shock and compare it to a dh.....nearly identical, just scaled down. why do you think cane creek is now made by ohlins?
  • + 0
 nothing better is so far from the truth hes uhhh... yea, just not right in any way.

DH stuff is derived from mx. Simple. From frame designs to shock tech. Who do you think designs most of the mainstream shocks on the market. MX companies. Fox, Curnett, Risse, etc. In fact, companies like curnett make some of the best suspension products on the planet, and they are an mx / car racing suspension company. Same with fox.
[Reply]
  • + 8
 wow, looking nice, can't wait to see how they perform
  • + 2
 Looks soooo incredibly sweet - hooray for USD forks!
  • + 0
 I go the 2005 Dorados and I would love to get the new one... I bet it performs super sweet
  • - 2
 they feel sweet, i've had a little ride round on some. i'm not sure whether to get hese or the new boxxers
  • - 34
 "putting the front wheel between your legs and twisting is not in any way a measure of how torsionally stiff it will be on the trail, so let's just forget that thought altogether." oh really then how come forks that don't bend between your knees dont bend on the trail and ones that do bend do bend on the trail? I might plot a graph to show to correlation.
But damn they do look the mutts nuts
  • + 20
 "and putting the front wheel between your legs and twisting is not in any way a measure of how torsionally stiff it will be on the trail, so let's just forget that thought altogether." That means to me, that you did it and it bends like back in the old days... Well I stick to my boxxers. Cuz they don't bend. The replacable steel insert stick is a good idea though, hopefully there is someone out there from Rock Shox, that reads this article... In my opinion: beautiful, heavier than the boxxers, bends, and damn pricy... Good luck.
  • + 5
 swell review, lets see a review on Risse Racing or Foes now Big Grin
  • - 3
 as sick as they look, and the kick ass damping system they incorparate in that beast.... id still take the new boxxer over it Smile , which im getting in 4 weeks!
  • + 3
 could buy a back up too and it would be around the same range as this!
  • + 1
 can't wait to see it ridden at the wold cups this year
  • + 4
 Think i'll stick to the 40's.
  • + 0
 How many squid are they then?
  • + 2
 Those look nice man but I would still have to give the edge to the Avalanche fork. It is the only true motocross fork for downhill bikes for about a grand less.
  • + 3
 they certantly look the business
  • + 13
 $2775?!?!?!?!?!
  • + 2
 thats what im thinkin
  • + 3
 Geez! Today's forks have evolved so much that even the last Dorado was INSANE for me.. However, This fork is just out of this world..!! Smile
  • + 2
 they are butter they are one of the sickest forks out there
  • + 1
 This is sooo dope! Im do glad they made another one! But by the time i can afford one ill probably have to buy it used anyways Frown
  • - 5
 go rigid. suspension is for pussies.
  • + 1
 ok man what ever you say
  • + 1
 interesting design
  • - 1
 just not cool Frown
  • + 1
 cosmic technology .... look damn good ;D
[Reply]
  • + 8
 All i can say: "Welcome back! We've missed you..."
[Reply]
  • + 4
 this looks amazing and the finish quality is impressive, but the bonding of the carbon legs with a lug in the lower crown predicts much flex.
Remember the first big DH Mr T from Marz?
Thay had similiar solution , which provided a "snake drive system to that fork, which makes no sense of the fork as a triple crown design.
And the price? You see what you pay for.
[Reply]
  • + 3
 its a bit of the steve peat syndrome.....
put him on an orange.. 'its the best bike!..steve peat rides one' so everyone goes and buys them ,now he's on santacruz, everyone rides them, same goes for sam hill and iron horse and soon specialized.. and boxxers, if peaty and hill get dorados you'll all be on them(those that can afford them), its all marketing,sponsorship and hype, the truth is if you put these riders on choppers they'd still be fast as f***k, and we'd all be buying choppers.
[Reply]
  • + 3
 Looks promissing... Hope they will be more reliable than the old Dorado's.
All though the weight is more than than a boxxer for instance.
And why use modular brake mount... not like you want to ride a fork like that with a 6" disc.
[Reply]
  • + 2
 I am new to pinkbike, but have been through the inverted/conventional fork debate before as I come from a motocross background. In simplest terms, a conventional fork and an inverted fork will exhibit different flex characteristics that will feel different to the rider. A conventional fork will have more flex at the clamp based on tube diameters and surface area. This flex results in less steering precision, but a better ride over small bumps. The brace reduces the flex, but it will not be as rigid as an inverted design. An inverted fork will offer better steering precision, but will have some binding on compression. This results in a "stickier" feel on particularily small bumps. When hitting a bump, there is a degree of flex in the stanchions. On a conventional fork this happens at the clamp, away from the sliding area. On an inverted fork this happens at the entrance to the upper, causing a slight binding.

Warren
[Reply]
  • + 1
 Why does everyone think the old dorados weren't reliable? If you service them like you would anything else on a race bike, they hold up great. You can't take the stanchion guards off, they'll collect dust, get hit by rocks, trees, friends, other bikes, etc... as long as you take care of them, they last forever.
  • + 0
 i believe people are referring to the bushings wearing out....the moment forces applied to the bushing of an inverted fork are greater than those applied to a standard fork.
  • + 1
 Ahhh. I weigh nothing, so that may be why I never had a problem with mine. I did huck the holy living crap out of it though....
[Reply]
  • + 1
 upside down forks have always been better, dorados were on most team bikes when they came out years back, the only reasons for the amount of boxxers we see now is up to now no dorados and not much choice from the other companies, shivvers , good fork but heavy, white brothers ,an exceptional fork but the company is not big enough to compete with the big 3, i run white bro's have done for years now and never had any probs .
  • + 1
 USD mtb forks are too flexy laterally. Fore and aft they're way stiffer than reg forks. But the side to side deflection is brutal, and I've owned/ridden them all.
  • - 3
 hmm, lets think about what you just said. the stanchions sit in bushings that keep them straight, correct? these bushings are circular, correct? if you agreed with the first two points, then how do you justify your comment about them flexing more laterally than linearally?
  • - 1
 --i don't doubt your experience, but from a mengr standpoint it just doesnt make sense
  • + 1
 I get what you're saying but it doesn't apply to the front wheel twisting. Go ride a USD fork back to back with a Boxxer (for example) and get back to me.
  • + 0
 Exactly dr sanchez.

I switch from my 888's to shivers when ever the weather gets worse. The flex was extremely noticeable at first but after I adjusted my riding, the flex is a +. Unlike 888's and boxxers (why does everyone and them mom mention boxxers. Boxxers are race only forks. They aren't even close to the same level as the dorado. Comparing them to the new 888's or 40's would be far better of a comparison) the flex is a good thing. If someone isn't used to it, or doesn't like how they flex, just make, or get made a stainless axle for them. Ya will stiffen them up beyond how 40's feel.

Rewster, the flex is controlled by the axle in the forks for USD forks. The stiffer the axle the less side to side flex. Front to back flex is next to none because the suspension compresses instead of bending backwards being our forks are not 90 degrees and raked out instead. So in other words there is only side to side flex and no front to back flex like dr sanchez mentioned. It's nothing to do with bushings. In fact bushings have nothing to do with these forks flexing in the first place... its the axle and the travel. Simple concept.
[Reply]
  • + 2
 They are so ugly.What were they thinking with that GRAPHIC. Do they think we still live in 90s or somthing. There is no bike in the world that this dorados would look good on.
  • + 0
 Damn Right!
  • + 4
 atleast these grafhics are 100x better than the Marzocchi 2008/2009 forks.
  • + 0
 There is no bike in the world that this dorados would look good on
what about the red m6 it was on!
fail
  • + 0
 God that's a sexy setup.... I used to have an m1 with a dorado, so, so fast....
[Reply]
  • + 4
 Great review preview Kakah - I love this comment, 'Fatties and hacks need more air, obviously' LOL
[Reply]
  • + 3
 I can buy the best fork in the MX world for $900 full retail, complete with ti springs and adjusters that actually work. Yay mountain bike industry!
[Reply]
  • + 0
 The reason they're going back to the USD design which, granted, is OVERALL heavier, is because they also have less unsprung weight in the bottom end, which results in a much more responsive fork. I have no doubts this baby would RIDE lighter than any fork out there. Costs a pretty penny though. Any shiver owner would agree with me.
[Reply]
  • + 0
 My whole Team is on them for 09. I will say a few of my guys have been racing on them out West at the SouthRidge races lately and they say its way better than the 2008 Fox 40 and 2008 Boxxer. I think you will start to see more people on this fork by the End Of The Year as it will fast turn into a Must Have for 2009 as the Cane Creek DB did a few years back. Cecil
[Reply]
  • + 4
 That looks like a mean fork, looks mint on the flatline aswell
[Reply]
  • + 2
 Holy wow, that looks amazing on the Flatline, this just may be on my "next" list as far as forks go! Although Im liking the 2010 BoXXer and its 6 lbs!
[Reply]
  • + 1
 A few of my friends have ridden them and really like them. All they need to do is make the top out bumpers just a little thicker... is tops out sometimes but you can not feel it when you are ridding. So I am told!
[Reply]
  • + 0
 Lol if they're actually going to retail that fork for $2275 there is going to practically be no market for it. It is not going to significantly make you faster than using a Boxxer WC or fox 40rc2. Waste of R&D money...unless they actually sell it at a competitive price with other top of the line DH forks.
  • + 0
 ummm, the original dorado's were the same price and they sold thousands of copies of it. Sooooooo there is a market. Not everyone are poor college students or highschoolers around here jett. We have a lot of adults that can afford whatever they want to.
  • + 0
 Yeah, I don't remember seeing too many dorado's around either. Yes, I am one of these adults. However; I wouldn't blow 2k on a fork. Waste of money. Actually i think the majority of users on this site are college students or younger.
[Reply]
  • + 0
 I have always said that manitou have felt great out of the box, but I have seen too many blow up, if they have made a reliable fork thathas a bit longer service life, they have a killer fork on their hands. Only time will tell. PS that is a sexy looking fork
  • + 0
 I think they fixed it by going with the massive uppers and 36mm stanctions. It was the 32mm's that killed em. Too much fork for that stanction. Only boxxers can get away with that... and even still, boxxers are weak as hell compared to the 40's or 888's.
[Reply]
  • + 0
 flag lilwalters (Feb 13, 2009 at 11:22) (Below Threshold) show comment
look around you man... offshore manufacturing is not only cheaper, but higher quality... this year, toyota DESTROYED GM... and GM is like 8 auto companies combined... they get paid less because the cost of living is far less... not to mention they do business smarter...

my advice is even if you can afford US product, still get an education... "


Toyota is a Japanese company yes, and their cars are designed in Japan, BUT they are assembled here.
[Reply]
  • + 0
 flag t3h1337r (Feb 15, 2009 at 12:20) (Below Threshold) show comment
ummm, the original dorado's were the same price and they sold thousands of copies of it. Sooooooo there is a market. Not everyone are poor college students or highschoolers around here jett. We have a lot of adults that can afford whatever they want to"

Are you even old enough to goto College?
The point is I dont give a sh*t how good they are, they are not twice as good as anything else on the market right now...
[Reply]
  • + 0
 flag rewster (Feb 12, 2009 at 16:57) (Below Threshold) show comment
"you can't compare mx to dh mtb. Just like you can't compare bmx to dh mtb. They are all totally different elements with one small thing in common...2 wheels"

very untrue. inertia, couples, moments, and reactant forces are very much the same for the two. it is true to say that just because it works on a mx, doesnt mean it will work for dh. but saying they're like cats and dogs is simply ignorant. open up an mx rear shock and compare it to a dh.....nearly identical, just scaled down. why do you think cane creek is now made by ohlins? "

Another very valid point
[Reply]
  • + 0
 flag ctd07 (Feb 12, 2009 at 12:13) (Below Threshold) show comment
I dpn't wanna clutter the comments, but... the pertinent point was that faulty/untested products aren't tolerated in the mx industry, riders simply wouldn't stand for it, the same is the case in bmx as the sport has properly established itself, mtb however is full of companies 'trying it on' with poorly designed 'test' products; that's what I'm getting at!"



My point exactly
[Reply]
  • + 1
 Its like a Lamborghini Murcielargo, aluminum accents to lush carbon fiber and highly engineered components... its all just a silly hyper fork... but who said a lambo isent DAMN GOOD!
  • - 4
 because a zr1 corvette is faster
  • + 0
 i strongly second that cletus
  • + 1
 And the mclaren f1 is faster than the vette... by a shit ton. Plus its a lame vette. Personally if I wanted a vette, I'd just get the Cadillac CTS with the vette motor on. Lighter, faster, better handling, with the exact same engine. Weeeet.
  • + 0
 And the mclaren f1 is more expensive than the vette... by a shit ton.

The cadilac has 550 horsepower the corvette zr1 has 638, it doesn't take a genius to figure out wich one's faster. And where do you get lighter, faster and better handling from? It's the same chassis with a caddy body with an overstuffed interior.
  • + 0
 not to mention it's all on a saab 9-5 grocery getter platform....
  • + 0
 Have you driven one joeyt?

As for cletus44, your stats are a tad wrong. Look again. One I test drive had the same 600+ powerplant as the vette I tested prior to it. Called "options".
  • + 0
 Yup, drove it. It's not a bad car, but it doesn't handle like a vette. Not even close. But we aren't comparing apples to apples here. It's a big, clunky sedan. Power to weight ratio, anyone? Not to mention the finish. All kinds of plastic in a $60k car? And the horsepower rating is 556, per cadillac.
  • + 0
 What do you think a vette is? Not plastic? Vettes have more composite plastics on them than fiberglass or carbon. They are the same thing minus the chassis so that arguement doesn't make sense.
  • + 0
 The vette with the exception of the rear quater panels is all carbon fibre. The floorpans are actually carbon with balsa wood supports laced in between
  • + 0
 bla bla bla bla this car that car OOOOOOOOO
[Reply]
  • - 1
 "Carbon outer legs" and "$2775$" shouldn't be in the same sentence together, when you are talking about a front shock, imo. To me, upside down forks are good only at lubricating inner tubes and that's it. I'm pretty sure it's working beautifuly, but even if I had the money, I'd pick the boxxer over this.

Also the graphics don't look very good. They should simplify that design. Less colors, text etc..

Considering it's intended usage, I don't think it will be the first choice of riders.
  • + 0
 Ummm, it's a cartridge system dude, it has nothing to do with lubricating things better. Its the whole point in being able to fit a larger cartridge in the uppers. The same idea as foes using the 2:1 ratio shocks. The shocks are huuuuuuge, and have absolutely insane bump sensitivity.
[Reply]
  • - 1
 Rewster - I am not a true fan of inverted forks on pedal bikes as I do not like the flex, They do seem stiffer side to side but honestly I wouldnt bother. BUT on a dirtbike however the size takes care of any flex you might have. I thought my monsters were stiff back in the day, until I got my kx250... mmmmm whoops are so much more fun with a motor Big Grin
[Reply]
  • + 2
 i personally think it looks like a fat waste of money and i also just freaking hate monituo fox and rock shox are way.
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  • + 2
 $2775????

it looks amazing, and im sure it will perform..... but no fork is worth that much cash imo
  • + 0
 what about the curnett forks?
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  • + 1
 stick with boxxers or 40s much cheeper thats what im getting and whats with it on the bottem go with top guys and 2700 out rages
  • + 0
 called get a job?
  • + 0
 dom, learn the spell, then formulate a proper argument.
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  • + 1
 for that money I'd rather shell out for a BOS fork..........or spend some extra cash and get your current fork re-valved. Much better investment.
[Reply]
  • - 1
 they look super tasty, i ride old dorado and i am very pleased with the way it handles and soaks up the meduim to big stuff. i saw steve jones from dirt testing this for recently in the dh track at gloucester on his new intense. no doubt a test from him soon.
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  • + 0
 i love the way the front axel is dezined there is no why of striping the axel and if you strip the clamps you can replace it easy grate job on the new fork
  • + 1
 someone should smack the piss out of your english teacher
  • + 0
 You as well my friend. At least start your sentence with a capitol, and end with a period.
  • + 0
 I think you mean 'capital'. The Capitol is a building in Washington DC.
  • + 0
 I always get mixed up as we have 2 capitol rd's around here... + im dislexic...
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  • + 0
 Hmmm looks super ugly, plus it's a manitou... please don't delete my comment though...respect my opinion...after all i am not making fun of you guys cause ya like it...
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  • + 2
 Man those things are sweet! To bad there so much money....
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  • + 2
 super nice work but $3000+ canadian is crazy
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  • + 0
 the modular brake mounts are genius!!! everybody should start doing that. I loved old dorados but i cant afford these ones!! Never mind they are still pretty.
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  • - 1
 All the fancy damping in the world wont stop them flopping about after a month or so! I loved the old ones where you turned the front wheel and it just kept going in a strait line ;-)
  • + 0
 What are you turning the bars for? Lean, kid, lean. The torsional flex actualy helps you track straight when you hit something off camber, like a rock, root, or other such things that make trails fun. These are sure to be the fastest forks in the racing world, yet again.
  • + 1
 What are you talking about dunx? I ride shivers now, and have rode dorados many times, and that is just an excuse for not being a good enough rider. I have no flex in my shivers. None. Zip. Zilch. nada. If they flex too much, get a stainless axle made like I did. Simple... Problem solved.
  • + 1
 "The torsional flex actualy helps you track straight when you hit something off camber"

haha, that's like saying that it's good to have play in a rear pivot because it aids in active turning....redunculous. torsional flex? ....armchair engineer alert!
  • + 3
 Its open for discussion as to how much it applies on a pedal bike, especially on the front, but it is widely known that MotoGP bikes have a certain amount of torsional flex built into them to help track better at extreme lean angles. Also, C'dale actually removed material from their Judge's swingarm for the same reason.

Having the front wheel between your legs and twisting proves nothing in my mind, it's not a force that you encounter on the trail. First, how often are you riding hard enough to discern your fork flexing, all while the fork is in a fully extended position?? The deeper you are into your travel the stiffer the fork becomes.

Also, the tire contact patch is rather small and not big enough to provide the traction to simulate having the wheel between your legs. I just don't think it really works like that.

Of course I am no engineer or anything, just talking from experiences from riding many inverted forks. Its all opinion after all....
  • + 1
 Its been proven that too rigid of a fork actually hurts your riding newster. I'm guessing you don't know much about bike design and just know what you think looks cool. You want flex. Period.
  • + 0
 t3h1337r

"I ride shivers now, and have rode dorados many times, and that is just an excuse for not being a good enough rider."

I best tell my sponcors that Im not a good enough rider and cancel the worlds than.

Im sure that Zumbi, mavic, Fox shox, Rock Star, 4Mountains, Funn, Maxxis and Hope will understand when I tell them that I have been put in my place that Im not a good enough rider anymore!

Im going to throw my bike away and go and cry.

Thanks for putting my mind at rest.
[Reply]
  • + 0
 I'm not a Manitou fan, more likely i hate them, but this fork is just way to nice, to put on your bike. Hopefully it will it will do better then other Manitou forks.
[Reply]
  • - 2
 wish they'd sorted the graphics out, ruined them. Also, can someone explain why they're still trying carbon upside down forks when the new boxxers are lighter and probably stiffer and probably cheaper? it just seems like they're using MX technology and bodging it so its light enough for MTB use? not a fan, but I dont race so I wouldnt know.
  • + 3
 Dude you missed the whole point in these forks.

You also have to realize, that with the larger uppers, you can fit a bigger cartridge in there, adding further rideability, adjustability, and over all ride in general.

Not everything is about weight. If it was, how come I'm faster on my shivers than my 888's? I'm talking much faster. They feel, work, and ride way different. Inverted forks are dope. Most people that have owned a shiver or similar will say the same thing. Heck my wb DH-3's felt flippen buttery as hell.
  • + 2
 "Not everything is about weight."

I am a weight dork on my personal bikes, not going to even pretend not to be, but there are times when it just doesn't matter. For example, if a CaneCreek Double Barrel added 5 lbs of random weight to my bike I would still run it, it's just that great and is such an advantage. Geometry and suspension, don't compromise for weight!

WB DH-3's, mmmmmm! I miss mine!
  • + 0
 Thats cool, I just did a bit of thinking in my head and I suppose they do make sense. Maybe to some people they do justify their price tag. But I still dont see it really. I Do know what "t3h1337r" means about white bros forks though, they did feel awesome.

'not every thing is about weight' then why have they made it out of carbon fibre?
  • + 0
 Atomlab31,

The carbon material choice could be for a few reasons. One may be stiffness, as in the ability to build in stiffness where it is wanted and be forgiving where it may not be needed. They clearly are not the absolute lightest DH fork out there (not even close), but they are lighter than some.
  • + 0
 Carbon is stronger than aluminum can ever be, thats why.
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  • - 2
 Hopefully stiffer than the first run... or usd forks in general. They work on a mx bike, not so well on a mtb. I have a feeling that its going to be yet another Manitou product that is sooo close to being spot on but some glaring flaw that keeps it from being great. I also have a feeling the new Boxxer will kill the Dorito.
[Reply]
  • + 1
 the return of the forgotten child.... fuk yhea..
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  • + 1
 C'mon and RIDE THE DAMN THING HARD ALREADY!
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  • + 1
 it reminds me of a motocross fork with the decals and running upside down
[Reply]
  • + 0
 hurray for TPC+, no really i like it, its the only system they came up with that hasn't failed horribly
[Reply]
  • + 1
 It looks like a real piece of art!!!
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  • + 1
 look tight, still wouldn't pay 2k for one though
  • + 6
 You wouldn't, because it's more like 3k. Yikes!
  • + 1
 I bet it's nice, but at nearly a thousand more than a Boxxer, it's kinda hard to justify.
  • + 3
 God look at the MSRP for the Fox its similar but they dont really sell them for that much. The fit and finish on that fork is second to none, they thought it through. You get what you pay for.
  • + 2
 Ya, but who wants to spend that much on a fork. With the price of DH gear these days it makes one think about switching to MX. Those bikes have a little thing that makes the "brraaaapp" sound for you so your lips don't get all chapped. The new boxxer has won many races already, and it's what, lighter and cheaper.
  • + 3
 Well, the people who are going to be buying these are going to be serious about riding. Also, let's not start comparing forks that we haven't even tested ourselves, because preferences and experiences are going to vary.
  • - 2
 Lol if you think DH is expensive moto isnt for you, thats why i ride dh now. Moto is retardedly expensive.
  • - 5
 Serious about riding? That's a bit judgmental. I guess moving to Whistler to ride everyday and working as a bike wrench to support my habit isn't sufficient to be considered "serious about riding". I hope you enjoy the $3000 fork your parents are going to buy you juicyt.
  • + 1
 lol wow you should take a critical thinking class, just because you dont buy the fork doesnt mean you arent going to be a serious rider and he didnt say that. Just said that if you are going to spend that much money on that fork you arent/shouldnt be some junior beginner rider.
  • + 0
 Alright, time to clarify what I said. I am not saying that if you don't buy this fork that you aren't serious about riding, that's ridiculous. Not everyone who loves riding is going to want, or be able to afford the fork, including me. I don't think preferences of parts and builds has anything to do with passion. What I was saying is that, for the most part, the kind of people who are going to be buying these are probably racers, people who are willing to make some serious sacrifices to get some, and yes, rich people. I am not saying certain people should/should not get these forks. I am saying that certain people are/ are not going to be getting these.

As a side note, the price mentioned in the video (or wherever) is the MSRP I believe. The fork will probably not sell for that much in stores, as with most products compared to their MSRP. And my second note, to jonnydh, I understand how you feel, but as I have now shown you misunderstood me. That comment about my parents holds no water, because I built one of my bikes (DNA) by myself and bought the V10 complete. When I turned 14, my parents, who are poor, told me I had to get a job because they can't and don't want to buy my expensive bike stuff for me. I have been working since 2 months after my birthday to pay for this stuff.
  • + 1
 whats with everyone saying "id rather stick to my boxxers, no my 40s" blah blah blah, the old dorados are still more advanced then some forks that are on the market now
  • + 1
 how so? other than carbon outers? pretty simple stuff going on inside ...and I don't mean that in a bad way either.
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  • + 0
 b> OMG guys, i just don't know what to say.....looking soooo soooo.....WOW!
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  • + 2
 Legend it's back...
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  • + 1
 Is there anyone on here who has actually ridden on (apart from fclinder)?
[Reply]
  • + 1
 2700 bucks?! wowsers. nice fork though!
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  • + 0
 Ok.it may be the best....but $2775 ..come on..that's too much!
  • + 0
 seriouslly and for something that isnt even that great. Ill take 2 1/2 fox 40s or boxers any day.

If there are two downfalls to mtb its matnitou and shimano ( not to be confused with saint).
  • - 2
 Dude 100% made in the usa. I'm sorry but I don't want some 10 year old asian kid in taiwan working on my 1000$+ dollar forks thank you very much. The extra cost is worth it, ntm your helping an AMERICAN company out. Can't afford it, get educated, sell something, or put a liver or leg up for sale. lol
  • - 2
 look around you man... offshore manufacturing is not only cheaper, but higher quality... this year, toyota DESTROYED GM... and GM is like 8 auto companies combined... they get paid less because the cost of living is far less... not to mention they do business smarter... my advice is even if you can afford US product, still get an education...
  • + 0
 I think "t3h1337r" has a stake in Answer Products. The off shore vs USA arguement made sense, let's say 10-15 years ago, but now many companies out source because the tooling and production capabilities aren't available on this side of the pond. Quality? I hate to say it but off shore stuff is no less quality and sometimes exceeds what's being produced here. Look at when Rock Shox was producing forks in the US, the quality you speak of was not there. Look at what they are now. Who could argue with that.

Higher price does not always dictate higher quality. Its insane at how overly priced the mtb industry is.
  • + 0
 couldn't have said it better myself... speaking like that, you sir must actually be a doctor...
  • + 0
 No... but I did stay at a Holiday Inn once.
  • + 0
 I have nothing against Taiwanese made produts, they're the only way it's possible to have cheap DH frames. But american products made in taiwan are a joke, how come a taiwanese spaghetti legs Boxxer WC can cost almost the same as a american made Fox 40?
  • + 1
 you do realize that boxxers are now 35 or 36mm... not really fair to call them spaghetti legs when you're talking about a 4mm difference... i find the boxxer WC's internals are far more reliable, not to mention a much higher level of tunability, on account of it being airsprung and the external floodgate adjustment...
  • + 2
 Ok, so lets clear this up! Canadian MSRP for a Fox 40 RC2 is $2540, MSRP for a 888 RC3 WC is $2200, MSRP for a Boxxer WC is $2200. The Dorado has a MSRP of $2775, that DOES NOT mean that that is what they will retail for. It is going to be hundreds of dollars more expensive that the competition, but will NOT sell for $2800.

As of right now I have no idea how it is going to stack up against the other top end forks, but lets assume for a minute that it actually IS that much better. For comparisons sake take the CCDB for example. It retails for a few hundred more than a a run of the mill DHX, but it is THAT much better. As I said above, if the CCDB added 5 lbs of random weight to my bike and cost $1000 more, I would still try my best to get one. If the Dorado is in the same category as the CCDB and only a few hundred more than a 40 RC2 it may be more of a player than you think. There sure are a load of 40's out there, right!

Now we just need to find out if its any good....
  • + 0
 lol, frankly, if my shock added 5 pounds to my bike, i'd be in the market for a new shock... i understand you're simply making comparison, but weight plays a large issue in today's bike industry... maintaining strength and performance while reducing weight seems to be the latest hot topic in the industry...
  • + 0
 So 5 lbs was clearly an exaggeration, but it gets the point across. If it actually is as mind blowing as the CCDB, then maybe the few extra hundred bucks and added 1/2 lb of weight will be well worth it. I would far prefer a CCDB w/ a steel spring over a titanium sprung DHX, I think the difference is more that .5 of a pound for that scenario.

Back to the point though: it is not $1000 more than a 40, but should be somewhere around $2-300 extra.
  • - 1
 wow I think the pissing match is hilarious. You guys are all douche bags. until you ride the fork just stfu now. All I said was an opinion and it blew into this shit. You guys are lame.
  • + 0
 woah, easy there gunner... legitimate civil conversation... i don't think there's anything in the rules forbidding that...
  • + 0
 No but their back and forth what fork is better this and that has nothing to do with this article being the forks A: have not been tested and reviewed yet, B: most people on this site has not seen one in person, nor had a chance to ride one.

Just wait before people start saying what fork is better and for why. Until then you guys are just all guessing.

I felt like including douche bags for additional "fun" vocabulary hoping to provoke someone's response to it. Merely for my own entertainment since people get so defensive around here Big Grin
  • + 0
 lilwalters (Feb 14, 2009 at 7:25) (Below Threshold) show comment
you do realize that boxxers are now 35 or 36mm... not really fair to call them spaghetti legs when you're talking about a 4mm difference...

i find the boxxer WC's internals are far more reliable, not to mention a much higher level of tunability, on account of it being airsprung and the external floodgate adjustment...
-----------------------------------------------------------------

Well...
the 2010 boxxers are quite nice, but for someone that doesn't race a higher level of tunability is something BAD, because u will or can make a MESS tuning the fork and put some combinations that can "DESTROY" the linearity, stability and plataform of the fork and u can BRAKE them...
so "SOMETIMES MORE DOESN'T SEEN TO BE THE BEST" (or something like this)
[Reply]
  • - 1
 wow, i have a friend that just got one of these in, can't wait to try it out!
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  • + 0
 Mmmmmm this is look great i think tkis is better than mine Big Grin
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  • + 0
 holly S*it thats a beast!
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  • + 0
 what bike is that? and those forks are lush bet they get agressive Wink
  • + 0
 its a flatline pro
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  • + 0
 i love it long time, but hopefully stiffer this time around
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  • + 0
 Would love buying these forks but they are to pricy,looks very good
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  • + 1
 that is fcking tight
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  • + 0
 ooooh very nice dont like the price tag very much though
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  • + 0
 holly shit those are nice, that a work of art
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  • + 0
 Its sooo Nasty.. I want1.
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  • + 0
 o the best i want one so bad i use to a have the old one
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  • + 0
 Bad decal kit prefer my foes f1 xtd
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  • + 0
 is t that much better than a boxxer or fox 40 for that price!?
  • + 0
 How can you say that when YOU HAVE NOT RIDDEN ONE. One again, people think they know how something rides just by seeing a few pics. Did you not even bother to read the article?
  • + 0
 im just saying that for 1000 dollars more it better ride like the best fork ever. its just a huge price for a fork. i did read the article and it still seems like a ridiculous price. i dont see how a fork can be 1000 dollars better than a 40 or boxxer WC.
  • + 0
 Because it wasn't made over seas in a sweatshop environment. Instead, they are hand made one by one in the USA using real metals. You forget that labor is not cheap in the US.
  • + 1
 dude i think you need to calm down with replying to everybody's negative comments on this fork. you probably have some sort of stake in the company. it will most likely flop like the older one did. people will buy boxxers or 40s regardless of where they are made because they are raced more commonly by pros and they have been on the market for ages so people can trust them. i dont think people will buy this for especially for an extra $1000 because guaranteed there are kinks that will have to be worked out. they can say everything will work fine but its only after its on the market for a while when they figure out what they need to fix. and they cant use the old one as a base design because they claim that everything is new because the other one clearly was horrible. just respect everybody's opinion and keep your own
  • + 0
 how did the older one flop? It lasted 3-4 years. Just about as long as any other fork design.


You say kinks need to be worked out? Did you fail to read that this isn't even a review. So how are you already knowing these forks have issues? That was my point... people are bashing on something that hasn't really been ridden by many, hasn't been tested by many sites, and has almost no reviews to date. So in the end, its nothing about opinion, its everything about just waiting for the test results before you bash them. That is generally called slander...
  • + 0
 ok...boxxer came out round 1997. youre wrong there. 10 years? And its inevitable that the fork will have issues. thats how all new products work.the first one is never perfect. and yes. this one is new
  • + 0
 ummm no, the boxxer has durastically changed in the last 10 years buddy. So again, no specific model fork will last more than 3-4 years. Period.

And how is it inevitable that the fork will have issues? And NO this one is not the first. Its still somewhat based on their tpc dampening... an old and proven design. This is not microsoft... these are forks. There shouldnt be many issues off the start with any system because they put R&D into it, test the hell out of it, refine it, test it more, then release it. Last I've seen pro riders normally get the forks seasons before they come out. What us metal workers and engineers call "prototypes".
[Reply]
  • - 1
 gorgeous fork, if I have money for it ...
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  • - 2
 looks much better ive got an 05 one and its not amazing so this will prob be better
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  • + 0
 thats $2775 US?
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  • + 0
 what a beast of a fork
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  • + 0
 Very high value!
[Reply]
  • + 0
 is it 300 mm or 200 mm ?
  • + 2
 "-Internally adjustable travel between 180mm and 203mm"

300mm is almost 12 inches, dude....use those brains homie!
  • + 0
 they aren't super monsters love... just common sense. Super monsters died. No one in their right mind besides huge drop huckers would need them, and even still, most frames geometry had to be tailored to the forks to eliminate head tube snapping. People were even warned by Jan Karpiel about running them on the apoco and arma. He had to build the frame up just for the forks, or it was both a liability and safety risk.
[Reply]
  • - 1
 very good quality !!!
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  • - 2
 Maybe it rides well... is sure is ugly as sin though.
  • - 1
 this isn't a fashion show. Queers ride pretty bikes.
  • + 0
 Tell the Santa Cruz Syndicate that. Its not about pretty, its about not being ugly as fuck. By the way... only queers use leet speak for a pinkbike ID douchebag.
  • + 0
 LOL, he even said leet speak. What's your's triptex? I bet all your shit is color matched like a chick. Dude get over yourself. Syndicate can give a shit less about how they look... they care about how they ride. Funny you bring S/C into the pic when I live RIGHT next to the company and see the guys saddle up on various trails around here.

Stupid canadian knowing more about american stuff than the americans. Go enjoy your pretty canadian bike as I'm sure most of the american riders around can give a shit less about how pretty something is besides a lady. Remember, you don't need to make up for an ugly lady by getting a pretty bike... just get a decent lady to begin with.
[Reply]
  • - 2
 needs to be cheaper then boxxer midrange to work.
[Reply]
  • - 2
 meh... I'm stickin with my 2005 Stance Flows.
[Reply]
  • - 2
 they should make a single crowned dorados
  • + 0
 they did......
  • - 1
 They sucked....
  • + 0
 only single crown inverted forks that stood the test of time were the shivers. People ran them on their urban bikes also. You couldn't break em. The single crown shivers barely lasted and were a Lawsuit magnet.
  • + 0
 If I remember correctly, the sc dorado had way thinner stanchions....
  • + 0
 Ummm of course they did. Same with the shivers. Do you really think you can stuff a 35mm stanction in those tiny uppers?
[Reply]
  • - 2
 They look like motocross forks !
[Reply]
  • - 2
 man i wish there were some better pics Thumbs Down
[Reply]

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