Pinion Gearbox - Ridden

Sep 24, 2011 at 0:07
Sep 24, 2011
by Matt Wragg  
 
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If you’ve ever wondered, no we’re not above theft for you, our lovely readers. Especially when it comes to something as exciting as this new gearbox from Pinion. We spotted them at Eurobike a few weeks ago and it’s fair to say we were pretty excited about them. So when Falco from Pinion showed up on our doorstep with his pre-production bike, we felt we owed it to you. As soon as he turned his back for five minutes we hammered (or if Falco's reading this, lovingly fitted) the nearest set of pedals into his bike and legged it. Can you blame us?

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Falco's Nicolai Helius with the pre-production Pinion gearbox. To say that this is a special bike would be an understatement.


Why a gearbox? Rear mechs are a flawed system, there’s a box of broken mechs sitting in the same garage we stole Falco’s bike from to prove that theory. These days they shift incredibly well, but they are always vulnerable to being ripped off, are open to the elements and put weight in awkward part of the bike. So over the years many people have tried to find a different system: Rohlhoff and Shimano make their incredibly intricate geared hubs, Honda put a mech in a box and Lahar mounted a geared hub in the middle of the frame. Not to mention a small legion of men in sheds with novel solutions.

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One of the major advantages to a gearbox is the lack of weight at the rear axle - no cassette or rear derailleur required. Less unsprung weight means that the suspension can theoretically react faster to the terrain.

None of these have really given enough of an improvement to really catch on though. Internal gear hubs tend to drag, Hondas had a complicated system of chains to drive the bike and the Lahar had both of these problems. And a common theme among all of them was the weight, they’re all relatively heavy.

This is why we’re so excited about the Pinion system. They have done something that now you see it seems obvious, but nobody has tried before – mounting the gears around the bottom bracket. Getting your head round the Pinion system is somewhat of a mindset change, gears have always been something you can bolt onto your bike, but with this they're part of the frame. It isn't overly complicated (on the outside, at least) and it seems competitive weight-wise.

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The Pinion gearbox is noticeably more compact than any other gearbox design that we've seen. It almost goes unnoticed when looking at the bike from the drive side.

What Pinion have behind them is engineering expertise – Christoph and Michael, the founders of Pinion, met while working at Porsche on projects like their double clutch gearbox. With that kind of background you can’t doubt they know a thing or two about gearboxes. They haven’t rushed either, this project has taken them more than five years to get to this stage and they’re still developing them. The version we tried was number 18, but there’s more tweaks coming before production.

Pinion P1.18 details:
• 18 gears without an overlapping gear range
• Sequential shifting with 11.5% jumps
• 636% gear range
• Uses a twist shifter
• Total weight: 2.6kg (including shifter, front and rear sprockets)
• MSRP: Helius AM frame w/ Pinion P1.18 gearbox - $3399 EUR

Pinion P1.18 gearbox. Photo by Jens Staudt. www.mtb-news.de
Pinion P1.18 gearbox. Photo by Jens Staudt. www.mtb-news.de
The gearbox's cogs are housed within a sealed aluminum housing and fully protected from the elements, making for a reliable and and nearly maintenance free system. Photos courtesy of www.mtb-news.de

Riding the Pinion: So what did we manage to find out before Falco managed to catch us? Well, it works. It was a little strange using gripshift again, like some late-90s flashback, but the feel of the shifter was pretty nice - it’s very light and the indexing is crisp. We did notice that without a rear mech it was a touch unusual not to feel the feedback from chain moving on a cassette through your feet, but not in a bad way. There’s no noticeable drag anywhere in the system either, although that shouldn’t be surprising.

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The twist shifter uses two cables to run through the gears, but the required effort was surprisingly low

The eighteen gears were plenty, the range was fantastic and they felt nicely spaced out. Having all eighteen in one place made shifting over the range much simpler and this could be a big advantage over multiple chainrings. There’s no repetition of ratios and you can get to them in quick sequence.

Falco later explained (he did forgive us) that you need to learn a couple of things with the gearbox. You can’t always shift when you’ve got the power down, but he’s confident that’s just an adjustment to your riding style and after a few days on the bike it’s something you’d find natural. We did notice this pedalling, there seems to be a threshold to how much power you can put through the pedals and shift. If you’re just cruising along it’s not a problem, it's only when you put a bit of force into matters. When the pedals are in the vertical position there’s no pressure going through the gearbox, so if you’ve got good cornering technique you should be able to grab a handful of gears ready for the exit, which was always one of the advantages of gearbox designs.

Weight-wise the bike was on the money too. Falco’s bike is around the 33lb mark (15kg), which is about right for a 170mm trail bike with this kind of build, especially one made by Nicolai. The tubeset in this bike is the same one they use in their downhill frames...

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The Pinion gearbox is a tidy package that shows a lot of promise. We can't wait to spend more time on the production version to put it through a full length test.

Pinkbike’s take: On our quick spin we came away with the overall impression that the Pinion felt very normal. This may sound anticlimactic, but it’s actually very important, it feels like a system you could live with. There are lot of questions we have now that can only be answered by getting one of these out on the trails, but based on our first impressions we’re excited to answer them...

What do you think of Pinion's gearbox? Is this the one that finally puts gearboxes into mainstream use?

Visit the Pinion website for more info.
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136 Comments

  • + 44
 so far there seem to be just two downsides:
twist shifter and you have to use special cranks to work with the gearbox...

want a 6 speed version for DH Big Grin
  • + 17
 Apparently one is in the works... It'll be lighter too as there are less gears...
  • - 25
 This is a great idea.........but when you think about it its pointless...........because the only reason your gonig to need it is for DH, FR, meybies AM ect...........and your cant ride DH using a twist grip, just doesnt work :/
  • + 22
 are long travel bikes pointless because you only need them for 'DH, FR, meybies AM ect'? no. so maybe its you that needs to think about it some more. you have basically said its pointless and then listed things that prove the opposite. calm down, sit down relax and try and let some blood flow to your brain it will aid your, obviously inhibited ability, to make reasoned arguements.
also whilst i would agree everyone hates grip shit style shifters im sure they have a long term plan to make a trigger shifter.
  • + 9
 Sam means that because you can't really use a twist grip shifter in DH and freeride because you want the bars to be solid, this system won't really work on dh and freeride bikes. And the system is taking the "derailleur" forward, away from a vulnerable place and so the suspension works better, which really would only be in effect on rough tracks being rode at speed, as found in DH and Freeride, not usually found in xc. That is why he is saying it is pointless. When they invent a trigger shifter for it then it will be mint.
  • - 11
 yup, with gripshift, everytime you go over a jump you accidently shift gear! = lame!
  • + 6
 If you guys are that bad of a rider and end up shifting everytime you hit a jump with a gripshift system or think you can't ride DH with it, then you should probably be riding something like a 26" trike with a 24 pack of beer in the basket on the back.
Ride a little more relaxed, you won't have a problem, you don't need to hold on as hard as you can to the bars, typical problem with the true bike riders who've never ridden anything else, goes away when they ride a 215 pound motocross for a season or 2.
  • + 17
 I like trigger shifters better myself. But Im going to have to disagree on ghost shifts. I think folks who think this will happen all the time never used a decent grip shifter. I had an X0 for a while on my DH bike and it had a very positive feel and stayed in gear at all times. Also, I didn't usually ride with my hand on the full length of the shifter. I would move my hand over a bit to shift, it becomes second nature. As far as I can tell, at this point in the game the grip shift is the only way for this system to work correctly. You don't have the spring tension of a rear mech on the cable which is what allows a trigger shifter to work so well. This thing works a lot more like a motorcycle sequential gearbox. You have to change your thinking. All that being said, if these catch on they will continue to improve. I like it. Totally bad ass.
  • + 8
 I ride grip shift on my Dh bike and it works amazingly.. Just like the guy said above when you ride any kind of bike your supposed to be super light on the handlebars not death grip
  • + 2
 Sam how is this pointless? Their point was to make an internal gearbox on a longtravel trail bike, keep it competitively light, and reduce the vulnerability to your whole drivetrain. Its not the end all be all for drivetrain, its just a step in a better direction Smile
  • + 2
 But you can't change gear under load, so I must ask how this is any use for competition?
  • + 6
 C'mon people ride motocross where the whole right grip turns! I don't see any problem with grip shift. It will allow you to rip through as many gears as you want. Say you crash and need your lowest gear to get going.
  • + 1
 I wasn't necessarily saying it was made for competitive use. I said it is competitively light. 170 mm, full gear range, 33lbs. And you cantshift while pedaling, just not smashing the pedals. However on their own website it says you can shift at any moment. So maybe they will have this kink worked out by production phase. This is still in prototype form but very close, its their 18th version and 5th year designing. I'm sure they can figure it out.
  • + 0
 Meant to say can shift***
  • + 6
 genuinely think that this is the future for mtb's, so many future advantages, as soon as they create/trend a standard fitment it'll begin to take over
  • + 2
 For me gripshift, bunnyhopping and rough (fun) trails just don't mix. You guys who say ride with a light grip must not be riding the kind of rough trails I like to hit. Try bunnyhopping at trail speed(or any speed) with a light grip! Light grip On a rowdy trail will have the bars torn right out of your hands and that ain't a pretty sight. Not that I'm saying you need a death grip all that often.
  • + 7
 dude, your not the only one riding rough trails. Gripshifts aren't great, i've never liked them, but try making a trigger shifter with 17clicks, even if you managed, it would take you a minute just to shift from top to bottom.
  • + 3
 running an x9 twist shifter with the ODI lock on grips that match it I have never had any problems, maybe your not gripping the bars with your 2nd and 3rd fingers enough?
  • + 4
 I'd be more interested if there was an electronic shifting option. I don't mind gripshift - i ran it for ages and I can bunnyhop, race, jump, rail turns, ride park, and make unicorn tears into gold coins - but I'd like to see a third option for shifting, for the sake of innovation. Let the flaming begin!
  • + 0
 There are already 3 options. Care to make up some more randomness?
  • + 2
 Electronic shifting is still unofficial for MTB as far as I see it.
  • + 1
 def not giving up my Saints
  • + 4
 Get a ZERODE instead!!!!!!!!!!
  • + 1
 I don't like grip shifts at all, anytime you ghost shift when your catching your bars is bad mind you not very many people doing no handed tricks run gears. (except big mountain/freeride)
  • + 3
 You could do like this guy did.
www.pinkbike.com/photo/2386795
  • + 1
 HAHA thats a well good idea^^ i like that. im forever getting my shifts the wrong way round on ma xc bike as its the reverse of my dh bike
  • + 1
 @Antron
there I was just about to be a smart arse and suggest that paddle shifters would work for this box and you've ruined all my fun by highlighting that someone's already been there and done that.

So to take the idea further, they could integrate the paddle shifter in to your brake levers, so that waggling them up and down changes gear? Oh no.. wait.. doh
  • + 1
 No, I haven't ruined your fun, check out the album that that picture is from. They're modified paddles for a Rohloff geared hub. If it's possible with a Rohloff you could probably do it with this!
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  • + 19
 Lets combine this with the Acros hydraulic shifter with the Pinion Gearbox. Think of the possibilities of that set-up on a capable downhill frame. And anyone who is troubled by the idea of the gearbox needs to be quiet and let it develop. You guys can keep taking poor lines thru the rocks and breaking your derailleurs off or constantly tweaking them while I am flying past you effortlessly with my beautiful new gearbox. Remember without progression and technological advancement, including all the dumb ideas and mistakes, we would not have the brilliant bikes we ride today.
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  • + 18
 I could see this working if everyone agreed on a standard size/ fitting
  • + 52
 Yep. Too bad the industry as a whole can barely agree on any standard...
  • + 5
 this design calls for a completely new rear dropout spacing
I can't decide between 155 mm for stability or 105 to be cooler than bmx Wink
  • + 5
 stability for more fastorz Razz
  • + 1
 Or spacers could be used to keep the dropout spacing to 155mm
  • + 1
 rotor aligment and chain line becomes a bitch then =/
  • + 3
 The rotor will stay in the same place if using spacers, and the chain line is better because you could line it directly with the front cog
  • + 8
 I bet most of the hate is coming from Sram and Shimano.. haha
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  • + 10
 i like innovations like these .. everyone is skeptical until it finally work. carbon frame, 10 speed shifters,air forks , etc etc
  • + 1
 I agree, I found it really handy compered to traditional shifting as long as its maintenance is as simple as its function. The hydraulic brakes as well as suspensions were a rational step forward since a mtb is moving on dusty gravel with a lot of uphill & downhill, especially downhill. So you really need them. Regarding the carbon & 10 speed shifters, apart from a pro rider, few people can really tell the difference, myself included. Innovation is also an electric downhill bike, would you buy one? (no offence).
  • + 1
 My mistake: between carbon frame & alu. it is easy to come to a conclusion related to stiffness, especially in uphill sections. But, between 9 or 10 speed (3x10 or 2x10) depending on the ratio front & rear it is a bit difficult for an average rider like me to tell the difference. I belong to majority not minority.
  • + 1
 i would not buy and electric bike because i think it defeats the purpose. i am a downhill biker so my experience stops there. an electric downhill bike is of no use for me since we have chairlift. but in other countries where people have to shuttle around it could be a great innovation. as for the 10 speed shifter. am cross country might not see a huge difference adding 3 other gears on their already 30. but on downhill 1 gear makes a whole difference.
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  • + 6
 Do want! Bit pricy but I can wait for trickle down. Belt drive it please!

I'd even take a derailleur and cassette in a sealed box bathed in oil (aka honda). Constant chain pull angle to simplify dialing out pedal bob, less to snag on rocks. Simpler, cheaper, symmetric rear hubs with larger diameter axles and bearings. weight moved from way off center and un-sprung to centralized and sprung.. and belt drive to the wheel so I don't have to oil my chain! maybe throw the freewheel before the cassette so you can shift while coasting... and make the box outa carbon fiber.
  • + 1
 ^ what he said!
  • + 1
 you can belt drive it yourself... the parts are hard to find but they exist
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  • + 4
 does Falco keep the derailer hanger on there because he has no other way to open a bottle?
(kidding)
Serious question: how does having the tensioner at the crank affect pedal bob, chain stretch, chain slap, anti squat, pedal feedback, bb clearance?
  • + 1
 As far as clearance, it looks to be above the gear so it wouldn't be the first thing to be hit. Since all the gears are up front its important to keep the chain on there. As far as pedal bob? No change. Chain slap? Looks like it would bethe same. Anti squat? Not sure why it'd change. Pedal feedback? That depends on the bikes chain growth.
  • + 2
 I was talking about this kind of chain device yesterday. AM bike and hammerschmidt with this kind of chain device would be amazing. Climbing and along the flat gears, dual speed for the single speeders on an AM bike. 3 speed Hammerschmidt with a chain device would be perfect for me.
  • - 2
 quote - Serious question: how does having the tensioner at the crank affect pedal bob, chain stretch, chain slap, anti squat, pedal feedback, bb clearance?

?!?! i see the marketing got to you mate. it simply tensions the chain goddamit, do you even have any idea what the other stuff you mentioned means?!
  • + 1
 BaronVonSchwinn, this type of chain device has been around for many years in the form of the RooX Roller Coaster.

www.roox.at/Components_web_2006/product_page_chaindevices_2006.htm

I would say that the advantage is that you would gets less slap because the device sits near the BB where there is little suspension movement - if it was at the rear axle it would be thrown around a lot more.
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  • + 3
 It's gonna work, cause it's 'Made in Germany', not in china or some place around. Gearboxes are the future, it only needs to drop the price and find trust from the bikes manufacturers. The cassete/derraileurs system has been around for decades, it's time to get some better stuff....
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  • + 4
 I would like to see an article with a comparison of the pinion gearbox and the gboxx 1 with a rohloff speedhub, which you can find on the Nicolai Nucleon AM. What arte advantages and disadvantages of these to systems? Smile
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  • + 7
 lets see a titanium and carbon pimped version too
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  • + 2
 Love to see progression of any and all things bike related. The more these products evolve, they will become more efficiant, reliable, lighter, and even more affordable.That said, make a great product, and all the haters will be first in line to buy it !
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  • + 2
 Finally, awesome work guys! Let's broke that silly cartel agreement of big brands about buying more and more new cogs, chains and derailleurs. Your system has very reasonable weight, 636% gear range is very cool, maintenance period is perfect BUT I think that much gears is not necessary even for XC so you can save another bit of weight and simplicity and make it like 10 or 9 speedSmile Also what about rockring? And maybe chain device should be more compact. Thanks!
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  • + 5
 Mechs are so primitive compared to a good gear box, its about time someone does this.
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  • + 2
 Really? This system makes perfect sense for mountain biking. Remove the gearing from the rear and widen the rear hub flanges strengthening the rear wheel considerably, remove the rear derailleur, shorten the chain and replace with a much stronger and tougher chain (little to zero chain slap- yes!), bring the majority of the drive train weight into the the most central and lowest COG point on the bike, man I can really get my head around it. This is awesome.

I loved the Hammerschmidt, I love geared hubs, but I really think this is the future.

I dont need 18 gears though, but hey you know what i will take them if the pricing on this goes down. $3k plus is just more than I can afford but this is very exciting indeed.

Grip shift dont bother me as I have been running it forever so bring it on.
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  • + 2
 2 things I really like: made in Germany + its weight. 2 things that worry me: its maintenance + the cost (of maintenance). 1 (silly) objection: how many frames will need to cosmetically deformed so as to ' host' the new gearbox (especially the carbon ones).
  • + 1
 maintenance - almost none. changing the lube once a year perhaps and when the gears go to hell, simply buy a new one (that should be at least 3 yrs of everyday riding)
  • + 1
 Maintnence would be oiling the tranny. I think they said you need to replace or maintnance the gears every 60,000km.
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  • + 4
 This is such a great move for the bike industry , give it a few years and some refinement and some thing along these lines WILL be the future for our sport.
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  • + 1
 Ok you people seem to be buggin about twist shifting and such but have you guys completely ignored the fact that you (can't) put heavy leg work into this system without it failing, I don't know about you guys but slamming on the pedals on hard sections or crazy climbs happens, and if this system (current system) takes a dumb while trying to crunch up the hill I would be forever disappointed.
  • + 1
 I've been thinking about this since I wrote the piece and what I keep coming back to is: is there any gear system that works under power? Cars, trucks and bikes all have clutches to isolate the gears from the power when you're shifting. So maybe the bigger question should be, should we have clutches on our bikes?
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  • + 1
 I think that it's a great idea with a lot of potential! However it is expensive to buy and could be expensive and tricky to fix if damaged. Rear mechs are vulnerable, but they are also easy to come by and to replace, also any one with an average amount of mechanical skill can fit them. Good luck to those involved in this, it is a dream worth chasing!
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  • + 1
 Pinion's gearbox was one of my personal highlights for 2010's Eurobike - and it was good to see that these guys (that have a solid background in making gearboxes for BMW) had a bigger booth at 2011's Eurobike. And that a number of manufacturers like Alutech and Nicolai were presenting bikes with that gearbox in it.

As for versions with less than 18 speeds, the guys from Pinion already answered in 2010 "if we can do 18 speeds, we can easily do 9 or 6 speeds as well - it all depends on the demand." So, let's all hope gearboxes make it to the showrooms in a short while, as the advantages are more than obvious in terms of weight distribution, maintenance, sturdyness etc.
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  • + 1
 God I can't wait for this or any other gear box drive train to get on the market. I hate derailleurs so much. I just hope my current rig holds out till there market price comes down a bit. I'd love to rock gearbox bikes for DH and a all rounder.
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  • + 1
 Great concept and design. All the negatives posted are very subjective.. The only one I can see is : The need to buy a new frame to adapt to this. We all have great bikes already. The need to splurge $XXXX in a new frame (not obviously distributed in every country) makes it prohibitive. Unless EVERY manufacturer embarks on the adventure, it will make it an exclusive (or competition sponsor-driven) item at best. Also, even if all makes would try to propose this, I can see a few case where proven frame designs (as in many of the super-low suspension ones) would not work with the ergonomics and dimensions of the Pinion, which is too bad..

Single-speed is where it's at :-)
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  • + 1
 Here is the million dollar suggestion that will really perfect this system. Take the pneumatic trigger shifting of Shimano Airlines and swap that out for the grip shifter. The single greatest feature of using airlines was that you had a right trigger and a left trigger and you could choose right upshifts or downshifts and the left side does the other choice. Those triggers were so smooth and awesome. Imagine having that tied to the internal gearbox benefits. That is my dream drivetrain. Make it happen please!!!! So close! =)
  • + 1
 It wouldn't have to be a pneumatic trigger - you just need one cable turning the mechanism in one direction to shift up, and another to turn it in the opposite direction. That way you only need to push with either thumb, just like Airlines. The only problem would be taking up the slack of which ever cable was the 'slave' on that particular shift. People have tried trigger shifters with Rohloff, but the Rohloff takes a WHOLE lot of cable in its run through the gears. Judging by the fact that the photo shows gear 18 on the collar right next to gear 1, the Pinion also uses a lot of cable. Deraillers use tiny amounts in comparison.
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  • + 5
 another downside, inbuilt to a particular frame!
  • + 4
 Yes but this is just the projecting. If it is sold to other nike companies then they'll happily take it on. Think about it-If say, Nicolia, santa cruz, Trek, Intense and orange for example, take on the Pinion system- they'll all have a universal standard fittment (to that specific design anyway). you could buy a box and have the gear ratio's to how you like and when you want to buy a new frame, you could sell your old one and keep the gear box to transfer to your new bike. Much the same as selling a frame now and keeping all your components that you like.
It is still early days but if and when the other companies take this on, it'll become the norm'. Much the same way as Disc brakes Suspension came about.
  • + 5
 mmm but then Trek would take that standard and make it 3mm wider... that seems to be their thing with rear axles at the moment
  • + 1
 Well maybe so but the point I'm putting across is that the pinion box will be the universal standard. That's what'll be bought and used as the main design.
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  • + 1
 This is the future- Rohloff and Shimano have the IGH options but this really is awesome. How many riders continue to move to a 1x9 or 1x10 set up looking for simplicity? Well give these guys some real money and time and lets see what they can do.

Nicolai builds a bitchin frame- I would love to see some like Transition take this on as well.
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  • + 1
 Grip shift with gearboxs is fine, as you can change more gears in one movement than with a trigger, so for a all MTN bike it's great.
If you run the shifter in so you're hand is only just touching it, YOU WILL NEVER MIS SHIFT.
I had a Lahar and had no issues with shifting at all. Oh, and to the tester, it was about 40lbs, so hardly heavy for a bike five years ago.
You guys banging on about the shifter are very narrow minded, you'r missing, the massive gear range, shifting when not pedaling, virtually zero maintenance. Fool proof, even virtually zero gear tuning, way less unsprung weight, so better performing suspension, also lighter rear end for chucking about, longer lasting chain, low COG, shifting even when coasting through a rock garden, and not having something as fragile as your balls hanging off the back of your bike to be smashed, bent etc. I'd happily swap that for grip shift, and have, as I now have a Zerode, a comuter,trailbike hardtail with an Alfine. Also the cost is made back so quickly, evn without any broken mechs, your chain will last longer, and no perishable cassette(yeah you still have one sprocket front and rear, but they're not having a chain rammed into them every minute.
I'm all over it. Sign me up.
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  • + 1
 I have been waiting for something like this or years. expensive specially when you think 3399 euros = $4700 us. expensive now but the price should drop a bit for the gearbox and other frame makes will have less expensive frames. Too bad I am poor, otherwise I would try to buy one.
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  • + 1
 It would be awesome if they sold a 9 speed gearbox that you could team up with any crankset including hammermsunvbesut.

That way you can have your 9 speed and your hammershmigent for 18 speed then regular cranks for 9 speed ie DH or manly AM/trail riders.
  • + 2
 why? more weight, more parts to break. what's worst - even more $$$
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  • + 1
 Grrrrreat idea, seems like it's the evolution of the G-Boxx. I've been riding one for 3 years without a single problem and I love it. Love the Gripshift too.

I would like to see the possibility of mounting the swignarm pivot right around the crank axle like the G-Boxx so you don't have to use a chain tensionner like this one above and hear that chain slap going down like a fückin Harley-Davidson idling at a red light.
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  • + 2
 Not going to lie, I was anti grip shift until about 4 hours ago. Road my friends M9 with a grip shift setup and it was solid. There is definitely potential there.
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  • + 1
 As soon as they make them with trigger shifters then i'm def getting one. No more worn chainrings/chains, cleaning mechs and cassettes. Need to get them sorted asap so they can be good and affordable.
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  • + 2
 www.mtb-news.de/news/2011/08/25/alutech-fanes-pinion-2
this is another Pinion-Frame to come. also a german manufacturer. ALUTECH.
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  • + 2
 I'm all for gearbox development! WOn't buy with gripshift though. Six gears covering the normal 2x9 range would make me very happy..
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  • + 0
 Yes think this is a good idea, but derailluar in a box could work better due to less gearing parts = LESS Weight and more performance, so wonder if this will go the way of other gear box bikes and dissapear
See my page for pics of my Sealed Drive Bike
  • + 3
 how is derailleur in a box more performance? it seems like "D in a B" (haha) has fewer speeds, needs to be turning to shift, is less smooth and less robust
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  • + 1
 "Total weight: 2.6kg (including shifter, front and rear sprockets)" = 5.7 pounds? that seems waaaaay too light for this sort of thing. looks sick though, gearboxes are 100% the future, as Zerode has shown.
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  • + 1
 you guys forgot about GT's IT-1. it was made for 2 years (06-07), I have one and love it. 46ibs stock is tad on the heavy side tho
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  • + 1
 Hope the bottom panel is reinforced. Could see a lot of rocks flying up from the front wheel and hitting the flat surface and making dents. Could even damage the internals :/
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  • + 2
 If In say 5 years, when this becomes slightly more affordably and all the kinks are worked out, i would deffinately buy this
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  • + 1
 Look at Pro's running 4spd dh drive trains!! look at me ripping derailer off in rock garden! problems solved. $1499 for the 6spd version, sweet!.
[Reply]
  • + 1
 good quality grip shifts are actually nice to run, i like this, so much neater than others a have seen, i dislike the large sprocket at the back thouu
  • + 1
 so put 11t on there and show them all how it's done!
  • + 1
 if i was silly enough to waste my money on this!
  • + 1
 well you don't know what the 'box's internal ratios are, so thats probably a normal size for the rear sprocket and what your used to seeing would be way too small
[Reply]
  • + 3
 it gonna need valvolines!
[Reply]
  • + 3
 Gripshift SUCKS massive plums. That is all.
[Reply]
  • + 1
 I one day want to live in a world where derailleurs are obsolete. This looks like a good start.
[Reply]
  • + 2
 you had me till "twist shift"
[Reply]
  • + 2
 The Pinion would work with a Minion, in the Opinion of my Dominion...
[Reply]
  • + 1
 derailleurs seem to work good enough, it moves my chain up and down the cassette.
[Reply]
  • + 2
 it'd be interesting to see a hydraulic one
[Reply]
  • + 1
 "You can’t always shift when you’ve got the power down,"

This isn't an issue for anyone?
[Reply]
  • + 1
 i like it. i'm open to some fresh ideas for the better good! hope it goes well and it takes off! :
[Reply]
  • + 1
 33 pounds for a 170mm gearbox bike?! thats pretty bloody good for a non gearbox freeride bike!!
[Reply]
  • + 1
 Bye bye derailleurs and cassettes???!! Virtually no maintenance?
When the DH version comes out put me down for 2!!
[Reply]
  • + 1
 I love it! I want something like this very much! The inside detail looks very stout! RideOn!
[Reply]
  • + 2
 At 33lbs... looks awesome!
[Reply]
  • + 2
 i think 't's a cool idea but i think it is to expensive for now.
[Reply]
  • + 1
 why do they still use those huge ring / cog? can save some weight there. shorter chain, better clearance...
  • + 2
 By increasing gear size, you reduce load on the gears and your legs. If you ride a mtb with micro gearing, then switch to the same mtb with the same gearing, but with larger sized gears front and back, it will be easier to pedal(only just). Not a huge difference but it just helps reduce strain on parts.
  • + 2
 Yes micro gears also put very high loads on the bearings.
[Reply]
  • + 1
 thats so cool bet its expensive tho Frown
[Reply]
  • + 1
 somebodys gunna hit a rock just sayin not hatin
[Reply]
  • + 1
 looks interesting, but I was hoping twist shift had died years ago!
[Reply]
  • + 1
 nice this pinion sistem.....
[Reply]
  • + 2
 This is the future.
  • + 2
 t's the future only if Shimano joins in, but they'll never want to do away with their disposable derailleurs. This is the right direction. It'll become lighter and more reliable and I'm sure the twist shift will be a faded out as well.
  • + 0
 shimano already make a gearbox for mtb.... ever heard of zerode bikes??? they are downhill, trigger shift, and a damn sight better setup than anything mentioned here
[Reply]
  • + 1
 $3400 will take a long time to get used to.
[Reply]
  • + 2
 So 0-60mph in...? Razz
[Reply]
  • + 2
 Twist Grips... really?
[Reply]
  • - 2
 twist shift? urgh..

hammerschmidt looks nicer too.

Wonder how much the whole system weighs too - it's not ideal for lightweight XC etc, looks chunky and can't be lighter than a small derailleur
[Reply]
  • + 1
 Frame still has a mech hanger? odd
[Reply]
  • + 1
 looks like I will buy a Nicolai next
[Reply]
  • - 2
 il stick with what i got, but good idea i geuss
[Reply]
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