While electronics are pervasive in our day to day lives, until recently bicycles had remained relatively free of them, except for cycling computers and lights. That's rapidly changing, and over the next few years it's likely more and more electronically controlled components will be entering the cycling world. Shifting and suspension are the two places where the changes have already begun to happen, but other components, such as dropper posts, may see electronic controls as well.
Electronic shifting appeared as early as 1990, but wasn't commercially available until the introduction of Shimano's Di2 system for road bikes in 2009. While still not available for mountain bikes, prototypes have been spotted, and there's no reason not to think Shimano isn't at least considering an off-road version. An electronic shift system on a mountain bike would mean no more dealing with cables and housing that can be contaminated by the elements, and would make cable routing less of an issue. Wires take up less space and can navigate sharper angles on a frame than what is possible with traditional cables and housing.
Fox's iCD system allows the rider to control the front fork and rear shock's suspension settings simultaneously. Further advances in the integration of electronics and suspension are just over the horizon.
The suspension world has seen a new wave of electronics enter the field, ones that work infinitely better than the ill-fated K2/Noleen electronic shock that arrived circa 1999. In 2012, Fox introduced their iCD system, which allows riders to control both their fork and shock settings at the same time. The system uses a Shimano Di2 battery for power, with a claimed run time of 2.5 months before needing to be recharged. Even more sophisticated systems are on the way, including Rock Shox's e.i. (electronic intelligence) system, which uses accelerometers to measure the force of an impact on the front fork, and then relays this information to the rear shock within .1 second. Marzocchi currently has a motocross fork that electronically controls the fork's compression and rebound settings, with plans in the works to introduce a mountain bike fork using this same technology.
Dropper posts are another area with the potential to see the introduction of electronics. As far back as 2009 Shimano filed a patent for a dropper post controlled by an electronic motor. At this year's Sea Otter Classic, Giant Bicycles had a prototype dropper post that uses a servomotor to raise and lower the seat. Giant's prototype had wires running from the handlebars to the post, but the concept of an dropper post that can be controlled via a wireless remote on the handlebar is even more appealing – no more cables to contaminate or hydraulic lines to kink.
Although Shimano's patent for an electronically controlled dropper post was filed in 2009, they haven't announced plans to produce one any time soon.
Of course, the addition of electronics to bicycles isn't without potential downsides. While advances in battery technology have allowed for increasingly long run times, the possibility of getting stuck in the woods without a working derailleur or suspension system does exist. Plus, the inherent simplicity of the bicycle has always been part of the appeal, and adding intricate electronics certainly adds a level of complication not everyone will approve of. Riders exploring remote locales could also have difficulty finding replacement parts, and servicing electronics isn't something that can easily be done in the field. Whatever your views, it's going to be interesting to see where this influx of new technology takes us over the next few years.
A true purist would ride a single speed rigid bike with cantilever brakes.
To me, if they can get it to be reliable and simple I'd say why not. If I can't service it myself at home or it will jack up the price like crazy then I'll stay clear of it.
1.To commute
2.To exercise (bikes are synonymous with fitness)
3.To have fun
Exercising, training, whatever is the right word, is enduring a hardship in order to develop a healthier body and mind. That requires forcing the body to effort. But in the process people want it to get kind of easy. So they look for ways to make it so. And they go to such extents in order to get that paradox of "easy hardship" that they f*cking forget what was the point. They want it to be enjoyable. If I commit myself to it, it's gotta be fun. Too bad if it is too easy it gets boring quite fast, and we end up with a piece of toxic junk you don't want and never needed.
Then the commuters, who also want to have things easier and faster, understood! But there is an issue... Why do most people who can afford an el-bike (important: those who can afford an el-bike!), decide to ride a bike to work instead of taking a bus or a car? Because they: 1.Believe it is an exercise! 2.Because they think it is more eco-friendly. Both things go to shit as soon as they buy an el-bike, and to compensate they come up with the lamest, stupidest excuse: I don't want to come sweaty to work or to a meeting. Oh you bloody hipocrite.
Specialized Turbo looks f*cking sweet though, at least it is honest! Pure fun, pure power.
that might be useful feature
except brakes never ever electric brakes!
I want to feel the reactions of my bike, not feel the reactions of some electronics
trollolololo
Shimano have poor margins on Di2 compared to their mechanical systems, its really seen as a flagship product than a profit generator
Di2 XTR sales would be so small, its probably not worth the time to do the R&D and tooling
I have seen several MTB's using Ultegra Di2 in a 1 x 10 format with the climbers buttons mounted to a custom made rapidfire "pod" to give the correct finger ergonomics on a flat MTB handlebar, but is custom work, not Shimano's...
(The cars are killing the planet? Oil is in everything you own. Where do you think the energy came from to manufacture your bike and all its components, It wasn't a hamster in a wheel. What other abundant and cheap source of energy do we have other than fossil fuels? We have to find another source before we run out. Until then oil wont be going away).
Get smart, give people an enhanced environmental and social education, instead of numbers and dates, and the planet will be fine. Show them all religions, show them atheism, let them contemplate and choose, find the deeper meaning in life and nobody will buy an SUV or four mountain bikes
Does anyone know a way to get this guy blocked?
When it comes to other parts, I don't see any significant benefit and I'm not fan of doing things differently just to show that it's possible (when talking about commercial products, not prototypes).
the new 11 speed Dura-Ace Di2 is actually a lighter groupset than the new 11 speed Dura-Ace mechanical groupset (this is a first for Di2 as the older 10 speed Di2 systems have always been slightly heavier, the weight difference was actually only the battery in a true comparison)
you can take a spare battery with you when using the older 10 speed Di2 systems, it just mounts into a battery holder either on the bottle cage or under the down tube, or other locations on some bikes (not hard to engineer a suitable location for MTB)
typically a road rider will get 2,800-3,500 km on a single charge, which gives a huge range. Current road Di2 is designed so that you get low battery warning, then after 100km the front derailleur stops shifting (this consumes the most power) allowing you to get home using the rear derailleur gear range.
if you have worked on Di2 or ridden it, its actually a brilliant system
I have a diagnostics suite in my workshop and can setup the gears from the workshop computer! Its also ideal for internal cable routing frames which can often have "difficult" problems with gear indexing reliability which is usually related to internal carbon texture or convoluted routing pathways playing havoc with gear shifting
once those Di2 cables are installed, unless you smash the derailleur or tear a cable by accident, there is nothing to adjust or maintain apart from cleaning the drivetrain as normal (lubing chain)
whether its worth the large price premium is another matter altogether?
I too was internalizing that complicated battery situation in my head. :-)
"I cant, I forgot to charge my bike"
Had a good laugh at this one.
but i have derailleurs that are ten plus years old and still work, cant say that for any of my electronics :?
Nowadays electronics have an "engineered lifespan".
maybe MTB will be different, as we have a far less friendly relationship with the UCI. In fact, i would kind of welcome the UCI trying to ban something like this: anything to drive that wedge deeper.
You have to walk before you can run geeze....
The other rider gets up and says "Ahh yea I'm ok, it's just that when I went to shift my system crashed and my rear shock exploded which sent me flying over..
.
"Ohh" the first guy says, "you must be running the Vista version of Di and iCD".
I want full body solar and a solar bike with a solar trailer.
I see no reason why it should not be done on bikes. (If done right, obviously)
And for all the people saying they do not want to sound purist, well you just do.
20 years ago you would be politely expressing your opinion about hydraulics having no place in bikes... ?
People think industry should react to demand. There is no demand because this is what designers do, they create what does not exist yet or improve current designs step by step. then marketers create demand for it by packaging it. And they all do it with the use of what's called "Imagination", a thing that with all due respect, an average bread eater lacks. So he has very little needs and demands ,especially that he cannot "need" shit he hasn't seen. Top racers can do it, because on the edge they are able to imagine what sort of equipment can take them further.
Let's just take it in a buddhist way... enjoy it passing by
On second thought. Give me radio controlled brakes and eliminate those annoying hydro lines between levers and calipers. Battery power calipers might even be able to recharge themselves with a bit of clever engineering.
Buaaah haaa haaaaa haaaa.
(but maybe, like in the year 2063)
The system must weight 2-3lbs anyway, even if there are performance advantages--no thanks.
Is that why everybody needs $3,000 frames--so they can negate the weight savings by putting on this techno garbage?
I'll keep my shifting mechanical...at least I don't need to be an electrical engineer to wrench on my shifting.
Hmm... sounds a lot like the complaints people have about electronic controls! Sure, it might take some time, but I bet you like anything, if it provides any advantage that people will start to use it. And come on, fork companies have been trying to mechanically adjust suspension settings on the fly forever! Watch, one World Cup XC or DH racer will win a race - or the season - with electronic controls. Everyone else will grumble about it for the off-season (not pure! cheating!) then quietly ask their sponsors if there's a way to get in on that electronics action before the next season. Or maybe they'll start using cantilever brakes, brick-sized cell phones, and steel frames to protest.
What do I do when something doesn't work with this thing? You can't repair it by yourself.. You'll need someone to repair it..
I have a little collection of my past downhill bikes dating back to about 1995 (when I started downhilling). If I look at my bikes the developement is clear to see and the newer the bikes the quicker they are downhill. (don't give me any comments about a good rider being just as quick on any bike), I'm just an average rider and my Tomac is quicker than my Sintessi which is why I bought it (and they were both world cup standard bikes once).
Point is I bought newer bikes as they allowed me to go down a hill faster, Electronically controlled suspension has the potential to react to terrain faster than mechanical, with that comes the potential to go faster.
So just as suspension has progressed from an elastomer block electronics is just further developement, so long as its reliable it will sell.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=SBXQ-6uI8GY
So with that in mind, If all the relevant sensors could communicate via wireless, have no visible differences from a regular shock - apart from a properly engineered bump somewhere to house a battery and a servo; I'd be okay with that.
But what we have right now is a plastic box stuck to the side, and wires everywhere - like a student prototype. I can't actually believe they've released a product that looks the way it does. It wont take off until they let Fox engineer a solution from the ground up. Until then we will have tacked on boxes.
Anyway, packaging is probably secondary to them at this time. I'll also bet that the engineers prolly don't like it, but are forced to make it ready for release by corporate cats for marketing reasons.
Another question too me is what exactly does mean for the internal design of dampers on mountain bikes. In the short term, these controllers will most likely effect change by actuation of external switches on existing shocks and forks no? But this means actuators, linear or rotary, that will increase weight and complexity. But what about the the long term where the dampers have internal electronics and can effect change internally? Yes! Magneto-rheological fluids inside mountain bike shocks that are controlled by varying magnetic fields to adjust damping 100's (understated for sure) of times a second, which takes power.
A suspension that can adapt to conditions as it see's them is the holy grail of all wheeled sports.
That said, I'm not sure if I really care for it here on mountain bikes.
It seems like something that only the endless budget of sponsored racers looking for that next competitive edge, might see any real need for all of this. With all of the cool new technology out there, we've obviously seen a lot of recreational/fitness riders on dirt riding single speed rigid bikes. Do I even really need 1x10 or 2x10 gearing, or 29 or 27.5 tires, to have fun out there, let alone more computational power than it took to land Armstrong on the moon? I’m with the “Keep It Simple Stupid” school on this one, and don’t log nearly enough miles to justify a lot of extra money for little extra whizbangs that I wouldn’t have much faith in.
I have had or seen faliures on simple cable and hydraulic systems, but they seem few and far between, and can often be overcome w/ a little enginuity if needed. I'm not sure I'd trust fine electronics, little LiPo batteries or even the softwear to be as reliable, especially considering the abuse I subject this stuff to out on the trail.
It's bad enough that I can barely find a stick shift car any more. I want to drive, not steer. Same thing with my biking ...
I get the argument that goes, if you dont like/want it, don't but it, but...
Prob is, you might not be able to get other good stuff without buying it.
For example, if I want kashima and some damper adjustments, I also get a lock out on my fork and a propedal on my shock (both of which I never use and would rather not have because of added cost/weight and complexity).
Electonics would certainly amplify that problem.
Basically I just want to see everyone, regardless of what kind of bike they ride, to hold hands in a circle and sing about our love of bikes. Be it road, CCX, XC, 4x, BMX, DH... whatever. We are all cyclists. And we all love new tech.
How about you try a demo of it first and make an educated decision.
Then if you don't like it... don't buy it... simple!
I'm willing to try it out before making a judgement... I'm not scared of possible future developments...
Its called progress
If you are sat there thinking that electricals will ruin your riding experience, Ill tell you that it doesnt, I own a recon instruments goggles HUD kit, (shop.reconinstruments.com/product/mod-live-uk) designed for snowboarding but by god it is a fantastic thing to have while riding a track, just for the convenience of everything from your music to speed and whether that jump really is bigger than it looks.
At the end of the day, try it before you hate the concept, dont get paranoid about running out of battery halfway up a mountain as every good biker brings spare tubes like you should always take a spare battery for it.
I don't want to charge the batteries in my bike unless it gets me up the mountain.
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When I say, will it be useful for racing, I mean, will the result be worth the play. Active auto balancing suspension might never get light enough or provide performance gains that are worth using it. As I always say, human performance will always be not only a deciding, but also a dominating factor in cycling. So amatuers might gain more from it than racers.
That electronic revolution will mean mostly lots of gadgets as far as I see it. Probably a completely new breed of small companies will pop up with their techno-MTB products. Interesting to see how it will unfold. Nothing for me personaly