2010 Banshee Legend MKII - Spy Shots
by Home Team
Feb 22, 2010
Shots taken at the Banshee Factory in Taiwan.
I am not going to waste space with a lot of words, I am going to let these pictures do the talking for me. I will just say that I was lucky enough to be locked in a room with a couple of 2010 Banshee Legend MKII frames and a camera. Trying to fit one into my backpack crossed my mind a couple of times. I should have brought a bigger bag.
Pics inside,
I am not going to waste space with a lot of words, I am going to let these pictures do the talking for me. I will just say that I was lucky enough to be locked in a room with a couple of 2010 Banshee Legend MKII frames and a camera. Trying to fit one into my backpack crossed my mind a couple of times. I should have brought a bigger bag.
Pics inside,
For more information on the Legend MKII frame visit www.bansheebikes.blogspot.com.
Banshee Legend MKII - Team Red
Banshee Legend MKII - Black and Green
Banshee Legend MKII - White
You may have noticed that on the black frame there are two green bands on the seat tube and on the white there are three red bands. This is because the black is a medium and the white is a large. For the black and white frames there will be three bands for the large, two for the medium and one for the small.
I tried to leave the factory with one tucked under my shirt, but I was stopped by security. I guess I have to wait until they are in stores like the rest of the public who wants one.
Keep riding,
Rob Dunnet
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Banshee Legend MKII - Black and Green
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Banshee Legend MKII - White
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You may have noticed that on the black frame there are two green bands on the seat tube and on the white there are three red bands. This is because the black is a medium and the white is a large. For the black and white frames there will be three bands for the large, two for the medium and one for the small.
I tried to leave the factory with one tucked under my shirt, but I was stopped by security. I guess I have to wait until they are in stores like the rest of the public who wants one.
Keep riding,
Rob Dunnet
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191 Comments
When I seen the 1st pics of this bike i was not exactly blown away , but in the painted options it makes them a whole lot tastier 
)
)
for more information on geometry and sizes
http://www.bansheebikes.com
http://www.bansheebikes.blogspot.com
http://www.bansheebikes.com
http://www.bansheebikes.blogspot.com
yea, but the wierd thing about the jedi is that it has 2 inches of rearward travel, and somnething like 8 inches downward travel. so it has a really different linkage, but looks the same
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The white and black schemes are so hot. The chrome just ruins it IMO. Great looking bike either way, curious to see how they do.
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just the frames make my pc wet of drool
Awesome looking frames! I dig the black and green...but the Team is slightly irresistible.
That sizing thing is going to make my life hella easy.
That sizing thing is going to make my life hella easy.
for more information, weights, geometry ...
http://www.bansheebikes.com
http://www.bansheebikes.blogspot.com
http://www.bansheebikes.com
http://www.bansheebikes.blogspot.com
weight is super light. go to the banshee website it says the weight i think. i think retail in canada is 3400 frame only not 100% though
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sick..
but the frame is too expensive for a taiwan frame, even if the frame is one of the best on the market.
but the frame is too expensive for a taiwan frame, even if the frame is one of the best on the market.
Ehm. Almost every frame out there is made in Taiwan. And if its made in the Usa or somewhere else does not mean its better. Ill rather say its the same thing. Witch it is.
The frame goes for 3000us with rc4 shock.
Cant wait to get mine
(black & green)
The frame goes for 3000us with rc4 shock.
Cant wait to get mine
(black & green)
backkippe was not suggesting any lack of quality on the taiwan built frames , I'm guessing hes meaning the price should be far lower as it will of been built at a very low cost , and he's right
Actually this frame costs a lot more than nearly every other frame priced at same level and higher. Taiwan is not cheap like China. The reason that so many bikes are made in taiwan is not due to price, but due to the fact that the industry is massive there and established. This means that they have all the tooling, skills and materials required for bike manufacture. There are many manufacturing processes and materials that taiwan are capable of that you cannot source in the wester world. Ever tried to source 7005 Aluminium that doesn't come from Taiwan or China? Tried getting hard anodising done in the west, it is not easy to come by.
I bet this frame costs twice as much as a V10 to manufacture.
I bet this frame costs twice as much as a V10 to manufacture.
The reason of price for a taiwanese frame:These frames are built at pacific cycles a factory of legendary precision and quality. every legend frame is also hand inspected by Jay(the owner of banshee) he moved out to taiwan a couple months ago to supervise the building of these frames
It lists from $2900 to $2999 USD suggested retail, but retailers will likely sell for a little less. Such a bad ass bike!
but the frame is too expensive for a taiwan frame, even if the frame is one of the best on the market
its well in the pricing ballpark compared to many other bigger "brands", selling their Taiwanese DH race frames for the same, or even more money into the UK market
Specialized 2010 Demo II frame is £1999.99 in the UK
Legend Mk2 in the UK is also £1999, including Fox RC4 shock
the other Banshee suspension frames in the UK are typically selling around £1200 (Scythe, Spitfire, Rampant)
...it tells you something about the sheer amount of manufacturing time / cost, even in Taiwan that the Legend takes to make (for example the shock "canoe")
its well in the pricing ballpark compared to many other bigger "brands", selling their Taiwanese DH race frames for the same, or even more money into the UK market
Specialized 2010 Demo II frame is £1999.99 in the UK
Legend Mk2 in the UK is also £1999, including Fox RC4 shock
the other Banshee suspension frames in the UK are typically selling around £1200 (Scythe, Spitfire, Rampant)
...it tells you something about the sheer amount of manufacturing time / cost, even in Taiwan that the Legend takes to make (for example the shock "canoe")
just because one bike is overpriced doesnt mean another one has to be too
if they knocked that price down they would get much more people, if i had 2k to drop on a frame id go specialized because of the size of the company and the support they provide
if they knocked that price down they would get much more people, if i had 2k to drop on a frame id go specialized because of the size of the company and the support they provide
have you ever emailed or tried to contact one of the bigger bike companies like specialized? it takes forever for them to get back to you ... if they ever do. With smaller companies like Banshee of Transition emails are answered within a couple of days ... and usually by someone who knows what they are talking about. From simple tech questions, request for stickers or something more complex the smaller companies are there for you. That is why I would pay for the quality and customer service you get from the smaller companies ...
Banshees support is rediculously good in my experiences.
We had a question about my dads scythe and emailed banshees customer support and the next day Jay McNeil himself had emailed us back with the info we needed, why they made it that way for the scythe.
Another guy on mtbr found a small issue with his frame with wear conditions in his specific riding environment and banshee sent him a new frame with a custom fix to his problem.
... the specialized demo is a good bike but deffinatly not going to come with Ti hardware like this nor will it have the same amount of design and engineering behind it (this was a masters degree project to begin with!)
We had a question about my dads scythe and emailed banshees customer support and the next day Jay McNeil himself had emailed us back with the info we needed, why they made it that way for the scythe.
Another guy on mtbr found a small issue with his frame with wear conditions in his specific riding environment and banshee sent him a new frame with a custom fix to his problem.
... the specialized demo is a good bike but deffinatly not going to come with Ti hardware like this nor will it have the same amount of design and engineering behind it (this was a masters degree project to begin with!)
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it looks more like a copy of a specialized demo if you ask me they just changed the size of the like to make it look slightly different. thats it thats all
not half !
spesh is a horst link, and these are more like a dw link or maestro or equilink etc for a start
spesh is a horst link, and these are more like a dw link or maestro or equilink etc for a start
well, considering the were both designed to be ridden by human beings, you could say there are a few similarities between the two frames....
Dad game it ! This baby is damn - hotttt ! I'll trade my complete Gambler ( I'll only keep my Hopes Moto V2 ) for this beauty
"it looks more like a copy of a specialized demo if you ask me they just changed the size of the like to make it look slightly different. thats it thats all"
Demo is FSR
Legend is virtual pivot
different suspension system
Demo is FSR
Legend is virtual pivot
different suspension system
These frames are 9.5 lbs with a steel spring. It is a race frame, not a freeride frame. Banshee makes some of the best frames out there, but they have serious issues with supply and distribution.
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It looks pregnant to me. Saying nothing for ride as I have not been on one but I don't get the drool factor over the looks of the frame. Quality and craftsmanship=yes, looks=no
"just because one bike is overpriced doesnt mean another one has to be too
if they knocked that price down they would get much more people, if i had 2k to drop on a frame id go specialized because of the size of the company and the support they provide"
I would not say either the Legend or Demo are overpriced - compare their pricing to Santa Cruz's V-10 (£2600) or the Intense 951 (£2,300) in the UK
bear in mind, that Freeborn sells "direct" to customer, cutting out the "middleman", so that customers save about 1/3-1/4 compared to other 'brands' that have distribution to regular bike stores
if the Legend was sold at trade prices to bike shops, and then to customers you would be looking at a UK rrp of £2,500
its not a "cheap" frame to manufacture - if you want an affordable, quality bike get a Big Hit or Giant - if you want the exotic you pony up and get the Legend, V-10, M6/951, Evil, etc.
if they knocked that price down they would get much more people, if i had 2k to drop on a frame id go specialized because of the size of the company and the support they provide"
I would not say either the Legend or Demo are overpriced - compare their pricing to Santa Cruz's V-10 (£2600) or the Intense 951 (£2,300) in the UK
bear in mind, that Freeborn sells "direct" to customer, cutting out the "middleman", so that customers save about 1/3-1/4 compared to other 'brands' that have distribution to regular bike stores
if the Legend was sold at trade prices to bike shops, and then to customers you would be looking at a UK rrp of £2,500
its not a "cheap" frame to manufacture - if you want an affordable, quality bike get a Big Hit or Giant - if you want the exotic you pony up and get the Legend, V-10, M6/951, Evil, etc.
yes lets compare a taiwan made frame to super exotic american brands what are imported to the uk in small numbers D:
:
You are aware that V10's and Revolts are made in Taiwan yeah? Also the legend is made in way smaller numbers than any of the other frames mentioned.
This is just beatiful. Dear bike industry: more of these please! It's great to hang an eye on such a great piece of engineery from time to time
Its a good placement of the shock. It makes the frameweight more centered and lower. It makes it easier to move around. Trust me, i have had the mk1.
Considering center of gravity yes, considering maintenance and wear on bushings, no. I'd rather have a somewhat higher center of gravity than having to replace the mounting hardware every 2 weeks. Just iagine how much dust, dirt and mud that will find it's way to the mounting. Same with the old Commencal, they should've fixed that issue in some way.
The shock is actually pretty well protected by the shock basement for frame mounting, and the link mounted end is protected by the plate between the rear tiangle struts pretty well when under sag. It has been tested for well over a year and no complaints at all yet from any testers.
I should know if what youre saying "jinx" is correct. Witch it isnt. All of the frame links and the rear swingarm pluss all of the things on the frame above the canoe stops most of the mud. I never ever had to think about much mud on the shock when i rode on the muddiest of days here. Trust me, their is not much mud hitting that shock, or bushings. I didnt even have to change out the original bushings out when i sold the mk1. They where smooth and good as new. And that was from over half a year of muddy and rainy riding. Our town is known for its plenty of rain all year. And if it comes mud in that area, the mud easily slides out the bottom of the canoe.
And if you want things even cleaner, you can do the same thing as the sicklines guys did on their mk1 on the rear swingarm, to protect the lower link from mud.
And if you want things even cleaner, you can do the same thing as the sicklines guys did on their mk1 on the rear swingarm, to protect the lower link from mud.
Dude check the rear mount of the shock, if that isn't unprotected I'll call myself a gummi bear. That mount is less protected than the one on the old Commencals and those had some serious trouble with mud, dust and sand getting inside the mount and ruining the bushings and mounting hardware. It's still a sick frame, and will most probably be my next frame but I'm just pointing out that the mount is unprotected. Same with the new turner dhr.
I can only talk about here in Sweden, and since it rains almost all the time during the summer people need bikes which have better protected mounts.
I can only talk about here in Sweden, and since it rains almost all the time during the summer people need bikes which have better protected mounts.
I ride in muddy Scotland on my legend, and can't say I have once ever had to clear gunk away from the shock. The plate in the rear triangle stops all mud spraying off tire into the shock.
.... definitely a nice bike
they actually left me in a room with two frames and their camera. my camera ran out of batteries ... when i finished shooting I found a bunch of other pictures on the memory card ... including the third color option ... so I borrowed them for a little bit
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As i told a guy above. It has a 9.5" shock. And has 8" of travel. What are you even complaining about.
This bike has a 3" stroke shock, and with 8" travel it yields a relatively low leverage ratio (2.7:1).
I used a 300lb spring with my 75ish kg's, for pure dh. 350 for fr. So yes, the leverage is low. Witch is good for making the shock last longer due to less stress on the shock.
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"yes lets compare a taiwan made frame to super exotic american brands what are imported to the uk in small numbers"
Legend is made in small numbers too - don't get "hung up" on 'where' its made - Taiwan is not actually as cheap as you might think
we have only 6 Legends frames coming to the UK for the start of 2010 - hardly a big number?
"had something like 2500GBP in my mind.. without shock"
Legend is GBP£1999.99 with Fox RC4 shock, seatpost, seatclamp and pivot spares
Legend is made in small numbers too - don't get "hung up" on 'where' its made - Taiwan is not actually as cheap as you might think
we have only 6 Legends frames coming to the UK for the start of 2010 - hardly a big number?
"had something like 2500GBP in my mind.. without shock"
Legend is GBP£1999.99 with Fox RC4 shock, seatpost, seatclamp and pivot spares
So I Love banshee's but now knowing that they're manufactured in Taiwan is surprising, you'd think with the price of these bikes they would have them made at a local Canadian fabrication shop. I have nothing against this but that's why I own a Stab, manufactured somewhere else AND also much much cheaper. does anyone know if all frames are made in Taiwan or just the MKII???, is the Scythe made there as well?.
All Banshee frames are made at a small high quality factory in Taiwan, the same place they make Canfield Bros and Evil Revolts.
A good portion of all of the quality bicycles are made in Taiwan. I was surprised when I found out how many of the big brands are made there. Santa Cruz, Specialized ... and the list goes on and on. Chances are you are riding a bike that was made in Taiwan. And the frames that are produced in the USA ... good chance that the tubing for the frames came from Taiwan. And even if your frame did not come from Taiwan ... some of the components ... if not all of them were manufactured in Taiwan.
Banshee is making products that just scream quality right now. Stiff, strong, sexy to boot, and just oozing with quality down to the hardware choosing to go with titanium. I'm not sure why some people have their panties in a bundle over cost... Why would you expect a smaller company to go lower in cost than all of their competitors? This isn't Mongoose or Sette.
taiwan is a newly industrialised contry or something i learnt it in geography haha. pretty wicked frame. from a distance it kinda reminds me of the evil revolt. and what a stunning frame to look like on a glance i say 
It was the MKIII. Come on Banshee, put your letters together and make a more memorable and unique name... Abysmal, for instance.
Why not? It's not as though "MKII" is random... it stands for Mark 2, which means it's the second incarnation of the Legend frame.
Because of what has happened here: Brand confusion and a stigma that may be associated with other cheaper MK___ bikes. It's a bike...no need to tell us about its displacement or any other pointless information.
It is not pointless if they have changed things since the last model. Secondly, it is their bike and they can call it "Legend MK II Spongebob Square pants on fire versus giant donkey" if they want.
Banshee are nice, but they haven't personality. Just erase the logos and nobody will identify the next year Banshee. I would love to see the evolution of scream, but they killed it.
The next year Banshee? For the past several years their frame designs have not changed ... look at the Amp, Wildcard, Scythe ... they have not changed. And can be recognized in pictures and video popping up all over the internet.
http://www.bansheebikes.com
http://www.bansheebikes.blogspot.com
This is the new banshee ...
http://www.bansheebikes.com
http://www.bansheebikes.blogspot.com
This is the new banshee ...
An evolution of the Scream, are you kidding, I guess it worked for the time back when 'hucking' was the thing to do, but seriously...
...that is like asking for the evolution of a Hummer, it's dead and gone man!
...that is like asking for the evolution of a Hummer, it's dead and gone man!
wow, the Banshee reps are all over this page trying to 'correct' peoples pov's about cost/taiwan etc. Man it looks so unprofessional!
I just sure hope Banshee have improved the design of their pivot housings as the bearings clamped against nylon bushings to tighten them on my banshee them is pretty damn lame - and certainly doesn't allow the linkage to be responsive enough for dh use!
I think the frame looks nice, albeit a near copy of an Iron Horse or Karpiel linkage design, but up close that horrible mass/mess of welding is sure to crack pretty soon, hope they've got a good warrantee dept! :-)
I just sure hope Banshee have improved the design of their pivot housings as the bearings clamped against nylon bushings to tighten them on my banshee them is pretty damn lame - and certainly doesn't allow the linkage to be responsive enough for dh use!
I think the frame looks nice, albeit a near copy of an Iron Horse or Karpiel linkage design, but up close that horrible mass/mess of welding is sure to crack pretty soon, hope they've got a good warrantee dept! :-)
yup, design has changed, pivots are totally floating, not friction between links or anything.
You are entitled to you opinion, thats cool.
You are entitled to you opinion, thats cool.
Ha! Since when are reps responding to people's questions unprofessional?
And do you know of any other companies that put 50 prototypes in riders hands for over a year before releasing to the public? If you follow the blog, this is a very transparent company...
And do you know of any other companies that put 50 prototypes in riders hands for over a year before releasing to the public? If you follow the blog, this is a very transparent company...
banshee has always been honest about were their product is made. i think it is time for some other brands (not just frames) to step up and be honest about where their product is coming from.
Don't you realize that despite the fact that a bike may have the same linkage as another, it can feel completely different. Pivot location and linkage shape can change the wheel path, leverage ratios at certain travel lengths etc; which alters the feel of the suspension. There are tons of virtual pivot bikes out there: vpp, maestro, dw, etc., but all of those bikes perform differently. Not to mention differences in weight, headtube geo, chain stay length, seat tube angl, bb height and so on. So even if the suspension type is the same as many others, it's certainly not a "copy". Oh, and it's spelled warranty by the way.
psilde - my pov is more along the lines that by banshee's quibbling with the average pinkbike user makes them look like a backyard project trying desparately to gain some credential for how they do things, any person with an ounce of common sense knows that the whole made in Taiwan over made in 'our' country debate will never end [ever thought that Taiwanese people might have pride in things made in their country?] so joining the debate is pretty naive and IMO, looks bad for the company - if people have questions, then they should talk directly to banshee.
builttoride - glad to hear you changed the bearing design, do the mk2's have a forged or cnc'd shock cradle? - p.s. glad to see you got rid of the machining lines in the milled cradle pockets, IMO they just made the frame look like it had only been rough cut and botched out the factory in a hurry - looks much better now!
builttoride - glad to hear you changed the bearing design, do the mk2's have a forged or cnc'd shock cradle? - p.s. glad to see you got rid of the machining lines in the milled cradle pockets, IMO they just made the frame look like it had only been rough cut and botched out the factory in a hurry - looks much better now!
The shock cradle on the Legend MKII is 3D forged in separate pieces and then welded together. The pieces of the shock cradle on the Legend MKI were machined and welded.
looks awesome...but does it look like the seat tube needs more reinforcement at the top tube junction? idk.
I road one of these bikes and did not like it at all... The linkage acts funny when you pedal it... Almost like the chain tension pushes the wheel down. Not a fan.
Not possible that you rode a MkII, there isn't one in Canada yet. You might have ridden a MkI. Many changes have been made. Can't wait to get our 8 together. Then we can compare at Moose
The linkage design has a lot of anti-squat if you are running sag of 33% or less. Good for pedalling, but might feel funny if you're not used to it. The more sag you run, the less anti-squat you can feel. (I have a Mk1.)
Go to the blog page and read the article written by Keith Scott on the changes he made and why he made them. It's very interesting and informative.
I really like how accessible the shock remains while being cradled low in the frame...very nice. I'd love to swing a leg over one of these things sometime.
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The black and white are both killer. The silver/red one... I applaud you doing something newish but it resembles a department store bike paint job. No offense, it just does.
http://www.walmart.com/ip/24-Boys-Power-Climber-Bike/2233451
http://www.walmart.com/ip/24-Boys-Power-Climber-Bike/2233451
I do totally agree. That's why I bought black anodized Scythe. So called "Team" paintjob needs more polishing. There is no need to add more of everything, maybe "Team" could be a completely clean frame, like Amp.
The LEGEND looks great!!! For those of you knocking the Taiwanese made frames Giant spends 8% on Research and Development in a 60 billion dollar industry per year 5 billion is there take from what I researched. Who else does that? Have you seen GIANTS lineup this year? They have the latest, greatest, most sophisticated equipment to weld these frames together and make alot of frames for other companies as well not to mention any names. Giant also has bigger buying power in the industry which results in cheaper prices for better materials used to develop frames for you the consumer so be thankful you get quality for an awesome price!
how are these "spy shots" if they are full on studio photography with banshee logos in the border?
other than that, neat-o.
other than that, neat-o.
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Looks awesome, the full build @ Vital MTB is very nice too. But srsly, if the TR450 is going to be cheaper, that´s the way to go. Loving the quality&service and all that from banshee, but what counts for most people is the price. 2000€ would be the absolute maximum I´d pay for that frame.
The polish price is only a tad over it, doubt you find it for a lower price. Not many higher end dh frames below that price.(retail at least)
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I never gave a shit for Banshee but this frame looks sick! The design looks solid, low center to gravity and at all an unique look. In some ways a little bit of a Demo or the new Turner
"2000€ would be the absolute maximum I´d pay for that frame."
well the good news is that the Legend with Fox RC4 shock is GBP£1999
well the good news is that the Legend with Fox RC4 shock is GBP£1999
Euros, not Pound, sweetheart. And judging by current exchange rates it´s going to be significantly more than 2k€
Team Geronimo just finished their 2010 rides . . .
--> Check it out here --
--> Check it out here --
Welds on the chrome frame are a little ugly / messy for a frame at that price point imo. Probably not a structural issue but those inconsistent beads are pretty obvious. Would like to see a little cleaner finish in the high-end market they're going after.
my banshee's welded the same like this all over, its what you get when a bunch of chinese orphans weld your frame! :-@
It seems the average Banshee/Transition fan is like the average applemac/Ipod user, more concerned about image and glossy exteriors than quality and won't ever look closely at their frame :@ lol
It seems the average Banshee/Transition fan is like the average applemac/Ipod user, more concerned about image and glossy exteriors than quality and won't ever look closely at their frame :@ lol
"Euros, not Pound, sweetheart."
ah shucks..no one has called me sweetheart for some years
ok in Euros its €2277 (Stirling and Euro are almost at Parity compared to previous years)
ah shucks..no one has called me sweetheart for some years
ok in Euros its €2277 (Stirling and Euro are almost at Parity compared to previous years)
ill get negative propped to hell for this no doubt, but it looks like a lower quality version than the first. the big chunks of ali around the shock used to be 100% cnc made, now it just looks like a big casting with the inside has been milled a bit. not that its necessarily any worse, its just a bit sad cause it was increadible what they did, given how much it cost, with the first one.
yeah they'd have to do some CNC work on the inside to face up the pivots and stuff. its just a pitty, forging is nowhere near as nice or precise as CNC work. dont get me wrong, i think its still very nice, its just now its only in the same league to me as a giant or a sunday, where-as for the old frames i thought them up there with Nicolai, Racebike or Canfields.
but like i said, when i saw the price of the earlier CNC'd ones, i was genuinely amazed at how they could do it for that price (i know the cost of that shit as well as anyone, trust me)...and i guess i was correct at thinking that they couldnt.
on the upside, forging is only done for fairly large scale work, so it must mean that we're all gonna have the opportunity to try one at some point.
but like i said, when i saw the price of the earlier CNC'd ones, i was genuinely amazed at how they could do it for that price (i know the cost of that shit as well as anyone, trust me)...and i guess i was correct at thinking that they couldnt.
on the upside, forging is only done for fairly large scale work, so it must mean that we're all gonna have the opportunity to try one at some point.
We could have stuck with the CNC machining on the basement, but it would have meant that the MRSP would have been about $3600 for frame and shock, due to price of the machining as you mentioned.
Forged material is also quite a bit stronger than machined material due to grain alignment that happens during forging process... so the forged parts are lighter, stronger and cost the customer less.
Forging can only be done to a certain thickness without compromising quality, so the foging is done acurately for external, and then internal is machined down from the slightly thicker base forging. This also increases precision of internal faces as you also mentioned.
Forged material is also quite a bit stronger than machined material due to grain alignment that happens during forging process... so the forged parts are lighter, stronger and cost the customer less.
Forging can only be done to a certain thickness without compromising quality, so the foging is done acurately for external, and then internal is machined down from the slightly thicker base forging. This also increases precision of internal faces as you also mentioned.
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I think the bike looks awesome! I recently emailed Banshee and Rob Replied the next day.. excellent service! with other companies it take weeks to reply!
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