Welcome to the wide world of Ibis wheels and rims, what we refer to as The New Normal and The New Wide. The 928 is a 29er rim with 28mm width that delivers enhanced tire stability and high strength at low weight. The 741 and 941 are 27.5 and 29er rims with monster 41mm widths that deliver super tire stability even with large tires at low pressure. The 741 and 928 are available as optional upgrades on the Mojo HDR 650b and Ripley 29 now, the 941 is scheduled as an option for the Ripley beginning next month. We anticipate that these wheels will be availalble in the aftermarket in June.
Wider rims are better than narrow rims. A wider rim delivers better sidewall support so you you can run lower pressures in your rubber. Lower pressures do several beneficial things, including increasing the contact patch, which results in better traction. Tires mounted on wider rims don’t burp as easily. Running lower pressures on varied terrain actually reduces rolling resistance. Wider rims are stronger and stiffer. With increased traction comes increased braking control.
In 2013 the first wide carbon fiber rims came out, called Derby Rims. Derby is our good friend and in fact Ibis liked his idea so much we funded half the original tooling expense of these rims. Having access to the Derby Rims proved invaluable in testing for our own concepts and designs. Derby’s rims are made in a different factory than ours, as we will be needing a much larger quantity than his source can provide. For now, we will only be selling complete wheels, so if you’re looking for rims only, we heartily endorse the product that Derby is selling. If you can get them that is, Derby Rims have been regularly selling out each production run.
''You can’t have too much traction'' - Ancient mountain bike proverb.
Dramatically Increased tractionWide rims support the tire’s sidewalls better, allowing lower pressures without the tires folding over or burping. This dramatically increases stability and traction. This shows up as faster cornering and braking, better grip in all conditions. How much lower pressure can you go? In general, for a given rider, using tires you've used before in a given locale, you will be able to run lower tire pressures with wider rims. How much lower can only be determined through experimentation. Typically, riders are running 4–6 psi less than normal. Light riders on moderate terrain are running as low as 15-17psi.
Tires: Go Big, Go SmallBig - If gravity is your thing, bigger tires and lower pressures equal more traction. The problem is, you can only go so low with large tires on narrow rims before they become unstable. Enter the wide rim. Select the pressure you want without having to over pressurize the tire to control stability and burping.
Not-so-big - If you’re leaning more toward XC use, you can actually go down one tire size and achieve the same or higher levels of traction and performance, only at a reduced overall weight.
Less Tubeless Burping Wider rims dramatically reduce the incidence of burping. With wider rims the tire sidewall can’t exert as much force on the bead to unseat it and allow air to escape.
Low Pressures Equal Low Rolling Resistance“
Anyone who wants to ride really fast off-road needs to decrease tyre pressure. The rougher the ground, the more pronounced the effect. Traction and comfort increase too,” said Peter Nilges, Editor, Bike Magazine (Germany) Our wide rim profiles provide better sidewall support, allowing you to run lower pressures with no ill effects. More from Peter’s university thesis: “
Any such unevenness means that part of the forward propulsion force is required to lift machine and rider upwards. This is equivalent to riding a short uphill grade that requires a certain amount of lifting energy. A tyre with less inflation can adapt to unevenness more easily. The total system needs to be lifted to a lesser degree and less frequently. Resistance is reduced, less power is required.”
Read the great article hereHookless Bead Rims are Far StrongerImpact damage is the way most carbon rims die. The rim we’ve designed is much stronger in the area where impacts occur since it's a solid rectangle instead of an inverted "J". This spreads the impact out over a larger area that is also supported by more material. We tested the impact strength of several major brands of carbon fiber rims and discovered that the change to hookless bead was a major advantage in impact strength. We also optimized the layup to further increase strength. In the end, our rims are 50 to 300% stronger in impact than competing rims we measured. We don’t want to throw anyone under the bus, but we do want you to know that these are well-respected and well-known manufacturers.
Stiffer and LighterThe switch to carbon fiber as a rim material has allowed us to build a 475 gram 41 mm wide rim, which is lighter than the much smaller and weaker alloy rims it replaces. The 928 is 100g lighter and several times stronger than alloy rims of the same size.
More Predictable Steering Without wallowing sidewalls, and with dramatic increases in rim stiffness and contact patch area, the front end of the bike feels more precise and firmly planted than it ever did before. The difference is even greater than the improvements that came from tapered steerers and through axles in recent years.
Tire Fit We’ve carefully sized the bead area so that it’s easy to mount and dismount most tubeless tires by hand. Many tubeless tires will inflate and seat with only a floor pump.
History Repeating ItselfMountain bike rims were not always narrow. The venerable Araya 7X, a popular rim from the ‘80s, was labeled 26x1.75" and had an inside width of 25mm. That gives a tire to rim inner ratio of 1.78. A 2.35 tire on a modern 19mm gives a ratio of 3.14, even higher than our 3:1 outlier number mentioned above. A 2.35 tire on our 741 rim results in 1.73:1, back to the original Araya number. Read more about the history on the story tab to the right.
What to Expect The 41 mm wide rims typically increase the tire width about 3 -5 mm at the widest part of the casing. The diameter stays about the same. The shape of the tread cap will be flatter as well. The 741 and 941 change the shape of the tire and you will want to select a tire that has a good profile on the wider rims. Generally we have found that tires that start with a rounder profile across the tread cap work the best.
ibiscycles.com/wheels
That being said, while Derby doesn't offer a wide 26er carbon rim alone, Woven Precision here in Ottawa does.
www.wovenprecision.com
People say "no one's forcing you" but the reality is, they're only not forcing you if you're willing to stop doing what you're doing altogether. It's like saying no one's forcing you to stop using Windows XP. However if you want to continue using the internet (which is what most people use a computer for, mostly or at least partly) then when Pinkbike no longer supports your old, yet perfectly fine browser & the new browser is no longer supported by your old, yet perfectly fine OS then you either "acquire" new everything or do without something that has become so important to you that it feels impossible to do without.
I love the sport but this industry with its derailleurs, 15 mm axles & stupid wheel sizes can eat shit & burn.
The market is obviously not going in the 26" direction, and it's risky at best to assume that there's a significant and lasting market in people retrofitting their 5 year old bikes with $1300 wheels. On the other hand, there are TONS of brand new 29 and 27.5 bikes selling right now, and the competitive scene is increasingly dominated by the bigger wheels. For the next couple years (at least) it will be impossible for the 26" market share to grow, and it makes no sense to produce a niche product like this for a shrinking market. If they did make these in 26", they'd probably have to cover the cost of the 26" tooling using the money from the other two sizes, which would drive the cost of all the products up.
I'm not saying people should buy new bikes every couple years, or that everyone should jump on the bigger wheel bandwagon. My only mtb is a 26er and I like it, but if it was my money there's no way in hell I'd be betting on a sudden comeback of 26" right now.
The cost of making another tool to create a 26" wheel would impact the costs of all the wheels to the public, since they'd probably try to recover the prices across the family. So the previously $1200 wheel set might go up to $1500.
That all being said, I think judging by the size of Ibis (and many smaller bike industry companies) they don't have a dedicated market research person who could definitively forecast how many wheels they might sell, and what the amortization schedule would look like. They aren't that sophisticated. They are simply guessing, putting their money where everybody else is, and abandoning the bike (Mojo) and riders that got them to that point.
thanks Scot
I have worked with Ibis cycles many times and I will agree with @jaybird951. Best customer service in the biz. Stoked to try some of these wheels when they are available.
Producing a big wheel bike because the industry tells you to do so rather than because it's better is hardly the pursuit of the best performing products.
www.light-bicycle.com/New-26er-33mm-wide-enduro-MTB-all-mountain-downhill-carbon-rim-tubeless-compatible.html#.U0LI04nnYm8
they deliver anywhere in the world.
and best is the cost : 2 rims 650b 32 holes , gloss finish, UD weave , extra material added for my fat ass , shipping with in 10 days of my order for $370- total
I'd expect the larger Ibis would benefit from quantities of scale and would be able to not only beat Derby's pricing on the rims, also offer complete wheelsets (with quality Taiwanese hubs) for less anyone else could do otherwise. Even at $1000 they'd still beat every carbon wheelset producer out there except Light Bike.
Thinkin' about it....will I receive any news with filter on? Er...
The weight and price look great!
I currently run my 2.35 Schwalbe magic mary at 18psi on a Velocity 35 blunt rim with no problems (I ride rugged alpine terrain). Used to run 15psi on Schwalbe Muddy Mary 2.5 with a 42mm rim. I am, however, pretty light weight at 60kg (132lb)...
More innovation is right around the corner I am sure.
Does making the rim out of carbon solve that fact??
Doubt it.
Not buying into "flat tires roll faster than tires with air in them"
I can't tell we the riders are gullible or if the rim makers actually believe their own nonsense.
Carbon rims begin life without bead hooks. This means that they start out with thick bead walls. To create the bead hook. the inner surface of the bead wall is milled away leaving the bead hook behind. The result is a thinner bead wall. This makes them weaker in the circumstances that would cause a pinch flat such as running straight into the square edge of a rock. Sure, they could start out with a bead wall twice as thick so that milling away material to create the bead hook resulted in a still-thick bead wall, but they don't. Remember that conventional rim profiles are based on the properties of aluminum, not carbon. The properties of carbon are just now being leveraged for rim design resulting in new rim profiles that are unfamiliar and scary to some folks.
Just admit it, making a hook rim mold is more complicated, whereas the hookless mold is easy going. A hook has great advantages such as better tire retention at low pressures etc. - but it takes more efffort to mold it. Jus look at the stupid amount of material in the rim face and tell me this makes any sense at all...
Anyone remember Planet x BMF rims? They were pretty fat I loved them even just for how they looked
This has been done before. There is a reason it didn't stick. So lame.
Santa Cruz carbon is strong, but has had some debonding issues.
Point being: no company or product is perfect.
"We can't put big tyres in the back of the HDR, now this is a real quandry, any ideas how we can fix it anyone?"
"Let's make a wheelset that makes tyres even bigger!!"
"That has got to be the most ridiculous...ly brilliant idea we've ever had!!"