Gondolas For the People

Aug 2, 2011 at 14:58
by Mitchell Scott  
Automobiles and bicycles share an oddly dependent, deeply ironic relationship. Unless you live at the edge of a trail system, or anywhere near a bike park, it's fairly difficult to not drive before you ride. There's a boon in trailer hitch racks and truck pads for a reason. Shuttling, of course, is the most overt offender. But it doesn't end there. Problem is, riding bikes in 2011 is just way too fun to let a conscience get in the way.

shuttling
Overloaded gas guzzler at Retallack Lodge, New Denver BC. Photo: Paddy Kaye

The truth of the matter though, is that bikes and cars really shouldn't go together. Kind of like ice cream and obesity, or abusive parents and prodigal kids. One element is astoundingly good, the other terrifically bad. Put the two together and you’re not making any real progress. And yet, when you look closely at the sport of mountain biking, even the whole of cycling for that matter (in the developed world anyway), it's almost impossible to ride a bike without a car. Which, when you break it down a little further, is akin to saving and sorting all of your recycling before burning it all in the fireplace. Which is what probably already happens, but that's another story.

shuttling
Shuttle here, shuttle there, shuttle everywhere...even in Bolivia. Photo: Lucas Kane

Think about it. We're riding bicycles! That's right, the bicycle, a 18th Century solution to a 21st Century problem. It is a most marvelous invention – circles turning circles, propelled by another bit of design genius, the human engine. Consider this: when a human being gets on a bike we become the most efficient animal on the planet. That is to say the energy required to move us, say five kilometres (approximately the calories in one apple) is the least amount required by any animal to move that same distance. If that weren’t a sweet bean enough for you, when a human gets on a bike, the bicycle itself becomes the most efficient machine on the planet. That is to say, the energy required to move the same distance is the least required by any mechanical invention on earth.

photo
Bikes + truck = smiles - guilt. Photo: John Gibson

So here we are, as modern world cyclists, driving to ride. Exempt are the growing legions of bike commuters who transport everything from kids to building supplies by bike. And it's not just shuttling, although that seems to be the most extreme offense. Dedicated cyclists still load their 22-pound cross-country steeds and drive an hour out of town to hammer trail. Even road bikers mount their über efficient carbon fibre asphalt missiles onto the car and drive on a road to another network of road to, you guessed it, ride road.

But it's more an infrastructure thing more than a personal choice. We built this world around the car, not the bike. Of the millions of commuter trips made every year in the United States, less than one percent are made by bicycle. No, the bike, for all intents and purposes, is just for fun.

photo
Very efficient babe on the Noblest Invention. Photo: Ale di Lullo

Which is great. To bike defines fun. The most fun. Just really sucks that it comes with a fossil fuel prerequisite. But couldn't that be changed?

Enter the gondola. Whizzing along on low emission electricity, load em up 4, 8, 10, 20 at a time and go crazy. Visit a country like Switzerland, where gondolas dart up every second valley and for the recreational rider the car becomes a non issue. Back in North America, sure, there's the odd gondola, but it's more of a resort experience that's hard to get to and hard to stay at without significant cash or local residency. That being said, for anyone who's ever spent any time at a bike park, you know they're the business.

photo
Leogang Bike Park, Austria. Photo: Ale Di Lullo

Gondolas for the People, people. And if you think it's a pipe dream anywhere outside of Europe, think again. Portland has a beauty of gondola that travels 500 vertical feet from downtown to a hill top university. Four bucks a ride, free to students. Maybe not a huge trail network, but it's a start. Sounds like it ran over budget and pissed some locals off, but forget about that. If we could only dream for a second….

Consider the money communities spend on infrastructure, stuff like hockey rinks, soccer fields, aquatic centers. Facilities for fun, funded by public monies. Designed and built for the people, they're made affordable, solely purposed for the good of society. Subsidized? Damn straight. They're not positioned to be marketable experiences or tourist attractions designed to make profit--although those monies would most assuredly help. Just a simple, cheap as you can make it, pay for itself one day lift -- a tramway to good times. Get us off the car so we can focus our trail building attentions and infrastructure around one sustainable network, both the up and the down. Imagine texting your buddy on a Tuesday afternoon, "See you at the gondola in 20." It'd be the best.

photo
If not gondolas, how about a few chairlifts? Photo: Sterling Lorence

I guess the sad part is, could it ever happen? Could towns like Nelson, British Columbia, Fruita, Colorado, Moab, Utah, San Fransisco, California, or Bellingham, Washington ever have community run, super high-efficient, self-loading gondolas, trams, chairlifts, or monorails that were recreationally oriented? Hop in from the city center and get whisked away to the heart of a wicked trail system. Runners, hikers, jump on board. Old people and little tykes too. Get a season's pass for $100 bucks. Users help build the trails (or do what Switzerland does, get people with small misdemeanors to do the work as part of their community service).

photo
The fun factor of the funiclaire, Zermatt, Switzerland. Photo: Sterling Lorence

It’s all there. Take a fraction out of military spending by most countries and we’d have gondolas by the hundreds. The bicycle is a fairly harsh draw out of the environment. It takes factories, plastics, metals and boatloads of energy just to make one. But its potential to make good on that ecological investment is much greater than the cost. We all know this. All that goodness seems somewhat lessened, however, when we're constantly forced to toss the sucker into the car every time we want to go for a ride.

Time for some solutions.

Author Info:
BigTimber avatar

Member since Apr 18, 2011
19 articles

171 Comments
  • 156 11
 too bad in california we have these people called ENVIRONMENTALISTS that will do anything to shut down the fun and thrill of others....
  • 28 0
 I giggled.
  • 46 0
 And don't get me started about the rangers I'm CA. They are the reason why I can only session my local trail for 1 day and then it gets torn down
  • 21 3
 lol being young and not understanding land usage, especially in marin
  • 27 45
flag starcbiker (Aug 9, 2011 at 4:25) (Below Threshold)
 the rangers are just doing their job,"don't shoot the messenger". if you want a trail to stick around go through the hassle of making legal. if thats not working don't get caught or ride at night so you won't get caught.
  • 6 2
 Haha, getting payback
  • 19 52
flag audeo03 FL (Aug 9, 2011 at 5:36) (Below Threshold)
 @mnorris122:

The city should provide the resources to rebuild, but imagine for a second that it was a burial ground. The indigenous peoples of the Americas have been brutalized and controlled to the nth degree. Have a little heart, or be quiet when some kids destroy your families gravesite for their fun.
  • 16 5
 @tstep3:

The environmentalists are also responsible for preventing the sale/destruction of a lot of public land to private parties/developers. So, while the laws may seem a bit draconian, build discreetly and enjoy what could be owned by some crappy person/company that would be even more interested in getting you in legal trouble.
  • 20 2
 Why would you even want to dirt jump on an old Indian burial ground anyway?

Haven't you seen Poltergeist?
  • 11 1
 @zorba73:

Don't forget Pet Cemetery!
  • 5 3
 People in CA have gone through legal means to regulate a trail....Environmentalists are seriously the problem, also RICH environmentalists have the power and that means they get to choose weather a trail is bike OK or not. Its happened numerous times, the rich have the power, until bikers get money to put down with their ideas there will not be any trails or bike parks in CA that are designated for biking only. Sure there are a handful available now, but any new progression towards a park of some sort is out of the question. The "bike park" of San Diego Mission Trails has been in discussion for years upon years, CA is just a large step behind when it comes to extreme sports and regulating parks for people to progress in and it is extremely sad.
  • 10 3
 "too bad in california we have these people called ENVIRONMENTALISTS that will do anything to shut down the fun and thrill of others....
"

Well said!
  • 3 0
 That's the best thing about living in NC, our hippies all ride. Gotta love Boone, you can get a shuttle from almost anyone!
  • 3 2
 Its funny that the environmentalists would be so disinclined to support such a infrastructure improvement. It would indeed lessen the impact that cyclists have on the environment, but how much of the biking community would be able to utilize these lifts? A large majority of the biking community enjoys going UPHILL, so keep that in mind. Is there such a large benefit that the state and local government could justify funds to build such projects? There are many questions that need to be answered before this idea could be seen as a finished product.

The real answer to this problem, although not the most popular alternative, is to ride your bike to the trail. end of story.
  • 15 9
 I would NEVER NEVER want to ride anything that the forest service deemed was doing significant damage to an area's ecosystem, it's like shooting yourself in the foot. Unless you're an absolute a-hole, why the hell would you want to f-up the world for you children and children's children? If everyone rode their bikes wherever they wanted it would be a disaster, and there would be no more woods to play in. THERE IS A REASON WHY YOU CAN'T RIDE IN CERTAIN AREAS. DEAL WITH IT IF YOU CAN'T UNDERSTAND IT. "Environmentalists" are not the issue, it's the riders who think that the whole world belongs to them. If you look at places like Ashland, Oregon you realize that it is completely easy to build an amazing, sustainable trail system in partnership with the FS and hikers. Confrontational attitudes on our part only strengthen "environmentalists'" belief that bikers think they own all the public land in the state, and it's just for their usage until it gets completely destroyed and they move onto something else. Get your hand out of the cookie bowl and grow up you guys. Trying to open up protected land is like a 5 year old not being able to delay gratification.
  • 4 1
 You guys still don't realize that the gondola's would benefit both riders and environmentalists. I believe the building of a gondola (especially for bikes which use such a small amount of forest space, unlike ski hills) would benefit the environment by canceling out the fossil fuel emissions. It's like driving an electric car up a hill instead of a diesel, but with 10 of your buddies crammed inside it.
  • 5 1
 nmorris you stated "That's true, and the city has said that they will provide resources to build somewhere else, but they've been saying that ever since September"

Please remember that our governments have been promising to do right by the native canadian community since we landed here. And yet they still live on reserves in third world conditions. You really don't have a leg to stand on for this argument.
  • 3 4
 ja I'd also have to face it... we came, we conquered and even stole their chicks... and then we complain when some jumps are in the theoretical wrong place.
  • 4 0
 DEEP
  • 28 3
 While were on the subject of Natives being (insert your own word of choice). Here in Flagstaff Arizona, the Native Americans wont let us turn Snow Bowl ( Mt. Elden) into a lift access DH MTB Park. They say we cant do this because it will mess with their way of life, which is based around circles, and harmony. When at a town hall meeting a rider was arguing with an Indian about this idea. One of his buddies walked in with helmet cam footage of him illegally riding down Mt. Elden. He put in up on the projector and said, "Have you by chance felt out of sync with the universe for the last 7 hours?" The Indian said, "No, Why?" The mountain biker replied, "Because i just spent the last 4 hours hiking up the mountain and then 3 hours riding down it on my Trek Session 8, and you had no idea, and no feeling that something was...off! Don't you think that you should have felt a disturbance in the force, because you say your so in touch with your surroundings, but you felt nothing." The Indian just stared at him grasping for some sort of comeback. "the guy addressed everybody on the council and said, "I rest my case!" then left.
  • 1 1
 i like how this turned into one big discussion about native territory and how there poorly treated, but seriously i dont think the gondalas are a good idea unless its within 10km just because of the time consumption that could be used riding
  • 3 0
 I would say that hikers and equestrians who feel like they own all of the public trails are more of a problem than environmentalists in California.
  • 5 3
 soooooo glad i got neg propped for supporting park rangers... next time one of you gets hurt way out in the backcountry with no one else around we will see how much you hate them...
  • 2 0
 @ Ryanlak

Exactly.
  • 4 0
 www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEFPUfARZrE this video will anger everyone
  • 3 2
 I'd love to have lift access to any killer run or hill but after learning and knowing about the history of native peoples (from any continent), my RESPECT for them and their culture takes precedence over my wanting to ride. There's plenty of other places to ride.
  • 1 0
 Wont someone think of the trees?

www.youtube.com/watch?v=G880gxjj9dI

lol
  • 2 0
 Well written article Mitchell, That would be an amazing world to live in with lifts and gondolas just minutes away. If only we could make it happen, maybe someday...
  • 2 0
 common guys, compact all those important ideas ya got into a comment less than 9 lines long!
  • 2 0
 @shastaoutdoormedia
if enviromentalists werent tearing down everything; there would be longer lasting trails and trail networks. and plus isnt california already so overly populated with parks anyways? shouldnt your children not have to worry about bike trails "doing significant damage to the ecosystem"? i mean we're not logging the entire forest or putting up huge wildlife barriers (roads). but i do see what your saying; there is better things to do than fight with people. but it just sucks if everything is deemed unridable
  • 1 0
 @shastaoutdoormedia-Trust me, were not trying to "open new land" or protected land. In San Diego I was actually pointing out that people had organized together to promote a "bike skills park" which we have none of, and it was to be built on an already existing "BMX" jump location that is legally there for riders to build and jump on as of right now. We bikers wanted to be able to have more access and be allowed to bring tractors water trucks yada yada to build a bike park. Nothing has happened in the past two or three years with that........Other trails that were used specifically by illegal aliens(mexican workers using hidden trail networks under thick brush) were brought to the attention of the authorities, cleaned up and made legal for the public to use. Horse riders started chopping thick brush back when they shouldn't have and next thing you know it was shut down, that trail might have been the Fish and Game that shut it down though not environmentalists. I'm mainly just talking about so cal and how it seems that we should have already progressed to the bike parks that are in other areas of the US. San Diego usually adapts and progresses, happened with skating as I grew up and now there are tons of parks, but none really designated for pure biking. Thats all I'm saying.
  • 38 2
 I Live in Switzerland, BITCHESSSS!!!!!!!
  • 3 0
 Rock the casbah!!!
  • 2 0
 went to switzerland last month.
...without my bike Frown
  • 2 0
 I live in Oregon CHUMP!!!!!
  • 26 3
 I'm not buying this whole "guilt trip" about shuttling and gas guzzling and all the enviro-fascist-eco-doomsayer warbling. Come back to me when you stop all the atv'ers, dirt bikers, quadders, RV drivers pulling an SUV, 5th wheelers, leisure boaters, cigar boaters, wakeboarders etc. I keep my carbon footprint pretty much as small as I can....I have one chosen sport/hobby, DH MTB....just a bit of shuttling is all I do and I'm not going to lose any sleep or stress myself out about a few gallons of gas for my biking pleasure. My chosen sport, so simple in its nature, yet complex in its execution, creates employment, gets people active, builds character, increases tourism, provides fun and excitement, and provides social opportunities.

"Shuttle-guilt"...zomg, so North American puritan guilt-trippin' uptightedness......so Chicken Little. Maybe we need plastic Five Ten's and bamboo TLD gear and biodegradable tear offs and Minion's made of camel skin.
  • 3 2
 Dirtbikers account for so little pollution.
  • 8 0
 Yeah but they account for insane trail degradation as well as noise pollution which is a way bigger concern than the C02 they produce for those hippies... and yet they somehow find a way to constantly use ATV and moto use to keep mountain bikes out even though they're completely unrelated.
  • 3 0
 gnarbar your the man hahah completly agree!!
  • 1 0
 offroad vehicles (orv's) account for more than a biker does, obviously. but @rbspecial is also right in that they are still an insignificant part of the total emissions outpout of the world.

There is lots of rideable land in america, and I don;t mind driving a little further so I can ride trails specific to my mtb and moto in places that don't bother the public.
  • 1 0
 How much would this camel skin tire cost?? I'd rock some.
  • 1 0
 half the price of a Minion
  • 23 1
 Good article, although I really don't understand why everyone thinks that a machine running off of electricity is super clean (eg: hybrid cars, gondolas, etc). Electricity had to be made (burning coal, oil or gas, or using nuclear fission) which already involves a huge amount of emissions, not to mention building the infrastructure (electric pylons, etc) to get it to places. Yes, they may be marginally more eco-friendly depending on which ones you look at, but people need to stop thinking that just because electricity comes out of a socket and you can't see any stack gases exiting from the socket it doesn't mean that it's clean.
But yes, sweet jesus gondolas everywhere would be awesome. More ski resorts need to start wising up and realising that biking = money.
  • 5 1
 Natural gas and nuclear are VERY efficient and produce significantly less emissions than fossil fuel sources. But I agree with you, people do not consider where and how the energy is produced.
  • 1 0
 When they say it's cleaner, they mean that over a period of time, it will cause fewer emissions than the same amount of people using cars will. The proof is found when you find the amount of energy the gondola/lift uses and where it came from, and do the same for the car. I can't say which makes less impact, but certainly one will transport the same amount of people on fewer emissions.
  • 2 0
 Um, sorry Eldo. Natural gas IS a fossil fuel. And besides that, we do many other things with it like make plastics. Unless you use a cryogenics (that even sounds expensive because it is) unit at every gas plant you can't recover the ethane from the gas stream. To add to what Gabor has said, people also don't consider the total energy and environmrental impact is of manufacturing hybrid cars. Maybe have a look at what goes into mining and refining copper, lead and lithuim. Some folks need to get their heads out of the sand before painting oil as an energy pariah.
  • 2 0
 This person speaks truth. Think about the factory required to make anything, plus whatever it takes for the workers to commute...etc.

Especially those that buy a bicycle every year, the manufacturing foot print off sets the good of a bike. I hate all the jumping on the green band wagon with blind folds, look at the whole picture not just the "green" sticker!

That being said I love my new bikes and sports car, but at least I am not ignorant to what I am doing, for me it is all trade offs and offsets. In the end compromise wins.
  • 1 0
 i support the above arguments but people also forget that emissions are only one problem with our dependency on fossil fules , a more pressing problem is that they are a finite recourse so will run out , before this happens they will become far to expensive to use so wee need alternatives before oil just becomes to expensive or rare to use. even if you don't believe in man made climate change , you cant deny that there is only so much oil fact.
  • 1 0
 When I was talking about natural gas I ment as opposed to other fossil fuels. Natural gas is much better than oil and coal as far as emissions are concerned.

I also agree with the several above me. Sustainable growth isn't real, because to "sustain" means to maintain not grow... And in regards to the environment we are throwing off the balance. The Eco system is always trying to maintain an equilibrium of "sources" and "sinks" aka inputs and outputs. We use up the inputs and produce things faster than the environment can recycle the outputs.

I could go on and on about this topic and all of it's facets. I would highly recommend taking an environmental class while in school. I took one last semester at my university and it was eye opening.
  • 1 2
 peak oil is a scam...
www.prisonplanet.com/archives/peak_oil/index.htm

anyone go to the nhra round in seattle this weekend? top fuel ftw!
  • 1 0
 peak oil is a scam as well as it isn't - cheap sources of oil are depleting, European, Australian and American intervention in Iraq is a pure necessity if we are to live our lifestyle in the way we live it now, for as long as it is possible. People wouldn't look for oil offshore if they wouldn't know that wells in middle east will be over in our lifetime. In fact the brother of my best friend is working on a research ship cruising on Mexican Gulf. He says, since 8 years he works there, they found are so little places where it actualy makes sense to plant an oil platform, that it's just looking worse and worse. It gets just too difficut and prices must go up a lot so it gets profitable to drill it out. But when they go so high people might not want to buy it and pedal instead. Grow food in proximity of their homes etc.

All those hybrids sound cool... but they are retarded as well, we need to change our lifestyles, be less greedy - not find new ways how to keep on rolling the way we do. Driving a hybrid is like US changing credit ceiling, EU lending money to Greece - it's just postponing the sentence. Nothing to be happy about if you die, before the next case in the court, your kids will go there and along with dead ancestors -> they will figure out that you are the axxhole Big Grin


As for the lifts... People should pedal more...
  • 8 0
 I go to school at oregon state university, 35 miles from black rock, and I just bought my first car this summer. Before I had this car my friends and I rode our dh's 35 miles in a three hour marathon of hell carrying sleeping backs, fire wood, food, and water on our backs. This trip took a tremendous amount of time and planning and commitment. Now I am looking forward to being able to drive my truck, with five other people in the car with me, to black rock for a cool day of riding. Don't get me wrong, there are places to ride within 6 miles of our campus and we would would be riding our bikes to them and we don't NEED to go to black rock -- but give me a break... black rock kicks ass. I will be driving to black rock, guilt free, riding the trails on my 45 lb dh bike that I bought back in 2007. The day a bike is made that can be ridden 40+ miles without complaint and then take on a dh trail like sikter gnar or dog bone, I will shit my pants.

As for the gondolas and chairlift... Help me understand why this is different than shuttling? You ride you big-ass heavy bike (or small, light bike) down a hill and then you sit on a chairlift that lifts you to the top of a hill. That's what a car does. And don't give me the crap that a car burns fossil fuel and takes more energy, the electricity used to run that chair lift constantly takes energy that was most likely made by burning coal. You can tell me that a chairlift takes less energy, but until I see the real numbers I'm not convinced either way.

Road bikers confuse the hell out of me, so I don't have an opinion on them.

Next time you take lines directly out of a movie, site them.
  • 9 1
 If you're talking about Life Cycles, guess what? I wrote the script. Haha, citing my own damn self.
  • 2 0
 AndrewVB just got worked...
  • 1 0
 Good job on avoiding the main question....
  • 2 0
 I figured out that you wrote the story behind the movie after I looked it up, citing would still be nice.

Yes, I would, as many others would, prefer chairlifts over shuttling. As for going from the center of town to the forrest on a gondola... I'm not quite sure what this would accomplish? Would this take gas guzzling cars off the road? or would it just make it more convenient for any citizen to go to their favorite trails? or both?

good movie...
  • 3 0
 Sorry for avoiding the main question. The main point I'm trying to get across is that we need to start developing transportation infrastructure that's both environmentally sustainable and recreationally oriented. Gondolas are one example of this. And yes, you're right, if you live in an area that burns coal for electricity (which is whack by the way), then maybe it's not resulting in a net positive gain. There are, however, many places in the world where electricity is a low emission, highly sustainable energy resource. Way, way better than burning fossil fuels. The e-bike technology people are talking about, there's ideas structured around wind tunnels for bike transportation that have never been incorporated...the list goes on. And while nothing is going to be perfect, don't you think it's time we start looking for solutions that at least begin to reduce the impact our "fun" is having on the planet? That's really what the article is about and I think it has started some very cool dialogue amongst the fine Pinkbike peeps.
  • 2 0
 Chill.
  • 1 0
 BigTimber I like your thinking but if you think about the idea you've proposed it really applies to a very small group of areas. I say that because nearly all our power comes from coal, you may get lucky and have BC using hydro power as you've mentioned in your article, but part from that most of our energy comes from coal. Plus putting a strain on electric resources would only drive the governments to use more coal, do you really think they're bothered expanding renewable energy sources which cost more at a time of economic recession? But your article did get some dialogue going between the people on pinkbike which always helps, so props to you!
  • 1 0
 Agreed. Maybe just places like BC should consider the gondola idea. And you're right coal is really harsh. Unfortunately the technologies of energy production are still so wildly undeveloped that places still need to burn fossil fuel. Imagine if all the money put into war over the last 50 years had gone into new energy technologies? Thing is, shit has to start changing. And if it doesn't start changing somewhere, then nothing is ever going to change. Which would really suck. Which is why I'm promoting the gondola idea. Because I've seen it work and its rad. I'm just saying that in places close to relatively big hills with thousands of people cycling and hiking, and they need their car to do so, that something should be done about it.
  • 6 0
 Egh' If gondolas where built in my neck of the woods the weenie hikers would some how get politicians to keep bikers off of them anyway. Here in LA California there is a mini war going on with Hikers, bikers and equestrian riders. Everyone wants the trail to themselves and if a lift where built we would fight over that to. tisk tisk...
  • 6 1
 For some reason the tone of my previous email wasn't appreciated by the moderator. Let me try again.

I have an idea. RIDE YOUR BIKE. Today's selection of bikes makes this more possible than ever. Many of us enjoy the up as much and sometimes more than the down. In my area (British Columbia) fast guys on all mountain bikes go just as fast as the fast DHer on 90% of the technical trails. I have a five and five bike, Talas fork and adjustable seatpost. Rides like an XC bike to the top and stransforms into a downhill weapon at the top. I race a little XC so my bike is more set up to being efficient going uphill. If your not racing and don't need to set records on your local climb, there are plany of 6" plus bikes that pedal fine and will kill it on the downhill. You might even get in shape in the process.
  • 4 0
 I feel you. I used to ride 8 miles both ways to go freeriding which sucked on the ride home if I got hurt. I recently rode 100km to go to the only Shore like trail around here and you don't exactly shred or progress your riding when you are tired and saving energy for the ride home.f*ck Gondolas though they need huge amounts of fossil fuels to create. I say Brushless motors and Lightweight LiPo batteries (charged by solar panels) that can be taken off at the trail head, locked to a tree, then put back on for the ride home. For long rides use several batteries on a bike trailer, also left at the trailhead. None of these bullshit hub motors though. The expensive version www.ego-kits.com. The cheap version www.cyclone-tw.com/order-A.htm. If you are good with R/C electronics you could make your own kit using R/C plane engines and Li Po batteries that can give better power to weight ratios than most dirt bikes big $$$$ though and no warranty.
  • 5 2
 A Human on a bike cannot travel nearly as far as a bird can fly using the same amount of energy required. And a bicycle is not even close to the most efficient machine on the planet compared to windmills, hydro electric dams, and solar powered vehicles, just to start. The whole article made a good point but lost track with envious daydreams.
  • 6 2
 first, you cant really compare them because one creates kinetic energy and the others create potential energy. ignoring that however, hydroelectric dams, solar cars, and windmills are all actually pretty inefficient because they only harness a fraction of the energy available to them.

a perfect example is the solar car, the solar panel on it's roof is only about 10-20% efficient. which means that of the 1000w/m that are incident from the sun it can only harness 100-200w/m. not particularly efficient last time I checked. that's also ignoring the efficiency of the battery and motor, etc. That dosent mean solar cars are bad, but they arent as efficient as a bike. the ratio of energy in to energy out is nowhere near as good as a bike.
  • 2 1
 don't forget to take into account the weight of the thing our measuring. the amount of energy a bird needs to go a distance compared to it's weight is more than the amount of energy human needs to go the same distance compared to it's weight.
  • 1 1
 Pwn'd by physics!
  • 3 0
 Gondolas are not super cheap to run (one at DMR is rumored to cost $15,000/month to operate), and Electricity is not free nor clean.. Also - Moab DOES have one Gondola in place, and used to have another one up near Moab Rim. The Moab Rim lift has been dismantled for years, and the other is still in place near the Colorado River, but has not run since....?

Keen idea though, and a good read, thanks for sharing!
  • 3 1
 15,000 a month? that only takes like 300 people paying 50 bucks each to pay off, and last time i checked isnt there thousands of people that go to ski/bike hills in a month? so 15000 is pocket cash it seems like to me, its clearly running and making a profit, if it wasn't it would be torn down,

Electricity is actually really clean! alot cleaner than our other resources, and the best part is that its actually renewable! so i dont know why i have already read like 10+ comments from people saying that its actually not a good energy source! i dont know about california or other areas but in BC canada hydro energey is as clean as it gets! and then there is wind farms in california and the list goes on. Sure there is unclean ways to create electricity but there is alot of clean ways to create it too that their just isnt enough implementation of it yet. as far as i am concerd in my basic knowledge, electricity = clean
  • 4 1
 hydro electricity may be "clean" but in order for it to work acres upon acres of land have to be flooded.
  • 3 0
 Oh that's right, the whole world is blessed with the Columbia watershed. Outside BC where the earth is a little flatter, you can't do that. Coal is king because we have lived our entire lives with the expectation that we can walk into a room, flip a switch and have the light turn on. That's called base load, power that's being used somewhere all the time. Wind power? Pssh. Nobody told you that those windmills only produce on average 25% of their installed capacity and that lack of online reliability is why in Alberta only permits 5% of generating capacity to be wind powered. That way a gas-fired peaking plant can pick up the slack if the wind stops blowing to prevent brown outs. Unless the government subsidizes wind power it isn't economical because installation costs per kWh are too high versus actual output. Over my dead body.

Don't believe me? Maybe you need to look into power pricing. Let's take a large hypothetical situation where the green crusaders all got wind power installed instead of the big evil coal plants. Someone would have to pay to install 4 times as many wind farms as we actually need because our electricity demands do not decline when the wind stops blowing. Now if the wind is blowing we have 4 times as much power as we need and it's dirt cheap. Who is going to pay for this and not be able to make any money( or even get their money back from it)?

jon-15 has a point. Google Kinbasket lake. I'm all for Hydro power where it's feasible but it's not free. Just because an energy source eliminates emissions at the point of use doesn't mean there is no impact at all. You're just passing the buck so you can live in a dream world. Electricity is not magic, it all has to come from somewhere.
  • 2 0
 Combined solar and wind on every house would take no land away. Most places get govt. subsidies for this. Fuck fields of solar panels or windmills. Use the roofs and backyards.
  • 1 0
 THE MOAB GONDOLA on Moab rim was bought by the Sierra club, financed by rich hippies. They then tore it out, and thats what happened to it.
  • 3 0
 Even if you get your head past replacing cars with gondola's you need to take into account the added impact on the trails.

Ever been to whistler? Or any other lift accessed bike park for that matter? The trails take a complete and utter beating. And the mountains they are on have fully dedicated 9-5 trail crews that maintain them on almost round the clock basis.

While lift access to local trails would be nice, it will bring with it the crowds. Anytime you make something easier to access you'll get more people, its inevitable. So that little slice of heaven trail that you never see anyone on will soon become a congested highway (ever ridden a-line on a weekend), that gets rutted out in mere days.

Unfortunately in life you cant have the best of both worlds. You either work for your elevation and get perfectly groomed trails where its rare to see anyone. Or you pay $$$ for your descents, and deal with trails that are over ridden.
  • 1 0
 well said. I find the funnest trails are the ones that have a climb to weed out a bunch of people, and people who are willing to climb are usually (not always) less likely to skid or braid the trails.

But even if there were crowds at an area where you had to earn your vert; because the riders would have to spend time earning their vert, the trails would get less use and last longer between maintenance.
  • 3 0
 Hey I've got an idea that's only about 40 years old. HOW ABOUT YOU START RIDING YOUR BIKE. There's a reason that mountain bikes don't have foot pegs. It's so you can propel yourself. And get this, they actually go uphills too. For many of us the climb is as rewarding, if not more, than the down. I know it's hard to smoke while riding your bike uphill but it may actually cut down on your habit and you might even get fit in the process.

With bikes today, there is absolutely no reason to shuttle unless your just plain lazy. Buy a bike with 4 to 6 inches of travel, get a telescoping seatpost, etc. A bike in this category will range from 24 to 35 pounds and will be just as fast as your DH pig on more than 80% of technical trails. 'end rant'
  • 1 0
 Some people live in the burbs and have to travel 100s of km to trails. I've ridden 100k's after getting off the Train and I hate riding on the road.
  • 2 0
 That's a good article. We are really lucky here in Finland, in our law system there is "everyman's rights" that says by law that we are allowed to bike everywhere. The is few national parks that prohibit mountainbiking, but that's not a lot. I live downtown in Helsinki (capital) and it takes me 10minutes of riding on a road to get to endless amount of trails. More to the topic of the article, during the downhill skiing boom in the end of 70's and trough 80's even the smalles hills here got a t-bar lifts. Now there is lot's of places that are open during the summer for mountainbikers. So even a t-bar lift is better than nothing, but of course chairlift or gondola is much better. More about everyman's rights if you are interested www.environment.fi/default.asp?contentid=390532&lan=EN
  • 2 0
 I may be taking liberty in thinking that this article was written less as a how-to guide for reducing our impact, but more as a means of raising awareness. With this intent in mind, it seems that the majority of the people reading this article have entirely missed the point. I shudder to think of how many people who read this article will never have even considered the footprint of their lifestyles. Thanks for the article, at the very least it starts the discussion.
  • 2 0
 That was the intent for sure vicrider. Thanks for noticing.
  • 2 0
 here in seattle, 2.50 dollars to go on a lightrail from my house to a trail 12 miles south. 2.5 dollars and a half hour bus ride north to a dirt jump spot. 20 minute DH bike ride to the colonnade. 1 hr, 2 bus ride east to Duthie. and I have yet to tap into the ferry system and go west. you get what I'm saying here? you don't need a car. nor do you need a gondola. i highly doubt any city would build a gondola from like downtown to a trail. and this coming from a kid in the northwest. we are supposed to be the outdoor people of america. public transit is really where it's at, and cheaper by half then your gondola.
  • 2 0
 It's a nice fantasy. You'd still have to get to the gondola though, and the quickest way would be driving. Really for this to work there would have to be a gondola and trails on every large hill and mountain everywhere.
  • 1 0
 we are aiming for the same sort of thing at the network of trails near Innerleithen in the borders, its gaining pace now and all done by the community from a group of people willing to offer their services, including lawyers, engineers, shop owners and so on www.facebook.com/pages/Support-the-Innerleithen-Uplift/124813904230727 , this is the page for the group behind the whole movement/project!!!
  • 1 0
 The initial problem here is that we're living in a Type 0 civilization, meaning that we still gather the largest percentage of our energy from fossil fuels (dead plants essentially). That includes electricity, but not however solar generated electricity. A Type 1 civilization exists when the soul energy source is produced from the nearest star (solar electricity...). My point here is that once we can establish a Type 1 civilization our electric energy, if that's what we still call it, will be clean and no longer deplete our natural resources. The most efficient machine on the planet (bicycle) will be assisted by the second most efficient machine, an electric engine. It will power gondolas and trams in tall mountainous regions. It will power shuttles if regions like Moab and Fruita. A mountainbiker in a Type 1 civilization will certainly be one lucky son of a gun.
  • 1 0
 "IF MOHAMMED WON"T COME TO THE MOUNTAIN THEN THE MOUNTAIN NEEDS TO MAKE MOHAMMED SOME MONEY AND HE WILL DO WHATEVER YOU WANT," as to say figure out how to make it profitable and it will happen, wether you live in a Capitalist, Socialist, or any other type of economy it will happen.
  • 3 0
 for all the vancouverites, i heard sfu is planning on building a gondola up burnaby mountain. I know its not the shore but a lift access trail or two would be pretty cool
  • 1 0
 I've heard that too. I hope it doesnt take 50 years to make a decision ...
  • 1 0
 It will.
but yeah translink wants to put a peak to peak style gondola from the skytrain station to sfu, but residents are already getting angry because they don't want it going through their backyard. Fair enough.

www.globaltvbc.com/tensions+rise+over+proposed+gondola/4843692/story.html
  • 2 0
 Great read! I laugh every time I see a road bike on a car!!! Your driving on roads to go somewhere to ride a road bike!! If any town does it around here, I bet Bellingham makes it happen.
  • 1 0
 Shit, obviously I love riding, and call me evil for this if you want, but I DO enjoy driving, too.. Especially off road, at high rates of speed. I don't think you can call cars themselves 'bad,' thats just like saying guns are 'bad..' But like its said, guns dont kill people- people kill people, with guns. Peoples laziness and misuse of cars sucks for the environment, yes.. But cars themselves arent intrinsically 'bad.' Quite frankly, I like em! Big Grin
  • 1 0
 people also forget that emissions are only one problem with our dependency on fossil fules , a more pressing problem is that they are a finite recourse so will run out , before this happens they will become far to expensive to use so wee need alternatives before oil just becomes to expensive or rare to use. even if you don't believe in man made climate change , you cant deny that there is only so much oil fact.
  • 1 0
 A good article, but MTN Biking cannot grow fast enough. I would love to see my community pull together to help me build a bike park- still in the works, and the Red Tape and State Regulations make it almost not worth it- so I drive to another place to use the bike parks. Highlands. Johnson State. IdeRide (Kingdon Trails). Environmentalists also hold up all of the trail development in my home town. They own all the land and permit us to use the land as recreation, but any modifications that are not approved first through legislation, we have to just suffer, while trails need expansion, need maintenance and development mostly for safety reasons! I'll always drive to where the biking is, until we all own the earth together and making your own trail does not piss off the locals, the burried Tribe that might be or crossing boundries into other countires, my car is my other bike.
  • 1 0
 A lot of peole here may disagree with what I am about to say; if you do, please reply where you can.

While I agree with the general point that more gondolas would be a welcome addition to any area in which people want to get their gravity kicks, a lot of people here are forgetting that most of us here are talking about the use of our bikes for non-necessary fun, not our everyday transport. There is no "essential" travel involved when we go out and ride for fun; and transport policy is therefore unlikely to consider it very highly.

The article does make a one sentence cap doff to "the growing legions of bike commuters who transport everything from kids to building supplies by bike" yet that is not what we ride for here is it? (Personally I do but that has no relevance to my DH weekend rides).

Gondolas are highly unlikely to be a part of a coherent transport planning scheme since they do not represent a way to make essential journeys,
  • 2 0
 Super article! It is nice to think that one day, something like this might happen! The future is out there to be changed so hopefully....
  • 1 0
 "circles turning circles, propelled by another bit of design genius, the human engine. Consider this: when a human being gets on a bike we become the most efficient animal on the planet"

We have a Life Cycles fan...
  • 2 0
 Mitchell Scott wrote the narrative in Life Cycles dude! He's referencing his own work.
  • 1 0
 Thank you intrepidbiped...
  • 2 1
 Actually your food has huge fossil food inputs. A Hummer gets better gas mileage than you do walking. Unless you eat totally organic local food.
  • 1 0
 "Totally organic local food" has about 1/5 the yield per acre as traditional crops. Thats 5 times as many rainforests that need to be cleared to grow the same amount of food. Plus, if synthetic fertilizers aren't used, then animal waste has to be used. Land has to be set aside to grow animal feed, which offsets any benefit the fertilizers give to the original crops, widening the efficiency gap between traditional and organic farming methods.
  • 1 0
 @intrepidbiped Had no idea man, makes sense then!
  • 1 1
 Pretty much the only time I drive my Car is to go for a ride and everywhere else I just ride . Here's the question tho how much of your riding stuff do you keep in your car . I know for me if I take my gloves or Knee pad's Helmet and goggle's out of my car I'll forget to take them .
  • 3 0
 Here's a real shuttle...Windrock style:

www.sicklines.com/news-images/IMG_3703.jpg
  • 3 1
 im still gonna shuttle my big heavy dh bike up the mountain in my diesel guzzling 7.3 powerstroke on 37's cause thats what i bought my truck to do
  • 1 0
 no. you need to sell your 7.3 powerstroke on 37's and buy a Chevy Volt (So totally proud that my tax dollars are going into that fine automobile), AND the manufacturing of your DH bike is bad for the environment too. Buy a bamboo bike, some skinny jeans, and a deep v neck sweater and go do some skids.
  • 1 1
 welcome to beautiful british columbia, come see what a logging road and a real mountain looks like, kinda hard to fit 8 dh bikes, 8 riders and all their gear into a volt, let alone trying to get a volt through a cross ditch im gonna burn tons of diesel fuel pollute the air like crazy and do tons of skids all over my awesome mountains Big Grin
  • 1 0
 Diesels can run on used oil just add 1ml ethanol per litre. Or use biodiesel. Screw buying any new car it takes more fossil fuel inputs to build a new car than your used truck will ever use.
  • 1 0
 its a joke.
  • 1 0
 Well apparently you need to ride with less people and gear, besides all those people exhaling CO2 while riding is going to increase the global temperature and kill polar bears. I would love to see what a logging road and a real mountain look like, but my prius is having its gigantic battery changed right now, and riding a real mountain would taco my fixie wheels.
  • 1 0
 Well I agree I'll be driving my big truck still after reading this and half the fun is loading all the boys and bikes in my rig blaring music and laughing about the stupid stuff we did the week or night before. It is a big truck that is bad for the environment thats why we commute it up the hill. The gondola for all is a wicked idea and I'm all for it, but I know I'd still load up the truck and drive to your hill for fun too. bikesbeforebabes dont forget we live where there is endless mountains, clean water and huge trees and logging roads and the average is to roll a big boy truck but there are so few that get to live here so let them have there coal burning power and volkswagens and granola to make up for it hell some of these places are burning bc coal. And I can shuttle that volt in my rig if someone really wants it at the drop in point.
  • 1 0
 yea, I would do awful things to farm animals to live in BC. And if you haven't figured it out yet bikesbeforebabes I'm completely full of shit, and I absolutely would be shuttling DH bikes in an old pickup if I lived in gods country like you do. This gondola stuff is cute and would be lovely in our mountain bike utopia world, but it's unrealistic at best.
  • 1 0
 If he can get 8 people and all their gear into his truck regardless of how big it is that`s pretty efficient actually. And any electric car creates so much pollution in the sourcing of the materials in its battery that they don`t catch up to normal cars of similar size for overall pollution levels until they`ve been driven approximately 100k miles (that`s based off the prius, not sure what others are like but I expect its similar)
  • 2 0
 Hahah electric cars are a joke.
  • 1 1
 ATTENTION ALL HIPPIE HATERS==
yes, i hate them and their crappy music too, but they are in the political drivers seat right now, and that is reality. While all this BS about gondolas and chairlifts saving the environment is retarded, they don't know that. I want more lifts around simply because girlfriends and sisters aren't willing to shuttle us for all eternity. We need to use this angle to help the fight for more lifts/gondolas! Who cares if it is a bunch of BS about bikes and lifts saving the environment? If they think that, more trails will be open to biking and more lifts will be built!!!!
  • 1 0
 As far as the mentalists go, bit of a love hate relationship there. We need them to stop corporations from raping the planet, then there kickin you off your favorite trail.......Whatchagonnado?
  • 1 1
 bigdood is right, greenwashing is the new black.
nothin like chicken littles running around claiming pseudo intellectual facts /theories/claims about what society does or does not need.
does anyone with half a brain fall for this stuff anymore?
gondolas? how 20th century.
wait till the hippies get aload of the shweeb...

www.shweeb.co.nz

and talk about biting the hand that feeds. how much money has this author made off the shuttle uplift? directly or indirectly, shuttles have been lining his bank account for years.
  • 2 0
 Helium: Time to bring back the dirigible in a major way. Go Shred-Zeppelin.
  • 3 0
 fck everyone i have a truck and im gonna use it
  • 2 1
 That's the problem. Everyone already has a truck and uses it all the time.
  • 2 1
 i like it, i didnt know for 5 km, bicycles are the most energy efficient thing out there. THAT IS SO COOL!!!! i am all for it, i dont like spending gas money!
  • 5 0
 its true that bikes r super efficient, but i heard a fish in water takes the top spot and cycling is 2nd place, but i would guess that they probably arent talking about dh bikes haha, but road bikes, dh bikes r probably similar to like a hippo or somethin.
  • 3 0
 anyone knows what's up with Carlin Dunne ?
  • 3 0
 But you still have to drive your car to get to the gondola, GASP!
  • 2 0
 I was about to comment and say that but then realised the article is also touching on trams etc. At the end of the day, people should be riding to where they ride IMO - although obviously in reality this is not always possible, unfortunately.
  • 1 0
 If you live in the midlands in the UK, to even start thinking about gondolas would be daft, it's a good hours drive to any good gravity riding location for me (and i don't drive). I can get the train to some places, but bus links (e.g. i could get the train to edinburgh, but how would i get to inners from edinburgh with a bike?) are either very poor or non existent when you have a bike. And the train is truly awful to get a bike on anyway. Most only have two bike spaces, and if they're taken, you're likely to get turned away. For a nation that is supposedly trying to be eco-friendly, the politicians that are supposed to be implementing these things have a HELL of a lot to answer for. It's near impossible for me to get to a good riding location using public transport.
  • 1 0
 Never had a problem getting bikes on trains, and have been commuting via train/bike for the past year due to loss of licence. Guess this just depends where you are.

As for problems getting around via public transport I feel your pain, although this is definitely the reason I stick to hardtail/AM style bikes; as you're not reliant on other forms of transportation as you can actually ride the thing.
  • 1 0
 At one small point in time biking almost turned into a motor sport with shuttle fag ness. Then came the chairlifts. Viva ski resorts!
  • 2 0
 I've only ever gotten a ride to a trail once. I bike to my trails, and I bike back.
  • 1 0
 Kind of dumb. It would be nice to get away from cars to ride bikes, but gondolas and ski lifts arent the answer. And where do the get the electricity from the run the lift?
  • 3 5
 Alternatively DH riders could man up and get a second chain ring and ride up the mountains! Wink

In all seriousness though, think about what you're saying here; you want to replace cars ('bad' for the environment) with electrically-run alternatives? Excuse me but what fuels electricity? We're a long way off from dropping our dependency on fossil fuels. Whatever system you use is just going to be using 'dangerous' chemicals in a different way.
  • 2 2
 hyrdo electricity + windfarms = clean renewable electricty. excuse me were is the harmful chemicals in that equation? efficient implementation has been slow but its happening.
  • 4 0
 Large battery banks tend to have their share of harmful chemicals in them, not to mention the mining and manufacturing of the raw materials for the windfarms. Hydro electricity has never caused any environmental harm just ask the various species of salmon that are no longer around and the fall out from that. Don't forget the maintenance of these by vehicles that require fossil fuels. I am a supporter of the least invasive means of generating power that we can get however we are far from being a clean and none impactful species.
  • 4 0
 Fidorc80.... Facts are not welcome in a discussion regarding "clean energy"....
  • 1 0
 Wind/Tidal power is reliant on a highly expensive and environmental damaging production process. The only option is Nuclear; providing waste is correctly processed (be it disposal or recycling).
  • 1 0
 why the hell would I want to ride a gondola when my barley pops and maryjane are in the shuttle truck?
  • 2 0
 Never smoked up a godola? Your missing out. You don't have to steer just keep packing.
  • 1 0
 Not called the Ganjala for no reason.
  • 1 0
 Spark that shit in any mode of transportation you choose.
  • 1 0
 mother of susan, boys, you've fucking enlightened me. Big white has a gondola that needs to be boxed.
  • 1 0
 fire it up
  • 1 0
 great article! if only we could get some of the head honchos to read this lol
  • 1 0
 Why cant u be a head honcho? Work hard, be sucessful, run for office!!
  • 1 0
 haha! im more into bike design but boy would i kill for a gondola
  • 1 0
 It seems like too much of a utopia for North America.. Looks like I'm movie to Europe!
  • 1 0
 No shit we want gondolas. Bike trails do no damage to the fucking woods loggers do. Fuck environmentalists
  • 1 0
 1. No Complaining 2. Buy a Shuttle Buddy 3. Go Ride! 4. Repeat. www.shuttlebuddy.com
  • 1 0
 In the first pic, whats the padding that goes round the lip of the pickup bed called. What the bikes hang over.. Cheers.
  • 1 0
 As much as we all love Toyota Tacomas, get a diesel golf, run biodiesel, and install a roof rack. Crisis averted.
  • 4 1
 good article
  • 2 1
 Great, article
  • 2 1
 amazing article
  • 2 1
 Fantastic Article
  • 2 1
 I like it too Smile Nice idea
  • 2 3
 oh so u think u can one up me brindog i think its a super duper awesome article combod with a tail-whip
  • 1 0
 Leave Fruita and Moab alone - so much fun to ride down or up
  • 1 0
 I can't wait to take a gondola 40 Km to the nearest trail network! It's gonna be rad! Good thinking Mitchell!
  • 1 0
 that would be rad
  • 1 0
 Good write up and a nice read, not too long and not too short.That pic of Zermatt in Switzerland is Breathtaking.
  • 1 0
 we have a gondola up our local hill but unfortunately not for mtb use, damn tourists!
  • 2 0
 can't live in queenstown then cuz
  • 1 0
 with so many awesome "all mountain" bikes out there today, people just need to sack up and enjoy the ride up
  • 1 0
 6th photo down, now that's what I like when I get on a chair lift, shes inspiration before each run..
  • 1 0
 Smile agreed. Inspriation you don't often see at the operator level for chair lifts. Must expand this!
  • 2 0
 Greenwashing is the new black
  • 1 0
 Fu*% Im getting a jetpack!
  • 1 0
 Jet pack world record is about a kilometre.
  • 1 0
 Low emission nuclear powered jet back with an auto pilot for retrieval would be the biznaz
  • 1 0
 looks like someone can't afford the rest of his car payments!
  • 1 0
 Gotta love BC, we are always in a forest.
  • 1 0
 nice







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