Is It a DH Race If a Trail Bike Wins? By Matt Wragg Racing has always been racing. You show up at the race track and do whatever it takes to win. There are no moral victories, only the podium. If you're not sure, go and ask Sam Hill about his Champery race run in 2007. Eventually, we will stop calling it the greatest race run in downhill history, everyone will forget that the rain coming in mid-way through finals turning the track into a mud-bath, and people won't remember the world's fastest riders flocking towards him in admiring disbelief. With time, all that will be left will be the record book. And that says that Matti Lehikoinen was a second and a bit faster than him and won the race. You'd be a fool to bet that Sam doesn't understand that more clearly than anyone else. Since the earliest races recorded by man, people have tried to find an extra edge over the competition. Whether it was the early Greeks covering themselves in olive oil, or Nico Vouilloz calculating exactly where to tuck on the course to maintain speed without wasting energy, it's hardwired into anyone willing to spend their life chasing wins. They will take any advantage they can find. That means we can't fault Mitch Ropelato for racing this weekend's Fontana Pro GRT downhill race on a 29er trail bike. It's within the rules and it was obviously the fastest tool for the job. To take that win, he also had to beat his new teammate, Aaron Gwin. We would be pretty damned pleased with the world if we could beat Aaron Gwin in a push-cart race, let alone any kind of bicycle race. For a few years now, we've been hearing from The People Who Know These Kind Of Things that Mitch is very talented rider. Now that he has been taken in by Specialized's racing programme, it looks like he's shaping up to fulfill that potential. So, hats off Mitch. You killed it. We should also say that we quite like the Specialized Stumpjumper 29 he used to take the win. We have one on test at the moment and while we don't want to give too much away on that front, we can let on that it's a good trail bike. What it very definitely is not, is a downhill bike. The fact it weighs 10lb less than the lightest DH bikes out there is the big giveaway. What we want to know is why anyone is running a downhill race on a track where that is the fastest bike to race on? Since Aaron Gwin began beating the rest of the World Cup circuit into submission with the kind of consistent, winning form that hasn't been seen since Nico Vouilloz, people stopped asking what happened to the US downhill racing scene as often. Yet if you look behind him, there isn't what you'd call a stacked field. We've already said here that Mitch has potential, Richie Rude is probably going to scare a few people before long, Neko Mullaly still has his ride with Trek World Racing, and then... For a country as big as the US, with as many people riding bikes, that's quite a small group. National races are supposed to be the proving ground to move up to the higher, international levels. World Cup racing is at such a high level these days that the jump from even the most competitive national series to that highest level of competition is still brutal. They aren't the only thing that matters, of course. Switzerland has some of the best downhill tracks in the world, and little more than Nick Beer and Florian Pugin to show for it on the World Cup circuit. But, if you look at each of the strong downhill countries, you'll see a strong national series. It's fair to say that if you show up to a national race in Britain, France, Australia or New Zealand on a 29er trail bike, you're going to end the weekend at the lower end of the timesheet with a bag of bits that used to be your bicycle. Maybe you're now asking yourself "Why does a Brit writing for a Canada-based website care about the state of US downhill?" Because downhill needs the US. It is the biggest bike market in the world, and whether the rest of us like it or not, it's the most influential country for mountain biking. For downhill to grow and develop as an international sport, we need Americans needs to be part of it. It is supposed to be the fastest, most demanding pinnacle of our sport. If one of your top national race series is being won on trail bikes, you can't help but wonder if some people are missing the point... | What Wheel Size for World Cup Tracks? By Mike Kazimer At first, it sounded like an April Fool's joke: Mitch Ropelato beat Aaron Gwin at the Fontana stop of the Pro GRT race series riding a Stumpjumper EVO 29er. With a water bottle in the cage. Now, it's not surprising Ropelato won, as he's a ridiculously skilled bike handler (witness his three-peat at the Crankworx Pumptrack Challenge), but winning aboard a 29er trail bike does raise some questions. I will let Matt Wragg address the questions about the course itself (you can view one racer's helmet cam footage here), but while the Fontana course isn't the longest or gnarliest course around, three out of the top four riders were on non-26” wheeled bikes – could this be a glimpse at what will happen during the upcoming World Cup season? For the internet mountain bikers, the message board trolling experts of everything, Ropelato's win is a splash of gasoline on the already blazing fire of wheel size debate. Granted, the Fontana course is tame in comparison to World Cup standards – it's unlikely anyone, no matter how talented, could win Val di Sol aboard a trail bike, but aboard a downhill bike rolling on something other than 26” wheels? It's entirely possible. With pre-season training in full swing for pro riders, there's no doubt that many of them are experimenting with different wheel sizes, especially 650b. For a racer, if changing something as simple as wheel size can give them an advantage, they're going to do it. When racing is your job, equipment selection becomes more crucial, and can mean choosing to race on a wheel size that wouldn't be your first choice if winning wasn't the ultimate goal. With the difference between standing atop the podium and watching from the crowd coming down to a matter of seconds, or even milliseconds, it's worth trying any bit of bike technology that might add that extra blast of speed. When asked for his thoughts on riding a 29er vs. a 26” wheeled bike, Mitch Ropelato said,
No professional downhill racer has piloted a bike with anything bigger than 26” wheels to the top of a World Cup podium. That could change this season, and if a bigger wheeled bike does make it to the top, it will signal the tipping point in the wheel size debate, providing evidence other than the scientific and pseudo-scientific facts that marketing teams use to peddle their goods. There are still two months before the first World Cup, but Sea Otter is rapidly approaching, and the downhill course there is notorious for being better suited to a shorter travel bike. Will bigger wheels take the win? Only time will tell. Mitch Ropelato aboard his Stumpy 29er, complete with water bottle and cage. Photo: Cashman33 |
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Any track that is won on a light weight 29er trail bike should be stopped!
A track with that much pedalling is going to be won on a shorter travel rig, it's simple. And it should not come under the category DH.
And why are DH riders not allowed to use skin suits that creat less drag and wind resistance (like the mojo team did a few years ago). But a larger faster rolling wheel is allowed?
Why are pro downhillers making this an important race in their schedule? If it can be won on a 29er trail bike, it is not a proper DH race!
There are plenty of DH trails around here that are better for trail bikes than DH bikes in race situations but that doesn't mean the track is any less of a DH-specific run. Personally I believe that if you're having a race that's being promoted as a DH race, it better be on a run where the majority of riders will need and can effectively use a DH rig for. If you choose to get the advantages of faster overall pedaling, quicker sprints and more explosiveness, with the disadvantages of less travel and less handling in some spots, that's your choice. At the end of the day no matter what the race is promoted as, it is a MTB race. Take whatever the hell you want down it as long as it is classified as a MTB.
But in reality, many female world cup racers do ride heavily (or lightly?) modified frames to make them lighter. (ie. removing weight & strength).
www.pinkbike.com/news/Tracey-Hannah-Bike-Check-Val-di-Sole-2012.html
"Tracy Hannah with her custom Makulu from Morewood. The bike uses an XC top tube instead of a DH tube set in order to save a bit of weight; plus Tracy's light enough to be able to get away with using the lighter weight tubing. April Lawyer's Intense frames used the same trick."
Beyond that...I would imagine the suspension and geometry required to survive a World Cup level track would dictate what they run.
Good try though.
Secondly, and this goes hand in hand with we need better courses, a real DH course should NOT be won on anything but a 26. I love 29ers for everything I can find within a 50 mile radius of where I live; I ride a 29er in XC races. But I do not live close to any DH trails and I know enough about downhill to know that a DH race should be technical enough so that the known advantages of a 29er, or a larger wheel size, do not outweigh the advantages of a smaller wheel size. If we are even considering putting anything but a 26 in a World Cup DH race then we need to stop being pussies and build harder courses.
Mitch Ropelato essentially won an enduro race, minus the climbing.
Holy shit(!), I just realized even your joke is wrong... I don't know if you are using brain size as a metaphor for intelligence, but if we just talk about brain volume, then yes, people who wear smaller helmets probably do have smaller brains. Can't remember if head size/skull diameter/brain volume is sexually dimorphic. Point is it doesn't matter. Happy to clarify any other biology questions. Keep'em coming.
4.3.011 All lycra-elastane based tight-fitting clothing is not permitted.
4.3.012 A full-face helmet must be worn properly both when racing and when training on the
course. The helmet must be fitted with a visor. Open-face helmets may not be worn.
Let's go back to the motorcycle wheel size thing though..... Moto GP has regulations regarding it. 17 inch only. They also have a slew of other technical regulations just like in car racing. Should we start to concern ourselves with this as DH moves forward ? Perhaps we should... Personally I have an issue with a DH race being won on a 29 inch trail bike. I do. It's an abomination. What approach we take to curb this issue is yet to be decided but I think we need to keep DH a sport with some sort of IDENTITY.
Basically what it comes down to, is that track is an abomination for a national level downhill race track. It was won on a trail bike. Wheel size is completely irrelevant.
You have to be crazy what do you mean you can't buy many specialized in 26inch!!! He was on a 29er because it was faster for him and he felt comfortable on it period!!
Make sure to watch the last 1/3 of the course.
www.pinkbike.com/video/305359
Regarding what Matt Wragg said; our attitude here in SoCal towards mountain biking and trail access is probably the worst in the whole world.
A brotha can't even ride his bike without worrying about being fined.
Im very aware of those races and have been to a few of them. I am not ragging on Utah and proabably utilize this state more than most! However as you said yourself the scene could be much further along than it is. Thanks for the enlightenment....
Is everyone so bent simply b/c it was a 29er?
Also, enduro is where the money is not because the industry is pushing trail bikes; your average joe, who wants to ride a bit of everything and do so comfortably, and doesn't train hours and hours to go harder and faster, are the ones who buy those bikes. It only makes sense for the industry to promote a racing scene for them. Trust me, I used to live and breath elite racing, and one day a teammate told me "well, we really are only useful to sell bikes. [various older, wealthier recreational riders] are buying those bikes, and spending 7,8,9 or 10 thousand bucks on them because we win races on them. You do realize that a bunch of poor race bums who make sure they buy everything for cost don't drive the industry, right?" I thought about that when I saw the advent of enduro racing series across the country, and realized that they are having a hard time selling 19lb, $13k weight weenie xc bikes and elite downhill race machines to the average rider. Most people want to ride fun trails on 5-7 inch travel bikes; the industry is not pushing those bikes, but pushing the racers to sell what is in fact what most people want
I doubt it.
Anyone got any split times for this race ? that will reveal a lot.
To all those who feel really strongly and are complaining about the state of riding/racing where they live, start networking and do something about it. Sitting online and posting about how you hate something isn't going to do a thing to change it.
Most "true" (whatever that means) mountain ranges are barely free of snow by May (this year is an exception).
They're damned by the calendar and the weather.
1/2 that course is pedaling....no big travel needed...only lungs and some "flow skills".
Gwinny chose the wrong weapon....I think if Gwin was on an Enduro he would have done just as well if not better.
simple answer:
giant trance x (26er)
because when i wake up tomorrow & suit up into my riding kit, go downstairs and don the helmet, that's the one i can actually go and ride!!!!!!!!!!
obviously the answer will change for different people but the reason will be the same for any real mountain biker
its not the bike, its not the trail its not even the rider it is simply the ride itself
By BC standards, you don't need anything more than a 4" travel for any of the Ontario trails. No wonder you show up to a XC race, and everyone is on a 19-pound 29er.
Somehow Rob, Sid, Kyle, Matt Z and a host of others have managed to find their way onto top level DH competition. There is a logical progression from O-Cup courses to Canada Cups, weekends at Bromont, Plattekill, Mountain Creek and more. There were regular convoys to the US Open and will be plenty of attendance at the ProGRTs and Gravity East races.
It makes no sense and most people can't afford to have two bikes. I'd love to have a competitive enduro bike along with my DH bike but that's tough to carry (along with an XC and dirt jumper). Camp Fortune is a god send for the Ontario scene and we are all thankful that it can be used. Beyond that yeah, it's 90 second tracks but that doesn't invalidate the racing in Ontario.
@deeeight Yeah, I have seen the ridges of Ontario ravines. A lot of them are poorly made off-camber single track that get washed off with just a hint of rain, and accelerate the erosion of the ravine sides. Can't blame them trail builder's though; perhaps they could have just made the single track 30 meters below and avoid the issue, but then all the trails in Ontario would be a flat run with the occasional burst to climb 50 meters at most. Anyways, used to think they are scary... until I saw the rock cliff ledges out here that make the blood go cold as you get anywhere close to the edge.
Bottom line, myself and I bet everyone else on this damn comment thread would not have winning times at this race regardless of bike, shock, helmet, or shiny pants. And if they can't see through marketing (PB or Special-Ed) its their own fault.
I don't care how fast the 'new wheel sizes' are, they still need to look good when I sit down for a coffee after a ride.
And 26 inch wheels have the best proportion.
Exactly.... Whatever rolls fastest....
Split times would be great to have at this track. Better analysys then.
Dont understand they dont cut the track...
Last tech section and finish, ready, that is what I would do. So still a big Wall section in in for the classic feeling, haha.
But much nicer to watch the race at the finish area then. A bit more DH feeling ;-).
Is it a DH track, if a trail bike can pushed to a win there? Dont know. But at some MX tracks riders on MX2/lites are as fast as MX1 riders. Is it a MX track then?
Or MotoGP at Sachsenring is close to Moto2 times because its much corners.
A DH Track can be to very specific to one theme if this is typical to the area. Short track like Willingen Germany or Pietermaritzburg/RSA or the AUS Worlds Track. In a series of six or better 8 races no problem. But for a World Champs race it is difficult. But at the end, the best rider will win. Finding the best tech set up and bike is part of the game.
Had the 29" size a influence? I think it helps also a bit in the tech sections, because they are a lot about keep the speed in them or carry velocity through. This is what a bigger wheel is good at. The hole track seems to me like its build to flow. But not to find the difference in proper braking or narrow corners or go into any extreme lines.
Bigger wheels are also good over such nobby terrain. Many rocks there seem to me very much like track nobbs. Not rocks. Bumps to roll over. Not tyre killers.
I hope DH will stay free of tech regulations and will stay open to new influences. Only this way the bikes become better. Also course design should not be to strict. Many locals and many areas love to support and live the DH Sport, but have no mountains.
At the end Mitch R. won. Congrats again. Best combination of rider, skill, choise of bike.
Don't you think that equipment choices should be limited by organizers in order to keep the competitive field even? I mean, at the pro level the technical skills are so high that sometimes equipment choice can make such a huge impact, at what point does it become about who had the best equipment choice vs who had the best skills.
As a side note, I don't get why people are taking this discussion so personally, it's interesting stuff and shouldn't be taken as a personal insult because someone is discussing their wheel size.
next up: someone went faster through steep sections using a different set of brakes than the race winner
But I think, they could definitely have a better technique. There was a portrait about a German XC-racer, in the bike Magazin here in Germany recently, where he trained his bike handling and he was like, damn, I'm so much faster round the corners and through root-sections. Big surprise, not.
Who exactly is pushing an agenda here?
But you can be faster with bigger wheels
There shouldn't be any debate here
Different sports have different classes for a reason.
If this is such a big question then make a different class for 29ers
The field is supposed to be level , with no advantages (to a point)
This goes for both 26" and 29" in. Bikes
A couple years back a guy won the cross country short track event on a road bike.
The track designers need to go back to school and the root of mtn. biking.
DH is all about a nasty, fast, kiss your butt goodbye course, with a pedal at the start not the end.
Maybe we need new designers or some of the old DH race course designers to step up and show these people how to build an actual race course. Be it Cross Country or DH.
The situation is kinda funny in a way. Just think with the course designers we have now, DH will be raced with 4" travel bikes next. Maybe even DH hardtails will make a come back.
I do not notice much difference for full suspension bikes. I do not like how long travel 29rs fit me (I am about average height). On a hardtail, I do like larger wheels.
There are a lot of people in the US racing arena missing this point, it happens all over the place. they should call it All mountain or Enduro or something else; but leave DH to true DH tracks.
Now if lopes does a certain laguna trail on a certain day next month under 2 minutes on his new 29r..ill be impressed!
.fast and steep sans major rock gardens.
maybe best solution is to brake it up into categories? like they some times do with hard tails.
But definetely if the race was won on a 29er trail bike it was not a real gravity race at all!
thanks ! and sorry if I am hearting somebody(metrosexual) feelings!
Personally, i'm excited to see how the 29er enduros do this year, big rock-clearing wheels and the travel and burliness to take a drop to flat or two seems like a killer combo
[Tears hair out, slaps self in face, shrugs shoulders, then gets on with life...]
Questions are : Are they going to play with rules to sort this out ? If yes can they afford to do that?
or Is it going to be ok for the riders to choose different bikes for each race ?
amazing
Rant Over.
If you really sit down and think about it, the adjustments of technique and skill required to make a 29er go fast are more conducive to a DH racer than anyone else.
Being comfortable at ridiculous speeds, setting yourself up earlier for turns, being able to work a bike underneath them to wring the most out of it, the ability to lean a bike over to it's absolute limit are all things necessary for making the adjustment to riding a 29er effectively if you are coming off of a similarly purposed 26" wheeled bike.
Seems far more likely that someone with a DH racers skill set would be more likely to ride a 29er than anyone else. (Yes, I speak from personal experience.)
a 160 mm would be enough for this current track,He were right with the choise of the bike
On a 29er you can have more speed if the trail is not so difficult to ride and the huge wheels help you to ride over rocks and roots.
It not the idea behind Downhill that you use other Bikes to win.
Or do you ride to the next DH-cup with a E-Bike or a MX-machine?
it does look like sh#t
bla bla form follows function i know
It is not. Maybe the biggest MTB market (maybe, proper data needed), but it should have been specified if the author had meant that.
I have had an MTB since 1990, yes showing my age now 26 works well WHY change a good thing???
What makes you any different Mike? You're on the internet...giving an opinion....about mountain biking. Just because you have a platform to do it from, it doesn't make it any more valid. I suggest in future you don't insult your readers, and come up with something more novel than "we're on the cusp of different wheel sizes dominating in WCs" which has been regurgitated for the last 3 years, especially in light of this interesting Ropelato story.
1-WTF are 29ers even allowed on a DH course? Until the UCI removes their head from their ass (good luck) 29' wheels will be allowed on those courses. It all comes down to the industry being able to sell new equipment, if the new flavor for DH is 29" then all you guys are gonna have to go out and get new kit to stay competitive. I really think the difference in rolling abilities over obstacles on a 29er over a 26er (on a DH course) is enough that mid level riders to high level pros will have to change to a bigger wheel size to remain competitive (if this is the new trend.) Anything with a wheel over 26" shouldn't be on a DH course, just like road bikes without dual triangle frames are not allowed in sanctioned road racing (as per UCI rules). This is a matter of leveling the playing field when it comes to equipment, riding talent is a while other matter (as of course, if you were to put me for example on a 29er it doesn't mean I'll roll down a DH course without shattering my jaw/collar bone/spine)
2-Start building and modifying courses in North America to keep this from happening
3-I'm not anti 29er, and realize it's the way things are going, in fact, my next HT will probably be a 29er as selection is tanking (especially in 2014 I would imagine) it's not something I'm absolute thrilled with being a tall guy and knowing that my bike will resemble a stretch limo. But again, on a DH course? C'mon
The UCI dictate what is acceptable in terms of road bikes eg wheel size, width of rims, weight and the manufactures abide by it. All they have given us is cant wear skin suits or go bullet because that'll make the sport look gay (another rant about that later).
They should have stepped in when the first xc rider rocked up with 29" wheels and said no, mtb is 26" wheels.
And what was a boring flat section was turned into the place where crowds gathered to watch the jumps (and bucking and crashing).