Enduro/AM - The Weight Game

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Enduro/AM - The Weight Game
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flag mtbman1980
O+
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 8:28 Quote
swan3609 wrote:
crs-one wrote:
Circe wrote:
It’s also important to remember that we as consumers put tremendous abuse on our products. Somethings should be considered wear items. The “lifetime warranty” is an interesting trend and I wonder how long it will be sustainable. Santa Cruz can play because they’re backed by PON, a multi billion dollar corporation. It’s a lot harder for small brands. Warranty failures have put companies out of business in the past. Not to mention, the lifetime game has caused products to get heavier.

I'm all for it as a consumer but I think the implied logic behind the lifetime warranty claim - this product will last indefinitely if it is free of defects - will create unrealistic expectations across the board. It seems like companies are including generous insurance and disguising it as a statement about quality. Like I've got these carbon rim brake wheels with a lifetime warranty to the original owner, two years to the SECOND owner. That's clearly just them swinging their budget dick around.

Side note - currently riding a cracked discontinued frame with lifetime warranty ayyyyy

Second edit - I definitely see reedholden's logic. A certain company has a really strong team of heavy hitters that run around telling people they've never broken a frame, while being a bit more quiet about the fact that each team member gets a fresh frame every year.

This can go both ways with customers.. I have claimed 20 year old frames that cracked and specialized sent them an entire modern bike and absolutely stoked the customer out.. Then we had a customer that was pissed because they crashed their road bike and expected "lifetime" warranty to cover a new frame for them.. Which was silly for them to expect.


And amen to riding cracked frames! About 2 months after I bought my Enduro. I was trying this funky gap were you jump over a rock garden, touch down and then boost like another 30ft out without touching the rocks at all.. Move I do on the DH bike.. The enduro jumps better and I overshot the first landing and BB cased a rock and cracked the frame through the frame protector.. Specialized told be tough shit on that one.. Which I understand..


The one that I want to know is Yeti... How many frames had rude killed? I have killed off 4 of their earlier frames and seen another 10 or so dead through the shop.... I know that Rude hasn't not broke a frame.

When you are testing "prototypes" you never brake a consumer frame.
flag nubbs
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Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 9:36 Quote
Freaking yeti. Those frames crack if you just look at em too hard in the garage.
Has everyone done a rear end carbon sb5/6c replacement?
flag Circe
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 10:27 Quote
nubbs wrote:
Freaking yeti. Those frames crack if you just look at em too hard in the garage.
Has everyone done a rear end carbon sb5/6c replacement?

The new ones aren't any better? Are they cracking the same way?
flag nubbs
O+
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 10:51 Quote
Circe wrote:
nubbs wrote:
Freaking yeti. Those frames crack if you just look at em too hard in the garage.
Has everyone done a rear end carbon sb5/6c replacement?

The new ones aren't any better? Are they cracking the same way?

Have yet to see sb100/130/150 cracked. But I don't work at the yeti dealer in town...
flag swan3609
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Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 11:16 Quote
We only have a few SB100s and a sb130 out right now.. Have yet to see any issues with any of them.
flag R-M-R
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 11:29 Quote
Circe wrote:
nubbs wrote:
Freaking yeti. Those frames crack if you just look at em too hard in the garage.
Has everyone done a rear end carbon sb5/6c replacement?

The new ones aren't any better? Are they cracking the same way?

Based on a few weights people have posted in various forums, the new Yetis have gained weight and are now among the heaviest fully-carbon frames in their categories. If this is correct, I should hope the failure issues have been resolved.

Although weight is the most over-rated stat in biking, it would be disappointing if the most expensive mainstream frames are among the heaviest.
flag ajax-ripper
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 12:17 Quote
swan3609 wrote:
We only have a few SB100s and a sb130 out right now.. Have yet to see any issues with any of them.
Sold a bunch of yetis and ibis (about 1:1 ratio) saw about a 12% failure rate on the ibis bikes saw no broken yetis. (Sample size was 75 ibis bikes and 78 yeti bikes)
flag whitebirdfeathers
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Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 12:44 Quote
ajax-ripper wrote:
swan3609 wrote:
We only have a few SB100s and a sb130 out right now.. Have yet to see any issues with any of them.
Sold a bunch of yetis and ibis (about 1:1 ratio) saw about a 12% failure rate on the ibis bikes saw no broken yetis. (Sample size was 75 ibis bikes and 78 yeti bikes)

Is this on the most recent Ibis bikes like the Ripmo? I hadn't really heard of any since that came out. Previously there seemed to be a lot.
flag B650wagon
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 12:54 Quote
Clap, does SDG make a saddle that is extremely similar to the WTB Volt Pro 150mm wide when it comes to shape, materials and comfort...? If so, which one?
flag tangaroo
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 13:32 Quote
130 has been holding up well for me for 6+ months of abusive riding. Had to warranty for a cable port thing, but definitely not a structural issue.

Their warranty and service department were pretty damn easy to work with too.
flag clapforcanadaa
O+
Posted: Jun 5, 2019 at 22:13 Quote
B650wagon wrote:
Clap, does SDG make a saddle that is extremely similar to the WTB Volt Pro 150mm wide when it comes to shape, materials and comfort...? If so, which one?

Unfortunately we only go as wide as 140mm. The 135-140mm range encompasses the vast majority of riders and we haven’t gotten into anything wider than our Bel-Air or Duster.

Materials wise, essentially all our saddles would use a stronger material for the base (albeit heavier), use EVA foam (super comfortable, light and doesn’t pack down) and Kevlar sides for durability.

Shape wise the Volt has a slight rear rise, so the Bel-Air 2.0 would be closest. It was our best selling saddle last year so it’s super popular and we’ll received. Radar would be the other one to consider as it’s our new go to saddle with all our saddle tech packed into it.

Comfort wise is unfortunately something that comes down to using it. Saddle width is certainly a good indicator, but we push harder for correct saddle shape. If your saddle shifts you into a position you’re not suited for you’ll feel it. We design saddles for riders that prefer either flat or rear rise and give them the optimal shape for their preferred profile.
flag R-M-R
Posted: Jun 6, 2019 at 0:03 Quote
B650wagon wrote:
Clap, does SDG make a saddle that is extremely similar to the WTB Volt Pro 150mm wide when it comes to shape, materials and comfort...? If so, which one?

The Volt works for me, too, with 142 mm being a little better than 150 mm. As clapforcanadaa said, the Bel-Air 2.0 should work for fans of the Volt 142 - maybe also the 150. I prefer the Bel-Air for comfort and it's certainly better made than the Volt. The Volt's shell is flimsy: one of my test riders sagged it and wrinkled the cover to the point of forming small cracks in only a couple months. Mind you, this guy is huge, but I also put some deep wrinkles in mine. The Bel-Air looks as good as new after much more use.

If I had it my way, I'd make the central channel deeper and broader on the Bel-Air. Maybe take a little length off the nose. Even as is, it's right up there with my favourites.
flag B650wagon
Posted: Jun 6, 2019 at 17:54 Quote
cheers for info, been measured and currently on the 155 Phenom Pro, I'll stick to trying a Volt Pro 150 next.
flag R-M-R
Posted: Jun 6, 2019 at 18:28 Quote
B650wagon wrote:
cheers for info, been measured and currently on the 155 Phenom Pro, I'll stick to trying a Volt Pro 150 next.

If WTB is still doing their demo program, you can try before you buy.

I've also been measured by a couple of "trained" Specialized saddle fitters. One recommended a 120-something mm saddle and one recommended 150+ mm. The best approach will always be to try as many saddles as you can.

For me, the surprising discovery was that I like a different shape on the trail than I do in the more consistent environments of a shop or on my road bike. In those situations, I stay in a nearly constant location on the saddle, so a saddle with considerable rear rise is great: it follows the shape of the body and distributes the pressure.

Things are different on dirt: I sit at the rear on flat ground and slide forward on climbs. When I slide forward, the bike is tilted upward. If I use a saddle with rear rise, the nose is approximately flat; if I use a flat saddle, the whole saddle tilts downward at the angle of the rear portion of a rear rise saddle. When I slide forward on a climb, the latter is a lot more comfortable than the former, even if the former is a bit better on flat ground.

Saddle comfort is a huge factor in enjoying your ride, so don't stop until you find something that feels great!
flag Axxe
Posted: Jun 6, 2019 at 18:43 Quote
145 is minimum for me.

 


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