Enduro/AM - The Weight Game

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Enduro/AM - The Weight Game
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flag heinous
O+
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 17:34 Quote
For a large sample, you can go to races a day early, or even a few hours early and watch how many of the SRAM team and neutral mechanics are frantically rebuilding bikes. If you're able, take a look at the team hotels too.

Teams are generally the first to find a lot of the issues that lead to recalls, and also the issues that don't lead to recalls but do lead to poor performance - like how all the early crankset spindles in CX1 / Force1 were the wrong length by 4-5mm. Or how one year SRAM ran out 100% of warranty chainrings, globally, because the teeth were tearing off brand new rings in a couple of rides.

Shimano have certainly had the occasional issue - no question. When they had a bad batch of road chains snapping a few years ago they actually took a bunch of Pro Tour mechanics to the factory in Belgium and showed them the error, how they'd identified it, fixed it, and were testing the new one to ensure it didn't recur.

Shimano have been slow to get new products to market too, but the sheer number of SRAM warranties is amazing. It's why they're so good at it (and between that and the constant, major recalls at OEM level it's probably why they downsized US operations.

I've been really interested watching how the major custom bike builders who were doing loads of GX builds are suddenly doing loads of XT / SLX and less GX. Talking to one or two, they're relieved.

For another large sample, go talk to teams when they're selling bikes at end of season. It's a fun game looking at mechanics when they describe a used SRAM bike.
flag R-M-R
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 17:50 Quote
heinous wrote:
For a large sample, you can go to races a day early, or even a few hours early and watch how many of the SRAM team and neutral mechanics are frantically rebuilding bikes. If you're able, take a look at the team hotels too.

Teams are generally the first to find a lot of the issues that lead to recalls, and also the issues that don't lead to recalls but do lead to poor performance - like how all the early crankset spindles in CX1 / Force1 were the wrong length by 4-5mm. Or how one year SRAM ran out 100% of warranty chainrings, globally, because the teeth were tearing off brand new rings in a couple of rides.

Shimano have certainly had the occasional issue - no question. When they had a bad batch of road chains snapping a few years ago they actually took a bunch of Pro Tour mechanics to the factory in Belgium and showed them the error, how they'd identified it, fixed it, and were testing the new one to ensure it didn't recur.

Shimano have been slow to get new products to market too, but the sheer number of SRAM warranties is amazing. It's why they're so good at it (and between that and the constant, major recalls at OEM level it's probably why they downsized US operations.

I've been really interested watching how the major custom bike builders who were doing loads of GX builds are suddenly doing loads of XT / SLX and less GX. Talking to one or two, they're relieved.

For another large sample, go talk to teams when they're selling bikes at end of season. It's a fun game looking at mechanics when they describe a used SRAM bike.

Historically, Shimano didn't ship products until they were thoroughly tested and refined. SRAM took more of a "public beta" approach.

Recently, Shimano has been scrambling to regain market share after making a poor bet on 2x chainrings and electronic shifting, rather than 1x with cables, so they seem to be reducing development time, which will surely hurt their famous reliability.

That said, there's no excuse for still having dodgy brakes after, what, a decade?
flag heinous
O+
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 18:12 Quote
R-M-R wrote:

Historically, Shimano didn't ship products until they were thoroughly tested and refined. SRAM took more of a "public beta" approach.

Recently, Shimano has been scrambling to regain market share after making a poor bet on 2x chainrings and electronic shifting, rather than 1x with cables, so they seem to be reducing development time, which will surely hurt their famous reliability.

That said, there's no excuse for still having dodgy brakes after, what, a decade?

Yeah, I hear you. I've been running XT, XTR and Ultegra hydro brakes for years and only had one issue with a leaky XTR lever that was warrantied. It does seem like there are environmental factors that increase the likelihood of the issues people describe - I've just never seen it on any of my bikes, or athlete bikes.
flag seraph
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 18:29 Quote
R-M-R wrote:
heinous wrote:
For a large sample, you can go to races a day early, or even a few hours early and watch how many of the SRAM team and neutral mechanics are frantically rebuilding bikes. If you're able, take a look at the team hotels too.

Teams are generally the first to find a lot of the issues that lead to recalls, and also the issues that don't lead to recalls but do lead to poor performance - like how all the early crankset spindles in CX1 / Force1 were the wrong length by 4-5mm. Or how one year SRAM ran out 100% of warranty chainrings, globally, because the teeth were tearing off brand new rings in a couple of rides.

Shimano have certainly had the occasional issue - no question. When they had a bad batch of road chains snapping a few years ago they actually took a bunch of Pro Tour mechanics to the factory in Belgium and showed them the error, how they'd identified it, fixed it, and were testing the new one to ensure it didn't recur.

Shimano have been slow to get new products to market too, but the sheer number of SRAM warranties is amazing. It's why they're so good at it (and between that and the constant, major recalls at OEM level it's probably why they downsized US operations.

I've been really interested watching how the major custom bike builders who were doing loads of GX builds are suddenly doing loads of XT / SLX and less GX. Talking to one or two, they're relieved.

For another large sample, go talk to teams when they're selling bikes at end of season. It's a fun game looking at mechanics when they describe a used SRAM bike.

Historically, Shimano didn't ship products until they were thoroughly tested and refined. SRAM took more of a "public beta" approach.

Recently, Shimano has been scrambling to regain market share after making a poor bet on 2x chainrings and electronic shifting, rather than 1x with cables, so they seem to be reducing development time, which will surely hurt their famous reliability.

That said, there's no excuse for still having dodgy brakes after, what, a decade?

At least SRAM is quick to replace any brakes that have an issue. They've never turned anyone down.

And as mentioned before, it always seems like the OEM brakes are the ones with problems. I've never had an issue with an aftermarket SRAM brake.
flag ajax-ripper
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 19:48 Quote
R-M-R wrote:
Mechanics' bikes are always either the best- or worst-maintained! It's either:

This is tedious enough when I'm paid to do it; definitely not doing it when I'm off the clock.

OR

I am a bike mechanic. It is my identity - my calling. I cannot abide this imperfect machine.

Wink
My shit is always immaculate. My bike also got a time after every ride while I was working at the shop.
flag swan3609
O+
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 20:26 Quote
ajax-ripper wrote:
R-M-R wrote:
Mechanics' bikes are always either the best- or worst-maintained! It's either:

This is tedious enough when I'm paid to do it; definitely not doing it when I'm off the clock.

OR

I am a bike mechanic. It is my identity - my calling. I cannot abide this imperfect machine.

Wink
My shit is always immaculate. My bike also got a time after every ride while I was working at the shop.

I am the poor form example above. My shit is always a clap trap..


Litterally have replaced hoops in the parking lot at at DH race because I didn't want to do it that bad at the shop the week prior.

Even last week, I worked 50 hours at the shop.. And had my BMX on the back of the car 4 of the 5 days... I still was replacing Chainring are the track 15 mins before my first moto..
flag badbadleroybrown
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 20:41 Quote
I'm in between... I do maintenance probably every 200 miles or so on the road bike, every 80 or so miles on mountain bikes.
flag ajax-ripper
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 20:43 Quote
swan3609 wrote:
ajax-ripper wrote:
R-M-R wrote:
Mechanics' bikes are always either the best- or worst-maintained! It's either:

This is tedious enough when I'm paid to do it; definitely not doing it when I'm off the clock.

OR

I am a bike mechanic. It is my identity - my calling. I cannot abide this imperfect machine.

Wink
My shit is always immaculate. My bike also got a time after every ride while I was working at the shop.

I am the poor form example above. My shit is always a clap trap..


Litterally have replaced hoops in the parking lot at at DH race because I didn't want to do it that bad at the shop the week prior.

Even last week, I worked 50 hours at the shop.. And had my BMX on the back of the car 4 of the 5 days... I still was replacing Chainring are the track 15 mins before my first moto..
I worked at a trail side shop and often rode before and after work. I'm really OCD about strange noises on my bike, I would bathe and love my shit after every ride...

Co-worker referred to my OCD as masterbiking
flag mtbman1980
O+
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 20:57 Quote
Supper lax about cleaning but I usually give the bike a full check once a month. Every three I will do a bit of a tear down check bearings and add grease etc then torque everything back up. Seems to work for me.
flag heinous
O+
Posted: Jul 31, 2019 at 21:02 Quote
Functional cleanliness and servicing is where it’s at. For a lot of mechanics that’s easier because they have the context to know that noise, hesitation in shifting or wobble in the rim isn’t catastrophic and can be managed, where for people who aren’t up to speed with that stuff it could equally be serious.

Having said that, a big part of why I ride a singlespeed a lot is because it removes almost all of that from the equation. Lube the chain, keep an eye on pads and every 9 months or so give the fork and bearings a check.
flag swan3609
O+
Posted: Aug 1, 2019 at 1:51 Quote
heinous wrote:
Functional cleanliness and servicing is where it’s at. For a lot of mechanics that’s easier because they have the context to know that noise, hesitation in shifting or wobble in the rim isn’t catastrophic and can be managed, where for people who aren’t up to speed with that stuff it could equally be serious.

Having said that, a big part of why I ride a singlespeed a lot is because it removes almost all of that from the equation. Lube the chain, keep an eye on pads and every 9 months or so give the fork and bearings a check.

Not gonna lie.. The Di2 setup on my hardtail 29er "trail bike" has been essentially this trouble free.. I charged the battery in December and all I have done is lube the chain and add air every 5-6 rides. The handy dandy screen tells me I still have ~50% battery left. I havnt don't any work other than that since the season started.... Hardtails are pretty rad.
flag heinous
O+
Posted: Aug 1, 2019 at 2:11 Quote
Yeah, Di2 battery life is awesome!
flag swan3609
O+
Posted: Aug 1, 2019 at 2:16 Quote
heinous wrote:
Yeah, Di2 battery life is awesome!

It was weird.. My setup is all warranty cast offs and hand me downs.. The first charge on my battery lasted maybe 500 shifts and I got really bumbed about the whole thing. Then I recharged it and I have been riding it for a solid 6 months on 1 charge.. So maybe that first charge "woke up" the battery.. Idk but I am pretty happy overall with it.
flag Circe
Posted: Aug 1, 2019 at 14:24 Quote
New question. Why would you go carbon over aluminum or visa versa?
flag ajax-ripper
Posted: Aug 1, 2019 at 14:26 Quote
Circe wrote:
New question. Why would you go carbon over aluminum or visa versa?

Vibration damping, increased torsional stiffness and better warranty I reasons I buy carbon parts.

 


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