Enduro/AM - The Weight Game

PB Forum :: Pinkbike Groups
Enduro/AM - The Weight Game
Author Message
Posted: May 9, 2021 at 13:10 Quote
scotteh wrote:
R-M-R wrote:
scotteh wrote:
I'm running tubeless so no pinch flats.

That makes one of us! lol I'm on light casings, though.

Circling back on this - seems as though I jinxed myself with this post. Pinch flatted a tubeless EXO+ casing with 25 PSI yesterday. Snakebite near the bead and tear in the crown. Due to an (im)perfectly angled rock sticking out of a slab.

I ran DD casings before and they were a bit of a bear for big pedal days, but it looks like I might need to try them again. Or EXO / EXO+ with an insert, but that seems like extra faffing and I imagine it would be equal weight or heavier than DD.

RMR, I think I recall you saying that you are not a fan of the DD casing for some reason. What is your proposed alternative?

What is front or rear? Assuming rear, Exo+ front and DD rear might do the trick?

Alternatively, consider it as a riding mistake and work on choosing better lines? Wink

Posted: May 9, 2021 at 14:11 Quote
scotteh wrote:
RMR, I think I recall you saying that you are not a fan of the DD casing for some reason. What is your proposed alternative?

First, let's get the obvious out of the way:

• If it happens so rarely, maybe you can live with this frequency of puntures?
• An insert could reduce the pinch flats without adding rolling resistance.
• Have you considered more air? Razz

Double Down is a traditional "2-ply", which is just two layers of a full 1-ply casing. Sounds obvious, but not all burly casings are done this way. 2-ply results in a reasonable four layers on the sides and an excessive six layers under the tread. It's more efficient to put the material where it's needed.

I can't be certain what's best for you, I can only tell you I think Double Down isn't the best use of materials and other companies are making more sophisticated casings. It's important to also consider rubber compound and tread pattern, both of which Maxxis does well, though other companies have caught up. Below are some examples from other brands.

Goodyear uses basic constructions, which are most useful for their simple drawings, not their technology! Comparing these to Maxxis' designs:

• EXO is the same as Goodyear's "standard", plus an additional sidewall panel to create three layers all over.
• EXO+ is the same as "EN", plus the sidewall panels again.
• Double Down is the same as "DH", plus a rubber bumper at the bead.



Vittoria's Trail casing uses standard 1-ply construction (two on the sides and three under the tread), adds the sidewall panels, adds bead bumpers, and adds a fourth cap ply under the tread for four layers all over, plus bumpers. Their Enduro casing uses 1-ply construction with the bumpers and two, full-width cap plies, creating four plies on the sides and five under the tread, plus bumpers.


Specialized's Blk Dmnd casing appears to use four layers everywhere, plus tall bead bumpers / sidewall supports.



Kenda's AEC and AGC appears to use 1-ply construction with an extra layer of very robust panels. AGC adds bead bumpers.



Schwalbe's Super Trail is similar to EXO+ with 1-ply construction, sidewall panels, and a full-width ply (ignore the purple piece; that's just a standard bead chafer) for four layers all around, possibly with a small gap of three layers where the sidewall meets the tread. Super Gravity is the same, plus another full-width ply.



Vee appears to use 1-ply construction with tall bumpers for their Enduro Core. Gravity Core appears to be four, tougher, layers all over with the tall bumpers. Unclear to me whether the reddish surface shown on the layer with the tread is a separate fabric layer or just graphics; if it's the former, add a layer to my descriptions.


Michelin's new Trail Shield 2 appears to be a modified 1-ply that uses four layers on the sidewalls and four or five under the tread. The updated Downhill Shield appears to be similar, plus a full-width ply, plus bead bumpers.



WTB's new Light casing appears to be equivalent to EXO, while their Tough is a basic 2-ply (four on the sides, six under the tread) without the bumpers, which would make Tough the most low-tech casing among "high-end" brands (possibly tied with Hutchinson's 2-ply casing, but I'm not clear on Hutchinson's constructions).

Posted: May 11, 2021 at 13:40 Quote

The first of many parts arrived today!

Posted: May 11, 2021 at 18:41 Quote
Bike yoke posts make my pants tight every time.



Need help. Cant find Shimano N04C brake pads anywhere that isn't Japan.

On a newer Xtr M9120 caliper (4 piston) can you put old, non finned saint pads in them and it works fine right?

Posted: May 11, 2021 at 19:48 Quote
nubbs wrote:
Bike yoke posts make my pants tight every time.



Need help. Cant find Shimano N04C brake pads anywhere that isn't Japan.

On a newer Xtr M9120 caliper (4 piston) can you put old, non finned saint pads in them and it works fine right?

tons online....

Posted: May 11, 2021 at 22:14 Quote
TibZ wrote:
Alternatively, consider it as a riding mistake and work on choosing better lines? Wink
I have never chosen a good line in my life and I don't plan to start now lol .

R-M-R wrote:
First, let's get the obvious out of the way:

• If it happens so rarely, maybe you can live with this frequency of puntures?
• An insert could reduce the pinch flats without adding rolling resistance.
• Have you considered more air? Razz

*snip - awesome detailed tire post, thank you!*
1. True, I am just wary of shredding a tire as it could be a very long walk out on some of the backcountry riding I do that has fairly sharp shale-y rocks (Pemberton, Tyax, etc.).
2. I think the next step is to keep the EXO+ casing and try out CushCore (will probably get XC version to avoid adding too much weight).
3. Absolutely not haha, 25 PSI is my ceiling. Pretty sure you're joking, but ride quality goes downhill on a bobsled above 25 PSI IME.

Posted: May 11, 2021 at 22:30 Quote
Fair enough, and I agree about pressure. If I get a flat and finish a ride with a plug, patch, or tube, I run about 30 psi as insurance ... and it's horrible. After my fourth hole in a Specialized GRID casing in a single ride, I was running well over 30 psi to try to prevent further damage. Ended up with six punctures and utter bewilderment at how some people choose that kind of pressure.

Anyway, EXO+ with an insert sounds reasonable. If you're willing to stray from Maxxis, casings with a bead bumper / "apex insert" can be an effective defense against pinch flats.

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 5:22 Quote
nubbs wrote:
Bike yoke posts make my pants tight every time.



Need help. Cant find Shimano N04C brake pads anywhere that isn't Japan.

On a newer Xtr M9120 caliper (4 piston) can you put old, non finned saint pads in them and it works fine right?

I found a few on Ebay when looking, some sellers in HK too but they looked a bit dodgy. Ended up finding a UK seller and paying just below RRP.

There are parts out there, you just have to hunt. I spent 8hrs shopping for parts at the weekend and the only thing i havent got yet is a chain.

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 6:11 Quote
morewhitenoise wrote:

The first of many parts arrived today!

I swapped from an A1 reverb to a Revive a few months ago. The revive is so much better that they shouldn't even be classed as the same type of product. Smooth as f*ck, easy to work on, and the revive feature is great.

Will be buying one for my other bike very soon, going back to working on the reverb for that bike was so much of a pain I got a fixed post instead.

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 6:32 Quote
Yep, you don’t realise how clunky other posts are until you use one

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 6:36 Quote
bikerboywill wrote:
Yep, you don’t realise how clunky other posts are until you use one

I usually buy mid-tier components with the exception of two things- suspension, and dropper posts. High end versions of both perform dramatically better than their mid-tier brethren.

I’ve been running BikeYokes for a few years now and love them.

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 7:26 Quote
IME, DD casing punctures more easily than some lighter tires. They have great bump feel though, to me it seems like maxxis prioritizes this feel over other metrics.

I run michelins now but I can tell right away when I get on a bike with a maxxis in front, they soak up bumps well. Very small bumps Im talking about, like little rocks and chattery braking bumps.

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 7:49 Quote
ninjatarian wrote:
bikerboywill wrote:
Yep, you don’t realise how clunky other posts are until you use one

I usually buy mid-tier components with the exception of two things- suspension, and dropper posts. High end versions of both perform dramatically better than their mid-tier brethren.

I’ve been running BikeYokes for a few years now and love them.

How often do they leak pressure and you have to re-adjust? This seems to be more common on the more pricepoint posts that have adjustable pressure, but wondering if they've fixed it with the higher pricepoint.

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 7:51 Quote
clapforcanadaa wrote:
How often do they leak pressure and you have to re-adjust? This seems to be more common on the more pricepoint posts that have adjustable pressure, but wondering if they've fixed it with the higher pricepoint.

Once every one to two years.

Posted: May 12, 2021 at 8:31 Quote
R-M-R wrote:
clapforcanadaa wrote:
How often do they leak pressure and you have to re-adjust? This seems to be more common on the more pricepoint posts that have adjustable pressure, but wondering if they've fixed it with the higher pricepoint.

Once every one to two years.

So that’s a yes then, guess they fixed that!

We chose a non-adjustable cartridge as there wasn’t an off the shelf adjustable pressure option (in our price range) that had a reliable track record. The main cartridge that is used by PNW, RF and various OEM’s had a 5% failure rate which was pretty aggressive.

BikeYoke definitely seems solid so surely you get what you pay for. Only major issue I’ve ever seen was a head shearing off, but I only saw two of those with no backstory so it’s hard to qualify that as an actual issue without a backstory.


 
Your subscriptions
no posts

Copyright © 2000 - 2021. Pinkbike.com. All rights reserved.
dv42 0.022340
Mobile Version of Website