Pig ugliest AM/Enduro/XC/DH bikes out there if yours is a pig post it!

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Pig ugliest AM/Enduro/XC/DH bikes out there if yours is a pig post it!
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Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 7:51 Quote
tom666 wrote:
Mr-Magura wrote:

One way of fixing this, could be to demand carbon footprint declarations on the goods, just like there's a declaration of content.

Magura Smile

I have thought about this before.

In the UK we have these on all of our food, I think most countries have them in some form:


Instead of calories, fat, saturates, sugar and salt it could be CO2, water use, power use, material gone into landfill and recyclability score.


It is just nearly impossible to gather such information Smile

Exactly what I had in mind.
Collecting the data is not as difficult as it may seem.
The main obstacle would be that most of the "holier than you" companies, knows perfectly well that they're not as holy as they claim to be, so they'll do whatever they can to avoid it.
They are living on the fact that most people has no clue about carbon footprint calculation, so they can get away with playing green through reusable packaging that requires cleaning, and so forth.
If a proper carbon footprint declaration has to be on the product, they'd be out of business right away.

So for this to happen, the only way in my opinion is to inform the general public.
Just reading this thread, gives a hint about how difficult that is, given a lot of this is not as it seems, leaving a lot of people with a bad case of cognitive dissonance.
It is however the only way forward, but it takes a few people that are willing to put in the effort it takes, without getting rich from it, and who has the balls it takes to not give up after half a year, as it's guaranteed to not be a pleasant ride.


Magura Smile

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 8:22 Quote
Mr-Magura wrote:

Exactly what I had in mind.
Collecting the data is not as difficult as it may seem.
The main obstacle would be that most of the "holier than you" companies, knows perfectly well that they're not as holy as they claim to be, so they'll do whatever they can to avoid it.
They are living on the fact that most people has no clue about carbon footprint calculation, so they can get away with playing green through reusable packaging that requires cleaning, and so forth.
If a proper carbon footprint declaration has to be on the product, they'd be out of business right away.

So for this to happen, the only way in my opinion is to inform the general public.
Just reading this thread, gives a hint about how difficult that is, given a lot of this is not as it seems, leaving a lot of people with a bad case of cognitive dissonance.
It is however the only way forward, but it takes a few people that are willing to put in the effort it takes, without getting rich from it, and who has the balls it takes to not give up after half a year, as it's guaranteed to not be a pleasant ride.


Magura Smile

I completely agree most companies will not want to surrender the information, even if they had it.

I do think it would be very laborious to collect all the information and potentially both difficult to calculate and easy to fake/mislead.

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 9:17 Quote
gnarnaimo wrote:
secondtimeuser wrote:
NorCalNomad wrote:


Why aren't they winning anything then? Razz
Spent all the money on R&D, nothing left to pay fast riders? Razz

Their fast riders are busy waisting energy pedalling in the air of jumps

Is everyone forgetting that Sam Blenkinsop won king of crankworx last year?

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 10:44 Quote
tom666 wrote:
Mr-Magura wrote:

Exactly what I had in mind.
Collecting the data is not as difficult as it may seem.
The main obstacle would be that most of the "holier than you" companies, knows perfectly well that they're not as holy as they claim to be, so they'll do whatever they can to avoid it.
They are living on the fact that most people has no clue about carbon footprint calculation, so they can get away with playing green through reusable packaging that requires cleaning, and so forth.
If a proper carbon footprint declaration has to be on the product, they'd be out of business right away.

So for this to happen, the only way in my opinion is to inform the general public.
Just reading this thread, gives a hint about how difficult that is, given a lot of this is not as it seems, leaving a lot of people with a bad case of cognitive dissonance.
It is however the only way forward, but it takes a few people that are willing to put in the effort it takes, without getting rich from it, and who has the balls it takes to not give up after half a year, as it's guaranteed to not be a pleasant ride.


Magura Smile

I completely agree most companies will not want to surrender the information, even if they had it.

I do think it would be very laborious to collect all the information and potentially both difficult to calculate and easy to fake/mislead.

It's no problem to make the calculation, as that just requires some general tools to be collected and made available.
As for the risk of fraud, that's no worse than with the declaration of content.
After some time, there will be a fair amount of data available, making it easy to spot the ones trying to cheat.

Given the alternative being the current situation, where most people base their choices on a mix of hearsay and religion, I'd say even a flawed declaration of carbon footprint on the products would be preferred?

Magura Smile

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 11:23 Quote
sosburn wrote:
gnarnaimo wrote:
secondtimeuser wrote:
Spent all the money on R&D, nothing left to pay fast riders? Razz

Their fast riders are busy waisting energy pedalling in the air of jumps

Is everyone forgetting that Sam Blenkinsop won king of crankworx last year?
Or Editors Choice for trailbike, trailbike of the year, ebike of the year... I think it was sarcasm.

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 13:17 Quote
dkidd wrote:
sosburn wrote:
gnarnaimo wrote:


Their fast riders are busy waisting energy pedalling in the air of jumps

Is everyone forgetting that Sam Blenkinsop won king of crankworx last year?
Or Editors Choice for trailbike, trailbike of the year, ebike of the year... I think it was sarcasm.

Never trust "awards" from publications (that includes online ones...) that rely on ad revenue in the outdoor space. I've personally worked on projects that have gotten amazing reviews and I know it's not anywhere as good as the review says + some things are just not true. Sites like outdoorgearreview.com and blisterreview.com were both born out being fed up with the fluffing reviews/ sometimes actually 100% fabrication "reviews"

But I know Norco makes decent stuff. And Jill and Sam are amazing riders.

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 13:21 Quote
sounds like Maggie is doin a good job whatever that may entail :-)

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 13:22 Quote
dkidd wrote:
sosburn wrote:
gnarnaimo wrote:


Their fast riders are busy waisting energy pedalling in the air of jumps

Is everyone forgetting that Sam Blenkinsop won king of crankworx last year?
Or Editors Choice for trailbike, trailbike of the year, ebike of the year... I think it was sarcasm.

I figured. Dudes just so sick tho.

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 13:57 Quote
Mr-Magura wrote:
tom666 wrote:
Mr-Magura wrote:

Exactly what I had in mind.
Collecting the data is not as difficult as it may seem.
The main obstacle would be that most of the "holier than you" companies, knows perfectly well that they're not as holy as they claim to be, so they'll do whatever they can to avoid it.
They are living on the fact that most people has no clue about carbon footprint calculation, so they can get away with playing green through reusable packaging that requires cleaning, and so forth.
If a proper carbon footprint declaration has to be on the product, they'd be out of business right away.

So for this to happen, the only way in my opinion is to inform the general public.
Just reading this thread, gives a hint about how difficult that is, given a lot of this is not as it seems, leaving a lot of people with a bad case of cognitive dissonance.
It is however the only way forward, but it takes a few people that are willing to put in the effort it takes, without getting rich from it, and who has the balls it takes to not give up after half a year, as it's guaranteed to not be a pleasant ride.


Magura Smile

I completely agree most companies will not want to surrender the information, even if they had it.

I do think it would be very laborious to collect all the information and potentially both difficult to calculate and easy to fake/mislead.

It's no problem to make the calculation, as that just requires some general tools to be collected and made available.
As for the risk of fraud, that's no worse than with the declaration of content.
After some time, there will be a fair amount of data available, making it easy to spot the ones trying to cheat.

Given the alternative being the current situation, where most people base their choices on a mix of hearsay and religion, I'd say even a flawed declaration of carbon footprint on the products would be preferred?

Magura Smile


Related to this the BBC iPlayer still has this up if you have access


Summary
For every pound spent on food shopping, 77p goes to the supermarkets, giving them a huge influence over what people eat. In an experiment to discover the hidden truths about everyday foods, Horizon has built a supermarket where the products are labelled with the real story of how they are produced and their effect on consumers and the environment. Mathematician Hannah Fry and dietician Priya Tew invite members of the British public to come in and discover the truth about their favourite foods.


https://docuwiki.net/index.php?title=The_Honest_Supermarket:_What%27s_Really_in_Our_Food


https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0006p3j

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 14:30 Quote
interesting...

fcuk Waitrose then haha

Posted: Dec 9, 2019 at 17:21 Quote
sosburn wrote:
dkidd wrote:
sosburn wrote:


Is everyone forgetting that Sam Blenkinsop won king of crankworx last year?
Or Editors Choice for trailbike, trailbike of the year, ebike of the year... I think it was sarcasm.

I figured. Dudes just so sick tho.

Was def sarcasm. Blenki is a legend and such a blast to watch!

Posted: Dec 10, 2019 at 0:53 Quote
iffy wrote:
Mr-Magura wrote:
tom666 wrote:


I completely agree most companies will not want to surrender the information, even if they had it.

I do think it would be very laborious to collect all the information and potentially both difficult to calculate and easy to fake/mislead.

It's no problem to make the calculation, as that just requires some general tools to be collected and made available.
As for the risk of fraud, that's no worse than with the declaration of content.
After some time, there will be a fair amount of data available, making it easy to spot the ones trying to cheat.

Given the alternative being the current situation, where most people base their choices on a mix of hearsay and religion, I'd say even a flawed declaration of carbon footprint on the products would be preferred?

Magura Smile


Related to this the BBC iPlayer still has this up if you have access


Summary
For every pound spent on food shopping, 77p goes to the supermarkets, giving them a huge influence over what people eat. In an experiment to discover the hidden truths about everyday foods, Horizon has built a supermarket where the products are labelled with the real story of how they are produced and their effect on consumers and the environment. Mathematician Hannah Fry and dietician Priya Tew invite members of the British public to come in and discover the truth about their favourite foods.


https://docuwiki.net/index.php?title=The_Honest_Supermarket:_What%27s_Really_in_Our_Food


https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0006p3j

Yo my dudes, if you're that worried about what you eat etc, come to the Balkans, there's loads of agricultural land, mostly vacant and cheap. My extended family lives in a village 30km from a larger city, they're mostly self-sufficient with a cornfield, barns with cows, chickens and piggies, they farm tomatoes, paprika, make their own schnapps, have truckloads of apples and plums from their orchard, knit their own clothes from wool, use locally sourced wood for heat and cooking. What more could you need. I know that you have peasants and farmers in England as well, however if you cash in your condo/house you could buy acres and acres of land here and live like royalty

Posted: Dec 10, 2019 at 2:32 Quote
Sounds good. I need to plan another visit now that I am a civilian. I forgot what the national dish was there. Some kind of pastry stuffed with lamb or beef. Only better than the Cornish variant.

Posted: Dec 10, 2019 at 5:31 Quote
iffy wrote:
Mr-Magura wrote:
tom666 wrote:


I completely agree most companies will not want to surrender the information, even if they had it.

I do think it would be very laborious to collect all the information and potentially both difficult to calculate and easy to fake/mislead.

It's no problem to make the calculation, as that just requires some general tools to be collected and made available.
As for the risk of fraud, that's no worse than with the declaration of content.
After some time, there will be a fair amount of data available, making it easy to spot the ones trying to cheat.

Given the alternative being the current situation, where most people base their choices on a mix of hearsay and religion, I'd say even a flawed declaration of carbon footprint on the products would be preferred?

Magura Smile


Related to this the BBC iPlayer still has this up if you have access


Summary
For every pound spent on food shopping, 77p goes to the supermarkets, giving them a huge influence over what people eat. In an experiment to discover the hidden truths about everyday foods, Horizon has built a supermarket where the products are labelled with the real story of how they are produced and their effect on consumers and the environment. Mathematician Hannah Fry and dietician Priya Tew invite members of the British public to come in and discover the truth about their favourite foods.


https://docuwiki.net/index.php?title=The_Honest_Supermarket:_What%27s_Really_in_Our_Food


https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0006p3j

The disclaimer here is that I haven’t watched the doco but supermarket profit margins are insanely tight. If there were these suggested regulations on reporting this stuff would people be willing to pay more for there shopping in exchange?

Also, random point of interest that Magura may know: what’s the carbon footprint of the ink that these suggested new labels are printed in?

Posted: Dec 10, 2019 at 9:49 Quote
ASDA

The operating profit of £803.2 million was achieved on the back of £22.92 billion in full-year revenue, an uptick of 2.1 per cent year-on-year.


 
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