Protein

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flag snyda
Posted: Apr 14, 2014 at 17:44 Quote
1.4-2 g protein/ kg body weight
flag snyda
Posted: Apr 14, 2014 at 17:53 Quote
slidways wrote:
allix2456 wrote:
The basic idea behind Creatine
Allix

I can further this with some more indepth detail however like allix2456 I am not qualified in anyway and all this information is from personal research online and I am not offering a professional opinion, nor am I claiming that all I've said is 100% true.

But here it is

The body has creatine without the use of supplements, it creates it and obtains it through diet, but obviously supplements can boost the amount, where the benefit comes from is the energy cycle involved during lifting or short burst cardio.

Trying to keeping it simple

ATP- adenosine triphosphate (triphosphate as sounds contains 3 phosphates)
CP - Creatine phosphate
ADP- adenosine diphosphate (diphosphate again contains 2 phosphates)

When we lift weights or sprint for short ~10sec bursts we use the ATP-CP energy pathway.

The body has only a few seconds of ATP 1-3sec for fuel so it relies on CP to help it recycle.

The cycle
ATP releases energy for use by breaking down, when broken down it breaks off the outer most phosphate resulting in ADP and one free phosphate.

So right now you have ADP and single phosphates floating around

CP then breaks down and its phosphate is donated directly to ADP to re-form ATP thus re creating the cycle. This adds about approximately 8-10seconds of energy.

So with ATP and PC together "ATP-PC pathway" we have approximately 10-12seconds of fuel from this source.

So what does this have to do with creatine supplements
Creatine binds to the free floating phosphates that is created during the ATP break down to ADP, thus creating creatinephosphate (CP), this extends the time period that this pathway can be used.


How does this help you?
More stores of creatine mean you will deplete this store later in the workout and therefore you can workout a little harder.

By giving you more fuel thought you need to use that fuel so you need to do the work, it means you can use that extra 2 or 5 lbs or you can pump out those extra 2 sprints or few seconds, essentially using creatine will help give you more energy but you will only see gains if you use this energy to work out harder. Its only minimal effect but for those who are very serious any extra load they can helps them improve. Don't expect it to be some miracle.

Creatine is still understudied long term and we don't know the long term effects of supplementation and it only helps to boost natural supply, I personally don't use it but i can definitely see the draw of doing so.

I see more reason for downhill riders to use it for events because water weight is not a worry and the event involves short burst of energy over 4-5min, for endurance events the ATP-PC cycle is not really used, there may be some indirect effects that aid in recovery but I need to look into that further but it shouldn’t have any effective on race times actually with the increase in water weight it may be bad.

Creatine will add about ten pounds.... of water weight.... and also has not been tested for long term usage but people can have serious complications when there is too much creatine in their systems... Like death
flag slidways
Posted: Apr 14, 2014 at 21:16 Quote
Mick26IP wrote:
slidways wrote:
liamd-24 wrote:
Yea that's the whole day but I do have snaks like fruit

Yea I'v been working out for about 9months but my diet has changed a lot
Yea I got told that I'd lose muscle wich is why I got reckomended to use protein shakes and do weights Smile and I have noticed a difference Smile

Also are almonds good to snack on? People say there good but the high calories and high fat kind of scare me :/

I think the key here is calories in vs out, your body has a minimum calories it need to live without exercise, add in your exercise/daily movement you get your daily calorie expenditure. this number is the number you work off, from here you work out if you workout more or eat a little less (say no less than 500 calories under maintaince) is pretty safe from my reading.

The calories in vs calories out theory is true, but it's also a little flawed, not every calorie is the same. For instance, a mcdonalds meal has 1500 calories. 1500 calories from real food, vegetables, fruit, etc will be treated differently.

True but that starts getting very specific.
If you need 1500 to loose weight though and you eat 1500 from McDonalds you will still loose weight, the calories in vs out is still big factor however where the source of the calories definitely can have added effects. Its all very technical once you start getting into those specifics.

For most people the calories in vs out is enough however the more important reason to eat healthy id think is more down to the improved nutrient profile and healthier source of food that improves health. If you get 1500calories from burgers and fries you will no doubt be lacking some serious vitamins and minerals as well as fiber and your sat fat will no doubt be much higher than you want as well as sodium (salt).

Of course I would not suggest anyone lose weight with crap food, its still not good for you and it lacks nutrients and is loaded with additives, salt, fat, sugars, preservative in most cases. But if you are going out one night you don't need to be afraid of it if it fits your daily intake and there is no medical reason not to eat it.

But as I said earlier I am not qualified in anyway just personal research over the years so please take this as my own opinion not as 100% fact though.
flag bcfong
Posted: Apr 17, 2014 at 20:24 Quote
Mick26IP wrote:
slidways wrote:
liamd-24 wrote:
Yea that's the whole day but I do have snaks like fruit

Yea I'v been working out for about 9months but my diet has changed a lot
Yea I got told that I'd lose muscle wich is why I got reckomended to use protein shakes and do weights Smile and I have noticed a difference Smile

Also are almonds good to snack on? People say there good but the high calories and high fat kind of scare me :/

I think the key here is calories in vs out, your body has a minimum calories it need to live without exercise, add in your exercise/daily movement you get your daily calorie expenditure. this number is the number you work off, from here you work out if you workout more or eat a little less (say no less than 500 calories under maintaince) is pretty safe from my reading.

The calories in vs calories out theory is true, but it's also a little flawed, not every calorie is the same. For instance, a mcdonalds meal has 1500 calories. 1500 calories from real food, vegetables, fruit, etc will be treated differently.

Incorrect. As long as you are under your maintenance which would be a calorie deficit it doesn't matter what you eat you will still lose weight. The only difference between McDonald's and veggies etc is the other health benefits with vitamins etc.
flag snyda
Posted: Apr 17, 2014 at 22:21 Quote
bcfong wrote:
Mick26IP wrote:
slidways wrote:


I think the key here is calories in vs out, your body has a minimum calories it need to live without exercise, add in your exercise/daily movement you get your daily calorie expenditure. this number is the number you work off, from here you work out if you workout more or eat a little less (say no less than 500 calories under maintaince) is pretty safe from my reading.

The calories in vs calories out theory is true, but it's also a little flawed, not every calorie is the same. For instance, a mcdonalds meal has 1500 calories. 1500 calories from real food, vegetables, fruit, etc will be treated differently.

Incorrect. As long as you are under your maintenance which would be a calorie deficit it doesn't matter what you eat you will still lose weight. The only difference between McDonald's and veggies etc is the other health benefits with vitamins etc.
Source?
flag slidways
Posted: Apr 18, 2014 at 8:22 Quote
I'm following you bcfong.

You know your fitness.
Although i would argue there are definitely some research that shows certain eating can aid in weight gain or loss and that even eating will alter genes in which may actually change where the body will store fats.

However personally I see that while these changes take place the only reason they will help you loss weight is because they are increasing your daily caloric needs in which case we still came down to calories in vs calories out.

As for above user.
10calories is 10calories no matter where it comes from,.
Now is it possible that 10calories from one food may actually promote faster metabolism or promotes a way for the body to and therefore increase your daily caloric needs aiding in weight loss yes, may some foods promote slower digestion and therefore give you more time to burn fuel with less storage or take the body more energy to digest said fuel, yes. But that 10 calories is still 10 calories no matter what it doesn't suddenly become more or less. If you eat more than you need for that day you will gain weight.
Calories are a measure of energy and 10 calories will always be 10calories.
flag philiusmaximus
Posted: May 7, 2014 at 0:01 Quote
Can't be bothered to read what's been posted already but have a look at whey protein isolate. High protein and nearly no carbs. Usually comes as more of a juice or watery drink as opposed to a shake type.
flag traildigger15
Posted: May 28, 2014 at 15:00 Quote
snyda wrote:

Creatine will add about ten pounds.... of water weight.... and also has not been tested for long term usage but people can have serious complications when there is too much creatine in their systems... Like death
How much creatine are you talking about? I've been using a whey protein powder shake to help build and repair muscles after climbing that contains creatine, and i've had no such effects. I can definitely feel the difference in muscle soreness with and without drinking it, but i've neither bulked up ten pounds of anything nor suffered any health problems from it. IMO it's fine and probably beneficial in correct amounts, after all, you can OD on almost anything, including water Wink
flag snyda
Posted: May 28, 2014 at 15:44 Quote
Ya it was a substantial amount. A man had his muscles crushed under a bridge which released an enormous amount of creatine and that lead to kidney failure a couple weeks later and then Death.

While unrealistic, should still be taken into account....

And the placebo effect is a mighty fine thing Wink but hey... If it works. I dont supplement it personally because the science doesnt really support it and there have been no longer term studies on it
flag traildigger15
Posted: May 29, 2014 at 13:38 Quote
dang, gotta stay away from things crushing me even more now haha.
But i think it helps. I was drinking a muscle milk shake before i started using the powder and it didn't have much of an effect, at least not to the degree that the powder has.
I will say i was dubious at first, but now that i've been using it i don't see much harm in responsible consumption.
flag Animalistik
Posted: Jun 16, 2014 at 15:05 Quote
snyda wrote:
Ya it was a substantial amount. A man had his muscles crushed under a bridge which released an enormous amount of creatine and that lead to kidney failure a couple weeks later and then Death.

While unrealistic, should still be taken into account....

And the placebo effect is a mighty fine thing Wink but hey... If it works. I dont supplement it personally because the science doesnt really support it and there have been no longer term studies on it

We have creatine inside us naturally although it is different from the over the counter supplement creatine which goes through a chemical change inside the gut. Creatine leaking out of the muscle because of damage can happen and from what I have read it usually happens from over exertion in people that are unconditioned and/or not giving the body enough time to rest and replenish. You can read up on Rhabdomyolysis which is the condition and has been the center of controversy within crossfit but it's even hit the seasoned crossfit warrior. Hyper enduro always has its risks. You are definitely correct about placebo and there is a ton of it in the supplement industry. Creatine works but the results are marginal and plateau as the natural unenhanced athlete reaches his maximum potential. As a enhanced athlete myself I don't even bother with supplements anymore except for protein powders because I love some of the flavors and some pre-workouts (non caffeine)
flag Animalistik
Posted: Jun 16, 2014 at 15:10 Quote
Also the 1 gram of protein per pound of body weight is an old metric founded on zero science. I believe that no natural un-enhanced male should go over 200g of protein per day, you start having diminishing returns and possible constipation from too much protein in the diet. For example Ronnie Coleman in his off season ate 300 to 350g of protein a day which I still think is overkill but if you are anywhere near that then you are wasting money on protein not being used and going out your butt.
flag snyda
Posted: Jun 16, 2014 at 15:42 Quote
Ya I read up more and there are some benefits to creatine supplementing, but no long term studies on the effects it can have. Ill maybe supplement in season.

I dont no what enhanced male is, but hopefully you dont do roids....!

And the protein carries validity. Cant find the research paper right now, but they made the case that even non athletes could benefit from 1.2-2 g/kg daily protein intake. Was brought up in my exercise physiology class.

And protein isnt stored as fat. It only gets metabolized at high levels of intensity if fat and glycogen stores are depleted !
flag Animalistik
Posted: Jun 16, 2014 at 16:16 Quote
snyda wrote:
Ya I read up more and there are some benefits to creatine supplementing, but no long term studies on the effects it can have. Ill maybe supplement in season.

I dont no what enhanced male is, but hopefully you dont do roids....!

And the protein carries validity. Cant find the research paper right now, but they made the case that even non athletes could benefit from 1.2-2 g/kg daily protein intake. Was brought up in my exercise physiology class.

And protein isnt stored as fat. It only gets metabolized at high levels of intensity if fat and glycogen stores are depleted !

If you find a recent study on the protein after the year 2000 I'll take a look at it. I like looking for studies on pubmed. enhanced means steroids and hgh. I used hgh to help me heal from a shoulder surgery. and I've used so many different steroids Razz and to be honest they tank my endurance, I've been lowering my dose thinking about going natural after a few years of using. Protein is a good thing but just like anything too much of something isn't good. The problem with the metric is for example someone weighs 300lbs. It's extremely unrealistic for them to consume that much protein using the 1.2-2 g/kg daily
flag snyda
Posted: Jun 16, 2014 at 16:50 Quote
Ya it was linked in one of my lectures. It was recent but I cant figure out where it went.

Bro gotta get off the roids. The negative chronic effects are staggering!!!

Haha welcome to my life. Im 240. Supplementing is my only option and something ill do during my season to help me maintain weight while training.

 


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