Privateer Bikes 161

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Privateer Bikes 161
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Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 10:30 Quote
R-M-R wrote:
sir-hc,

Thank you for compiling that list. For the sake of establishing the lower boundary on weight, we could include a Last Tarvo at 2080 g - 4 lb lighter - with various Scott models in the same ballpark.

People who buy the 161 are generally not concerned about weight and are often looking to keep the cost down, so it's not surprising 161 build kits aren't the lightest, which further increases the weight beyond that of the lightweight leaders.

I agree weight is overrated and small reductions in efficiency or descending speed can slow a bike down more than a large reduction in weight can speed it up. Just wanted to directly address some of the concerns about the weight of the 161.

That Last Tarvo is very light! Be interesting to see how stiff and durable it will be, its strong money too!

IMO, enduro bikes have been getting heavier, Spesh Enduros have got heavier each time there has been a new release, new fuel is heavier than the last and the slash will do the same. Having a sub 30lb enduro bike is a rarity nowdays, broken frames and warranty claims are not good PR and they arn't good in the pocket of the manufacturer.

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 10:36 Quote
sir-hc wrote:
R-M-R wrote:
Just a thought on the weight:

Many people mention the 161 or other notoriously heavy bikes weigh X lbs, and sometimes people express dismay because some other bike weighs significantly less. The 161 weighs a couple pounds more than some other frames in its category, so that's the maximum amount for which it can be blamed. The rest is the build choice.

A heavy frame doesn't somehow make everything around it heavier. There are probably plenty of lurkers reading this thread, so I want to reassure them the 161 doesn't mysteriously build into a much heavier bike than others. Compared to some other bike that would weigh X lbs, the 161 will probably weigh X to X+3. There are equally heavy frames in the category and the lightest I can think of is a lot more conservative in its geometry.

I've stuck a few frames and their frameset weights (no shocks) below, Privateer is 300g heavier, less than a 1lb.
I'd echo the comments above, seeing lots of builds with heavy wheelsets, dual ply tyres, big range heavy cassettes.
Privateer - 3900g
Raaw Maddona - 3600g
Commencal Meta AM - 3600g
Geometron G1 - 3600g
2019 Enduro Sworks - 2900g
2020 Enduro - 3100g
Slash 29 AL - 3400g
Transition Sentinel - 3900g
Yeti SB150 - 2900g
Liteville 601 - 3000g (approx, 301 listed at 2900g)



I've got a sensible build on mine
- Lyrik RC2
- Renthal Fatbar V2 Alloy / Renthal Stem
-OneUp 210mm Post / Specialized Phenom
-Next R Cranks / XTR Groupset (10-45 cassette) / XT Trail Pedals
-Pro4 Hubs / DT XM481 Rims / Maxxis WT Exo Tyres
-Formula Curas / Formula Monolithic Discs
-34lbs

Thats 1lb heavier than my enduro, dont notice the weight difference when riding. Actually find the privateer faster everywhere, except flat tight turns, steep technical climbs are way easier.

I could lose another 1lb off that with lighter hubs (DT240), lighter pedals (XTR), different discs (formulas are 50g an end heavier), carbon railed saddle. Howver, no need, its fine as it is. In theory you can get to 32lbs, but you will need deep pockets!
I do have a set of xc wheels and tyres I can throw on it for local rides (i've sold my reactor 290, as the 161 did everything better or equal, plus the seat angle/top tube was too slack/long) and it'll drop 1.5lbs

IMO bike companies put a lot of focus on weight, sometimes too much, to the detriment of the performance of the bike (climbing, descending, cornerning). I'd sooner have an extra 100g for a properly sealed set of pivots which keeps the bearings running smoother for longer...

I'm not so sure that the 161 is actually 3900g though.

I weighed mine (P3) w/o shock prior to building it up and it was closer to 4200g. Its an absolute pig.

Whether that matters or not is a different discussion entirely and up to personal preference.

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 10:44 Quote
My p4 is 16.4kg but I can climb anything on it and keep up with my riding buddies until the fun part, reality is it's not a good bike for flat mellow trails, it needs more muscle to get it up to speed in undulating trails but that's not why I got it in the first place, I just enjoy the flat trails as a part of my work out regime Smile but I cannot think riding a different bike for the type of riding I like

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 11:30 Quote
sir-hc wrote:
That Last Tarvo is very light! Be interesting to see how stiff and durable it will be, its strong money too!

Yes, the Tarvo is both remarkably light and remarkably expensive. Not greatly more expensive than many of its carbon peers, though, and it may offer more for the money, so there's a legitimate value proposition (within the low-value realm of high-end frames).


sir-hc wrote:
IMO, enduro bikes have been getting heavier, Spesh Enduros have got heavier each time there has been a new release, new fuel is heavier than the last and the slash will do the same. Having a sub 30lb enduro bike is a rarity nowdays, broken frames and warranty claims are not good PR and they arn't good in the pocket of the manufacturer.

Most people are wisely willing to take on a few extra pounds if parts are stiffer and more durable. You're absolutely right that people can forgive a little extra weight, while broken parts are a huge strike against a company - and rightly so.


undercoverfreak wrote:
I'm not so sure that the 161 is actually 3900g though.

I weighed mine (P3) w/o shock prior to building it up and it was closer to 4200g.

I stand by my statement that weight is of little importance ... but that's a hefty frame. My Bird AM9 (v2?), size L, is exactly 3000 g fully bare, i.e. without shock, axle, seatpost collar. Less travel, less stiff, presumably less strong; not a direct comparison, but it's difficult to justify 40% more mass. Privateer is on the right track and I hope they'll refine the design a little with future iterations.

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 11:39 Quote
While I'm probably showing my dark and dirty triathlon past here, a really clean, and properly lubricated chain Vs one that is even moderately dirty is a greater watt saving than dropping over 2kg from the frame. Don't even get me started on aero!

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 11:47 Quote
It's true! Two national-level endurance athletes I know did some tests with fancy lab equipment and found the one with average to good drivetrain maintenance was saving about 35 watts over the one with notoriously poor drivetrain maintenance. That's about 10% - 15% of their normal output, which slows a rider down more than the entire mass of the bike.

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 12:01 Quote
Heavier bike is approximately equal to stronger legs

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 12:39 Quote
BRB, going to get stronger legs.


Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 13:28 Quote
TET1 wrote:
Heavier bike is approximately equal to stronger legs

Never over biked, just under legged.

Posted: Jun 18, 2020 at 13:32 Quote
BRB, going to seek a refund.

Posted: Jun 19, 2020 at 1:02 Quote
I got a email yesterday stating that my bike will be delayed again, there is apparently a supply issue for 1 part that goes on it. Right now it seems like I will get delivery late June/early July. I am a bit bummed about it, but at least they are open and honest about it.

Posted: Jun 19, 2020 at 13:42 Quote
Some photos of my P2 full build on his first ride.





Posted: Jun 22, 2020 at 4:14 Quote
NordicRider wrote:
I got a email yesterday stating that my bike will be delayed again, there is apparently a supply issue for 1 part that goes on it. Right now it seems like I will get delivery late June/early July. I am a bit bummed about it, but at least they are open and honest about it.

When was yours supposed to arrive? A buddy and I ordered full bike July wk1 and haven't received an update yet.

Posted: Jun 22, 2020 at 5:02 Quote
originalitterman wrote:
NordicRider wrote:
I got a email yesterday stating that my bike will be delayed again, there is apparently a supply issue for 1 part that goes on it. Right now it seems like I will get delivery late June/early July. I am a bit bummed about it, but at least they are open and honest about it.

When was yours supposed to arrive? A buddy and I ordered full bike July wk1 and haven't received an update yet.
May week 2, they are building them as they have been ordered(according to them), so your mate and you will probably be one of the last people to get it in this batch, unless July wk1 is the batch that got delayed until October.

I got a updated by email a few days ago, where (if I remember it correctly) they expected the bike to be built and sent end June/start July. They also stated in the email that they are just waiting on 1 component right now, but not what component.

Posted: Jun 22, 2020 at 5:16 Quote
NordicRider wrote:
originalitterman wrote:
NordicRider wrote:
I got a email yesterday stating that my bike will be delayed again, there is apparently a supply issue for 1 part that goes on it. Right now it seems like I will get delivery late June/early July. I am a bit bummed about it, but at least they are open and honest about it.

When was yours supposed to arrive? A buddy and I ordered full bike July wk1 and haven't received an update yet.
May week 2, they are building them as they have been ordered(according to them), so your mate and you will probably be one of the last people to get it in this batch, unless July wk1 is the batch that got delayed until October.

I got a updated by email a few days ago, where (if I remember it correctly) they expected the bike to be built and sent end June/start July. They also stated in the email that they are just waiting on 1 component right now, but not what component.

Damn that's a hearty wait. Definitely give us the update when the part arrives. Hopefully it's a big batch and solves the whole backlog. Have you asked them what part it is?


 
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