22 Hightower, small bump compliance

PB Forum :: Santa Cruz
22 Hightower, small bump compliance
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Posted: Aug 31, 2022 at 17:36 Quote
I do. I asked some pretty basic questions which no one chose to address. Your post about tuning vs. chassis actually helped a lot because I was wondering if I was just chasing a ghost and that chassis was just that much different. Haven't ridden this chassis in any model before. Your post helped eliminate that possibility.

Your info is helpful because it is similar travel, same design, and can somewhat cross reference that info to the charts I find on SC now. You weighing similar running that much more psi, then, even being different shock, is a far cry from where I was, or thought I should be from my initial online searching when I got the frame. No, not close seemingly, but getting an idea with a similar design does give me some insight. I won't be at that psi, but if that had been posted prior to me finding the chart, I would have questioned my initial findings and current settings for psi and realized that needed testing, more digging.

I got this frame as a warranty replacement, so no shock, no shop to help set sag, just me and whatever info I could find. I don't get too hung up on sag numbers because of my past experiences. I knew someone knew, and my next step was going to be to email SC because I knew they knew. It's simple for them to figure and provide the info, which they have done. Knowing what psi provides proper sag is the same as measuring sag and adjusting till you get there, just a quicker way unless you have a chart, or know what psi to start at. I find it hard to not relate psi to proper sag. I figured if I was off, someone would know based on my weight and the psi I was running. That was my thinking.

These type posts are/were very common on the moto forum I am on. If we knew the bike, it was easy to know if the spring rate was off just based on the riders weight and rate spring they said they had. This is why I posted what I did. psi for rate and my weight. applied the same logic. bike riders think different I guess. Now, maybe you will be able to look at it differently and realize we are talking the same language, just using different means. If you know susp, then knowing how these 2 relate is worth knowing. Ever been riding with a bud that knew nothing about susp, just rode, and asked for help, or rode your bike and said wow? I have. Checked psi and adjusted, checked clickers, explained what does what. Some I ride mtn bikes with I used to ride dirt bikes with. I know this is OT, but I like to discuss this stuff and used to discuss, get asked on the trail about settings, what was going on, with those friends. Smart guys, but they knew I tinkered A LOT and knew they could bounce ideas off me. Like to do that here, but the vibe and responses are different than on a dirt bike forum or in person. Not a big deal, just a learning process.

O+
Posted: Aug 31, 2022 at 17:54 Quote
I've also always hated how people are so obessed with sag numbers. I hate quantifiable data!! Why go by objective values when you can go by subjective, experienced feel? Can you (gmoss) teach me how you set your suspension?

I'm half your weight kitted up. Same shock as you. Lemme know what you got for me.

Posted: Aug 31, 2022 at 18:51 Quote
Haha. Susp is subjective.

Posted: Sep 7, 2022 at 10:47 Quote
I would check the tune on your rear shock. You mentioned you got the frame through a Warranty claim, but no rear shock. The compression tune on the new Hightower frame/shock is very Light. You may need to have your shock re valved for a lighter compression tune.

Posted: Sep 7, 2022 at 17:56 Quote
Mikelb01 wrote:
I would check the tune on your rear shock. You mentioned you got the frame through a Warranty claim, but no rear shock. The compression tune on the new Hightower frame/shock is very Light. You may need to have your shock re valved for a lighter compression tune.

Will do. I briefly thought about that as I have done the same in the past for used shocks, but I forgot to ask the person I talked to at Fox. I will likely do that over the winter when it is time for a full service.

Posted: Sep 8, 2022 at 11:07 Quote
I have a 22 hightower with a super deluxe. 185 pounds and run a 205 psi in the shock with the biggest volume spacer available. I tried forever to tune the rear shock PSI by feel. I like to hit big features so I tend to run my suspension stiffer than most.

I didn't find a comfortable PSI until I used sag as a starting point. I was initially running 240psi because I saw my bottom out ring close to max. I was frustrated with the rear feel so I decided to start by getting the proper sag amount. I found that at 30% sag I only needed around 200psi. I left it at 200 and took the bike out and it was night and day difference better. Small bump compliance was far better and the rear end felt way more planted.

The rear is way better on this bike compared to my HTLT.

Also keep in mind that sag is important to many other characteristics of the bike other than just rear end feel. It can determine how the bike corners, steers, jumps, climbs etc.

I also found running a double down rear casing tire to help calm the rear end as well. The thicker sidewall on the tires deff mutes the rear end a bit and keep it feeling more planted. At my weight I can run about 23-24 rear psi with no inserts. Makes the rear end feel super good on the fast steep rocky east coast trails.

Posted: Sep 8, 2022 at 14:14 Quote
Thanks for the input. I am not discounting sag, it is first and foremost important, just like on motorcycles, and yes, it controls how everything else about how the bike works. I was not far off and know I have been on both sides of proper pressure now, but I find this bike to not be as good as my LT, at least consistently. I am going to have another conversation with Fox about revalve this time. I think that is potentially an issue now. Small bump is improved a lot, but not consistent from ride to ride and sometimes during a ride.

Posted: Sep 9, 2022 at 9:18 Quote
gmoss wrote:
Thanks for the input. I am not discounting sag, it is first and foremost important, just like on motorcycles, and yes, it controls how everything else about how the bike works. I was not far off and know I have been on both sides of proper pressure now, but I find this bike to not be as good as my LT, at least consistently. I am going to have another conversation with Fox about revalve this time. I think that is potentially an issue now. Small bump is improved a lot, but not consistent from ride to ride and sometimes during a ride.

Something is deff off. My V2 is drastically better than the LT. Only thing I liked about the LT was that it was shorter and a bit easier to maneuver in tight trails. Rear end also felt a little more poppy and fun but deff not as stable or planted.

Posted: Sep 9, 2022 at 15:50 Quote
To me, the LT felt more like a comfy trail bike. My new HT feels like a full on enduro bike. I like the trail bike better, and the lighter weight. The LT was not quite as precise on direction changes, which I also liked. Rode today and bike felt good, I really just don't like it quite as well as I did my LT, for what I ride. The new bike is working much better, but it does dull out the trail moreso,

O+
Posted: Sep 13, 2022 at 7:00 Quote
That makes sense. I know people do race enduros on the HT. I don't think it is as enduro specialized as the megatower or other long travels, but it does have the capability.

Posted: Dec 27, 2022 at 8:02 Quote
Thought I would follow up on this thread in case someone comes along later. I ended up having the ahock serviced and revalved for the frame. This improved the small bump and overall performance of the rear. However, it still was not what I expected. I have ordered a different frame brand but wanted to try something else so I bought a DVO Topaz 3 for the HT. Set it up and immediately had the ride I was expecting all along. Small bump is great, pedaling support is great. Surprised at the change. Never ridden anything other than Fox. For me, I believe having the 3 position compression lever just works better, which the Float X doesn't have. I use the mid setting all the time.

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