Cushcore - Why you use them or why you don’t

PB Forum :: All Mountain, Enduro & Cross-Country
Cushcore - Why you use them or why you don’t
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Posted: Nov 14, 2022 at 8:44 Quote
I've been running a lightweight insert in the rear tire for about 5 years now. First Huck Norris, now Cushcore XC.

I do it to protect the rim and will always run one, whether I'm on carbon (current) or aluminum. I was going through rims too quickly for my preference with my preferred tire pressure.

There's nothing wrong with anybody running or not running inserts, or trying heavier casings or more pressure instead of an insert if they're hard on rims. I find that high enough pressure to ensure I'm not pinging my rims off rocks (which is no big deal on occasion usually) results in a lack of traction. I also hate heavy, slow rolling rubber even though my CC is obviously adding weight.

Pick a solution and be a d*ck about it.

Posted: Nov 14, 2022 at 15:54 Quote
Have used CushCore Pro = works awesome but so f*cking heavy! Then tried Cush Core XC = bullshit, very minimal rim protection, zero sidewall... these are for tires 2.3 wide or less, only. If you really smash, and use 2.4 or more the XC's are like having nothing in your tire.

My goldilocks has been Tannus Tubeless Armour. Not quite the all our full protection of CushCore Pro, but close. Not quite as much sidewall protection, but very close. Wayyy lighter. I'm able to use EXO+ along with Tannus Tubeless Armour. They're lighter or about the same weight as a tube at 160 grams... so together with and EXO+ casing tire, you get a lighter set-up than full DH tires but I've found better protection, grip and sidewall support than DH tires. You also keep a more supple tread vs the stiff tread of DH tires.

Posted: Nov 14, 2022 at 23:49 Quote
islandforlife wrote:
Have used CushCore Pro = works awesome but so f*cking heavy! Then tried Cush Core XC = bullshit, very minimal rim protection, zero sidewall... these are for tires 2.3 wide or less, only. If you really smash, and use 2.4 or more the XC's are like having nothing in your tire.

My goldilocks has been Tannus Tubeless Armour. Not quite the all our full protection of CushCore Pro, but close. Not quite as much sidewall protection, but very close. Wayyy lighter. I'm able to use EXO+ along with Tannus Tubeless Armour. They're lighter or about the same weight as a tube at 160 grams... so together with and EXO+ casing tire, you get a lighter set-up than full DH tires but I've found better protection, grip and sidewall support than DH tires. You also keep a more supple tread vs the stiff tread of DH tires.

Useful info about the XCs.

It’s interesting about the weight of the Pros, the alternative for me would to be using Doubledown or heavier, which aren’t much lighter. Even with Doubledowns at a decent pressure I was still getting regular rim dings as my speed increased (and talent lagged behind).

Posted: Nov 15, 2022 at 0:19 Quote
in response to the OP. I don't use insterts for Price, weight and the fact that I only get a puncture once every couple years.. I'm a heavy boi so no need for low psi
Hell! 4 of my 5 bikes still have tubes in em!!

Posted: Nov 15, 2022 at 15:05 Quote
islandforlife wrote:
Have used CushCore Pro = works awesome but so f*cking heavy! Then tried Cush Core XC = bullshit, very minimal rim protection, zero sidewall... these are for tires 2.3 wide or less, only. If you really smash, and use 2.4 or more the XC's are like having nothing in your tire.

My goldilocks has been Tannus Tubeless Armour. Not quite the all our full protection of CushCore Pro, but close. Not quite as much sidewall protection, but very close. Wayyy lighter. I'm able to use EXO+ along with Tannus Tubeless Armour. They're lighter or about the same weight as a tube at 160 grams... so together with and EXO+ casing tire, you get a lighter set-up than full DH tires but I've found better protection, grip and sidewall support than DH tires. You also keep a more supple tread vs the stiff tread of DH tires.

I used to use Tannus. But kept getting wobble on my tire no matter what I tried. Even took it to a shop once to get it done and still had wobble. Trying CC XC next season.

Posted: Nov 15, 2022 at 15:39 Quote
Kango wrote:
islandforlife wrote:
Have used CushCore Pro = works awesome but so f*cking heavy! Then tried Cush Core XC = bullshit, very minimal rim protection, zero sidewall... these are for tires 2.3 wide or less, only. If you really smash, and use 2.4 or more the XC's are like having nothing in your tire.

My goldilocks has been Tannus Tubeless Armour. Not quite the all our full protection of CushCore Pro, but close. Not quite as much sidewall protection, but very close. Wayyy lighter. I'm able to use EXO+ along with Tannus Tubeless Armour. They're lighter or about the same weight as a tube at 160 grams... so together with and EXO+ casing tire, you get a lighter set-up than full DH tires but I've found better protection, grip and sidewall support than DH tires. You also keep a more supple tread vs the stiff tread of DH tires.

I used to use Tannus. But kept getting wobble on my tire no matter what I tried. Even took it to a shop once to get it done and still had wobble. Trying CC XC next season.

Interesting, have been using Tannus for almost 3 years now? No wobble issues... maybe a defect, should warranty them. I'd get a good look at a CC XC insert before you buy them. They're really thin and so where the edges overlap a 30mm ID rim, it gives you very little protection. Because they have such a small surface overlapping the rim edge, it really gets cut up by the rim under hard impacts. A few months of use for me and they were so cut up they were useless. They'd probably work much better in a 25mm ID rim with a 2.3 or less tire.

O+
Posted: Nov 19, 2022 at 21:30 Quote
I run DIY foam inserts. Purchased some “spa pool foam” from the local para rubber store. It’s what they use inside the lids or tops on spa pools/jacuzzi/hot tubs. It looks exactly the same as the foam as a Cushcore is made from and even feels the same so with my limited knowledge and logic, should be the same. Basically it’s “Closed cell” EVA type that doesn’t absorb water as if it does it, your sealant will disappear.

I got the shop to use their band saw to cut the big lengths into narrow strips approx 35mm wide, so slightly wider than my 30mm internal rim. Then I just wrapped it around the rim to get the correct diameter and cut. Joined it together at each end to create a hoop with a zip tie (drill a hole in each end to put zip tie through) if they don’t have a band saw, you could use a straightedge and a Stanley knife.

I did chamfer the inner edges to get it to better fit and get the similar tapered edge to a CC. Just used a sharp Stanley knife to do this. Cuts like butter, just like your fingers so be careful.

Once I was finished, had a CC looking insert. I did run valves that let air in underneath the insert. There are a few hack ways to get it to work if you don’t want to pay for CC or Peatys valves but they work the best.

In total, foam cost me $30 NZD and I done 4x 29 wheels and still have enough leftover to do another set I reckon. Yea there is a bit of time pissing around trimming and shaping but 1 hour max whilst drinking a beer and cleaning up after. When CC retail for $250 NZD, I think it was a good idea to test the theory. Yeah sure someone will probably tell me “CC are way more expensive so they must be way better than your DIY one”. Call me skeptical but it’s a hoop of foam that absorbs blunt forces and also takes up volume inside of a tyre like a volume spacer in your air suspension. There’s not that much rocket science to it.

Do I like it? Yep. I run low 20’s tyre pressure on Specialized Black Diamond Butcher and Eliminator tyres and I do get the feeling it dampens the chatter out and offers more in the way of sidewall support so I will continue to run them. Yeah they add weight. I don’t notice it too much and anyway, the benefits outweigh the weight penalty.

O+
Posted: Nov 19, 2022 at 21:54 Quote
I ran cushcore front and rear for two seasons. It gives a great damped feel through rock gardens. It is heavy as shit and also a pain in the ass to change. I got good at it, but still ended up giving up on it. Simplicity is the key to life.

O+
Posted: Nov 22, 2022 at 14:01 Quote
a-prince wrote:
I ran cushcore front and rear for two seasons. It gives a great damped feel through rock gardens. It is heavy as shit and also a pain in the ass to change. I got good at it, but still ended up giving up on it. Simplicity is the key to life.

Yeah I’m one or two bad experiences away from going back to tubes

O+
Posted: Nov 23, 2022 at 4:57 Quote
How often were you changing the cushcore? I only have to mess with mine when I put new tires on.

Posted: Nov 27, 2022 at 8:12 Quote
As a lighter guy, 165lbs, I have a strange ability to destroy tires and rims. I went from cc pro, to tannus, to now neither but I run dd casing and almost 30psi.

Reason I went away from them both is that when it’s cold out they’re friggin terrible to change. I had flats with both cc and tannus, neither of which were their fault, two sidewall slices, and it took me for freaking ever to break the bead off pull the insert out, and then figure out a place to pack the insert back to the pickup.

If I ran park a lot, I would cc it up.

If I didn’t live in a place that got cold, I’d tannus for sure.

As it stands now, flats are inevitable so I just run a beefy rim, dt Swiss e1700, no insert and 28-30 psi.

Also I did a tannus review right here that somehow is my most watched video by an absolute long shot. https://youtu.be/Ug8BvxsWxDk

O+
Posted: Nov 27, 2022 at 13:46 Quote
EarninTurns wrote:
As a lighter guy, 165lbs, I have a strange ability to destroy tires and rims. I went from cc pro, to tannus, to now neither but I run dd casing and almost 30psi.

Reason I went away from them both is that when it’s cold out they’re friggin terrible to change. I had flats with both cc and tannus, neither of which were their fault, two sidewall slices, and it took me for freaking ever to break the bead off pull the insert out, and then figure out a place to pack the insert back to the pickup.

If I ran park a lot, I would cc it up.

If I didn’t live in a place that got cold, I’d tannus for sure.

As it stands now, flats are inevitable so I just run a beefy rim, dt Swiss e1700, no insert and 28-30 psi.

Also I did a tannus review right here that somehow is my most watched video by an absolute long shot. https://youtu.be/Ug8BvxsWxDk

Vitoria Airliner is easy to deal with on trail if you want to run something

Posted: Dec 14, 2022 at 20:36 Quote
I'm running cushcore xc front and rear for the damping it provides.I do notice it a bit on the climbs but after a while you just forget that the weight is there and get used to it. I notice a pretty significant difference on the downhill and I like having them in. If you're having issues with dinging rims I'd probably get the pros, but I don't personally feel I need that kind of protection.

Posted: Dec 14, 2022 at 23:08 Quote
Not Cushcore, but ran Rimpact for more than a year on my hardtail which I no longer own, and currently use Nukeproof ARD on my Privateer 141.

The Rimpact was a beneficial addition to the ht both in terms of ride quality and rim protection. I've combined it with Schwalbe Supergravity, Maxxis DD and EXO casings. It was a bit of a pain to install/uninstall with the beefier tyres, esp. if they were on the narrow side, like the DD DHR 2.3. Plain old EXO was fine, and despite low expectations I managed to wear down the tread of the EXO HR2 without suffering any punctures or sidewall slashes. The feel and compliance with the low pressure and thin sidewalls was an improvement over the tougher casings. The insert allowed me to drop 2psi from my insert-less pressure, which doesn't sound like much, but makes a difference in feel and traction on a ht. It also allowed me carefully to pedal back home on a flat tyre in a couple of occasions (dry sealant in one case and issue with valve the 2nd time). When I finally removed it, the Rimpact was full of cuts and couldn't trust it enough to reinstall it.

When I had my LBS buid the 141 the ARD was the only thing they had in stock and it was dirt cheap, so I figured why not. I had a brand new wheel laced for the build and wanted to keep it nice and round for a long time. Being new to rear suspension I was afraid I'd start plowing through stuff so opted for some extra security. I've had it since May and apart from the rattle issue (which can get very annoying) it appears to offer very good protection. I had one sliced tyre last week (Schwalbe Supertrail) and it happened while climbing at a very low speed. It was a recently broken rock that had a knife-sharp edge and was wet. The tyre rolled over the edge but slipped sideways and slashed it between crown and sidewall. The tyre had been used for 1200km already so it might have been an older nip that the rock cut through. I managed to roll down the rest of the trail without damage to the rim. Removing the insert to install a tube was surprisingly easy with riding gloves and a plastic tyre lever. Upon inspection the ARD has only suffered two small cuts so far so it fairs well. I shortened it before reinstalling with a new tyre to stop it rattling (for a while).

Comparing the two, the Rimpact feels like it offers a bit more damping, but it won't save the rim from a very hard hit. The ARD may offer better ding protection but appears to do nothing for damping. Next I'm going to try the Panzer, although it's a bit more pricey than I'd like. Cushcore is too heavy and expensive for me.

O+
Posted: Dec 15, 2022 at 7:00 Quote
Instead of Cushcore I tried a heavier casing to avoid the extra cost and hassle of installing cushcore. So far so good. I run Maxxis DH casings and maxxgripp rubber front/rear. I weigh about 210lbs and run psi in the 21-23F/23-25R ranges.

It definitely slowed the bike down on the climbs but the downhill performance is great; lots of grip and damping. For a while it was hard to adapt to the added weight on the climbs until I decided I would try hard to not act like a wuss, and eventually pedaled myself into better shape.

I think some people are hitting stuff hard enough where they do need cushcore, but I found running DH casings to solve the issue for me, plus I get all the added puncture protection.


 
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