Is a hardtail worth it?

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Is a hardtail worth it?
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flag d-dog123
FL
Posted: Apr 6, 2023 at 9:57 Quote
I'm in the market for a new frame and im stuck between a full suspension and a hard-tail. They are both the same brand (Ferrum) and they both are going to cost about the same to build up- $1600 HT, $1750 FS. The hard-tail would be higher end while the full-sus would be kind of bare-bones. But thats not my problem. I am leaning towards the hard-tail but im afraid it wont be as capable as the full-sus. I lean towards the more experienced side of riding but i still have along way to go when it comes to skills. I plan on racing enduro and riding light enduro- downhill which is were my problem comes in. I want a bike that can do it all but wont hinder my performance when it comes to racing. I also dont have much money to spend, about 2000, and would like a higher end ride. I cant decide if i want to spend a little more, get less, and rear suspension, or spend less, get more, with no rear suspension.

I guess what im really asking is, can a hardtail be built up to be just as capable as a full suspension bike. And if any of yall have ridden any big parks and sent it hard with a hardtail, or do i just get a full-sus.

I have trouble putting my thoughts into words so if this is confusing, im sorry.
flag zeeino
Posted: Apr 6, 2023 at 16:07 Quote
Hardtails are fun, but if you're looking to go fast on rough stuff, you should get a FS. I typically ride a hardtail if I know that I'll be riding smooth trails with very few bumps, or if I'm riding with slower riders. You can ride a "hardcore hardtail" over anything, but you'll be much faster on a FS with similar geometry.
flag hydraulica
Posted: Apr 6, 2023 at 16:29 Quote
A good rider on a hardtail can be better than a mediocre rider on full sus.
flag d-dog123
FL
Posted: Apr 6, 2023 at 20:07 Quote
zeeino wrote:
Hardtails are fun, but if you're looking to go fast on rough stuff, you should get a FS. I typically ride a hardtail if I know that I'll be riding smooth trails with very few bumps, or if I'm riding with slower riders. You can ride a "hardcore hardtail" over anything, but you'll be much faster on a FS with similar geometry.

tup
flag joelsman
Posted: Apr 14, 2023 at 18:37 Quote
FS for comfort, especially at speed
flag ScaryGuiTarS
Posted: Apr 19, 2023 at 1:00 Quote
joelsman wrote:
FS for comfort, especially at speed
That's for sure!

I have to say though, there are some hardcore hardtail-only riders out there that can do a lot more with them than I ever could. I still rode HT for the vast majority of my MTB years, as so many riders have. I now finally got a really killer HT that blows my mind with its capability and overall riding experience. Riding this thing is like a testament to those that swear by HT's and I'd think other than the most nasty of terrain, this thing could handle just about anything my Stumpy could. I'd still prefer of course my Stumpy in certain situations but I'd take this HT anywhere if I had to. I upgraded a few minor things but if I needed to increase its ability I'd maybe use slightly better forks & brakes.

These HT's with the modern bike technology today and all the capacity for the same level components as the FS bikes are WAY more fun to ride.

~JSV
flag MT36
Posted: Apr 19, 2023 at 8:20 Quote
In pink bike you will get a lot of bias towards FS, and I am part of it for sure. And I want to give all the HT riders out there total respect because HT is awesome and lots of fun. FS is just straight up more capable on descents though. It will broaden your horizons if you are riding large descents, “large-ish” airs, and lots of technical terrain. Not saying HT won’t be loads of fun, because they are sick and modern hardtails are loads better than they have been in the past, but the two setups are very different.

I rode hardtails (including full rigid) for years and got to a point where I rode faster and handled more terrain than my FS buddies. I went back to FS then and realized that I was missing out on a lot of capabilities on the HT. I don’t regret my HT stint at all. Yes you CAN be skilled enough to ride HT in all situations, but these sorts of riders are rare and an anomaly, for obvious reasons. It takes a strong athletic work ethic and aggressive mentality to ride HT like a FS enduro rig.

Unless you live where there is lots of flat or smooth terrain and/or have a strong desire to be ride HT because of the challenge or aesthetic, and never ride chairlift terrain, I would go FS and upgrade the components as you can.
flag ScaryGuiTarS
Posted: Apr 19, 2023 at 10:12 Quote
@MT36 - There ya' go. That says it all! tup

~JSV
flag Gravelben
O+
Posted: Apr 19, 2023 at 16:00 Quote
Hardtails are great, I love mine but from your description of how you plan to ride it (enduro to DH, bike parks etc) I think a FS will suit your use better.

You can ride steep rough trails on a good hardtail but almost always slower than you would be on a FS with similar tyres/geo, and you will also get sore and fatigued sooner from the bike transmitting more impact to you.

HT and FS both have their advantages. I have both and prefer my 140mm hardtail for more rolling and pedally XC to trail type riding without many big hits, and my 160/150mm FS for chunkier stuff, bigger features and long descents. I ride harder things on my hardtail now than I did on a short travel FS bike 2 years ago though. And a hardtail is much easier for cleaning after winter mud riding!

A hardtail does help you become a better rider, but when I'm stretching the limits of my ability/confidence I appreciate the extra margin the FS gives and try things I wouldn't on the hardtail.
flag d-dog123
FL
Posted: Apr 20, 2023 at 5:50 Quote
Gravelben wrote:
Hardtails are great, I love mine but from your description of how you plan to ride it (enduro to DH, bike parks etc) I think a FS will suit your use better.

You can ride steep rough trails on a good hardtail but almost always slower than you would be on a FS with similar tyres/geo, and you will also get sore and fatigued sooner from the bike transmitting more impact to you.

HT and FS both have their advantages. I have both and prefer my 140mm hardtail for more rolling and pedally XC to trail type riding without many big hits, and my 160/150mm FS for chunkier stuff, bigger features and long descents. I ride harder things on my hardtail now than I did on a short travel FS bike 2 years ago though. And a hardtail is much easier for cleaning after winter mud riding!

A hardtail does help you become a better rider, but when I'm stretching the limits of my ability/confidence I appreciate the extra margin the FS gives and try things I wouldn't on the hardtail.

Thanks, I live in memphis so it is very flat but i travel a good bit and bring my bike with me. So ive decided a trail bike would just make sense. For me, i dont really clean my bike so that shouldnt be a problem. But i do like the more reactive feel of a hardtail
flag ScaryGuiTarS
Posted: Apr 20, 2023 at 10:40 Quote
There are certain things, meaning technology, that I feel REALLY helped elevate the HT to a new level and make it way more enjoyable as a fully capable MTB. The tapered headtube and the option of superior forks, of course. The 1X drivetrain systems are liberating, and most of all has been the dropper post. I could never see myself MTBing again without a dropper.

~JSV
flag 52Jeff
Posted: May 22, 2023 at 13:07 Quote
A nice slack hardtail like the Ferrum can handle any trail. you just need to work harder since you will be the rear suspension. I ride the same trails with my custom Marino Hardtail as I do on my 190/190 Norco Shore Freeride bike. you would be surprised at how capable a slack hardtail with a good fork can be.

photo
flag ScaryGuiTarS
Posted: May 25, 2023 at 0:57 Quote
WTF! That Marino looks waaaaaay slack. That's a nice lookin' ride! tup What's the HT angle on that? How much travel on those forks?

Yeah a real quality HT frame w/a monster fork can be tough as nails. Man, most of us older riders started MTBing in the nasty and gnarly on rigid frames anyway, so we should be well-off on hardtails, ya' think? I'd take my Chameleon anywhere I'd take my Stumpy, just would have to adapt to the response.

~JSV
flag naptime
FL
Posted: May 25, 2023 at 4:22 Quote
Yesh
A hard tail will teach skills,technique an lines that will make you a faster rider on the FS
flag Maxants33
Posted: May 25, 2023 at 5:36 Quote
I am trying to decide the same thing.

I have been on a hardcore hardtail for a while - but am considering moving up to a full sus.
photo

But - I love hardtails! I ride a lot of tech on mine. With 29ers and 2.6 tyres + modern geometry, you can do a lot.
If your from the UK you might know Rogate, Bike park Wales, Forest of Dean, Redlands. I have taken my hardtail down some very rough descents including a few of the techy black runs at Bike park wales.

I am considering a full sus after slipping a disc. Now my lower back is a bit weaker and drops >1m cause quite a sting in the lumbar region.
But, I cannot shake this idea that a full sus will take the fun out of a lot of my riding.
Sure, I know a full sus will be faster, but if its all about speed - I can just do a flow trail on my hardtail, where a hardtail probably is faster than a full sus(?).

I am worried the techy stuff, where you have to unweight and bunny hop and really work the bike - will just end up being a case of hold on and point the bike in the correct direction.
I do notice if I take a slomo video at the bike park, the good hardtail riders are way more dynamic than the average full sus riders.

I am probably overreacting. I have borrowed my friend's full sus at bike parks, and sure - its not simply point and roll. But, it is way easier. And if I get a nice full sus better suited to my size and riding style, probably going to be easier still.
I am also racing my first enduro in July. Thankfully we have a hardtail category quite often in the UK, so no requirement to get a full sus to not come last!

If anyone disagrees - please let me know!! I am poised to buy right now!
Cannot decide between a steel longer slacker hardcore hardtail, or a Bird AM9 full sus.
Please help me decide Very confused

edit:
Also I have a hardtail XC bike and a hardtail DJ. Too many hardtails?
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