Suspension SETUP, a 'how to' guide...

PB Forum :: Mechanics' Lounge
Suspension SETUP, a 'how to' guide...
Author Message
flag Nateispie
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 at 10:21 Quote
Is it normal to have white oil violently shoot out the schrader valve on my fox float rl every time I release air?
flag freestyIAM
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 at 10:21 Quote
brianl wrote:
gpgalanis wrote:
Hi guys. Do you follow the factory recommendations regarding sag, rebound etc or do you use different settings? For example Fox recommends 15-20% sag but it is impossible for me to ride like that because the traction is really bad and I get a lot of arm fatigue.
Assuming you're talking about a fork, since Fox recommends 15-20% sag, what rebound and compression settings are you using? Too much rebound and/or compression damping can cause fork harshness.

This ^. As a general rule of thumb, the heavier you are the more damping you need. So using the weight chart on the fork, if you are say the in the lightest bracket then you should only have to use a few clicks of R/C damping. If you are in the heaviest they you probably need to use many more clicks of R/C damping. And as always depending on how seasoned a rider you are how aggressive your riding and trails are, adjust accordingly.
flag freestyIAM
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 at 10:23 Quote
Nateispie wrote:
Is it normal to have white oil shoot out the schrader valve on my fox float rl every time I release air?

If my memory serves, the old Float RL are open bathed so yes to some degree. Just a small amount though. It shouldn't be watergunning measurable CCs of sus fluid. You have a problem if that is the case.
flag gpgalanis
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 at 12:56 Quote
Thank you guys. Personally I find 15-20% sag in the attack position to be too firm for me so I usually run a bit more. As for the rebound it makes a big difference for sure so I experiment a lot until I find my sweet spot.

My objective is to have both good small bump sensitivity and mid stroke support but since having both at the same time is quite a challenge I try to find an acceptable compromise.
flag chickenrunz
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 at 14:52 Quote
gpgalanis wrote:
Thank you guys. Personally I find 15-20% sag in the attack position to be too firm for me so I usually run a bit more. As for the rebound it makes a big difference for sure so I experiment a lot until I find my sweet spot.

My objective is to have both good small bump sensitivity and mid stroke support but since having both at the same time is quite a challenge I try to find an acceptable compromise.

It depends on your fork, cheaper forks have one or the other. Good small bump sensitivity = dive like a swan. Good support = zero small bump sensitivity.

Well designed fork (usually the mid-higher end ones) can do both.

Well at least in my experience anyway.
flag WasabiJim
Posted: Dec 29, 2017 at 16:56 Quote
chickenrunz wrote:
gpgalanis wrote:
Thank you guys. Personally I find 15-20% sag in the attack position to be too firm for me so I usually run a bit more. As for the rebound it makes a big difference for sure so I experiment a lot until I find my sweet spot.

My objective is to have both good small bump sensitivity and mid stroke support but since having both at the same time is quite a challenge I try to find an acceptable compromise.

It depends on your fork, cheaper forks have one or the other. Good small bump sensitivity = dive like a swan. Good support = zero small bump sensitivity.

Well designed fork (usually the mid-higher end ones) can do both.

Well at least in my experience anyway.

yes, nice breakaway with good support is indeed the challenge and requires fine balance of spring rate and dampening both compression and rebound. not all forks let you tweak these to your preference - fox CTD vs separate LS and HS compression
flag chickenrunz
Posted: Dec 30, 2017 at 2:34 Quote
i meant to say cheaper forks will do one or the other at any one point in time, good support (less sag), good small bump sensitivity (more sag)- pick one.
flag gpgalanis
Posted: Jan 2, 2018 at 12:53 Quote
Hi again.

When you have a bike with mismatched travel (160 -140 for example) how do you set your suspensions in terms of full travel use and bottom out resistance?

Personally I prefer to set it up in a balanced way so both ends will use the same travel and leave the extra travel of the fork for some unexpected situations.

What do you think?
flag FlyHacker
Posted: Jan 2, 2018 at 13:23 Quote
Hi,
I have a problem with my fox 34 2015 fit 160mm. If I pump correct psi (around 70) for my weight 68kg my fork sucks travel. Its like 145mm instead of 160mm. I know this happens beacuse of too hard negative spring (its steel spring, not air like rs pike for example). How can i fix that? Maybe someone had the same problem and fixed it?
flag freestyIAM
Posted: Jan 2, 2018 at 14:20 Quote
FlyHacker wrote:
Hi,
I have a problem with my fox 34 2015 fit 160mm. If I pump correct psi (around 70) for my weight 68kg my fork sucks travel. Its like 145mm instead of 160mm. I know this happens beacuse of too hard negative spring (its steel spring, not air like rs pike for example). How can i fix that? Maybe someone had the same problem and fixed it?

Try burping the fork seals with a small zip tie. Totally winging it here but sometimes the fork wiper seals creates unwanted sealed air chambers. If that sealed air chamber has less air in it than the surrounding atmosphere it can act as a negative spring.
flag freestyIAM
Posted: Jan 2, 2018 at 14:32 Quote
gpgalanis wrote:
Thank you guys. Personally I find 15-20% sag in the attack position to be too firm for me so I usually run a bit more. As for the rebound it makes a big difference for sure so I experiment a lot until I find my sweet spot.

My objective is to have both good small bump sensitivity and mid stroke support but since having both at the same time is quite a challenge I try to find an acceptable compromise.

May be impossible to achieve depending on fork's air spring curve. My stock 2016 Pike was either sensitive off the top and divy in midstoke OR harsh off the top and supported in midstroke. I eventually got to the promised land with Luftkappe. If you have to settle for a compromise i would trade the initial sensitivity for better midstroke support. I think a poorly supported midstroke is more detrimental to the ride than a lack of initial sensitivity.
flag JohnyBoy
Posted: Jan 5, 2018 at 2:49 Quote
So I thought I'd give a Shockwiz a go, its telling me sag , rebound and ramp up are all good but I have too much compression damping. Problem is the shock is already running the lowest compression tune Rochshox make. So could it be the high shock pressure I run choking the damper. I could run one more volume spacer and a bit less pressure in the shock, would this help. As far as I'm aware shock is in good order and IFP pressure is as it should be at 350 psi. Bike is a Bird Aeris 120 with a 55mm shock giving frame leverage of 2.18 average. ????
flag oldmanfalling
Posted: Jan 5, 2018 at 8:04 Quote
I've got a 2017 Rockshox Super Deluxe fitted to a Transition Patrol. I took the bike out for it's first run today and attached my Shockwiz to get an idea of how the basic setup is.

It seems I have a problem with High Speed Compression, and I think the harshness when riding down some stairs confirms this. I don't know how, even if it's possible, to adjust the HS Compression on the shock. Everything else looks good.

Here's a screenshot of the Shockwiz recommendations (ignore the Fox thing, it's just what I named the unit):

Shockwiz Screenshot

Anyone got any ideas?

I'm going to go out again soon and see if I can replicate the suggestions, or if it was just an anomaly, but to know if I can make an adjustment would be reassuring.

Thanks very much
flag brevard-bikewrench
Posted: Jan 6, 2018 at 14:29 Quote
freestyIAM wrote:
FlyHacker wrote:
Hi,
I have a problem with my fox 34 2015 fit 160mm. If I pump correct psi (around 70) for my weight 68kg my fork sucks travel. Its like 145mm instead of 160mm. I know this happens beacuse of too hard negative spring (its steel spring, not air like rs pike for example). How can i fix that? Maybe someone had the same problem and fixed it?

Try burping the fork seals with a small zip tie. Totally winging it here but sometimes the fork wiper seals creates unwanted sealed air chambers. If that sealed air chamber has less air in it than the surrounding atmosphere it can act as a negative spring.

Do you have any volume spacers in there? For every volume spacer/ token/ reducer, 5-10 PSI less is needed (totally depends on set up though). For example, on my Rockshox pike I have 3 volume reducer tokens inside, recommended pressure is about 75psi. I am currently running 55ish PSI in there. It is a 150mm fork but the o ring is topping out around 140mm travel. This is good though, as it gives you an extra bit of trade for super hard hits.
flag brianl
Posted: Jan 6, 2018 at 18:05 Quote
FlyHacker wrote:
Hi,
I have a problem with my fox 34 2015 fit 160mm. If I pump correct psi (around 70) for my weight 68kg my fork sucks travel. Its like 145mm instead of 160mm. I know this happens beacuse of too hard negative spring (its steel spring, not air like rs pike for example). How can i fix that? Maybe someone had the same problem and fixed it?
Is a (newer) air spring upgrade available from Fox? (enter the code into ridefox.com)

 


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