Old Riders....But not "Old School"

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Old Riders....But not "Old School"
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Posted: Sep 11, 2019 at 22:53 Quote
Yeah. Plastic bikes. Maybe I'll have one when they are ready. Or when I am ready. But I am a confirmed metal man. Steel is real and all that crusty shit.

Posted: Sep 11, 2019 at 23:05 Quote
I just like welds on my bikes. Aesthetically pleasing.

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 0:07 Quote
sterlingmagnum wrote:
that’s ridiculous..... there are multiple reasons why alloy frames get lifetime warranty while carbon gets 3 years or so. There are chinks in every chain. Neither are “better” than the other, its all characteristics one might prefer...

It all boils down to preferences. Not everyone values paying a premium for insignificant or subtle differences.

For me personally? Im a cheap bastard who values practicality and who cant tell the difference between an RC or Charger 2 damper..... its all smoke and mirrors....

Besides no one buys a bike based on scientific facts.... it is “all” preferences.
Not sure what you're basing that on but every carbon frame I've owned and several sets if carbon wheels have lifetime warranty...

Carbon is a superior material, period. It's more flexible and can be laid up to do anything that alloys can do and more. That's not to say every bike made from alloy is shit but it's an inferior material and carbon is better.

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 1:38 Quote
Pretty sure my Trek Remedy is lifetime warranty for original owner.

Someone buy it. LOL!

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 1:50 Quote
jamezyo wrote:
looks like sat will be nice enough to smash park laps . Those Rheeder jumps have been on the back of my mind for the Last few days.
Can’t wait to see lower pipe dream.
Any of you old summa bitchz gona be up for closing weekend ?

If it's not pouring rain this local will be rolling.
Lower Pipedream is killer! Now they need to redo the top next year, same treatment as the bottom. Pull the lips back up and relax some of the tight berms to carry more speed.

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 2:39 Quote
whitebirdfeathers wrote:
I finally took the time to listen to the new Tool album. I was left completely underwhelmed. Every song is a slow burn going kinda nowhere. It’s not unpleasant but it’s more atmospheric than anything else. It’s a bit like a prog-metal Enya album.

Wow, this album is truly misunderstood by most on first listen. I was a little unsure on my first listen as well then a switched flipped for me after multiple listens. If your expecting Undertow, Anema or Lateralus part 2 forget it. Maynard keeps the growl and aggression in check on this one. I'm stoked they didn't make any of those other albums redux.
This album is melodically different yet somewhat familiar and truly fantastic. Mix these new songs within the more aggressive tunes of the past albums and you have yourself one hell of a live catalogue.

BTW, people said WTF is this about Led Zeppelin IV and Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band albums when they came out too. Misunderstood

This song is killer. Enya only wishes she was in on this one.

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 6:14 Quote
The boy and I are hitting Revy to ride the new resort trail on Saturday, then Sunpeaks Sunday.
Crossing fingers for no rain

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 6:49 Quote
d-man wrote:
The boy and I are hitting Revy to ride the new resort trail on Saturday, then Sunpeaks Sunday.
Crossing fingers for no rain
I will cross my fingers for no rain bro.
Friday gona got enchanted forest on way out.

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 7:35 Quote
d-man wrote:
The boy and I are hitting Revy to ride the new resort trail on Saturday, then Sunpeaks Sunday.
Crossing fingers for no rain
well forecast for Revy on Saturday is an inch of rain!

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 8:30 Quote
jerome wrote:
d-man wrote:
The boy and I are hitting Revy to ride the new resort trail on Saturday, then Sunpeaks Sunday.
Crossing fingers for no rain
well forecast for Revy on Saturday is an inch of rain!
Shhhhhh man, don’t say that. Just cross your fingers.
Just keep coming to the star!

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 8:41 Quote
whitebirdfeathers wrote:
badbadleroybrown wrote:
whitebirdfeathers wrote:

It’s not a negative if the designer can achieve their desired outcome.
Given material properties, that's not possible. To attain equal stiffness requires greater material density and weight... to achieve equal compliance requires less material and compromise strength. To try and find a balance point between them requires material variability that increases costs and complexity of welding and manufacturing and negates cost benefits.

Carbon is a superior material, period. Anecdotes and preferences don't change that fact.

Do you follow the weight game thread in here? RMR, who is an engineer designing bikes, had an amazing post recently discussing these notions. I’ll find it and paste it here.

Here's what he posted. Wasn't exactly as I remembered it but still interesting:

The misconceptions about materials drive me nuts. You could build the stiffest bike in the world - or the most flexible - out of any material. Carbon is not inherently stiffer. There's been at least one recent example of a major manufacturer being a little embarrassed about their aluminum frame being stiffer than their carbon version - with minimal difference in weight.

Tires have inches of compliance. Suspension has half a foot. Bearings and bushings have flex and/or play. Your handlebar has nearly a centimeter of flex. The frame material barely qualifies as a drop in the bucket - and it could go either way, stiffer or softer. The material damping properties are pretty minor, too, in the frequency range that can make it past your tires and grips.

Examples of the doublethink surrounding carbon:

• Carbon frames are compliant and smooth; aluminum are harsh.
• Carbon frames are stiff and precise; aluminum are flexible and noodly.
• Carbon frames are strong, stiff, and last forever.
• Carbon frames and components are sketchy because they're prone to damage from rock strikes and crashes; aluminum are sketchy because they're weak and prone to fatigue.
• Carbon rims are more comfortable because they damp vibrations.
• Carbon rims are harsh; buy aluminum for comfort.
• Carbon bars are more comfortable because they damp vibrations.
• Carbon bars are harsh, buy aluminum for comfort.

In the history of cycling, there have been plenty of examples to support each of these statements - and plenty of counter-examples. Don't let anyone tell you all these statements can be simultaneously true due to differences in vibration attenuation and anisotropic material properties. I'll be the one to say it: the emperor has no clothes and carbon is not magic.

If someone tells you their carbon bike is soooo much stiffer and smoother than their aluminum bike, ask them:

• Did it cost three times as much?
• Is it loaded with top-shelf parts, compared to mediocre ones on the old bike?
• Was the old bike several years old and does equipment tend to get better year after year?
• Was the old bike's suspension several times past its service interval ... for the third time?
• Does the new bike have larger tires with softer rubber and more compliant casings?
• Is this the halo effect of your shiny new purchase?
• Would it end your marriage if you had to admit you spent ten grand and it's not much better than the old bike?

A frame made from high-end, nicely engineered carbon will be better than the equivalent in aluminum. I'm not denying that. I'm saying:

• The difference is a fraction of what it's made out to be.
• You'll get better return on investment by upgrading many other components before your frame, particularly springs & dampers, tires, grips, saddle, wheels.
• No material makes an inherently stiffer, smoother, stronger, etc. final product. That's a product of the design.
• Components made

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 8:50 Quote
I’d rather my bars bend than break.
For shit kicking and straight abuse I’m goin aluminum. My carbon AM bike is nice but I don’t smash the f*ck out of it like my glory.

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 11:58 Quote
I ran a 35mm clamp stem and a 35mm carbon bar on my bike for a year. I just swapped it out for 31.8mm alloy bar. Because the carbon was way too noodley. Much stiffer now. And quieter. That carbon bar talked all day long. Squeeking and creaking in the stem in the grips and even in the shifter clamps.

Posted: Sep 12, 2019 at 12:29 Quote
All materials have there merits. Steel, Aluminum, magnesium, Titanium Carbon fiber even Bamboo!
The idea is to maximise the material for its intended purpose. There is no ultimate material and its a fine line between stiffness, compliancy and longevity. personaly I love the hydroform shaping and welds of Aluminum. Carbon fiber gives the desighner unlimited control over shapes. Then the marketing guy says OMG it must be a pound lighter than the Al. frame. Which is a realy f*cking bad idea! What pisses me off the most is that each year the frames must change. So what was wrong with last years frame?
This is what forces me to buy bikes that are NOT the current model. I need proof from feedback of regular riders riding the bike. Generaly it takes six months to a year for the flaws to be revealed.
Cool that the bike industry realizes that Aluminum is here to stay. You can still buy exellent steel hard tails . Been thinking about building my own Bamboo frame for a gravel bike.
Im all about the latest teck but it has to work and last before im impressed.

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