Exclusive Look At The New 2011 Orange Five

 they peddle amazingly well for ANY bike let alone a single pivot, i would hihgly recommend one waki

 yup, but the problem I have is that this beauty here costs as much as Blur LT...

 Like the video says; geometry is key...

 I just love all these all-mountain rippers coming out. When I started getting real serious about mountain biking ten years ago, you had xc machines and DH machines. Now I can have my cake and eat it too. God bless us everyone.

 I was trying to tell it to everyone for like 5 years now...

 Waki, what makes you think single pivots are worse than multi link bikes? They have many more good things about them than multi link bikes... and if designed well, can ride just as good as any multi link bike.

Single pivot bikes have half the issues other bikes do. There is less points of failure, much LESS friction in suspension movement, as more bearings on multi link all add to friction. More bearings on multi link bikes means more bearings to go out, and need maintenance. Multi link bikes are generally more flexy than single pivot bikes due to more end points on the metal (each bolt adds a place of flex). In other words... it is actually more of a headache to go the multi pivot route. I have to say, outside of a select few multi link bikes like the canfields, I'm 100% single pivot now, and probably won't switch back.

Ever wonder why you rarely hear about single pivot peeps complaining about bad bearings, or needing replacement parts? They generally never do.

Also, companies like Tomac, with their new frames, have proven you can make one of the best riding bikes on the planet using only a single pivot design. Proven, reliable, and a great ride.

In other words... don't be afraid of single pivots. You won't be unhappy with the switch... but only if you get a decently designed single pivot (in which the Oranges have proven to be)

 I don't know why I thought that, it's just I am a techno freak you know. At the same time Santa Cruz makes one of the best linkage bikes along side of top 10 best single pivots: Heckler and Superlight and maybe Bullit (67 HA for 180 fork is a bit strange to me).

Well this Orange might speak to me if it's price gets well below the price of Blur LT2. If it was the price of SC Heckler, I wouldn't think twice. Right now Five is only slightly cheaper. Brits have some serious labour/manufacturing costs, they need more emigrants

 Best thing to do man, is try it out. When it comes down to it, its 100% rider pref.

There are also cons to look at single pivot bikes tho. Like others said, brake jack (but this in no way effects all frames and design), lack of plushness persay (you will see what I'm saying when you get on one). Single pivots will never have that bottomless plush feel a horst link etc will have. (Even comparing my old azonic frame, a giant faith, and my tomac, my tomac is the stiffest feeling linkage out of 3, even with a super light coil on the shock). It's a love/hate ordeal. Some people get off on that ultra plush ride of multi link, but some like something a bit more rigid that tracks pretty crazily well.

Definitely would never rule single pivots out. The "trendy" ones that dominate pink bike seem to be a plague. and hurt the simpler designs (everyone thinks stuff needs to be high tech to work well... in that case people need to put gear boxes on their bikes, and add every single possible thing they can think of too the frame to add to that cool factor

It almost seems like a pissing contest on who has the newest most expensive, most color matched, most technologically advanced bike[because we all know that vpp or fsr design is going to turn each of us into elite world cup racers. (makes me wonder how many guys on here actually have a family, or a girlfriend). Sad people have shed such a bad light on stuff that is pretty damn decent. I'm always pleasently surprised when I demo a single pivot that to me rides better than any of the multi link bikes on demo. Just reinforces the fact that sometimes simplicity is better for certain people. (hipsters need not apply... they can stick to their chick pants and fixies)

 Heh man, I have no chance to try out Orange Five. But good thing is, with bikes like these I am sure I get satisfaction guaranteed. Some bikes are like that: Nomad, Blur LT, Orange FIVE or 223, Sx Trail, Trek Remedy / Session 88, Banshee Spitfire, Intense SS and a few more.

And single pivots vs linkage heheh. I rode cousins Heckler and it's super fun, different but superfun. This year I will ride it much more and this will make me decide. Only thing that Nomad does great it feels almost like DH bike in the bike park, still being able to ride trails well. This is when I am getting affraid of getting a single pivot trail bike. Can it do that too? Can it still feel like a FR bike a bit? It's all in the skills, but mine are average, and I'm too deep into job and family life to improve that significantly

And yes I serviced my Nomad twice already, didn't have issues with the bearings but still to even grease the axles I hade one thought in the back of my head while doing that: f**ck that sh*t! I want a f* single pivot

 @DARKSTAR63: hi

 Lol, still a nice bike.

 Uhhh why change a good thing? All they'd do by changing stuff is take away from the "sweet spot" they have already found.

They didn't need to make changes in order to make the vid. Many people have never seen an in-depth look at orange bikes... so this is exactly what it was for. Less new product, more just looking into a good proven product the company has to offer.

 That is the most ignorant comment I have ever heard.

Also, do you really think it's the bike that puts these guys to the top? Man, you are so far off it's not even funny. Your 27 for god sakes... you should be ashamed of yourself.

It's the rider that wins races bro. Stop thinking bikes are the reason why people win world cups...

I bet you never realized, that companies like Santa Cruz have WAAAY bigger of a budget... which means they a : pay their pros more, b: provide their pros with almost everything they need, from nutritional / supplements, to weight training setups and workout gear and machines etc. So if anything, why people win on Santa Cruz, Specialized, Trek, Yeti etc is because of how much money they put into the pro they are sponsoring... which allows him to train harder, get stronger quicker, and be more consistent. The bike is the least changing in the variables of winning a cup. It's all about the support. I bet if you ask peaty... he would say he probably had a lot less of the support that he has now when he was on orange. Orange is a small company...


Canfield doesn't win world cups... does that mean the Canfield Jedi frames are bad? Avalanche doesn't win cups, does that mean the avy forks are bad? White brothers doesn't win cups... does that mean they are bad? I don't think you guys know how much it costs a company to support a top 3 ranked world champ. Probably more than most of you guys and your parents combined make in a year.

 I don't think you've ever posted a positive comment, cheer up a bit.

 me?

nothing neg about what I said

 You shouldn't be braking round corners anyway and generally all the braking is done on smooth sections because of the brake jack.

 Can't help it on some courses, especially those with no smooth sections. If my bike causes me to have to ride in a particular way to make up for its technical limitations, its not the bike for me. I'd rather have the choice of riding however i want.

 Geometry + Shock tuning can take care of the pedal bob, kickback no.

RP23's and DHX 5.0 Airs with their ProPedals help, a lot, shock tech has come long way past few years.

 Its a hardcore AM rig

 I raced a 224 for a season, struggled to get decent results on it.
Did better the next year on my Sunday, back to where I would expect to be.
Not racing this year (for obvious reasons for those who know me) so can't comment with results, not riding to shabby just now though on the same old Sunday :o)
Last weekend top 225 was Hutch in 14th, not sure where the top 224 was.
I think the Top 225 (now link activated) at Leogang was Thom Braithwaite in 26th, not sure, but did anyone race a 224 in the finals?

 lol, he's reverse downhilling

 its class might try it one day

 How does it cause the shock to work harder?

 When there is only one pivot point the shock works harder because it is directly affected by the terrain. When there are more pivot points, they help to alleviate some of the forces through displacement and allowing the shock to not have to directly absorb it all. More pivot points = a better feeling ride (in most cases). Why do you think all these bike companies continue to improve technology for multiple pivot point frames... it's not just a coincidence that single pivot frames are a dying breed.

 They do it because then they can create hype about it and tell you it does all the wonderful things. Also sp arnt a sying breed, Notice this year that santa cruz and lapierre who both run linkage bike have now got single poivots out too.

 That's actually not the reason manufacturers use mutiple pivots. Pivots do not absorb impact at all. All they do is manipulate the wheel path. All suspension systems are directly impacted by terrain. If you're talking about leverage ratios, that's not the case either. A shorter stroke shock will work harder than a longer stroke shock. Which means a multiple pivot bike like a v10 will work "harder" than a single pivot low leverage bike like a makulu. But that doesn't say one is better than the other. And as for single pivots being a dying breed... There actually seems to be a lot making their way onto the scene lately: morewood makulu, evil revolt, transition tr450, trek session 88...

 maveri 20! what are you on about!!! single pivot bikes are the easyest to maintain as there are far less bearings and linkages to go wrong. they are simple and work well, FACT

 it's simple physics, 1 point of pivot is going to have a lot more force applied to it than multiple pivots that spread the force between each point. there is also less brake jack, improved pedal efficiency, and less chain stretch with a multiple pivot frame than single. It might not be as responsive as a single pivot but for freeride/dh, it's the way to go. Single pivot is thrown around loosely, im speaking about only 1 moving point on the frame.

 It is simple physics if you break it down. Take two 8" travel bikes with 3" stroke shocks, one single-pivot and the other a multi-link system. In order to go through the entire travel, the shock must be displaced 3", right? Given that all other factors are identical (other than the linkage), the amount of "work" on the shock is exactly the same. If you're talking about the force put upon the pivots, then yes, it is distributed throughout each of the links. However, that does not affect the shock whatsoever. If you want to talk about maintenance of each of the pivots, sure, there is less stress per pivot because it is distributed, but on a single pivot bike, you can usually make the pivot much bigger (and therefore more durable). It can also mean the difference of replacing 2 bearings vs. 6 or 8. Responsiveness has more to do with leverage ration rather than suspension design. And I would rather have my suspension be more responsive for FR/DH.

 i see. well i learned something useful today. If single pivots work so well, why is the majority of frames multiple pivot? i'm still curious about that

 What I'm saying is... they're not... there's a lot of very effective single pivots on the market now. And many of them are new designs too.

 so which are the best(and most advanced) single pivot frames in the market right now?

 Well, I think that would be personal preference and experience... but some of the more popular ones would be Morewood Makulu (my own biased opinion), Yeti 303RDH, Evil Revolt, Commencal Supreme, Trek Session 88 (or any of the treks, for that matter), Empire AP1, any of the Foes models...

 so single pivot doesn't only pertain to one pivot point, it just means that it's pivoting in one direction versus a virtual pivot point which has more directions of pivot (v10)?

 hahaha! so after all this ridiculous comments, you don't even know what a single pivot is????

 @Maveri20: That is correct. It means there is only one pivot between the frame and the rear axel. Any other linkages/pivots outside of that (such as rocker links, for example) just manipulate the leverage of the shock.

 i'm just clarifying. manipulating the leverage of the shock increases pedal efficiency? is that the only benefit?

 Some linkages also adds stiffness to help with side load.

 Manipulating the leverage ratios can affect the very essence of how the bike feels, including pedaling efficiency. Designers can tune it so the bike is very plush at the beginning of the stroke to soak up all the small bumps and make it ramp up at the end of the travel to prevent bottom out. Or make it very linear throughout. It can mean the difference between making a fast "plow-through-everything" bike (like the makulu) or something stiffer that pops better over jumps like the 303RDH - and yet both of these bikes are 8" single pivots.

 cool stuff. i've actually learned a lot. thanks

 A longer stroke lower leverage designed shock will do these things : They are more sensitive to bumps etc, as there is more stroke in the shock, they don't heat up as fast, which in return, makes them more consistent working for longer periods of time, they are capable of larger more violent impacts due to the amount of fluid in the shock (back to the heat element). These are the main reasons companies like Foes/Curnett do so well with the 2:1 leverage shocks. They are ultra consistent on gnarly runs... day in and day out. Maintainance is less being there is more oil, which generally allows for greater intervals btw services. Best thing to do to understand about shocks, is start researching off road shocks, pre runner shocks etc. That is generally the reason people like me run a WAY longer stroke shock on our trucks than were supposed to... they all around work better, for longer.