Eurobike 2013 - Day One at the Outdoor Expo

Aug 27, 2013
by Richard Cunningham  

Day one at Eurobike is outdoor only, and if it is any hint of what we can expect to see in the mighty halls of the largest bike show on earth, diversity is the word to explain it. Page down and enjoy the first of many reports, as Pinkbike plies the aisles of Eurobike.

The 18-speed Pinion gearbox now exceeds the gear range of SRAM s XX1 and X01 elven speed transmissions

Pinion had their 18-speed gearbox on a number of bikes at the expo's demo area. One transmission was opened up so guests could hand-crank it and shift through the range. The twist shifter feels much improved.



Nicolai with Gates Carbon Drive and Pinion 18 speed gearbox

Nicolai had a range of demo bikes featuring the Pinion transmission. Nicolai's 27.5-inch-wheel hardtail had a Gates Carbon Drive cog-belt system, which was very promising for those who are in search of a low-maintenance mountain bike.



Nicolai Gates Carbon Drive and 18-speed Pinion Gearbox

The left rear dropout must be removable to allow its owner to change out the belt. Note that the belt has a central groove that lines up with a 'fin' in the sprockets to maintain proper alignment. Nicolai's beautiful dropouts require belt tensioners - like a single-speed drivetrain - but the gearbox-equipped bike has seven more gear options that SRAM's XX1 derailleur-based transmission.



Nicolai

The 160-millimeter all-mountain/enduro model is chain driven and includes a short idler near the crankset to control chain growth as the suspension cycles. Weight is around 30 pounds and it features a RockShox Pike fork and Monarch reservoir shock.



Nicolai also had a chain-driven 16-millimeter-travel AM Enduro racer with the Pinion 18-speed drivetrain - yes it had 27.5-inch wheels too.

Details of the Nicolai show the adjustable 12/142 millimeter dropouts, the ball-bearing chain guide, and its four-bar rear suspension configuration. The gearbox is well integrated into the chassis and the fact that the sprocket diameters never change, means that chain tension will not affect the suspension differently as its rider shifts through the gears.



Schwalbe s First Ride tire program is only available to members of its hand-picked prototype testing group. All tires in the program have blue stripes or graphics.

Schwalbe's First Ride tire program is only available to its sponsored pro racers and hand-picked members of its prototype testing group. All tires in the program have blue stripes or graphics - like this Magic Mary enduro racing tire.



Three out of fur men wore spandex

Oh my. You know you are in Europe when three out of four of your friends show up in Spandex - the very same Spandex.



Nuke Proof Mega AM 27.5

Nukeproof redesigned its 160-millimeter-travel Mega AM range for 27.5 wheels and announced that it will not be offering 26 inch wheels on any of its built-up bikes for 2014 across the board. Diehard 26er users, however, will be able to purchase Mega AM frames in the 26-inch wheel version - and Nukeproof's DH models will remain 26ers, um, for the time being, they tell us. The Mega AM Pro shown here will run $5149 USD and frames will cost $2339 for either the 27.5 or 26-inch-wheel options.



Nuke Proof Mega AM 27.5 details

Nukeproof specs the Mega AM with a SRAM X9 drivetrain and matching Avid brakes. No reason comes to mind why they chose a tall 36-tooth chainring for its two-by-ten transmission We'd rather see a 32-tooth sprocket up front. A look at the Mega AM's single-pivot rear suspension suggests that it is capable of taking a beating without suffering in the least. Suspension is led by the wonderful and new RockShox Pike fork and completed by a Monarch reservoir shock.



The Vivax elevtric helper motor is concealed in the frame s seat tube - where is it at the ready to give you pro cross-country climbing power to add to your bar-hopping social networking skills

The Vivax electric helper motor is concealed in the frame's seat tube - where is it at the ready to give you pro cross-country climbing power to crush your racer-boy buddies without subtracting from your finely-tuned bar-hopping and social networking skills. A bevel gear transfers torque from the silent-running gear-driven motor, to a standard SRAM or Shimano bottom bracket axle. The compact battery can be strapped below the saddle, or hidden discretely in a hydration pack for UCI World Cup competition.



Oretma protection looks like nothing we have seen lately. The neck supports are very compact

Ortema protection looks like nothing we have seen as of late. The neck supports appear to be very compact and the armored vests is designed to fit close to the body so you won't look like a Marvel Comic character in the lift line. We did wonder, however, if the ping pong ball padding on the knees would pop like packing material when we crashed. We will report back later.



KS has perfected its carbon fiber short-stroke dropper post. The Carbon LEV Integre hzs a 65-millimeter stroke and a 579 USD retail price. Weight is reported at 400 grams.

KS has perfected its carbon fiber short-stroke dropper post. The Carbon LEV Integre has a 65-millimeter stroke, internal cable routing and a $579 USD retail price tag. For trail riders who most often ride with their long-stroke droppers in the mid position, the LEV Integre offers more reliable and repeatable performance at a lower weight - reportedly, 400 grams.



You know you are in Europe when you. see how hard clothing makers try to bring spandex into the mainstream. Xbionic clothing is designed to make riders sweat early and thus keep cooler. Yeah right.

You know you are in Europe when you - see how hard clothing makers try to keep spandex in the mainstream. Xbionic clothing is designed to make riders sweat early and thus keep cooler. The colors, cuts and compression panels are vintage Star Trek.



Three massively capable tires from Continental Der Kaiser 2.5-inch and Der Kaiser Projekt 2.4 inch DH tires and the er Baron mud spike are poven World Cup performers.

Three massively capable tires from Continental: Der Kaiser 2.5-inch and Der Kaiser Projekt 2.4 inch DH tires and the Der Baron mud spike are proven World Cup performers. Continental is showing up everywhere on elite brands next season.



You know you are in Germany when an electric bike maker features a revolutionary human powered version without any form of mechanical assistance. Will Europe be ready to adopt this new technology

You know you are in Germany when a custom electric bike maker introduces a revolutionary human-powered version without any form of mechanical assistance. Will Europe be ready to adopt this new technology? Seriously, 3-Element builds a range of e-boosted city and trailbikes, as well as pedal-powered models. The E-Spire 29er here appears to be reverse compatible to its electric drive system.



Crankbrothers gave away pedals to Demo riders all day. Test them and keep them.

As a matter of fact, our pedals do grow on trees. Crankbrothers gave away Candy and Eggbeater pedals to Demo riders all day. All you needed to do was test ride the pedals and they were yours. Sweet deal.



Scott i-Spark Bosh assist motor power control Shimano Deore X transmission and Fox dual-travel Nude shock.

Blasphemy? By far, the most popular bike at the Scott demo was this one - an electrified Spark XC dual-suspension machine adapted to the new Bosch electric-assist motor called the i-Spark. It has everything its XC racing sibling has, including a handlebar-remote, travel-adjustable Fox-made 'Nude' shock.



Scott i-Spark Bosh assist motor power control Shimano Deore X transmission and Fox dual-travel Nude shock.

The left-side grip sports an electric control for the Bosch motor-drive.The cranks are over-driven with internal gears that power a Shimano XT derailleur transmission. The rear suspension is the same as its human-powered sibling. With the interest we witnessed at the expo, we expect the i-Spark will sell out before it is shipped to dealers throughout Europe.





150 Comments

  • 141 0
 An electric xc bike doesn't make too much sense but thats just me.
  • 78 3
 Would I get penalized for using it for shuttling?
  • 14 25
flag rumblefish255 (Aug 27, 2013 at 22:52) (Below Threshold)
 Now what makes sense is to use one of those to get back up to the top of the mountain for DH runs! No more walking...wait a second how much does it cost. crap there goes that idea! oh well back to walkin.
  • 4 3
 there's reason to shuttle in XC too. Think point to point rides (traverses, or DH's) accessed by boring logging roads. Beats having to shuttle and retrieve a vehicle.
  • 3 1
 Anyone know the pricing on the Ortema gear, it sure would be nice to find a neck brace that doesn't cost 4 paychecks to get. Also I like the idea of slimmer pads, the main reason I don't wear full suits of padding is cause they're bulky and are really uncomfortable.
  • 15 1
 electric bikes are good for people with physical disabilitys that mean they are not able to power on up the hills at the same rate as everyone else as it will double ifnot more the amount of power they put down, however for anyone else they are a terrible waste of money. That's the ways I sells them and that's the way I sees them!
  • 20 0
 At the Scottish youth XC training sessions one of the coaches has an electric bike that he uses to keep pace with the fast guys while shouting tips/encouragement/abuse. That's pretty much the best use I've seen for them.
  • 30 1
 An electric xc bike is fantastic thing! OK, I don't need it and I would never buy it for myself, but I plan to get one for my wife. Why? Quality time! Big Grin I would rather make 50+ km xc ride on Saturday morning whitout waiting for her on every climb than walking through city center and waiting for her in front of every store with shoes. Wink
  • 5 0
 Seeing all the belt drives first kind of made the regular bikes look dated... Oh-my, I feel strange.
  • 4 6
 its probably the most useless thing to be ever invented
  • 6 1
 my respect for scott just plummeted when i saw that picture.
  • 11 0
 I thought the whole idea behind XC was to pedal !?!
  • 3 4
 Few years ago I've been regulary told off and called a hater for btchn on electric city bikes. I've been told by bike shop emplyees that these bikes are perfect for old peopleand those with disabilities. Can someone tell me why in most cases I see those bikes ridden by perfectly healthy and not always fat, young guys and girls between 30-40? Because the majority of people buying them are who? Lazy people, who don't give a sht.
  • 1 0
 my knees will be so grateful, and i could back ride again Wink
  • 2 1
 But does it come in 650b Cause if not i'm out..
  • 68 13
 I really look forward to see Pinkbike (same thing for Vital...) grow up a tiny bit and not gratify us with that sort of ridiculous comment:
"Oh my. You know you are in Europe when three out of four of your friends show up in Spandex - the very same Spandex"

Firstly you are confusing Germany with Europe (but well, that's all remote for you so....)

Second, each time I went to North America I have seen the same ridiculous things (and I found it even more frequently!) you're making fun of. Strangely enough you don't seem to see that!

Now it's like when we hear the riders talking about muddy Europe... It's like I'd go to SoCal and claim north america is dry. PNW anyone?

I know I'll get neg propped so much that my message will vanish soon... nevermind.
  • 14 13
 Hehe, what can Richard know, he lives in Vancouver Alaska close to Quebec and they speak Belgian there. However I liked the comment on electric bike company releasing human powered version.
  • 12 4
 I live in the EU, and the comments RC writes makes me smile, they are just lighthearted observations. Take it easy bro.
  • 20 11
 @WAKI what? Sorry to be a nit-picker Vancouver isn't in Alaska or close to Quebec and Belgian isn't even a language...
  • 10 0
 Don't call him bro!!!!!
  • 7 9
 Aaah Jackclark - it came out now! What a cunning provocation I made there! you think that you Frenchie guys still hold the rights to the country, aye?
  • 1 0
 Enduro,
have you ever been to Lake Garda ?
  • 3 1
 Yes. Did you realize most bikers are german? No, nothing against germany and german people but as you seem to mean "I've seen the same weird stuffs in Lake Garda"...

@WAKI: be cautious with flags, it's not necessarily ournationality. As a French I can tell you you're story about holding rights is far from reality. I know, it was just provocative, just saying.

Anyway, back to bike and Eurobike new stuffs!
  • 3 0
 I'm sure EnduroManiac can spot my 'not-Frenchness' a mile (or a kilometer) off! Wink
  • 5 1
 These comments are just for fun, they are there just for the stereotype's sake. For example: cdn.ebaumsworld.com/picture/lafavinator/EuropevsAmerica.png

Salute
  • 1 1
 i have grown up and lived in the PWN all my life. eastside washington to be specfic. we get 60-80 days of sun a year. you think i care if you make fun of my mud...got dirt? get dirty!!
  • 2 0
 I didn't make fun if it, and would love to go ride there actually!
  • 28 5
 Looks like some intelligent people feel the same way I do about the archaic rear derailleur and are doing something about it. Some who want to delay progress say Kill the front mech, but that's the wrong attitude. Kill both mech's! I hope the rear derailleur i just ordered to replace the last one bent in a crash is my last.
  • 17 2
 I want Protour's autograph...
  • 6 0
 I've broken 2 this year, and I think we're getting close. 30lbs for a 160mm is right on the money...
  • 3 4
 I like my rear derrailleur, and i like the noise it do when it's hitting (eating) rocks
Also, a derrailleur is easy to repair/change and "cheap" whereas a gearbox will be shitty and expensive to change (because bike industry is not going to make something that works for bike lifetime...)
  • 9 4
 Protour - Several bikes with Pinion gearbox are on the market since some time, few look really good and have proper geometries. They so come in various wheel sizes. There's also Zerode. Why haven't you bought one yet?
  • 3 0
 @zede, how often do you change the gear box in your car? Of course when they will make it so it lasts a life time. Its a sealed unit so there is no reason it wont last. A gear box is much much much more reliable than a derailleur.
  • 3 0
 They said that about sturmy archers
  • 2 0
 My late-70s raleigh grifter has a sturmey archer 3 speed, and it's still running just fine thanks mega-turtle.
  • 6 1
 Protour - I couldn't agree with you more.

Last week I was left 10 miles from home with 1 gear when my rear mech cable snapped. Ride ruined.

The derailleur is a relic from the past and this 11 speed stuff is a total joke. If someone told me that 5 years ago that I would pay more in 2013 to have 11 gears than I would to have 27 gears I would have said that they were crazy. Why would I pay more for less?

If SRAM and Shimano were smart they would either develop their own system or buy up Pinion and use theirs.
  • 4 1
 protour for president! huzzah for pinion bikes
  • 2 0
 The Nicolai looks awesome, if I wanted a new frame, I'd seriously consider it.
  • 8 0
 Hey guys, remember Mike Levy's blog about gearboxes being dead? I sure hope to read a review on the all new Sram gearbox, or Shimano gearbox, and how gearboxes are taking over the market, written by the fool himself!
  • 2 1
 Too bad gearboxes are terribly inefficient compared to chains and rings (even dirty ones). It would be nice to see them more widespread but they're a way off stil. SRAM couldn't even get a 2 speed gearbox to be efficient and light.
  • 2 3
 Yep, gearboxes suck so much every single car, truck, motorcycle, mechanical machine, and so on uses derailleurs...
  • 2 0
 @Caiokv, yes, they're used all over the place because they're durable, compact, and relatively low maintenance compared to a chain drive system but they're definitely not efficient. No engineer will choose a gearbox over a chain drive when concerned with efficiency, weight, and cost. Just in case you missed it along the way, we're concerned with efficiency, weight and cost of our bikes.
  • 1 2
 The cost argument doesn't work. If you have a DH bike and keep it for 2 years of hard riding you are likely to break anywhere from 0-5 derailleurs. If you are on the wrong side of that equation, that's €400 for a decent replacement probably lower spec than what it came with. Also, hangers aren't cheap for a lot of bikes so that could be another €100. Cables need to be replaced about 4 times in that period so another €60. You'll probably have to change your chain/cassette so another €120 for a decent one. Derailleur bikes are not cheaper. Maybe first day they are but that ignores all day to day running costs. That's nearly €700 in mainenence over 2 years.

Not to mind all the fiddling about gears can take to get right in wet conditions and if you ride where I ride you will spend a lot more than that because of the weather. I go through 2 cassettes a winter.

Your efficiency argument doesn't hold up either, the full suspension bike is still chain driven, the ratio is just decided by the gears. There is no loss in efficiency.
  • 5 0
 Re: gearboxes on "car, truck, motorcycle, mechanical machine" - I think all of those generate a lot more power than a cyclist.
  • 2 1
 Also, as regards weight. Yes some gearbox bikes like zeroed are slightly heavier but they also have the weight in a far, far and ill say it again FAR better place than having a rear derailleur and cassette on the back of a bike.
  • 3 1
 If you think a gearbox doesn't add drag and reduce efficiency, as a thought exercise you should really try pedalling a Hammerschmidt in overdrive and reconsider your opinion.
  • 2 1
 There is some inconsistency going on here. If online trolls and geeks were really into gearboxes, the owner of Pinion as well as guys from Zerode would be on the main page of Forbes... But they aren't because same people btchn on rear mechs buy bikes equipped with drive trains with rear mechs. Then pushed to the wall with that some might say: I'll buy them when they are more affordable and developed - how exactly can that happen if so few people buy them?

Oh, it's the old case of: somebody should do something while I state demands and don't do sht
  • 2 0
 @Caiokv..........The average car/truck loses about 25% of the engine power getting that power to the ground through transmission and rear differential/ring and pinion. Would you consider it acceptable to lose 25 percent of the power you put into the pedals. Heck I would consider 10% loss unacceptable for anything other than shuttle runs. I would like to see some data on how much power is lost in a bicycle gear box but you won't see that kind of info coming from the people that make the things. I agree derailleurs are too fragile and would drop some serious money on gearbox bike.......if it was efficient and it is MUCH less efficient than a derailleur set up.
  • 2 1
 @bogey: Sorry, but if you are an Engineer I believe you should review your degree.

@lucdukeTX: I haven't seen many a bike with differential systems, it is not really like they would need one, and the whole transmission system used on cars is different from the bike's system I do believe you know that bit right?

So let's take a look on a bike gearbox:

-2 shafts
-one pair of gears coupled, while the other ones just freely spin

So what do we have?

4 bearings, and one pair of gears.

Total loss sums to:

0,97^(n) x 0,98^(n+1) (0,97 for the coupled gears and 0,98 for the bearing pair)

Being that n = number of coupled gears

So:

0,97 x 0,98² = 0,931%

That means we have a total loss value of ALMOST 7%.

All values were obtained from "Egrenagens, Stipkovic Filho, Marco" 3rd edition, Publisher: Printon
  • 1 2
 @Caiokv, a 7% loss is called brutal efficiency and you also haven't taken into account one other very important part of a gearbox. Guess what it is? Hmmm I bet you don't know.

So guess what, losing 10+ percent is totally unacceptable to anyone. Even a 7% loss it is like riding with your brakes dragging. I've ridden gearbox bikes and they're awful to ride because of this, not to mention the 7-12 lbs hanging around the bb. There is a reason you don't see any around (hint - it isn't the high cost that drives us away)

So why should I review my degree? You haven't told me yet.
  • 1 1
 @bogey

I have taken every internal aspect of a gearbox in consideration, every other singularity will be an external item, and will be needed for a derailleur system or for a gear box system.
The derailleur system has it's losses also, even more when clogged with dirt and old lube, if any.

And I truly believe you should review some concepts, because chains are not a gearbox substitute and you really should know that, if you are an engineer. Gearboxes are usually connected directly to the power source shaft, and the outer shaft ends on a belt pulley, not a chain. I am not saying chains are not used, of course they are, but they are far from being a better solution. When true engineers need a lighter solution they use an epicyclic gearing system in order to have the best weight/reliability possible.

Just so, how many systems actually use chain INSTEAD of a gearbox, or a simple pair of gears, or a belt?

About the extra weight I believe you haven't paid enough attention to the recent Pinkbike articles, because there are 14 Kg bikes around, and if I am not mistaken it is an Enduro bike, with it's 160 mm of travel, witch is actually a great weight, since conventional (by conventional I mean a $ 5.000,00 bike with a derailleur system) Enduro bikes are around 12 Kg.
  • 1 0
 @Caiokv, you're still missing a big factor in gearbox design. Your inexperience is showing through but keep trying and think about it some more. Hint, there are more than just 2 bearings and gears in any gearbox.

So now you want to connect the gearbox to a drive shaft and lose a bunch more efficiency?! BTW, belts mostly suck in true industrial environments where there are contaminants. Believe me, I've been doing industrial machine design for many years and have never had to be concerned with the weight of the gearbox, drive shafts, or sprockets (unlike a system on a bicycle). As I've mentioned any times, they are inefficient compared to a derailleur system, heavy and costly. Not a winning combination except for someone who simply wants a gearbox bike because he thinks it s cool.

BTW, 14 kgs sucks for a high end bike weight unless it is DH bike (with a derailleur system of course because you won't get there with a gearbox).
  • 3 0
 I must say that you two made better work here than Levy in his article. He sparked an interesting discussion back then but @bogey, you nailed it, however I don't think 14kg is much for a high end, aluminium 6" bike as long as that added 1kg sits around BB.

It was a Good read - cheers
  • 2 0
 14kg is not bad at all for a 160mm bike. The lightest xx1 equipped enduro bikes are around 12.5kg. The average bike in that category will be around 13-14kg. And as has been stated it is a lot better to have that weight around the BB than it is having it hanging off the back where is is unsprung.
  • 1 0
 @Bogey, I see you got really attached to my lack of experience, so I decided to step up and ask my professors at Mackenzie University about the use of chains and belts on industrial and machinery environment, and guess what? According to three of my teachers, all of them Masters in Mechanical Engineering, with at least 30 years on the market each, agreed that chains are only a good solution when slipping is an issue, and the axles distance is too long for a geared coupling, otherwise a belt would be a good solution, but still direct mounted axles and hydraulic coupling are the better option. I am really curious about your industrial machinery design, could you share some of it? My professors would appreciate to see your chain drive system applied and running.

And I don't know what bike you ride, but 14 Kg is a great weight for an Enduro bike, like samsemtex agreed above. Also I would like to see a DH bike with 14 Kg out of the world champs, it would be quite expensive to get such a set up.

About the gearbox, it has 4 bearings, 2 pairs. And the other gears are not engaged so they will not have a significant drag, and the coupling system also won't interfere, so be so kind and guide me throughout how a gearbox loss must be calculated, please.

And no, I do not want a gearbox just because it looks cool, actually I consider them rather ugly, but extremely functional and reliable, and that's why I do believe they will eventually become popular on mountain bikes.

Also I see nothing I say will be enough to convince you gearboxes are worth the extra loss, so whatever, you have your opinion, I have mine,and it was a good discussion after all.

Caio
  • 1 0
 Caiokv, I wasent going to get involved in this childish debate, but just wanted to point out that in a constant-mesh gearbox, one of each pair of gears will be running on needle roller bearings. obviously not a massive sourse of friction, but a gearbox will contain way more than 4 bearings, among other bushings and such
  • 12 1
 Good on pinion for trying to solve the derailleur problem. 18 gears is overkill, ISIS Drive is a load & the suspension pivot should be around the BB so there's no need for a tensioner, but still a clean & durable looking system. That HT is the cat's ass.
  • 3 1
 Get shafted, drop the chain altogether.
  • 1 1
 Oops, not sure if that is ISIS Drive or not, I don't follow this shit like I used to, but it looks like Pinion's crank uses pinch bolts so, looks pretty solid all around. Automotive transmission guys = long awaited win for the bicycle industry!!!!
  • 6 2
 Oh & f*ck Shimano/SRAM. That's all.
  • 2 4
 They should both quit right now while their ahead.
  • 5 1
 I would swap out my all the derailleurs i have, to get just one gearbox, it's such a better system.
  • 2 0
 You guys should check out the rohloff system produced decades ago. Was absolutely bombproof since they never had a gearbox failure (at the time I was using one on a cove g-spot w/ a bb centric pivot), though they never really caught on due to cost and were significantly heavier than the conventional derailleur system. Shimano also produced an 8 speed gearhub ages ago too, that never caught on either.
  • 3 0
 that's because half the benefit is in moving all that weight to the BB area and having a lighter unsprung axle weight for the suspension. there will always be chain growth to deal with in a four-bar design. i would like to see one of the VPP boys like Intense use one
  • 3 4
 How great Pinion does it oooh yes! But none of us here will actualy buy it
  • 3 0
 I do hope gearboxes become popular soon! Derailleurs are useful and all, but are far from being good enough!
  • 2 0
 There is already one Nicolai with Pinion in Bielsko-Biala Wink
  • 2 1
 Never had a problem with derailleurs. Gearbox would be useless to me. Expensive too.
  • 2 0
 "gearboxes are gonna take off any day now" - lotsa people, 10 years ago
  • 8 1
 Ahhhhh the twist shift still on the Nicolai...... How I would care so much more about that company if they just GOT RID OF THAT THING WTF?!?!?!?!??!!? Its been like 10 years now what is up?!
  • 2 0
 The gearbox needs to have tension to shift in both directions, so a regular thumb shifter wouldn't work.
  • 1 0
 i know how it works but they could catch some attention if they made a trigger shift work. a number of companies have made triggers work with gearboxes, nicolai has some futuristic aspects on their bikes but they are still stuck in the past with the dumb twist shift.
  • 1 0
 I have 10speed twist shift on my enduro bike, and everyone that has given it an honest go has loved it. I'll never go back to trigger shifters
  • 1 0
 Im not going to drop $90+ on a twist shift unless I can try it first, and when would I ever get an opportunity to try?
  • 7 1
 Electric bikes, spandex, 27.5inch bikes...Some in the Bike industry want to watch the world burn... Though this gearbox is pretty sweet! I mean they've done a lot of improvement in this segment, to make it lighter, more compact, and better looking! Well done, that fits perfectly on Nicolai bikes!
  • 5 0
 Oh dear! An electric bike just entirely defeats the whole point of a pedal cycle, we sit around wondering why there are so many obese people on this planet and yet oxymorons such as electric push bikes and 'diet' coke still exist!? If its too hard to pedal, try harder and get fitter! Oh and $580 for a seat post seems reasonable pfft! - did people just forget how to raise and lower a seat recently or what? ...rant over! [sigh]

I really hope those gearboxes catch on soon, they look so clean and neat, they just need a trigger shifter to be a success... or maybe just make them automatic...
  • 2 0
 "did people just forget how to raise and lower a seat"

Believe it or not, I did. And it only took about 5 months of riding with a dropper post. Plus if you have a remote, it's even one level up - maybe not for XC, but for trail riding it's one of the best inventions of the last decade.
  • 1 0
 I got 125mm reverb on my Reign and it works like a charm for 2 years. Bought it new for 300$. This 65mm KS is a joke. You can always put on the enduro collar that comes with Reverb and tune the travel to your liking.
  • 4 0
 I have to defend the spandex-boys!! Even though it’s not aesthetically pleasing....

Recently, on a trip through Germany I came through Kassel, where those guys are running a bikeshop. My Specialized dropper post had just blown to pieces. I found their shop, and they even had a Specialized representative just visiting them.
The Specialized guy saw my problem and was about to convince me that I had to send in the seatpost, having it checked out and so on.
So those guys just took a new post out of another model, gave it to me. They gave the broken post to the Specialized guy, telling him: "look at that young man, he needs to RIDE! deal with that seatpost for yourself".

So - in my opinion they are the only guys allowed to wear those outfits Smile
  • 7 4
 i wish the "Bicycle" industry would wake up and realise what damage electric bikes will do. crazy!!!

The definition of a bicycle - a vehicle with two wheels in tandem, propelled by pedals connected to the rear wheel by a chain, and having handlebars for steering and a saddle like seat.
and

bicycle (ˈbaɪsɪk ə l)

— n
1. cycle , Often shortened to: bike a vehicle with a tubular metal frame mounted on two spoked wheels, one behind the other. The rider sits on a saddle, propels the vehicle by means of pedals that drive the rear wheel through a chain, and steers with handlebars on the front wheel.

Electric bikes are NOT BICYCLES!!!
  • 13 4
 By damage you must mean: letting people who normally would not be able to enjoy riding because of age, medical condition or otherwise get out on a bike.

I think it has its place.
  • 1 0
 Shit.... The definitions rule out so many so called "bicycles" these days... Don't tell that belt driven Nicolai or Intense cycles which don't use tubular construction!
A closed minded world where things don't evolve is so much simpler and safer, but it makes me rage at strangers on the Internet when people suggest change and new ideas!
  • 5 1
 It's not a bicycle if it's not human powered without assist from any sort of motor.
  • 3 0
 Your definitions are already outdated. What about monocoque frames (instead of tubular), belt drives (instead of chain), and trials bikes without saddles...

yeah I can see as these things become more popular there will be changes. Will they ruin trails like a real motor bike? scare horses/hikers? lead a bunch of joeys in over their heads (breakdowns, etc..)? Some trails aren't meant to handle a large volume of rider laps, will this bring those numbers over the top? I think they open up a potential for some interesting riding in remote areas. Just motor across the boring roads to get to the alpine singletrack goods! and try not to breakdown!

but I'm not a fan of the whole "letting people who could not normally ride" argument. Usually that is abused by FATTIES, see elevators, handicap parking spots, courteousy scooters, etc..
  • 1 1
 Your fatties arguement left out the end result of all the other abuses: food, usually fast.

Trails rarely have any food outside of the berry bush.
  • 4 1
 BI CYCLE literally means TWO WHEELS. Nothing more, nothing less.
  • 1 0
 Brb taking my (imaginary) R1 on the TDF, since it has two wheels.
  • 1 0
 @ dbaser,
is that classed as shuttleing?
  • 6 0
 I will give up mountain biking the day any of those electric motors make it onto a trail. Its just not right.
  • 3 1
 You won't do it.
  • 10 4
 electric mountain bike? really Scott? That has to be the gayest thing you guys have ever made!
  • 2 0
 CyclingIsNotForLazipeople!
  • 4 0
 I see mtb going electric in the near future. The fact is, there are enough lazy people in the sport for manufactures to seriously entertain the idea.
It's funny how a sport with "mountain" in it, is so full panty waists.
  • 2 0
 speaking of which, I'll bet fabian barel was running one at crankworx last month...
  • 2 0
 That Vivax thing looks like the crazy setup that the Fabian Cancellara haters were trying to propose, saying he was using 'mechanical doping' to drop the sh*t out of Tom Boonen in that one Classics race. They even had 'video' of him pressing a button on the handlebars and then riding them off his wheel.
  • 1 0
 yeah the UCI is already on top of that. they were X-raying bikes!
  • 2 0
 Take every godda#ned electirc assist bike and its blueprint and throw them in a garbage crusher and destroy them. Bikes are for self-propulsion, not for lazy fat idiots to dumb down into a new battery powered wheeled couch. If you're too da*ned lazy to pedal, take up monster trucking or watching Nascar while stuffing your face with cheeseburgers and milkshakes. Motorized bicycles are an abomination, and are an affront to everything that cycling stands for.
  • 4 0
 maybe just me, but $575 seems a little steep for a dropper even though its carbon...but damn 400 grams!!!!
  • 1 0
 Good call.
  • 1 0
 it may get the xc crowd more interested, something that holds them back at the moment is the height they need their saddles at, if they could reduce their saddly height, they might gains more time on the downhills....
  • 1 0
 It's funny, if an AM rider showed up to ride with a rigid carbon post he might be thought of as old fashioned. But my mate who isn't that confident technically fitted a reverb for the national XC round at Hadleigh Farm and we all took the piss (not in a nasty way mind)! I did say though that if a sub 400g dropper was available I might consider it, so time to start saving!
  • 1 0
 'For trail riders who most often ride with their long-stroke droppers in the mid position' uhh???
  • 5 0
 Electric XC Bike.. BLASPHEMY 100%!!!!
  • 1 0
 "Nukeproof redesigned its 160-millimeter-travel Mega AM range for 27.5 wheels and announced that it will not be offering 26 inch wheels on any of its built-up bikes for 2014 across the board. Diehard 26er users, however, will be able to purchase Mega AM frames in the 26-inch wheel version - and Nukeproof's DH models will remain 26ers, um, for the time being, they tell us. The Mega AM Pro shown here will run $5149 USD and frames will cost $2339 for either the 27.5 or 26-inch-wheel options."

Hopefully I'm being a bit daft, but does this read as I think it does? You can't buy 26" wheels across the board, though you can on DH and the AM? It might be just because its 6am, though it doesn't make sense...
  • 2 0
 All the nukeproof full BIKES for 2014 except the dh bikes will be 27.5, you can get the mega am as frame only for 26 inch as well as 27.5. That's what I got from the quoted text.
  • 3 0
 Rather see a 32 upfront? I suppose it depends where you ride? But also as you have the granny ring why wouldn't you push for the taller 36 on 2x10?
  • 1 0
 Electric hardcore XC? not going to happen! The people who buy electric modes of transport are tight, fat & lazy normally (unless injured) and will not be spending thousands on one. Also they wouldn't know what to do with it!
  • 1 0
 I am wanting to make a retrofitting system for a zerode style gearbox. I'm thinking I'll make it compatible to bikes with high mounted horizontal shocks (Like my wife's jamis dakar) sitting above the bottom bracket. I want it to take a belt from the crank ring to the box, and a chain from there. I'll have to use a tensioner: maybe a derailleur cage mounted on the front triangle like the nicolai?
I can't really afford to make this, but I just really want gearboxes to be the future!
  • 1 0
 If you do this thé bike won't pedal well anymore... it's a good idea for a hardtail.
  • 1 0
 You just stated the problem with all gearboxes. Anyone who is pro-gearbox has already accepted that loss. I just wonder if it is that much worse than fat tires and long suspension. Making my own would be cheaper than buying one and i could find out for myself.
  • 1 0
 zerode or pinion equiped bikes don't have this problem, cause the pivot is well located. If you put a gearbox hub higher than the bb on a standard bike, you'll have your chain pulling on the rear suspension, and have an huge amount of energy loss.
  • 1 0
 That does depend on pivot placement. On a single pivot the axle moves up and, in the case of most bikes, towards the seat tube. That means the chain would grow slack, except for the derailleur cage keeping it tight, the same way it always does. With the chain coming from higher it might grow slacker, but the net would be pretty small considering placement and cage tension.
  • 1 0
 "sigh" Why is it that you need an engineering degree just to ride one of Scott's bikes? Sorry, but I like to ride, not spend all day pissing about with my adjustments on the trail. They make decent bikes, but complicated much?
  • 1 0
 Electric motor is cool, HOWEVER, that makes it a motorized vehicle. So when the ranger sees you blazing the trails on it, then its ticket time.On the concept, I agree with the guy who says get one for the wife, only if she'd pin it to keep up! Motor on a DH rig, one bike does all? Yikes! Can you say KTM, CRF, YZF.... Like that gear box program. Put some ti gears in that sucker...I want one.
  • 4 0
 Keep the motors on commuter bikes, please.
  • 7 0
 Keep the motors on motorbikes!
  • 4 0
 Lovin the sarcasm on the Vivax electric motor!
  • 3 0
 That E-spire bike kind of made me puke up my own ass. What an atrocity. The scott isn't far off either.
  • 1 0
 I was wondering where my FIRST RIDE tires came from, think Schwalbe will just send me a bunch for free. Ripped the tread complettly off a set of racing ralphs in 25kms. Customer service here i come.
  • 1 0
 So on that full suspension they removed the rear derailleur...but that chain tensioner sure looks vulnerable. I keep a bash guard there for a reason. Remove one potential failure point and add another?
  • 1 0
 That red Nicolai looks pretty legit, not sure about the belt driven one though. Also I hope the Xbionic spandex gear makes it over to 'Murica, I could use a good laugh.
  • 1 0
 If spandex didn't have that awful ass seam almost all the time, I would definitely buy it to keep cool down here. Because looking cool is more important than being cool. oh yeah!
  • 2 0
 Free CrankBro pedals for demo riders...So how many bike did you demo? Fancy sending me one of those sets of pedals? Wink
  • 11 0
 you need more than one, it's crankbros
  • 2 3
 Is it just me or CB feels like their chief engineer used to be a web designer?
  • 1 2
 waki you could probably make a better product then crankbros!
  • 3 0
 That gear box looks a bit more dependable than a rear derailleur.
  • 2 0
 The gearbox idea is really cool. I would like to see a long term test of it.
  • 1 0
 Is it 'good' design to have the shock anchor and linkage both on the top tube?
I think NS did something similar on the Soda, but it just doesn't look right for some reason.
  • 2 0
 Makes no difference as long as the designer plans for the loads involved and uses it to achieve the wheel path and leverage rate he or she wants
  • 1 0
 Thanks m-t
  • 1 1
 "Oh my. You know you are in Europe when three out of four of your friends show up in Spandex - the very same Spandex"
ah ah so true

they are the only ones who thinks they look great... and maybe they´re wifes...
  • 2 0
 Might as well get a young Philipino boy to ride your bike if you go electric, prob cheaper too.
  • 2 2
 You know, these reports are becoming eerily similar to reading the latest MBA mag. The Baron is not conti's mud spike, the Mud King is their mud spike. Typos, really? Vital is doing better, just saying.
  • 1 0
 "very promising for those who are in search of a low-maintenance mountain bike"

Oh, I thought everybody wanted a Low maintenance MTB, right?
  • 2 0
 Apparently I need a 650b bike now...
  • 1 0
 Stunningly bad "made for show" rubbish in the main. My eyes are sore from looking at those fugly bikes and outfits...
  • 1 0
 I like most of the bikes, probably won't be able to afford any of them though....Frown
  • 2 0
 160mm FS with gearbox weighing in at 30lbs? Is that a typo? I hope not.
  • 1 0
 And It's not the effigear-ion gearboxed downhill bike...a few pounds heavier
  • 1 0
 Vivax assisted Ronde van Vlaanderen anyone?
  • 1 0
 The new pike looks smart.
  • 1 0
 Those Conti tires on the left look nice. Anyone know the model?
  • 1 0
 Nukeproof.... the only thing that I'm interested in on there
  • 1 0
 and the tires. nobody has said anything about that yet. but there nice!
  • 1 0
 I spy a toilet bowl !!! oh... that's a neckbrace ???????
  • 1 0
 I can see too much electricity in the next future....I don't like it
  • 3 3
 The whole "dudes in spandex" thing needs to stop.
  • 1 4
 Holly crap that is one skinny dude! Turn sideways and he disappears.

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