Pinkbike Poll: The Future

Feb 6, 2015
by Paul Aston  
For people already involved in mountain biking, bigger tires, wider rims, lighter carbon, longer suspension, more gnarly trails, and taller jumps may be amazing advances - and that is just fine for someone who wants a little bit more speed and grip, the experienced racer needing an edge, the guy, who measures his mates by the gram, or the conqueror who has squashed his local trail network and needs higher jumps or longer loops.

Ask somebody who has never rode a mountain bike before, what faster, stronger, lighter and bigger means and the answer will probably be: "Compared to what?" What is "better" compared to "nothing?" For example, my dad, rarely rides bikes, so taking dad around a remote trail center on a carbon 27.5-inch bike, instead of an alloy 26-inch one might allow him to roll and climb a little faster and find a little more grip, and its high-end components might make his life easier, but dad is not going to have any idea about the recent technological advances in our niche sport. He will just ride the bike and assume that this is what a bike feels like. He will have no point of comparison from which to make that judgment, and probably, his riding level would be nowhere near the capabilities of the bike. Hopefully he would enjoy himself regardless, as he negotiated around 40-foot tables and avoided the black trails.

People for Bikes Philadelphia Pumptrack opening.

These guys aren't popping for carbon super-bikes yet, but they will be one day.



Are we enticing new riders with all this marketing and technology? Marketing $8000 super-bikes, to big-dog dentists and lawyers with disposable incomes, to passionate die-hards who live by the latest kit, or racers who must keep up with their competition will surely bring in plenty of dollars for bike makers this year, but is this bigger, faster, stronger direction that the market is currently taking the best way to grow our sport in the long term? How does an $8000 superbike with five functions on the handlebar get people off the sofas and onto the trails? Let go of the console and grab some grips? Get kids on bikes and families out for the weekend and breed the next generation of riders? I can't remember the last time I saw an advert biased towards new riders. It's always: 'We sold you THAT. but NOW you need THIS."

There has been huge evolution in the sport, especially in the UK, and for a period of time, new trails, pump tracks, retail shops and riders have sprouted up and all were welcomed with open arms, but has all that come to an end? Maybe I am biased, or blinkered because I have been at the sharp end for so many years. Perhaps all that high-end marketing hype actually does trickle down to newbies and reels them into the sport. Perhaps the current growth of our sport is enough to sustain us for the coming years. If it isn't though, are we digging a black hole by concentrating upon hyper-expensive technical improvements, building bicycles tailor made for elite-level riders, and constructing trails to showcase super-powers that will generate short term profits that will abruptly dry up when current riders are too old, injured or broken to ride anymore? Are there be enough new riders today who will possess disposable incomes and will progress to replace them? Maybe we should turn down the volume a notch or two and try making the sport more approachable - and encourage some new seedlings to enter the sport.

So, the question is: Are we investing in the future or bleeding the present dry? Ten years from now, when a huge chunk of the current cash crop have left the scene, will our feasts have created a famine?



Author Info:
astonmtb avatar

Member since Aug 23, 2009
486 articles

184 Comments
  • 90 0
 I think that more cities around the world should be putting in the effort to build a good pump track in a few of the parks in and around the cities so all ride regardless of skill, experience, and income can ride something fun. No matter who you are bikes are always a great way to get out and have some fun.
  • 91 4
 Bike companies push more and more bikes, but don't do enough to build more trails. It's totally unsustainable.
  • 22 7
 ^^Generalization. There are bike companies that are building trails and helping to grow the sport. They are the minority unfortunately.
  • 9 0
 Yeah my local park invested in a pump track and it made a community of riders. I learnt so much from that pump track and now I can teach others at it.
  • 19 6
 Sorry, was the article about bike companies not building trail?
Pretty sure it was about whether or not they are soaking us.
It's not hard to see that the top models from the top brands are serious bank breakers.
It's also not hard to see, as my boy "beersndspokes" said below, that there are options to the boutique bikes everyone would like.
Advances in bike technology have put everyone who rides, or who wants to ride, in a great spot.
A place where it is very hard to find a bad bike. The big boys spend a lot on R&D and price their products to reflect that.
Once there are advances though others will copy. If you asked me if I'd rather ride a brand new $3000 bike from 5 years ago or a brand new $2000 bike from now, I'd go with the cheaper one.
Lots of really nice stuff out there now for easy money.
Two packs of butts a week is $3000 a year.
Bikes are not that expensive
Laziness is though
  • 3 1
 Some city's don't know they need these. Awareness! Let them know. Even if 3 or 4 get together and did one. It would still be a relative short distance.
  • 2 1
 Ask bike shops to sponsor. Money going full circle. Win/win!
  • 2 0
 If I were to open a bike shop... if and when I could afford it, the first thing I'd do is build a pump track, whether on public land or my own. Preferably in a high visibility location. It manufactures a customer base. Involvement of the industry, both manufacturers and local shops, in new trail construction/trail improvements, is a massive opportunity. The pool of customers is dependent on the quality of the riding experience, which is arguably more dependent on the quality and quantity of trail than the quality of the bikes being sold.
  • 8 3
 If your dentist passes you on a $8000 "super bike" you might be a redneck.
  • 2 1
 It's one of the good things about CRC: they are the closest thing I have to a LBS and have spent a lot funding trails all over the country.
  • 2 6
flag MANA624 (Feb 7, 2015 at 11:13) (Below Threshold)
 @fecalmaster my dad is a dentist, mind you. Though not specifically on bikes, he does keep active and could pass a good number of people in a good number of things.
  • 6 0
 Well that's a relief
  • 7 1
 Every post office in the world should have a post office jump.
  • 3 1
 the one thing that i can think of to get more people into the sport is to lower the cost of mountain biking, everything is way to expensive for a young kid to get into the sport.
  • 6 2
 @corywilliam utter bull. A few hundred quid/bucks can buy a good quality second hand bike. You can't expect top companies to put millions into R&D and give it to you for nothing!
  • 5 1
 it's not so much the bike companies bleeding us dry, it't the entire distribution chain. I may sound completely negative towards this model and I apologize if I do, but the model the bike community has adapted of manufacturer, distributor, retailer customer is always going to be more expensive than a manufacturer to consumer model. That's just how it goes, I do feel bad for the LBS who has to scratch and claw for every penny because they are selling significantly marked up product to make ends meat. Look at YT industries for example, their model is straight to consumer and their prices are totally competitive! The amount of technology that bike comes equipped with is ridiculous, a complete DH bike with decent components for under 3000 USD, insane. In the grand scheme of things $3000 is still a lot of money, but so much better than buying just a frame for $2500. I like Mountain Biking the way it is, but companies should start piecing together lower end bikes to create a broader scope of customers if they want the longevity of the sport to continue. Develop high end parts, but stop focusing on carbon for the average consumer and just give them parts that are cost effective and will last. I know, easier said than done.
  • 2 0
 Honestly, I used to want more to be done about having a bigger riding scene where i'm at until my dad made the valid point of having jammed trails and whatnot. I like being one of the few riders on a trail if not, the only one. I don't ever want mountain biking to be as popular as football or any mainstream sport like that,
  • 1 0
 @kubaner: I mostly agree, but how many $2000 bikes has pinkbike reviewed in the last year? I can't think of one. and I think you are paying WAY too much for your packs of butts
  • 2 0
 @mechanicaleyemedia I'm sure you already know this, but as a beginner into the sport you really need your local bike shop to help you with the little things such as warranties, fitting, showing you how to adjust and make things work accordingly. Yes you could figure these things out on your own with a basic set of tools and knowledge, but you would be surprised at how very few people are mechanically inclined and shy away from even trying to dive into that sort of thing.

I first started once I quit racing motocross. I worked on my own mx bikes, but even mtb specific stuff was all new to me. I had no idea what size I needed, I didn't know anything about Pink Bike, I had no clue about my local trail centers. All of those things were discovered through the bike shop relationships I developed as a beginner. To me that is priceless.

I will agree that the pricing is high, and I did make a few purchasing mistakes to begin with, but its all lessons that needed to be learned one way or another. You could recommend an intermediate/expert rider in the direction of direct selling because they know what they want, they know what to look for in a spec sheet, and they most likely have a good skill set to build / repair their own equipment.

Its a tough scenario but nobody works for free. The best way to get people involved is to share the experience with friends.
I have multiple friends asking me all the time to come out and ride because they have seen pictures on instagram or facebook, mostly guys that like to ride moto. Fortunately I have a loaner bike that they can ride that is still worth $2500 easy so its not like they are starting out on a Wal-Mart special with paper mache rims and bars.
  • 1 1
 @mechanicaleyemedia direct to consumer is a great approach but you definitely don't want the entire market to go that way or I think you'll find prices aren't so good.

As for manufacturers focusing on high end stuff: that you do want. Your great value amazing bike for $3000? It's called trickle down technology.
  • 1 0
 @somismtb @minus8 completely agree with the above comments, an LBS is an essential key to the bike industry and if there were a shift in the supply chain to the manufacturer to consumer chain it would devastate the bike community. I was simply making a point that the supply chain is what seems to create these high prices; everyone has to make their money, I get that, I will never knock a bike shop because they are the point of sale. I'm not suggesting that companies adapt the manufacturer to consumer model, I was just stating that's where the problem lies in these high prices. As for focusing on high end stuff, I never said don't focus on it, but stop throwing excessive amounts into R&D to save a few grams/pounds, whatever. The new to the sport consumer won't care regardless, that's just my opinion.
  • 1 0
 @mechanicaleyemedia I get where you're coming from but as soon as a single manufacturer stops spending the money squeezing every bit of performance out of a bike that they can, their race teams won't do so well etc, and they ultimately don't sell as many bikes. Just look at the results from the DH World Champs last year; less than a second between the top 3 riders in the mens elite!

I don't think there's ever been a better time for newcomers to enter the sport. Less than £1000 (still a lot of money, I know) can buy a cracking trail bike. Shimano Deore kit is as good as, if not better than XTR gear from a few years ago. I doubt that would be the case without all this R&D.

Manufacturers of anything are always going to flaunt their top kit more. Car advertisements, for example, always show the top end 'sport' or similar model alongside the price tag of the entry level model.
  • 1 0
 Lompoc, CA, 93436 check out the bike park almost finished there. pretty epic.
  • 3 0
 It would be nice if manufacturers would disallow their products being sold on the web. I know EVERYBODY want a good deal, but stuff was less expensive when the LBS was the only place to go for parts, bikes and accessories. I've work in the industry for 30 years now, and to see someone walk through the door with a box of parts and a frame purchased from a website is very disappointing, especially when there are other clients waiting to buy and service their bikes from items already on the showroom floor. These web shoppers get the back of the line from me and I'm not even shy to charge them more for labor to have their items assembled and serviced. Why be so unfair you ask? Because there are grubs trying to get their hands dirty with the money they earned shoveling walks and delivering papers, drooling at what we have for sale, but we can't lower our prices enough to make it possible.

If we really want to help our kids become passionate, I mean really passionate about this sport we need to get back to the grass roots of the sport. No one needs disc brakes, no one needs suspension, and absolutely no one needs a 400$ Troy Lee helmet so that they can have fun. Parents need to get involved with their kids activities and have them make do with what they already have, not upgrades for performance, no kid needs performance. Every time a parent asks if the 20" wheel xc bike suspension fork has a lock out, I want to scream. Companies are audacious enough to make 20" DH bikes for kids ( 7 to 10 yr old's ) and sell them for more than I paid for my first second hand car. But where will they ride these machines? When kids try to ride at the local park or hill they are kicked out, regulations are put in place banning cycling on trails for fear of " liability " and children are stuck with nothing to do. Now, the cities prune trees so that the lowest branches are 10 feet off the ground...Kids aren't even allowed to climb trees!!!!!
  • 2 0
 I agree with you sir.
  • 2 0
 Anywhere i go, i try to get a good connection with my local shop. They give more advice than the internet, tell me about trails, etc. yeah pricepoint is nice, but i try to stick with local.
  • 2 0
 The thing around where I live is that we have a lot of places to bike at, its just that they are not well maintained, like little stumps in trails, rocks, etc. I enjoy seeing kids getting into the sport, but I like to the kids that have an understanding for the sport, not a family who shows up to these bike parks that have only ever been on paved or flat gravel paths. I get annoyed with this because these people are urging their kids to go when ever and take as much time as they possibly can to go around or do what ever. I have ran into these issues many times, for example, one of these kids stopped in the middle of the jump line, after a turn where you can't look far enough to see the exit, I nearly did a 180 while braking and trying to keep my self from running him over. Also, for example if any of you have ever been to Ray's MTB, this one woman was walking around the entire park, on the mountain biking trails while chatting on her phone, completely oblivious to me trying to pass her. My point is, I love seeing kids who are interested in mountain biking, going to parks, I even give them pointers on how to get even better. However, I don't enjoy seeing kids going to the parks in which their dad or mom thought it would be something "fun" to do for the first time ever.
  • 43 3
 Compared to 10 years ago - what is being done today is amazing. When I got into the sport in 2003, it was a bunch of 18+ year old guys and a lot of them were heavily invested in the 'herb. Nothing wrong with that - but as a 15 year old, it wasn't the friendliest sport to enter into haha.

Flash forward, and you have these awesome dads bringing their 10 year old's to whistler, and the kids are throwing down shit that I (don't tell anyone) would inspire to do! Another element is facebook. These young kids are getting exposure not just on pinkbike (which is HUGE!) but also their similar aged peers are seeing them send it off 30 foot doubles, and asking their parents to get them a sweet bike to cruise the parks with. Our sport is no longer growing at a linear/word-of-mouth rate - it's growing geometrically!

The growth today is awesome, it's positive, productive, friendly and this sport has some solid roots to it now that will ensure growth for the next decade no problem.

-Note: I'm not involved in any of the sales/marketing of this sport, so this growth is just what I observe, I have no numbers to back it up.
  • 74 14
 I'm sorry to be the douche to do this but it's growing exponetially.... Not geometrically... It's not gaining shapes....
  • 17 2
 Technically we are growing geometrically :p
www.pinkbike.com/news/absolute-black-oval-chainring-review.html

But yeah you're right in terms of exponentially. (Also I'm aware that oval chainrings have been around for a while)
  • 20 3
 Geometric growth is a thing. Its the "correct" term in math for exponential growth.
  • 4 0
 Gotcha there scott (:
  • 14 0
 Our sport is gaining shapes though, ovals, Cubes, Polygons...
  • 5 4
 Also, kids are doing things you aspire to do, not inspire
  • 7 2
 Exponential growth and geometric growth are two different things. Geometric growth changes at a constant rate, and exponential growth changes at an increasing rate.
i.e.
Geometric growth:
2, 4, 6, 8, 10...

Exponential growth:
2, 4, 8, 16, 32...
  • 31 2
 Pinkbike: Changing the world by teaching grammar, one poster at a time.
  • 4 0
 I'm a brand new dad and I can't wait for my son to grow enough so I can buy him one of those Commencal push bikes. Big Grin

Living in Basel, I know that he will be riding bikes every single day and if one day he decide that cycling will be his chosen sport... he will have all necessary support from his family, but also from his community (closest pump track is just 300 meters away).

I just hope that one day I will be fit enough to ride with him... let's see... maybe... ''Passport du Soleil'' Big Grin
I'm not asking for too much, do I?
  • 4 2
 Its aspire to do, not inspire to do. Also as pointed out above, its exponential growth not geometrical growth (it would be correct if we were examining a graph visually available to us and we could see the way it was growing, because "growing geometrically" could also mean it was going downhill as we cant see a graph to see otherwise) but your point is well taken and is damn right. - One finicky bastard
  • 2 1
 What they taught me at least is that 2, 4, 6, 8, 10… is arithmetic growth, where you add a constant number repeatedly to the first number. Geometric growth is modelled as (first term)•(rate of growth)^(number of term minus one), it grows exponentially the way that area grows in geometry as you square, cube ect… 2(2)^x-1 models 2, 4, 8, 16, 32… but in Canadian schools we call it geometric growth. theres no right or wrong, geometric and exponential mean the same thing.
  • 12 1
 Fooking hell people. Talk about a dog with a bone..... Should I start by pointing out that geometric growth is actually a mathematically correct term for exponential growth when referring to a discrete domain of equal intervals, so the poster was in fact correct? Or should I point out that many people who took it upon themselves to pounce on this actually correct statement and flex their falsely perceived superior intellect did so by omitting full stops, misusing apostrophes and making grammatical mistakes like starting sentences with additive connectives like "also"? Perhaps I should say that if you're going to pick up people on their mistakes then you should make sure that you don't make any, because you're asking to be picked up on yours? Or should I point out that no-one is perfect, that showing up others is a trait of a grade A douche and that we all make mistakes? No, I think not......I think I'll just say get over yourselves. As we're here to read about bikes, I think I'll just do that instead.
  • 7 1
 i proofread blahblah's reply like 3 times to make sure he didnt misspell anything or miss any punctuation. good job blahblah; A+
  • 1 0
 Sorry to start a battle.... Keystone I meant to proofread blahblahs comment....then I got shittered drunk I no longer cared.
  • 2 0
 I debated using the term exponential - but upon further drunken thought - geometric seemed more appropriate given how families are structured. Holy hell - didn't know there were so many armchair ahh fuck it - shut up and ride!
  • 1 2
 So many armchair: high school drop outs?
  • 1 0
 Got me there.... Oh wait got my honors good enough diploma.
  • 1 0
 Represent! I was offered a scholarship for my ghetto education degree scores.
  • 30 1
 Let's say that "true new MTBs" start at around 700$, you can get a base DJ/XC bike for that. To make it really fair let's use 1000$. The most expensive bike will land around 10k for a complete factory build, but you can surely turn it up with straight dumb parts like carbon fiber rotor rings, ti and alloy replacements for axles or tiniest bolts in already feather weight products. So end bike will go for around 14k I assume. So we have something between 1k and 14k for a new MTB. Now the big question is What is the true share of the total MTB market for 8k+, hell, even 5k+ bikes - 10%? 5%? 2%? 0,6%? Not sure if there is anything to worry about.

I am also more than sure than technology is pushed to the limit these days, it's hard to imagine any breakthrough. Sub 10kg , sustainable Downhill bikes are not going to happen sorry... and even If they would, why would you need one? We started of with Banshee Scream and MOnster fork at 25kg, now average DH bike easily goes at 16,5kg.

The problem i have is the growth of our sport, which I honestly think is a bullshit. We need quality in our sport NO1, growth NO2. Sure, numbers of riders are a good backup when you want to get permission for a trail, but NO1 problem is to get people who are going to stick their neck out and talk to municaplity then No2, get people to build and maintain trails. That has little to do with number, it has to do with quality and sense of responsibility - that comes from education, from seeing others working. I am sure of one thing, whatever growth of the sport brings more people shitting on trails than building and maintaining them. So first worry how to make people more active in community, then how to get more of any people. We need established riders quit saying that somebody should do something. We need them to become that somebody, there's enough people not doing anything and riding on someone elses hard work.
  • 1 1
 I agree, this so hard though. The other thing I've been thinking about is more of a user pays model (I can hear the cries of "its already too expensive" immediately). This way it doesn't matter so much if just a few people are doing all the work because there will be money to support new tracks, facilities etc. But how you do this is difficult without penalizing racers (IE race entry). There could be a levy on all new bikes for mtb support...i can't see that happening as it requires too much coordination, plus people would strongly oppose it at first I'd imagine. Oh well, back to postulating.
  • 2 1
 Nailed it man. The problem with N01 people is that most of them are experienced leaders, and most of them will of course be leaders in their day to day job, so they will most of the times prioritize its hobby (mtb) to last.
Regarding people that doesnt have the leadership edge or is just too young, is perhapa more focused in improving his skills and his only, as it is an individual sport. I might be generalizing on the last one...just food for thought.
  • 4 0
 Wakitruth
  • 3 0
 @russthedog- Tha'ts an interesting idea: A levy on new bikes to support trail building. Imagine if just $10 was added to every mountain bike purchase made. An insignificant amount of money in the cost of a bike, but could be a HUGE boost to trail organizations. Voluntary memberships are a drop in the bucket of what such a small surcharge could mean.
  • 2 21
flag AllMountin (Feb 7, 2015 at 0:37) (Below Threshold)
 BTW, you foreign a*sholes using commas to denote decimals(0,6%)... it's just f*cking weird. How do I know whether you mean 0.6%, or whether you mean 0%, 6%? Carry on. :-)
  • 3 1
 @AllMountin Actually having that fee on a bike does sound reasonable. I'd call myself an opponent of a pay-to-ride model - it just feels wrong, I'd MUCH rather dig than pay, not because I couldn't afford it, but the fact I can take my bike and go ride somewhere without a single cent spent is something I'd stick to. Not for the money, but for the sake of biking. However, if there was a fee, that would be fairly distributed to trail builders on a new bike, I'd have no problem with that.
However, I don't think it can work. No matter whether it's a set fee or % (% could make even more sense, perhaps, even just 0.5%), it'd be hardly any different from either the shop sponsoring the trail organisation OR paying it in taxes and getting the city support the work. You could try to do it an other way, just paying a fee for a purchased bike and distributing it, but you'd end up having to set up pretty sophisticated system of applications for these funds, people who would evaluate whether the trail network that requests funds etc is legit, then stuff, more stuff and in the end you might end up doing more work either on the "funding organisation" side AND the trail network managers/builders.
As a very passionate biker, my motivation for trail building isn't money, nor the time spent matters to me. I build to ride what I want to ride, or to express something, trail building is art. Yes, it does cost money to get tools, it costs a lot of time, but as with any form of art, it shouldn't be profit driven, and if you build in a place where the community is worth building for, they'll take care of you, at least from my experience.
  • 1 0
 So in the end, when funding the trail crews matters, it should be the advocacy that gets the job done by convincing the municipality they want to support the sport in the area and funding it from tax money, even if it would mean a "bike tax" - they have the infrastructure you'd have to build around it. Obviously they may also have corruption, but that's another topic.
  • 4 3
 As to adding dollars to bikes for trails, woohoo, NO1 sorry Nobody is getting away with doing sht so easy. More people would sit on their bum doing nothing and on top of that they would be sitting in position of "I pay - I demand". NO2 it would be a disaster for trail building grass roots therefore for everybody else m. A lot of pseudo-activist grumps would not only take half of this money to themselves, they would also become too powerful all to quickly, imposing regulations
on trail building and use which would only limit freedom.
NO3 that would be impossible fiscally Big Grin
  • 7 1
 Another thing I see is that many people have extremely high expectations and complete misunderstanding of how to train and learn Skills. People want Whistler bike park or Alpine singletrack while they forget how valuable are some small yet extremely hard to create things like a pump track. Many of us fat wallet pricks with carbon bikes have little time to ride and it is hard to have more than two long rides in a week so it seems a waste to go to a pumptrack instead of to the woods, but perception changes when one understands that he can have 2 pump track sessions per one ride, which will take this one remaining ride to a whole another level. Same goes to practising basic riding technique skills on asphalt, wheelies, stoppies, manual, track stand, pumping flat ground, pumping figure 8. Then having a few simple training tools at home, like kettlebell, riding bike to work giving chance to train sprints and intervals on the way home. It's not only that we lack encouragement to appreciate those little things, it's that those little things matter and give us more than big ones. The problem is that What industry pushes is freaking heroes doing insane runs or jumps which gives us old grumps, feeding the market, absolutely nothing. So we end up in a spiral where our kids, even though inspired by what they are shown of Andreu Lacondeguy, have no actual example in their proximity how to get there.
  • 3 0
 Hurray for builders!

Personally i can get out once a week with my studies. Since it's raining here, i just ride to my locals, build all day, and ride back.
Actually, when it's this kind of weather, i prefer building to riding, since i know if i build, i'll have more trails to blast around on in the summer.
And if other people use them, all the better!

Although maybe this stems from the fact we don't have too many trails in the immediate area, hence my motivation to build.
I can see why people who already have loads of trails might not feel the need to build. But they should be able to see that trails aren't eternal and need maintenance.

Hey how about this:
Sell a mcleod and shovel with every bike!
Have trailboss tools up for rent (cheap) at local bike shops!
  • 1 0
 i have to agree that the fee idea could be a two sided knife if not lead properly. Something that is needed is a sense of identity. A group or local identity, for example giving the sense of belonging to the ''riders of trail x'' or ''riders of comunity x'', that identity needs to be mutlidisciplinary from XC up to DH, even roadies, riders need to know each other and recognize each other habilities and strenghts, this will entice respect and teamwork which is the basis for trailbuilding. it is tricky to achieve specially cuz as i said it is an individual sport, it is easier to be an spoiled DH brat that makes fun of people that dont go 5 foot drops or an xc lycra guy that takes a condecending attitude showing off his 10k carbon bike and not talking to anyone.
  • 2 0
 WAKI you are so right! "We need established riders quit saying that somebody should do something. We need them to become that somebody, there's enough not doing anything and riding on somebody elses hard work." I've been building trails in my area for the last ten years because I love creating quality singletrack to ride. When I started I was in my mid fifties and I'm now 66 years old. I've had to have two hernia surgeries and I now have a fused sacroiliac joint in my back. It hasn't stopped me though, because I just love digging and improving what I ride. Hundreds of people ride my trails - quite a few I know personally, but apart from a hand full who help out sometimes, the rest have never lifted a finger to do any building or maintenance. Their attitude seems to be - a minute spent off the bike is a minute wasted, especially if someone like me is building the trail anyway. Unfortunately the majority are just plain selfish users. Now Strava has created monsters who resent me being on the trail working, as they may have to slow down to avoid me, thus ruining their effort to get the best lap time that they could have shown off to their friends. MTB (like a lot of other sports and recreation) has a lot of people involved who are full of piss and wind. Thankfully I have my wife a few friends who ride for fun and we always have grin and a whoop and holler when we get to the bottom of my downhill trail!
  • 2 0
 WAKI Wow I'm feeling this comment. spot on. accessibility.
  • 1 0
 general building has its place, hell ive done my fair share. what makes the real difference is building legit trails. using a shovel doesnt cut it anymore, support your local advocate and help them get more legit tracks for everyone.
  • 3 0
 The trails I've built are legit. They are on State Forest land and the club I'm a member of has signed an occupancy permit. I'm also a paid up member of MTBA and IMBA. Your point about supporting advocacy groups is spot on.
  • 2 0
 Good work, always so good to hear. State forest is a dream of mine - we normally build in pine plantations which means the trails get trashed every ten years. It does make it easy to get permission from the land owner though (relatively)
  • 2 0
 As usual, dead on balls accurate, WAKI. Wink

It's important for people to step up and stick their necks out instead of firing off at those taking the risks.

We have to build a community that embraces hard work and puts investments back into the bike industry -- work, effort, funds. We have these already, but it's a small percent of the 'core' of the industry. Trailbuilders, coaches, race promoters and a lot of the 'behind the scenes' folks are, but what about companies? Companies who give back, give incentives for community involvement and more.

I work for an online retailer and, to be quite frank, all I do is watch them take from the bike industry and the community members doing their best to give back; we don't invest shit back into the industry as a company, and it kills me! We need the companies cleaning up from bike sales and racer exposure to put effort back into it all.

This poll generalizes too much -- the industry is full of both doers and do-nothings, and it can be tough to tell the two apart unless you're close enough. Are we investing? Sure. In the right stuff? I dunno.

There's a lot of marketing that goes on versus a sustainable investment in the future, and that worries me, personally.
  • 17 0
 Pump tracks are perfect to get little ones riding. Then you need fun flowy "green" runs without too much elevation change to get them hooked.

It's not about the equipment to get new people into the sport. It's about the trails and bike parks. That is where we need the effort.
  • 2 0
 Just can't agree more with you. I'm a father of two daugthers and would like to introduce them to the sport. The biggest problem is lack of an entry level trials that could be ridden by families.
  • 3 0
 Absolutely. When I got into biking back in '02ish as a teenager, we didn't have shit for trails. We'd just ride down random ravines, build sketchy jumps, and huck random cliffs. I always dreamed of the types of trails that now exist in the same town I grew up in.
  • 2 0
 Add my agreement to that. The Vancouver area has a number of simpler tracks and trails but the learning curve from the simple to even green North Shore rings is steep (no pun intended) to say the least for most kids.

I'd also advocate for training over equipment any day.
  • 1 0
 Exactly. I have no idea how I got hooked on biking, but if I want to get my kids into it, it will be wide open flowy places like Kingdom Trails that does it. My local trails are sorely lacking anything between gravel paths and rocky tech.
  • 17 0
 I think our focus should be a bit more on being accepted by the society. Advocating trails, building skill parks and pump tracks in cities.

The bikes we have today range from reasonably priced and good, to stupid priced and amazing, but it does all trickle down, and the youngsters seeing pros sending massive stuff on these amazing bikes have a lot of options to get the trickled down version and try to get into it.

More often than not, I feel like the question is "where do I start?". The low cost yet capable (..enough) bikes are simply not advertised, which might be one thing bike brands could look into, but even the rich kid who gets a V10 for christmas will likely not get into it if the hill in his backyard will strictly forbid bikes in the forest.

I come from Czech republic, there is a whole lot of great trails around, but a big majority of them are secret, therefore if you are new to the sport and have no one to introduce you to a few trails, all you can do is drive 3 hours to a bikepark. That's not very encouraging, while turning on World of Warcraft is just a click away.
  • 2 0
 Low cost bikes *mostly* look ugly in comparison to top level models. While I agree with the need for bread and butter products to be visible to target consumers, bike brands advertising lower end models would create image problems for the brand. We'd inevitably associate that company with low cost bikes, if that was their marketing strategy. If Kia comes out with a luxury car that is equal to/better than a Lexus/Mercedes/BMW in every conceivable way, it may still struggle to sell. It's still a Kia. Maybe Specialized needs dual branding? A separate brand to market to the economy consumer.
  • 1 0
 @AllMountin valid point! I honestly don't see a very good solution. Dual branding could be one indeed. But that might kill the smaller brands out there, such as Airborne(and definitely more). They may or may not be amazing bikes (I've never laid my fingers on one), but they do have some proper looking bikes for low prices, but they couldn't ever get the funding Specialized or Trek could invest into the low end brand.
  • 5 1
 I think companies like Canyon and YT will bring prices down. When top Capra costs a 1 grand less than cheapest Nomad with no decrease in quality, then things will shift. It is the big companies that can offer lowest prices though as they have the best deals on components and lowedt production prices.

The thing is also that lower end components are incredible these days, look at Deore, Suntour forks. So the problem is us: We are damn spoiled, we freaking are. There are so many threads on forums where people new to the sport want to buy a new bike.
  • 1 0
 Even if bikes would be free, it takes trails to ride them and I hardly ever see the people who profit from the MTB industry sowing the seeds of their own prosperity.
  • 1 0
 www.giant-bicycles.com/en-us/bikes/model/atx.27.5.2/18750/76228

That is a bike with a halfway descent(if hard to maintain) fork, & disc brakes, for $440. That's about $360 in 2005 dollars. If you think about what $360 would get you in a bike in 2005 (here's a hint: Walmart or used,) that's absolutely incredible.

The paradigm shifts even more if you're willing to spend $800-$1000. You can truly get a bike many of us would have paid more than $1500 for(in 2005 dollars) at that price range, these days. Something that you can really learn to ride on for a few years, with no problems.

I think the constant media coverage of brands that can't hit those price-points(because, realistically, every brand that isn't Giant, Specialized, or Trek can't,) skews our perception to what's really available to someone who doesn't have our level of obsession. Our "quality floor," what we consider to be the "bottom rung" of an acceptable bike, is no longer in the same place. How many of us would own a hardtail as our only bike? Not many, I'd wager.

I helped a buddy buy a bike the other day. He got a Fuel EX 8 for $1800. You can't even buy that bike in 2005: a bike that was a competent descender, but still didn't feel like a beach ball on the climbs didn't exist!
  • 16 0
 I feel like a lot a people my age don't mountain bike or even play any sports at all. Everyone was asking for the latest console for Xmas when I was asking for a neck brace
  • 13 0
 We need more bicycle infrastructure in the U.S. so that simply riding a bicycle around town is not life-threatening.
  • 4 0
 I'm one the same page. That's one of the main reasons I don't have a road bike. Plus fat people and spandex don't mix well.
  • 10 0
 I am bleeding the present dry. By that I mean, I refuse to give up on MtB including DH even though I am 51 yo and have a 5 yo daughter. I don't want to quit. I don't want to give in to the "old man's world" of big mileage rides with tons of altitude gain on 29ers supplanting the feeling of ripping down a trail nearly out of control, aspiring to get better at jumping even as my history and present tell me not to. I should be totally investing my time and efforts on the kids, and give up on my own narcissism - but I can't. I am bleeding the present dry. I am pulling the trigger on a Marzocchi 380 next week. Shame on me.
  • 3 0
 Totally feeling that. Keep the inner kid spirit. I'm 37 going on 17, just started dating a 26yr old and live for biking. I'll grow old kicking and screaming.
  • 2 0
 Keep fighting the good fight! I am 42, and as long as my body holds up, I will continue to chase that adrenaline rush. Sadly though, most of my riding friends tend to be half my age. All of the riders I know around my age have taken to riding these marathon gravel road rides. To each their own, but even the beer can barely make these gravel rides tolerable.
  • 2 0
 never apologize - Im 43 and I still love the speed and that feeling of flirting with "almost losing it". I was off riding for about 10 years but Im back in full throttle. Whistler Bike Park is to blame. Love my AM and climbing for fitness but really I do it all for the DH. Waiting rather impatiently for my 2015 Aurum to come in.....
  • 8 0
 I think one silly trend is marketing higher and higher end mountain bikes to younger and younger kids. When I was a kid, all kids rode bmx bikes that cost $3-600. Now you see 12 y/o kids on DJ bikes they can barely get a leg over, and that cost twice as much, who could easily rip on a 20" and that's not enough, now they are making 24" FS bikes. If the kid is too small for a 26" he/she is probably growing so fast they won't finish the season on the same size bike.

You can take my money. I can afford my superbike, but leave the poor kids alone!
  • 7 0
 The Charge bikes guy once said something along the lines of "Making an amazing six thousand pound bike is easy. The difficult thing is making an amazing three hundred pound bike. We need more companies run by people like Nick Larsen, rather than bean counters with the sole interest of lining their own pockets. Don't get me wrong, I love looking at new cutting edge stuff, but more needs to be done to make the sport affordable for teenagers to get into.
  • 1 3
 For example I'd love to buy a commencal supreme 24 for my son but the price is a joke. For 2000 euro I could and would buy him a motorbike instead...
  • 7 1
 You have to push the top end of technology to get a good trickle down to the lower level stuff. The existence of $10k+ bikes on the market ensures that, in a few years time, even the average joe with $3k to spend on a used bike can get some of the technological advancements that were available on that $10k bike. 1x11 drivetrains too expensive? That created a need for companies like Oneup to produce more affordable ways to get to that gear spread. Carbon bikes used to be expensive and unattainable, but I bet you money I could go find several nice examples of carbon bikes from the likes of Santa Cruz and other companies well within the $3k range. You can get a 26" carbon downhill bike for a quite reasonable price these days. If they stopped pushing the technology once they made the first v10c then they would still be immensely expensive and unattainable for the average rider. I, for one, welcome all technological advancements because all they do is drive down the price of the previous generation of bikes and make it easy for someone to get a ballin' bike of a few years ago for mediocre bike of today prices.
  • 7 1
 All this marketing hype only exists to people who spend too much time on the internet. There's lots of guys out there who shred on older 26ers and really don't care about whats new. The fast guys are fast no matter what they ride.
  • 6 1
 When you're a kid it's all about what your parents do, if they encourage you into a sport. A lot of our parents wont have even known about proper mountain biking when we wanted to get into it, but when all of our kids grow up, there'll be twice the amount of young riders!
  • 5 0
 To be honest I would rather mountian biking stay as it's own niche community. Granted I might be a little biased because I am super lucky to live in Squamish where trail rights are easy to come by as the community is already invested in the bike scene.

The reason I want MTBf to stay a niche community is because I feel like more people will try the sport without understanding it if it is marketed to a large range of people. Whistler altready gets complaints about A-line being "choppy" and "not flowy" from people that don't understand the sport and take their hardtails with 2" wide bars from 1992 down A-line.

I feel like if we try to expand mtb into a more mainstream sport we will end up with more of these people and it will actually end up being worse for the trails. I fear that with more people the quality of riders will go down and more and more people will start to complain that your favourite trail is "too hard" and that it needs to be toned down. We already see it now, and I fear we will just end up seeing it more and more if MTB expands too much.

I guess what I am trying to say is quality of riders>quantity of riders
  • 5 0
 I think the more people that get into mountain biking, the more trails there will be, which is what a lotta people on here seem to want. More legal trails that are fun to ride, technical, have flow and aren't full of barbaric indiana jones type traps along the trails because some old lady doesn't like mountain bikers. Just look at the development of skateboarding, it got more popular and brought in more people to build skate parks and skate spots. A lot of people still don't like skateboarders but they have come a long way. The top pros at a skate contest can make like $200,000 at one contest. Mountain bikers get like what $20,000 for the top contests?
  • 9 1
 Ya
  • 3 0
 I have 3 sons and the oldest already is nagging that he wants to ride with me. So I will do my part of keeping the Sport alive. Do you?
But the way prices of high end bikes are going concerns me, because I wil have to buy 4 bikes in the near future in stead of only one. ....
  • 3 0
 I applaud you for wanting to get your kids high end bikes, but is it necessary? I know some great circa 2010 built bikes on the Buy/Sell page that would be great for beginners and wouldn't break the bank.
  • 3 0
 I'm reading through posts and realizing that nobody seems to be addressing the actual question.

"So, the question is: Are we investing in the future or bleeding the present dry? Ten years from now, when a huge chunk of the current cash crop have left the scene, will our feasts have created a famine?"

Part one of the question is an "either or" which does not make a whole lot of sense, as you cannot choose one over the other. But it seems as though we are doing both. Just this week I see a posted video of a ten year old gapping the super jump on a scaled down Canfield full suspension, and see offerings from Commencal and Kona as well for our newer human crowd. Finally there is a safe alternative to letting your kids out the door on a Chinese made, and minimum-wage assembled tank-of-a-bicycle designed to roll to school for one season. At the same time, we the riders are allowing the manufacturers to raise the prices to new levels because we are giving them the money that they're asking. $50 to $100 per tire? $500 seat posts? Carbon fiber and integrated electronics? WE are driving the demand and leaving the business side with very little choice but to strive for the betterment of the products which WE need to remain both progressive and safe in our adventures.

Secondly, ten years from now, the current cash crop will be renewed and the limitations of the manufacturers will still remain to be driven by what we are willing to pay for their products. The question rings out as though we are going to run out of bicycles and/or people who will purchase and ride them.

In summary, I believe that we need to be smarter than this. There is no feast, and there is no famine. There is a progression of bicycles for those of us who actually NEED these tools for control and safety in our continuing adventures, which we will buy as we can afford. There will always be lesser and cheaper versions.
  • 3 0
 Trails around here are decidedly unfriendly to beginners. Part of that is to do with the pea gravel that exists on even the tamest trails which intimidates kids and wives. The other part is the fact that any jump or drop of any substance has a technical run in and runout to keep noobs off of it. There are no decent sized jumps or drops with easy speed before them. You have to either have bmx racing legs or the ability to rail a berm to get enough speed to clear the first jump. Even half decent riders have to wait for some rain to carry enough speed. Then the landings, often hips, have to be pinned and require hard braking before the next slippery berm or risk hitting a tree at full tilt. When I build my own trails to my own skill level and for grommets I have to constantly battle against vandals tearing it up. Florida has tons of beginner friendly trails and some places for advanced riding but again nothing for intermediates who want to catch some air and hit some berms, but aren't full on freeriders.
  • 5 0
 The biggest problem I've had in getting my friends to ride with me is that buying a decent mountain bike is expensive for a university student already writhing in dept.
  • 2 1
 insert - see kona precept!!!
  • 3 0
 I think the precept is even kind of pricey for the entry-university-student market. They really need something under $700 that can hold it's own once you start getting to the light-intermediate level, with good geometry and decent enough parts that you aren't fighting it.

It's a lot to ask, but I think it's really what we need to be asking for if we really want to grow the sport.
  • 1 0
 Airborne.
  • 1 0
 Second hand...
  • 3 0
 To be honest, it isn't the equipment that affects participation, it is the level of elitism that surrounds it. MTB is one area where I experienced generally little elitism and this is why I find it easy to get friends into. I recently got my first taste of XC skiing and the disapproving grimaces that i saw on the trail as i shuffled along on my rental skis with my dog in tow and even derogatory comments made me want to possibly never do it again. As a sport, pricepoint isn't the main focus. You get participants by the community, accessibility and fun you build around it, not because it is the cheapest/most expensive/coolest/easiest/hardest hobby. Don't rag on the guy/girl with the old gear. If you want to do your part, sell your old gear off cheap (take a look at the buy/sell and decide if it is really reasonable- chances are you could go lower, just saying...).
  • 1 0
 True that. If it was about flaunting gear we might as well just have runways. And as to selling old gear cheaper, do it for the kids.
  • 1 0
 Well said. I've always felt like mountain bikers, in general, are a welcoming group. We all know the rush that comes from mountain biking and want to pass it along.
  • 9 7
 What a stupid article. It's not like there are precious resources here that need to be preserved. People that are solely focused on technological advancements bring nothing to the table anyhow, so they can fuck off and we're none the worse for that
  • 2 0
 Well more could always be done but NICA is doing a great job getting high schoolers involved. I know because that's where I really got into it. The MN High School Cycling League gave me the chance to race and be on a team with other high school riders of all skill levels. The MN League has almost doubled in participation every year since it started in 2012. They are literally running out of trails that can host that many kids (upwards of 400 per race sometimes).
  • 3 1
 Pumptracks and and easily accessible trails are definitely an important part/tool to bring new riders to our sport, but another important factor is gear evolution, especially with kids bikes. I work in a bike shop and its always bothered me that kids bikes (particularly youth mountain bikes) often weigh more then some mid range adult bikes and have the lowest range components that make riding the bike even more difficult. Im not saying that entry level bikes should come kitted out with XX1 and carbon frames but smartly spec'd, mid-weight, reasonably priced bikes do more to get kids and beginners out on the trails then almost anything I've seen. Cheers.
  • 2 0
 As far as i can tell there are two ways to get into serious mountain biking;

1) continuing to progress from a kid or,
2) starting as an adult, renting a good quality full suss.

The latter is the route i took, after being dragged along on one uplift day and renting, i was hooked, went home and starting researching bikes straight away. I shelled out £2k on a new downhill rig 3 weeks later. The shop i rented from no longer rents. Last year i dragged 2 friends along to a UK uplift venue that rented. 3 weeks later one had bought his own downhill bike. I tried to take 3 different friends to the same uplift venue a few weeks ago and was told they no longer rented. Two of the guys tried to source bikes from elsewhere to no avail. Before you all say BPW rents, yes i know, but it has been impossible to book an uplift until recently.

I understand that renting very expensive high maintenance bikes is high risk and not profitable but how can newbies be expected to spend a minimum of a grand on a good quality full suss without ever trying the sport? Uplift venues are missing out on potentially many years of repeat customers and bikes shops are missing out on years of new bikes, maintenance, parts and accessories.

Maybe the large manufacturers could work together with some of the bigger uplift venues in the UK and form symbiotic relationships that have more foresight than "we'd get +/- 10% return on our investment in 2015".
  • 2 0
 Mtb priority have to be the love of nature and mountains. Make people love these and you have future. The "future" will find it's way, maybe trail and xc racing, or downhill and enduro, or bike park and freeride, or tour and adventure, or whatever everybody wants and inspire his soul. We don't need every year new 24", 26", 27,5", 29", 30,6"... bicycles, spare parts, 7,8,9.10,11,12...sprockets, carbon this and that, ultra expensive wheels, electronic suspension and drivetrain. A little evolution, to the point of refine, durability and geometry "corrections", are all we need to keep on.
We have to give our love of mountains and passion for the sport to our children, family, friends, everybody who can accept it, so the future will be on our sight...
  • 2 0
 I think society as a whole is putting a damper on the future of biking. Kids today seem to rather play video games, text, or watch tv. When I was a kid, we were on our bikes constantly. We didn't think twice about riding 4-5 miles to the candy store. Biking gave us the freedom to go wherever we wanted. Not so much today.
  • 2 0
 I guess I have a little different take on this. In a lot of areas craigslist and this website will have some pretty good deals on used bikes. I wasn't actually aware that people asides from bike shop employees and well to do 30-40 year olds bought new bikes. Just about everyone I know rides used bikes ranging from $250-$1700 or so in price. I personally have a fleet of just about all 2006 bikes and even though my freeride rig is almost ten years old that doesn't diminish from my fun any. If we have a community or riders the used option is always available and a great way to break into the sport.
  • 2 0
 When I started there were no trail centres, now there are, so the sport is waaaay more accessible where I am. If you know nothing about bikes as a newcommer, you don't know about all the expensive technical options, so its not scary.
  • 2 0
 Definetly feel not enough is being done to encourage new riders. Im old enough to be a part of the sharp rise of mountian biking throughout the 90's and then the unfortunate decline. "Back in the day" there was a lot more exposure, XC and slalom races were broadcast on NBC and other channels, pro mountain bikers were in commercials for soda and shoe companies, and there were even commercials for bike brands like Huffy ::GASP::. But when you think about it, XC and slalom are something even a rookie can look at and say "I can give that a try". And when there are commercials on TV, people who were never exposed think "Whoa, thats cool! And now im thirsty". And when there are commercials for mountain bikes for brands like Huffy, that rookie thinks "Hey, this looks affordable". Face it, we all probably started on shit bikes but it was all we needed to start the fire! Now there isnt nearly as much exposure for mountain biking as there was. There are no commercials for bikes, no pro mtn bikers advertising major brands on national channels, and the only events braodcast on national television are events like Rampage, Crankworx, etc etc. Now mountain biking as a whole is struggling to get new comers attention, and even when they do perchance see it on TV how many of those potential new comers are saying "That looks like fun.....I think ill give it a try", probably not to many. And say you do get the one or two rookies who watch Rampage or some other extreme event, now they are looking for bikes....so they look for bikes like they saw then riding on TV and are slapped in the face with price tags nearing 5 digits!

I love mtn biking and I do what I can to turn people on to it, but I do have to say.......the much emptier trails are a bonus.
  • 2 0
 Mtn biking used to be a passion that was powered by blood sweat and tears. riders in the New generation dont know what it means to dig build and work just so you can ride 5 minits to ride down hill. I remember when me and some of my buddy's spent three months chopping wood digging and putting together a trail that not only tested the limits of what could be done on a heavy down hill rig but all together made you wana puke just thinking about riding such tall wood ladders and hitting such gnarly drops. In the new age of riding people want easy fast flowy crap built for them the don't work or understand that every old school trail was were are sport began. And that the sport will never be what it was when I started riding. It's all about how light a bike his or who can jump the highest not about who is a well rounded rider in all styles of this sport.if you ask. Me the term mtn biker will eventually be nothing more than a guys who rides on a flat dirt road if the sport keeps going in the direction it's Going. Ever since digger left things just haven't been the same and I think the best thing for this sport would be to teach new riders the work ethic that we all had when we started and that to ride down you have to pick up a shovel now and then. The reason we had a place to ride in the first place is because of builders like digger and my friend Gary harder. So learn form the old guys they know what's best for are sport.
  • 2 0
 Pump tracks, skills parks, bike parks, all cities need to invest in this and encourage the youngsters of today.Rather than let them continue to X-box, Playstation, Facebook or whatever they do these days, get them outside in the fresh air and sunshine. Skate parks are being built in cities and towns, how about some bike parks.
  • 2 0
 Unfortunately it is difficult to get cities to fund these projects or provide land. The word of the day is litigation. Everyone is afraid of being sued. I swear it drives every decision made by our local government.
  • 2 0
 The future can be construed in many ways!!! There does need to be a happy median of consumer appreciation for bike level when it comes to a specific realm of this sport Despite stoke level, we all get stoked when we ride. There needs to be budget gateways for every genre or else this sport will slowly go the way of the dodo. Gone are the days of searching through the backpages of MBA, FLOW, TWENTYSIX, DIRT RAG, or DECLINE for those crazy "wacky arm waiving inflatable tube man" deals that for a majority of us previously sought after, and me personally (for me many, many xt rhyno lite xl wheelsets later). And yes I know of CHAINREACTION.COM. If you can afford to buy local please do so. Otherwise all of the LOCAL BIKE SHOPS we grew up with could cease to exist (just like the; DODO, DINOSAURS, BLOCKBUSTER, the QUICK STOP, CHUNDER, SMALLER BRANDS and SHOPS (GOAT, 243, etc). part 1 of 2
  • 2 0
 At the moment i am trying to convince my schoold to build a pump track for the ECA i run, one of the students dads has put up a tone of cash so it looks like it may get built. just need to get the land. there are alot of kids who are intrested in riding, the only problem we have is, as we are in Asia, alot of the parents dont want their kids out in the sun, they want them learning math! But some are great and really in to it.
  • 2 0
 It would be great to see mags and websites reviewing entry and mid level gear for both adults and kids... help first time buyers and those ready to make their first upgrade figure out what's decent and worth spending money on.
  • 2 0
 Here is why the entire bicycling industry is about to go Kapoot! First, bikes cost way too much. This is cycling, not motor sports. Should top of the line road bikes made in Taiwan be the same price as a hand built Ducati? Nope. But hey they do. And Top Tier mountain bikes are not much less. So here is why I believe the industry is phucked. The bicycle industry is phucked due to all the corporate companies like Shimano not legitimizing their pricing so the LBS can stay in business versus the customer going to Chain Reaction and buying the same product at sometimes below LBS wholesale prices. Second, hey great that all you big guys like Specialized, Trek, and Giant want to make dealership stores called concept stores. But hey if I'm going to go buy your top tier bike that can cost as much as a Ducati, well then you should act like a real dealership and instill said warranties, etc and make the industry legit so bike mechanics can make a livable wage and the shop doesn't get phucked on all the warranty works. Yea,,,chains in lieu of actual cash for all the Avid brake warranty work doesn't keep a LBS in business SRAM. Were we are at like it or not, the bicycle industry is no longer an industry of recreational fun. Just as the motorbike industry hasn't been....but yet both are considered that way...yet the bicycle industry has yet to conform and control it's industry so each entity of the industry can all make money and stay in business. There are a crap ton of on line motorcycle stores just as there are for bicycles...but...but... it is way more legitimized in the motorcycle world so the LMS can stay in business. So as long as the corporate bicycle companies keep doing what they are dong now...well it will all be internet except for concept stores where you can have a minimum wage high school kid work on your 12 thousand dollar bike! Awesome industry!
  • 1 0
 "Current growth of the sport is enough to sustain it in the future." -> My vote.

This activity of ours is a money and time sink, with the added "bonus" of bodily harm. That is the reason why the percentage of participation is low; it is and always will be an alternative "sport."

Also, I have faith that more industry "disruptors" like YT/Bikesdirect/Canyon will emerge to curb the tide of $10,000+ bikes. But the pool or users will more or less still be the same.

Just my opinion,

Bryan
  • 1 0
 I like the way MTB is heading. Maybe it's because the trail systems I have access to or something. But all the trails here get harder and harder the further you go. so the beginners can do the shorter loops while the more experienced can ride harder stuff by riding further in. I don't see a problem with the technology growing, the companies are obviously going to advertise their highest end products. No one will be impressed with the cheap stuff. We need the expensive stuff to keep advancing our sport, and the companies offer cheaper options for those that do not have the money to spend.
  • 1 0
 I ride with a local club in the North West of England, for about the last 9 years. Over that time our club has stayed around the hundred members mark, which sounds good, but things have changed. When I was a newbie Wednesday Night rides used to attract 15-20 riders, now we are down to 7-9. Sunday rides used to be similar 15-20, now 3-5. I'm now a ride leader and put back into the club, there are a few of us left but not as many as before, who have now moved on (road riding, kids, rambling etc..) We still have a strong Saturday ride of 15-20, but this is the traditional easy ride for beginners. The hard part seems to be to persuade people to start doing the harder rides. Our club basically leads rides around the Lakes, Peaks, Yorkshire etc a lot of the newbies have got bored of trail centres and man made trails and want to try the natural stuff. Perversely I prefer bike parks myself as I've done natural trails all my life, but I'm the exception to the rule I guess
  • 1 0
 In Sweden we have something called Allemansrätten (all mans right) it gives you the right to hike, bike or whatever on someone elses land, so the need of trails or trailcenters isn't vital for the accessability to ride. But that doesn't alone makes more people ride - good value bikes, better kidsbikes, marked trails, clubs or companies with newbie groups and information is the way to go.
  • 1 0
 It's always the same the company I bought my bike from sent me an email a week after I bought it telling me that they have a bike and it's better than the one I just got and I need to have it after I just got a new bike that I haven't even got broke in ???
  • 1 0
 Get the next generation into biking, start with small pump tracks where they can have fun, teach them your techniques to keep them entertained, and grow them to apretiate the sport!! From BMX to DH, let them try at their own pace, but keep it interesting, join them on the ride, and teach them how to take care of their bikes.
  • 2 0
 All I know is if this El Niño thing stays around the west coast much longer mt. Biking is not going to be seasonal. Please snow because we are wearing out our bikes before the season officially starts!
  • 1 0
 Year round riding in cascadia is the worst! (While i do enjoy a good powder day, the trade off tickles my pickle just fine)
  • 2 2
 Reading ''this El Niño thing'' was difficult for me to understand, i guess it is due to my mother language. Next time drop the ''El'', your make spanish speaking members easier. Smile
  • 1 1
 Life easier
  • 1 0
 The most advanced mountain bike without a trail makes the bike useless. (like right now in the north east of USA and many other places)
Mountain biking is 50% trail and 50% bike, this coming up season I'm going to spent more money and time on building my own dream bike park in my woods then actually riding the bike, I think that's what's going to progress my riding skills then spending more money on my bikes.
  • 3 2
 Kona is probably one of the best ways to break into this sport as of right now, their PRECEPT/PROCESS series is a pretty immaculately set up for beginners, let alone an affordable mode of egress/regression for us downhillers/riders looking for something else to keep us interested/entertained (just don't you dare say fuking say ENDURO). ENDURO is to ALL MOUNTAIN as FIXIE is to FIXED/TRACK (HIPSTERS GO SUCK IT!!!). I'm not saying that it's the same as the top of the line S-WORKS DEMO or a full on custom NICOLAI, it's not, but it's product like KONA's that can help this sport survive. And if you don't want to buy new, or your friend doesn't want to. You have one the of the best tools right in front of you, the PINKBIKE buy/sell page (it's epic). If you think about it snowboarding has a solid 15 years on us, and the most basic complete setup/models are affordable at well below $500 and you can have just as much goddamn fun as you can on some $2000 dollar burton setup. All in all let's keep trying to make this sport accessible to anyone and everyone. KEEP the STOKE levels high. if your not going to ride one bike, loan it to a buddy forcibly if must be. You never know when you might gain/create an extra enthusiast!! RIDE BIKES, DRINK BEERS, HAVE FUN! part 2 of 2
  • 1 0
 I agree to a certain extent, but nevermind bike companies building cheap bikes....
What i think we need is more LBS's taking in second hand bikes. Buy the second hand bikes, service them, and sell them on.
Of course it's difficult to get into mtb if you're looking at buying a new bike...

Get into mtb with your walmart bike, and a basic helmet ride basic trails, get your fitness up, and while doing that save up.
Get a second hand hardtail, and ride it to bits, replace stuff when it breaks, and little by little you'll end up with a decent bike.
If going into DH buy new pads and full face.

The average trail hasn't changed THAT much in 10 years, so there's no reason why you can't pick up a 6/7 year old bike and shred the trails! (be it DH XC DJ anything!).
  • 1 0
 I mentionned LBS'S since newcommers won't necessarily know about pinkbike, and they won't have people to recommend what they should get. With an LBS it'll be slightly more expensive than buying from the dude direct, but your bike will be serviced, and you'll hopefully get given the right tool for the job!
  • 1 0
 You say hipster as if it's a bad thing.
  • 1 0
 Oh, the irony of reading a story like this in the MTB press.

"Wow, you're doing a project that'll encourage new riders and progress people who already ride? We like the angle that you're self funded without any support from the industry and trying to get off the ground. We'd love to cover your story and maybe help you with some exposure for your project. You'll just need to pay for our professional photographer to come up for the day. Oh, and of course, there'll be the overnight fees too."
  • 2 0
 I TOTALLY FORGOT ABOUT GRASSROOTS DOWNHILL RACES. Thats where I started 13 years ago (RAGGED MTN, DHD). BEST THING EVER. HIGHLAND had a friday night race league this past season. MORE THINGS LIKE THAT NEED TO HAPPEN!!!
  • 1 0
 By the time those kids are in their twenties a solid mountain bike will cost over $5,000. The industry itself is pinching out a lot of new comers. Talking to folks that don't ride think its outrageous to pay $800.00 for a mountain bike. They gasp when I tell them I have over 4 grand in mine. Then I tell them its a mid level bike and doesn't come close to the upper offerings costing $8,000 plus. I get it cost a lot to develop these rides along with other costs like advertising and sponsorships bit its getting out of hand.
  • 1 0
 should encourage new riders, simply for the sake of fun for those kids. local big s dealer's crew build small pumptrack just outside their shop - that was kickass move even if it wont bring them new clients, kids are having fun out there and that's the main point though
  • 1 0
 Pump tracks are a great idea. We have 3 where I live (although one you can't use-very long story). They provide a great place to ride for all ages and abilities. We have just had a open gym put in our local park which gets used for about a week then no bothers it would have been much better to have put a pump track there instead.
  • 1 0
 my sons a lucky little shit!his birthday is the 8th and will be 10 and is going to inherit my dh,dj and xc bike.the kids are the future.hooooooook them up any chance u get or u will end up with a lazy xbox playing kid with no drive.gotta inspire the kids NOW!even if its not ur kids.
  • 1 0
 Some of us have been telling pb we want lower end bikes reviewed, but we get no satisfaction. If the concern in this piece is legit the fault lies with the industry and not the bulk of riders who, while they drool over super bikes, have more riding on how the $3000 model functions after someone else has ridden it for 2 years and then put it up for sale.
  • 1 0
 while this maybe about bike companies draining the future, trails do play apart, pump tracks alone are not the answer!

the real auestion is what is MTB?

Society is driving comerialisim to new heights itself, the couch potato now wants to have an app to ride on the 6" fru ju bike but not earn the fitness or the skills required for such a weapon.

then theyre are the so called trails digger built wide enough to get a truck down causing more i juries to punter riders sending them to hospistal for broken collarbones wrists and such what, similar thing happend at this period in snowboarding. the punters could buy good gear wanted to ride like pros but not earn the skills through hard work years of experience of failure and success, this is the couch potato MtBer now, buy technology dumb trails down so they can make GoPro hero edits.

for new kids coming in theyre is no reason to buy new except for helmets, shoes theyre are very good second hand bikes everywhere, esspeciallfor DH, but oh no mummy and daddy go spend 10-12k look factory yet dont buy proper protection for little Johhny!

many people can ride fast today as well, but have not developed basic skill sets, bikes and trails do the work u til shit halpens and then its bit shite dodo!

this is a socitital issue not just an MtB thing,same reason people line up to have the latest ime iphone, its the c o c k head culture I call it.
  • 1 1
 Ive ridden almost completely on pirate natural steep as shit trails all summer to get away from these soul draining trail destroying muppets and its been a blast, so dont blame techology we are inventing our own of destruction, parents being the worst teaching their young, the world is a tough and nasty place at times but the examples set are very poor indeed, not all parents but its definitely the majority otherwise society would not have swung the way it has! MTB will survive, companies may not in long run, thats Capatilisim, better education and clinics buy these corporate Giants like Sram Shimano Bell etc could help, but it does not have to be a Macdonalds bersion, keep it real, keep it natural, not fake, plastic and not for profit, out back for the right reasons is my callto these companies, I dare you. The only issue I still c is land access thats the danger, the PC brigade are stronger every year!
  • 1 0
 I dunno... I just saw Freehub being sold at Whole Foods last night. This poll is tough to answer, because it's too vague. There's a lot of generalization here, but I guess that's the point -- encouraging comments and clicks. Wink
  • 1 0
 There is controversy in North Van as established trails get dumbed down and become more "Flowy". Please, leave established trails as is and create "flow" on trails that are new.
Trails will never get too busy if you improve your skills to a level where you are one of the few able to ride gnarly trails, or it takes such a long time to ride uphill into a trail that few people ride it.

Either that or move to the central coast of BC. Actually don't. That's where I'm going
  • 3 1
 We need $10k super bikes to help push industry so then there can be trickle down benefits for the newer riders. Thats why we have Deore derailleurs with a clutch on them now.
  • 4 2
 We also need more people doing 70 foot front flips on DH bikes. It helps push each of us to... uhhh
  • 3 0
 My point is, new technology is expensive. If we didn't make super expensive high tech bikes, that technology would never make it to cheaper builds. Just like clutch derailleurs, which started out at the top level groupsets and has now trickled its way down. Same with carbon with companies like Santa Cruz offering more price point carbon frame options.
  • 1 0
 And one more thing to all you wimps out there if you don't want to get hurt don't ride a trail above your skill set and above all dont alter are black trail so you can ride down. Some riders like a risky trail
  • 1 0
 Growth of the sport is positive. Encouraging city municipalities to develop parks and support the sport of biking is the way to go! Check out Bike Parks Calgary on Facebook to see how we are supporting the future
  • 1 1
 I have to ask what I think is an obvious question:

Why is growth in ANY sport desirable in the first place? Growth in your business I understand; there is money to be made. Wanting growth in your religion, sure; there are souls to save. But in a sport? (Yes, I get the idea that mountain biking is often claimed to be the religion that worships a the altar of single track but that is tongue-in-cheek.)

Is the growth necessary for R and D to bring us new shiny trinkets for our trusty bikes? [Disclaimer: I LOVE shiny new toys!] In my particular area of Pennsyltucky, there are actually fewer rider that I run into in the woods than there were 15+ years ago. I don't miss them.
  • 2 0
 Hello there. Here in Croatia we have 0 indoor skate parks and 0 bike parks. How the hell can we encourage new riders? f*ck our government.
  • 2 0
 I've lived in 8 different places in my life but not one of them have had a decent trail system or a bike park. It is no wonder why kids aren't riding bikes for fun.
  • 3 0
 No matter what sport you can never put to much in the future.
  • 3 1
 I think there is more danger in mountainbiking getting too big. And getting all forests shut down, as a result of that.
  • 1 0
 but the more people the more power we have as a group.
  • 2 0
 But they have to be the 'right' people -- any old consumer is just going to consume, consume, consume and will kill the sport. Look at snowboarding. They marketed it to everyone, it blew up, and now there's a massive bubble where companies like Nike and Quicksilver have killed their snow programs all together because of the cost vs ROI. If we market to any old idiot, that's what we'll get, not people who actually love biking for biking. We won't get active community members who invest in their riding communities, trails and programs, but people who just want the best bike for the cheapest price. More isn't always more.
  • 4 2
 HARDER TRAILS. MORE AFFORDABLE BIKES. LONGER PRODUCT LIVES. SHREEEEEDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
  • 1 0
 There are loads of kids and new riders getting into MTB. The ripper categories at races are getting bigger every year. Pointless article.
  • 2 1
 I dont want more people on Trails. that just causes more problem than what we already have and make existing issues tougher to resolve.
As a rider i have to say f@$% growth!
  • 1 1
 My fave local trails are the least busy (generally more advanced) and I'd like to keep it that way. In Ontario Canada, the more people that get into something, the lamer it seems to get. People are terrified of risk.
  • 3 2
 If growth = Lower prices and more places to ride, I'm in. If not, maybe what we have is enough for the future.
  • 5 3
 Hey it's the Philly Pumptrack!
  • 1 0
 Looks dope.
  • 1 0
 I have no idea why someone would've downvoted you for that comment. I've only managed to hit it up once, but Kenn and the crew really impressed me with what they've done there.
  • 1 0
 Is that to me or carlierremy
  • 1 0
 Carlierremy.
  • 1 0
 Entry level always needs to be nurtured. However advances in tech make this sport forever new!
  • 3 2
 i beleive there is a fair amount going on , but you can always have more development !
  • 3 2
 Wouldn't a kid under 5' tall starting out in MTB want a small bike? Oops, can't because there are no more 26" trail bikes.
  • 1 0
 The kids market is better than ever. High end 20 and 24" bikes are what has made the difference. 26 has become a tiny incremental change as a result.
  • 1 3
 also too many Audi's and cocks in Porshes arriving at trail heads, either a beater car van or truck/ute is appropiate or youre not a MtBer if ya bike does not exceed the cost of your vechicle youre a dick! wanna ben rider! end
  • 1 3
 atleast leave the Audi, Porche, Ferrari at home, you can afford a beater and look real docuhes, also real MTbers can't type, spell, use proper grammar, Ok get over it , get real, ride more, less douche bags in the world being PC right fighters!
  • 2 0
 three words: Young Talent Industries
  • 2 0
 edit
  • 1 0
 Marketing. Companies do it. Who cares.
  • 1 3
 The best price for performance is bmx. Hands down. You can hit stair gaps, 20 footers to flat and most shore trails on bmx. Sure you won't be as fast, but it's way more fun.
  • 1 0
 BMX will always be BMX!!!
  • 2 1
 Yeah, try riding a bmx when you're 6'3 .
  • 1 0
 Got a problem with black trails?
  • 1 0
 From the slums of Shaolin
  • 1 1
 what future? post III world war atomic holocaust?
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