Continental describes their burly Der Baron 2.4 Projekt tire as being the ''enduro baron,'' which gives you an idea of what the Germans were going for when they designed their latest offering. The Baron comes in a single 2.4'' width, and with 240 thread-per-inch (60 TPI layered four times) under the tread, 180 TPI (60 TPI layered three times) count in the sidewalls, as well as their Apex protection insert at the bead, it's clearly meant for some serious riding on equally serious terrain.
Der Baron 2.4 Projekt Details• Intended use: all-around / soft conditions
• Size tested: 29'' x 2.4''
• 'BlackChili' compound
• 240 TPI (60 TPI x 4) under tread
• 180 TPI (60 TPI x3) sidewalls
• 'Apex' sidewall inserts
• Weight: 1,035 grams
• MSRP: $85.95 USD
•
www.continental-tires.com /
@ContinentalMTB All of that adds up to a portly 1,035-gram weight in the 29'' offering, so look elsewhere if you have a problem with a tire that weighs more than some cross-country bike frames do. It's also not inexpensive, at $85.95 USD but, as you'll read, grip and confidence in nasty conditions clearly don't come cheap.
Zee German's at Continental have thrown a lot of their tire technology at the Baron, including the always impressive BlackChili rubber compound that seems to be somehow as tacky as a Hallmark Christmas movie but without wearing away quick enough that you can actually see your money disappearing on the trail. Despite the name, Continental didn't actually mix chili peppers into the rubber compound, but they did infuse it with ''nanometric carbon soot particles, which are optimized in shape and surface properties for best uses for the intended tyre.'' Wissenschaft!
They're claiming that the mix makes for 26-percent less rolling resistance, a 30-percent higher friction value (grip), and a 5-percent increase in mileage, although I doubt those numbers come from comparing apples to apples. Regardless, I've found the BlackChili compound impressive in the past.
The Baron features a very open tread pattern designed to excel in soft conditions, or when things are wet and messy. When the tire was first introduced at Sea Otter, we were told that it was intended to mimic how a cut spike option performs without having to actually break out the snips. The aggressive yet open tread pattern should be able to penetrate into the ground and clear mud well, but not squirm on hard surfaces or roll like a tractor tire, two traits that a true mud tire is usually guilty of. Continental designed the Baron with this in mind, and also made sure to ramp the leading edges of the crown knobs in a search rolling speed.
As you'd expect with any tire that weighs over 1,000-grams, the Baron's casing is fairly robust. There's a 240 thread-per-inch (60 TPI layered four times) layer under the tread, and a slightly more supple 180 TPI (60 TPI layered three times) count in the sidewalls, both of which should provide a massive amount of protection against pointy rocks and possibly even gunfire. Continental also employs their Apex inserts just above the Baron's beads for some added flat protection for when you're running super low pressures, and all of the above is also tubeless-ready when combined with some sealant of your choice.
PerformanceThe idea of there being a 'best tire' is about as true as the Easter bunny; there's just too many different types of terrain, conditions, and riding styles, let alone when you get into what one person values over another when it comes to wear rate, rolling speed, weight, and other things you may or may not care about. One man's tire choice is another's worst nightmare, but I suspect that anyone who uses a set of Der Baron 2.4 Projekt tires in mucky conditions will find themselves to be upright and in more control than they expected. In short, this tire is unreal in wet, or even just soft, settings.
They throw sticky mud off of themselves like a wet dog shaking off water, as you'd expect given their very open lug layout, and they're just as surefooted in slick conditions as Schwalbe's Magic Mary that everyone and their cousin seems to love. But where the big Continental has an advantage over the Mary is when it's not just mud and soft dirt that you have to contend with, but also when the trail is covered in wet roots. I've been somewhat let down by the Mary's performance on slick roots, obstacles that it seems to prefer to skitter over if you don't exercise extreme caution. The Baron, on the other hand, offers more grip and control through sections that have more wood than dirt.
This won't be an issue if your trails don't have loads of roots on them, but those who are lucky enough to be constantly tested by Mother Nature's tentacles will likely be big fans of the Baron. What you might not be a fan of, however, is their rolling speed, which feels to be, despite what I've read elsewhere, about on par with what you'd expect from such an aggressive design. They're heavy, which also doesn't help matters, and the open tread pattern means that they like to make you work for your momentum. That said, this is really only noticeable when on hard packed ground or when it's dry out.
Despite their slow rolling feel on dry or hard ground, they're also very impressive when it hasn't been raining for days on end. I ran them between 17 and 23 PSI, tubeless, of course, and felt zero weird knob squirm or odd casing flex, and they're surprisingly great all-around'ers when you consider how mind-blowingly awesome they perform in the mud.
Most riders don't even change their tire pressure for the given conditions, let alone swap tires out, which makes it difficult to ever recommend a true mud tire to the average person, but the Baron acts like a proper mud option when needed but without getting sketchy and weird when it's dry.
I can't recall a single moment when the Barons let me down in the cornering department, with a consistent edge feel to them that doesn't have that on/off sensation that can lead to some scary moments. Predictable and stable - what more could you ask for? Certainly not increased braking traction, as the Barons do drop anchor well. I also suffered exactly zero flats while using them, and they're showing little signs of wear.
Pinkbike’s Take: | As great as they are, their 1,035-gram weight and slow-ish rolling speed will make them a definite no-go for some riders, especially those who don't need such a burly or mud-capable tire. But, for a guy like me who lives in the Pacific Northwest and has to deal with mucky trails on probably half of my rides, the 29'' x 2.4'' Baron is hard to beat. - Mike Levy |
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its funny when tire companies claim TPI count for layering lower TPI count multiple times - it doesn't work like that in terms of tire performance from carcass construction
some high end open tubular road tires have genuine 320TPI carcass, and the performance difference to vulcanised lower TPI count tires like Conti GP4000II is very noticeable
But, this does not matter because those stories about wrapped casings or teared on sidewall near the bed are very common. I have destroyed 3 conti's last season and I simply quit them (2 years ago I had cut through apex sidewall). Apex or not, ProTection or not, casing is not robust, period.
If you run a guding business then off course go for spec because they wear out slower so you save cash. Also percentually your clients will rather be Joeys than shredders so they won't give a fk if it is butcher or ground control. But the braking and cornering grip of minion dhf MGrip over butcher Control is just gigantic. At least in central and northern Europe. Perhaps not in sandy Spanish trails.
If you were from Madeira though, I bet you'd be running my minion
Continental come on let's fix this casing issue.
Did you try a der Baron Projekt or der Kaiser Projekt? If not, you should before you comment. These are different. That's like saying that Double Down isn't enough because EXO is too flimsy.
Agree on the casing leaks which is a major design flaw (gonna try a different sealant), but performance-wise, these are like no other Conti - you can't even compare these to the der Baron/der Kaiser Trail tires, or the Baron or Kaiser DH tires. All very different. They should lovably name their tires less confusingly to help end-users more easily see the differences.
continental.....= German for "does not stay inflated"
P.s your a pisshead
I refuse to try any more Conti tires. They've lost my trust like they've lost many others in this comment section. I've found Maxxis to be reliable and overall the better tire compared to any brand. If WTBs lasted longer I'd use them. But too much leakage, tyres that go wobble in the night and high prices and I see no reason to even bother anymore. Nothing like $40 a ride! I get that you're a fan of them and they really work for you. Good on you! Keep rollin.
It's like companies saying they have 800 thread count bed sheets. Just doesn't count
Everyone else who has TK stories, these are not TKs. I am certain that there has been a bad batch (or two) in the last year as almost eeryone has warped or torn the bead on a TK. One set of Der Baron Projekts (very different to the old Baron/ Rubber Queen) for four weeks training and the Trans-Provence. No punctures, no warping and enough rear tread left to ride for another couple of weeks when I got home (just). Best tyre ever (although I have not tried the new Michelins).
Also, funny that an Orange Seal fanboi downvoted my experience w their sealant. It's not my fault it didn't seal up the Conti's - probably mostly Conti'S fault, but the fact stands that it was the worst of the 3 on the dBP/dKP.
Then buy then buy them in a store so you get the same quality as we do.
And with regard to your suggestion above, I mean a real DH tyre as I already hit my rims enough with dual ply Minions, even when running a lot of psi. Running a mid-weight tyre would probably mean destroying my rims and pinch flatting all over the place, which isn't my idea of a nice day out on the bike.
Now Minions do pack with mud more than Shorties and indeed it is an issue I know and mud pile stuck to tyre changes 1ply tyre into 3" Gazzaloddi from 2003. (I had Highrollers and they are terrible with that) But compared to Shorty typ tyre, Minions are less suspectible to be caught by diagonal roots on downs, and offer MUCH more grip on slick rocks. It is worth mentioning here that brakes play a major role in places as wet as ours. I hope you don't run Formulas. Latest Guides and Shimanos allow me to brake on most of wet slick rock with front brake at angles as big as 30 degrees and also stay controlled over roots if there is no other place to brake on. What brakes are you running?
Cheers
Trouble is I come across all kinds of surface during one ride, lots of slick clay mud where the Shorties would excel but also rooty descents and some rocky bits here and there. I ride DH but also lots of "enduro" (in my case a bunch of DH tracks mixed with steep natural trails and some tarmac/fire roads to link up it all up).
I too liked the old 26" Baron and am getting on well with the DerBaron 650 on the rear this Winter. It has tough sidewalls without too much weight and the compound seems good even when the ground is frozen. For greasy (clay) Southern UK trails in Winter I found that same Baron a bit slidey upfront and appreciate the deeper tread on the Shorty.
Compared to a Shorty 2.3 Maxxterra on the rear the Baron doesn't hook up on steep slippy climbs just quite as well, its almost there though. It's going towards DHRII territory there, a great Summer tyre (although Baron is better than DHRII, to be fair the Shorty hooks up on steep climbs like no other IMO, unless casting the mind back to the "boat anchor" Swamp Thing!) maybe its the ramped knobs on Baron and DHRII that limit steep uphill traction in the wet a little.
There's a very level headed comprehensive review (see link) comparing 3 great tyres, Tim's other pieces on the WT Maxxis tyres are interesting too, heres the comparison link - wheelsizeagnostic.com/review-shootout-schwalbe-magic-mary-vs-conti-der-baron-vs-maxxis-shorty . Another good Enduro tyre comparison on the Enduro Mag site aswell. Both are worth a read.
Issues, yeah, I had a Shorty go unusable wobbly last year when the bead reinforcement rope slipped (warrantied, thanks Maxxis HQ) and my DerBaron rear does look a bit wobbly - it doesn't seem to notice when riding though. These tyres are too expensive to chuck before they wear for wobbliness reasons. Are they just trying too hard to make light pliant carcasses and thats why the get compromised? Come to think of it my 26" Baron got warrantied due to a scary crosshatch pattern appearing in the sidewalls as if the reinforcement fabric was coming through the rubber. So at least these guys stand by what they made.
So much great rubber nowadays.
Enjoy the mud guys.
Improved: - allround conditions grip - wet conditions and roots grip
Less well compared to Kaiser Projekt: - dusty conditions (by a small margin) - more sensitive to tyre pressure (0.1 bar below my preferred pressure and the carcass folds over in turns)
Bottom line: I now routinely check my pressures before every ride (you should do that anyway imo). Result: I have greatly improved traction in many situations. Added benefit: my DH bike lost something like 700 grams compared to the Kaisers, which made the bike much more lively. Great gravity tyre.
PS: also ride 'em on the Enduro, funny what consistent tyre feel between different bikes does for you...
I too liked the old 26" Baron and am getting on well with the DerBaron 650 on the rear this Winter. It has tough sidewalls without too much weight and the compound seems good even when the ground is frozen. For greasy (clay) Southern UK trails in Winter I found that same Baron a bit slidey upfront and appreciate the deeper tread on the Shorty.
Compared to a Shorty 2.3 Maxxterra on the rear the Baron doesn't hook up on steep slippy climbs just quite as well, its almost there though. It's going towards DHRII territory there, a great Summer tyre (although Baron is better than DHRII, to be fair the Shorty hooks up on steep climbs like no other IMO, unless casting the mind back to the "boat anchor" Swamp Thing!) maybe its the ramped knobs on Baron and DHRII that limit steep uphill traction in the wet a little.
There's a very level headed comprehensive review (see link) comparing 3 great tyres, Tim's other pieces on the WT Maxxis tyres are interesting too, heres the comparison link - wheelsizeagnostic.com/review-shootout-schwalbe-magic-mary-vs-conti-der-baron-vs-maxxis-shorty . Another good Enduro tyre comparison on the Enduro Mag site aswell. Both are worth a read.
Issues, yeah, I had a Shorty go unusable wobbly last year when the bead reinforcement rope slipped (warrantied, thanks Maxxis HQ) and my DerBaron rear does look a bit wobbly - it doesn't seem to notice when riding though. These tyres are too expensive to chuck before they wear for wobbliness reasons. Are they just trying too hard to make light pliant carcasses and thats why the get compromised? Come to think of it my 26" Baron got warrantied due to a scary crosshatch pattern appearing in the sidewalls as if the reinforcement fabric was coming through the rubber. So at least these guys stand by what they made.
So much great rubber nowadays.
Enjoy the mud guys.
Bold statement!
I have been nothing but blown away with how well the shorty has taken on the PNW wet season. From North shore shit show to Bellingham greasy trails its never blown out a corner on me....
I guess maybe this will be a tire I have to try... especially if I can get to ride and potentially hate it and then message you with a 300 word hate essay to your inbox... cause thats how Pinkbike works correct?
You know I hear this from a lot of people... yet the North Shore is Roots and rocks... has not been a problem, maybe my riding is just so hack and slash I don't notice haha.
Also the compounds continue to be changed over time. I haven't tried the new Baron Projekt but the old one had the most amazingly sticky yet durable rubber. The old Rubber Queens (UST 26) weren't quite as sticky but rolled faster and wore at least as well - whilst the newer Trail Kings (Protection 27.5) roll even quicker but are prone to tearing/breaking up so wear faster.
I wish they made better carcasses because I think the best of Conti's black chili tyres have the best rubber on the market but I've found recent Maxxis tyres so much more painless with tubeless, tougher and better feeling on the trail
Any 29er recommendations for a burly descending tyre.
Looking to beef up the specialized Enduro for an adventure in the French alps next summer.
#mindblown
Suggesting another wheel size just when everyone has almost stopped losing their shit sounds like heresy to me