The Cutaway Special - Interbike 2018

Sep 19, 2018
by Mike Levy  
Interbike 2018


I had never heard of Wiawas before walking by their booth, but this diced up and sanded down carbon BMX frame pulled me in faster than a donut sale at Tim Hortons. They're a Korean brand who is probably better known in the archery world of all places, and that's where they've borrowed some technology to manufacture their Nano Carbon frames.

See that white layer in the cut up carbon downtube? That's called S-Core.

So, what Wiawas are doing is placing a foam core in between the two layers of carbon fiber that make up the tube, and they've got some pretty interesting test result numbers to go along with it as well. According to their own tests, an S-Core tube is 41% stronger in a bending test, 31% stronger in compression, and 45% stronger under distortional loads compared to a ''normal carbon shaft in the same quantity."

Wiawas aren't the first to put foam in the walls of a carbon tube (ten PB points to whoever can remind me who else did it), and while I have no idea if it's as good as they say it is, it sure does sound cool.
Interbike 2018
Wiawas is a Korean brand who's putting a foam core inside the walls of their carbon tubes.



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Maybe it was just me, but do you remember when fidget spinners came out and you were like, ''WTF is this useless thing?'' I feel like such a hypocrite for wanting to permanently borrow this freehub demo gadget from the Industry Nine booth... I couldn't stop watching the damn thing. And the sound!

The fidget spinner you're looking at shows how I9's six pawls interact with the 120-point drive-ring to deliver a 3-degree engagement. But I mostly just like watching it spin around.



Interbike 2018


Push Industries is always busy working on new stuff, but they didn't have anything previously unseen in their booth this year. What they did have, however, were these neat clear tubes to show how their ACS3 coil spring conversion kits work. In the upper tube (the one without a coil in it), you can see the adjustable air-sprung bump stop system that runs down the middle of the coil to the spring seat. This see-through display lets Push adjust the pressure in the bump stop so you can feel with your hands the very noticeable difference it makes.

The $389 USD ACS3 kit will go into the 2015 - 2018 Fox 36, 2014 - 2018 RockShox Pike, or a 2016 - 2018 Lyrik or Yari forks. All of the components are hand assembled and manufactured in Push's Loveland, Colorado, facility.



Alto CMX275


I already used this photo of Alto's cutaway hub in a previous Interbike article, but I'm going to use it again because cutaway. You're looking into one of their Boost mountain hubs with an XD driver, and while you can't quite see them, there are four pawls and a 48-tooth drive-ring in there, too. An aluminum axle runs through high-end NSK ABEC7 bearings (or you can upgrade for an extra $365), and both end-caps are threaded so you can be bang-on with your bearing preload. Or way off, actually, so don't mess it up.

The US-made rear hub goes for $462 USD, while a front costs $339 USD.



Interbike 2018


This cut open Kali Shiva full face shows off their Nano Fusion shell, which sounds like it's from a NASA science lab. It isn't, but it is an in-molding process that joins acrylic self-healing foam and carbon nano-tubes with the shell.

In English, that means that Kali used a different density foam, one that they say "dissipates energy more efficiently and in a smaller volume than any other material on the market,'' in places on the shell that are likely to make hit the ground.




Interbike 2018


Okay, technically this isn't a cutaway or see-through demo, but I could see through the hub shell when I removed it from the hub body. Huh? Yeah, that's what I said when I first saw TwoPointZero's modular Phoenix Hub System. Actually, that's what I said after I learned about it, too. It's an interchangeable hub shell setup that allows a rider to use the same inner hub body (freehub, axle, brake mount) on different wheel builds, just so long as the other wheels have TwoPointZero's hub shells in the middle of them.


Interbike 2018
Interbike 2018
A massive aluminum nut holds the inner and outer sections of TwoPointZero's modular hub together.


TwoPointZero says that their hub "eliminates the need for multiple cassettes," so if a rider had a wheelset that they use for racing and another that they use for training or just to beat on, you can change from one to the other without needing to move your cassette or rotor over to a different hub... But you do need to use the supplied giant-sized socket to undo a massive aluminum nut that holds the two pieces together. The inside face of the outer section is shaped to lock into the outer wall of the inner hub body, thereby keeping the two from ever going in different directions. I bet you'd want some nice grease on those faces, too.


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They're close to releasing a mountain bike version that will be compatible with all of the freehubs, frame dimensions, and axle sizes, and you'll be able to get it in Centerlock and 6-bolt flavors. The MSRP is still TBD, but it's probably safe to assume that it'll be close to the road hub's $750 USD asking price. That includes two outer hub shells, one inner hub, the aluminum nut that holds the two pieces together, and the largest socket ever used on a bicycle component.



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Here are the whirly bits inside of a Pinion gearbox that was out on display at the Outdoor Demo. While they said that no one had lost a finger yet, I wouldn't be surprised if it happened before the end of the day.


91 Comments

  • + 39
 Erm, that swappable hub seems like a pretty dumb idea to me. Instead of swapping cassettes you swap the whole hub?? Even if it is easier than removing a cassette, you'd still have to remove the brake rotor... Wtf? Who comes up with this shit?
  • + 3
 It says you wouldn't have to swap the rotor
  • + 6
 Yeah, seems like it would be a lot cheaper and easier just to have a separate cheap wheel with a cheap cassette if you want another for a beater.
  • + 5
 @DC1988: You're either going to have to remove either the rotor OR the cassette, because both are going to be wider than the aperture in the hub... unless you have a tiny ass road cassette.
  • + 3
 @sam264:
Perhaps the rotor will slide off/on centre lock style held in place by the big nut
  • + 26
 I have dt swiss hubs in all my wheels, I just pull on the cassette and cassette + body come off and I just plug them onto another wheel / hub.

Takes me 30 sec
  • + 1
 @DC1988: Looks like the big ass nut is behind the centrelock mount, so you'd have to remove the rotor to access it, which requires having either a cassette tool or BB tool AND the specialist socket.
  • + 3
 @DC1988: But look at it and explain how that would work? The center part has to pass through a hole that's smaller than a cassette or brake rotor, yet end up with a cassette on one side and a rotor on the other. Unless they've invented a folding rotor, it's got to come off.
  • + 4
 @alexhyland: Or, if we assume pricing is similar to the road model, 2 expensive hubs and cassettes would still be cheaper. $750 for the first hub with everything required, $150 for the second shell (and the MTB version will almost certainly cost more because that's how it always is). So $900 for 2 hubs. You could get 2 King hubs and still come out ahead, and that's the most stupid overpriced bike thing I can even think of (which we all know is saying a lot).

Maybe if they reduced the price of this by 60-70% it might make sense. Maybe.
  • + 3
 @TheHill: DT240s are just an amazing hub and they roll so dang well. That simplicity and ease of service/repair is the paramount of Engineering philosophy
  • + 4
 How much toot are they smuggling in that cutt away frame.
  • - 1
 @Svinyard: Funny how different experiences can be.
I got dt240 too. Could not possibly dislike them more.
First of all mine are centerlock which really limits what brake you can run and you need tools on trail you don't usually carry in case something comes loose or gets bent, then for some reason the bearings do not last in them no matter what quality i put in. Original or Enduro ceramic, doesn't matter after a few month they all feel exactly the same as the freehub... never had that with kings or I9... i would even trade them for some generic shimano's if it wasn't for rebuilding my rims on different hubs...
  • + 3
 What if one day you want your hub to sound like a swarm of bees but the next day you want to quiet like a ninja??
  • + 3
 @deiru: Then you might be a redneck.
  • + 3
 Replies here are pretty funny. Cassette is mounted to the axle which is removable, rotor is mounted to the hub shell so you would need two rotors (cheap) and only 1 cassette (expensive). This is obviously aimed at XC guys that have an ultralight race wheel set that they can't ride every day because of cost and failure risk. A lot of those people are older and have enough money to have multiple wheel setups. Not saying it is a great solution, but that is their marketing.

Where they are really missing the boat is the fact that it will support any hub standard that comes out without replacing the wheels. Many of us have seen it go from QR>135>142>148>157x26>275>29 That is 15 possible combinations currently. For me personally I have had expensive setups on every standard so if there had been an option like this with King or I9 I would have saved thousands of dollars in wheel swaps.
  • + 3
 Wish they had Semenuk on display with sections cut out as I am sure he is not human !!!!!
  • + 2
 Couldn't agree more. WTF? Just build a backup set of wheels you can switch out. I bet you'll want to change the tires, too.
  • + 2
 @salespunk: look at the images Bro, the rotor isn't mounted to the hub shell.
  • + 1
 @deiru:
asking the real questions
  • + 1
 @michibretz: put decent bearings in them. Enduro are cheap bearings. Get some INA or *ag those are proper industrial grade. Cost more but will last so much longer.
  • + 1
 Now that's what i'm talking about.
  • + 1
 @Weens: I had some folding rotors, but they don´t fit the brake caliper after folding...
  • + 18
 Transparent fork lowers would be sweet....
  • + 7
 If they are ohlins, then you could watch the air spring assembly popping out at you!
  • + 14
 Come on gearboxes..... you gotta perfect that schdit before SRAM announces their Pterodactyl 13 speed 8-60T 3lb cassette.
  • + 4
 For $800
  • + 11
 I want definitely in future bike with gearbox and belt drive BUT!! why are that sprocket inside whole metal? my feet doesnt have so big torque, like my TDI motor in Van, where is similar sprockets Big Grin Big Grin guys! you need invent some 800gr version max, otherwise it stays like concept like still is... i didnt ever see it on the hill... also, does it at least same effectivity like clasic chain? just under 1% of power loss? Hammersmidt had much, Shimano Alfine is better, but not reliable and also big losses.... please... make it useful, i want it to use, but...
  • + 36
 If you calculate the torque you create by pedaling, it is actually not far off a small car.
  • + 21
 The crankarms (leavers) are quite long compared to the leaver in an engine so you generate the equivalent torque to a small diesel engine. Pinion explained all of that in their release. They are around third the weight of a motorbike gearbox and they have to withstand 3-4 times the torque so they are quite light from this point of view.
  • + 17
 Put some of that SUPER Magnesium in there Wink
  • + 7
 The Torque in a bicycle gearbox can be quite high so I don't think you will see self lubricating plastic pinions anytime soon. And the engineers behind Pinion worked for Porsche so they should know a thing or two about light gearboxes Big Grin
  • + 7
 @jmrmuc: Well, they did an internship at Porsche....
  • + 3
 @jmrmuc: I'm sure gearbox emissions won't be worse off the dyno...
  • + 2
 That pinion box is a thing of beauty and the design team is faced with a serious adoption problem on multiple fronts. The first is durability where a mistake would savagely kill their business from the get go. The second is weight, overzealous shaving could result in catastrophic failure and buyers should be willing to accept the extra weight. The third is resistance to change - twist grip shifting is something I've never seen on a mountain bike, not even sure how I'd deal with it. The forth is price compared with the basically simpleton design of decades old derailleur shifting, again shaving cost could impact durability. I'm rooting for their success.
  • + 7
 I have massive aluminum nutts.
  • + 5
 " torque you create by pedaling, it is actually not far off a small car"

Are we sure about this? A 500W pedaling output is pretty high but a low end 10A alternator on a small engine puts out at least 1200W. And that's just running off the accessory belt at idle. A quick search brought up some physics class quizzes showing average pedal torque around 20Nm. Toyota's 1.6L Corolla engine puts out about 160Nm. Think about accelerating a bike to 15mph on a flat vs pushing a car vs flooring the gas. By my calculations I'll be receiving about 8 downvotes for too much math...
  • + 4
 @Sardine: by my math, with a 75kg rider and a 175mm crank they could generate almost 125Nm at the cranks
  • + 3
 @Nobble: But you can almost double that. Some force also goes through the other pedal and if you really hammer it down you go into 200s.
  • + 17
 @Sardine: Watts are units of power. Torque is a measure of force. The difference in this case being rpm. A car idles at 600-800 rpm. Human pedals at 1/10th that, even less in very high torque situations. Also peak torque is much higher than average torque for pedaling a bicycle. It is peak torque that will cause things to break.

Imagine a 170 lb rider starting on a steep hill. Assume they stand on one pedal with ~90% of their bodyweight. So force on the pedal is 153 lbs. Crank arm length is 175 mm = 6.9 in = .575 ft.) , so torque at the crank is 153*.575= ~88 ft lbs. Assume a 32t chainring and 50t rear cog which gives a gear ratio of (1.5625), the torque seen at the rear hub is 88*1.5625 = 137.5 ft lbs. That is comprable to a small car.
  • + 2
 @Sardine: Pinion has to assume the strongest riders (think about that broken effigear gear box at the start of a DH world cup race). Some of them can produce more than 2000 W. Assuming 100 RPM, that already creates 191 Nm. But of course, power output when pedaling is not smooth. Assuming it follow a sinus curve, you get to a maximum torque of 270 Nm.
  • + 3
 @mrleach: thumbs up for explanations/comments based on facts and physics!
  • + 0
 @Sardine: i dont care how you stage the numbers, anyone who thinks a human leg puts more torque on a bicycle crank than even the smallest automobile engine is delusional.
Anyone who has ever been kicked back while trying to start a motorcycle knows this.
  • + 0
 @mrleach: you need to stop at the crank. 88ftlbs.
  • + 10
 Nitpick regarding I 9 freehub description; 120 points- yes, however the pic shows that this is achieved not by a 120 tooth ring, but with 60 teeth and two sets of 3 pawls. Each set are offset by 3 degrees, with only 3 pawls engaged at a time. Interestingly- one of the pawls in that pic which should be engaged- isn't.
  • - 2
 customer comes into see mechanic "man this is the 5th hub this year...."
Mechanic: "just get the new bontrager rapid drive hub. No fancy spokes either."
  • + 5
 My I-9's have never failed me, and have survived being on three DH frames. Yes the proprietary aluminum spokes are a PITA, but they do make a hub that uses standard J-type spokes.
  • + 1
 Nice catch! Pardon the pun.
  • + 5
 "According to their own tests, an S-Core tube is 41% stronger in a bending test, 31% stronger in compression, and 45% stronger under distortional loads compared to a ''normal carbon shaft in the same quantity."

And in impact testing?
  • + 8
 Probably be dead silent. Combine that with an XTR drivetrain, and your bike would probably make zero noise whatsoever.
  • + 1
 Isn't that a road bike frame. Probably not an issue there.
  • + 4
 putting foam core to increase moment of inertia has been in multiple industries(f1,golf clubs, etc) for a long time. increases the stiffness with minimal weight gain.

looks like to me that they did tube & lug construction and they decided to use foam core tubes instead. Theres probably some weight savings here but i think this kind of stuff is not better than an integrated monocoque

www.rockwestcomposites.com/materials-tools/core-materials/rohacellr-foam-core
  • - 2
 @jollyXroger I would imagine that "31% stronger in compression" is alluding to that.
  • + 5
 @Trailsoup: Clearly you dont ride on the roads in the uk Smile
  • + 2
 @ka-brap: Its abit vague but that doesn't really cover what he is asking.

Not the best analogy but compress the cardboard centre of a toilet roll between your palms and its allot stronger than if you just poke the side with the tip of your finger.
  • + 1
 must be some vibration elimination too , I guess???
  • + 1
 @Trailsoup: You are correct in this, but it does not say anywhere in the article that this is suitable only for Bastion Cycles design and not Robot Bike. Both companies use 3D printed titanium lugs and carbon fibre tubes, but one makes road bikes and the other mountain bikes.

@ka-brap: As @dbox123 already said it's not exactly the same thing. I assume when they tested the compression it was at very low speeds, while the "impact" that I referred to is at much higher speeds.
  • + 2
 @Trailsoup: It's a race BMX frame, not a road bike frame
  • + 3
 @jollyXroger: I honestly wasn't trying to be snarky with that comment, just wondering. But obviously, you're both right. And quite often, Asian suppliers simply don't know what we are looking for. They quite often aren't mountain bikers and also use the wrong words when describing things, which is totally understandable.
  • + 3
 @Trailsoup: it's a bmx frame
  • + 3
 @Ironyyyy: Lug and tube carbon construction's biggest advantage is that it's strong. It's a low tech and heavy way to build a carbon frame but far more tolerant of getting whacked against things than a monocoque, which makes perfect sense for a BMX. On that note between the tube thickness and the foam between them that frame is seriously overbuilt. The current BMX world champ rides for them too, so they clearly know their stuff.
  • + 2
 @Ironyyyy: If I apply the parallel axis theorem, then the moment of inertia would increase if I took that mass on the inner side of the foam core and stuck it on the outside. There may be something peculiar about composite materials that takes advantage of the double wall. Or it may be marketing bs. Hard to tell in this industry.
  • + 4
 Looks like @mikelevy got so mesmerized by the I9 hub he counted the teeth in the drive ring twice.
Or was he just seeing double?

If you'll watch closely, there are 60 teeth in the drive ring and two sets of 3 prawls. Each set of 3 prawls is out of phase with the other so the engagement effectively doubles to 120.
  • + 5
 I'll take the Car Bonetube for 10pts, Trebek. Muahahaha, that's what your mother did at least! Sincerely, Sean Connery
  • + 6
 isn't it wiawis? not wiawas.
  • - 7
flag stumpymidget (Sep 20, 2018 at 3:17) (Below Threshold)
 Who cares?
  • + 7
 @stumpymidget: obviously he does jackass.
  • + 2
 Hey @mikelevy, does the self healing foam in the Kali Shiva do what it sounds like and allow a helmet that has had a light knock to self repair so that you don't have to replace it after accidentally dropping it on the garage floor?

And is there any news yet on Pinion doing a rapidfire style shifter?
  • + 7
 Forget about the Kali or any of this stuff that shows the internals. We can figure all of this out. What we need is a cutaway @mikelevy. Ain't no one figured out what's going on in there.
  • + 6
 $339 front hub
  • + 2
 As for the Pb points, one brand that i can remember that had a dual tube setup like these (but wiht honeycomb between the 2 layers), was italian brand FRM.
  • + 4
 Bianchi with their countervail for 10 PB points.
  • + 1
 The Zipp 2001 used cored laminates back in 1992, but that was a road bike, so who cares. Klein used sandwich on the Mantra carbon in 1999.
  • + 4
 I just want a 29er enduro bike with a gearbox!
  • + 2
 Check out Sick bicycles bro
  • + 1
 Yeah right...when you cut a carbon frame , no matter what producer, it looks that clean. What a joke!
  • + 1
 Trek have also used foam sandwich in their carbon frames (remedy comes to mind), especially around the BB area.
  • + 2
 @mikelevy, you need a manicure!
  • + 2
 Not my hand ????
  • + 2
 @mikelevy: Then who's hands are they? What have you done and do we need to call The Wolf?!
  • + 1
 Where is the porta-potty at again ?
  • + 1
 i give the phoenix hub a solid zeropointzero
  • + 1
 Maybe you can just use standard tools to change out your cassette?
  • + 1
 Swapping hub interals huh Eek that’s neat!
  • + 2
 I love cutaways Big Grin
  • + 2
 I want to see how they make those cutaways and have such a clean edge on everything! That’s the amazing part. I can’t cut bars down without having ends that look like a broken off tree.
  • + 2
 @sledMXer: if it's on a carbon bar use tape on the inside of where you're cutting it prevents a fray
  • + 4
 @sledMXer: you are using the wrong blade. A 32t or carbon specific hacksaw blade with a saw guide and a bit of tape will make it perfect. Then hit it with a bit of nail polish on the end
  • + 2
 @Svinyard: I know, I was just be a bit dramatic. I have the Park Tools saw guide just for cutting bars. I haven't heard of using nail polish either. Is there a preferred color that makes one faster? Smile

@icarlson112: I put tape on the outside of the bar, haven't heard of putting it on the inside.
  • + 2
 @sledMXer: red makes it go faster of course. I dunno, I just use the clear stuff. Prob should ask my wife lol
  • + 1
 MMMMM
  • + 1
 Swatbox festival

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