Ellsworth Rogue Sixty - Review
The all-new, 160mm-travel Rogue Sixty is an important bike for Ellsworth, probably more so than any other bike in the company's history. If it bombs, well, it could be a serious strike to an already tattered reputation. But if it's a winner, it could signal a fresh beginning for a brand that's seen its mostly unfair share of criticism, much of it from people who've never even thrown a leg over an Ellsworth.
The bike in question features their 'XT 1X' build kit that, you guessed it, comes with an XT drivetrain and a single chain ring. This build would normally ring in at $6,495 USD with a set of DT Swiss aluminum wheels, but my test rig showed up with a set of color-matched Reynolds carbon hoops that bumped the price up to $8,420 USD.
The bike in question features their 'XT 1X' build kit that, you guessed it, comes with an XT drivetrain and a single chain ring. This build would normally ring in at $6,495 USD with a set of DT Swiss aluminum wheels, but my test rig showed up with a set of color-matched Reynolds carbon hoops that bumped the price up to $8,420 USD.
Ellsworth Rogue Details
• Intended use: all-mountain / enduro
• Wheel size: 27.5''
• Rear wheel travel: 160mm
• Four-bar, Horst Link suspension
• Carbon front triangle, seat stays
• Internal dropper post routing, Di2 compatibility
• 66° HTA, 74° STA
• Weight: 29lbs 8oz
• MSRP: $8,420 USD
• www.ellsworthbikes.com
• Intended use: all-mountain / enduro
• Wheel size: 27.5''
• Rear wheel travel: 160mm
• Four-bar, Horst Link suspension
• Carbon front triangle, seat stays
• Internal dropper post routing, Di2 compatibility
• 66° HTA, 74° STA
• Weight: 29lbs 8oz
• MSRP: $8,420 USD
• www.ellsworthbikes.com
Continuous internal routing makes maintenance a cinch.
The lines exit innocuously at the seat tube junction.
Frame Details
I think it's fair to say that Ellsworth has taken a few steps forward in the appearance department. The Rogue Sixty is a looker, especially compared to its predecessors. The bike's front triangle is carbon fiber, as you'd expect to see at this price point, and a 3K weave-finish has been combined with orange highlights. The bike's seat stays are also carbon, and the two sides are joined with a bridge just aft of the aluminum rocker arm to increase rigidity.
The proprietary 12 x 148mm axle features hexagonal ends for the same reason, as does the upper shock mounting hardware, all of which goes in line with what Ellsworth says about aiming to create a torsionally stiff frame.
Check out the details on that rocker arm.
Ellsworth says that they used a keyed 12 x 148mm axle to improve rigidity.
Frame details include internal cable routing with full-length guides to keep you from having a nervous breakdown while trying to fish out that new derailleur cable, and there's a spot inside the frame for a Di2 battery should you want to go full robot with your shifting. If you know me, you might also know about my fetish for bikes that can fit a bottle inside the front triangle, which the Rogue can do, and there's also a second bottle mount location on the underside of the downtube.
What else... the bottom bracket is threaded, there's a set of ISCG tabs, there's enough tire clearance to make the bike's Highroller II rubber look skinny, and you can't mount a front derailleur.
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 The Rogue's 160mm of travel comes from a four-bar, Horst Link design. |
Suspension Design
The Rogue's 160mm of travel is controlled by Ellsworth’s AEES (Active Energy Efficient Suspension) design, a four-bar system that is said to provide a supportive pedaling feel while under power but remain active for traction. That's easier said than done when you're dealing with this much travel, especially when some riders will care more about pedaling performance than out-and-out bump absorption while many others will look for the exact opposite.
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Specifications
| Specifications | ||
| Release Date | 2017 | |
| Price | $8420 | |
| Travel | 160 | |
| Rear Shock | Fox Float X Factory | |
| Fork | Fox Factory Series, 36 160mm Boost | |
| Headset | Cane Creek Tapered ZS44/56 | |
| Cassette | Shimano XT 8000 11 speed 11-42T | |
| Crankarms | Shimano XT 8000 1X 32T Boost | |
| Chainguide | MRP AMg V2 I-05 26-32T | |
| Bottom Bracket | Shimano BSA 73mm | |
| Rear Derailleur | Shimano XT 8000 GS | |
| Chain | Shimano HG-700 11 speed | |
| Shifter Pods | Shimano XT 8000 | |
| Handlebar | Raceface Atlas 35mm, 20mm rise, 780mm | |
| Stem | Race Face Turbine 35mm | |
| Grips | Lizard Skin Charger Ellsworth | |
| Brakes | Shimano XT 8000 | |
| Wheelset | Reynolds | |
| Tires | Maxxis Highroller II 2.3 | |
| Seat | WTB Volt | |
| Seatpost | Race Face Turbine 30.9 150mm | |
Climbing
There seem to be two schools of thought when it comes to bikes like the Rogue and climbing: some people don't give a rat's ass how well their 160mm bike pedals and handles on the climbs just so long as it's a demon on the descents, while the other group knows that just because a bike rips on the downhills doesn't mean that it gets a free pass to suck on the uphills. The second group is one hundred percent correct, of course, and the Rogue would make those riders quite happy.
Rocky Mountain's new Slayer is one of the best pedaling mid-travel bikes that I've ever spent time on, and the Rogue is right there with it when it comes to pedal-powered spunk. There were more than a few occasions when I got to the top of a climb and reached down to flip the Float X's pedal assist lever to the open setting, only to find that it had been left wide open all along. The big Ellsworth also refuses to sit back and wallow in its travel on steep climbs, something that goes a long way to having the Rogue make mincemeat of a lot of technical pitches that have stymied shorter travel and supposedly quicker handling steeds.
The short, 420mm chain stays make it easy to approach those confined corners and have it feel like you're pivoting right over the rear axle, and that's not a common trait among bikes in the same class as the Rogue. The last all-mountain bike that really impressed me with its handling on climbs was Alchemy's Arktos, but the Rogue matches it in every way, and maybe even trumps it when things get tighter than a duck's backdoor.
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As well as the Rogue ascends, I wasn't a fan of the Shimano XT cassette's massive jump between the two largest cogs. The largest cog on the Rogue's cassette is a 46-tooth pie plate and the one below it has 37-teeth, making for an awkward feeling nine-tooth jump between the two. I get that a lot of riders on 160mm-travel bikes aren't wanting to do anything more than spin up the climb at a relaxed pace, and for them, the nine-tooth gap probably doesn't stand out. However, I often felt like the 37-tooth cog could feel a bit tall on steep climbs, but the gigantic 46-tooth bailout gear was far too low.
All this praise for the Rogue's handling and pedaling means that it's a good choice for a rider who wants all of the suspension without all of the mushy laziness that can sometimes come with it. There aren't a ton of 160mm-travel bikes that I'd be happy to pedal around all day, day after day, but the Rogue is on that shortlist.
Descending
The Rogue's greatest strength is perhaps its all-around handling prowess that nearly always seemed to be just right for whatever situation I found myself in. There are slacker bikes and longer bikes, and there are steeper and shorter bikes, but the Rogue Sixty's numbers seem to grant it the ability to feel at home in more situations than I expected. It's a bit of a shape shifter in that it feels just as happy to piddle along on a blue or green level trail as it is to fly into far more challenging terrain.
Granted, it doesn't quite have the poise of a Slash or Slayer when faced with sections of trail that might make some riders question what they think is fun - it can feel more nervous than those two previous examples at such times - but I'd argue that the slight amount of ground it gives up in those rare moments is worth the all-around capability that it provides.
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The Ellsworth is a lot of fun regardless of what's on the day's menu, but it's is at its best when the main course includes any and every kind of corner. Slow, fast, tight, or wide, the Rogue dives into all of them in a way that makes the rider feel like he or she can do no wrong. Isn't that exactly what a good-handling bike should do? Of course, but it's rare for a slack-ish 160mm-travel bike not to make its rider feel like they're working hard to get around that one janky corner that every trail seems to have. The Rogue manages to make every corner feel like it has the ideal radius, however, which is a pretty neat trick.
The short, 420mm rear-end no doubt plays a role in how the Rogue can deal with the tightest of bends, but I wouldn't discount the bike's rigidity as a factor as well. Granted, there aren't a lot of noodley bikes out there these days, especially not for a 160lb rider like myself, but the Ellsworth is very clearly a solid package that never once displayed a single odd shimmy or shake.
Unlike a lot of enduro-focused bikes on the market, the Rogue doesn't need to be ridden at ten-tenths on every descent to be fun, which is a great thing when you put aside the ego and realize that pulling on a set of knee pads isn't going to make you Richie Rude. It's not the ground-hugger that a Slash is - more feedback is sent up through the bike - but that makes the Ellsworth ideal for a rider who values the ability to easily pop and play instead of the plow approach that's not always the most fun way of getting things done.
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For as well as the bike handles, I wasn't that impressed with the Rogue's rear suspension. The flipside to the bike's great pedaling efficiency seems to be a less than super supple feeling to the top of the travel, especially when you're on the gas, and that isn't ideal for a bike with nearly half a foot of suspension and twenty-five to thirty percent sag. This wasn't as noticeable on smooth, fast trails, but repeated high-frequency impacts felt like they were being passed up and into my feet a bit too well.
The opposite end of the stroke seemed to come up all too quick also, with a some hard bottoming moments giving my janky ankles grief a little too often for my liking - that shouldn't happen on a 160mm-travel bike. The stock Float X shock comes equipped with a volume spacer from Ellsworth, but I'd have to add a larger one if I was keeping the Rogue Sixty in my stable permanently.
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Component Check
• Maxxis Highroller II Tires: You usually can't go too far wrong with big meat from Maxxis, and this is certainly true when it comes to descending. The Highroller IIs might not be as popular as the Minion, but they always work well across a large variety of terrain. The one caveat to that, at least this time around, is a distinct lack of climbing traction. To be honest, this isn't a complaint that I've had before, but I just didn't gel with the Rogue's rear tire this time around, with more spinouts than a Dukes of Hazzard episode when the trail was wet and slimy.
• MRP AMg Chain Guide: I usually get by just fine without a chain guide, but I think that a lot of riders on 160mm-travel bikes would prefer to have one. Ellsworth ships the Rogue Sixty with MRP's little AMg guide that runs drag-free, doesn't clog up with mud, includes a removable bash guard, and weighs a bit over 100-grams. Hard to argue with any of those points.
The nine-tooth jump between the two largest cogs feels awkward.
Race Face's Turbine dropper post was a gem during testing.
• Reynolds Carbon Wheels: I'm a bit conflicted over these admittedly awesome wheels. I love a set of nice carbon hoops, which the color-matched Reynolds certainly are, but they also add just under $2,000 USD to the price of the bike when it's spec'd with a set of DT Swiss wheels. Value is obviously a subjective thing, and I don't often comment when it comes to prices for that reason, but I bet that the Rogue Sixty would perform just as well with the aluminum rims at $6,495 USD.
• Race Face Turbine Dropper: The Canadian company's dropper post, which uses technology licensed from 9point8, hasn't been trouble-free for us in the past, but that wasn't the case with the one on the Rogue. The 150mm of stroke was smooth, the post performed flawlessly, and its trigger-style remote is one of the best around. It's good to see Race Face get on top of the issues that their early production Turbine droppers had.
Pinkbike's Take:
 | I'm going to cut right to the chase: people love to make fun of Ellsworth, which is a bit of a shame because there are a few companies out there that are certainly more deserving of the heat. And people will continue to make jokes at Ellsworth's expense, but I don't think that anyone who rides a Rogue will be among them. Ellsworth's all-mountain rig isn't perfect, but it's an extremely efficient bike that handles like it has been wired directly into your brain. No, it wouldn't be my first choice for out-and-out enduro racing, but it's a great bike for a rider who wants an all-mountain machine that hasn't sold its versatility for the ability to win an EWS race. |
About the Reviewer
Stats: Age: 36 • Height: 5'10” • Inseam: 33" • Weight: 165lb • Industry affiliations / sponsors: None • Instagram: killed_by_death
Mike Levy spent most of the 90s and early 2000s racing downhill bikes and building ill-considered jumps in the woods of British Columbia before realizing that bikes could also be pedaled for hours on end to get to some pretty cool places. These days he spends most of his time doing exactly that, preferring to ride test bikes way out in the local hills rather than any bike park. Over ten years as a professional mechanic before making the move to Pinkbike means that his enthusiasm for two wheels extends beyond simply riding on them, and his appreciation for all things technical is an attribute that meshes nicely with his role of Technical Editor at Pinkbike.
Stats: Age: 36 • Height: 5'10” • Inseam: 33" • Weight: 165lb • Industry affiliations / sponsors: None • Instagram: killed_by_death
Mike Levy spent most of the 90s and early 2000s racing downhill bikes and building ill-considered jumps in the woods of British Columbia before realizing that bikes could also be pedaled for hours on end to get to some pretty cool places. These days he spends most of his time doing exactly that, preferring to ride test bikes way out in the local hills rather than any bike park. Over ten years as a professional mechanic before making the move to Pinkbike means that his enthusiasm for two wheels extends beyond simply riding on them, and his appreciation for all things technical is an attribute that meshes nicely with his role of Technical Editor at Pinkbike.
Author Info:
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When figuring out your geometry please note that the majority of your riders are between 5'9" and 5'11". Why do you make bikes that are either too big or small for a person who is 5'10". The medium is bit small with a 432mm reach and the large is a true large at 462mm. This bike would be pretty good for a 5'8" rider or a 6'0" rider.
Other than that, wish it fit me and I would love to ride it.
Erik
Why?
I'm 5'10" and I feel like I'm a tweener on every bike I try. M is too small L is too big.
Yeah I am in the same boat - 5'11 and always on the small side of a large and the big side of a medium. Making a bike that is ideal for people like 5'9 - 6'0 seems like a no brainer to me (at least for North American/European markets, where your average adult male likely falls into this height range).
So far, kona probably has the best sizes.
According to Chris Porter, we're all riding bikes that are too small/short anyway.
I think the problem with this is height isn't the determining factor, im 6'0 but have longer arms than my 6'3 friend (we've measured, you know; arm-off, knob-off- guy things), so a bike that fits an orangutan shaped person like me usually doesn't fit my more stump armed friends, despite being the same height.
I think for me it's a ground clearance and standover height issue. But then every cockpit length is sort of a compromise. New school geometry(long top tube/short stem) , while intended to answer a lot of stuff for a lot of people seems you have me straightened out.
Now if they'd just stop putting the seat tube at such a slack angle so I'm not pedaling from off the back.
As far as the discussion above about shock tuning vs mechanical leverage, too much mechanical anti-squat corrupts technical climbing IMO.
IIRC they also claim to have built some anti-squat (ie chain stretch) into the design.
I don't know why the reviewer didn't just say this instead of writing that it 'should be an efficient climber.' Tell us why.
I dig the look of this rig. Props to Ellesworth for upping their game and bringing an all-mountain swiss army knife to the party. Now if only I werent 5'11... ????
And saying that "it's really "only" a $6.5k bike, it just has $2k wheels on it", makes it even more ridiculous. It's ok to spend $2k for wheels!?!
Give any solid rider a used $500 frame from 2005, with basic components, and they're still better than you on your $8.5k rig.
My point of view comes from being the guy on the mountain or bike park on my used, 5 year old frankenstein frame, that I'm proud to say I built up myself using parts from several other bikes I've built - that didn't cost me any more than $1-2K...
To those with $8.5k to burn: I've got some debts to pay off, can you lend a brotha a couple bucks?
Big up MTB and the haters out there who had just based on brand name; I ride a Kona, apparently the kool kidz say they suck too
#moretolifethanayt
.
Above all else Ellsworth's new owners need to keep on top of the customer service, it will take time (as in years) for them to shed the reputation Tony built.
Hey, that's a good name for a bike company: Taint Bikes.
Think about it this way: you go into a bike shop with two identical bikes for sale. One is a Santa Cruz xyz the other is a no name xyz. Most people in the know would pay more for the known brand based off of reputation and marketing hype alone over an unknown brand.
''Tis how you ride it'. There's your company slogan.
I propose the following by way of guarantee: "if you aren't completely satisfied, we'll fly Tony Ellsworth to your house, so you can personally punch him in the nuts." (that's the remedy everyone I know that owned an Ellsworth is looking for)
Would not buy based solely on the company rep, though.
The point is this guy has screwed so many riders over that you do not ever give him another cent. As in "screw me once shame on you, screw me twice shame on me" (insert Bush joke).
Secondly, @Mikelevy its not about "people continuing to make jokes at Ellsworth's expense" at all, thats an absolute mischaracterization. Its about the above.
This guy is a con and a scam artist, why should anyone support that- irrespective of if it was the best bike ever made?
My point was that calling someone a scam artist means they knew something was flawed but didn't care and still tried to push it on the consumer for profit.
Lets be clear this is NOT what Tony was doing. Instead he truly believed the design, construction and materials used were the best possiable and bike failures were caused by improper use.
This issue is that he's naive to the abuse a mountain bike can be subjected to and inadequate materials were used!! But let's be very clear, it's not like he was using super thin wall tubing to save costs know the bikes would break... he truly believes he's using the best materials for the application.
So let's not confuse wanting to build the best possiabe bike around but not knowing how with a flat out scam artist.
The issues in the past were with the uber light Truth and epiphany models. Tony actually does a ton of machine stress tests (I would know I've seem them) and then he gives out prototypes for further testing.
If you take a super light weight XC bike and beat on it what do you think is going to happen?
Hell that huck master Bender rode for them and never had bike failures because he was riding the correct bike for the application!
Perfect analogy that might help everyone... Ford built a Raptor Truck that claims it's a Baja killer that can be jumped and hit whoops, we'll take it to the real desert and they fall apart so fast (personal expirence of owning 2) so should I say that ford is scamming people because there truck can't handle real off road abuse? HELL NO! It's the morons that get in them and think they have a trophy truck who destory them in 20minutes.
Honestly all the bike haters and misinformation have made me sick and really kills the whole sport for me.
Sad part is 80% of the people on this site can't even ride a bike to its full potential so they look to the bike to blame for their lack of skills.
I'm done ranting and could give a shit how hard you negeative prop me cause I know the real truth, not the 16yr old kid PB band wagon.
Here is a thought to all... shut the fu*k up and ride as many bikes as you can to find what works, just stop jumping on the TE bandwagon, the shit is beyond old, if you don't like it don't buy it, just shut the f*ck up!!!!
PLEASE SHOW ME WHERE A WELD FAILED... Ps all properly done welds have the tensinal strength of 20lbs/sq inch.
But if you are 16yrs old and don't know much it's easy to blame others... pretty typical of the current generation... jump on the band wagon with no scientific data to back shit up.
If you have Tony cool, just stop bashing a bike because you have heard negative things about the owner.
Please bash the owner, not the bike it's self
So there you have it, another Pinkbike key board warrior with nothing to actually prove... I guess jumping on the band wagon of ignorance is the thing to do.
Stay in school kids and learn the facts before assimilating with the masses in hopes of getting more props on comments.
I don't care if you love or hate Tony just stop saying he intentionally scammed people...that's what's wrong with the bike industry and why I have moved on to a real job and real life
The only thing garage are your false claims... pics or it didn't happen
on a side note it looks like the forum has spoken,upvotes for the truth(haha see what i did there) downvotes for the bullshit liar.
Sad thing is I wasn't defending Ellsworth I was just trying to set the record straight.
The forum has spoken?! Haha 95% of the people haven't even ridden an Ellsworth much less understand Finanante element analysis, they just junp on the band wagon.
And f*ck my self?! Nah I'm gonna go bang my super model girlfriend in my mansion on the beach then get stoned as hell and go to In-an-out. If you want pics let me know and I'm happy to ruin your life.
Get a clue before you spout off at the mouth with ZERO PROOF!!!!
Clown
All I want and everyone else is PROOF!!! without it you are just another keyboard warrior.
As for my future... we'll it's all set so no need to go there.
TELL PINKBIKE THE TRUTH!!!!
I'm not one for personal attacks but your ignorance warrants many. As for your Dare breaking, did your wife (or husband) run it over in the garage?
And since you think Tony made such a poor product please explain what that is since you are an expert.
And to the rest of the haters at least Tony followed his dream to quit his day job and build the best full suspension mountain bikes around. What have you done for the sport except bitch and complain?
Lower your seat post out of your ass and get a clue.
Neg prop away, I sleep good at night know the actual truth NOT internet bandwagon shit!!!
I'm done... sorry to everyone for the rant, just trying to keep the readers accurately informed
I feel bad for your kids... what kind of role model are you?
PS.My truck is better than yours.
As a side note, welds don't fail...the tube itself cracks AT the weld, but it's not the weld itself. So a frame broke on you...that sucks...it happens to thousands of people. Some of those failures are totally user error and that's the reason companies say go f*ck yourself because they're the ones getting scammed out of a frame. I'm not saying you were doing that, but jesus christ, if they don't warranty your frame don't buy from them again. Tell people beware...but don't go spouting shit you have no idea about saying "the weld broke." That's akin to me saying I broke my leg simply because I can't walk on it anymore when all I did sprain it badly (and I can't walk on it.) Yes, my leg is "broken" but there's a difference between a broken leg and not being able to walk on it. Same end result (not being able to walk on it), different avenue which can give a totally different outlook on the situation.
People come on pinkbike to be informed not read bandwagon lies. The sad part is you keep sending me hostile private messages but then block me.
I really do hope the mods suspend your account
I've asked you multiple times please leave me alone, no one cares that you are super insecure and feel the need to attack people.
You don't like Ellsworth bikes (no proof why but oh well) we all get it... leave it at that and stop the personal attacks!
I don't care one way or another about the frames or company...but it'd be a good idea to know the difference so as to not inadvertently spread misinformation
6495 vs 8420. The msrp of the DT Swiss wheels are 835$ and the Reynolds are 2500$. That is 1665$ difference, yet to put those wheels on it requires a 1925$ extra. So, they are getting that big a difference in the cost from the manufacturer? Assuming they get a 50% msrp and ... let me see, carry the one.... that works out to. Yup, the consumer getting a big bit of tire tread in the rear. In this case it looks like this bike would actually be considerably cheaper to build from new frame and on-line bits. XT even di2 is not super spendy. Wheel prices above. Fork runs 979$ from Jenson.
I am sorry, this industry has gotten too greedy. Finally the mathematical proof.
I have too much flannel already but if any bike company did that I would buy it regardless of how it rides or cost
Gotta admit, Ellsworth knows their target market!
On android i can just download the music, and put it in the music directory in the file system (file system!? I know, far out eh?) and listen away. Or transfer it to a dedicated music player with an OTG cable.
Broken by design = rubbish.
Ahem.
I'll shut the door on my way out.
2c
I agree! That's a $3500 bike all day!!
I have nothing against Ellsworth but do tell which companies deserve heat.
Tony is still involved with his brand and IMHO still comes off as kinda of a dick- reading the comments, Tony Ellsworth still has a negative reputation and that spills over to the Ellsworth brand-
The graphics are certainly out of the norm, sometimes that's a good thing but nothing I can see indicates these are trend leading graphics which kinda just says "weird"
Nothing exciting about suspension or kinematics as far as I can tell-
Tony should start by rebuilding his persona and reputation if he is really set on restoring this brand to mtb glory
You 14 year old shit heads will bash things just because someone else did. f*cking annoying twerps.
GO RIDE YOUR BIKE!
Got the bike two weeks ago, yeah I go faster compared to a dw link xc bike because im not bouncing all over the place and my tires are staying on the ground. If i was riding flowy trails the ripley would probably be faster.
Ironically, he seems to have a problem with sensitivity. Extra points for spelling though so it's not all bad...
+1 from me bro
That puts some of the positives from earlier in the review into a bit of a strange light - because hey, this thing is apparently nimble and playful and corners really well, and it's an efficient pedaler - so it does that sort of stuff as well, perhaps, as a bike with less travel (say one of the better mid-travel bikes). Which is worthy of highlighting - but then it seems it doesn't do the thing it's supposed to do better than those bikes (being plush and taking big hits without bottoming out). So then why buy this over a mid-travel bike?
Hm, how long was the test period I wonder?
Think about it this way - some guy my size (230#) buys one of these - is it even possible to tune that shock to keep the thing from bottoming out in that scenario? If so, will it just be super harsh in the early part of the stroke?