Both SRAM and Shimano would likely tell you that if you want the best results, you shouldn't mix and match components from other brands with their drivetrains. They might also use the word 'ecosystem' sternly. There's a good chance that most of us stick to the same, er, ecosystem when it's time to replace a cassette. But what if you didn't have to?
e*thirteen's new Helix R 11- and 12-speed cassettes fit onto SRAM's common XD freehub, but they're saying that it's ''engineered to bridge the compatibility gap between SRAM and Shimano components.'' In other words, you can use the same $289.95 USD Helix R cassette with either a Shimano or SRAM ecosy... Drivetrain.
e*thirteen Helix R Details• Compatible with SRAM, Shimano drivetrains
• 12-speed range: 556% (9-50)
• 11-speed range: 511% (9-46)
• Fits XD freehubs
• Replaceable alloy large cogs
• Steel cluster available separately
• Weight: 355-grams (12-speed, actual)
• MSRP: $289.95 USD (11 and 12-speed)
•
www.ethirteen.com e*thirteen also says that it's lighter, less expensive, and offers more range than either brand's high-end 12-speed cassettes. Oh, and they'll also sell you the aluminum and steel sections separately.
The $289.95 USD Helix R cassette fits SRAM's XD freehub body, but e*thirteen says it's also compatible with Shimano drivetrains. There are 11 and 12-speed versions, different colors, and you can buy the aluminum and steel sections separately.
So Many NumbersThe Helix R cassette can be had in a 12-speed version with 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 20, 23, 27, 31, 36, 42, and 50-tooth cogs that offers a massive 556% range. For comparison's sake, SRAM offers 520% and Shimano 510% range for their widest 12-speed cassettes. My scale said 355-grams for the Helix, 363-grams for an XX1 X-Dome, and 376-grams for XTR.
None of them are inexpensive, of course, but the Helix costs the least at $289.95 USD. If you want XX1 or XTR, that'll be $449 and $379.99, please.
With 9-tooth small and 50-tooth big cogs, the 12-speed Helix R is the range champ.
There's also an 11-speed version (available early December) of the Helix R cassette that gets 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 20, 24, 28, 33, 39, and 46-tooth cogs for a 511% range. It retails for the same $289.95 USD, and e*thirteen says that it weighs 325-grams. I'll let you dig up the numbers for the comparable SRAM and Shimano 11-speed bits.
The Helix's two-piece design means that e*thirteen can sell the larger, faster-wearing aluminum cogs separately. Orange, purple, black, or bronze will cost $129.95 USD on their own, or there's a $159 USD, PVD-treated blue option that's said to offer "
double the durability compared to anodizing.'' We'll be putting that one on a long-term test bike. The hollowed-out steel section that makes up the rest of the cassette should last much longer, but you can also buy it on its own for $159 USD. It's like Build-a-Bear but pointier.
SRAM... and Shimano?Now that we're squeezing way more cogs into the same amount of space between the spokes and dropout, there's not much difference between SRAM or Shimano's 12-speed cassettes when it comes to where the cogs are sitting. To give you an idea of how tight it is down there, a SRAM shifter moves the cable roughly 0.15mm more than Shimano does, or about the thickness of a piece of paper.
That rather tiny gap is why you can use a 12-speed SRAM cassette with a Shimano derailleur and shifter or vice-versa and have it be close to bang-on, even if they'd rather you didn't.
The steel section (left) is machined from a single piece and helps contribute to the low 355-gram weight. The 9-tooth cog (right) means you can drop to a small chainring size without losing anything on the high-end.
So, is it as easy as just splitting the difference between the two drivetrain giants? Not so much.
''
Both SRAM and Shimano use different spacing and sprocket thicknesses in different parts of the cassette,'' e*thirteen told me. ''
While the spacing is important for a cassette to work properly, the biggest challenge to designing the Helix was to make it work well with Shimano's new chain design. We also had competitor IP to consider, which surprisingly factored into the sprocket spacing as well. The net result is decidedly not what you would get if you split the difference between SRAM and Shimano, but it works well.''
I paired the 12-speed Helix R cassette with both mechanical and electronic drivetrains from SRAM, as well as Shimano's XTR system.
Does it Work?e*thirteen's cassettes use a modular, two-piece design, with the bottom section slotting onto the XD freehub's splines and getting locked into place via 3mm pinch-bolt at a low 3Nm of torque. Your freehub bearings are under there, so best not over-tighten it.
Next, you slide the steel cogs (with its bushing) onto the freehub, making sure to align the indexed locking section on the two pieces before using a chain whip to rotate and lock it into place. If your chain whip is in the shop for repairs, you can put the wheel on your bike, shift onto one of the steel cogs, then hold your rear brake while pushing down on the pedals, just like how you'd lock a quick-link together.
The two halves of the Helix R cassette interlock, and there's a 3mm hex key to ensure everything stays put.
Turning the steel section to the right sees fins machined into its backside interlock with the aluminum section, and there's a tiny image of a padlock for you to line up and make sure it's done correctly. Next, thread the 3mm hex screw (3Nm again) into place and you're ready to roll. Wait, you put grease where the instructions told you to, right? Good.
Embargo timing meant that I haven't put in a ton of miles on the new cassette, but I did pair the 12-speed, 9-50 tooth block with three different drivetrains to see if e*thirteen's claims of cross-compatibility hold true: SRAM's wireless Eagle AXS XX1 and cable-controlled XX1 systems, as well as Shimano's XTR drivetrain. And yeah, everything seems peachy. Shift quality with either SRAM system matches the stock performance, with shift speed and noise seemingly unaffected by the third-party cogs. This wasn't always the case with e*thirteen's previous cassettes; I've had good luck with them, but some riders weren't able to get their shifting bang-on perfect and without the odd delay or tick, tick, tick sound. While I can't comment on durability, the new Helix R seems to match the performance of SRAM's stock components.
Okay, but does it play nice with Japan? Shimano's Hyperglide+ tech, and specifically the design of their chain, lets you shift under heavy pedaling loads in a way that just wasn't possible before, but do you lose that if you're not using a Shimano cassette with it?
I put the Helix R on
Giant's new Trance X Advanced Pro, pairing it with a Shimano XTR derailleur and XT shifter, then went out and shifted like a ham-fisted gorilla up every single hill. In other words, just a normal ride. The results: While maybe just a hair away from matching a full Shimano setup, the chain moved over the cogs silently and without any bangs or worrying noises, much like a full Hyperglide+ setup. Impressive.
Shimano's Hyperglide+ components let you shift under load without issue, and that doesn't change if you pair them with the Helix R cassette.
As for reliability, I have no clue - it hasn't been long enough to talk about that yet. That said, the PVD-coated blue option that's claimed to offer double the life of the standard anodized cogs sounds interesting, so we'll put that in the long-term plans for a review down the road. Also, both SRAM and Shimano cite friction and chain wrap issues for not using the 9-tooth cog that e*thirteen has at the bottom on their cassettes, but I suspect that it won't be trouble given the limited time the chain spends in that gear. We'll see.
It's what the guys set it up with. I think I will likely change to a 32 in future.
It was the recommendation. And they're prettier....... :-)
yup
I've also only ever seen/personally broken shimano chains, but that's probably an isolated thing.
Look after your drivetrain, wash grit off it and keep it lubed and it will last a while.
I think ZFC’s chain longevity test clearly demonstrated that SRAM’s expensive chains outperformed everything else by a wide margin.
My gravel bike has a GX chain and that chain has at least 2000kms in it. 300km on that bike is like 4-4.5 rides.
Regarding the e13 cassette: the 9-11 jump sounds horrible, that is too bog of an jump...
I like the idea of the 11 speed cassette, perhaps with an 11 speed derailleur (medium cage) and a Shimano 12 speed chain.
All the ranges, better shifting, shorter cage derailleur, and lighter. May be a great option.
I want to put together the most frankenstien drive train possible (until Box is back in stock). Maybe I'll try that!
So, I wouldn't hesitate to use a 12 speed chain on the new one. If they have corrected the residual issues on the last one I think using the 9-46t with an 11 speed XT or XTR derailleur and a 12 speed Shimano chain may be the ticket to not having to use a long cage derailleur.
Medium cage derailleurs work just fine for 9-46T on all the bikes I've ridden them on, and for anyone who doesn't want to dangle a long cage off their bike, running a 9-46T cassette seems to be a great alternative in many cases, in my opinion, provided their bike doesn't have chain growth that would put them into a long cage at the 46T mark.
Also where can you buy a medium cage anymore?
The 9-46T differential with a medium cage has worked for me fine however, with a medium cage. Shimano Still makes medium cage derailleurs in their most current 12 speed line up, and seems to be stock of 11 speed gear still out there to buy also.
I'm hopeful on the new one, since PB has said they seem be shifting well.
Second, I can order an Shimano 12sp XT cassette for $150 off Ebay, direct from Asia, so how is this cassette a deal?
This is made to compete with XTR, not XT. If the extra 115g of rotating unsprung mass on the XT means nothing to you, then you aren’t the target market for this new cassette anyway.
Wobble or no wobble, customer service has always been bar-setting! Good work.
Even everyone's favorite brand Shimano has had tons of issues on thier lastest products. The shop I work at has had complaints of creaking Cassattes, thier new hubs last a few hundred miles at most before creaking like crazy, and the wandering bite point in their brakes blows my mind. how on earth have they not fix (imo) such a glaring issue!
With that said, yes I've seen counterfeit Shimano parts. Usually badged as lower-tiered Shimano drivetrains (mainly Acera, Alivio derailer). I have yet to see XT counterfeit cassettes though.
Who care how much the cable moves? Cable pull would apply to mixing shifters and mechs, not cog spacing.
""Both SRAM and Shimano use different spacing and sprocket thicknesses in different parts of the cassette,'' e*thirteen told me." - This isn't making a lot of sense to me either, if anyone cares to clarify.
But it's the first I've heard of variable spacing within a cassette. I have heard that the overall spacing is very slightly different between SRAM Eagle and Shimano 12sp
blog.artscyclery.com/science-behind-the-magic/science-behind-the-magic-drivetrain-compatibility
Check that out for more info. Notice in the chart that the cable pull doesn't really match up with gear count. Some long pull systems have lots of gears, and some short pull systems have very few gears.
I initially had the TRS+ 9-46 but the machining tolerances were off at the smaller cogs which caused shifting issues and noise. I did a warranty claim and eThirteen were kind enough to send me a replacement smaller cog assembly, but in the lighter 'Race' version. I ran that for a little while and it was great. But over time, as it wore down or 'broke in' I started having shifting issues and random noise again in the smaller cogs. Visually, the steel teeth looked like new. Which led me to believe that it was probably my derailleur and chain. Realigned my derailleur, still making noise and shifting like crap. Put a new chain and derailleur in and it was still shifting like crap. I said f*ck it and put in a Shimano XTR 11 speed cassette with a 45t Wolf Tooth cog and had zero issues since.
I wanna like this, but I'm just not confident in their quality control. Though their warranty department is excellent.
Shifting was pretty good on last gen, aside from a few quirks I just couldn't get over, as listed above. Shifting was smooth most of the time, but miss-shifts were just too common.
36-42-50t is a lot less useful than 39-46-51t on the big end of the cassette (SRAM/e13 vs Shimano). It's the difference between having two good climbing gears and three. My local trails certainly demand good climbing gears, not a cassette with a bailout gear.
556% range + light weight + low cassette cost + electronic shifting + hyperglide+. This could be a WINNER!
And what chain. Assuming XTR HG+ chain, but would be nice to list it explicitly. Same for the Eagle setups: assuming XX1 12sp chain, but should be explicit. Because it sounds like a decent chunk of HG+'s goodness may be in the chain...
Nope, only mentions the shifter and mech. The previous paragraph did mention that the HG+ chain is an important part, but did not actually specify that an HG+ chain was used.
If this indeed offers improved shift quality and durability from the gen2, it will likely be my go-to cassette for the foreseeable future.
It is interesting that if 0.15mm is on one shift, then times 11 shifts the difference is 1.65mm. Not sure if this is still negligible. I guess the trick is to set it perfect in the middle of the cassette and have ~0.8mm mismatch on lowest and highest gear.
These parts aren't cheap, but there are a lot of places people pay way more money for less weight reduction.
Friends don’t let friends ride E13.
Can we all just collectivelly yell at them for doing this. Chain & cassette or shifter & mech should be the only things that must go together.
It also means you could drastically change your bike's anti-squat and chain-growth. You don't want to change chainrings willy-nilly _just_ because your cogs are smaller or bigger.
I may try sometime.
Well I am lazy/sneaky and I have a 2X crank. I replaced the 36T with a 34T narrow-wide but I left the 22T on the crank. This was a mistake. I forgot to turn my clutch on and bounced the chain from the narrow-wide onto the 22T. When I started pedaling again the grinding on the chain stay was horrendous. Have a pretty nice scar in the aluminum now.
This trick was nice on my hardtail. When I had a terrible climb ahead of me I dropped by hand into the 22T and had a 22/40 ratio to crank up the hill.
I'm very curious about this because everything else sounds great - basically like SRAM cassettes but way cheaper...
I wasn't feeling so great when I saw that the TRS cassette was dropped from their website. If I remember correctly, the Helix is a little heavier than the TRS Race. That might be a good thing. The colors are a bummer. I liked the all black look of the TRS. It was relatively unique. IF my buddies thought I was running a cheap SunRace, that's on them. The Helix just looks like a Garbaruk cassette. Maybe next time I'll get a Garbaruk to avoid the possible install complications.
It is sad that Sram has that cassette design locked down to the point that no one can sell a XD completable cassette in the states without it being some Rube Goldberg-esque setup. Thankfully E13 found a way around it. Meanwhile, Sram could make their own 11 speed cassette that adds a little more range but that would cut into selling all of us fools on a full 12 speed group. I would rather save a little money and weight by sticking with what I have.
I check my chain regularly, but don't have a tool to measure cassette wear? Are there any workarounds'
Include ZTTO, Garbaruk, Sunrace, KCNC, Ingrid and the likes and see how they stack up against each others and the big two!
I love the idea of the 9 cog. I've wondered why more manufacturers aren't offering this as well. I use a 32t up front so I may even notice a bit more speed from that. Since my FS SJ is by far my best bike, it CAN be fun riding on some half-paved trails and on the long fire roads. The small cogs are great to have for those purposes. I'm waiting until the color I want is available and I'll definitely try this.
~JSV
It might have a 9 tooth gear but good luck adjusting your Shimano derailleur so that you can actually get into it reliably once you've done a mud ride and it's not brand new anymore.
The 2 piece design is a pain, requires 2 chain whips, too much cleaning and greasing, and tightening small screw that could strip the soft aluminum.
Alot of compromises to save a little weight seems to be the ethos of this company, I'm happy with cheapo Sunrace.
There is no real need for two chain whips. It is way easier to use one whip and the bike's chain.
E13 is doing something useful. Who else makes a cassette for an XD driver that you can buy in the states? I'm pretty sure it is just E13 and Sram. They are making a smaller and lighter cassette with more range. It's hard to argue against that. If you want a sunrace cassette that weighs twice as much, have at it.
www.sunrace.com/en/products/cassettes-sram
I don't live somewhere like California with crazy steep long climbs (found out after riding them that nobody rides them!).
So basically, I use everything, but never in one ride
Id expect it to last my lifetime if I spent that much
Anti squat? Not sure, don't care.
The bike runs just fine and pedals near the same as the 30t it came with.
As for the other 10,000 average riders buying this, it’s good to see a review from someone with similar average skill to give useable feedback.
XC racers have high thresholds and watt/kg but in terms of peak output I'd wager they are not at the top of output. XC racers are more like the GC and time trialists of the road world, not the sprinters or track racers.
No hg shifting - like shimano tho
www.pinkbike.com/buysell/3031755
The technique for removing and installing an XD cassette is the exact same as basically any other cassette. I'd say it's actually faster than an HG or Microspline cassette that's not one piece.
You put the cassette on the freehub body and you turn the cassette tool clockwise. The cassette tool just spins part of the cassette instead of spinning a lockring. When you want to remove it, you hold it with a chain whip and turn the cassette tool anti clockwise. Simple as that...