UK Bike Shop Chain Evans Cycles to Cut 300+ Jobs

Mar 10, 2021
by Alicia Leggett  

British bike retailer chain Evans Cycles is expected to cut more than 300 jobs at its 55 stores, bringing its workforces from 813 down to 475 employees, despite the pandemic bike boom that has given the bike industry unprecedented levels of demand.

Evans Cycles was bought by controversial British billionaire Mike Ashley’s Frasers Group when the chain faced severe financial trouble in 2018. At the time, Evans Cycles employed 1,300 people, and the sale caused a stir about the loss of those jobs and other negative changes, even prompting a takeover of the Evans Cycles Instagram by a disgruntled employee. Now, Frasers Group aims to cut even more costs.


The remaining workers will have to reapply for their jobs, and managers will be expected to work 45 hours each week, up from 40, The Guardian reported. They will also be moved to zero-hour contracts or what Frasers Group calls “casual worker agreements,” meaning that they will not be guaranteed regular work hours. Frasers Group pledged to stop using zero-hour contracts five years ago after the group faced criticism from unions and members of parliament. However, nothing changed, and the issue remains polarizing.

Evans Cycles employees learned about these changes last week via an internal document. A note to staff read, “We cannot rely on old ways of running our business and we must adapt. These changes will look to address the cost of sales ratio in our stores and ensure that we are able to be more flexible with our cost base out of peak trading and during difficult trading periods.”

Frasers has not offered any comment on the matter.

Posted In:
Industry News



258 Comments

  • 170 1
 Not surprising and a real shame that it has ended up this way. Sports direct were full of promise when they first bought Evans "it won't change", "we'll stay out of running it" etc. anyone who knows anything about Sports Direct could see straight through it.
Sad times and I feel for the remaining staff. I had 7.5 years working for them and had a blast for the most part. Glad I left when I did.
  • 99 269
flag racecase (Mar 10, 2021 at 9:24) (Below Threshold)
 I wonder what Meghan will have to say about this?
  • 65 13
 @racecase: nothing, somehow I don't think she is going to be too bothered about what is happening to the riff-raff back in the UK
  • 22 10
 @racecase: You should pop round and ask her seeing as though they left us for the US
  • 38 1
 Anything related to Ashley’s groups is bad news, there’s no commitment to staff or customers and you go from an individual to a number as soon as you get your foot through the door
  • 5 2
 @racecase: Something about Sport Direct not providing enough protection?
  • 24 6
 @racecase: for evans sake, can you leave meg out of this disaster...
  • 4 3
 @McArdle: Seeing how out of shape Mike Ashley is, he could probably hire one of the laid off bike employees to give him some tips on weightloss from cycling.
  • 2 0
 @HB208: The sports direct side of the business treat ‘big Mike’ like a god, It’s mental and almost cult like!
  • 4 0
 @McArdle: Think about owning a sports shop, yet never taking time to be healthy.
  • 19 8
 @racecase: people don't know what's funny these days....
  • 8 31
flag dinger2h (Mar 10, 2021 at 11:43) (Below Threshold)
 @racecase: £30 million reasons to shut her trap.
  • 19 5
 Seems like the only bike shop on earth going through hard times . Mr Ashley must have been reading trumps book !
  • 1 2
 @dinger2h: £30 million- a laptop for every child in the uk for online teaching. What a difference that would have made over the last 12 months. This can never happen again!!@dinger2h:
  • 5 1
 @Matt115lamb: more like that toad Boris.
  • 6 0
 Hopefully every employee starts looking for a new job. When a “group” for VC firm buys a company they end up destroying it far more often than not.
  • 6 2
 @Prof: £30 million for her(Megans) 3rd wedding Is what I was referring to. Paid for by the British tax payer....
  • 6 1
 @dinger2h: because you gave her 2p a year she’s gotta shut up , sounds fair !
  • 12 2
 MAKE EVANS GREAT AGAIN! we employees tried our best to make evans a good bike shop but unfortunately it was ran by utter incompetence and people who are truly out of touch with cyclists. Let me be very clear, Evans was screwed well before sports direct took over! Awful people have been running that place for years and now an ex Evanscycles owner and huge turd, mr rice, has another company on the rise which is essentially Evans 2.0. Company BALFES BIKES was brought out and is now well on its way to be the next evans. I would urge fellow cyclists to boycott these corporate cycling stores and look else where as there other alternatives. The people who run these company’s are soulless and couldn’t give a monkeys about bikes and it’s enthusiasts, a stain on our sport for hobby for sure! F**k these pieces of sh*t ✌????
  • 10 0
 @Makeevansgreatagain: Thats really not true at all. it was more than just a single bike shop. Yes Evans was in trouble before SD got involved, that was well publicised and why SD were able to buy it. That was due to the previous investors being rubbish and using it as a cash cow, lumping in unpayable amounts of debt. if you excluded that, it was a profitable company. there were management issues in some departments, people helicoptered in by said investors who did make store life hard.
The team who have gone to the other company you mention are some of the biggest cycling nerds i've known and should not be tarred with the same brush. The one in particular you mention is the guy who actually made Evans great before it was made bad by subsequent investors. (and no, I don't work for any of them)
Having sat in some of the meetings with Mike Ashleys brother (one of SDs directors) and members of their board when they took over, they have backtracked on every promise they made in said meetings.
Your account started out as a bit of a laugh but has since descended into some horrid far right, borderline abusive "thing", we get it, you got burned, but so did a lot of people. Don't drag decent people and companies into this sh1tshow, move on.
  • 4 1
 @Makeevansgreatagain: Mike Rice was one of the nicest people I knew during my 13 years with the company. He always had time for me and helped me out with some special deals along the way. As Daver27 said, he was one of the people that made Evans great, and really did care about the brand. It only really started to go down hill when the investors came in and Mike started to wind down his involvement in the company. I'm guessing you are a bit butt hurt because Mike hasn't employed you at Bafles.
  • 1 2
 @Daver27: no, I think you’re find you are very wrong on this topic. You have no idea what make evans great again is or was so lets not assume anything. as for this horrific far right wing stuff you snowflakes keep going on about, where is it? What as been right wing? Because the name relates to a former presidents slogan? Get a grip soy boy and focus on riding your bikes. Evans was a cool place to work with a lot of top riders and people involved but unfortunately management onward was spineless and was walked all over by corporate vultures that knew nothing. Senior staff getting caught out lying on several occasions to cover for each other.
  • 3 2
 @Makeevansgreatagain: You mean the guy in the Gatwick store who felt aggrieved because his attitude sucked towards doing his job, locked the company out their Instagram profile, dragged its name through the mud and kicked up a massive fuss only to get fired and, from what I can gather, handed it over to other members of staff who carried it on but without the smarts and an added dose of plain nasty? Massively grown up and not exactly clever.
Frankly your derogatory term and the fact you reference one of the worst human beings about as inspiration for the account name just highlights my point above.
You don't know me, you didn't sit in the sports direct take over meetings and have no idea what was promised or meant to happen. I left 2 years ago as I could see the writing on the wall.
Feel free to spam every comment on here as before.
Night night.
  • 2 1
 @Daver27: you literally have no idea about any of it, I mean seriously where do you get your info from? Because you sound like a complete p*ssy and didn’t even explain what MEGA did that was far right and abusive? Your chatting out your ring piece. How about when over 200 members of staff gather up and agree that people who ran evans and Sd are crooks and they also agree that a corporate fascist style regime is happening and is the cause of these bike shops to fail? You didn’t know that? What about like I said before when very senior members was being caught lying and trying to make people’s lives hell? Guess your too busy sucking c@ck in those meetings young Dave and submitting to your superiors like a good sheep. Pull your head out of your liberal arse and stop being such a snowflake. Who cares if someone makes references from president Donald trump, just because you don’t like him doesn’t mean he has to be cancelled? he’s not voldermort ffs, pussy boys like you give cyclists a bad name because your to quick to cry over people’s beliefs, you far left moron. “The guy in the Gatwick store” do you know him? Ever spoke with him? Didn’t think so, your all talk young man.
  • 2 1
 @Makeevansgreatagain: Young Dave, lol.

Most extraordinary thing I've read in a while.

Good luck in the job market.
  • 2 1
 @Daver27: still waiting on what exactly was right wing about MEGA? To busy in meetings not doing anything apart from being a yes man ????
  • 2 1
 @Makeevansgreatagain: you'll be waiting a while, the posts on Instagram in question were deleted around the time he got the boot. I'm not naming him, not because I don't know him, but because I'm not stooping to that level.
The irony of you moaning like this, the taunts, the derogatory comments, the negatives towards the guy who actually made Evans Great (massive fail with your username by the way, lol) is amazing.
With this silky smooth way of dealing with people you have, I'm surprised SD haven't snapped you up like a chicken nugget, nom nom nom.
  • 1 1
 @Daver27: waiting a while because you have no idea what you are talking about, how about you go live under real far right conditions before you cry over a slogan. The Instagram account got taken down late last year actually so again, where are you getting your info from? Surely not in them meetings you was in? I guess you had a mouth full of corporate wang like a good little soy boy. No one asking you for names but you clearly didn’t know anyone in any of the stores who was involved. silly Dave, enjoy being a bitch in those useless meetings you attend and keep up the good job contributing nothing to cycling, maybe we’re see you up pitch hill some time and still see if you have spunk on your mouth ???????? get out of here with your neo facist views
  • 2 0
 @Dale17: Totally agree. Mike was one of the people who made Evans a brilliant business and is still highly respected in the industry. When Active sold the business on and subsequently Mike left was the beginning of the end. This make evans great guy clearly doesn't know what he's talking about.
  • 2 0
 @Makeevansgreatagain: Again with the irony. 15 hours for your abuse laden response as apposed to my 1?
And still no clue at all.
Finally something we agree on though, the meetings were useless.
You carry on being this utterly amazing ambassador for cycling, see how that works out.
  • 145 3
 Mike Ashley = dickhead
  • 4 2
 A dick but act quick. They have the last C2 Large Norco Optic in the country!
  • 1 0
 Sounds like a real Tallywacker Dollar
  • 105 2
 If I lived in the UK, I would totally boycott them. On another note, support your local bike shop. Yesterday I called a bike shop in town to discuss getting a Transition PBJ and it turns out they stopped carrying the brand. Nonetheless, the guy offered advice on sizing and told me to not go with the brand they do carry because it won't fit me right (I am tall). I am going to make an effort to do all of my parts shopping there from now on.
  • 20 4
 If you are ever in Boise, get a demo bike from Joyride. I'll shout them out here.
  • 18 51
flag Rucker10 (Mar 10, 2021 at 9:21) (Below Threshold)
 What if my local bike shop is an Evans? I have to boycott and support them?
  • 22 2
 @Rucker10: I'm sure there are other shops in town.
  • 34 1
 @Rucker10: LBS usually means independent.
  • 38 1
 @Rucker10: Funny looking UK flag you got there. But yes, boycott them anyway.
  • 19 2
 @noapathy: He missed the "American Revolution" part of Social Studies.

But I suppose the saying goes, "If you remember the late 18th century, you weren't there maaaaaaaaan"
  • 24 0
 The sad thing about boycotting Evans is that you’re also screwing the innocent staff. Can’t really win either way
  • 18 1
 @mashrv1: Yes, but giving your business to LBS also means that they can expand their headcounts and treat their new employees well.
  • 4 0
 @HB208: +1 for Joyride. The owner Phil is an absolute boss. They've got a great crew down there.
  • 1 0
 @IdaGOAT: They are great. I unfortunately haven't purchased any bikes from them just because I don't feel like SC offers that good of a value, but I try to buy other things from them as much as possible.
  • 8 4
 interesting that the solution to a 'bunch of people lost their jobs' is an attempt at 'making sure the rest of them lose theirs too'.
  • 4 0
 The have the monopoly on Norco though, no one else can sell them in the UK.
  • 8 4
 @mashrv1: The innocent staff are f*cked either way. Sorry to inform, but that's just how capitalism goes....
  • 2 0
 @HB208: .... until they become so successful they get another store.... then another then they become a chain of stores and everyone hates them.
  • 3 0
 @Richt2000: no they don't. They have no new bikes listed online and no longer show up in the dealer/distribution listing on the Norco site. Hopefully they end up back in bike shops again ????
  • 2 0
 @James-at-Pedals: oooo that sounds promising :-)
  • 2 1
 @HB208: I've only bought a few smaller things from them. I got a new Slash a few weeks ago because SC is having a helluva time getting anything but the new Nomads out. I had an Enduro Expert on order from George's since November then it got pushed from January back to end of July so I had to cancel. I ended up driving to Utah to pick this Slash up from the Trek shop down there.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: Is that the same owner of the Joyride in Logan?
  • 2 0
 @ryd-or-die: I don't think so. I looked up that shop and they seem to just share a name.
  • 3 0
 Ah yes, the elusive PBJ for us large folk. Hoping to get my hands on one one day.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: Bought a new ride from there last year. Great shop.
  • 2 2
 MAKE EVANS GREAT AGAIN! we employees tried our best to make evans a good bike shop but unfortunately it was ran by utter incompetence and people who are truly out of touch with cyclists. Let me be very clear, Evans was screwed well before sports direct took over! Awful people have been running that place for years and now an ex Evanscycles owner and huge turd, mr rice, has another company on the rise which is essentially Evans 2.0. Company BALFES BIKES was brought out and is now well on its way to be the next evans. I would urge fellow cyclists to boycott these corporate cycling stores and look else where as there other alternatives. The people who run these company’s are soulless and couldn’t give a monkeys about bikes and it’s enthusiasts, a stain on our sport for hobby for sure! F**k these pieces of sh*t
  • 1 4
 Well if they are cutting staff because they aren’t making enough money surely boycotting them will only perpetuate the problem thus resulting in more job cuts, the very same thing you wanted to boycott them for in the first place.
  • 2 0
 @Bigwill13: Right, as I mentioned above, shifting support to local bike shops means those shops can hire more.
  • 1 0
 @c-radicallis: Mate they're f*cked anyway if they work for SD, it’s an absolute shambles of a company ran by desk jockeys that have never worked in stores to experience busy periods or problematic staff or staffing, they look at headcount and turnovers to predict how a store should be ran, theoretically it should work but not every city is the same and sq ft of a store means nothing in relation to turnover of stock/staff levels aren’t correct.
  • 1 0
 @Fektor: Lol, yes, I think it might be the only bike brand that actually makes a dirt jumper for tall people.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: @Fektor: just so you know the new Commencal Absolut comes in a large size with a 440mm reach too, just like the large PBJ.
  • 1 0
 @tobiusmaximum: I need the XL. I am 6'4" with long arms lol. I've ridden the L Absolut and came away wishing it was a tad bigger.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: what year was it? 440 is about the longest reach you'll get on any dj bike (as far as i know)
  • 1 0
 @tobiusmaximum: Last years. The Transition PBJ in XL has a 465 reach.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: woah. You learn something new everyday.
  • 95 1
 Mike Ashley is a dreadful man and I feel genuinely sorry for anyone who has the misfortune of working for one of his companies. Best of luck to all at Evans, hope this terrible news leads to better things.
  • 16 1
 100% agree - the unfortunate reality is that his stranglehold on the uk ‘high street’ is growing.

Until people vote with their wallets and boycott nothing will change.
  • 10 2
 I must receive about 3- 5 junk emails per day from Sports Direct. Very aggressive marketing and a PITA. This is where capitalism goes wrong. Corporate greed on this level will surely lead to drastic change for the worse.
  • 9 0
 @justanotherusername: I think (and this is purely speculation) that even if those of us who are aware of the situation vote with our feet, there's more than likely a large proportion of customers who don't know about the high-level scumbaggery involved here. Anyone who doesn't actively pay attention to the news quite likely doesn't know about who owns Sports Direct or Evans, or what the implications of that are.
In the case of Sports Direct as well, I think unfortunately they have such a stranglehold on the lower priced end of the market that those on lower incomes might really want to boycott, but really have limited other options.
As I say, no idea of any of this is true, but it wouldn't surprise me.
  • 7 0
 @codfather1234: agreed with people on lower incomes not boycotting - where else can their kids get £15 branded tracksuits and £30 nikes - it's not gonna happen anytime soon. Same with Primark and all the other low-cost brands - the UK economy is such a shit show that there's no option to be ethical for people on a non-living wage/universal income (and don't say "well they should go to x and get x shoes" as those kids will be picked on - no thanks to the consumerist propaganda shoved down our societies throats).
  • 4 0
 @hambobet: I don’t know this to be the case, but primark don’t seem quite so viscous with their staff - he is fairly unique in just how much of a shit he treats people.

Totally agree though that asking those on low incomes to boycott a place that helps them save money isn’t realistic - the unfortunate truth is that that many are on low incomes because they work for places like this... never ending circle.
  • 4 0
 MAKE EVANS GREAT AGAIN! we employees tried our best to make evans a good bike shop but unfortunately it was ran by utter incompetence and people who are truly out of touch with cyclists. Let me be very clear, Evans was screwed well before sports direct took over! Awful people have been running that place for years and now an ex Evanscycles owner and huge turd, mr rice, has another company on the rise which is essentially Evans 2.0. Company BALFES BIKES was brought out and is now well on its way to be the next evans. I would urge fellow cyclists to boycott these corporate cycling stores and look else where as there other alternatives. The people who run these company’s are soulless and couldn’t give a monkeys about bikes and it’s enthusiasts, a stain on our sport for hobby for sure! F**k these pieces of sh*t
  • 71 1
 local bike shops that are owned by riders rule!
  • 8 0
 Fully agree! In my experience they definitely care about their customers, and actually try to build the riding scene for everyone to enjoy. When it works, its awesome to see.
  • 13 0
 I stopped buying major bike stuff online when I saw the amount of effort my LBS puts in to maintaining trails, supporting races and scholastic efforts.
  • 10 0
 Mike Ashley must've created a pb account to downvote you because I don't know who in their right mind would disagree with this. I almost feel bad doing all my bike maintenance myself, but I always get my cables, housing, lubes, tools, etc. from my local rider owned shop. Happy to spend literally the one extra dollar they charge vs. the mega online competition knowing it's going into the right pockets.
  • 50 1
 I think it's a bit of a weak term to say that the issue of zero hours contracts is "polarizing". This suggests there's a massive amount of strong support for them (at least a similar amount as there is opposition), rather than just a very small number of robber barons who think they are good while most people roundly hate them. For a more fitting term you could try one of "hated", "immoral", or "scummy".
  • 2 1
 MAKE EVANS GREAT AGAIN! we employees tried our best to make evans a good bike shop but unfortunately it was ran by utter incompetence and people who are truly out of touch with cyclists. Let me be very clear, Evans was screwed well before sports direct took over! Awful people have been running that place for years and now an ex Evanscycles owner and huge turd, mr rice, has another company on the rise which is essentially Evans 2.0. Company BALFES BIKES was brought out and is now well on its way to be the next evans. I would urge fellow cyclists to boycott these corporate cycling stores and look else where as there other alternatives. The people who run these company’s are soulless and couldn’t give a monkeys about bikes and it’s enthusiasts, a stain on our sport for hobby for sure! F**k these pieces of sh*t
  • 60 11
 Go, capitalism, go! All hail profit margins. /s
  • 44 1
 It’s the billionaire’s right to fire those people because he works so much harder than us /s
  • 1 2
 @kleinblake: got to be irony, shhhuuurely
  • 14 10
 @kleinblake: are you implying he has some obligation to employ people?
  • 16 3
 @conoat: legally? As they have an employment contract be absolutely does. Of course however is is treating staff isn’t illegal, immoral yes.

And without staff, what would he do? Run the businesses by himself? Use sense.
  • 15 19
flag splitlit (Mar 10, 2021 at 11:37) (Below Threshold)
 Always love the anti-capitalism narrative, when this is actually how capitalism works. They let go of a bunch of people, thus resulting in: disgruntled ex-employees, horrible PR, declining service based on less staff. The ex-staff will eventually find jobs in other shops, and a lot of the consumers will shift their purchases to other LBS because of this and the service. That results in lower revenues and lower profitability, and a loss of market share.

Don't get me wrong, this certainly sucks for those that are being let go, and I hope they find a new opportunity. But the market will adjust and so will the consumers and so will labor.
  • 16 0
 @splitlit: small businesses can't compete on margin, and most people look for the lowest price, not the best service. If what you said were true, those giantbusinesses with bad reputations would never get that big.
  • 15 1
 @splitlit: You said it better than we could have. "This is how capitalism works." Read: in the short-term interests of investors and owners and not in the interest of the workers, public and rest of stakeholders. So, yes, the narrative writes itself.
  • 11 9
 @Layman:
So what’s the solution? One state run anti-capitalist bike company? That worked great in the past...
  • 13 2
 @cvoc: The solution is raising salaries to reasonable levels, thus allowing working class people to actually vote with their money and influence the market such that the truely better companies prevail.
  • 14 26
flag phops (Mar 10, 2021 at 14:32) (Below Threshold)
 @Layman:

Do you get tired of shitposting on leftist echochambers like reddit, so you just can't help yourself but to bring this bullshit here?

Capitalism does, in fact, work. If a smaller buisness gets out competed, the consumer, a.k.a the people who are buying the actual product wins, because they get the same good for a cheaper price. If there is substantial enough demand for a higher quality good, then there will be a market for it at a higher price. If a bike shop goes out of buisness, this doesn't change the demand, and the employees of said bike shop can find work elsewhere, especially if you are the owner because buisness ownership experience isn't a industry specific thing, and being able to actually run a buisness for some time is a very valuable skill.

The funniest part though is that as a leftist, you should be ideologically opposed to bike shops because they pay a certain amount to the factories for the bike, and then sell it at a higher price, which in your world is "theft".
  • 6 5
 @FatSanch: If a small business is trying to compete on margin, they'll never make it. People have a choice whether they support their local communities and pay a bit more, or get everything at Walmart/Costco/Amazon. I make that choice on a daily basis, and buy almost everything I can local, especially in light of the pandemic and its effects on local businesses. Most of the times, its because I like the owner, and I don't even think about the price. On the other hand a lot of people choose to buy at the lowest price too, and that's fine as well. The aforementioned companies providing a low-cost alternative is a benefit to a lot of people in our society as well...

End of the day, all of my LBS are all out busy and looking for more people, not laying people off. There's more people trying to get in the sport than ever. This to me sounds like a poorly thought out decision by a corporate management group, and somehow that's equated to capitalism being horrible.

If salaries are "raised to reasonable levels" then all of you would move over to the Rocky Mountain thread and start bitching about how expensive the bikes are.
  • 11 0
 @splitlit: you’re absolutely right. That’s why Amazon and Tesla both went under and their competitors are crushing it thanks to all the bad PR they get from union busting and wage theft.
  • 1 5
flag splitlit (Mar 10, 2021 at 16:07) (Below Threshold)
 @kleinblake: Sure, and that's why I don't support these companies. I vote with my wallet, and a lot of other consumers do too. With that said, the vast majority prefer the low prices/innovation those corporations offer over how they treat their employees. By the way, nobody is forcing the employees to work there.
  • 16 0
 @phops: Um, I don't use Reddit? But it sounds like your confusing my unknown-to-you personal economic philosophy with communism. Everybody who adds value to a product deserves to reap a reward - the manufacturer, transportation, retail, etc. But I appreciate the 5th grade rendition of supply and demand nonetheless. Unfortunately the real world is a bit more complicated, and there are plenty of people willing to exploit the system and their fellow man in the pursuit of lining their pockets. Not every business that fails or succeeds does so based simply on their ability to align supply to demand.
  • 8 0
 @cvoc: That's a fair question, but I don't think the only options are unbridled capitalism or communism (which has never really existed at a country level). There's a lot of space between the extremes, and I personally would like us all to find one that prioritizes the inherent worth of our fellow man. There are plenty of ways to achieve that while still encouraging innovation, entrepreneurship, and rewarding hard work and good ideas.
  • 4 0
 @Layman: well said. Capitalism needs to be restrained enough to drown it in the bathtub if it starts getting too big for it's britches.
  • 11 0
 @splitlit: poor people don't get a lot of choice of where to work. If you can't afford to move and a big company puts your small businesses employer with a heart of gold out of business, do you starve or take a shittier job?
  • 8 0
 @phops: whoa, dude. supporting some common-sense, data-supported restraints on capitalism does not make you Karl Marx.
  • 10 0
 @phops: Labelling complex economic structures as ‘capitalist’ or ‘communist’ is as ridiculous as labelling political structures as ‘right’ or ‘leftist’ - there isn’t any nuance allowed and in reality the centre is often where the best outcome lies for everyone.

I am not anti capitalist, it would be pretty hypocritical of me as I run a small business an use all of the ‘capitalist’ tools available to me to do so but does that mean as a result I need to make certain choices regarding staff pay and welfare?

The paradox of capitalism in this image is that in driving to achieve the lowest available cost of service and highest possible profit margin means a resultant ‘system’ that cannot sustain itself as people don’t have enough spare money to actually buy goods anymore (so the system throws credit at poor people, so they can buy clothes with 3 equal payments or get payday loans)

In short, capitalism as a broad definition is probably the best option available to society currently, it just needs to be regulated a little more fairly so everyone can benefit, not just those hard working stressed out billionaires.
  • 2 0
 @cvoc: I too find it easy to justify a bad thing by comparing it to a single other bad thing, like those are the only two options!
  • 7 1
 @phops: if by "work" you mean

- transfers vast amounts of wealth from poor to rich
- incentivises exploitation of people who have to sell their labour to make a living (i.e. most people)
- incentivises extraction of finite resources, causing ecological and environmental destruction

Etc.

Then yes, capitalism *does* work.
  • 1 3
 @justanotherusername: higher concept question that was. sorry you missed it.

I am asking, do you think he is legally, morally or otherwise, obligated to employ people?
  • 4 0
 @conoat: ‘higher concept’? As in specific to your delusions of grandeur?

Do I think he is obligated, legally morally or otherwise to employ people? Yes, in some way to all of them.
  • 2 2
 @justanotherusername: then, why aren't you? or I?

the answer is, he does not have any obligation to employ people. What you are saying, makes him a slave. He is forced to do your bidding. He has every right to pack it up and fire everyone, sell the business and f*ck off to Monaco or somewhere. Then 100% of the employees are out of work.

It's the same as saying you have some "right" to health care. You absolutely do not, since that right can only be fulflilled by a human. Saying you have some right to their labor, is saying they are your slave. You are a puke if you honestly believe that.
  • 3 1
 @conoat: The whole "rights" argument is usually framed incorrectly. Flip the coin. It's more about obligations - meaning, as an exceptionally wealthy society (yours or mine or the rest of the so-called "first world"), what obligations does it have to its citizens? Where should we direct the excess capacity we generate? Towards tax cuts for the rich? Or towards making sure nobody goes hungry or dies unnecessarily? It's not an abstract question - it's a moral declaration of your priorities.
  • 1 8
flag conoat (Mar 11, 2021 at 7:19) (Below Threshold)
 @Layman: no one goes hungry or dies unnecessarily in either of our countries. it's a complete falsehood that is trotted out to justify ever increasing government control and spending.

a true capitalist society(neither of us live in one) would have no excess capacity. that is idiotic. If I have 50 orders for widgets, making 100 is ludicrous. If I do make 100 and am stuck with 50 widgets no one wants, that's my burden, but also my right to do with what I want. I don't owe anyone a widget becasue I have extra.

and ffs, please for the love of the baby jeebus, stop with the f*cking class warfare rhetoric. "tax cuts for the rich" you even have a shred of an idea what the "rich" pay in taxes? I will give you a hint...IT'S ALMOST ALL OF THEM! My wife and I aren't rich. we are high earners. wildly different things. Our tax bill, if it were someone's salary, would put that person in the top 5% of wage earners. that sound fair?

the top 10% of wage earners pay 90% of the income taxes in the US. the top 20% pay 96%! the top 1%? yeah, they pay 40% of all federal income taxes paid. the bottom 50% of all tax payers pay an effective tax rate of 0%. SO! you have a near even split of people pulling the f*cking wagon as you have along for to the ride. What happens when you push that burden so high on producers that they simply drop the yoke? you have an entire country full of deadbeats in a wagon going backwards down the hill.

So, instead of demonizing the people that own the capital, run this businesses, innovate and produce hundreds of millions of jobs, say thank you. With out the Steve Jobs, Elon Musks, and Richard Bransons of the world, we...neigh, the entire planet would be far, far worse off. Capitalism has lifted over 4 billion...thats nine zero, BILLION, people out of poverty in the last 50 years. 200 years ago, 90% of the planet lived in abject poverty. today it's less than 10% even with a population that's 400% higher. Capitalism did that. Business owners did that. Innovators did that. BILLIONAIRES DID THAT!
  • 1 2
 @justanotherusername: "highest possible profit margin".

you know how I know you don't understand what running a business is really about, even though you proport to have one? It's that you either fail to see what the point of a "high profit margin" is or you are being purposefully obtuse and omiting it.

Any successful(I will leave you the possibilty that you run an unsuccessful business. It seems likely) business in a competitive market pushes to get costs down and gross margins up, for the express purpose of lowing prices to gain further market share. It takes about a 7th grade understanding of mathematics to know that lower net margins on higher volume sales makes more money than high margin and low volume.
  • 1 0
 @FatSanch: MAKE EVANS GREAT AGAIN! we employees tried our best to make evans a good bike shop but unfortunately it was ran by utter incompetence and people who are truly out of touch with cyclists. Let me be very clear, Evans was screwed well before sports direct took over! Awful people have been running that place for years and now an ex Evanscycles owner and huge turd, mr rice, has another company on the rise which is essentially Evans 2.0. Company BALFES BIKES was brought out and is now well on its way to be the next evans. I would urge fellow cyclists to boycott these corporate cycling stores and look else where as there other alternatives. The people who run these company’s are soulless and couldn’t give a monkeys about bikes and it’s enthusiasts, a stain on our sport for hobby for sure! F**k these pieces of sh*t
  • 1 0
 @conoat: "It takes about a 7th grade understanding of mathematics to know that lower net margins on higher volume sales makes more money than high margin and low volume."

Except it does not take just 7th grade understanding of mathematics, which is evident when you realise the ammount of physicists, mathematicians and engineers working in business and finance.

Don't over simplify the question at hand just to try and prove your point.
  • 1 3
 @c-radicallis: what I am talking about is not macro-economic theory. It's business theory 101 at your local community college at best. Stop trying to make rudimentary business math into quantitative easing theory to prove your point.
  • 4 1
 @conoat: there is so much wrong with your arguments I'm not sure where to begin. Nobody becomes rich in a vacuum. Businesses use roads, airports, ports, etc. Which are all supported by taxes. If you found a way to get rich without being supported by others, then by all means, keep all your money.
  • 1 5
flag conoat (Mar 11, 2021 at 9:08) (Below Threshold)
 @FatSanch: do you think I use roads at a 1500% higher rate than a person that makes the mean salary?

because that is the current amount I pay more than the average person. How am I getting equity?
  • 7 1
 @conoat: Poverty has been decreasing at ever increasing rates since the beginning of humanity. Capitalism has been around for very tiny fraction of that time. Capitalism is not responsible for decreasing poverty.

Innovation has been increasing at ever increasing rates since the beginning of humanity. Capitalism has been around for very tiny fraction of that time. Capitalism is not responsible for increasing innovation.

Capitalism does create a lot of jobs, which might seem cool at first, but taking a deeper look at today's society reveals the existence of many bullshit jobs, and also an ever increasing amount of underpaid jobs as result of increasing alienation, as result of increasing specialization and automation of work, among other reasons.
Nowadays automation may even have negative effects in society, since it is now being used to increase capital, instead of being employed towards decreasing work time while making it more productive, as was the case in earlier human societies.

All "Steve Jobs, Elon Musks, and Richard Bransons" achievements rely on the work of their contemporaries and predecessors. That's how living in a society works. Working class people of today have no reason to thank them. Some might argue that we should even be unthankful to them because they have actually taken much more from society than they have given back, as is proven the ever increasing inequality, and also by the fact that being that rich is mostly luck driven (Since you and your family earn soo much you might be too disconnected from the reality of working class people to understand this, but i can elaborate further on this point if you please).
  • 6 1
 @conoat: @conoat: I employ 8 people, myself and business partner own more than a few quids worth of CNC machinery, nearly own our premises, our balance sheet is very healthy and our employees are very safe, and hopefully happy people.

We make a very good profit margin on our products and we continue to grow at around 30% year on year, this year more and we have further invested to increase product line and capture more of the market as you say, it’s also improved the employee working environment too so that’s a bonus - we strive to be as efficient as possible, as environmentally friendly as possible and as ethically sound as possible all while ensuring business longevity and safety.

I have been doing this for 20 years, do you own a business, or are you involved in one in any way other than being perhaps a bean counter?

You see, if you make billions of pounds profit you don’t need to push your staff to the very edge of the working wage, do you? That’s called greed and exploitation my small minded little friend.

Maybe you are one of the strange individuals that like the idea of billionaires as you think one day you will be one? Well, you won’t.
  • 4 0
 @conoat: But the reality is that, despite you paying soo much tax compared to "normal" people, you are still actually getting the better end of the deal, because your earnings depend on others work, which then depends on them having infrastructure which enables them to work.

Investing in society in such a way that creates more specialized and automated work is expensive, but in the end the incresed alienation of people from the value they produce still pays off for the capital.
  • 4 0
 @c-radicallis: he is still a ‘normal person though’ even though he may want to consider he isn’t.

Even if he pays 1500% more tax than the plebs he is still a penniless individual compared to those with actual wealth.

Some people are just obsessed with their ‘right’ to be mega wealthy without seeing they they are not and will never actually be, quite sad really.
  • 2 0
 @justanotherusername: Very true. The wealth of someone such as Jeff Bezos is truly insane.
  • 5 0
 @conoat: "no one goes hungry or dies unnecessarily in either of our countries."
This is not true.

Over 10% of American households are food insecure. The percentage is higher for households with children, so yes, milions of American children suffer from hunger. In most cases this is because people can't afford food.

Why? There are many reasons, but this is capitalism - people try to buy everything the cheapest possible, including labour of other people. With unregulated minimal wages, Amazon and the likes pay the least they can, and being monopolists, they dictate how the market looks like. So even if people work hard, they can't sustain themselves and their families. Then other citizens and government (from tax money) have to help - food banks, or sorts of relief systems - so citizens pay because large companies are not regulated and can't be made to pay themselves for the work they benefit from. Effectively, government ends up subsidising the large companies by keeping their employees alive.

www.ers.usda.gov/topics/food-nutrition-assistance/food-security-in-the-us/key-statistics-graphics.aspx
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunger_in_the_United_States
  • 3 0
 @conoat: BTW the hunger issue is present in the UK as well and it deteriorated in the recent decade. It may be surprising it happens in first world countries, but hard to argue with the facts.
foodfoundation.org.uk/new-food-foundation-data-sept-2020
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunger_in_the_United_Kingdom
  • 3 0
 @Slabrung: further more, the hunger in many third world countries is a direct result of the extraction of wealth and resources from western capitalists/colonists (see Africa and South America, for example). Third world countries aren’t under developed, they’re over exploited.
  • 1 2
 @Slabrung: do you know the metric of "food insecure"? or are you just taking it how it sounds? the actual measurment is if any time in a week you didn't know when you were eating next. sounds scary? well, if you arent sure you will eat at 7pm or 9pm, they count that as insecure. it's a complete load of shit
  • 3 0
 @conoat: I suppose you would attempt to spin this so you can consider it to be a 'load of shit' - but then you do earn '1500%' more than average so what would you know, eh big roller?

You are an ignorant, arrogant piece of shit, learn to at least read first - From the website given above:

Food insecurity here is based on an affirmative response to one of three questions:

In the last 12 months, did you or other adults in the household ever cut the size of your meals or skip meals because there wasn’t enough money for food?

In the last 12 months, were you ever hungry, but didn’t eat, because there wasn’t enough money for food?

In the last 12 months did you or other adults in your household ever not eat for a whole day because there wasn’t enough money for food?
  • 1 0
 @conoat: By the way - what part of the bike industry are you involved in? - You must own one hell of a shop or business to be paying yourself 1500% more than the average guy in the UK?
  • 1 0
 @justanotherusername: I think he owns Evans, lol.
  • 34 1
 This yet another example of the problem with ownership by conglomerates and/or shareholders. Despite likely churning an accounting profit, Fraser will do anything for the last drop of margin- and will harm communities, employees and customers (I can't imagine you fire 45% of staff in shops without a significant drop in customer service) to do it.
  • 13 0
 It is really frustrating when short sited owners don't understand that creating value also means being a good business long term. The founder of Whole Foods seemed to get this... of course, then they sold to Amazon.
  • 22 0
 @HB208: Long term is irrelevant when corporate "leaders" are incentivized on a quarterly basis or less.
  • 3 0
 @Layman: That's not true for every company. I work for a public company that I actually do thinks beyond next quarter, but that is certainly not true for every company. When the pandemic hit, no one was laid off at my company expect for a few people in a portion of the company that really really took a hit.
  • 10 1
 Not true. Large corporations can be very supportive of longer term strategic planning. It isn't about the size of the organization, its about the underlying biases of the organizations leadership team and how they choose to see and demonstrate value to their ownership.
  • 2 0
 @Layman: I just had to complete a 3/5 year business objective plan (which we seem to update every 2 quarters).
  • 5 0
 @HB208: I'm glad you do. Historically, you're not alone. Most companies operated on a stakeholder model rather than a shareholder model prior to the 1980s. The pendulum is swinging back in that direction. We'll see if it swings fast enough to avoid social upheaval.
  • 3 1
 @noplacelikeloam: Correct - it's not about size, it's about structure (and culture as you point out). But public companies that don't focus on quarterly returns are rare these days.
  • 1 0
 Shareholders don't have a say on what the company does. They are silent investors. However, publicly owned companies do have a different business dynamic than privately owned companies.
  • 2 0
 @Layman: Financials of public companies seem to be almost secondary to public perception nowadays. Look at Tesla and solar stocks. Most have gone up hundreds of percent if not thousands of percent in last few years while their financials are extremely poor.
  • 3 0
 @tacklingdummy: That's the problem. The market has become a self-licking ice cream cone and it's no longer good decisions that are rewarded, but hype and marketing. But for the people who work at these companies or depend on their products, it's not a casino game - it's their livelihood and their lives. When jobs are cut in the name of making the quarterly target, people lose their homes. When the desire for more profit more than triples the price of insulin in 10 years despite it being patent-free for nearly 100 years, people die. For the last 40 years, we've been content to pretend the market is some sort of Darwinian culling machine for companies. But it's been a facade all along, and the people most hurt aren't the people at the top of the pyramid - it's the people at the bottom.
  • 1 0
 MAKE EVANS GREAT AGAIN! we employees tried our best to make evans a good bike shop but unfortunately it was ran by utter incompetence and people who are truly out of touch with cyclists. Let me be very clear, Evans was screwed well before sports direct took over! Awful people have been running that place for years and now an ex Evanscycles owner and huge turd, mr rice, has another company on the rise which is essentially Evans 2.0. Company BALFES BIKES was brought out and is now well on its way to be the next evans. I would urge fellow cyclists to boycott these corporate cycling stores and look else where as there other alternatives. The people who run these company’s are soulless and couldn’t give a monkeys about bikes and it’s enthusiasts, a stain on our sport for hobby for sure! F**k these pieces of sh*t
  • 27 0
 Zero-hours contracts means poor uberized workers: www.theguardian.com/business/2021/mar/09/mike-ashley-owned-evans-cycles-to-axe-300-staff Greedy corporations gonna use the crisis to do a "take it or leave it" to lower down the wages at will.
  • 9 0
 This "Zero-hours contracts" seems to be a UK thing:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zero-hour_contract

"The term 'zero-hour contract' is primarily used in the United Kingdom"

Kiwis have banned them: "A bill outlawing zero-hour contracts in New Zealand was unanimously passed on 10 March 2016"
  • 8 0
 @zoobab2: yes, they should be illegal.
  • 22 0
 Was always gonna happen. Not as good as a local bike shop and can’t compete with online pricing. Was just a high end Halfords
  • 5 1
 Though that’s right, Mike Ashley would behave in this manner even if it was the most profitable, popular and slick operation around.
  • 1 2
 You’ve nailed it
  • 37 14
 Capitalism is broken. We need some large scale adjustments.
  • 30 5
 I don't disagree with this take, and capitalism is working out for me and my wife just fine. I hate seeing how much people in the US struggle with basics while the best off lobby against anyone's interest but their own.
  • 3 2
 @HB208: Bingo!
  • 17 4
 governement manipulated and bastardized capitalism(crony capitalism) is broken. we need large scale adjustments in government.
  • 3 3
 @HB208: The "basics" are extremely relative
  • 8 3
 @Peally: Food, shelter, clothes, healthcare, childcare, and education. Not that relative if you as me.
  • 14 5
 Capitalism isn't broken, it's just that most capitalist societies unfortunately drift towards cronyism (ie. bribes, lobbying, revolving doors for politicians, political donations/fundraisers).
  • 9 5
 @splitlit: "Capitalism isn't broken, it's just that unbridled capitalism leads to bad things."

Fixed that for you.
  • 9 2
 @conoat: absolutely.
and there are people who actually believe we live in free market capitalism! at this stage its an utter fallacy. i'm just waiting for some lunatic to say that the solution is communism lol.
  • 14 5
 @tobiusmaximum: I don't think the solution is communism. The solution, at least in the US, is divorcing money from politics and getting rid of the electoral college. Most Americans want better social programs, but the way are government is structured means that small states (I live in one of them) have huge influence over federal level policy.
  • 9 5
 @HB208: Getting rid if the electoral college will do harm to those people in the middle of the country (fly over states). Our founding fathers were very flawed men, but they understood that we all need to be represented as equally as possible. We need to give more power back to individual states and less power to the federal "one solution fits all" government. Each state has different problems and issues. We can't allow the the left coast or right coast dictate what happens in the middle. I agree divorcing all money from corporations, lobby groups, and all labor unions from donating money to political parties. I believe donations from individuals should not more than $1000. I am pro-capitalism with restraint that favors the middle class. We need to get rid of every congressmen and senator that has been in DC for more than one term, too many old out of touch politicians.
  • 8 7
 @Esmond: "Our founding fathers were very flawed men, but they understood that we all need to be represented as equally as possible."

Except that is literally the opposite of what the EC does. If anything, it makes people in small states more equal than large states. This was a compromise based on slave states wanting power, so I wouldn't push this too much. I live in the "middle" and my state is set up in the same way, with small areas getting more power than the large areas. Guess what they focus on? Super regressive policies that hurt the population. They are literally trying to make it harder to get ballot initiatives going so we can't pass medicial marijuana, even though most of the state wants it.
  • 3 6
 @Esmond: What issues specifically are you concerned would not be represented, however? I mean, having something like a public option actually helps people living in smaller states more since they tend to be more rural and poor. Public lands? Well, Democrats seem to want to protect public lands more than any member of the GOP. Trump just got off a four year attack on public lands after all. I guess on cultural issues, maybe, but not the issues that affect the well being of someone's day to day life, such as healthcare, childcare, union protections, etc.
  • 2 0
 @HB208: Agreed up to your comment "small states...." It simply has to do with corporate money in politics, like you mentioned straight off. Corp oligarchs buy the politicians, who then make policy to benefit the oligarchs who pay/own them. Doesn't have anything to do with states per se.
  • 6 2
 @Esmond: That's a mythology mate. The reason it's a myth is because of something called "winner take all". The electoral college is literally the most undemocratic thing we have in this country. It does nothing but take the "losing party's" votes in a given state and throw them in the trash! It would be way better to have an open popular system. Then at least the "losing party's" votes would actually be counted towards something!!
  • 4 3
 @Esmond: definitely agree with this take. I'm from CA, trust me you don't want us having even more control over everyone. Things need to change but the electoral college is important. Like you said, getting money and politics split apart is what we need and term limits. It's insane how long some of our congressmen have been in power and how crazy rich they've gotten while constantly promising change and blaming the other side. It's one big party.
  • 4 0
 @mybaben: It's all complicated. Thanks for hearing me out at least. Pinkbike MTB forums are probably not the place to debate these things in depth haha.
  • 3 2
 It is puzzling to me how some people are anti-capitalism, but pro-globalism.
  • 2 0
 @splitlit: I love playing devil's advocate, so I'ma go nuts here. And here it goes: if one of the largest issues with capitalism is corruption, moreover legalized corruption aka lobbying, would everyone agree that it is a fundamental aspect of capitalism since it appears in every form of capitalistic government to varying degrees?

Just as a side note I mostly agree with you. I think that capitalism tends to gravitate towards corruption because its a natural commodification of power and privilege. Cronyism is an unfortunate side effect of power dynamics.... I personally think that capitalism has a great carrot but the stick has been shrunken to the point that the punishments are not proportional to crimes, especially for the powerful. And that needs to be fixed first.
  • 2 1
 @Breeconay: Corruption and cronyism exist in every type of economic system (ie. its a natural human tendency called greed). Its endemic in socialist/communist societies. I was born and raised in a socialist Soviet satellite state and corruption is embedded in absolutely every single part of society. Its hard for people to understand what its like to have to bribe and grease every single person you have interactions with.

I think people need to remember context and that everything is relative. If someone thinks capitalism is broken, I say "compared to what?".

I wish these employees the best of luck in finding new employment, but this isn't a sign that capitalism is broken, rather a management team full of @ssholes. I've been in their position and have been fired/quit to move on to greener pastures.
  • 2 0
 @splitlit: I enjoyed your comment. It's very well thought out and from experience. I have no malice towards capitalism, I just think we've exposed parts of it that need addressing, like cronyism and unique forms of corruption. It's in need of the bike equivalent of a tuneup. Lot's of people hear critics and think that legitimate criticisms of capitalism = a bleeding heart communist. I merely hope we can take a productive system and improve it to the benefit of all. Oddly enough pinkbike is kinder than reddit.

I am stoked to ride soon, though.
  • 4 3
 @tobiusmaximum: those lunatics already exist. en masse. Look around, you see it everywhere. the push towards socialism is simply the same thing a pedophile does with kids. It's grooming. moving the Overton Window at a pace as to not make the frog jump out of the pot. Single payer health care, wealth tax, student loan forgiveness, UBI? these are real things that exist today or are being publically championed by politicians and cheered by idiots. Tomorrow these become: ban on private medical care, confiscation of wealth over a certain amount(only of those not of the goverment class mind you), State owned higher education and labor assignments(hello Caste system!!).

Our only real hope is the next generation rebels against this feckless Millenial generation and values freedom, liberty and the innate right of man to be independant.
  • 4 3
 @HB208: the EC is the only barrier between the representive republic and mob rule. without it, California and New York would wholesale dictate how Kansas lives and operates. That is wildly immoral.
  • 1 0
 @HB208: Cheers!
  • 19 0
 You're watching a 5 year plan to liquidation in action.
  • 16 2
 I saw the hat and pretty much knew the story....read it and was not surprised. If you're American--this is normal business "leadership". Can't be happy with 1.8 billion...need to tighten the tourniquet and get to 1.82. It's time for everybody to stop work and say we ain't down with your relentless pursuit of money...you "rich" guys aren't ever happy. They hide behind drugs, ex-wives and a fake persona. They are ruining all the fun.
  • 17 2
 Maybe norco will turn to independent dealers now. My shop was rejected due to their exclusive deal with evans. Does norco have any idea how bad that sounds as a consumer?
  • 9 2
 It's the reason i didn't buy a Norco
  • 4 0
 Won’t be long before they find a U.K. distro. I work in an independent store. We also reached out and got told To hold on and reach out again soon...
  • 1 0
 @Moskau:

I did tell them that evans has a pretty poor rep in the uk and is going bust. They said its not in their plans to change it anytime soon. More fool them. They have awesome bikes but could sell 10x more of they werent exclusive to evans
  • 13 0
 Loved my time working at evans, Mike arsehole killed the company during the pandemic, taking away the work shops ability to be able to order parts for repairs or upgrades turned a lot of business away. No clear Communication From the fraser’s head office. Will miss the team I worked with and wish them all the best as they all have a lot of great knowledge that’s surely gonna be lost in the industry when it comes to helping people out.
  • 4 0
 glad to hear you won't become a zero hour simp
  • 10 0
 Dude's got a net worth of nearly two billion dollars... his problem is the same as Jeff Bezos', they just aren't willing to take the tiniest of L's to keep people actually making a living
  • 4 1
 he`s not the only one lol. Had a guy on facebook Marketplace try to sell some new 26`` DHF at 110$. DUDE GOT THEM FREE AND HES TRYING TO SELL THEM AT FULL PRICE.
People don`t like to take the slightest L.
  • 1 3
 How do you think he got the 2B?

This is his business and he can run it how he wants. Funny how everybody knows all the margins and bottom lines for Evans cycles all the sudden...
  • 2 0
 @warmerdamj: probably born rich and used that money to get richer. A la Bezos, musk, gates, Buffett, etc.
  • 1 0
 @kleinblake: wWhat's your point either way? All I get from this brief exchange is that we are both wasting our time bantering about something that really has no impact on us and is going to repeat itself many times over in different ways.

We should just go ride our bikes man.
  • 1 0
 @warmerdamj: Not trying to tell a billionaire how to run his business, but when the entire world is struggling, the least they could do with 1% of their money is help other people
  • 9 0
 Last summer without warning they took away trade discount and offered a 10% discount up to £1000, to be in line with the rest of his brands. It was an insult to all passionate cyclists working for them. Will they attract anyone who is into the sport to work for them? Highly unlikely. They have no idea about cycling and do not understand our world works.
Saying this, even before Sports Direct took over, Evans were wasting money everywhere, more concerned about how their stores look like, than their staff, losing so many passionate and knowledgeable people, because they did not want to pay them just a little bit more. Always just above the minimum wage. London living wage? So not make me laugh.
Worked with amazing people there, made friends for life, learned a lot and had a great time working for Evans, but the patent was sick a long time before the takeover.
  • 2 0
 There were some good days... like listening to NWD soundtracks and having to explain the playlist to Roadies, and the camaraderie that came from being united against the man.
That said, you’re right: the patent was sick before the takeover. We lived in a place 20ft sq and I remember tearing a hole in the corner of my pay envelope (to empty out the coins) while my wife put an extra £100 on it for rent. In the 10months I worked there I never saw my Evans pay check.
Hope the affected staff find great jobs.
  • 10 3
 It's stylish now to dunk on the obvious greed of big businesses, but before you go high five your rider-owned LBS' managers, ask them as politely as you like how much they pay, what kind of benefits they offer, what kind of stability in hours and schedules their employees or contractors get
  • 6 2
 I don't think you read the article. I mean ...I know it's a staggering 3-4 paragraphs long (almost rivaling the novel War and Peace), so I can't blame you for missing this part....BUT

They will also be moved to zero-hour contracts or what Frasers Group calls “casual worker agreements,” meaning that they will not be guaranteed regular work hours. Frasers Group pledged to stop using zero-hour contracts five years ago after the group faced criticism from unions and members of parliament. However, nothing changed, and the issue remains polarizing.
  • 3 1
 @kymtb0420: Thank you for replying. I sincerely don't understand what you're trying to draw may attention to. In the US and likely in some other nations represented on PB, even not being an independent contract worker (being an employee), doesn't guarantee a worker regular work hours. If you're part-time like many bike shop employees, you have very few rights beyond what a IC worker gets. And so rate of hourly pay is surely one of the top indicators of how well the shop is taking care of their workers. So is how regular their schedules are

My point is that just being a rider-owned LBS doesn't indicate employment practices that are one shred better than those of this shtty UK megastore. A consumer has to ask how they treat their workers before running to social media to upvote the LBS. I've worked in three shops, each totally different
  • 2 0
 @Snfoilhat: My point is....it's all crooked. I do see your point about a larger company having more resources for steady employment, but that is 10 year ago thinking. They don't want to pay people anymore...they want every penny to themselves.

I just thought it was funny that some of the points you were making, were exactly mentioned in the article...to where it seemed you didn't read the article. Wink

No matter what...It's a big club-and you and I ain't in it. I forget who said that---but he said some other funny stuff to. ;0
  • 8 1
 I went to Evans once , pre Mike Ashley, as my gear cable had broken on my commute into work, after two people spent 5 minutes looking at a screen they told me they were too busy, I assumed they were joking, they weren't so I never went back. Ashley is a complete twat and turns most things to shite.
  • 8 1
 Disgustang
  • 3 0
 We'll see more of this.. unfortunately. And it's not just bike shops, this is going to be a global shift in many different industries as our economies pivot to a new way of doing business.
  • 3 0
 Restructuring has been going on for a long time and in many industries. I’m glad that I have a job that can’t be automated or offshored
  • 5 1
 @Mntneer: hold capitalism's beer.
  • 3 1
 Mike Ashley and his cronies are clueless about the cycle industry and the need of those who still support the brand, companies such as Norco need to wake up and remove their brand from Evans, they're the wrong fit for such a forward thinking brand, it would seem that Evans is the only cycling business going backwards in the current pandemic cycling boom, shame on Ashley.
  • 4 0
 Sad story. Germany might lose against all those turbo capitalism states in the future, but i still like the idea of social market economy. So, hello future Frown
  • 4 1
 Germany seems to be doing rather well. I would have preferred to be born there than in the US, FWIW. My dang great grandfather left germany 100 years ago... well, maybe that was good timing all things considered.
  • 2 6
flag nurseben (Mar 10, 2021 at 12:59) (Below Threshold)
 @HB208: You are truly clueless.
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 @nurseben: you're such a douchebag...
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 "Managers will have to work 45 hours a week now"...lucky.
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 That translates as 6 full days a week - 8 hrs a day with a half hour lunch break. Most people in the UK only work 5 days a week, so not that lucky...
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 No more after work biking for those guys ????
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 Any idea if this means Evans Cycles will stop organising road and MTB sportives (Ride It)? I did a couple and thoroughly enjoyed them and was impressed by the organisation. Last year's programme was cancelled because of Covid so was wondering whether they used that to bring the programme to an end.
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 RIDE IT has gone, along with the 29 staff who ran them. It was never a profit making thing for Evans, purely for marketing ( The fact you enjoyed them proves it worked) Unfortunately lower rider numbers and yearly increases in costs meant the amount it was costing the company became too much to run in the usual format. So we rethought the offering, lost some staff and came up with a figure they begrudging accepted. That was March last year. As soon as Covid hit they basically used it as the excuse they needed to wrap it up. Not that we'd have lasted too much longer by the look of it either. What hasn't been widely reported is that they intend to close the Gatwick HQ and move everything up to Shirebrook, it might have already happened. So that's basically the whole company except the store staff unemployed or perhaps offered a move to Derbyshire. Evans Cycles no longer exists, it's now just another stall in the SportsDirect stable.
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 BTW, one of the RIDE IT managers now works for Sportive Breaks heading up their UK sportives. I think you'll find a few of the old staff there as well.....
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 @Dale17: That's a real shame but thank you for the heads up about Sportive Breaks. Hopefully they and other companies will step into the space and expand their offering. I always had a good time on Ride It events riding new places and meeting other like minded people.
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 @Dale17: They closed Gatwick HQ last month, most of warehouse staff and head office staff made redundant (over 90%).
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 @gooral: And that's the real tragedy. The head office was full of great, knowledgeable staff who wanted Evans to survive. Now it'll be SD staff who don't understand the industry and will focus on profits, making it Evans Cycles in name only.
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 Wouldn’t expect anything else when the owner is someone like Mike Ashley. Feel sorry for the staff, who are clearly regarded as having little value.
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 This is sad to read. I love the Pinnacle Chromium concept of a Women's do-it-all urban bicycle. I was that close to buying from UK for my missus, but the didn't quite like the shapes and looks. But on paper this was a great product at a reasonable price range, meeting my needs at least: comfort, modern, with retro looks yet light weight.
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 i always cringe when i hear that a company is being bought up someone that views it as an investment but has little interest in the product and or especially the employees and maintaining a high level of quality and good service .
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 MAKE EVANS GREAT AGAIN! we employees tried our best to make evans a good bike shop but unfortunately it was ran by utter incompetence and people who are truly out of touch with cyclists. Let me be very clear, Evans was screwed well before sports direct took over! Awful people have been running that place for years and now an ex Evanscycles owner and huge turd, mr rice, has another company on the rise which is essentially Evans 2.0. Company BALFES BIKES was brought out and is now well on its way to be the next evans. I would urge fellow cyclists to boycott these corporate cycling stores and look else where as there other alternatives. The people who run these company’s are soulless and couldn’t give a monkeys about bikes and it’s enthusiasts, a stain on our sport for hobby for sure! F**k these pieces of sh*t
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 Is this guy the Newcastle owner as well?
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 yep
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 Unfortunately.
And look how that's going Frown
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 When customers are that eager to buy, why do you need customer service.
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 Well, if you want a good business after a once in a generation bike boom is happening due to a 1 in a hundred year pandemic, you might want to not act like a jackass.
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 Next year's sales - but they don't think that far ahead.
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 Terrible shop anyway, shame for the staff though
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 The high street is no longer a viable arena for retail. The internet and global pandemic have put paid to that... Doesnt help when its owned by a clown either mind...
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 Sounds like the UK version of Performance Bicycle, and probably headed the same direction.
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 Gotta keep those profits going up! Who cares about employees. Total dick move by Evans cycles.
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 It's was dying long before Mike Ashley took over. Way before. He bought a failed business and couldn't turn it.
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 Ouch! I liked Evan Cycles. It's too bad all the European online shops are likely suffering from lack of sales of parts where customers are coming from North America. Why? Parts manufacturers like SRAM and other boutique vendors and restricted their commodities to be sold and shipped to other places of the world. Now that Shimano has followed suit in the past few years, I'm sure their online business has also gone down as well. It really sucks that global competition is restricted by LBS that don't want to be competitive in their pricing and then that is followed suit by manufacturers restricting their products to local markets, thus driving up the prices. I hope Evan Cycle can remain in business and compete with Wiggles/CRC. After Wiggles bought CRC, it's just not the same. How do the Brits say that - it's shites! I really wish European stores can tell parts manufacturers like SRAM and Shimano to shove their exclusivity contracts up their asses and start selling things the way they did before.
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 I actually think market restrictions might be good for retailers of commodities. Wiggle were front runners in a worldwide race to the bottom with cycling commodity prices. Five years ago the UK cycling market had become so competitive it was cheaper for a Japanese customer to buy Shimano wheels in the UK and ship them back to where they had come from. All for the retailer to make single figure profit margins. It was crazy, not least from an environmental perspective. Yes, cheap prices are good for the consumer in the short term but the market needs stability and the race to the bottom was very de-stabilising as Evans and even Wiggle's performance prior to Covid would attest to. The big change for the UK market is Brexit. Previously brands could do nothing to stop UK retailers from selling to the free market in the EU. Now however they have the power to tighten the UK market even more.
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 "It really sucks that global competition is restricted by LBS that don't want to be competitive in their pricing"

That's so factually inaccurate it's hard to know where to begin. To start with, Evans isn't a LBS, it's a nationwide chain. Mike Ashley wouldn't own Evans if it wasn't a high street brand.

Online retailers and large, nationwide chain stores (Evans, J E James, Halfords - in spite of their reputation) have much more buying power than the small LBS.
The reason why they are so large is that they are able to buy their stock in bulk (think tyres in their thousands, chains/inner tubes etc. in their tens of thousands - per order). The more stock they buy, the less it will cost per item. There is no way an LBS can compete with this, they don't have the resources or the warehousing capability. If a LBS were to do the same, it would either have to spend all its capital on buying a shit-tonne of stock, buying bigger premises to keep that stock in and then sell at a smaller profit, or buy less stock at the higher price and charge more. If they only bought the amount of stock they could afford but charged less to try and keep up with the likes of Evans, CRC/Wiggle etc, there wouldn't be enough profit in the sales to y'know, pay its staffs' wages. Or the rent on the shop premises.

The moral of the story is that if people really wanted to help local bike stores, stop buying from big companies and buy stuff from the little guy.
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 @JonnoMiller13:

Why would you buy form a crap shop that give poor service, sorry but they have got themselves into this mess
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 @JPKD: Might be great for the individual bike shops or retailers as they can jack up the price all they want. Sucks for all consumers who want the lowest price and the widest selection of products.
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 @JonnoMiller13: I would agree to a certain point about supporting LBS. However, I disagree about getting ripped off with the markups, especially if every LBS goes with the MSRP, which is BS pricing IMHO. No, manufacturer should suggest what a store should charge. It's pretty much price fixing. If every country is a socialist state, sure everyone should pay for the same price for the same item. However, in a capitalist free open market world, these fix pricing scheme is called price fixing and it eliminates or decreases competition.
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 what a lousy company, everything about them in this article stinks! they're moving to 100% efficiency, bad news for the little guy, say goodbye to your rights and freetime, it's happening in everything
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 Makes no sense, as it states the bike industry has boomed and continues to do so. Most likely down to greed from the top. The shop was crap 15 years ago and hasn't really got any better by the sounds of it.
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 How during a time when cycle shops are selling bikes faster than they can get stock does this happen?

The chain took a massive nose dive when it got bought out and taken over by a chav!

Such a shame!
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 I feel sorry for any person in this position who cant put food a on the table, but as many people state as a Brand they are useless, they sell things because they are their. I posted a review of a product and it wasn't complimentary , the did not post as it wasn't in the "spirit" of the other reviews, this is illegal for a start. I bought some sealant that was so thick it did not coat the inside of the tire so was useless, they did nothing about it and did not offer a refund. Last month I e mailed them asking what they had in stock or coming in to stock as I wanted a new bike, their reply was "check the website periodically" to me this individual deserves to be sacked as he did nothing to assist and he is not contributing to the company or its success. This is why they wont be missed, as for managers working 45 hours, welcome to the real world of successful companies.
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 The new kids ready to replace them are Balfes bikes.

This business was taken ove by Mike Rice the man who made Evans into the machine it is today. He’s doing the same with Balfes as he did with Evans. Make it a massive money making entity to suck as much money from the industry as possible then leave to let the ramians fall into chaos.

They’re the total embodiment of the word leach. They destroy LBS shops with their vast buying power and have no care or love for the cycling community just to take from it as much as they can.

They open shops in close proximity to long standing community shops and they fall because they just can’t compete with price.

Evans is the front of the problem. Mike Rice and his foundations are the real issue with Mike Ashley just following the preset left by Mr Rice, both absolute dooshbags.

Until the industry gets some morals and respects the LBS for its support to the community and the industry over these massive money machines then nothing will change.
We all need to act by not shopping with them.
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 Yeah shit shop... but sux for employees
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 So frustrating that this is the only place to buy Norco bikes in the UK!!
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 As someone who bought a Norco sight whilst working there I wholly agree; Miles from LTP (Norco's parent company) was always very helpful but the Evans system is a pile of shite. Reassuring to know I can get spares in the future...
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 Not anymore. Norco pulled the plug on them.
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 Cut staff then make the rest work harder...Scumbag owner
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 Running a business based on arbitrary marketing stats and ratios - sounds like the cornerstone of a great business...
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 Will they get any redundancy pay since they need to reapply for a new job?
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 Absolute bunch of c u next tuesdays....
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 Mike Ashley for you. Will end up running it like Sports Direct
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 His ownership is one of the main reasons I don’t have a norco optic. Evans have a norco exclusive in the uk which a shame
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 glad evans cycles is going, every single time, staff is unhelpful, and don't know their arse from elbow.
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 Used to be a great bike shop many years ago, now, the local Evans near me is shockingly bad.
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 just here in the comments for my daily business/economics lesson... learning a lot.
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 Thoroughly uninventive hat graphics. Kinda' makes me gag up a little vomit.
The new owner must be one Trump fanboy following the same philosphies to success?
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 I belthe hat was un jest, against the new ownership ?
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 Stooped phone. I believe the hat was in jest, against the new ownership
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 @nojzilla: it came from the previous owner as he was just as bad but sacked anyone involved. When the new owner arrived it got stepped up a gear.
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 @thegreenman88: cheers! I knew I'd read something aboot it, an ex employee or some one?
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 capitalism is a beast that doesn't feel full !!!
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 It’s simple for me, f*ck evans and f*ck Mike Ashley!
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 Rubbish shop anyway
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 Right sizing workforce - to bad this means serve job cuts. Time to do something else than wrench on bikes...
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