First Ride: The 2020 Cannondale Moterra Isn't Just Another SUV eMTB

Jul 23, 2019
by Dan Roberts  





Cannondale launched the original Moterra back in 2016 with an aluminum frame and a link-driven single pivot design that delivered either 130 or 160mm of travel depending on the model. The name may be the same, but the new Moterra is an entirely different beast, with 160mm of travel on all models, a carbon front triangle, and a Horst link suspension layout. It's now rolling on 29" wheels for the M, L, and XL sizes, while the size small gets 27.5" wheels.
Cannondale Moterra Details

Bosch Generation 4 System
Wheel Size: 27.5 (S) and 29 (M, L, XL)
Travel: 160mm F&R
Sizes: S, M, L & XL
Price: $6,000 - $9,000 USD
More info: www.cannondale.com

The bike's geometry has been updated as well, but the changes weren't too drastic - the 66° head angle matches that of the previous Moterra LT model, as does the 75° seat angle. The reach numbers have increased, though, by approximately 20-30mm per size.

In recent years Cannondale has had a change in brand mindset, shifting their focus to reach a broader group of riders. Peter Vallance, Senior Product Director, stressed their pursuit of fun, dependable, and well thought out bikes. And it’s with this mindset that they developed the new Moterra.


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Details & Features

Cannondale envisage the Moterra as the eMTB for people who come from having an analog full suspension bike. It’s a bike for people who are already informed about mountain biking, rather than the SUV-approach that some brands are using to reach beyond the traditional mountain bike industry.


Frame Materials

All Moterra models use a carbon fiber composite front triangle paired with an aluminum rear end. In some segments gram counting is rife in development, and while weight is an important factor Cannondale erred (errr, 'aired'?) a little more in the direction of durability. The frame carries a lifetime warranty.



Proportional Response

Sampling just a small percentage of the population shows the diversity in heights and weights between people, and trying to accommodate all these shapes and sizes into one package is tricky. What could be good for a small and lightweight Dave might not work for a long and hefty Sheila. Cannondale’s answer to this is 'Proportional Response'.

While taking into account that the center of gravity of a system of bike and rider will be different for an eMTB (with the added weight from the motor down low) Cannondale adjusts the frame kinematics for each size to tune the way the bike pedals, brakes and compresses the suspension. This should give a repeatable ride feel for the aforementioned Dave and Sheila and make sure that each rider extracts the same amount of fun that Cannondale engineered into the bikes.

Kinematics and geometry are handled by Luis Arraiz. If you don’t know about this chap then you should do a bit of searching on the internet to see why he’s gained the title El Kinematico. Arraiz moved the upper link position around to maintain the same acceleration and deceleration responses. Added to this he adjusted the shock mount on the mainframe to increase the leverage ratio progression as the frame size grows to add more resistance for the increase in mass that the bigger riders bring.



AI Offset Drivetrain

Not a new idea, and one that Cannondale have used for a while, the drivetrain (hub included) is offset towards the drive side. This wins important design space for tire and chainring clearance and allows more meat on the chain stay yokes which are often a weak point of any bike. The cherry on the cake is the better balance of spoke tension in the system, which should lead to a more durable rear wheel.


Stopping Power

With the added mass traveling at a high speed, Cannondale partnered with Magura to develop a new brake disc to up the braking power and also handle the increased heat build up. All models and sizes of Moterra come with big 220 or 225 rotors up front and 200 or 203 rotors out back (dependant on either Magura or SRAM brakes specced).

The new brake disc increases the number of pathways for the heat built up in the steel stopping portion of the rotor to dissipate into the aluminum spider, directing it away from the calliper, pads and brake fluid.
Photo Ale di Lullo






E-Bike System

Bosch Generation 4

The Moterra is built around the new Generation 4 Bosch Performance CX system with 250W (more on that soon). This new system is a much more compact and lightweight affair with increased performance capabilities all round. It's actually shrunk to half the size it was and ditched 3kg in the process. But performance is nothing without control, and the new system samples the inputs at a much higher rate and responds to those inputs with a faster response time. Power delivery is smooth and with a vastly reduced lag and makes the system feel a lot more natural in the whole riding experience.

The new eMTB mode is a welcome addition too. It continuously and seamlessly matches the rider's output, ranging anywhere in assistance from 140% to the full whack of 340%. It's almost a set and forget mode that just goes about its job silently and smoothly beneath you.

Nearly all Moterras use the bigger 625Wh Powertube battery (the Moterra 3 uses the 500Wh) and come with the 4a charger to refill your bike with go-juice in a shorter time. It’s hard to give an estimate of range, as it depends on a great many factors, but there’s a lot of data available on show through the display that goes into quickly helping you manage your ride with the different assistance modes that the system offers. But for example, we rode for 2.5 hours over about 23km and almost 1,500m of climbing in a mix of eMTB mode and Turbo and returned back to base with 18% battery.


Photo Ale di Lullo
Photo Ale di Lullo
The Moterra uses the new Generation 4 Bosch Performance CX system.


Integration into the Moterra

With one of the weight saving tactics employed by Bosch on the new system being to use a motor casing made out of magnesium, Cannondale added some armour in the way of a sturdy aluminum skid plate. With the added mass of an e-bike it sometimes results in you going through trail obstacles rather than up and over. So, this skid plates protects your investment.

There’s a sealed battery cover protecting the down tube located battery, an integrated speed sensor on the frame monitoring what’s going on via the magnet on the brake disc and a neatly positioned charge port at the bottom of the seat tube.

There’s been some good work to clean up the bike and there’s definitely no cable salad going on out front. It is recognizable as an eMTB, but it’s much closer to an analog bike than some of the competition. All cables are routed internally through guided tubed moulded into the front triangle.





Photo Ale di Lullo
The Moterra 1, as tested.


Build

The Moterra 1 that I rode comes specced with a Fox 36 up front with the Grip2 damper and a Fox DPX2 shock out back, which despite its visual size packs a deceptive amount of party.

Drivetrain is all SRAM with a mix of NX, GX and X01. Stan's Flow MK3 rims are laced to a front Formula hub and a rear SRAM hub and use DT's thicker Champion spokes. Maxxis tires provide the grip and the Moterra 1 comes with a Minion DHF and DHR II combo in 2.6 width. If wider tires aren’t your thing then the Stan's rims will easily accommodate narrower tires without having an adverse effect on the tire profile.

Magura MT7 brakes do the stopping and use the big 220 and 203mm rotors, which is a really nice touch to see specced on all sizes. The bikes specced with SRAM also see the big rotor sizes too.

Cannondale handles the stem and bars with 780mm wide bars mated to a nice short stem. Grips and saddle are from Fabric, which is part of the Cycling Sports Group, and were damn comfy to use. The dropper is also Cannondale-branded and worked well, although the drop is on the short side. Another little addition on the Moterra 1 is the SuperNova front light (with high and low beam), just in case you're out so long that the sun disappears.

Cannondale has four spec options of the Moterra.

• Moterra 1: SRAM X01/GX/NX, Fox 36 Grip2 & DPX2 - 7999 € / $9000 USD
• Moterra 2 - SRAM GX/NX, RockShox Lyrik Select Charger RC & Deluxe Select RT - 5999 € / $7000 USD
• Moterra 3 - SRAM SX, RockShox 35 Gold RL & Deluxe Select R - 4999 € / $6000 USD (*500Wh battery)
• Moterra SE - SRAM GX/NX, RockShox Boxxer Select Charger RC & Super Deluxe Select - 6999 € / $8500 USD

All spec information and pricing is available on the Moterra page of the website.


Photo Ale di Lullo


Moterra SE

One bike that jumps out in the line-up is the Moterra SE. While the frame remains the same there’s a Boxxer up front with 180mm travel. Even though many places in the world have lift access to the trails, be it from a chair lift or shuttle, this Moterra SE could be a splendid option for riders keen to lap their DH trails outside of lift hours or alternatively, if there’s no lift at all, get to the top quicker and cram more laps in coming down.

It also looks damn mean and there’s no doubting its intentions with the dual crown bolted on there.





Moterra Geometry Table
Moterra Geometry Image


Geometry

The geometry of the Moterra is focussed around having balance, and there’s no crazy numbers that push the envelope. There’s a lot of experience that the development team can look to from not only Cannondale but the other brands in the larger parent group. And with the e-bike product lead, Andreas Wildgrube, being almost exclusively an e-bike rider the development team definitely isn’t at their first rodeo.

There are four sizes on offer from 430mm reach for the S up to 495mm for the XL. A 66˚ head angle on all sizes and a 450mm chain stay to take a bit of that mad hill climb motorbike idea for when you’re deciding to see what bat shit crazy gradient you can make it up.

The 75° seat angle isn’t mega steep, and for spending more time aboard a Moterra the seat would probably get nudged forward a bit. But it’s definitely not bad, and results in a comfy space when sat down and climbing. Especially when climbing more technical terrain there’s a lot of body language going into the bikes, so a comfy position is a must.

The seat tube length is tiny bit longer than some other bikes out there, and maybe results in the shorter dropper posts being used. This is something we noticed with the Cannondale Habit as well. As is always the case with bikes, it’s best to jump on one and see if you fit properly before you hand over your hard-earned cash.

One surprise is the BB height. On paper it’s a bit high, but bikes are a collective of figures and factors that all work together. So out on the trail it didn’t feel as high as the number would suggest. It also leads to a greatly reduced amount of pedal-ground interference occasions that, especially on e-bikes, can come about all too often.

It should be noted that the S size uses 27.5" wheels. In a concerted effort to reach more riders, and not force them to ride something unmanageable, Cannondale chose the smaller wheels for the smallest frame size.








The relatively unknown town of Alpbach, Austria was the destination for the Moterra launch. It’s relatively unknown due to its lack of authorized trails. But the Cannondale team wangled a deal with the various land owners for the launch and opened up some beautifully loamy trails to take the bikes out on. Big sweeping fire road climbs with panoramic vistas, steep, loamy and rooty descents and some equally steep and rooty climbs were laid out to show what is possible with that added motor power.


Photo Ale di Lullo


Climbing

The seated climbing position was comfy, but as mentioned, to make it a little more personalized the seat would be moved forwards a touch. Not once was the shock lockout lever touched, mainly to see how the suspension performs while climbing. But the package of anti-squat and shock tune handled the climbing well. As explained by Arraiz, the motor actually smooths out the power delivery, reducing the normal pulsing effect when pedalling, meaning that they could tune the acceleration response of the bike differently to that of an analogue bike.

Long smooth climbs are eaten up and with the excess of energy you can take loose inside rocky lines on the fire roads to see how long you dare keep your feet on the pedals after you’ve broken traction. There is loads of live information on offer from the Bosch system, such as cadence and power output, which was fun to keep track of and see how different gradients and terrains used a different power and speed. And after not much time at all you’re using these metrics to gauge range and effort to see if you can sneak in another lap before your battery runs out.

Technical climbing is still, personally, the most impressive aspect of eMTBs. Things that at first look nigh on impossible turn out to be achievable and many times deja vu kicks in from riding trials motorbikes as you’re using the same techniques and exaggerated body language to find grip and muscle your way up ridiculous climbs. Alpbach had some violently root infested climbs that really were a challenge, and once completed, a delight to get up. The Moterra balanced out the whole riding experience and brought a lot of fun to getting to the top before the descending started.


Photo Ale di Lullo


Descending

The bike was immediately comfortable and easy to get on with. Setup back at base was quick and easy, and only required 25% sag in the shock and about 10psi more than normal in the Fox 36 to get it feeling balanced. Out on the trails the bike felt dependable, in a way that you’d been riding it for much longer than just a few hours.

When descending it did take more rider input to pilot the bike compared to the analogue bikes I'm used to. Manuals were hilarious affairs and probably where the added heft is felt the most, but the descending capabilities of the Moterra were very good. If Jérôme Clementz, who was our guide for the launch, tells you that there’s a sneaky double coming up, you had no doubts or hesitations in the bikes handling or character to pull when you saw the flying Frenchman pull.

It was a short ride on the bike, and only more time and more diversity of terrain will tell the full story, but after that short ride it was clearly an easy bike to feel at home with, one that was predictable, consistent and entertaining.







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407 Comments

  • + 218
 Worst thing I ever did was ride a E-MTB.

It cost me $6000 and I pick it up tomorrow lol. (Merida E160 900e)

One full day test ride I was hooked. More trails, no reliance on shuttling, see shit and places I’ve never been before and just make the most of the little time I have as a husband and father with a young family.

I’ve kept my traditional trail bike, but there is a place for these ebikes and they are only going to get better.
  • + 26
 Those are all reasons why I want one. I'm a hubby, and a father, and I own a side-business on top of full time work in aerospace. I don't have as much time to put into riding as before, and I'm only getting older. I'd love an ebike so I could shuttle myself on some DH trails when resorts close, and I'd just like to get in longer rides once in a while.
  • + 107
 @Leppah: forgot to mention you graduated from MIT
  • + 4
 @mi-bike: that was funny. Well-played.
  • + 15
 Yes, same exact thing happened to me and in the same life situation. You will love it. I get three times the amount of descending in the same time period and I'm more fit than usual. Technical climbing is also a joy. I can clean things that I was always walking before. Also being able to do recovery rides on trails is another amazing benefit. Dirt jumping ebikes is great too as it just allows continuous loops. I too have my traditionally bike, an SB150 but the Meta Power sees significantly more riding.
  • + 31
 but guys...for $6000 you could buy a dope moto cross bike....


sorry the old man in me couldn't be shut up.
  • + 19
 Half the reason I ride is for fitness and health. So a e-bike would ruin half my reason to go ride. Plus who wants to deal with all the extra maintenance, headaches and expenses of an a e-bike, more fun to just grab your simple pedal bike and go pedal.
  • + 10
 Heck yeah dude! I want one bad too. There are lots of places I ride on my moto that are deeeep in the mountains, and I love riding my mtb on some of those trails, but just getting back there and riding the trail usually takes a drive down a shit forest service road and then 3 hours and 3k of climbing, just for one trail. Some days it would be nice to hit those trails on a bike (instead of a moto) but with the ability to get out and up a little quicker. Sure, I could sack up and do a 6k ride over the course of many hours, but I don't always have time to do that or the desire to spend that much time hiking uphill with a bike. Having options is great, and there are tons of people who live places where a moto might not get used much but they do have some good shit they can access on an ebike. Plus, shuttles are lame - they take too long, you're in the car, and you're burning gas.
  • + 6
 @heatproofgenie: just to clarify for everyone else, there are things that are literally impossible to ride on a pedal bike, no matter who you are (unless you wanna take a trials bike and do it that way), that are possible on an ebike. To me, it helps bridge the gap between whats fun on an mtb and whats fun on a dirt bike.
  • + 2
 @preach: yeah but if you have the means, just get both!
  • + 11
 Ahh the classic "I'm a husband/dad/work and have limited time therefore my fun takes priority over any of the risks that ebikes pose to trail access, user conflict etc".

But it's FUN! Have you even tried one yet?

Also have to throw in the obligatory "What about when suspension forks and disc brakes came out? Were you against them too?" argument.
  • + 11
 @in2falling: You couldn't be more wrong on the fitness and health part bud. Nice try
  • + 6
 Shaft,you just smashed that nail straight on, ebike=more time on the trails/laps=more fun. Im f*cking sick to death of hearing all the bra's spunking on about ebike hate, we all grow up,we all get less time to ride, so just have the most fun you can.
  • - 11
flag secretninjaguy (Jul 23, 2019 at 10:11) (Below Threshold)
 @scoot34: go ride your mopeds somewhere else.
  • + 7
 @in2falling: go test ride an ebike, you'll go further ,faster and still be blowing at the end of your ride.
  • + 20
 @Leppah: that is 80% of the people who ride mtb. Every rider I know is a dad over 45 and none of them ride e-bikes.
  • - 3
 @in2falling: You still get a workout on an ebike. Similar to how riding park for a few hours works you. Pedalling a long jump line is the best HIIT I've ever had.
  • + 2
 Looks super fun to me! Let'er Rip!
  • + 1
 @in2falling: as long as your rides don’t get any shorter time wise then I don’t see why you’d lose fitness. A 2 hour ride is a 2 hour ride whether you go 14 miles or 25. If anything you may get stronger. More descending is like more HIIT.
  • + 4
 @preach: can’t ride a mx on mtb trails
  • - 2
 If you're thinking your regular mountain bike isn't fun enough...save yourself by buying a rigid single speed. You'll start enjoying one or the other soon enough and at a fraction of the cost as well as improve your fitness and riding skill. Plus you'll have an off season, wet weather, mud covered thrasher bike for the winter.
  • + 1
 @in2falling: I'll agree it could be a slight more headache for maintance. However, if you think an Ebike is less for your health and fitness you are very wrong.
  • + 29
 MTB Industry
“E Bikes are dumb, they are cheating”

Logical Person
“3-4 times more descending, have fun climbs and riding places you never thought were possible. I’m sold”
  • - 36
flag BasedGawd (Jul 23, 2019 at 12:07) (Below Threshold)
 @Leppah: If you work full time in aerospace, which no one asked, shut up and buy the newest version of a dentist bikes like all the other lazy f*cks
  • + 9
 @BasedGawd: he makes and sells paper airplanes
  • - 28
flag BasedGawd (Jul 23, 2019 at 12:13) (Below Threshold)
 @scoot34: no. You'll become a lazy incompetent slob who doesn't have the leg power to even descend anymore.
  • + 14
 @gramboh: Someone can't afford one @bitter much?
  • + 2
 @trickland: true, but you also can't hit triple jumps on a MTB without a 100 yard downhill run up ;-)
  • + 0
 @dirtbag-tyrel16: Spot on, more action...
  • - 3
 I can get a nice KX125 for $6K to rip the trails with!
  • - 14
flag gramboh (Jul 23, 2019 at 14:38) (Below Threshold)
 @deadmeat25: great counter argument. I could buy a Turbo Levo on the drive home tonight at Dunbar in cash if I wanted. Could you? What difference to the argument does it make?
  • - 11
flag casman86 (Jul 23, 2019 at 18:03) (Below Threshold)
 @dirtbag-tyrel16: You have those switched around backwards? Nobody asked for off road E-Mopeds. It was completely forced onto people and trails by the Shit MTB Industry.
  • - 2
 yup yup exactly, totally agree
  • + 3
 @in2falling: you still get a work out FYI. It’s just a faster farther one.
  • + 2
 @in2falling: exactly 100% health and fitness go longer more often and you'll get fitter, that's the idea.
  • + 1
 @gapsforlife: Yet! Ha Ha!
  • + 13
 Working 10 hour days 5 days a week definitely strains the having the time get proper rides in. E-bikes do have a place, The most important thing Ive found regardless of the bike you ride is to be a respectful rider.
  • - 9
flag pinnityafairy (Jul 24, 2019 at 5:08) (Below Threshold)
 Electric crackenfail
  • + 9
 @casman86: forced? Did they steal people's credit cards and bank account numbers? Are bike shops now forcing people to buy them at gunpoint?

eMTB's are outselling regular MTB's by a large margin in Europe where they don't have the same puritanical views about riding. That is happening because they are fun and people enjoy them.

People need to get over it. For casual riders it allows them to ride more, see more and get deeper on trails. More people on trails means more advocates for trail access. Once the regular public starts to see how poorly public lands are managed (Observation not Recreation is mandated in many Federal land grants) they will get pissed and start demanding change.
  • + 7
 @dirtbag-tyrel16: If you think about it, you have been cheating for years. 12 gears in the back. 50 tooth cassettes, Front suspensiion, Rear suspension, disc brakes, plus size or 29 inch tires. All designed to make your ride easier and faster with more control. Unless your riding a 26 inch single speed hard tail you have been cheating when you ride. Just saying.
  • - 1
 The "busy dads just wanting to get a ride in and eBike lets me do that" argument is a funny one. I'm a busy dad and when I have a limited amount of time, I'm more interested in getting an uphill workout in. Keeping my fitness up is a lot harder than keeping my descending skills up, and keeping my fitness up benefits me in many ways. Especially given that a 20min climb sprint to keep my fitness up usually only results in a 3-4min downhill. I'd rather do a 30 minute ride on an acoustic bike and get a good workout than a 30min ride on an eBike.
  • + 2
 @gumbytex: Why not have both? You can climb just as hard on an ebike as acoustic, just put it in eco and ride at threshold. Then get two descents and two climbs.

Anyway I think part of it comes down to the trails one has to ride. Here in CO, most everything is steep sustained climbing for 1500-2000' in one go. That kind of trail is hard to ride in limited time.
  • + 1
 @mi-bike: Haha, well played. I didn't mean it to come across that way, hahahaha. I guess I could've just said I'm hella busy.
  • + 6
 @heatproofgenie: Theoretically, yes. In practice, in my area the only guys on ebikes are out of shape or old. I've yet to see one fit guy doing this theoretical "threshold climbing in eco mode" you speak of, in my area at least.
  • + 1
 @gumbytex: Fair enough. I actually haven't seen it in my area either but it is how I use mine. Beastly training tool for enduro racing if used correctly.
  • + 4
 @dirtbag-tyrel16: $6,000 underperforming electric moped laughing my f****** ass off
  • + 4
 @dirtbag-tyrel16: Did you really just say the MTB Industry is against ebikes. They are the ones pushing it. No one knew they needed one until the industry started force feeding them to us.

I get it ... I own a business, have a family, work too much, too out of shape ... I will eventually give in and end up on one of these and I know I'll love it. But right now ... NO NO NO! And it's not ego, it's not about nostalgia or fitness or purity or any of that crap ... I'm far too practical for that, it's about TRAIL ACCESS. I'll ride a road eBike all day long and not feel the least bit guilty about it, but in California trail access is getting harder and harder to keep and every single one of you riding a motorized vehicle and calling it a mountain bike is sinking one more nail into the coffin of trail access for all of us. I don't care if eMTBs exist, I don't care if you ride one, but please, ride where motorbikes are allowed to ride, don't lobby your local MB association or trail stewards to include you in trail access. It is not a MTB anymore. A Tour de France rider rides at about 250 Watts, You're adding 500Watts to your own 150-200 Watts. That's a motor bike and you're gonna get us ALL kicked off the trails. This is all just too short sighted and selfish. Even the industry is shooting itself in the foot. They sell a ton of them now, but what happens when you can't ride bikes on dirt anymore except your own private property and ski resorts.
  • + 7
 @heatproofgenie: I can clean things that I was always walking before.

That's because it's the bike doing the work. You're not cleaning anything.
  • + 1
 @mtbkski: sometimes, when I'm feeling especially masochistic, I ride my 2012 Spec. p.1. It's quite entertaining. But mostly I ride an enduro bike, because it's more fun. And I wish I had an e bike too, because those are a looot of fun.
  • + 1
 @plyawn: where do you draw the line? You should only run trails because the bike will always be doing some work, therefore the bike is clearing it, not you.
  • + 0
 @SDBrian: An average Tour de France rider puts out 1200-1400 watts and it simillar for pro XC and Enduro Rider, Trails adapt and so do the rules.
  • + 0
 @SDBrian: Pathethic mono view from a tiny mind that only sees the small picture....
  • + 2
 @plyawn: It's similar to a trials motorcycle vs dirt bike. The trials bike with the right pilot can clean insane climbs. I guarantee you lots of technique and skill is needed. Some fitness or maybe a lot depends on the climb.
  • + 1
 @dirtbag-tyrel16: That is only in a sprint and only for 10 seconds max. Top sprinters might even do upwards of 2000 watts but that is probably a training number and not at the end of a 150k stage.

Top riders at threshold probably put out 400-500 watts or so at threshold or 5-5.5 w/kg.
  • + 1
 @preach: but you can't ride it on the mtn bike trails, very few places to ride dirt bikes
  • + 2
 @gramboh: don't forget to trash chair lifters and truck droppers ,lazy ass bitches
  • + 2
 @salespunk: the local shop is outselling mtn bikes 3/1 here.their business has exploded selling ebikes.they'd be dead without ebikes.
  • + 2
 @gumbytex: ya and I see all the guys in my area truck dropping with beers and joints, and guts that look like they're in their third trimester
  • + 1
 @pinnityafairy: well you are a fairy, hahahaha
  • + 0
 @SDBrian: its getting harder and harder to walk in California without stepping in human feces.And fear mongering doesn't cut it try again ,next
  • + 1
 @plyawn: you're walking, you aint clean shit either
  • - 2
 who the hell pays 6k for an ebike , I wouldn’t ride an ebike for free, you can get a sick trail bike or a kx250 lmao some people are just dumb
  • + 136
 "We're testing a feature that lets readers exclude certain kinds of stories from their Pinkbike homepage. Going forward we'll post more eMTB news globally. If you aren't interested in it, just turn on the filter and eMTB content will disappear from your Pinkbike homepage."

Well done PB.
  • - 66
flag enduroNZ (Jul 23, 2019 at 0:53) (Below Threshold)
 @dark-o: is it possible to switch you off too?
  • - 69
flag nojzilla (Jul 23, 2019 at 2:16) (Below Threshold)
 But, If I filter out mobilitEbike news does that include articles on how shit SpackEbikes are how f*cking Lame able bodied riders on mobilitEbikes are.................?
genuinely interested
  • + 58
 eMTB filter - hilarious!

Way to walk the tightrope Pinkbike...or are you just fence-sitters?

Personally, I find the whole eMTB "controversy" a giant waste of oxygen. Shut up and ride!
  • + 2
 Speciadale Molevo
  • + 15
 @mnorris122: cause that would just make one look like a homophobic prick... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • + 19
 @gravity354: for real. Is everyone a purist who hates all assisted forms of travel? I don't get it - I sure hope none of the eMTB haters use their vehicles to shuttle! If it bothers you for whatever reason, ignore it.

Who cares, really? I've been riding my moto more than my mtb this summer. Been riding my BMX a bunch too. It's all fun and awesome stuff, whether I have no suspension, no brakes and one gear, or tons of suspension, a gas motor and huge brakes and a clutch, or anything in between.

@nojzilla have you ridden an e mtb? How about a dirt bike? "Able bodied riders" can take any bike, motorized, sorta motorized, suspended, rigid, whatever, and shred. If I had more cash and more space, I'd have a couple eMTBs to fill the gap in between my motorized toys and non-motorized toys. Your logic is terrible, my dude. By that line of thinking, MTBs are lame because "able bodied" athletes could just run! And shoes are lame because we could all run barefoot! lol
  • - 1
 No. Filtering sucks. I like pinkbike because of what it stands for, and their point of view. Not because they filter content so they can make users and ads/manufacturers happy.

And i don’t want ebikes with dual-crown forks and fat riders clogging my trails.
  • + 4
 @trialsracer: You didn’t moto on the mtb trail. Stop comparing it to that.

Have you ever almost crashed into an eMtb rider who was going UP a DH trail because they didn’t know/care?? I have. Its infuriating.

I’ve yet to see intelligent, trail-concious humans on eMtb (at least in america).
  • + 0
 @gravity354: ebikes are going to ruin trail access. Simple as that.
  • + 14
 @sevensixtwo: Plenty of our trails in and around Hood River, Oregon are dual use and shared with moto riders. I ride moto, e-bike, mtn bike—all for different reasons—all on the same trails. All are super fun and I'm always stoked to discuss the differences with whomever I encounter on the trail.
  • + 4
 Thanks PB! Have an ebike and need a place to learn and share. Been feeling like an outsider lately on PBFrown
  • + 9
 @sevensixtwo: Same in the UK. Dudes are forgetting/ignoring trail manners. Barging past us analogue guys on the single track climbs with no warning cause they are getting “uphill flow”. I’m into ebikes but not at the expense of others enjoyment of the hills.
  • + 1
 @sevensixtwo: @sevensixtwo: Well hey now then! I'm your man! Don't own one, but demo'd a Kenevo in SoCal for a week last year. Rode with an ex motocross pro who's a bit broken these days but loves his Levo, aint fat, and would most likely spank you (and me) on any fitness test. Thing was super fun, and when they can bring them down below 40, for real, I'll have one in my quiver. I actually sessioned Skypark bike park as they do not have a lift, and that was literally the future. Bike parks without the need for a capital intensive lift. And for XC, I did a 30 mile figure 8 in Santa Monica that most people only do one half or the other. Same energy spent as if I had done half on my normal rig, but I got in twice the distance in a place I only get to visit rarely. And while you may have had an encounter like you claim, that would most certainly be a rare edge case. I'd say the standard complaint against all of us still stands: we can do 40+ on downs without much effort these days, and most trails are multi-use. Way more accidents and near misses due to that. There really is no need for tribalism on this subject.
  • + 4
 @secretninjaguy: Life is almost never simple, and while there will be fits and stalls, the same thing that happened with snowboarding will happen here: all good, allowed everywhere, nobody admits to having been a staller back in the day.
  • + 6
 @Brewdoo: somehow I have the feeling it is way more rare than you imply. Just a gut feeling is all.
  • + 7
 @sevensixtwo: uh yeah I did. I rode moto on the multi use trails where I ride my mtb and my friends ride their ebikes too. On non-motorized trails, we only ride mtb (and people hike and ride horses.) 50% of the best trails around me I ride on both a moto and an mtb. This season, I have actually only ridden three trails that are non-motorized on my mtb. The rest of them I share with motorized and other non-motorized travel. In fact, thanks to the dirt bikers, we have some SICK descents for mtbs that are definitely not "IMBA approved" haha.

If you are saying you have ebikers on your non-motorized use trails, the problem sounds like it's with your local ranger's office or trail association not properly designating trail use, or perhaps you have a crowded trail system that would benefit from an up-route only and some dh only routes. Whatever the solution, it doesn't sound like the ebike itself is the problem.

Also, ebikes don't climb THAT fast. Even in turbo mode. Some people feel the same way about riders going "too fast" on the way down. I've run into motos and ebikes while riding my mtb, and I've run into ebikes and mtbs while riding my moto. And hikers and horses. All situations present a challenge, but I think that's part of multi use trails.
  • + 2
 @Captain-Spaulding: exactly. you get it. Same here in Idaho and Wyoming.
  • + 3
 @Chuckolicious:https://youtu.be/XPZDEWBzneY
  • + 1
 @Captain-Spaulding: not around here, the rednecks on dirt bikes and quads have a problem with anyone not using a motor.
  • - 5
flag secretninjaguy (Jul 23, 2019 at 17:57) (Below Threshold)
 @Chuckolicious: I quit snowboarding and sold my shop because of the snowboard industry back in the late 90s. Throw the people who actually built up the industry under the bus in order to pander to a bunch of posers. Just like mountain biking right now.
  • + 1
 @sevensixtwo: I ride a rail trail on my road bike.. often towing a burley and i hear an EfatBike buzz up past me with zero regard that it isn't a road. I get it.

that being said, I would love to be able to descent more without needing lift access.
  • + 2
 @won-sean-animal-chin: flipp’n skiboarders! Like missiles I tellz ya! ????????????
  • + 1
 @secretninjaguy: huh? Like who? I started in ‘87 and know a player or two.
  • + 1
 @Chuckolicious: ftr im a skier but i ride with lots o knuckle draggers. We're all just playin on teh mountang. Cant wait for teh E ski
  • + 1
 @Chuckolicious: it should be pointed out that Skypark has to have staff on the upline sit there to tell eMTBs to slow down as there have been incidents of them crashing into analog bikers on the way up.
  • + 1
 @Rubberelli: Huh, wasn't the case last year. But as with all new things, there will be dummies who do dumb things. I bet something that comes along for a park like this is Ebike/fast lane, and slow lane. I saw instances where a family pod was spread out on the climb and created a log jam for everyone.
  • - 1
 @secretninjaguy: THIS! If you live in an area where trail access is an issue you know- it's a bicycle with a motor, aka a motorcycle (tell me its not- just because you have to pedal? Splitting hairs doesn't count). As the technology improves and miniaturizes it will be harder and harder to distinguish between ebike and human powered. The anti-access people will seize that on the motorcycle argument and move to ban all bikes, human powered or not. There is no MTB without MTB trails! But its fun!
  • + 1
 @Chuckolicious: Skypark is much more busy this year than last, for sure, and there are quite a few more ebikers there every weekend.
  • + 3
 @Chuckolicious: Yes yes yes!
I think like snowboarding rejuvenated skiing and now skiing is great again, Ebikes will do the same for the cycling industry and in a few years regular bikes will back in style and support and participation will be stronger than before.

same thing with windsurfing vs kitesurfing, first comes the backlash as people are frightened of something new invading their space, then acceptance and full integration comes about 10 years later.
  • + 0
 @DDoc: Don't bet on it....
  • + 70
 I'll never understand why people feel the need to post snarky comments about ebikes. As long as people are having fun and getting to enjoy the outdoors then just leave them alone. if you shit all over another persons hobbies or interests then you're a pretty sad individual.
  • + 45
 I've nothing against e-bikes and will probably have one at some point (when I retire or when the knees go- whichever comes first).
However, I think a lot of the hate comes from the possible increased risk of injury to other trail users due to the extra power and weight of e-bikes in overcrowded areas where trail access has been difficult to obtain (a lot of places in the US for example). They see e-bikes as a potential threat to trail access for all types of bike, which is understandable.
  • - 38
flag nojzilla (Jul 23, 2019 at 2:17) (Below Threshold)
 If your'e able bodied on an mobilityEbike your'e even sadder
  • + 3
 @tremeer023: Fair point well made.
  • + 0
 Overton window is moving
  • + 8
 The problem are the people who buy them: More and more people who dont belong in the woods because of disrespect in ignorance get e bikes.

Hikers Here in Germany and Austria hate Ebikers as they are way faster on fireroads and have no manners...its bad for us normal bikers.
They even check if you have an engine at your BB or not
  • + 1
 @rotos: I'm noticing this as well.
  • + 5
 @tremeer023: losing trail access because of e-bikes is a slippery slope fallacy. Anecdotal evidence in my area (Virginia) shows that building and riding pirate trails leads them to being legal. I realize the e-bike issue is different, but there are real parallels to pirate trail building and pirate trail riding.
  • + 5
 @cole-inman: I'm down with anything involving pirates.
  • + 1
 @rotos: Ha, just saw this. Kinda sad that nobody has picked up on it. You're spot on.
  • + 2
 @NotNamed: This is the exact same thing people said about skaters, snowboards, pretty much any new modification to a sport. They are all hooligans!
  • + 0
 @tremeer023: Not understandable, that's ridiculously narrow minded at best...
  • + 1
 perception of risk and real risk are two different things,
how many people are scared to go swimming because of sharks?
unfounded fears cloud many minds.
  • + 1
 @cole-inman: Yes,
If you wait for the "Fiends of Whatever Park" to build a decent trail, you will still be waiting.
  • + 0
 @deadmeat25: within the last year or so I have noticed a couple of what appear to be regular mtb's (older ones) on the road outside my office which magically move by themselves at up to 30mph +. They are clearly retrofitted and modified e-bikes (basically a shed built e-moped with thumb throttle) but at a glance you would not know. A great way of avoiding road tax, MOT, insurance and fine on the road. However, off-road on allocated and often shared singletrack I can totally see potential problems. If the authorities and regulators (health and safety police etc) are unable to spot the difference then all mtb's could be tarred with the same brush.
Advancement in e-bike tech combined with garden shed tinkerers could create some seriously fast e-mopeds perfectly disguised as regular mtb's.
  • + 49
 Loving the fact that ebikes are evolving nicely to look more and more like a normal mountain bike. An ebike will defintely be my next mountain bike purchase.
  • - 115
flag scottzg (Jul 23, 2019 at 0:11) (Below Threshold)
 If you want a motorbike, go get a motorbike. The fact that it looks like a bicycle is so much bullshit.
  • + 20
 Totally. The new drivetrain that Specialized is doing on the road bikes is where I think the industry should go. Smaller motor and batteries to take the sting out of bigger days while getting some of the agility back. I think once you see some stuff get into the under 40 lbs range you might get the best of both.
  • + 16
 My riding buddy just pulled the trigger and bought a spesh turbo levo, I told him he's 2 years too early, these bikes are developing at an alarming rate, so far I think yt will get my money (the decoy is the sex). But look, a new lighter motor packaged in a sleek frame and developed for the most important thing in biking, fun.
  • + 7
 @the-barn: I have two friends with levos and they both agree that 250W engine is too much because they pretty much never feel the need for full power, so in this regard engine and battery would have to be reduced by half in size and those bikes would be so much more appealing. And I agree with them even if I don't really see myself riding an ebike anytime soon!
  • + 7
 @winko: I thought the Levo was too heavy and too powerful. Longer range, less power, less weight would be the way forward. That Lapierre ezesty with the removable battery, that's what I would get if I bought one today
  • + 0
 @scottzg: You have clearly never ridden one. They are amazing fun. Makes the climbs actually enjoyable
  • + 8
 @jaame: I have one rule that applies to buying cars and bikes. Do not buy french
  • + 5
 @the-barn: I had a Clio years ago and it was reliable AF!
  • + 3
 I don't know about that, I'm more of the opinion that making your huge chonk of a downtube 'appear' smaller by making half of it matte black has the opposite effect - it just labels it and does the ugly proportions no favours. I'm looking at you, Orange. Give it five years and I bet everyone will be speccing oversized downtubes on normal bikes just to capture the new trend, but personally I think it looks foul. Form should follow function, but where the function is 'where do I put my 5kg of battery'... I hope this look stays with the eMTBs.
  • + 0
 @the-barn: Well let me tell you that it makes me chuckle when i see or hear people make comments like that about french cars. I have worked for Renault for over 20 years and they are certainly no worse than any other manufacturer. In fact they are better than a lot you would expect them to be!
  • - 1
 @the-barn: no too late, the 2018 its perfect imo. I hear the 2019 are noisy more expensive and you can't override the speed limiter for doing DH runs at the park. pick up a 2018 for 4k in the states. I thought I might upgrade as the years go on but my Turbo levo is still running great and I don't use it that much so I hope it will last a long time.
  • + 2
 @winko: I see options developing for different uses, much like motorcycles. Where I live, a lot of my buddies feel the batteries aren't big enough/don't last long enough, and they are using "turbo" mode to try to get up some of the moto hill climbs and such. That being said, I think there could also be a huge market for what you describe as well. Guys who just want something to take the sting out of the access road on the way back to the top for another lap.
  • + 2
 @gkeele: your sister has ugly proportions, but she still gets ridden.
  • - 1
 Last summer I was DH riding my turbo levo at Killington Vermont and the operator was looking at it weird every lap, at the end of the day I said "do you know its an ebike?" We were both surprised he didn't know.

did 3 days DH and still had 1/2 battery. my buddies got a new appreciation for ebikes as they couldn't keep up, the big ass tires and extra weight and power to move on the flats gives unbeatable traction, control and speed. So fun.

Isn't this the holy grail, too be able to ride your DH bike everywhere?
  • + 39
 I've been riding for 20+ years, I love our sport, I love the outdoors. But I'm a busy dad and husband and I work long hours with little 'me time'. I now only get out riding once or twice a month if I'm lucky, which is really crap. When I do get out, my fitness has gone to hell and it ruins my ride. I would absolutely love an ebike for this reason. Not because I'm lazy or disabled, but because I'm a 35 year old desk jockey that wants to make the most of the precious time I do get on a bike. We don't all have the luxury of time to be able to keep at peak fitness. My next bike will definitely be an ebike.
  • + 7
 Good on you. I've friends in exactly the same situation and adore the amount of fun they can cram into such a small space of time aboard an ebike.
  • + 1
 Yep I still have my 3rd mountain bike in the shed (1994 Diamondback Axis TR that I love) but with a bit more than ten years on you two kids and a pretty full on job my once a week rides keep me sane but not fit! My Norco VLT has given me the chance to ride more trails, haven't had it long but some days if I feel good turn the assistance down and pedal hard, if I feel rubbish push it up and at least I get to enjoy the downs, which is why I ride, always has been! For me definitely worth the investment, needed to be fun enough on the downhill and the Norco is that for me.
  • - 21
flag StFred (Jul 23, 2019 at 4:44) (Below Threshold)
 Why don't you buy a MX Bike? Less expensive, less effort, no need to pedal... Best of both worlds
  • + 15
 I’m in the same situation, but I bought a smart trainer and a TrainerRoad subscription. The workouts are hard (but short, so I can do them before everyone else wakes up) but I’m just as fit now as I was at 19. And it’s way cheaper than an ebike.
  • + 3
 I was looking at getting one last year for this reason. Me and a mate rented turbo levos at Grizedale forest and ride them for about six hours/40 miles.
The weight of it totally put me off. It was about 7-8kg heavier than the Nomad I had at the time. You needed the motor because it was so heavy. Then after 5 hours when the battery ran out it was a pig. In my opinion, it was 6kg too heavy to give a lively ride. It was easier on the ups, and I was consistently one heart rate zone lower than when on my normal bike. On the downs and flats it was not as much fun. The turbo mode (highest of the three power settings) was a hoot, but not really necessary. Also not like a motorcycle at all.
We surmised that perhaps ebikes are still a few years away for mid 30s semi fit guys. I would definitely not want a Levo. I would like to try the Lapierre that’s 18kg and has a removable battery though.
I think for me, an ebike will come when I’m closer to 50 than 40.
  • + 4
 @StFred: more expensive to maintain and operate... And even less places to ride...
  • + 15
 Who thinks all of these testimonials are fake news generated by the ebike lobby? Im too lazy to snoop the profiles but it really seems like bs. There can't possibly be this many pudgy dads who just CANT seem to find the time to ride, but now ebikes 9 hours a day.
  • + 4
 @skerby: I think you'd be surprised, but if you do see people astroturfing please let us know.
  • + 12
 @skerby: It is a hilariously lame argument. I like to poke holes in it because I am a 38 year old desk jockey dad who gets 3 maybe 4 rides a month. Their argument comes down to "my fun is more important than any of the risks ebikes post to trail access, user conflict etc".
  • + 2
 @SangamonTaylor: That's exactly what I did and still do. Got up early, rode the trainer, stayed in shape. Now all ya gotta do is press "turbo".
  • + 6
 @skerby: rampant astroturfing.
  • + 5
 @gramboh: Precisely. Self centered thinking encouraged by consumerism.
  • + 2
 @SangamonTaylor: I'm a big Zwift geek myself. Spent the whole winter actually riding, never been able to hack it before. 51 and this season getting PRs on climbs I've been doing for many years!
  • + 6
 @highfivenwhiteguy: People whining about being 35 and out of shape cracks me up. What are they going to do in another 10 years.. I'm 50 and struggle with endurance but I have too much self respect to buy an ebike.
  • - 3
 @skerby: ebikes are sick. I'm not pudgy and I'm not a dad, and I love them. If you're ever in the northern rockies, I'll introduce you to a handful of dads (and not dads) who love their ebikes and will probably shred your doors off, motor or not.
  • + 5
 @gramboh: "my neighbor shouldn't own that car/that gun/ that dog because I can foresee a scenario where it could negatively impact my life."
  • + 1
 @fazza24: or you can do all that and actually have a ton of fun when you press turbo, because your powering up shit that used to be reserved for motos? I'll tell ya what, rent an ebike and go ride the moto trails in Crested Butte or Moab area, and tell me all you had to do was "press turbo".
  • + 0
 @trialsracer: because there aren’t enough mtb trails in *moab* or *crested butte*, two of the top MTB destinations in the US?
  • + 3
 @skerby: Suddenly 100s of ebikers on pb, just lying in wait to extoll the virtues of motorized bikes on what feels like the first full-feature advertorial outside pb's core market.

Yes, where did these affluent pudgy dudes all come from?
  • + 2
 @PinkyScar: I love how riled up everyone gets on PB, and that when I mention not being at peak fitness everyone assumes that I'm "pudgy"! haha. I'm just popping out to cash this cheque from the Ebike overlord...
  • + 2
 @skerby: No doubt. Where’d these people come from?
  • + 2
 Doesn't take much to get up an hour earlier and go for a run everyday to stay fit... Excuses are like assholes, everyone's got one. People are such pussies nowadays... I guess you'll have to wait until they come out with e-runners, what was I thinking.
  • + 4
 @VPS13: Ew. Running sucks. I sure as hell ain't getting up at 4am to go running.
  • + 0
 @skerby: Really? So this is a concerted bot/troll campaign to promote Ebikes? Sheesh, I guess I've spent too much time focusing on the fact that we didn't land on the moon and didn't pay enough attention. Infowars needs to be alerted!
  • + 1
 @PinkyScar: Well, seems like well under 100, let alone "100's". And maybe, just maybe, there's been more adoption and acceptance that you thought. As for your fat shaming, the people I know who have them would more than likely spank you (and me) on any empirical fitness test, or were just way old and still out there having fun. I'd say Occam's Razor is the safest bet here, and a concerted bot/troll campaign to promote Ebikes is far from simple.
  • + 0
 @VPS13: MTB from 87-2004, got bored, picked up running on the same trails I used to ride. Got the point I was running off road ultras, urban night runs in NYC, and everything in between. Was way fun, until my lower back informed me of the compression damage I had done. IT Band too. Got back on the bike in '15 and haven't looked back. Running f#cks up way more people than the industry wants to admit, but a few minutes looking at the physics and it's pretty clear why. However, I did take up hanging with the wives on the stair master, and found that thing is the workout of workouts. Even ran the Empire State Building run-up in 2013 and crushed it. My a$$ never looked so tight and fit. And basically no impact. So I'd modify your statement to "take 20 minutes every other day on the Stairmaster and do 100 floors".
  • - 1
 @VPS13: I run all the time, usually do 1 to 2 half marathons a year. I bike all the time, hike, and work out. I am not fat or pudgy and I ride an ebike. I track my heart rate with all the fitness I do and my heart rate is the highest with mountain biking, whether it is on my regular bike or my ebike. Heart rates about the same for both. The thing is if you go hard on a mountain bike, you will do the same on an ebike. If you don't push yourself on an ebike, you wont on a regular bike either. So if your chubby on an ebike, you will be chubby on a regular bike. It isn't about the equipment, its about how hard you push yourself.

My body just doesn't like running more than 16 miles. Too many things start to hurt. Maybe this e-runner thing is the ticket...
  • + 1
 @trialsracer: Trails are a shared public resource (unless on private land). You can do whatever you want on private land within the law. Your argument makes no sense.
  • + 1
 @trialsracer: Rode a Levo in Steamboat. I was blown away by how powerful the thing was. Blasted up the mountain like it was nothing. We agree on something. I have no problem with ebikes on moto trails. For the most part, I think that's where they belong.
  • + 1
 @VPS13: spoken like a true elitist
  • - 1
 @BeerGuzlinFool: they want to have their cake and eat it too. Being out of shape sucks. Everyone knows that. Solution: don’t fall out of shape. Or live with it. Ebikes are for paved bike paths and commuting.
  • + 0
 So much judgment in this thread. Live and let live!
  • + 29
 Worst decision i ever made, buying an eMtb.. I contracted scurvy, my wife was eaten by wolves and the doctors found that my rib cage was on backwards
  • + 20
 ‘Going forward we'll post more eMTB news globally. If you aren't interested in it, just turn on the filter and eMTB content will disappear from your Pinkbike homepage.’

Now hopefully there won’t be any comments from the ebike haters, and if there are we will definitely know they’re just trolls
  • + 2
 They'll keep the filter off so they can hate them anyways! Haha, if not they'll probably go back to hating 29ers, or something else that turned out to be great
  • + 22
 Keep it up! Now that it is possible to hide the emtb content there should be no more problems (i hope...Smile
  • + 20
 those who have a "problem" with e-bikes will surely find other things that will offend them
  • - 8
flag hubsession (Jul 23, 2019 at 3:44) (Below Threshold)
 Now all they need is a way to block @scottsecco virtue signaling comments and I’ll be set!
  • + 8
 @FindDigRideRepeat: sure glad I got a notification for this.
  • + 18
 I have never seen an E bike on the trail until yesterday. I was visiting my hometown and rode to a nearby trail head above Fort Collins I wrapped up a short ride on single track. Just as I was leaving, I met a rider at the trail head preparing his E bike for a ride It was an amazing coincidence. The rider is a longtime friend of mine. When he was my age now, I was a teenager. He taught me how to ski and how to mountain bike. He is an incredible mentor. I owe much of my life experience to the lessons he taught me. The last time that we rode together was 21 years ago. I was out of water and low on fuel but of course I had to ride with him. We enjoyed 14 miles together at an even clip. My heart burned while I followed him up a few steep sections. One of his ankles and knee were fully braced to support old injuries . He has endured multiple surgeries to deal with a nervous system illness. I was inspired by his continued pursuit of the sport that he shared with me so long ago. When I see a rider on the trail, I will try to make a point not to look at their bottom bracket. A friendly greeting will suffice.
  • + 17
 The filter is such a great idea. Peace in the internet! Thank you pinkbike! Now i‘d love to see, how many people really filter out the news. It woul be an interesting social bubble ignoring wht rules the bile world as long as possible. Like in the dark middle ages: progress is devils work. Burn it!
  • + 5
 Never ignore. Always know what the enemy is planning! Big Grin
  • + 14
 And here we go…

It took all "purists" exactly 1 year to finally realize how FUN e-bikes are. Almost the exact same time the same people bitched about, and then embraced, things like full suspension and disc brakes.

Can't we just ride and stop all the whining about stuff that is built to have FUN!?!??!?
  • + 5
 I remember when people had so much hate for 29ers. "They're for people that can't ride. They make things easier so out-of-shape riders can have easier climbs and less skill downhill!" Now most of those haters are riding them.
  • + 18
 Double Crown ftw!
  • + 5
 Hopefully the head angle is decreasing, too...
  • + 4
 @yoobee: yeah that HA is stééép
  • + 13
 Very Nice PB, just do us all a favor and don't call regular bikes Analog. It sounds tech but makes no sense, regular bikes are not like 8-track tapes either. come up with a new term to differentiate the two.
  • + 4
 I think the new term is "acoustic"
  • + 2
 No, "analogue" bikes, i.e. analogous to e-bikes...which makes even less sense.
  • + 1
 Synthetically Inertiatised (SI) and Direct Inertia (DI) driven vessels
  • + 1
 Came down here to make the same comment. Please stop trying to be cute. "Analog" (or analogue - they couldn't even be consistent within this article) is a ridiculous way to describe conventional mountain bikes. I think they're implying that eBikes are "digital", but that isn't even correct - eBike electronics are a mixture of digital control and analog power section. And even if eBikes were fully digital, the um, analogy in no way extends to conventional mountain bikes.
  • + 11
 The Boxxer build actually makes sense as an E-Bike. There are many DH parks or local DH lines where shuttles or lifts aren't available. Coler in Bentonville for one. And the Kitsuma Loop in NC. I could go on and on listening to people talk about the merits of 'earning' your downhill, but no one really likes climbing. Sometimes, you just wanna shred downhill without expending half your energy on climbs. And maybe you wanna do that multiple times a day. Nothing better to do that with than a dual crown fork E-Bike. It's like self shuttling! But STRAVA! Well, there's an E-Bike selection now. And the electric motor becomes a lot less useful in gravity runs. E-Bikes don't let people go faster downhill.
  • + 3
 This!
  • + 13
 E-Bikes always struck me as insanely expensive, but it makes you wonder why Yetis and shit cost the same money as this thing without having to worry about the motor
  • + 1
 or the cost of the battery. Normal mtb technology has come to a pinacle and I can only see incremental advancement over the next few years. The demand for expensive second hand mtbs will dry up a lot I reckon causing slower sales.
  • + 1
 There are bargains to be had.

I picked up a Merida E160 900e for $6kAUD. Fox Factory 36 with grip2, fox x2 rear shock, Saint brakes, di2 etc.

Only con is it’s a Merida, doesn’t carry the bro points at the trailhead like a yeti. Plus the fact it’s an ebike lol
  • + 0
 @Brasher: who needs bro points? Smoke them all on your merida and forget about such things. You get bro points for just being out there! Smile
  • + 1
 Ducati & Husqvarna, have both released new E bikes recently. They must have found out how cash heavy cyclists are. Im looking forward to all the big motorcycle companies joing in.
  • + 9
 PB,

You have figured out how filter eMTB Content. Can you apply this same thing to my computer to filter out the Kardashians, politics, reality super star (whatever the hell that means), any new bike that looks like a Trek Session (Now 80% of the bikes out there) and by far the worse...triathlon bikes? Thanks
  • + 10
 In my opininon the abilities of eBikes to climb the technical stuff is exactly the biggest issue with them. It encurages people to climb on downhill tracks which is just freaking dangerous!
  • + 10
 is that an actually occurring issue?
  • + 11
 @colincolin: Around here, yes. Ebikers have started doing laps up and down the same blue or black diamond trails instead of looping back up the fireroads like the rest of us. It started causing issues a year and a half ago, and it's only gotten worse.

Probably depends on the riding scene where you are, here the ebike riders are 99% middle aged guys in decent shape who used to ride a bit 10-15 years ago, and are now getting back into it because ebikes made it easy. They all ride with the assist in the maximum setting and rarely ride further than 10-15 miles in a day.
  • + 7
 I won't buy one, but not necessarily because I disagree with the "make climbing easier" but more because I couldn't stop myself from modding it. I didn't study electronics engineering and computer science to NOT mess with an e-bike hahaha
  • + 4
 Seems like the new Bosch system is much more sensitive to detecting modifications. There's a three strikes and you're out protocol that renderes the whole system useless after the third attempt. But maybe you have the knowhow to get in there undetected?!
  • + 1
 @dan-roberts: I like a challenge
  • + 4
 @dan-roberts: I've heard that about the new motor.. I saw a lot comments from people pissed that they couldn't modify it... Great for general riding... I don't have an issue with a 20 mph pedal assist bike... But, these bikes that are going 60 plus are skating around government regulations by sticking pedals on them..
  • + 1
 @dan-roberts: something tells me a man with those skills could get around it haha
  • + 7
 e-bike haters: "You can go to heLL with your electronic bike..." --- as they scroll their social media... --- "I'll never submit to you evil bastards..." --- checks his altitude on his smart watch --- "I'll stick with a chain driven bike my entire life..." --- jumps in his prius, gives me the bird...
  • + 10
 6000 Euros for NX components, damn....
  • + 4
 Try buying a road going e-bike.. 3000 for acera.
  • + 3
 At least people don't get to spaz about the lack of a motor on such an expensive cycle
  • + 5
 Ebikes are great and all for certain people, areas, etc. buuuuuuut my concern lays in the batteries. we've all seen the "hoverboards" spontaneously combust or if you break a lithium battery it combusts and starts a chain reaction generally. I dont care so much about the rider being burned i care more about where the rider is at the time of possible fire and if that leads to a wildfire which is a big problem in it self especially in the Western US.
  • + 6
 Your phone could start a fire..
  • + 0
 @reverend27: Not the same size fire your bike will make though...
  • + 1
 @grottsylocks: Actually (yea I just said that), the intensity of a fire in a standard cell phone is such that it will likely ignite most everything around it, kind of like one of those magnesium fire starter blocks. And while your bike is likely in the garage, your phone is on your bed stand or in your jacket pocket.
  • + 1
 Not a wildfire, but there was a house fire caused by an eBike in Sydney earlier this year:

www.smh.com.au/business/consumer-affairs/an-orange-flash-then-melanie-s-house-burnt-down-20190426-p51hj2.html
  • + 7
 love how "to save weight" is mentioned 17 times in the article but TOTAL WEIGHT is curiously missing from this press release. hot takes from pinkbike, people.
  • + 4
 Ebikes won. Mountain bikes lost.

In three years people who pedal will be equivalent of a grizzled old dude riding rigid single speed 26.

If PB wants to stay in business they need to embrace them. If shops want to stay in business, they need to embrace them.

The annoying people blathering on about being so busy and having no time and how much fun ebikes are mountain biking.

You, the person complaining in the comments are not mountain biking. You are a fossil, a relic. Obsolete. The industry doesn’t care and PB doesn’t care. Pedal your way to a cliff and jump off because the sport you love doesn’t exist anymore.
  • + 2
 Hate to admit it, but I think wibblywobbly is right. Inarticulate, but right. From an industry perspective, it makes total sense to embrace ebikes. Bike companies are just drooling at the prospect of older, less fit riders spending big bucks on these mopeds. The folks I know in the industry all say this--and they have their talking points down, too. So much so that if you object to access for ebikes, you're an no-fun elitist who hates old people and the disabled. I think in five years, ebikes will be the norm on the trails. Personally, I liked mountain biking because it was hard. You needed fitness, skills, and mechanical acumen to venture into far places on a bike. Not any more. Any chucklehead can do that now on an ebike. And yes I've been on one. And no, I wasn't "grinning from ear to ear" at the end of the ride. All I could think of was how much these things would transform the sport. And they have. Change happens. In situations like this, you either adapt or move on.
  • + 1
 I would need to see the data showing Levos and Kenevos outselling Stumpies and Enduros before I agreed with your point. At my local bike shops, the eMTB no longer get prominent placement like they did when the Levo first came out. I saw big sales on them last year, so maybe they are not selling in the USA like you think? I honestly don't know.
  • + 1
 @Rubberelli: Hope you're right and I'm wrong. I tend to be a worst-case scenario type. Must be the Irish-Catholic upbringing! Smile
  • + 1
 @Rubberelli: I think the Kenevo is outselling the Enduro but I think that has more to do with the Enduro. Specialized has pretty much given up on developing it and is putting all the money in to ebikes.
  • + 1
 @wibblywobbly: i would say the Enduro is probably the most common long travel trail bike on my local SoCal trails (and most bikes are long travel trail bikes) so that would surprise me. I think I've seen 2 Kenevos in the wild. Perhaps 100 Levos.
  • + 4
 Not a fan of Cannondale, but I have to admit that this commercial video is really original and super well made. Good job!!!

PS: even if I don`t own a nuclear bike yet, to all those eMTB haters, ignorants, narrow-minded, short-thinking suckers: looking forwards to your impressions in several years or decades depending of everyone`s age. I don`t think you`ll have the humility to say that you were wrong about eMTB. Ah ah!! just wait and see... Smile
  • + 4
 Where i agree they are amazing helping people who struggle to ride due to fitness or health problems, I cannot stand looking at those MASSIVE frames haha! most trails i ride 70% of the riders there are on e bikes, but i'm just jealous because i can't keep up!
  • + 4
 Its funny how people have to need to justify their e bikes. Just ride ride your bike man! Also the 'we all have less time so now we can ride more'. I tell you: having more and more less time to spend on your bike has nothing to do with ebike or not. It is our society today. More and more disstratcion and things that are not important. My parents have ridden bikes like crazy and even raced them. They did 4 - 5 rides every week. They had two young kids at home. Did they habe ebikes? No! They just managed to spent their time on stuff that was important to them. Nothing more. The reason you think you need an ebike for time reason is bs. Because now you do one more thing which you have not enaugth time for again! Sorry for my english. Cheers
  • + 4
 @dan-roberts

There is a typo in this bit..... " It's actually shrunk to half the size it was and ditched 3kg in the process." . Reality is old Performance CX model was 4 kg, new Gen 4 as on the Cannondale is 2.9 kg.

When you look at the Bosch system weight including larger in tube battery it is only really 400 grams lighter than the old one.

If you want to check that for yourself you will find the details on the Bosch tech pages.
  • + 2
 There's an upcoming article focussing on the new Bosch system where we'll be getting all the information straight from the horses mouth. Apologies if there was a wrong number in there.
  • + 3
 So this e-bike hate is reminiscent of paddle boards about 10 years ago. Us “surfers” hated them, they were wave hogs cause they could paddle into waves 100’ feet out further than short boards. Now you see them everywhere, they aren’t the best for shredding beach breaks but I bought one and can now get board time on lakes and in rivers not just the beach on a perfect day..... = real possibilities. Paddle boarding a little whitewater can be as fun barreling a wave and way more accessible. Hmmmm May be time for me to rent an bike and see where it can get me.
  • + 5
 Want the look of riding an ugly heavy MTB without any of the sense of accomplishment of doing something under your own power? Emoped is for you.
  • + 3
 Well that was fun. Time to get my day 23 badge, win a new pedal bike and turn on the emtb filter so as to never bother you folks again. Honestly I only passed 2 ebikes ever ( a kid and a super huge guy ) and will let the state filter them off the trail if they want. The I’m old, dad, work a lot so I can’t pedal excuse is lame though. I’m super old, dad and work a lot but pedal every day. To each his own, cheers.
  • + 7
 i like turtles
  • + 2
 After riding a couple of ebikes I really like the added fun of tricking the motor to boost you off features. One of my local trails has a bunch of bermed turns and one is after a slight uphill and I have never liked it on a regular bike, on an ebike I give a pedal kick at entrance the motor kicks in and I rail out of the thing like a rocket. I also learned to pedal on the face of a roller and let the motor push you down the back side it is amazingly fast. I am not getting one any time soon, but there is definitely fun to be had on these things.
  • + 2
 I am spoiled, old, an not a dentist. I have a 26" Ti hard tail with a rigid fork, a 150mm full suspension bike, a YT decoy E bike, a Husky FE501, and a KTM 1190 Adventure R. All pretty radically different from each other. In no way does the Decoy do what the Husky can do. I love riding all of them and all have their purposes I see the Decoy as more of an adventure bike that gets me away to explore. Pinkbike is WAYYYY ahead of most of the commenters as the e bike thing is coming. Calm down, try one, and open your minds before you shoot your mouth off.
  • - 4
flag fazza24 (Jul 23, 2019 at 14:26) (Below Threshold)
 Swingset, I have tried one. Specialized Levo. It's really flippin' fast, especially in "turbo" mode. Had one blow by me on a steep climb last week. Knocked me right off my line. Older guy, with a big gut. Almost a caricature of the the classic ebiker. It's a different sport, really, and should be treated as such. I would love to have one to blast up fire roads to get to fishing spots, though. That I could get behind.
  • + 5
 not gonna mention the weight? standard. every detail but the elephant in the room.
  • + 5
 Well there ya go. It weighs about as much as an elephant.
  • + 6
 I Sort and Came Here For The Comment.
  • + 4
 Me too.
  • + 2
 If e bikes had a gas engines they wouldn’t be allowed there for they are just hybrid mo-peds. Shouldn’t be allowed on trails. These abominations are truly for pussies who want to short cut hard work. Not buying the excuses unless you are physically disabled. Fat and lazy isn’t a disability.
  • + 0
 Why shouldn't they be allowed on trails? If you're worried about them tearing up trails, don't. Your local Cat A racers are putting down a hell of a lot more power than an average rider+250 watts. And your local fatasses are way heavier than an average rider+an ebike.

Really the only issue is people riding them like dicks, ripping up down-only trails and going way too fast around blind corners and whatnot.
  • + 1
 I love everyone's lame excuses for getting one. If you aren't willing to put in the work to ride a mountain bike then guess what, this isn't the sport for you. Not our problem you had kids and work too much, that was YOUR decision. Live with the consequences and stop justifying your consumerism and lust for instant gratification.

Ever wonder why pinkbike and the industry in general is pushing these so hard? Un-tapped markets and profits. Mountain biking is intrinsically hard and requires dedication to succeed at. Not too good for getting new people into the sport and buying more stuff is it? So make the sport easier so less motivated people can enter it and buy more stuff. The integrity of our beloved sport is being eroded in the name of profits.

So go ahead, keep parroting the same tired tropes that make you feel better about being a quitter and someone who takes the easy way out. As long as you're having fun right?

Next time you think about riding please stay on your couch instead. Leave the mountains to the people who love them enough that they are willing to dedicate the time and effort to ride them.
  • + 5
 @highfivenwhiteguy: lmao if you love the mountains so much and are sooooo dedicated to them, why don't you sell your nice cushy Maiden and buy a hardtail like mine...better yet, something rigid with V-brakes and single compound tires, since mountain biking NEEDS to be intrinsically hard.
  • + 1
 My bad, clicked the wrong profile. Sell your slash or whatever other FS bikes you're rocking and ride a Xizang from the 90s to prove how cool and hardcore you are.
  • + 8
 @mnorris122: because motorized/non-motorized is the most logical and enforceable distinction for land managers to grant 2 wheel access to trail systems. This has historical precedent and is the only way to draw a line in the sand. It's been discussed to death. The argument comes down to whether you think having fun is more important than that risk.
  • + 3
 @gramboh: At the end of the day, you're still going the same speed (unsafe for multi-use) downhill. In fact, most mountain bikers can ride faster downhill than someone on a dirt bike.
  • - 3
 @mnorris122: Man, you really got triggered didn't you? Going into someone's profile to launch a personal attack is a bit extreme, no? And you even failed at that. If you actually looked you would have seen that bike was sold a long time ago. Your incompetence is palpable.

If you have an actual point to make related to ebikes I would love to discuss.
  • + 4
 @highfivenwhiteguy: my point was that there's no logical reason to ban ebikes from MTB trails, then you came in foaming at the mouth screeching about how mountain biking needs to be hard...why do ebikes bother you so much? Who hurt you? If you don't want to ride an ebike then don't ride one, it's really easy.

Also going into someone's profile to see what bikes they ride requires me to make a miniscule movement with my thumb three times, not exactly what I'd call extreme. Extreme would be the 700km race I just did in 84 hours (though the winner did it in 44...jesus) trust me, I'm no EMTBer.
  • + 0
 @highfivenwhiteguy: boring. Talk to the paw.
  • + 8
 @mnorris122: What you did was resort to personal attacks rather than address points with a thoughtful argument. It doesn't matter how little effort it took, you still chose to do it. Pulling a trigger is easy too, but that does not make the decision to do it any less consequential. And again, even though it was "a miniscule movement with my thumb three times" you still managed to get it wrong. At this point it is difficult to give you any credibility whatsoever. You trying to add brags into every response is the icing on the cake.

If you want to know why adding a motor to a mountain bike and still calling it a mountain bike is a bad thing try educating yourself on why mountain bikes were allowed on trails that motorcycles were not in the first place. Go to your local ORV park and look at the condition of the motorcycle trails. I am not sure what conditions are like where you live but here in western WA we have access to some incredible trails in sensitive areas. Keeping the numbers of riders down and limiting the effects of those riders is crucial for maintaining access and protecting the environment. With the population boom in Seattle and other areas along the west coast more and more people are picking up the sport. That's fine, but the increased use of trails is having detrimental effects and is changing how trails are built. And that's without any motors.

My problem isn't with the ebikes themselves. My problem is with the effort of companies and ebikers to equate them to normal bikes in order to make more sales and gain access to trails reserved for non-motorized use only, threatening access for the existing user group and adding strain to the trails themselves. Ebikes on shuttle trails? No problem. Ebikes on motorcycle trails? Knock yourself out, but be prepared to get made fun of by every person on a real motorcycle. Ebikes at bike parks? Not sure why but go for it. Ebikes on sensitive backcountry trails? No. If I lived somewhere with fewer people and access issues I might even consider buying one, but current conditions in my region dictate that trails are something to be revered and protected, not abused because it's "fun" and the user needs that instant gratification.
  • + 1
 @highfivenwhiteguy: you comparing ebikes to motorcycles makes it difficult to give you any credibility....in case you failed to notice, I immediately realized i clicked the wrong profile and made a correction.

Ebikes do no more damage to trails than a particularly strong or heavy (or both!) rider.
  • + 3
 @highfivenwhiteguy: Yeah…god forbid that a NEW technology comes along and local, state, and federal government has to actually RETHINK their regulations. Yikes—how awful!!!
  • + 2
 @Captain-Spaulding: The risk is on climbing/traversing especially on single track multi-use trails shared with hikers and horses. No one has ever claimed there is more risk of user conflict on descents because an ebike is close enough to a normal bike there. Hikers, horses etc. are not expecting a near silent bicycle type object to approach them at 20-30km/h from behind on a fire road or 15-20 km/h on single track climbs (yes, have seen both of these in person on the north shore).
  • + 3
 @gramboh: So what's the solution? Ban bikes because they're too silent and fast? If so, I think we should be looking in the direction of Prius and Tesla—because how will people cross the road?

The simple answer is we need, now more than ever, more trail courtesy/awareness and embracing of new technologies and thinking instead of all the negativity at these solvable problems.

I for one don't ride my bike(s) to get pissed off at what others are riding. In fact, I think it's terrific to see such diversity in not only the types of rigs on the trails, but the people who ride them. A jerk, is a jerk, is a jerk…we'll never solve for that problem—but we can kill even the nastiest of riders with kindness and leave a positive impression on those around them.
  • + 0
 @Captain-Spaulding: Regulations are based on impact to the environment, and in case you haven't noticed humanities's relationship with the environment isn't so hot right now. Well, actually it is hot but that's the problem. Anyways any responsible governing agency is going to look at impacts of ebikes versus regular mountain bikes. The addition of a motor and battery complicates the situation and adds risk to the land manager, so governments giving carte blanche access to ebikes is doubtful. Ask Californians how their trail access is working out, then tell them you want to add motorized bikes under the umbrella of mountain bikes.

Also be careful of "kicking the bees nest" with government reevaluating regulations. DDT was a NEW technology that came along but due to problems fueled the fight for protection of the environment and helped lead to the creation of the EPA by a Republican administration. DDT along with a host of other chemicals were banned. The comparison here is that governments reevaluating trail use to include ebikes may in fact jeopardize existing trail access by acting as fuel for anti-mountain bike access groups.
  • - 1
 @mnorris122: I absolutely noticed, your "correction" was still wrong, you failed twice. Just quit before you hurt yourself.

Adding torque and weight to a bike will absolutely have more of an impact to trails than a non-powered, lighter bike. Take a look at soil cohesion, then look at what is required to overcome cohesion between soil particles. More torque to a wheel means a greater shear force on the surface. And shear force leads to....? That's right, erosion.
  • + 1
 @gramboh: Precisely. The greater risk to other trail users is not going to sit well with land managers, particularly in a country where being sued is standard procedure.
  • + 0
 @Lasse2000: Great contribution to the conversation.
  • + 0
 @highfivenwhiteguy: You should take a moment to appreciate how awesome your life is that this is your biggest problem. Always good to look on the bright side! :-D
  • + 2
 go try to clean some moto hill climbs and tell me they are for the "fat and lazy." and tell me it wasn't an awesome time.
  • + 3
 @highfivenwhiteguy: yeah, and when Kate Courtney's on the gas up a climb she's putting down wayyyyyy more torque and power than an ebike in turbo mode with your average 60 year old on board, albeit through a less aggressive tire.
  • + 2
 @highfivenwhiteguy: Good thing ebike manufacturers and ebike owners are forming their own advocacy groups to deal with this issue proactively right? Oh wait, still crickets, I guess ebike owners are too busy working/being a dad/out of shape/injury/it's fun and just ride the coat tails of previously performed advocacy work.
  • - 1
 @gramboh: so what which is it? Noisy or quite, because you have argued both.
  • - 1
 So the elite racers who ride e bikes and use them to train, their fat and lazy right?
  • + 0
 @highfivenwhiteguy: you are completely ridiculous and just love to talk of your ass. Go ride your bike instead of writing your walls of nonsense. I'm going to do an extra long skid on my local trail just to piss you guys off.
Yolo pussies.
  • - 1
 @radrider: Aspire to be more than you are, use your gifts as a human to make the world around you a better place. Let go of your consumerism and practice self sacrifice, give back to the community you take so much from. Instead of skidding down a trail that others worked so hard to create maybe spend a few days volunteering to help build them? Once you understand how much work goes into planning, acquiring access, building, and maintaining them you might also understand why it is so important to protect trails and the land they are built on.

Try challenging yourself to come up with a cogent response to the points I raised. What you have said only demonstrates ignorance and small mindedness. Rise above your animal instincts and embrace the greatest assets we humans have; logic and critical reasoning. Those things gave us the bikes we ride on, they took humans into space and produced the phones and computers we are using this minute. Why not apply them to making mountain biking as good as it can be and protecting it so that future generations can share in our fun?

Strive to be judged not on how much fun you have or stuff you own but on the impact you have on those around you.
  • - 1
 @highfivenwhiteguy: your the one with nothing to say except a whole bunch of crap.. I do build trails and have been for 20 years in Copeland forest(horses and dirtbikes to comete with) and the don(full of angry dog walkers) where i mostly ride, and hydro cut(pure xc bliss) back in the day. E-bikes have zero effect on those trails, especially compared to the guys riding when it is wet which really destroys a trail.
I dont ride E-bikes, but dont see anything wrong with them in any way, but always some hot head can find something wrong in anything... try to make the world a better place LOL, i have planted over half a million trees single handed, what the f*ck have you done.
  • + 1
 @highfivenwhiteguy: sermon on the mount. How high is your horse?
  • + 2
 Here's my gripe: Where I live, I can't, or shouldn't, ride an eMTB anywhere that an eMoto can't go. I like that the MTB has that allowance to ride non-motorized trails. Right now, eMotos and electric Dirt Bikes are $2500-$6000 more expensive than the most expensive eMTB, but in a few years I think you'll see those gaps narrow, and if given the option between a eMoto that can do highway speeds and 50 miles on a charge vs a 20mph limited bicycle with battery, I think the choice would be easy, especially if the same trail limitation and restrictions apply.
  • + 3
 My main issue here is: land/trail designation. If it is posted no motorized use, you should respect that. In my zone, I will be happy to slap ya with a citation if I catch ya on one of our epics with an EMTB.
  • - 1
 Yeah, I think e bikes are cool and they have their place. We have non motorized use trails and people have been tearing down the no e bike signs. That being said I ride moto and mountain bikes, but we don't have sanctioned moto trails in town so really e bikes shouldn't be allowed either. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
  • + 2
 I just turned 52 and have been riding mtb couple times a week for the last 25 years, unless i'm broken. I remember my first santa cruz bullit with marz superT , 2x chainguide and dh tires as an xc bike. I can't do that anymore, my next bike will be an ebike. I'd love to have a bike that weighs 40lbs with a 29'r 180f/ 27.5 170r, that would get me stoked on mtb again. where i live, where's there's no shuttles and the climb is hard as hell, i struggle to keep motivation to ride sometimes when i just really don't feel like suffering. Bring on the next gen of ebikes!!
  • + 1
 I'm not interested in filtering out the ebike content otherwise how will I know when someone produces an ebike that has actually progressive geometry or something even close to a good fit for someone over 6'3" (besides Nicolai)? I'll just keep manually filtering through these limp early attempts until something better arrives.
  • + 3
 That SE model looks freaking awesome. Too bad I've already spent my money on traditional bikes that will always be first priority.
  • + 4
 I'm still faster than all the e-motorcyclists on my trails. Guess those watts dont buy skill.
  • + 2
 Ride it with an eBike and beat yourself. Because no ones faster than you.
  • + 8
 @Lasse2000: No thanks; I ride real bikes.
  • + 1
 Thats right, haha. You can buy a little virtual fitness now, but you cant buy skill.
  • + 3
 Why does this POS have pedals if it's a motorcycle uphill and a downhill bike on the way down? Oh that's right, so they can pretend to be cyclists and use multi use trails.
  • + 1
 What happens when an e-bike explodes - like they have definitely done in the past - and starts a wild fire? Just wondering what that will do for trail access.
  • + 1
 Currently ride a Capra and love it but i ride for the downs. At 44yrs old my next bike is likely to be a YT Decoy in about 3yrs time. Apart from riding more i am looking forward to not needing a diesel van for uplifts because they screw up the environment more than any ebike.
  • + 1
 Got me an Ebike 12 months ago. Riding at least twice as much as I used to. Getting to see heaps of places I used to struggle to get to. My old non Ebike is hardly seeing any use at all. Only downside is the cost of Maintenance, Chewing through the chains, cassettes and brakes and also weight gain. Man have I ever got fat. Who would have thunk it.
  • + 4
 I remember when snowboarding was going to ruin skiing...

m.youtube.com/watch?v=XPZDEWBzneY
  • + 2
 brilliant example! THX for that. This quote shows how haters tick:

"They just don't see our side" "Is their any room for compromise?" "Absolutely not!"
  • + 1
 ''It's actually shrunk to half the size it was and ditched 3kg in the process.''

So what is the final weight here, are we talking something like 18kg if you shaved 3 kilos in the process? I strongly doubt there would be this much shaving without bragging about the final weight way below 20 kg, 18 even.
  • + 1
 I would hazard a guess they went from a small size drained of fluids at 23kg to a genuine medium size ready to ride at 21kg
  • + 4
 Cannondale (and many other companies) love to quote reductions vs. previous year, but almost never quote total weights. It's like some sort of scene from a dystopian novel where each measure is relative to another, in an endless chain, until you get back to their original bikes in the 80's, only to find out that they lost the original model figures years ago when they went paperless.
  • + 2
 All fun and games until your e bike decides to take a shit and throws up a code 30 miles out on a trail. Then your stuck pedaling a bike heavier than a dh bike all the way back. Seen it happen. Technology will fail you.
  • + 4
 But when it fails and you must pedal, you suddenly become a real Mountainbiker! Embraced as a real sportsman by all pinkbike hardcore supertrained uphill-affinicados. So if if your e-Bike fails, you win. Win-win.
  • + 1
 @Lasse2000: No, then you're even sadder. Sad for having an ebike, then even that lets you down. Big Grin
  • + 1
 Ran out of juice a bunch of times. adds to the adventure. not as bad as you might think. Definitely more problems with ebikes, you can crunch up a derailleur easy. Mine just died deep in the woods and I thought I was screwed but we figured out it was the main connector and lucky a little piece of tinfoil did the trick. Got to carry more tools and parts for sure. Next big ride i'm packing a tow rope, just in case.
  • + 1
 Likely Getting an Ebike for the wife. She loves the downs and hates the ups. She also is slower on the climbs and hates it when she feels like she is slowing me down. It will be a perfect combo for us. I am gonna stick analog for now and she will blaze on an electric. Days when she is not riding i am sure i will end up borrowing her rig from time to time.... Why not!
  • + 5
 No weight description?
Skip...next bike pls
  • + 2
 Weight is not the point on eBikes. Only bio bikes are paid in the -1000 grams = + 1000€ way. Ebikes are battery size +150WH = +1500€ [+1000 Gramms].
  • + 2
 @Lasse2000: Same situation for electric cars ... bigger and heavier. "They are electric and environmentally friendly"
  • + 4
 No words about the weight?
Cannondale Webpage isnt informative either..I'd like to know...
  • + 1
 I love the cheating comments. Lets look at the bikes we are riding today. 12 speed cassettes, 50 tooth cogs in the back, front suspension, rear suspension, disc brakes, plus size or 29 inch tires.... what does all this do? Makes it "easier" for us to ride the trails. If we are honest with ourselves, unless you're riding a totally rigid, single speed, 26 inch tire bike with coaster brakes..... we have been using technology to cheat when we ride. All of these things were designed to make riding "easier". Hmmm.
  • + 0
 ridiculous statement. Better bikes make riders more capable with the skills they have. Why would you not want to be more capable, ride faster, climb better, etc etc... At the end of the day you will have accomplished more, not the same in an easier manor..
Why aren't you riding a child's tricycle on your local trails to really up the difficulty level????
  • + 1
 This is what i'm talking about!! ebikes are great for lapping jump runs.
Lets be honest though, no way those bikes still had the "Governor" on.
Actually its dangerous to have it on when jumping.
Rat will tell you if you could understand him. hahaha
love ya Rat, Keep "Charging" !)
  • + 1
 Why would it be dangerous to have the governor on while jumping?
  • + 1
 @PtDiddy: 20mph is right around average dirt jumping speed,
can't have the system turning on and off erratically right before you air.
if the cutoff was like 25mph it wouldn't be so much a problem.
  • + 0
 When I want a good sweat and exercise I take my Sentinel. When I don't have the energy or time, I take the KTM. Best of both worlds. I've been conflicted, earning far towards the negative spectrum of how I feel about E-bikes. But I can say this, the Cannondale video turned me off even more.
  • + 2
 That ad video makes me want to ride so bad. It'd be awesome to do ebike races on these super short and steep tracks. Maybe 4X but with a climb too?
  • + 1
 I'm curious if the comment total was less than, matched, or exceeded what the PB staff thought it was going to be for the maiden voyage of an e bike article after the filter option went into effect. Hilarious.
  • + 3
 Hey PB while your adding filters lets get a filter for the nude Brett Tippie in that Spank ad it makes me uncomfortable ????
  • + 0
 Wow, that's a really long chainstay (450mm) they got there, which will certainly plow nicely, but good luck trying to do anything tight.

Ain't nothing wrong with an ebike, but to say that this bike is designed for people who already mountain bikes, nah, that's just a marketing gimmick that PB has advanced for Cannondale; shame on you PB.

Let's face it folks, if you really know how to ride a mountain bike, you are not going to choose an e-sled that can't manual.

My wife has a Pivot Shuttle, based on the Mach 5.5, now that's an ebike!
  • + 0
 I was up on Mt Wilson shuttling frontside and the shuttle driver made an e-MTBer remove his battery since they are illegal. He had to ride the whole way on a heavy-ass bike with non-functioning motor. He was a nice guy... but alot of these guys never bother to check what is legal or not and just assume everything is open; "must be legal since they sell it". Def not the best way to impact the local hikers opinions if you just ride illegally on the trails... dumb*ss. Hurting his own future potential to ride those very trails.
  • + 3
 I'm guessing your the type of guy to stand and wait for a crosswalk light on an empty road.
"OMG its illegal!!! Look at this dumbass who thinks hes above the law!"
He was probably thinking how little sense it makes that an electronically assisted mountainbike is considered illegal on a mountainbike trail...
I'm sure you have always checked every trail you ride to make sure its legal to bike on it..dumbass

-I dont ride E-bikes, but at least I can see there is nothing wrong with them except the jealous haters that speak out against them and the laws written by people who have no clue about mountain biking/E-biking/motocross.
  • - 2
 @radrider: Well you guessed wrong. I never said I am against e-bikes in any way. Funny how you imply all these things I never stated. You obviously didn’t understand my point. In California e-bikes face heavy restrictions in many locations, especially national forest land. As I actually stated, as an e-bike owner, it is stupid to not be aware of the restricted areas, ride the trails anyway and piss off the hikers who DO affect MTB trail access. I am actually for opening up access to e-bikes.
  • + 0
 @fudgedredd: your an idiot
  • + 0
 @radrider: You never bothered to actually call for clarity or ask anything. You just made a rash assumption about the kind of person I am and then, when shown to be wrong, just toss out insults. Call me whatever you want, but you seem to have embodied your own insults.
  • + 1
 @fudgedredd: you are hilarious.. i only assumed you are an idiot, and you clarified that. I didnt say anything about you not liking e-bikes.. god this is so over your head i feel bad.
  • + 2
 That's a weak AF motorcycle or a heavy MTB liable to leave you stuck in the backcountry having to sell your body to a pack of coyotes for just one more watt...
  • + 1
 Hopefully Scott takes one look at the SE model and releases a BAS E Gambler. I could never afford one but an EDH makes more sense to me than the eXC bike everyone is putting together.
  • + 4
 Seriously?

I could almost get a yeti for that kind of dough.
  • + 3
 I AM SO INCONVENIENCED BY THIS CONTENT IM NOT INTERESTED IN ON THIS WEBSITE I DO NOT PAY FOR.
  • + 2
 again, that's not a 75 deg seat angle - not if you're 6'4" with the seatpost full extended. we're into the low 70s here and climbing would suck, were this not an e-bike.
  • + 1
 how does seat angle change by adjusting the seat height?
  • + 1
 @radrider: effective seatpost angle is not the same as the actual seatpost angle. companies love to quote effective (or virtual) seatpost angle, but if you look at the actual seatpost it's at a far slacker angle. make sense? it mostly only really matters to tall guys and guys with disproportionately long legs. The actual angle here looks closer to the head angle - 66 degrees.
  • + 1
 @shredddr: Ya the seatpost angle is about 66.5, but the effective seat angle is still no more angled than 74 even with a maxed out 20" seatpost, move the seat forward about 3/4 inch to get the 75 degrees.
  • + 1
 @Cannondale : sorry but digging through a mountain to transform it into a small bike park to advert an e-bike is the worst thing ever.
  • + 1
 Who said anything about digging through a mountain? One of the stupidest comments I’ve read, and there are some real beauties in here.
  • + 2
 @platnum: as you know, most people here consider e-bikes as motorcycles and are scared that their favourite trails will be destroyed by armies of disabled e-bikers aboard their ecologically unfriendly weapons... This trail building is not going to help change mentalities. You didn't get my point here, but glad I made the top of your list!

Sorry, gotta go recharge my battery for tomorrow Smile
  • + 1
 @konamat: still don’t. You make absolutely no sense. Do you feel the same way about all bike parks.
  • + 1
 @konamat: I also think most people here consider e-bikes to be bikes, bikes that need to be peddled. As far as ecologically unfriendly weapons, pull your head out of your ass and come up for air.
  • + 1
 @platnum: don't forget to stay polite big fella, we're all bike friends here..

Reading comments and analyzing polls related to e-bikes, unfortunately a vast majority of PB users are very negative and agressive about them. Open your eyes, it started way before you got an account in here.
  • + 1
 @konamat: sorry, didn’t mean to offend. If you have thin skin or no sense of humour you probably won’t like me. That said you still haven’t answered my question.
  • + 0
 @platnum: whatever different sense of humor we have, I wouldn't joke this way with someone I don't, it's more a respect kind of thing to me. But no worries, I'm a big boy now and internet doesn't offend me anymore, thanks for asking.

To answer your question cristal clear: I've actually always felt OK about hand made trails in general. It's fun and so on and resorts get all kind of legal authorisations to build them, so I guess there is nothing bad about that. There are major economical concerns for the resorts too, so they need to get people coming all year long.

In this advert, it's different: they've built a trail that no one will ever ride again. Who needs a trail like this, there? This is clearly meant to attract younger riders and push them to ride uphill and show them it's fun etc... Fine. But I regret they haven't filmed an existing trail to end up with the same result, to me this is useless digging action.
  • + 2
 So close on the name, but I think Cannondale Mopedda is really what they should have went with.
  • - 1
 WINNER!!! Salute lol
  • + 2
 Has anyone noticed the new Giro helmet?? Just like the new Fox Dropframe Wink
  • + 3
 Now all we need is ratboy throwing a sick shredit on this
  • + 1
 I moved to Madeira and bought an e-MTB to winch me up to the top of the climbs. I hate it. Stupid, noisy, heavy, clumsy thing.
  • + 1
 Read through the whole thing trying to find out the weight but to no avail. The article could just be "this bike weighs x" and I would consider myself informed.
  • + 1
 "there’s no doubting its intentions with the dual crown bolted on there."
I don't know man, that head angle might have something to say about that...
  • - 2
 1500’ of climbing and they returned to base after 10 miles and only had 18% left? Not impressed. I’m fairly proudly eMTB ignorant but I thought these were supposed to take your rides farther? 1500 feet where I ride is the warm-up. Don’t see the point. So maybe you’ll get 2500’ out if you’re judicious then descend with a heavy bike? Correct me if my assumptions are way off?
  • + 4
 Meters, not feet. Kilometers not miles.
  • - 1
 @beavisnroses: whoops, guess I’m an ignorant reader my bad. Damn 1500m is pretty impressive. Still no interest in it.
  • + 2
 At least this is more fun to argue about than wheel size
  • + 1
 So- Ebike stuff aside.... New enduro platform preview? Possible they co developed the Monterra and a new Jekyll?
  • + 3
 www.pinkiebike.com
  • + 0
 eMTB are JUNK...they are a FAD and will die out soon...thankfully. If you need a motor there's no need to take up cycling...get in your car or ride a motorcycle.
  • + 1
 Hugely great news, more open pit mining in my country! What about getting your ass off the chair and go train those legs...
  • + 2
 but how its compared with more traditional rascal??
  • + 1
 I wonder if I could put a bike rack on it?? That way I could use it to get my mountain bike to the trailhead.
  • + 2
 E-Bikes, cause no wants to climb all day?
  • + 2
 Correct. Nobody wants to. But everybody pretends he wants. Classic internet warrior phenomenon.
  • + 0
 I've been riding e-bikes for years, where (e) stands for (e)very pedal stroke on the climb is under my own power and
(e)ar to ear grin on the way down since I earned it!
  • + 2
 You had me until I saw a dual crown without a direct mount steam........
  • + 1
 The music is funny. It was like a commercial for a toy when you were a kid.
  • + 1
 E Bikes are the future of MTB. Takes all the hard climbs out of MTB. My next bike will definitely have a motor in it!!
  • + 1
 This is specd like garbage for 9k. Would much rather ride the intense ebike for that
  • + 1
 *Disclaimer: don’t touch Cannondale bikes, their QC is worse than terrible...
  • + 1
 honestly, if i never saw another e-bike i wouldn't care. but i have to say i like what they did here for the video.
  • + 2
 Looks like a session, I mean, Levo.
  • + 1
 Looks like a YT Decoy rip off with a seh german motor instead of she-mano. But HEY is an american cannon so shhhhh....
  • - 2
 Ebikes are for lazy hacks and those who have little to no bike handleing skills. All this is going to do is make trail aceess that much harder because THEY ARE MOTORIZED VEHICLES.
  • + 1
 Moterra SE, now we can talk about emtb
  • + 2
 It turned my filter on
  • + 1
 Every e bike should have a dual crown
  • + 1
 From a Cannondale owner:

Please big C, make a Claymore again!
  • + 1
 flying Harleys yet? worlds!
  • + 0
 If I would be 21 I would probably reconsider the e-bike purchase... but because I am 55 I am completely in....
  • + 2
 you would reconsider with 21 just because you don't have enough money Wink
  • + 1
 [Insert comment slagging 'comfy' and 'comfortable' ebikes here.]
  • + 0
 Next time a big brand releases yet another trash laz-e-bike, they should say no to the check.
  • + 0
 Prop for "laz-e-bike" Razz
  • + 1
 That track does look sick to be fair
  • + 1
 Any emtb designed will be more or less clumsy and disproportionate
  • + 1
 WHAT IS THE WEIGHT FOR A MEDIUM????
  • + 0
 I sell these for a living and I have a bad hip. That being said, I will never buy one.
  • + 0
 I rode one for 2 days as well.
  • + 1
 Shit, I can't even down vote myself!
  • + 1
 Fuck E-bikes
  • + 1
 You will brake and e-shock your dick... don't!!!!
  • + 0
 lol. kiddo, go play ego shooter. But close the window - it's sunny outside.
  • + 0
 Weird Bosch and Yamaha don't support the trails these machines wear out.
  • + 0
 just ride dirt bikes you pussies
  • - 1
 And yes please, bring more not able people to the spots there should not be at, so we got more banned locations
  • - 3
 nice motobike, but why buy this stuff for 9000USD when you can buy TWO KTM dirtbikes for same price with so much more power? Smile (of course its dumm to compare these, but funfactor of dirtbike is totally elsewere!)
  • + 3
 Where can you get a KTM for $4.5k?...
  • + 0
 I just blocked E-content in my settings...E is persistent as f*ck
  • + 1
 cool motorcycle!
  • + 0
 Buy glasses.
  • + 0
 Please stop with the ebike reviews. Enough is enough.
  • + 0
 Fuck E-bikes
  • + 1
 Use your filter mate, youre boring.
  • + 1
 @Lasse2000: Does not work...
  • + 2
 @Kaspy: it does. but not everybody is clever enough to use. Trolls.
  • - 1
 EMTBs suck. you can filter that.
  • + 1
 Nice nick name... how appropriate for you... Smile
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