Hope Cuts Price on Made-in-England Carbon Bike
Hope just announced that they are slashing £2000 off the price tag of their upcoming HB160 carbon super bike. It's a welcome, yet surprising, move. When was the last time you saw a company drop prices on a highly anticipated bike that has yet to reach the market? Riders who already paid the original £7500 asking price will be getting a £2000 refund check in the mail.
I visited Hope Technology at their summer press camp in Briancon last July to check out the official release of their first-ever production bike. When they finally dropped the bombshell about the price, I was expecting a single digit below five-figures and was pleasantly surprised when they said £7500. I thought it was fair enough for a carbon frame that is laid in the UK, as well as a full Hope and Kashima coated Fox build kit; not to mention the fact that the bike had been developed from scratch, had proprietary parts and.... oh yeah, they had to build a new factory, buy all the machines to CNC the giant molds, cut the carbon fabric and bake the frames, and employ new staff to build the bikes.
The following is lifted from Hope's Facebook page:
 | Our first bike, the HB160 was successfully launched last August and received praise from all who rode it. An asking price of £7500 certainly put it into the Superbike category, but given the quality finish, attention to detail and uniqueness, it’s not unjustified. However, this price didn’t really sit well with one of our founders, Ian Weatherill. He’s been quoted many times stating that UK manufacturing can easily compete in the global market, but initial pricing for the HB160 didn’t really reflect this. Over the Christmas break we spent time reassessing our Carbon bike program and finding ways to bring a UK manufactured bike to the market at a more affordable price. We have managed to recalculate the absorption of the R and D costs for our whole carbon bike development program. This has enabled us to drop the retail price of our HB160 to £5500. We realize this is a major shift in pricing, but there will be no compromise in quality. The frames will still be meticulously manufactured in Barnoldswick by the same craftsmen. What about the original customers who paid £7500? We have committed to refunding the difference in purchase price to all these customers and will be in touch over the next few weeks. This has been possible due to our initial and ongoing commitment to keeping production in the UK, enabling us to pass on all cost savings directly to our customers. #hopetech #madeinuk |
We asked Alan Weatherill, brother of owner, Ian, and the manager of sales marketing at Hope a few questions:
How did you realize that you could knock a whopping £2000/27% off the price of the HB160 bike? That's as much as some manufacturers entire margins.
It all comes down to amortization of R&D costs. As you know, the development of the bike as well as research into carbon production techniques was all new to us and so costs were pretty high. Initially, as is normal, we looked to spread these costs over several years of bike production, but over Christmas, we decided that the carbon development shouldn’t only be attributed to one project as this knowledge will be used in multiple products over many years.
Will the quality of the bikes produced at the lower price be identical to the more expensive models?
There are no changes to the production methods, materials or processes. Our guys still take so much pride in every bike they make, they treat each one like it’s their own bike.
You will be refunding previous buyers who paid the full £7500. Has anyone ever done something like this in the MTB industry before?
We’ve never heard of it before in any industry, but we couldn’t let down the customers who had enough confidence in us to buy our first bike. They supported us, so we wanted to give something back, literally.
Why didn't you just pocket the cash and buy more toys, e-bikes for example?
It’s back to the previous answer really. Morally, we couldn’t do this to our customers.
Does this mean you are now making very little markup on this bike, hoping it will act as a loss leader?
We’re still making some money on this bike. Maybe not quite as much as before, but we’re comfortable with it.
Does it have anything to do with the number of requests for the bikes after last year's launch, are you selling more than you expected, therefore, experiencing a better price per unit?
No, we sold four bikes last week before the price change and we’re still only planning on making 4 or 5 bikes a week, so the quantities aren’t changing.
Hope already have a shed/factory load of machines for CNC machining, but they had to buy an even bigger one just to carve out these £700 chunks of alloy.
Dropping the price from £7500 to £5500 moves the HB160 from the superbike to 'hmm that's not too bad,' putting it in line with many other bikes, including direct sale models, even though they will still be retailed through local bike shops. If you have already spent £7500 on an HB160, your refund will be on its way soon. Imagine departing with all that hard-earned cash but justifying it to yourself by the fact you have your own dream bike to keep for years, then nearly a third of the money is back in your account - I would save it and be halfway towards buying a 29er if they listen to me and make one soon...
Hints were already made about more bike models in the future, so hopefully, we might see a whole range within the next few years, still made in the UK and perhaps even cheaper?
Still made here, but 26.666% percent cheaper wherever you buy one.
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#sorry (not really lol!)
#sorry
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monarchy_of_Canada
So will are still under the royals thumb.
Sorry bikes aren't as cheap as you want them to be.
And yet, companies like YT, Canyon, Whyte, etc can sell top shelf bikes for $2-5K and make profit. And these aren't Hufffys....
Lets say that the $2100 net is legit. And sure, rent, labor, etc. But how many of these do they sell in a year? The profits are not insubstantial.
Profits shouldn't be insubstantial for these companies. They take risks, build brands, and make something happen. Santa Cruz has made a huge name for itself over a long period of time. I've owned several bikes of theirs in the past. They should make money. So should Hope, Specialized, YT, whomever is doing a good job for their customers.
Myself, I like making money when I work.
That's still over $9,000 in Canadian dollars. Definitely not the original, eye-watering, $13,000, but still not anywhere close to "hmm, that's not too bad"...
life problems I wish I had
Clever marketing or not it’s impressive that they chose to go down this route. Fair play Hope!
Some times pinkbike users I dispair, if this was a u.s bike company would there be so many poor comments from our cousins over the pond?
Somehow, I do not see the connection to Hope, or to drivereights rant about the demise of the bike industry.
Of course the soaring sales of ebikes cannibalize sales of real bicycles.
And there might indeed come a shift of production from Taiwan to Cambodia, etc. But there we are not talking about 10k highend MTBs...
We’re still making some money on this bike. Maybe not quite as much as before, but we’re comfortable with it."
Wonder what is ENVE, and also all the brands that manufacture their carbon frames in Asia, opinion about this.
Of course Hope deserves respect for returning the money to the early adopters but then again they didn't really have a choice there. Imagine (as they probably did) if they chose to keep it. It would have generated so much hate and it would have been the last time someone trusted them enough to invest up front in one of their new products. Not saying this is some clever marketing trick. They did the right thing and they get my props for that (even though I'd never buy that bike, sorry).
UK worker who slacks off thinking so what if I get sacked Iv got the government to bail me out. (that's very much a thing in the UK) down the road from Barnoldswick theres a town that has a population that almost entirely filled with lazy brain dead bums who get of on living of the state.
Already been there and done it for over a year. I also got less than 65 and no rent payed for me. I cared alot.
Come across plenty off people in UK who don't give a s@#t tho.
I will say however, that it is now clear that the buying public has spoken and brands have taken notice. This is impressive to say the least.
That said, their carbon frames are incredible also. And while I know their choice of graphics is a love/hate thing, i personally think they make some of the best looking bikes you can buy...and if i'm going to pay used-car-level prices for a bike, it needs to look as awesome as it works.
It isn't £700 though, that's just one half of one side and you missed the 10 days of machine time, not to mention the programming, all adds up.
Machining a frame mould can be done on pretty much any modern 3 axis mill so long as the table is large enough, modern cam software has opened the doors to this kind of work outside of ultra high budget guys.
Olsen cycles (I think) on Instagram have a new cnc mould too, another small company managing it in the UK without a big budget.
If anyone is being pissy about hope chances are they've not used them. As a company goes they're ethos is kinda like ENVE, but Hope don't make false claims...
Use hope stainless BB’s and you don’t need DUB !!
The price increases will be realized in their other, more popular product lines.
how do I know ? I leave very close to the test drive track of BMW Group in South of France, and a friend of mine is a test driver over there.
He drove Phantom, Ghost and Wraith, and those ugly cars are absurd and, most of all, totally unreliable !
Rolls Royce make many things including the engines for airbus boeing etc. The place for RR in barnoldswick does exactly this ... pin point engines for passenger planes that millions of people use every day.
Now the facts have been dealt with , you are a pleb! there is not a fella on this planet that if had the dosh wouldn't buy a Rolls.
Well done hope , well done RR and well done good old British engineering !!!!!!!
(I use to be a RR tech....)
There is more going on here than "just supply and demand".
Hope makes some amazing products, right? And they really don't sell at that much more of a premium, despite likely having higher labour costs and overhead per product, I imagine. I think that takes work.
Hope did this bike, and it follows Hope tradition - it's premium. Through and through. I think they came up with a proof of concept. They were not over ambitious, and it took the time it took. If this was about making crazy cash and big margins, they would have came to market fast with a full size run and it would be outsourced nearly 100%. But they didn't, and given the work that went in, and the product that came out the other side, the original price was fair. However, it's not in line with Hopes philosophy, and the rest of the range. Not attainable. So, I imagine there is truth to the story. I imagine they sat back and figured out real efficiences and cost cutting measures and implemented to being the product in line with there true brand and market placement. I doubt it has a lot to do with selling or not selling a butt load. I.e., not a simple response to s low to non existent demand.
But...sure...it could be simple economics.