Pinion Gearbox to Enter US and Canada

Sep 14, 2017
by Richard Cunningham  
pinion gearbox


Gearbox fans in North America will have reason to smile today as Pinion announces that they have partnered with Gates (the Carbon Drive people) in Denver, Colorado, to open a distribution and support facility there. Pinion North America will service the brand's OEM customers here, who up until now, were the primary source for customers who wanted to purchase or preview a Pinion transmission. Their new headquarters will service both US and Canadian customers, and their central location puts them in an accessible time zone for gear-curious mountain bikers anywhere on the continent. Here's the official release:





Pinion Gearbox to Enter the USA and Canada

German gearbox specialist Pinion is officially launching its product in North America. Beginning in October 2017, the company’s bicycle gearboxes will be available in the USA and Canada. With this move Pinion is responding to the rising demand and interest of North American customers and bike manufacturers.

Pinion sees big potential for its low-maintenance bicycle gearboxes in the new markets, especially in mountain bikes, touring bikes, and gravel bikes. The Denkendorf-based gearbox specialists are hoping for similar success in the USA and Canada as they have enjoyed in Europe. Pinion believes US bicyclists want the same thing as Europeans—a low-maintenance shifting technology that is more durable than derailleurs and makes bicycling easier and less work. “Whether it´s a world traveler, mountain biker or daily commuter, our seven gearbox types are perfectly tuned for every specific usage. They are reliable, require no adjustment and are almost maintenance-free,” says Christoph Lermen, Pinion CEO.

Up to now in the USA, bicycles with Pinion gearbox technology have been available through a handful of selected brands, including Co-Motion, REEB Cycles, Ventana, Viral, Carver, Lynskey and Tout Terrain. In Europe, Pinion has partnerships with over 90 well-known OEMs such as Ghost, Stevens, Nicolai, Tout Terrain, Kalkhoff, Raleigh, Rose, MTB Cycletech, Idworx and numerous other manufacturers.

bigquotesEntering the US market has been an important topic for us for several years, Despite the different market segmentation in the USA and Canada compared to Europe, we believe that the requirements of a bicycle in North America, mainly in the USA, are generally the same as those in Europe: The customer wants a reliable bike that is fun to ride and reduces the typical maintenance and care.Pinion CEO Christoph Lermen
Domahidy Designs Titanium All-Mountain Pinion Hardtail 2016
Gates, the makers of the popular Carbon Drive cog-belt system on this Domahidy hardtail will be managing Pinion North America.

Pinion North America takes over sales and service for the USA and Canada

The service processing of American OEM partners, dealers and end consumers will be handled by Pinion North America. Marc Seemann is the contact partner for sales and support. Pinion North America will be operated from Denver by Gates Corporation.

The official launch of Pinion North America is Interbike Outdoor Demo in Las Vegas from September 20–22. Pinion equipped test bikes will be available at the Pinion/Gates booth. Christoph Lermen, Pinion CEO, will be on site for the initial launch of Pinion North America. "Journalists, retailers and customers are very welcome to test ride Pinion bikes and get information about our drive technology made in Germany!”

About Pinion

Pinion offers high-end gearboxes for bicycles. The two founders, Christoph Lermen and Michael Schmitz were working as budding engineers at the Porsche´s transmission development center in Germany and had the idea to create a bicycle transmission that was as intuitive to use as a sports car, with the same high precision and low wear. In simple words: Pinion builds a bicycle transmission with the heart of a sports car, as finely tuned as it would be functional. Suitable for any cycling route in the world, no matter the conditions.

Transmissions are available with 18, 12, 9 and 6 gears. Each of the gearbox types is finely tuned for a specific usage. The gearbox is integrated at a central position in the frame. Two spur gears connected in series work inside the housing box. A trademark of Pinion gearbox technology is the enormous transmission ratio of up to 636 percent. The gears are evenly graded and unlike with the derailleur gear system, there are no redundant gears. All 18, 12, 9 or 6 gears can "actually" be switched. The gears can be switched during the journey or when stationary by means of a twist grip.
pinion gearbox


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RichardCunningham avatar

Member since Mar 23, 2011
974 articles

210 Comments
  • 740 13
 Dear Pinkbike,

Just create a separate website for gearbox news. I'm only here for ebike. Quit pandering to gearbox sponsors who only care about making money. Ebike is the essence of mountainbiking. When I turn on Strava, put on my Enduro (R) goggles and fire up the ebike, all of my worries melt into the floor as I whir into the wilderness in symbiosis with mother nature and iphone X.

-Everybody Ever
  • 14 0
 Poetry
  • 25 1
 you win pinkbike
  • 21 39
flag freewheelprojectmtb-club (Sep 14, 2017 at 15:16) (Below Threshold)
 Mate, no matter how bad sounds but we have to be happy with the time we lived and the evolution we saw during, we all love old school , I'm still doing dh on 26 so what? this will not stop the progress, face it, on some point you will be on a position you have to ride your bike but your f*cked old Big Grin by that time I hope they will have light enough bikes for us
  • 31 21
 Why is everyone so hesitant to new ideas on this site?
  • 46 12
 @jordangraves: not NEW ideas. BAD ideas. find me someone bashing on dropper posts
  • 66 2
 @speed10: don't knock it till you try it. As a one legged disabled war veteran, gearboxes allow me to change gear with ease. Id be stuck at home permanently on drugs without them.
  • 11 2
 Pee. My leg. Going down...
  • 21 20
 @jordangraves: because E-bikes are NOT bicycles anymore. jsut because it has two wheels with an engine/motor doesnt mean its one. Would you call a Honda CRF250X a bicycle? its got two wheels, a handlebar and seats.
  • 21 3
 @speed10: people bashed dropper posts when they first came out. I know many who said "no way, to heavy don't need"
  • 98 4
 Yea, create a separate site for gearboxes, call it PinkBox.
  • 27 1
 @SlodownU: Um, yeah--kinda think that name's been taken by another 'industry' : )
  • 2 4
 @font style="vertical-align: inherit;">font style="vertical-align: inherit;">SlodownU /font>/font>: p


Or PinionBike
  • 5 1
 @unconvinced: He was talking about ebikes
  • 1 0
 @Geriatric-J: Bigger than the bike industry!
  • 15 18
 Are you reading this shit pinkbike? Figure out what your readers want. Check out the 99:1 ratio of ebiker opposers to supporters. Man you guys are f*cking up.
  • 4 2
 @d-man: Seriously, I see people bash dropper posts still. "I can just drop my seat in two seconds, waste of money and weight"
  • 6 5
 I'm in the same boat but I want an eMTB with a gear box
  • 15 8
 Long travel ebikes are actually destructive to the community. They are marketed for "self shuttlers", so you don't have to go through all that pain and suffering of pedalling or driving a pickup out to those difficult access areas. It's kicking sand in the face of trailbuilders who have worked and fought for years to keep something good for the locals, or at least those who are decent enough to ask to be shown things, rather than just demand info.
Hard access is a gateway to gapers. 160 travel ebikes will serve to ruin that. They're fine as commuters, but have NO BUSINESS on the trails!

Gearboxes are rad though. F*ck derailers!
  • 4 11
flag e-moto (Sep 14, 2017 at 21:39) (Below Threshold)
 @viatch: As..long..as..your..Acoustic..bicycle..is..using..gears..its..a..machine--motor--or--NOT
  • 6 1
 @e-moto: lol he never said it wasn't a machine...
  • 3 3
 @viatch: you are wrong because the Honda can not be moved by human power with pedals!
  • 5 3
 This is honestly, probably, the future on MTB. Once they find a way to lower the weight on it and get rid of the twist shifter. I think a lot of high end bikes will adopt this set up maybe 10 years down the road.
  • 4 10
flag choppertank3e (Sep 15, 2017 at 1:47) (Below Threshold)
 @speed10: I think dropper posts suck. Why would I not want to stop before tackling a tricky climb or smashing a downhill run? Why would I only want to put my seat down four inches from max to hit jumps, DH, verts? Why would I try to climb with my seat only four inches from slammed? Why would I want the extra weight or the ridiculous price?
  • 2 0
 @speed10: Bravo! lol
  • 7 3
 "You don't need a dropper when you know how to descend properly." Say hundreds of older riders who can't adapt to the new fangled things. @speed10:
  • 11 0
 @speed10: dropper posts are the work of the devil and are clearly expensive, dangerous and help spread communism.
  • 1 0
 LOL just what i needed this morning.
  • 1 0
 Say Fuck yeah with gusto speed10!
  • 4 0
 And what does this have to do with gearboxes?
  • 2 1
 This has to do with the comment section. @macroman:
  • 4 0
 Boy I can still recall people giving me shit about my bike with suspension on it. You'd think I just ran them over...
  • 3 4
 @speed10: Ya but this is the same site that bashed 27.5 and 29ers and said they would never last....
I'm with @jaordangraves on this one.
  • 3 4
 @viatch: When e-bikes have foot pegs instead of a crankset then we can talk.
  • 4 0
 @jordangraves: I wrongly compared dropper posts and ebikes. The dropper post has not threatened any trail that I'm aware of. So even if people do hate droppers (I guess a few exist), their refusal or acceptance of the idea shouldn't impact any other riders. This important factor is why it's critical not to just lump ebikes with "new ideas" i.e. boost, Di2, plus tires.
  • 1 0
 @d-man: do u have a link to these comments?
  • 5 1
 @DiveH: my future trails build will all require a hike-a-bike out...have fun etards.
  • 1 0
 @jrocksdh: just search on the main page for 'dropper post' and the first few pages should be littered with comments like that.
  • 1 1
 Its like a shitty Father John Misty Song. Well done
  • 1 1
 @Bobby12many: But all Father John Misty songs are shitty.
  • 3 1
 @viatch: There are 2 types of E-bike the lazy commuter style and then the pedal assist style that doesn't work unless it's being pedaled. The latter being more classed for MTB use. Also your Honda example uses gas and doesn't have circular moving cranks
  • 1 1
 While ebikes are fun it's clearly for those who don't want to exert themselves too much. You'll have to cut back on the Cheetos if you're going electricSmile
  • 4 2
 @DiveH: how is riding an ebike worse than shuttling? So trail forks is bad too then because people don't have to "ask" where the goods are? Another weak argument with no evidence to back it up .
  • 3 0
 @cartoon: 27.5 lasts because you can't even buy 26 anymore, unless you lace your own wheels, which I do, in spite.
  • 1 1
 I have an impression that Pinkbike is inhabited by 26 inch wide back to the future humans
  • 1 0
 @Travel66: preach brother...or is it Comrade????
  • 1 0
 @Nefariousd: ни чертовски
  • 1 1
 @baggyferret:
  • 164 1
 I don't know, I really don't have any pinion about it.
  • 2 10
flag owlie (Sep 14, 2017 at 13:48) (Below Threshold)
 tah
  • 12 7
 I lost grip, shifting pinions about it.
  • 17 1
 I oughta belt you for that.
  • 10 1
 I'm having an internal struggle on the matter... what can i do? I'm easily triggered
  • 6 1
 it's gear-anteed to make you faster
  • 17 1
 Srsly? Y'all​ need to think outside the box...
  • 11 2
 wait, is this going to start a chain reaction of puns? If so, I hope no one snaps it
  • 12 2
 the shift in market demand will surely derail the competition.
  • 138 7
 Looks like a Yamaha.
  • 18 1
 You probably meant eYamaha.
  • 7 5
 @jaycubzz: I think it looks like a sess.... I'll show myself out
  • 76 6
 "The gears can be switched during the journey or when stationary by means of a twist grip."

F^&K, Still!!!! Will someone make a gearbox trigger shifter already!?
  • 8 16
flag spaceofades (Sep 14, 2017 at 13:44) (Below Threshold)
 You just don't get it, do you Scott?
  • 8 2
 Effigear. Watch your language and as kindly next time.
  • 16 0
 Clearly people are willing to pay a premium for top shelf parts, and now availability in North America is getting sorted. At this point it's not the gear box that they have to try to sell, it's that grip shifter. ...Or they could come up with a trigger system and the entire combo would probably sell itself.
  • 13 0
 The cycle monkey (US distribution) guys told us a trigger option is in the works.
  • 23 1
 @jubilee55: just skip the cable actuation and go electronic!
  • 28 1
 @MX298: Yean, and while you're at it, throw a motor in there. No, wait....
  • 19 0
 Effigear submitted a Press Release to PB earlier this year, and the editors deemed it not worthy of a place on the news feeds. Surely a Press Release needs to be, well, released by the press??

I found it last week by chance after trying to find out about the gearbox bike being ridden by Benoit Coulanges at the World Cup this year.

So, PB, could anyone let us know what was not newsworthy about that? Why was it not given any space on the home page? Be careful of silence PB, for it breeds conspiracy theories.

Here is the link to that page BTW

www.pinkbike.com/news/effigear-gearbox--how-does-it-work.html#cid1797918
  • 3 1
 @orientdave: I farted and wrote a press release - but it doesn't guarantee column inches unfortunately
  • 1 1
 @Elipirelli: All they have to do now is get both shifters on the right side of the stem.
  • 2 0
 I sometimes wonder if Pinion may be receiving some sort of yearly "retainer/incentive" from shimano/ sram to not develop a trigger shifter $$$$. As they sure seem to be dragging the chain, on this one.
  • 3 0
 @Sparkless: They've shown one at Eurobike, but it has been ignored. It's a sequential style trigger: one in each side of the handlebar, like a sports car. I really hate when the media does this kind of BS.

www.mtb-news.de/news/2017/09/04/eurobike-2017-pinion Here you go! Smile
  • 1 0
 Shimano has one for their internal hubs. Works great even under power.
  • 1 0
 @choppertank3e: Yeah on the bike I ride to work I've got a Shimano Nexus 8sp geared hub with a trigger type shifter. It is a bit rapid rise like in that you pull the cable to go to a heavier gear. It would work with Alfine too and they even do Alfine in a Di2 (electronic shifting) option. The main difference is that Pinion and Rohloff use two cables instead of one. It could be done though. There is a (hydraulic) trigger shifter option for Rohloff so I suppose something similar could be done for Pinion too.
  • 2 0
 @ninjatarian: Yup, trigger system and I'll buy one, grip shift was a bad dream from many moons ago
  • 1 0
 @orientdave: That Nicolai bike with Effigear he is racing on is nice. He had some sort of mechanical issue at Ft Bill??? this season. Warner and Claudio thought he ripped off his derailleur, haha. Its a mid/high pivot single pivot compared to the 4-bar linkage Nicolai traditionally uses. No tensioner device needed on that frame either. I don't care for the Gates belt drive used by on the Nicolai G bikes, and would rather see a chain as used on the Zerode bike. Gates distributing will likely see more belt drives in off-road application.
  • 36 2
 I've invented a piece of foam you can wrap around a derailleur to protect it from dings and mud. I think I'll charge $150 for it.
  • 7 1
 As long as it's 29'er specific and mad enduro TAKE MY MONEY!!!!
  • 26 6
 The problem is that any time you have to metal parts interacting, there is drag. In a derailleur system, you have the first cog (chainring) interacting with the chain, then the chain interacting with the rear cog (cassette). Any scheme to adjust the RPM that is not done by adjusting these two cogs will introduce more interaction, and more efficiency loss, whether its gears, an idler pulley, or a derailleur-in-a-box like the old Honda DH bike.

If each interaction is 99% efficient, then with two interactions on a traditional derailleur system, you have .99*.99= .98, or 98% efficiency. With a simple gearbox design like effigear, you have a spur gear that turns a selected spur gear (on an array of gears) that turns another spur gear (once again, on an array of available gears). Thats 3 interactions, or .99*.99*.99 = 97% efficiency; add the two more interactions for the belt or chain drive, and you have .99^5 = 95% efficiency. An extremely fit biker can sustain 200 watts, so with a very generous 99% efficiency for every gear/cog interaction, thats 10 watts lost. This is a bitter pill to swallow for a human-powered machine.
  • 64 0
 You should see the hub on my dirt jumper. Shit hardly moves.
  • 25 1
 What you can mathematically determine on paper and what you can feel on the trail are two very different things.

I wouldn't build a road bike with this system, or a light XC bike but for AM/trail riding I've been super impressed and there's way less drag than I was expecting to the point where it's pretty much imperceptible. There's just a nice mechanical whir from the box that should fade as it wears in properly. The grip shift and supposed delay is a non issue too.

I shift 10x more now than I used to and am always hitting the perfect gear lightning fast. Being in the right gear all the time has meant that I can ride longer and harder than I had before.

It's so nice knowing that your gearing will be 100% perfect every ride. Only maintenance required between rides is a wash and chain lube.
  • 20 1
 Well yes and no. That applies to the perfect laboratory testing. But if you count in dirt, and loss of lubrication the efficiency goes down dramatically. So for instance for backcountry riding (where you have minimum servicing) the gearbox can be more efficient than a muddy chain (that also wears very quickly).
  • 2 0
 @dwojo: I really want to try a gearbox bike, and I figure I will probably own one some day when I have the spare cash - probably a Nicolai. I just wish it were possible to retrofit one to existing bike designs. The suspension designs that interest one may not be available on the limited class of bikes that are gearbox compatible.

What bike do you use, if I may ask?
  • 9 4
 @IluvRIDING: The inefficient muddy chain still is going to connect the gearbox to the rear wheel.
  • 4 0
 @WaterBear: yeah they are proper fun not having to worry about shitty gearing ever.

I'm hoping that over time they become more universal. I find it strange that frame manufacturers would build e-bikes but not offer a gearbox option. Hopefully this is a step forward in seeing them on more oem builds. It would decrease the price as well which for me is the only downside to this system right now.
  • 1 1
 @dwojo: I found my self shifting less or not shifting because I was either peddling or the gripe shift is hard to turn. If it's wet forget shifting! XO shifts great!
  • 7 0
 @WaterBear: I am running a Zerode Taniwha. Due to the cost of the frame and drivetrain I'm running it as a 26er still Smile they're still good and my fox 36 is just awesome so hard to justify replacing it for bigger wheels at this stage.
Phase 2 will be new wheelset and fork.
  • 8 1
 Whoa! Slow down, I just started algebra 1!
  • 6 0
 @VTwintips: 1) not necessarily - check out those photos above.
2) If you use a chain, a single speed has much lower friction cos you don't have any extra cogs on the hanger.
  • 1 2
 @IluvRIDING: there's only friction between the chain and the cog it's on. The other cogs have no bearing on the friction.
  • 3 0
 @mi-bike: He means the idler cogs on the derailleur, you know, the ones the chain is always on just like the chainring.
  • 4 1
 There's loss of power when a chain goes through the jockey wheels. This is well-documented. Every time someone talks about loss in IGHs or gearboxes they ignore derailleur losses. Try to set the cranks spinning backwards on a BMX or SS. Now try the same on an MTB with a derailleur (and try at the top and bottom cogs).
  • 4 0
 @iamamodel: Well, the Zerode Taniwa, for example, needs a chain tensioner to account for chain growth during suspension movement. So the chain tensioner probably sucks as much energy as the jockey wheels of a derailleur. Granted, the Taniwa *will* presumably have a perfect chainline in every gear, which a derailleur bike would not. I'd like to try a gearbox bike. If the price came down, I'd be interested. I enjoy wrenching bikes - but have zero time to do it, so a "throw it in the corner until you ride again" sort of maintenance schedule is perfect for me.
  • 5 1
 hey @hamncheez
i ride a bike with an effigear on...in whistler for the last 3years!
this bike is unbeatable on the way down!
Who's looking for maximum performance on the way up here in this column?
Who knows how many watts he does produce when at the best of his game??
Maintenance free, instant shifting, weight centered on the bottom bracket...Seriously>>gearbox is a game changer!
You doubt it...Try my bike anytime in whistler, and ENJOY THE RIDE!
  • 2 4
 You took the words right out of my mouth on the Zerode. Not to mention that adding a moving fragile part to eliminate a fragile moving part in an equally as vulnerable place is counterproductive in my eyes. I mean, I've seen broken zerode tensioners in person. As much as I want Zerode to succeed as a gearbox company from New Zealand, I really dislike their concept. Having to replace a hard to find part is real dumb (although not to hard to rig together if really needed).

With hardtails, and certain suspension designs, a gearbox is more sensible. That being said, with hardtails, the rohloff hub makes a bunch of sense too. I mean, there's no unsprung weight in that situation. I guess the wheel might feel a bit heavy compared to if the weight were at the hub, but Rohloff hub means no special frame needed, which is a huge win.
  • 1 0
 @VTwintips: belt driven
  • 1 0
 @SethStar: both can be? also ... even less efficient and cutting frame in half :/
  • 8 0
 this ain't Le tour de France, mate.
A handful of watts goes nowhere riding dirt with 2.5" knobby tyres, pedal bob and shit aero for a couple hours.
  • 2 0
 Surprisingly, a well lubed chain is more efficient than a belt drive:

www.bikeradar.com/us/road/news/article/chain-or-belt-drive-which-is-faster-36074

Its a small difference, one that doesn't matter on a mountain bike, but it shouldn't be claimed that belt drives are more efficient unless you have a chain like your one buddy who leaves his bike out in the rain or on the back of his car when driving in the winter on salted roads.

I realize that this site is geared (get it?) to DH bikers, but for many of us who have graduated college and have families and careers, there is no time for shuttling and bike parks anymore. I get up at 6am and still get in 2 hour rides, or about 2600 feet of climbing/descending before work. The faster I can climb the more vertical descent I can get. That being said, the small difference in climbing speed, over an entire season, could be offset by the low maintenance in time and money of a sealed transmission.
  • 15 2
 Woo Hoo!!! Still don't have a frame to put it on but WOO HOO!!! (0 sarcasm, 100% stoked)
  • 7 0
 Well yeah I'm really really thinking hard about going for a frame with Pinion. Currently still on 1x9sp, horribly creaky octalink cranks (2004 LX) and I'm finding the limits of my the geometry of my ten year old frame. It is the time to seriously consider a different type of crank and gearing system on my next frame. Most likely candidates now are Portus (krowdkarl.de, currently on kickstarter) and Olsen (olsenbicycles.com, has been on kickstarter and currently in business). I really like the Olsen concept but I just somehow prefer steel over carbon. Even tough Olsen really seems to do an amazing job. He might even overbuild it and be so confident to give you crash replacement. But Olsen is willing to have the frame welded in steel too, so that puts him back in the game. Even BTR could do it for you, though that'd be a first for them. Too bad Effigear is currently only available on Cavalier and Nicolai, not on any decent steel hardtail. Yes it is a lot of money but wearing away a couple of Eagle cassettes isn't cheap either.
  • 26 2
 i haven't heard of one single brand that you just mentioned.
  • 2 0
 Try 18 bikes. They do (or used to do) custom steel hardtails with Pinions. I think it was about £2300 for the frame and gearbox.
  • 1 0
 That portus hardtail looks sick. Would be so much fun.
  • 4 1
 Whilst I am a big fan of the "idea" of the gearbox the reality just isn't quite there for me at the moment. I haven't ridden any but from reading reviews the big downsides are the shifter, you can't change under load and the weight. The shifter I can live with. I used Gripshift 20 years ago and had no issues with it, obviously a trigger shifter would be better. Changing under load is probably something you really need to adjust to and plan ahead rather than just banging through the gears. I think the weight will come down with time and a few carbon / 3D Ti printed parts. For me right now a cheap 10 speed drivetrain does the job quite well as long as I clean it after every ride. Maybe a gearbox could be on the cards in a few years.

One good thing about all this ebike tech is that the bottom bracket area is being designed with a gearbox / electric motor in mind. Agreeing on a "Universal Gearbox Mounting Standard" is a whole other minefield.
  • 3 0
 @fartymarty: If you read the article that was on here recently then you'll see that it can be shifted under heavy loads without backing off and without risk of damage, but It has to be an electronic shifter. Pretty sure we will see a E-trigger shifter soon as they were hinting in the article.
  • 2 0
 @MikeGruhler: sorry only skim read the article. An electronic shifter would be great.
  • 2 0
 @fartymarty: I can shift between pedal strokes 90% of the time without backing off at all. Shifting is lightning quick and super precise. No crunching like on with a cog/derailleur shift. Gripshift is fine but I'll probably try a trigger when it gets developed. I think the gripshift will be quicker though for multiple gear changes though.
  • 2 0
 @dwojo: This is why I have to try one. There are so many conflicting reports. Everyone who has ridden one for a decent amount of time says they would never go back.
  • 1 0
 @fartymarty: I am working on the new "Super Boost E-pinion Mount" upgrade as I type this.

It's gonna be way stiffer and less power loss due to bb flex, etc.
  • 1 0
 Look up Deviate cycles on facebook. Game chager!
  • 1 0
 @ccdb93: Really? Pretty sure you must have heard of Nicolai. Cavalier with the Effigear has been covered here on PB too. I only learned about Portus when I discovered their steel version of the Alutech ICB2.0. I love low top tubes and the ICB2.0 does that. Almost like an (old) Kona Process but with threaded bottom bracket. As for Olsen, I only learned about that from the last edition of Cranked magazine (cranked.cc). They have a nice interview with Steven Olsen. Actually, Olsen used to design carbon MTB frames for On-One. You may have heard of those. As for BTR. Ehrrm... I guess it is best to not use PB as a main source for mountainbike related content.

Yeah the grip shift is a thing. I did use it for the front mech back when I ran that (never got why anyone would operate a front mech with a trigger shifter, it is never going to work as SRAM kindly pointed out) but I used to find it difficult to operate a grip shift on the fly. I mostly ride standing up which makes it a bit harder to shift and rotate my hand. Maybe the longer front center and reach will allow me to put more weight on the feet and less on the hands. That'd make it easier. Effigear does work with trigger shifters (or a grip shift that kind of works like a trigger in that you don't fully rotate it) but because of their belt placement it won't fit existing designs. Pinion has the belt where the chain used to be so the forces are similar to what the derailleur based frame was originally designed for. That said, there will surely be some kind of trigger option from Pinion. They just won't release it until they're fully confident it is up to it. There is a (hydraulic) trigger option for Rohloff so maybe something like that could work for Pinion too.

@fartymarty : Yeah the cool thing about Olsen is that it really modular. It can be built single speed or with a regular derailleur based drivetrain if that's what you want, you can run the Pinion (P or C series) or you can mount a Shimano e-steps motor underneath of that's your thing. At least much better than get a dedicated e-bike for the odd trip you're going to use it. And if gearboxes really are slightly less efficient, maybe racers will prefer to mount the derailleur for races and go back to Pinion for winter training. I think the concept really is great. And I like that he's still open to have his design built out of steel.
  • 1 0
 @Richt2000: Suspension-wise, hard to see anything meaningful from those teaser photos they posted. Seems like a DW-Link to me.
  • 2 0
 @fartymarty: After a decent amount of time you get used to anything. Just because you developed Stockholm syndrome doesn't mean something's great. Big Grin

Seriously though, I would like to try one as well. From the concept point of view Pinion makes much sense.
  • 25 16
 Derailleur works fine. Cheap to replace. Easy to service. I don't see the need for gearboxes honestly.
  • 14 11
 Exactly, they work "fine"...but if you're satisfied with "fine" then a derailleur will do.
  • 16 1
 @nohit45: From what I've read so far Pinion works "fine" as well, not great.
  • 8 8
 sorry mate, my hardtail stands upstairs not ridden. Third der hanger done in last 6 months. Crappy hangers for sure. Still...
  • 4 1
 @jollyXroger: True, it's early but i'm hopeful. I have replaced two derailleurs, two chains, and a cable this summer, so i'm REALLY hopeful!
  • 5 2
 The removal of that unsprung weight will allow the suspension to work better than replacing any shock could. I always thought why not have the freehub in the bb, that way you could remove alot of the weight from the back to the bb
  • 4 1
 @nohit45: Derailleurs work better than fine, really. They may be at least as efficient as any gear box, and while they wear out quicker they are also much cheaper to replace (at least they are if you're a cheap SOB like myself and you run NX derailleurs on XT casettes). The advantages of a gear box seem to be 1) they have the most optimal location of all drivetrain configurations I am currently aware of and 2) their service intervals are much longer.

Point 2) being somewhat negated by the cost of your average gearbox (unless you're unlucky like WAKI is), reason 1) is what really makes the gearbox distinct. 11 speed is cute and all but it puts mass in absolutely the worst possible place on the bike.
  • 3 1
 @ibishreddin: Could you imagine a pressfit freehub bb? Disaster waiting to happen.
  • 2 0
 That's what they said about suspension first hit bikes, and look where we are now...
  • 1 0
 Don't forget "weighs less".
  • 13 0
 Who are these people who always have perfectly working derailleur systems?
My shit is always a little off, cassettes and chainrings get worn out, I'm replacing chains every 3 or 4 months, hangers get tweaked, the clutch gets grimy doesn't work right, jockey wheels make funny noises, the derailleur gets a little bent and occasionally brakes. Cables stretch, housing gets nasty, tons of little bits and pieces to clean and service.
Frankly it kind of sucks.
  • 4 0
 @acali: I totally agree. It works great for 1 or 2 rides then cops a hit and is just off. Was just too bloody hard to keep it running perfect every ride.
  • 4 1
 @acali: Serious comment: sounds like it's time to invest in a good maintenance class and some cleaning tools. Not trolling. Really, learn some stuff -> enjoy more rides more often -> save money.

With regular maintenance I've managed to keep my XT 11sp setup running great for 2 seasons. Over a hundred recorded rides totaling 1100 miles per Strava. Same drivetrain. No BS.
  • 2 0
 Depends where you ride. We just did a week in the alps and everyone in our group bent a mech hanger or cage
  • 1 0
 @acali: I'm sorry to burst your bubble
  • 1 1
 @acali: I'm sorry to burst your bubble but I have no problems with my drive train at all and it's kinda Frankensteined. I run 2x too. I have a 24t Blackspire small ring and XTR big ring with XTR cranks(175 length) StraitLine bash ring, XTR 3 speed front der set up to run dual rings, XO 9 speed rear der(med. cage), XO shifters, SRAM 9 speed cassette, Jagwire L3 housing, Jagwire cables, SRAM chain and use Purple Extreme chain lube and that shit runs flawlessly. No kidding.
  • 1 0
 @lightsgetdimmer: Funny how that works. "Can I use X brand drive train part with Y brand other part"? Almost always yes. Seems like chain roller-to-roller length is standardized (otherwise chain wear tools wouldn't work) so pretty much any cassette has to work with any chain. So far my experiments mixing derailleur and cassette brands have been successful, too.
  • 3 1
 @WaterBear: asking "can I use Shimano shifter with Sram derailleur" is one of the best ways to get punched in a bike workshop.
  • 1 0
 @WaterBear: Well yeah, but everyone has been doing this forever, right? After all, there are so many aftermarket cassettes, derailleur pulleys, chains, chainrings that aren't from SRAM or Shimano, it would actually be odd for someone to have a complete Shimano or SRAM drivetrain. In my case, I'm running SRAM X7 trigger shifter with X9 rear mech, Blackspire chainring and DMR bashring on Shimano LX cranks, KMC chain, Shimano SLX cassette on XT hub, Clarks cable with Shimano outer cable.

@WAKIdesigns To be honest I wouldn't even know. There used to be the Rocket and Attack triggers from SRAM for Shimano rear mechs, but I don't know about any compatibility with current products. Anyway, be safe out there when exploring innovative new ways to get punched in a bike workshop.
  • 6 1
 My experience on a Ventana plus hardtail with a pinion was pretty terrible. They just do no want to shift under load. Not heavy load, or medium load, almost any load. On rolling East Coast trails, who has time for that. Maybe they'll break in after a couple hundred miles, but then you're stuck riding an ill tempered bike for hours and hours. Rohloff was the same way.
  • 3 1
 I had this experience on a demo bike that almost certainly had completed the break-in period. Combine a reluctant transmission with a rain-slicked shifter and out come the curse words!
  • 6 0
 Not my experience. I can sneak a shift in between pedal strokes 90% of the time without backing off even going uphill. Can also dump multiple gears and get right on the gas without that awful grinding. So much quicker, way more precise. If you just had 1 test rise then I'd agree your experience is probably valid, but after about 3-5 rides you work out how to finesse the system and you can shift lightning fast and like butter in between pedal strokes
  • 3 1
 @dwojo:
So you're saying you sneak shifts in between pedal strokes. But you also say you shift without backing off?
Those sound like two different things.
  • 1 0
 @jflb: by in between i mean right at that slight dead spot in between down strokes. Pedalling consistently so not pausing whatsoever to shift. Hope that helps
  • 2 0
 @dwojo: There was a zone where 2-3 shifts were just super notchy. The rest of the range was passable, but it was something like a third of the way in the easiest range a couple shifts I'd have to coast to get it to click over. Otherwise the grip shifter would just jam. The rep came 3 times to adjust it, it was never great.
  • 1 0
 @fatallightning: were you on a P18? They switch shafts and can be a real BASTARD when they do. I had one on a Nicolai Helius for about a year, it was a cool experience, ultimately I wanted a new bike and sold it
  • 5 0
 1.) This is not new technology
2.) Gearbox drivetrains will always be less efficient that derailleur systems because they still use a chain. Yes you take away the inefficiency of a non-straight chain line, but you add the inefficiency of the gear box.
3.) Gearbox's tend to be less efficient at low RPMs/high torque which is exactly the case you have with mountain biking

These are physical limitations of the gearbox, and they CANNOT be over-come to any substantial degree. It is just physics, and you cannot change physics.

I owned a Rohloff hub. It had it's advantages. The shifting under load thing is a thing, and if you are not getting it, you are in fact backing off pedaling, even if it is for a short time and you get good timing the shift. But I usually do this with shirting with a derailleur system, too, because there is no need to put un-needed stress on it and wear it out more quickly. That said, if you need to bail yourself out, it is possible to shift under load, there it is not with a gearbox.

However, the 'break in' period thing, while true, doesn't result in a drivetrain as efficient as a derailleur. When I first got the Rolhoff drag was VERY noticeable, and then after a couple of months it seems to get less, and then leveled off, and I was fairly happy. But then the things I got if for started not being true (that is a bomb proof drivetrain). First, the chain tensioner required for my full suspension bike seized up and stopped tensioning (not the fault of the geared hub, but just shows that if you have to have a tensioner, it is just as capable of failing as a derailleur). Second, I started getting skips in the gears under really hard efforts (and I'm not stalking about the awkward 7 to 8 gear shift, while just pedalling hard, the gear would just disengage like the gear mesh slipped. Finally, one morning I went down into my basement to find the hub had purged all of its oil bath onto the floor; and this was after less than a year of riding. This resulting in them replacing the entire internals of the gearbox, and a long wait from the service department.

In the meantime, I bought a cheap LX drive train while waiting. And it felt like I was being shot out of a rocket on my first ride. That 'break in' period was really just mostly me getting stronger and used to the lower efficiency. I was pedaling one to 2 cogs higher equivalent on the same climbs/sections of trails and crushing it.

When I got the hub back, I tried again, and it felt like I was pedaling in mud.

I have not since looked back. Derailleur drive trains are cheap (as long as you don't fall for high-end SRAM or Shimano XTR), efficient as long as you do nominal maintenance, and you can replace any broken part easily and quickly (same day through shop, or within a couple of days through mail).

Geaboxes I think have a specific nitch; which is hardtails (or maybe concentric BB pivot suspension) that do not require a tensioner, use a belt drive, for a rider that has excess amounts of power and fitness who doesn't want to have to do any regular maintenance to their drivetrain. But that's not most of us. Gearboxes also seems to be an awesome training device (refer above to the 'short out of the cannon' effect when returning to derailleurs), but they a bit high cost for that use.
  • 8 0
 APRIL FOOLS!!! We're just getting more e-bikes.
  • 3 0
 Just read up on the new Zerode Taniwha. Sounds like an amazing bike and a great drivetrain. Makes me want to get a gear box now, especially since it has a wider gear ratio then Sram's Eagle!!!
  • 2 0
 I break everything, however the only thing I have broken on my Taniwha in the 8 months I have had it is the Onyx hub. Love the thing and the twist shift is a non issue, dont even think about shifting which is exactly how you want it to be
  • 2 0
 I seriously don't understand point of this technology. Gear box will be replaced with light weight e-bikes that offer limited assist but act as mechanisms to provide infinite gears ranges with just one gear. I'm not opposed to e-bikes and think American are clueless on this infant technology.
  • 5 0
 Does it take 10w-30 or what?
  • 2 0
 more like 75.
10w-30 in fork lowers, tho Smile
  • 1 0
 I built a tournig bike for a customer with a Pinion gearbox two summers ago. I tried it a little and I think it was very good. So good in fact that I wanted to build my next trail hardtai with a C.12. But it is kinda expensive, so I'll stick with traditional 1x11 drivertrain Frown
  • 1 0
 I'm not against gearboxes, particularly with the potential benefits for suspension and handling performance. I just think they have some way to go before they are viable competition for derailleurs. What i really want though is an e-bike with a diesel generator to power the battery and a throttle.
  • 2 0
 I think Mike Kazimer wrote something last year about how Jesus would come to Pinkbike in the form of a gear box. A truer, more hilarious sentence as has ever been written on Pinkbike.
  • 1 0
 I'm just waiting the time when some companies (wheel manufacturers) make a upgrade to the nowadays motorized-frontwheels... I've seen on chinese page like Aliexpress some front whels with motor in their hubs, so you don't have to buy an entire bicycle, just put the motorwheel in your bike and take a ride, next day switch to the normal wheel an that's all...
  • 1 0
 @jordangraves: Not a new idea and still not as efficent as a standard drive, is the problem, try looking in to why we do not have sealed drive bikes, that is not a new idea, but reasons for that not existing is more to do with it making chains and sprockets would last too long
  • 1 0
 As of right now, gearboxes only make sense for dh bikes as they are too inefficeint right now. I do not think weight is a problem and will actually aid dh performance, and the bb is where weight is felt the least anyway. Find a way to make them as efficient as derralier bikes and how to attach to current frames and you have a winner
  • 4 0
 Zerode Taniwha all the ways!!!!!
  • 1 1
 This system is great for AM/DH style riding. Especially for new cut / low maintained trails. I would add some sort of crank arm locking design so you would have a fixed pedal/ foot peg like a motorcycle. Quick release and back to pedaling. Yes!
  • 1 0
 Ahh typical Pinkbike resposes. Everyone bashing a new technology. One that they have not even tried. I guess the automatic transmission in the car must be a problem for some of you.
  • 1 1
 Honestly, after riding the Pinion for a year, I think it's best to wait for the CVT version manuals are on their way out. I used to have a manual Outback, it was soooo tiring to drive with all the shifting, my new Outback has a CAT, now I can do other things: text, check Facebook, post on Pinkbike..........
  • 1 0
 Too expensive and very limited bike options. If they really want to sell these pinion bikes they need to send a demo bike to a bunch of bike shops. Def would like to demo one and would consider if the price was right.
  • 3 0
 When you take your gearbox bike out on the trail and everybody yells at you cause they think it's an e-bike....
  • 2 0
 When and if they get the gearbox right and when and if I can afford it.... I am sure it will be pretty sweet! Looking forward to trying a gearbox bike some day.
  • 1 0
 I think pinion could increase revenue and decrease costs by creating an ebike motor that fits their frames. That exploding market would get a bunch more frames on the market and then people could get gearboxes after market.
  • 1 0
 I would love to see this as an option on more bikes, but I can't imagine many manufacturers getting on board with this. That being said our current drive trains have been super refined and work really well.
  • 1 0
 Gearhubs are great - I ride my Rohloff Speedhub on all of my bikes and I LOVE IT! Since 2003! Tyler Klassen and Tarek Rasouli inspired me at this time to try it - NO REGRETS!
  • 1 0
 Yo, chill out, if you dont like something, dont support it. Its just a gearbox, its not gonna ruin your riding experience. Oh and f@&k ebikes
  • 4 1
 This article really grinds my gears.
  • 5 3
 Those puns get creaky sometimes...
  • 1 0
 @WAKIdesigns: gearbox are for drag queens
  • 1 0
 Would it be possible to hook up a trigger shifter or is the cable pulling ratio different than any Shimano, Sram, or Box shifters.
  • 2 0
 I think this uses a push/pull arrangement with two cables. So I don't think a trigger shifter will work as-is.
  • 3 0
 I'd like to try a gearbox/pinion before I talk shit
  • 2 0
 Best news I've heard all day!!
  • 1 0
 ok, now that they are available how do I put one on my banshee or tracer????
  • 2 0
 Yup, this is what I want to be riding.
  • 2 0
 Can I have a single speed pinion drive? :-p
  • 1 0
 Do they come standard with flappy paddle gear shifters? I want my flappy paddle gear shifters!
  • 1 0
 Is it good for cruising bike paths and riding on the beach? I just like how it makes my butt look Wink
  • 2 0
 If 1x hadn't happened, I'd probably be more interested in gearboxes.
  • 1 0
 Have they fixed the poor engagement, yet?
(a pair of freewheels in the gearbox and another freewheel in the hub make me sad)
  • 2 3
 Deraileurs work great if you take care of your bike is the simple fact of the matter. And anybody that can't take care of a bike with a derailleur will also find some way to not be able to take care of a bike with a gearbox.
  • 1 0
 perfect candidate for electronic shifting. Imagine just two buttons, one up one down. configurable any way you want it.
  • 3 2
 does it have an electrical motor no, don't want it .
  • 1 0
 do they work on full suspension bikes?
  • 1 0
 heavy, expensive, complicated. I'll get one for sure !
  • 2 0
 If only I had money
  • 2 1
 Might as well get a Yamaha
  • 1 0
 i want a Evil Wreckoning w/ the pinion gear box.
  • 3 0
 My Wreck is like 33.5 lbs, I can't imagine adding even more weight.
  • 1 0
 ..."by means of a twist grip" -/puts money back in wallet/-
  • 1 0
 Shimano DiGearbox will be the best!
  • 1 0
 Now everythings just looks like a session.
  • 2 0
 Nice one Pinion!
  • 2 2
 ''Pinion to enter US'' If Trump has read this he will now be busily building a wall.
  • 1 0
 maybe then can fix my gear box since day 1
  • 2 2
 I think Yamaha should put one of those e-motors on it! BOOM!
  • 1 1
 BMX IS SOOOO MUCH BETTER !! LOL
  • 1 0
 This is exciting!
  • 1 3
 I feel like I'm the only one who isn't excited about gearboxes. My 11spd stuff works great, and I have a paddle shifter.
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