Pinkbike Poll: What's Your Favorite MTB Suspension Design?

Jun 5, 2020
by Dan Roberts  

We're currently in the midst of some rather nerdy content at Pinkbike. Behind the Numbers is in full swing, taking a look at the suspension systems of five trail bikes and how the values and curves line up to the way the bikes ride. Our latest podcast got in-depth with bike setup and how our tech editors prefer to have their bikes working.

Some of you are evidently enjoying this down the rabbit hole approach to the geeky side of bikes. However, some of you think we should just go and ride our bikes. I'd like to say that we do both and am very grateful for the members of the industry, past and present, who like to chin scratch over the numbers and ride their bikes. Without them we wouldn't be where we are today and the bikes simply wouldn't be at the level they are, allowing you to extract as much fun as possible when you do go and ride. The whole 'just go ride your bike' argument for me is a little invalid.

Unfortunately then, for those amongst you who use that argument, this week’s poll is looking into suspension systems. I've had my head in them for the past four weeks and will do for the coming future so I'm dragging you in there with me.

Maybe this is my drum to beat, but engineering a bike is a practice in the art of balance. There are so many factors involved, each with their unique advantages and disadvantages when you tweak their individual dials that it makes plate spinning while juggling stood on one leg look like a doddle. It's not a check list that you work through, but more constant cycles of iteration that ever decrease in the adjustment size until either your deadline arrives or you sit back and know you've hit it bang on. If those two arrive at the same time then it's a jackpot.

Looking at just the suspension system, which our latest podcast touched on, you have so many factors all at work together. How the bike will compress the shock, how it will rebound, how it will react to acceleration and deceleration, different construction methods, pivot hardware, packaging for the rest of the components on the bike, the list is big. Even the cable routing can be a driver to defining a suspension layout!

Wwith each brand and individual having a different set of drivers to approach each project with, let alone opinions, experiences and environmental factors, it's simply no surprise that we have the vast array of designs out there that we do. I for one find it fascinating and love playing Sherlock Holmes to find out the reasons why certain bikes are the way they are.

Without further ado, we ask you, what's your favourite suspension system? And we've somewhat removed the marketing terms from the categories to see exactly the layout you like, or help you understand which bike is actually which layout.



Single Pivot
Example - Orange bikes

About as simple as a suspension system as you can get. But don't let that simplicity fool you into thinking the performance is lacking, quite the contrary. These bikes have a swingarm between the mainframe and rear axle with that swing arm also driving the shock.





Commencal Meta TR Ride review photo by Anthony Smith

Single Pivot Linkage Driven
Example - Commencal Meta TR

Still a single pivot, with a swing arm between the main pivot on the main frame and the rear axle, but now with a separate linkage system used to drive the shock. Same number of pivots as the four-bar bikes.





2020 Pinkbike Field Test Trek Top Fuel Photo by Trevor Lyden

Single Pivot with Concentric Rear Axle
Examples - Trek's ABP and Devinci's Split Pivot

Still a single pivot with a linkage driving the shock, but the difference comes when looking at the braking characteristics as the caliper is technically mounted on the seat stay and not the chain stay, like the other single pivot bikes.





Commencal Supreme DH 29 Review
Commencal Supreme DH 29 Review - non-driveside swingarm


High Single Pivot with An Idler
Example - Commencal Supreme DH bike

Still a single pivot, but now pushed so high that the amount of chain extension needs to be addressed with an idler pulley, changing the chain line. Most high single pivot bikes drive the shock via a pull style linkage tucked away between the swing arm and main frame.





Nukeproof Mega 275C review
Raaw Madonna V2 review

Long Link Four-Bar
Examples - Nukeproof Mega and RAAW Madonna

Now we disconnect the rear axle directly from the main frame, and introduce the instant centre. All the frame members, or bars, are long and usually this includes a Horst pivot doing the disconnecting between the main frame and rear axle. The Nukeproof drives the shock with a top mounted link and the RAAW uses a rocker link. You can also drive the shock using a bottom mounted link a la Specialized Stumpjumper.





Ibis Ripmo 2
Unno Dash review

Short Link Four-Bar, Co-Rotating
Examples - Ibis Ripmo and Unno Dash

If we push that Horst pivot, usually out by the rear axle, way closer to the main frame then we come to a short link bike. Still a four-bar system but now with two much shorter links connecting the rear triangle to the main frame. One differentiating point is that the links are rotating in the same direction.





Intense Primer S review Photo by Trevor Lyden

Short Link Four-Bar, Counter-Rotating
Examples - Santa Cruz and Intense bikes

Same as above but now the links rotate in opposite directions. The shock can be driven off either the top link or the bottom link.





Yeti SB140

Four-Bar with a Slider
Example - Yeti

Always an advocate for something slightly different, Yeti have been using sliding components to their suspension systems for a long time. Their latest Switch Infinity system has the rear triangle pivoting on a slider that moves up and down as the bike goes through its travel.





GT Fury Review

High Pivot Four-Bar with An Idler
Example - GT Fury DH bike

Still four bars, but if you so wish you can point the IC up real high compared to other four-bar systems. The same issue arises however as the high single pivot designs - you need to account for the huge chain growth with routing the main chain line higher up and closer to the high IC.





Spot Ryve 115 29 review
Spot Ryve 115 29 review

Four-Bar with a Leaf Spring
Example - Spot Ryve

Still technically a four-bar, but instead of the lower link pivoting at each end, Spot fix where it mounts the rear triangle and use a leaf spring idea to allow the movement.





Interbike 2017

Lawwill
Example - Old Rotec bikes

Back to the idea of the Horst pivot, but now the other seat stay pivot is dragged back close to the rear axle. Looks exactly like popular race car suspension systems, but the wheel and direction of travel is turned 90 degrees.





2020 Specialized Demo


Six Link
Examples - New Specialized Demo and Enduro and Atherton Bikes

Take a four-bar system, and then add a couple more links. In the case of the new Specialized Demo and Enduro, and Canyon Sender for that matter, the bike's instant centre is defined by the main four-bar system and then the shock is driven from a separate linkage system. So it's as linkage driven four-bar system, but with six links.

In the case of the Atherton bikes, the extra two bars are actually in between the chain stay and the main frame, essentially creating an instant centre for just the chain stay, which then is taken into account when calculating the instant centre of the whole suspension system. The shock is then driven by means of a rocker link. This is then a 6-bar system.






Hardtail
Just for a laugh

When this suspension system poll idea was trialled out at one of our daily Pinkbike meetings, hardtail came back as an answer. Me gusta, so it's in here as a cat amongst the pigeons.





What's your favourite suspension system?




353 Comments

  • 226 2
 All these articles do is reiterate how much I really don't know......

Before I read through the options I was hoping to answer with "coil"
  • 27 0
 i like the devinci wilson, best suspension
  • 7 0
 @pablopicasso1: I am on my second Wilson. I had a 2015 model and sold it. Went to a Pivot Phoenix, now back on a 2018 Wilson. Damn I love that bike.
  • 13 3
 @pablopicasso1: agree. The pedaling and braking characteristics of split pivot bikes like Devinci, Trek, and Orbea is great. Poppy playful suspension feel.
  • 39 0
 Clearly, PB readers most favourite MTB suspension design is the one that look best on "Huck to Flat".

If we pick one now, can we change our answer next year when some bike manufacturer again claims to come up with the newest and latest design?

Seriously, I'm sure most everyone will just pick the suspension that they know and ride, as I'm sure most people have not ridden more than half of these rear suspension designs...
  • 17 0
 @RowdyAirTime: nah man, I just picked hardtail because I haven't ridden enough different kinds of full suspension bikes to really have an opinion and I tend to ride my hardtail just as much as my squishy bike.
  • 13 0
 I wanted to answer,"the one on the bike I'm riding that day..."
  • 14 1
 @enis The lack of "Any system that has been well implemented and executed" as an answer shows how much a lot of people don't know.
  • 26 0
 there should have been an option that was "wat"
  • 2 1
 Lol!!!
  • 5 1
 I know they exist but have only ridden three to form an opinion.
  • 4 0
 @ninjatarian: idk if that is fair. you can for sure have a well executed single pivot, but if you are the kind of rider that likes lower levels of AR or progressive leverage ratios, then you are out of luck, those parameters are constrained. The multipivot bikes designs give you freedom to adjust those parameters drastically. But as you point out multipivot designs also have the freedom to alter AR and LR values drastically and its absolutely possible to design a terrible bike because you push the kinematics into some really weird territory. Its funny actually that the parameter range that has emerged are acceptable has been so close to just a well executed single pivot or linkage drive single pivot design.
  • 2 0
 @Foolcyclist: Which orbea bikes are split pivot bikes?
  • 4 0
 @clink83: Rallon and the Occam.
  • 3 1
 Whatever is on my Instinct in solid.. 4 bar something??? I guess I just do whatever Vanderham, Tippie, ALN and the rest of the RM Enduro team say is cool..
  • 1 1
 @pablopicasso1: I think it's a Horst link (long link 4 bar) turned upside down
  • 9 2
 Anyone else answer “Hardtail” because “I don’t know” wasn’t an option just to see the results?
  • 1 4
 @bman33: that's too bad..i really like Orbea bikes but a split pivot bike...eh...
  • 2 0
 @clink83: sounds like you don't like Orbea bikes then. Those are their most popular MTB's. My DH bike is a split pivot Devinci Wilson. Love it. I had a Troy a while back with a split pivot, also a great bike. What is your issue with split pivots?
  • 7 1
 I reviewed all the types and still not 100% sure which types my two bikes are.
  • 1 0
 @bman33: I had an Oiz and I was overall really really impressed with the bike, but since I have nerve damage in my hands getting beat up by a single pivot bike isnt so fun.
  • 1 1
 @clink83: single and split are two different animals. That said nerve damage can be frustrating
  • 1 0
 @bman33: The split pivot would fix some of what I didn't like about the Oiz, namely it turning into a hard tail under braking. You still end up with a ton of petal bob though...
  • 2 1
 No shoutout for redalp?
  • 75 1
 I like bikes
  • 21 3
 Bicycle, bicycle, bicycle I want to ride my bicycle, bicycle, bicycle I want to ride my bicycle I want to ride my bike I want to ride my bicycle I want to ride it where I like You say black, I say white You say bark, I say bite You say shark, I say hey man Jaws was never my scene And I don't like Star Wars!
  • 5 0
 Bike for life!
  • 53 0
 *sad URT noises*
  • 13 0
 What? No love for a design that only worked when your ass was on the saddle...?! #Pogo4Life
  • 17 0
 We blew it aha
  • 5 0
 @geephlow: yes! Unified rear triangle design i believe.. Like the original Rocky Mountain Pipeline
  • 3 0
 What would a Klein Palomino be? Half-URT? hURT?
  • 6 1
 @something979: the last GT i-Drive iteration was kind of a half URT.
  • 2 0
 @resinrider: I loved my Pipeline... That bike got me hooked on freeride and mt biking for life....
  • 1 0
 I had a fluro green Kona u'hu URT as my first ever bike. Sold it to someone to set up as single speed. Definitely went best sitting down.
  • 3 0
 They were going to add URT designs but their feet got blown of the pedals on the way back to the office and ended up in hospital.
  • 1 2
 @brianpark: no mention of vpp???
  • 1 0
 First full suspension was a Klein Mantra. Fast bikes standing, squishy while sitting. Harsh if you stood up going downhill.
  • 2 1
 @scottlink: They removed the marketing terms. VPP = Short Link Four-Bar, Counter-Rotating
  • 1 0
 @scottlink: he did. Short link 4 bar
  • 39 2
 Where’s the Four by Four from Knolly?
  • 18 3
 I'm guessing that would count under 6 bar.
  • 3 0
 Octo-Link. Unless you multiply..
  • 11 11
 In the bin
  • 12 4
 Knolly's FOURby4. Such an underrated suspension that's inspired by Formula 1 auto racing strut-style suspension.
  • 6 0
 I've tried a lot of different suspension designs and I can honestly say I am most impressed with the Knolly 4x4. I like the HSP w/idler on my Commencal Supreme and it would be fun to compare my Knolly Fugitive with a Forbidden Druid.
  • 6 0
 The new Enduro has more in common with 4x4 than it does with the Atherton bike. Both the Enduro and 4x4 utilize Horst link 4-bar designs to dictate axle path, with an additional parallelogram linkage to actuate the shock and dictate the leverage ratio. The Atherton bikes are using a short link 4-bar in conjunction with an additional Horst link that in combination dictate the axle path.
  • 3 1
 @thegoodflow: correct. Like I said below, Knolly, Specialized and the Sender are linkage driven horst links. The the axle path is defined by a standard horst link layout with the shock driven by another linkage instead of the rocker.

The Atherton bikes, with the DW6 link, actually use 6 links to define the axle path with 4 pieces connecting the BB to the rear axle as opposed to the 2 on a standard Horst link.
  • 2 1
 @five5hot: are you trying to throw in all the buzzwords? A strut, on bikes, could be said is used in the fork and was used by Maverick bikes, by the likes of Yeti 25 years ago, etc. A strut is where the suspension element is an essential structural component of the suspension layout. In cars it's used as the macphearson strut. It's used that way because it's cheap.

When racing cars you want to avoid that since you don't want huge loads in you precision suspension components. Look at the shocks (struts) used for wrc cars where the layout is used due to the requirements of the stock cars on which the race cars are based on.

As for formulas, mostly all of them these days use double wishbone suspension of some sorts with inboard shocks and springs. F1 uses essentialy solid mounted wheels (no pivots on the wishbones) and with torsion springs, one damper and torsion bar either corner of the car to handle roll and some shocks, they have additional heave springs and dampers on each axle to prevent the car from squatting under aero load, then they have inerters to minimize force spikes on the tyre tread surface to improve grip, the, and the can run the car without certain elements (no torsion bars or roll dampers for example), etc.

All this just to get a stable aero platform by keeping the car as constantly spaced from the road as possible.
  • 1 0
 @CaMKii: gotta take of my shoes to count all the bearings I need for a rebuild. I will say they did clean up the linkage on the Fugitive and newer frames.
  • 1 0
 @Primoz: They're definitely buzzy but I quoted "Inspired by Formula One auto racing strut-style suspension" directly from Knolly's website (first sentence of the second paragraph) www.knollybikes.com/copy-of-fourby4-suspension
  • 2 0
 @five5hot: ah, sorry for aiming my poop slinging at you when it should (rightly) be directed at marketeers.
  • 1 0
 @crazy9: nah , they last forever
  • 1 0
 I love my Endorphin.
  • 1 1
 @mattmatthew: Best trail bike I've ever owned. So well balanced, so capable. I'm anxiously awaiting the 2021 Endo Smile
  • 36 1
 All of this cool engineering and I just always go and buy the bike that looks the coolest.
  • 18 7
 Thanks for explaining why you voted hardtail
  • 1 0
 @kittenjuice: hard tails can look so bad ass.
  • 32 0
 Girvin flex stem!!
  • 4 0
 Someone is dating themselves lol
  • 17 0
 @Yaan:

That's all some of us have.

It's very hard to meet people in the time of COVID.
  • 2 1
 I think Girvin stems all got recalled in the early 90's, or was it Softride??? Hopefully both!.
How about Tomac's kevlar cord laced rear wheel "suspension" on his hardtail on the Mammoth Mountain Kamakaze?
Old school right there.
  • 2 0
 Slingshot!
  • 1 0
 @gtill9000: A desperate attempt to save weight. Classic example of theory vs practical.
  • 36 6
 Dwlink
  • 11 11
 Yeah...I'm pretty annoyed that they listed DW-Link, FSR & VPP & then just faux bar single pivot in those oddball categories.

All 3 have very specific patents that are the mainstays of mountain biking. During their patent phases, there was no way around any of them to get a bike to ride right. Faux bar is the only other thing to me.

Every other "design" is just a work around the 3 ways to make a mountain work right.
  • 24 3
 Yep, voted for the "Short Link Four-Bar, Co-Rotating" as that's technically what Weagle designed and patented. I have yet to ride a DW link bike that didn't pedal well while still remaining reactive and supple enough to feel compliant on the trail.
  • 10 3
 @pnwpedal: yep, dw link is amazing, I made the mistake of thinking maestro would be the same lol
  • 3 1
 @pnwpedal: My vote was for Maestro but I guess it's under the same as DW link?
  • 5 2
 @ctd07: Giants lawyers sure thought it was the same
  • 5 4
 @ctd07: Maestro was a knockoff of early early DW Link, and Dave has evolved the design a lot since then. I never rode one of the Giants though... How were they? Even the earliest DW Link bikes (Iron Horse IIRC?) rode really well for the time.
  • 4 0
 @hamncheez: I don't think it had anything to do with that. Dave tried to sue Giant
  • 3 2
 @pnwpedal: Giant still uses it. There’s a bit more flex from the lengthier bottom link, not enough to chew up bearings or anything though. Has the feel of being oversprung while pedaling but then opens up nicely on big hits and is noticeably smoother through high speed chop than single pivots, linkage activated or not.
  • 8 0
 @DHhack: Just got my first modern Giant (19 Trance Advanced 29). Pretty amazing bike, and I have had a bunch. Responsive pedaling yet balance and sensitive on the downs.
  • 2 0
 @pnwpedal: I had a 2014 Giant Trance with Maestro for a long while. I also owned a late model Turner DHR DW link. I will say I really liked the Giant, it did have a lot of similar properties to the DW link. Also the Turner was fantastic
  • 3 1
 @pnwpedal: I just pulled out my long-retired 2006 Iron Horse Azure and rode it yesterday. I swear that 1st-gen DW-Link is almost as good as a new-ish Ibis DW-Link I rode a few weeks ago.
  • 3 0
 @pnwpedal: I have a 2019 Trance Advanced Pro 29 0 and it's a great bike. The Maestro suspension is supple on the small bumps but still very supportive when pedaling, yet still opens up on the bigger hits.
  • 4 0
 @blowmyfuse: Annoyed that your major investment in a "so called next-level patented suspension design" turned out to be a modified 4 bar linkage? Ya, so sad. I'm sorry you overpaid for marketing hype.
  • 4 0
 @pnwpedal: Giant HIRED DW and paid him several hundred grand to develop Maestro - it was not a 'rip off'. And DW got his bottom smacked in an American court of law. But let's not let facts get in the way of the second most famous story about David versus the Giant - each had a different outcome.

Giant needed a new suspension platform after being sued by Specialized after Giant had developed NRS with Renault. They didn't want that headache again so they had to start anew - hence the creation of Maestro.
  • 3 2
 @iamamodel: you're half correct... Giant hired Dave as a consultant, reneged on the contract, and designed Maestro v1 on their own. Dave then sued, Giant out-lawyered him, and it was resolved behind closed doors with agreed upon media statements being released at the conclusion and nothing more (American legal system fail). Maestro v1 was not exactly what Dave designed, it included his concepts but was substantially revised by Giant.
  • 2 0
 @pnwpedal: you're both about half right. Giant didn't design Maestro on their own. But DW didn't design it completely at all. Giant canned him before completion and finished Maestro based on what he had already started
  • 2 1
 @jamesfoerman: dipshit, go smoke your own pole. Push your own chode ????
  • 24 2
 I am the suspension. Hardtail. Just like when I drove an old Mini, I was the crumple zone.
  • 1 0
 The crumple zone really made me chuckle LOL
  • 22 1
 Obviously, with all the complicated tech stuff, we all gravitate towards the hardtail.
  • 21 0
 26" steel hardtail is the only true option on pinkbike.
  • 1 1
 @faul: how dare you not mention bamboo bikes!! Big Grin
  • 3 0
 I just bought an XC hardtail race bike after 15 or so years on full suspension. It’s freakin’ awesome. It makes all the smooth boring trails exciting and it’s fast as f.
  • 3 0
 If it's not a penny-farthing you are doing it wrong.
  • 1 1
 Give me ht... Or give me... Roadie Big Grin
  • 1 0
 @bman33: You think bamboo is something... you should check out hardwood bicycles (such as Connor Wood Bicycles, ect.). Who says a bike can't be beautiful, and functional at the same time.
Big Grin
  • 20 0
 Clearly the answer is whichever allows the biggest water bottle to fit in the frame, duh!
  • 7 6
 Thanks for explaining why you voted hardtail
  • 1 0
 Sad but so true !!!
  • 17 1
 Who's actually tried them all?
  • 3 1
 most of these....i really like dw link, feels so crisp and sporty
  • 1 0
 @housem8d: also a fan of DW, but have only tried a few of the others
  • 1 0
 Missing only 3. Leaf spring, co rotating link and the hsp. Hsp was on the shopping table but went linkage driven SP instead in the end for alloy over carbon.
  • 3 7
flag ihatetomatoes (Jun 6, 2020 at 7:51) (Below Threshold)
 Owned and ridden an Evil (DW link). Giant (Maestro). Devinci (no idea). Transition ( Horst link so single pivot with linkage driven suspension?). Tries VPP and others.

Favorite is definitely the Horst link. DW link was definitely superior in performance but Horst link is definitely superior in fun factor. Worst was devinci and VPP.
  • 1 0
 @ihatetomatoes: Evils are delta links, not dw. Weagle designed them both, but they're different.
  • 2 0
 @toast2266: yup. It's a linkage driven single pivot, the Delta link.
  • 6 0
 I've worked industry/ shops for a long time. I keep an excel spreadsheet of my bikes. I've owned just over 70 high end full suspensions. I haven't tried all of these, but almost. I have zero preference. Give me a good modern rear shock and the bike will be just fine
  • 2 0
 @ihatetomatoes: devinci was DW as well forever
  • 4 1
 @alexisfire: DW as in Dave Weagle's design (Split Pivot), not as in DW-Link though.
  • 11 0
 I'd like to see PB generally describe the ride characteristics of each suspension platform. Perhaps even having a blind test would be interesting.
  • 2 0
 Comparisons are tricky because you can make two bikes with the same linkage design, ride totally different by moving a pivot a little bit. andrextr explains this here www.youtube.com/watch?v=78DD82fx4M8
  • 5 0
 @Aptlynamed: Similarly, you can make two different suspension designs ride the same by mapping the curves from one bike to another. It's the shape of the curves that matter most, not how you achieve them or the patent you're licensing. Patented suspension is for marketing more than it is for engineering. Just see all the people who blindly buy a DW, VPP, or Switch Infinity bike for no other reason than marketing.
  • 1 0
 @GTscoob: Yes, there can be tweaks that change the ride, but generally the same suspension platforms do have similar ride characteristics. I have owned a lot of VPP bikes and 4 link bikes as well. While each bike rode differently, they did have similar characteristics in pedal bob, brake jack, and ride characteristics. A general overview would be good because riders are not able to demo every suspension platform.
  • 5 1
 @tacklingdummy: Compare a modern Santa Cruz to one of their models from ~15 years ago. They're both VPP bikes, but almost every aspect of the suspension is different. The leverage ratios are completely different and the anti-squat and anti-rise numbers are totally different. The only thing they share is the basic layout of dual, counter-rotating short links. Simply knowing that the bike has a VPP suspension design doesn't really tell you anything about how the suspension actually performs (and even less about how the bike actually rides).
  • 1 1
 @toast2266: You are right the bikes from 15 years ago are totally different. I had the Santa Cruz Blur LT VPP from 2005 (7 Santa Cruz and Intense bikes) and it was totally different from the today. However, I'm not talking about comparing old iterations of VPP that nobody is using anymore. If you compare today's Intense VPP and Santa Cruz VPP they do ride different and have different suspension numbers, but they still have similar characteristics. I'm looking at the big picture. Some broad generalizations can be made with different suspension platforms.
  • 1 0
 @tacklingdummy: Ok, compare a 2020 Intense Primer and a 2020 Santa Cruz Tallboy. You (correctly) say they have different suspension numbers - the leverage ratios look totally different, the anti squat curves are substantially different, and the anti rise numbers are different. And like you said, they ride differently. The similar characteristic they have is that they're both full suspension mountain bikes. But making any generalizations about how they ride simply because they share an approximation of the same suspension design isn't useful at all.
  • 1 1
 @toast2266: The Primer and Tallboy have different travels. 20mm difference. 20mm is a lot in ride characteristics just in the amount of travel. I still think you can make some broad generalization on suspension design having ridden a ton of different bikes.

Anyway, agree to disagree. We are just spinning wheels in debate.
  • 2 0
 @GTscoob: this! this! this!

One thing Ive been learning to do is isolate systems from one another. It doesn't matter how your shock is driven, how many funny little weird links there are and how many pivots you have (which must be either 1 or 4, structurally i think, outside of shock links), all that matters is the path your axle draws.

how your shock is driven doesn't affect handling outside of progression and stiffness.
  • 7 0
 I honestly haven’t ridden enough of these to really say that I have a favorite.

I think I’ve demo’d a normal Horst link, DW link, and own a linkage driven single pivot. All of them have felt fine honestly. Maybe if the demos were for more than 30min I’d have a stronger opinion.

So far as long as the anti squat values are high enough, and the suspension is setup correctly for the bike and my weight... they all let me get out there and enjoy the ride. Which is really all I care about so far.
  • 9 0
 A horst, a hardtail and a Lawill walk up to a six bar...I can't think of a punchline.
  • 43 0
 The Barman says...

"I asked for 3 good bouncers tonight!

I've got one that will stay in their seat at the rear, one that will sue me as soon as they sense trouble, and finally - one that can't do squat!"
  • 6 0
 I think it would be interesting to do an equivalent to the “huck to flat test” but a “smash through roots test”. To be able to see how the wheel and linkage move while hitting square edge type obstructions would be cool! With max tire pressure!
  • 5 0
 How about with no tires whatsoever - remove that variable completely!
  • 6 1
 So the best performing rear suspension I've ever ridden were on single pivot, linkage driven, but I haven't tried these high pivots except for the Canefield Jedi, but it wasn't long enough to say anything about (also, where is the dual link high pivot option like the canfield jedi)?

Also, what about riding type/style? What works for DH isn't necessarily going to be the best for XC.

I'm super curious about the GT. My brain says that the host+high pivot would theoretically ride DH the best, but I haven't ridden one.
  • 3 0
 I'm not in the market for a DH bike (dad life) but if GT came out with a High pivot w idler Horst link AM/Enduro bike, I'd be all over that.

@GTBicycles Make make me that bike with
- a 20-25% progressivity
- AS that stars around 130% hits 100% at sag, then drops into the 50-60%s a full,
- a nice flat AR curve anywhere between 50-80%
- a Rear axle path that tracks about the same as the fork

Plz Ty
  • 1 0
 @freestyIAM: I'll make you one, but only titanium
  • 5 0
 very interesting but this article assumes a lot of prior knowledge which I am lacking. Can someone please tell me what the four bars are actually? On the long four bar system, are these meant to be left and right chain and seat stays?

And what is meant with single pivot? No pivots allowed in between "main" pivot and shock mount?

What is meant by concentric rear axle? is the axle itself also a pivot between chain and seat stays? If so, wouldn't that mean it's no longer a single pivot?
  • 4 0
 Single pivot refers to the fact that between the rear axle and front triangle, there is only one pivot. This means that there is none of the "instant center" mumbo jumbo, and that the main pivot is the center of rotation for the rear wheel. The way I look at it, the way the chainstay is determines where the rear wheel travels, and the seatstays determine the way the wheel is moving (the speed of the pivot's rotation). most linkage driven bikes require a pivot somewhere on the seat stay, as the shape of the rear triangle must change for the suspension to travel properly.

As said above, linkage driven single pivots need both a direct connection between the rear wheel and main pivot through the chainstay, as well as a pivot on the seatstay. Concentric rear axles accomplish both these things by keeping a direct connection from wheel to chainstay, and a pivot between the rear axle and seatstay.
  • 4 0
 The "bars" comes from dynamics terminology in mechanical engineering. Basically you flatten the bike into a plane and count the structural pieces between each of the pivots. So the four bars are: The front triangle, the chain stay, the seat stay, and then a rocker link. Of course there is some inherent confusion with this because strictly speaking linkage single pivot is also a 4 bar system, but we've decided in common usage to refer to that as faux-bar and not four bar, because the axle path is only governed by a single link.
  • 2 0
 @ZappBrannigan: Cool, thanks for explaining. I was indeed confused about why linkage driven single pivot was not a four bar.
  • 3 0
 @Thelittleweasel: Ah ok, so the single pivot refers of the pivot count between frame and rear axle (not shock mount).

And what is concentric is the center of the rear axle and the center of a pivot, I think I get it.
  • 2 0
 @ZappBrannigan: This is a better explanation than everything that was included in the above article. Thanks
  • 1 0
 @SunsPSD: Happy to help Smile
  • 1 0
 This would best be answered via imagery or a google search. If you use the words bar and linkage interchangeably it may make more sense. The suspension designs are a two dimensional concept with each bar (linkage) connected by pivots (two and three bar linkages do not permit movement). Fundamentally for a functional suspension design you need either 4 linkages, 2 linkages and a 2 piece slider, or one free floating linkage, and at least one linkage must be "stationary" and at least one linkage must have a spring/damper attached to it. Between changing the lengths of linkages and relative position of where the axle is, and the position of where the pivots are relative to the bottom bracket you end up with all of the different suspensions designs in existence. A concentric rear axle rotates around the same center as the bottom bracket, and eccentric one is offset or does not follow a circular axle path. (i.e. "S" curve or "J" curve).
  • 5 1
 While it's been a long time since I've ridden a bike with bad suspenstion, and other designs do certain things quite a bit better, Treks ABP is still my favorite for it's consistency. Just never seem to be surprised by it whether I'm riding my best or having a bad day. Pedals well under power as well. I only own hardtails and a Santa Cruz VPP, but my next bike is probably a trek unless I can try the new CBF suspension design on revels and canfields. Seems like it could have the same qualities I like in a Trek with even more benefits.
  • 2 2
 Same here...I've always enjoyed Trek's ABP, Split-Pivot or DW-Link the best. Trek just packages it the best...their aesthetics game is on-point. I'd like to try a Canfield, but hot damn thats an ugly bike.
  • 2 0
 @SvenNorske: how dare you ?! you are gonna get some hate from the canfield legion !!!.. seriously though, tastes are not to be disputed but a raw alloy canfield balance...come on....
  • 8 0
 I thought the hardtail option was a joke yet its the highest...
  • 11 0
 Well, there isn’t 15 variations of a hardtail....
  • 4 0
 Look up Simpsons Paradox.
  • 6 0
 I've been drinking the Canfield Balance Formula and high single pivot w/idler Kool-Aid lately. The Tantrum Missing Link was pretty intriguing too.
  • 3 0
 Yeah, there was just something about that Canfield Balance that I haven't found since! Is the CBF technically a short link 4 bar with co-rotating links?
  • 3 0
 @kylar: I think so. I just bought a Balance and it's unreal to ride. I've never ridden a bike with more traction and composure. The back tire literally feels like it's stapled to the ground
  • 2 0
 @BlackVR: Thanks! Now I can vote.

I also remember just hucking it into anything. "Whatever, bikes got this!"
  • 1 0
 @BlackVR: cool - glad to hear. Just picked up a Rail. Can't wait.
  • 2 0
 @kylar: CBF can be any of these setups. It is a formula. But Canfield and Revel are both short link 4 bar with co-rotating links.
  • 6 0
 I went with six bar because I like my Knolly Warden and I think that's where it would fit
  • 3 0
 Single pivot with concentric rear axle -- might have been helpful to have a photo of the brake side, since that's where the main difference seems to come from. I'm not quite understanding the description -- seems like all brakes are mounted on the seat stays.
  • 5 0
 Think of a FSR type suspension with the rear triangle pivot on the chainstay. Now move the pivot so that it’s concentric with the rear axle. That’s Trek ABP, Weagle Split Pivot, etc. The torque applied at the brake caliper is resolved at the rear axle pivot, so the suspension doesn’t stiffen up under braking.
  • 1 0
 I’m also struggling to understand this one. (But I’m simple, I ride an Orange)
  • 2 0
 @lewiscraik: Think I understand it now. Instead of the rear triangle being one piece, the chain stays and the seat stays join in a pivot at the axle. I know Kona has this type of suspension, and that’s what it looks like to me. Also thanks to @tbmaddux for the explanation. Far better than they thing about brakes they have in the description. As I said, aren’t all brakes mounted on the seat stay? That bit made no sense.
  • 1 0
 @TheR: Rear triangles that aren’t one piece are common... for example you’ll see it on FSR (Horst Link) bikes which are much more common than the article suggests, now that the patent has expired.
  • 2 0
 @tbmaddux: I know, but I'm talking about what makes a single pivot with concentric rear axle, as opposed to a simple single pivot. A Horst Link bike by definition wouldn't be a single pivot, and wouldn't have a one-piece rear triangle. My Turner's rear triangle is one piece, as are Yeti's and Santa Cruz, but I understand why those aren't single pivots. It was this concentric rear axle thing that confused me.
  • 10 7
 Pinkbike: there’s no conspiracy against evil

Also Pinkbike: what’s your favorite suspension design other than the delta link?


Anyways, mine is the delta and whatever the single pivot with the lever than my nicolai and clashes, jeffsys, etc have
  • 18 0
 the delta link would fall under linkage driven single pivot. It is a much more complicated linkage then most but still just a single pivot
  • 1 0
 @mtmc99: isn't it also very similar to the original Commencal meta?
  • 2 0
 @mtmc99: I don't see anything complicated about the Delta-Link to be honest. I find Evil bikes very, VERY appealing, both in numbers and looks, but the "Delta-Link"-Term seems very markentingish to me. It's nothing more than a linkage driven single pivot after all...
  • 6 1
 Faith restored at hardtail being the top answer, keep the 'fun' in our sport please
  • 4 0
 Since I didn’t have an answer I selected hardtail. Simplicity is bliss. All suspension system work great with right geo, good quality craftsmanship and materials.
  • 1 0
 You put down to words everything i'm thinking right now man...
I love me ole school geo ht, so fun and poppy. But a basic full susser is on me want list, riding ht can be brutal for us chronically ill dudes, hence a nice fs to help stay on mtbing. The hyper viking trail looks like an excellent entry, very upgradable, best part... Genuine hydroformed frame, very well made/finished, setup 1 by 8 out of the box, all for $398 cdn. Big Grin
  • 2 0
 My favorite had been the other 6 bar. Felt's Equillink suspension.

It felt similar to the short-link co-rotating four bars with less sag point sensitivity. (I don't see it on their website anymore,I guess they dropped it this year).
For those unfamiliar, it looked like the short link designs but had rear triangle that was flexible and added an extra link connecting the upper and lower links so it had an extra degree of tuning.
  • 1 0
 I agree with you. Man i'm still riding the Felt Compulsion 26 from 2013. Still one of the best climbing bikes I have even with 40-50% sag LOL.

The suspension simply works. It is either i get the compulsion 2020 or a Yeti. next.
  • 3 0
 Lawwill just cos it looks cool and I always wanted one back when Yeti used it for their DH bikes. No idea how it rides, easy to maintain or anything else. It just makes me feel 15 again!
  • 2 0
 After selecting one I had "buyer's remorse" and thought maybe I should have picked something else.

What's far easier for me is to select my least favourite!!! The Unified Rear Triangle. Never rode one that I thought was even OK. They were all terrible. Guess that's why I haven't even seen one in about 15 years (maybe more).
  • 2 0
 The most popular suspension system has surely got to be the telescopic fork as fitted to the front of pretty much every single mountain bike for the last 25 years. That's a pretty major omission from the poll. You could also argue that pneumatic tyres are a suspension system.
  • 2 0
 Head tube suspension... Cannondale!
  • 5 0
 One that keeps me rubber side down.
  • 1 8
flag kittenjuice (Jun 5, 2020 at 15:31) (Below Threshold)
 Thanks for explaining why you voted hardtail
  • 4 0
 @kittenjuice: dam the echo just keeps going!
  • 5 0
 Are we just going on looks here?
  • 4 1
 I've ridden just about all the different designs. I prefer a DW Link, But the Chris Currie 3VO suspension design is so good. Too bad Jamis can't market the bike well
  • 1 0
 I'm pretty happy with my Portal.
  • 1 0
 If the 3VO bikes didn’t say Jamis on them, they’d probably get a decent amount of hype. They certainly ride well.
  • 5 1
 All those options and when I voted hardtail was the most popular. Also didnt help thats what I voted
  • 5 1
 Voted that too. I like that hardtails behave pretty predictable. No sudden geometry changes, no rebound to fine tune etc. It just always works as advertised. You just never get that with a full suspension design.
  • 1 0
 @vinay: I just like it because its simple. My old giant trance could haul but downhill was very planted and predictable. My aggro hardtail is nice and reliable climbing just deal with the rear tire bouncing around. Also I am a Clyde and jump and ride aggressively the ragley mmmbop is good with a 160mm fork and 63° headtube angle. Was tired of bad climbing and shocks and bearings going out
  • 4 0
 My favourite suspension system is my arms and legs. It can be a real challenge to float over a hardtail. Good times
  • 1 5
flag kittenjuice (Jun 5, 2020 at 15:33) (Below Threshold)
 Thanks for explaining why you voted hardtail
  • 3 0
 @kittenjuice: it's the echo again
  • 1 0
 @brncr6: it's like the gad dang Grand Canyon in here!
  • 1 0
 @SoddenDeath: Helloooooooooooooo
  • 3 0
 Some other configurations:

-Flex triangle: early Cannondale scalpel
-Single pivot with a flex rear triangle: Yeti ASR, Kona hei hei
-Pull-shock: Cannondale Jekyll
  • 1 0
 Weren't the pull shock Cannondales linkage driven single pivots?
  • 1 0
 Short Link Four-Bar Co-Rotating like DW-Link are my favourite. Short Link Four-Bar Counter-Rotating Like VPP and Long Link Four-Bar like FSR and the 4ByFour are next. Not a huge fan of Single Pivots and Single Pivot Linkage Driven Designs. The rear axle needs to be separated from the main frame
  • 2 0
 So nearly no one wanted a hardtail as their one and only bike for the rest of their life, but hardtail is the most popular suspension design of pinkbike? Ok - we have a collective case of cognitive dissonance!
  • 4 0
 please realize that if you add all the full sus votes together its much larger than hard tail.
  • 4 0
 Regressive single pivot! Cannondale Prophet ftw... old school because I've got no cash pool. I do like the ride
  • 4 0
 What about that MacPherson strut bike with the Fox 40 stanchion coaxial to the top tube?
  • 1 0
 The one that hasn't been invented yet but when it is it will make most of these seem like URT's in terms of performance. There has to be a fundamentally different way to do it that is completely different. Think outside the box. Think outside of the swingarm.
  • 4 0
 Corona virus is a pretty good design. Suspended riding for a couple months at least.
  • 2 1
 This is a weird way to characterize different suspension designs. We don’t need more catergories than we already have.
Also, some noticeable players missing, like Canfield (multiple), Delta... not sure what else.
Not sure why this “poll” exists other than to see what’s hot in the public’s eye, which has nothing to do with the actual quality of various suspension designs. I know I just voted for what I currently ride.
  • 1 0
 My favorite look is the new vpps with the current shock at the bottom of the frame. But a bike is more than looks. It is the sum of it's part. I am looking forward for a new 5010 with the shock in the bottom. Just for looks. I tested a couple bikes last year and my favorite suspension platform and fit of the bike was the Ibis Ripley. To bad my legs are to shorts for 29rs. Finger crossed for a 27.5 or mullet version of the Ripley. I rode Mojo but I didnt like the feel. It felt different, not just the tire size.
  • 1 0
 Not sure of the value of this poll other than entertainment since we'd need to have ridden all suspension types in the same conditions, on bikes with similar geo and the same components, in the same time period with enough frequency to be statistically relevant, otherwise I assume most people would just vote for whatever suspension they have on their current bike. What would be amazing is to see all platforms tested by an independent lab for all of the variables that make a difference, along with the compromises and trade-offs of each platform. I imagine that would put a dent in a few manufacturers sales though. Anyway, the answer is obviously, Hardtail.
  • 1 0
 My 4-bar linkage is...Ummmm...whatever that patented horst linkage system that Specialized had for their Stumpjumper, Camber, and Enduro setup for about 10 years and where Rocky Mountain and a bunch of others tried to copy same principle but the only implementation difference was the rear triangle linkage is higher or lower for the rear pivots. Taking a look at all the suspension designs, I'd take the single pivot over any of them just for the sake of simplicity of the maintenance.
  • 1 0
 Well to be honest I’ve only ridden about 4 of these. My two favorites so far are single pivot (yep I like those) and short link counter rotating 4 bar or VPP. I like the way the VPP feels “locked in” when you pedal hard. I absolutely don’t like whatever Specialized does and I feel like sprinting is hard on my friends Transition scout. Those last two may just be because the Spec. Bikes that I’ve ridden have all been rentals and my friend’s Scout is setup for him. But single pivot simplicity is nice and when well executed does the deed.
  • 4 0
 What would the Kona Magic Link be?
  • 8 4
 wHat Ab0uT na1Ld R3ACT 2PLAY sUSp3ns1oN sYST3m?
  • 4 1
 where the hell is propain with their very interesting full floating, compressed on both sides shock?
  • 2 0
 Counter rotating short link 4 bar
  • 5 1
 Hardtail--FTW!

For The Win
F&%k The World
Frank The Welder
  • 2 0
 Aggression! Fuck yeah!
  • 1 1
 I currently have 2x linkage driven single (one flex seat stay, one one piece rear triangle), DW 4 bar, long link 4 bar, counter rotating 4 bar, and hardtail. After tuning the suspension to my liking, the DW has the edge by a little, but it also has the highest anti squat. If the others had as high a.s. it might be a draw. I do not fear chain growth.
  • 4 0
 Pick a suspension design and be a dick about it!
  • 1 0
 Well being that I ride a short 4 bar counter rotating I picked that but wish I could try em all. The split pivot still seems like a really cool concept by eliminating brake influence without a floating brake.
  • 1 0
 My friend had a Trek (forgot model and year) that had a full floater suspension design. This design was used by Suzuki motorcycles with great results. Why did Trek stop using it?
  • 3 0
 Whichever one permits me to carry a water bottle inside the front triangle tbh.
  • 1 0
 Either way you need the “white plastic dog cone” double blind placebo. If you could hide what your riding I doubt anybody could tell what they are riding other than the the hard tail.
  • 1 1
 I've had an opportunity to ride most of these bikes, or bikes with similar linkages. I will say hands down the four link with slider i.e. the Yeti linkage is by far the most efficient and best feeling. Is there a little more maintenance over time with this style linkage? Yes, but it by far feels the best. It's the most efficient for pedaling, putting more power directly to your rear wheel while still allowing the suspension to work in your favor. Also has a somewhat bottomless feel as you move through the suspension. On most of the other linkage designs you most certainly feel things start to bind up towards the end of your shock stroke. This does not happen on the Yeti's.
  • 1 0
 Marketing people of the cycling industry still have plenty of glory days in front of them...! ????????

For those who like a bit of facts / science, have a read here:
www.i-tracksuspension.com/suspensiontheory.html
  • 1 0
 After dealing with squeaky loose pivots in a 4 bar system I went back to a single pivot 15 years ago and stayed with it. So much less to maintain with out glacier silt filled rivers.
  • 3 0
 Grabbing popcorn and a beer.....
  • 1 0
 Omg I was just gaining insight about different suspension platforms and curious what's what in suspension kinematics. Lovely article!
  • 4 0
 Why is yeti a four-bar?
  • 1 0
 Wondering that myself.
  • 1 0
 Yeah, I am also interested to learn more about this.
  • 2 0
 The lower link is "infinitely long", according to Yeti.
  • 4 0
 Because it is. It moves on four elements.

The slider acts as an infinitely long link (hence Switch Infinity). Imagine the pivot in the middle of the slider is the rear end of this link and the other end is infinitely far in front of (or behind) the bike, perpendicular to the axis of the sliders. Same function, but a lot more compact than an infinitely long link!
  • 3 0
 Think of the Switch Infinity slider as acting like an infinitely long link (hence the name) mounted way out in front of the bike. Then you can calculate IC, anti-squat and -rise, etc. just like a four-bar.
  • 2 0
 @ethanshredz: Whoa, same wavelength, apparently.
  • 1 0
 The lower pivot of the rear triangle moves up-and-then-down as the suspension moves through its travel. You could imagine this pivot point being attached to a link that first co-rotates and then counter-rotates relative to the upper link, to get similar motion through the travel. This is the "Switch" part of the name. But if you want purely linear translation, rather than translation along an arc, your "link" needs to be infinitely long, instead of short like DW Link or VPP. This is the "Infinity" part of the name
  • 1 0
 Their original 303 had two of those. Indeed if you draw a short part of a circle around a midpoint very far away, it is pretty much a straight line. It doesn't take much more to just make that section perfectly straight and consider the midpoint (pivot) infinitely far away.
  • 2 2
 It's pretty similar to a DW link except it has a slider instead of a pivot. If you are cynical you could say it's to get around patents
  • 2 2
 Lol@ the downvoted. There is only so many ways you can make a 4 bar suspension before you start infringing on someone's patent.
  • 3 0
 Where does Giant's Maestro fit?
  • 3 0
 Short co-rotating Link, like DW technically... same same but different
  • 2 0
 @SonofBovril: Exactly. The majority of the differences between suspension configurations is the choice of how they're tuned, not something intrinsic to the layout.
  • 1 0
 It's the leaf spring thing without leaf
  • 1 0
 The only difference is Giants lawyer team was bigger than Dave's...
  • 3 0
 how about the supercaliber
  • 1 0
 Single pivot AFAIK.
  • 3 0
 the bmx'er in me wants to say elbows and knees
  • 1 0
 the hardtail rider in me wants to say the same
  • 1 0
 the idiot who crashes in me also wants to say the same
  • 1 0
 If the short-link four-bars get link rotation differentiation, then why don't the long-link four-bars get that distinction? Why not the linkage-driven single-pivots?
  • 4 0
 Maverick?
  • 2 0
 Pink bike pole
Should we give the 2020 rocky mnt slayer a 2nd chance and a proper review?
  • 6 0
 It's funny you mentioned Pole.
  • 2 0
 Thudbuster + Girvin Flexstem ^ 3" Gazzaloddi = Ultimate suspension setup. Surprised this didn't make it into the poll.
  • 1 0
 Just what would you this "system"?
  • 3 0
 Hardtail, ha ha ha, I love my hardtail but my rear pivots need surgery.
  • 2 0
 Yup knees need rebuilt with replacement pivots here.
  • 1 0
 Yup, riding a hardtail too hard for too long has left me with peroneal tenosynovitis & peroneus brevis tendinopathy in my right foot. Bit of a bummer. There's an argument for not passing so much force through to the body to be absorbed by our own linkages. Love riding my hardtail, it's a beauty, but I'll likely be forced onto a full boinger soon. Cue the violins.
  • 1 0
 @SoddenDeath: worlds smallest violins playing your song now.
  • 1 0
 @scotttherider: a violin is a violin, no matter the size...
  • 1 0
 @SoddenDeath: I’m aware. I played the instrument for 6 years....it’s a sarcastic comment we say in the states. If someone’s complaining we rub two fingers together and say well here’s the worlds smallest violin playing your sad song.
  • 1 0
 @scotttherider: understood, i have heard that one before... can’t remember if it was over here or in Canada though.
  • 1 0
 @SoddenDeath: probably both.
  • 4 0
 Knolly 4ByFour!
  • 1 0
 I got confused , so I pulled out my shock and installed a solid bar of HDPE in its place . Maybe it’s the first rigid DW link evil ? Should be fun to compare strava times .
  • 1 0
 Four bar with a leaf spring is not a four bar at all. It s a unified rear triangle with 2 corotative link. Giant Maestro for exemple.
  • 1 0
 Whenever there is a PB pole I bet on which will get the least or most votes and then vote according. Its a great lockdown game!
  • 1 0
 have had many but not all of those so unqualified to answer in detail but my fave of those ive had is 4 bar. bet you're all thrilled as fuck to know that right
  • 4 2
 Which one does Evil bikes fit into... or...?
  • 18 0
 They use a linkage driven single pivot design.
  • 4 2
 DELTABRO
  • 2 1
 @green727 : I guess its Single pivot linkage driven or single pivot with virtual pivot point to shock ?
Aggghhh what do I know about bikes , just want to ride Wink
  • 4 0
 @mikekazimer: This poll needs another poll under it, Poll A: which suspension design do you like best, Poll B:what suspension design to you want to try most.

Because long link 4 bar and VPP is all ive ever ridden but I'd really like to try this high pivot craze!
  • 2 1
 they fit into Awesome
  • 1 0
 after riding 4 bars for around 25 years and going to a High Pivot with an idler, I won't buy/ride anything else.
  • 5 6
 Enduro and Sender are NOT six-bars. And quite different than DW-link 6, which isn't really a 6-bar either. Don't lump them together, and don't make up new categories.

Downcountry was bad enough, don't make "6-bar" happen.
  • 2 0
 That one. No, not that one. That one.
  • 1 0
 Which one of these would propain's pro10 system be? Short link four bar counter rotating?
  • 1 1
 Craftworks ENR high pivot co-rotating. It's missing from the list. www.craftworkscycles.com/pages/what-is-i-track-suspension
  • 1 0
 Shame it was a 142mm rear end. Would of had a buyer.
  • 2 0
 DW Split Pivot or whatever category you throw it into... tup
  • 3 0
 Single Pivot with Concentric Rear Axle Examples - Trek's ABP and Devinci's Split Pivot
  • 2 0
 What category would be Knolly be in?
  • 2 0
 Linkage driven upper pivot long link four bar.
  • 3 0
 Six bar... The new Enduro actually has more in common with the knolly 4x4 than it does with the Atherton
  • 3 0
 @thegoodflow: it's exactly the same and neither knolly or specialized are six link. These are actually, but linkage actuated long link 4 bar designs. A classical horst link with another linkage driving the shock. Same goes for the Sender.

The Atherton bikes actually have 4 pieces between the BB and the rear axle, while a Horst link design has two.
  • 1 0
 Def have not ridden enough bikes to really know my answer, but I have a commencal so single pivot!
  • 2 0
 The new Enduro isn't 6-bar. It's an fsr linkage, straight up.
  • 1 1
 I wish there were more single pivot options Like Orange where you have just one lot of bearings to worry about through the winter months.
  • 1 0
 So take a Spot link add a Cannondale scalpel chainstay, maybe a high idler and Fox live. Go fast have fun?
  • 1 0
 Aesthetically the 6 bar - but I can't say I've even had the chance to try most of them.
  • 1 0
 Lol, the bias here is that people choose what they know. Clearly hardtail being a winner proves this is the case. Smile
  • 2 0
 @dan-roberts you forgot McPherson strut ! Maverick Smile
  • 1 0
 I don't have a clue to be honest lol. I have a Scot gambler and specialized Enduro. Both feel great to me
  • 1 0
 Linkage driven high single pivot all the way!! Great job bringing that tech back from the 90s Hsp absolutely rips!
  • 1 0
 Miss my Freedrive! Favorite design to date, shared the patent with GT on later variations of their I-drive. Simply genius!
  • 2 2
 For dh racing, 4 bar, for park and messing around, vpp, for Enduro, 4 bar, for xc, single pivot.
  • 1 6
flag kittenjuice (Jun 5, 2020 at 15:33) (Below Threshold)
 Thanks for explaining why you voted hardtail
  • 5 0
 @kittenjuice: thanks for repeating the same joke 25 times!. I finally got it.
  • 2 0
 @kittenjuice: and going!
  • 1 0
 Dw link love it on the ibis mojo 3 and ibis Ripmo
  • 1 0
 High pivot with a full floater BB. #ImissmySanction Frown
  • 2 0
 Why no softail design?
  • 1 0
 Ibis Bow-Ti
  • 2 1
 Who are the 5 people that voted for the leaf spring??? LOL
  • 2 0
 hey now, leaf springs are people too
  • 1 3
 LOL you don't know shit about suspensions LOL
  • 2 0
 I love lamp.
  • 2 0
 Transition SBG
  • 1 0
 Loved the giddy up on my patrol
  • 1 0
 No votes for Kona magic link?
  • 2 0
 It's a six-bar. Not that anyone is going to read this all the way down here, but the Specialized Enduro isn't a six-bar, it's a four-bar with an additional shock linkage.
  • 2 0
 Weren't those universally accepted as the worst idea ever? Always locking while going down and opening while pedalling. Had a horrible mind if their own.
  • 1 0
 Anyone know what kind the old Giant DH Comp was...
  • 1 0
 Would think that’s a linkage driven single pivot if you’re talking about circus 2004-6ish.
  • 2 0
 Grim Donuts...
  • 1 2
 Short Link Four-Bar, Counter-Rotating? Huh. Seems like a lot of off-shoots. Hardtail, Single Pivot, Four Bar, FSR and VPP are the general choices.
  • 1 0
 Green bike in Friday fails.
  • 1 0
 I appreciate the way they name each categories!
  • 1 0
 Lawwill... Schwinn Straight 8, Yeti DH8/DH9, Rotec
  • 1 0
 Never wrapped my pea brain around these designs. Cool review though.
  • 1 0
 What about the Supercaliber? Single pivot slider?
  • 2 2
 All these peasants out here bangin around on hardtails. Get a back shock ya ding dongs.
  • 1 0
 How did I know 'hardtail' would win as most popular linkage system?
  • 2 1
 Maybe because a list of 12 shit-driven-dick-linked-counter-rotating-no-forward-rotating-alien-controlled-filled-with-too-many-things-that-could-fail items just made your head explode, like mine?
  • 1 0
 1100 people are lying :LOL:
  • 1 0
 Fat bike, fat tires. Should have made the list. Not the same as hard tail.
  • 1 0
 Gotta love those undamped springs!
  • 1 0
 I love my own design:)
  • 1 0
 still a fan of giants maestro suspension,, works for me,
  • 1 0
 Anything with Dave Weagle's name on it.
  • 1 0
 But I have an evil with DELTA link and it's different than dw link which is different than split pivot which are all dave weagle designs
  • 1 0
 I'll take the 12 Bar Blues please in Eb

Which ever works. ))
  • 1 0
 Urt, you missed that junk I had a orange x1 maybe the worst bike ever
  • 1 0
 Man I wish balfa made a comeback! Or ironhorse!
  • 1 0
 Lol all the poor people answering hardtail
  • 1 0
 how can you vote??? Ya havent ridden em all!
  • 1 0
 Curious where a canfield would fall under???
  • 1 0
 What ever suspension is on the bike that I spent my college savings on lol
  • 1 0
 No love for Felt's 6 bar? One of the best pedaling platforms out there.
  • 1 0
 It’s Based on whatever’s looks the coolest when bottomed out
  • 1 0
 Whatever my Bottlerocket is.
  • 1 0
 4 Links like 97 Kona Stinky
  • 1 0
 What abouth the Propain Pro-10 linkage?
Which suspension design uw that?
  • 1 0
 Specialized is not a sixlink.
  • 1 0
 which one is the dual suspension? that's what I like.
  • 1 0
 Personal favorite, the Mongoose Freedrive, specifically on the Teocali !
  • 1 0
 Regardless of suspension design, our legs seem to work the best!
  • 1 0
 I put hardtail just because I don't even know which one I own know..
  • 1 0
 I like squish squish
  • 1 2
 The one that's locally made, on sale, in my size. All suspension systems work good nowadays.
  • 1 1
 So the lawwill is kinda like an eminent? Right?
  • 3 0
 No the eminent is kind of like a Lawwill/Rotec.
  • 1 0
 What’s a bar?
  • 10 0
 The place where everyone knows your name.
  • 1 0
 @asf: beautiful answer
  • 1 0
 Multi-loop anyone?
  • 1 0
 One that works
  • 1 0
 Uh............
  • 1 0
 BIKES!
  • 1 0
 Knolly 4 X 4
  • 1 0
 Rotec
  • 1 0
 Yes.
  • 1 0
 Iso-strut
  • 1 1
 Specialized is hideous
  • 2 0
 I like the look personally but if you like to manual that design would not like you
  • 1 0
 @Bikerdude137: Good heads up man, I do try from tile to time Wink Why is that? Which design is regarded to be the best?
  • 2 0
 @arthom: Well the design just pushes the chainstay out so it becomes very long
That would make it difficult to manual

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