Polaris Debuts Fox Live Valve Electronic Suspension - Coming to Bikes Soon?
Polaris RZR XP Turbo Dynamix UTV debuts Fox Live Valve electronic suspension.
Fox invited me up to Scotts Valley, California, to ride their Live Valve electronic suspension system a number of years ago, when it was in the prototype stages. During that whirlwind weekend of riding their reactive suspension on mountain bikes, Fox walked me around a Polaris RZR UTV that was also wired with Live Valve suspension controls. After swearing to secrecy, the Fox Motorsports crew gave me the opportunity to drive some hot laps with the tricked out RZR on their test course to compare how the system performed when it was activated and not. It was impressive.
Without Live Valve, the Polaris suffered body roll in the corners and brake dive. Flip the switch, and the RZR chassis remained close to ride height, which flattened the car through the corners and maximized the available suspension. Fox and Polaris developed the system for the Popular RZR for more than performance reasons. Live Valve's ability to react to violent steering inputs and angular acceleration is intended to be a safety feature to minimize the potential for a high-speed rollover. Polaris calls it, "Dynamix Active Suspension Technology." – RC
Polaris RZR With Dynamix Active Suspension Technology PR
What About Live Valve for Bikes?
Prototype Fox Live Valve suspension.
So, when does Fox Live Valve enter production on mountain bikes? The unofficial story is that Fox was ready to launch it for the 2017 season, and in fact, I've seen frames in production with ports and bosses to integrate the system. Reportedly, Fox decided to hold off on the official Live Valve release for at least one product season, presumably, to adapt the workings to "metric" shocks, and also to expand Live Valve's range of tuning to enhance the requirements of more aggressive riders. The video below shows how the OHV shock operates. The mountain bike Live Valve system controls the fork and shock in a similar manner, but the damping requirements are significantly different in order to provide firm pedaling and, simultaneously, unhindered suspension action. The benefits, however, are the same: supple or firm suspension, exactly when you need it, and a stabilized ride height for consistent handling.
How Fox Live Valve Works
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I am not even joking. Enthusiastic riders from 1910 would scoff at you for using a freewheel, let alone of those ultra-complex 3-speed-hubs which only work reliably for 50 years between rebuilds (meaning strip & grease, nothing to wear out or replace in there..).
Liked your comment though. Simple beauty in there.
I think the bike is already broken. The tubes of the frames rear triangle are only loosely connected to each other anymore and are moving in all kinds of directions. The fork is so beaten up you can actually see it compressing under load and all the while the chain is jumping sideways. I think I even lost my inner tubes somewhere, theres only a disgusting puddle of who-knows-what inside my tyres left.
Since a while ago, even my seatpost can't be relied upon anymore. How did it come this far? That's why I return to A all the time, bike needs to get fixed apparently.
@redbaronmulisha Frankfurt, Germany. You get the beer, I'll show you the trails.
Walk
Me personally? Occam's razor suggests that the simple answer is most probably the right one. But who knows what he would have said, if he had one of those electric shavers for a more consistent and smooth result.
Like the brain system
an electronically-adjustable low-speed orifice?
edit: and the 2nd piston entering a tapered cone for the bottom out
So even if you want the most high-tech mountainbike s#!t to ride on, you can stay completely off the grid.
Yeah.. get your dirt bike, which you need to refuel every couple of miles. And make frequent oil changes, throwing away volumes of oil every single time which would last for half a lifetime of mtb-chain lubing and suspension rebuild. Great way of thinking.
I lube my chain by dripping oil onto it, which is less wasteful. I bought a litre of biodegradable oil 6-7 years ago and still have half of it left.
My Fox 36 needs a service every 100-200 hours (or annually) and takes what, 150ml of oil each time?
My engine actually runs on mostly sunflower or olive oil, lots of solid fat and additional carbohydrates. I change it every day after my breakfast coffee, but at least its completely biodegradable and not even harmful to the environment, new or used.
But even if you run the Fox 40, 12 hours of actual dh-riding is more than it sounds like. How many runs down is that? A day-long enduro ride for me, including the transfer from city to mountain and all the uphill-riding is like 3-4 hours of ACTUAL RIDING time, and most of it is flat or forestry roads uphill. Singletrail amounts to minutes, I need something like 10-15 minutes for a 1500" descent.
Without all these connected sensors, it doesn't really translate, does it? If the shock and fork are trying to figure that out all themselves, isolated from the rest of the bike, it is just guessing. I don't want to say that you cannot improve that way, but its just not the same to the all-connected-Polaris where the system actually knows exactly about the inputs.
Using the same "LiveValve" label for both systems therefore stinks like unfair marketing. Sorry Fox, I'm a hardcore fanboi of yours, but in this case you'll have to explain in more detail.
Whats an electronic wonder gizmo doing with out lazers?
And it must have a cool beeep when you turn it on.
Wich results in a more progressive behaviour
it is progressive and thats what you are saying. BUT it's not progressive like an air shock. The spring rate curve has bends. If you calculate the average spring rate from all different coils you get the beginning rate. If the shocks get compressed more and more the lightest coil will hit it's limit and can't be compressed more. From this moment you can calculate the average spring rate from all coils excpt the one that is compressed because it doesn't move at this point. If you do this through the whole travel you get a spring rate wich is progressive because the average spring rate increases through the travel. You can image that this is also the case with two springs.
Now, how's the price tag going to look on these bad boys? And what's the cost or annual/semi annual maintenance?