Push ACS3 Coil Conversion Kit - Review

Apr 3, 2018
by Mike Kazimer  
Push ACS3 review


After a short hiatus, there's been a resurgence of coil-sprung shocks and forks hitting the market, but this time around they aren't getting installed on downhill bikes. Instead, they're showing up on everything from mid-travel trail bikes to full-blown enduro race machines. Air-sprung suspension has become incredibly evolved, but there are still plenty of riders out there who prefer the extra small-bump sensitivity that a coil-sprung setup can provide.

Push first joined in on the coil revival with the release of the eye-catching, steampunk-esque ElevenSix shock back in 2015, and last year the Colorado-based company followed up with the ACS3 conversion kit.
Push ACS3 Details
• Converts air-sprung fork into coil-sprung
• Kits available for RockShox Pike, Lyrik, Yari, and Fox 36
• Air-sprung bump stop
• Seven spring weight options
• Weight: 367 grams more than stock on a 29" 150mm Lyrik
• Made in Colorado
• MSRP: $389 USD
www.pushindustries.com

The ACS3 allows riders to convert their 2015-2018 Fox 36, 2014-2018 RockShox Pike, or a 2016-2018 Lyrik or Yari forks from air to coil. All of the components are hand assembled and manufactured in Push's facility in Loveland, Colorado, which helps explain the kit's $389 USD price.


Push ACS3 review
I installed the 150mm kit into a 29" 2017 RockShox Lyrik.
Push ACS3 review
Push make everything in-house, including the laser etched top cap.


Installation

Installation of the ACS3 kit is a straightforward process, and if you've ever performed a lower leg service on your fork is shouldn't be too much of a hassle. Even if you've never done anything except add some air and twist a few dials on your fork, Push have created instructional videos that goes through all of the steps in a clear, easy to understand manner.

I'd budget in an hour for the procedure from start to finish, but in reality it'll probably take much closer to 30 minutes. Basically, you're pulling off the lower legs, undoing the C-clip that holds the air spring in place, removing the air spring, and then putting in the lower portion of the ACS3 kit. The lowers are then slid back on, 20cc of oil is put into each leg, and then the foot nuts are tightened down. After that, it's just a matter of dropping in the correct spring, installing the top cap, and airing up the bump stop to the desired pressure (anywhere between 5-50 psi).

One of the downsides to a coil fork is that it's not possible to control the spring rate as precisely as you can with an air fork, where it's easy to add or remove one or two psi. That being said, Push have seven springs available, which, on a 150mm fork, means there are options for riders from 115 to 240 pounds.

It's also worth noting that once you install the ACS3 kit, it's a relatively permanent conversion. You can't swap your fork back to air, due to the fact that the spring may scuff up the inside of the stanchion, which would allow air to go to where it doesn't belong.


Push ACS3 review
The air bump-stop can be inflated from 5-50 psi, depending on how much end-stroke ramp up you're looking for.
Views: 6,228    Faves: 1    Comments: 0



Performance

Push recommends installing their seal kit at the same time as the ACS3 for the best performance, which is good advice, but I kept the stock seals in place in order to reduce the number of variables I was changing. Based on Push's reference chart, I went with a blue spring, which is the suggested choice for riders between 155 – 175 pounds (I weigh 160 lb).

Without Push's nifty Air Bump Stop that spring rate would likely have been on the softer side of things, due to the inherently linear nature of a coil spring. But, with the air chamber inflated to 25 psi the fork sat exactly where I wanted it to, delivering a super-supple feel at the beginning of the stoke, before ramping up to avoid any harsh bottom outs. I also ended up dialing in a little more low-speed compression than what I was running in the fork's air-sprung configuration. This provided a little more support at the beginning of the travel for pushing into corners or to preload before hitting a jump.
Views: 7,574    Faves: 9    Comments: 0

One of the selling points of coil-sprung forks and shocks is the superior small bump compliance and on that front, the ACS3 doesn't disappoint. I was amazed by how responsive the fork felt with the ACS3 kit installed – it takes almost no effort to initiate travel, and I found myself taking lines in the wet that I usually reserve for dry days due to the increased amount of grip. The kit delivered an instantly noticeable increase in traction, a sensation similar to running really low tire pressure. The wheel felt glued to the ground, tracking over every root, rock, and bump in the trail without getting bucked off line.


Issues

I didn't run into any performance issues, but at first the ASC3 made more noise than I would have liked. When faced with repeated large impacts the fork made a loud “thwack” noise that sounded similar to a wooden ruler hitting a desk - you can hear it if you turn the volume up in the video. At first, I thought it was the spring knocking against the inside of the fork's stanchion, so I installed more shrink wrap and a healthy dollop of grease to quiet things down. That made a small difference, but the noise was still present - the culprit seemed to be the air bump stop hitting top of the lower shaft. There's a small bit of rubber on the bottom of the bump stop that's supposed to keep things quiet, but it wasn't working as intended.

Push sent me a replacement Air Bump Stop, which had a thicker piece of rubber in place, along with what seemed to be more negative pressure - it was slightly shorter when aired up to the same pressure as the original. The replacement did the trick, and the noise that had been annoying me before was replaced with a blissful silence. According to Push, if a customer had experienced that problem they would have received the same treatment that I did - a replacement would have been sent out to correct the issue at no charge.




Pinkbike's Take
bigquotesFor riders looking to improve the comfort and traction of their current fork, the ACS3 delivers an incredibly smooth, comfortable ride no matter how rough the trail. However, that ultra-plush performance isn't cheap, and there's also the weight penalty to factor into the equation. Still, it's a very impressive product, and worth considering for those who want to make the switch from air to coil without coughing up the dough for an entirely new fork. Mike Kazimer









196 Comments

  • 81 11
 Too bad it costs as much as barely ridden Pike/ Lyrik on ebay. I get the coil thing, but this is 100$ too much for me :/
  • 35 1
 You should check out CR Conception, he does a pretty interesting coil spring conversion for many forks, all manufactured in France, for roughly 100€. Can also come integrated to their own cartridge for the price of the Push spring kit.

Mike you should check it out too as his solution is much more simple and usually lighter than stock air-spring systems !
  • 13 11
 Some of the cost of the coil is offset with longer service intervals.
  • 13 3
 @Marcencinitas: in what way does it increase service intervals?
  • 11 0
 @Balgaroth: I looked it up. while it is cheaper, it's just a shaft for the spring to sit in. the Push system has their bump stop system for endstroke ramp up so you can run a softer spring and not bottom out constantly
  • 8 5
 @Airfreak: I think he is saying it reduces the service intervals so the high cost of the coil is offset. ie. less servicing = save money
  • 5 1
 @SonofBovril: yeah word mistake sorry I meant reduce service intervals(or increase the time between service intervals). But its just the air spring side....Nothing is changed to the damper. The air side is one shaft and some grease/oil.
  • 3 1
 Only because you have not ridden one yet.
  • 2 2
 @Airfreak: I think he means the opposite.... as in not having to service a coil fork as often. which makes sense to me
  • 6 3
 @jarrod801: As Airfreak says, the air spring doesn't require much service to begin with. Basic service is lubricating oil in the lowers. The damper still requires the same service interval whether is is air or coil.
  • 3 0
 @jarrod801: @Marcencintas service intervals should still be about every 6 months if your getting good riding in, the oil is in the lowers for both the damper and spring side and keeps the stanchions lubed which prevents scoring them. overall its about a $60 to 75$ service + seals, with how expensive suspension is I'd stay up on service
  • 19 23
flag WAKIdesigns (Apr 3, 2018 at 10:10) (Below Threshold)
 I also think just buying this set won’t turn Lyrik or Pike into world’s best single crown fork. You’d have to send it to PUSH for Charger cartridge tuning. Lyrik not Pike just aren’t as good as 36, even 36 from 2011 offered better grip (plushness) to stability ratio
  • 3 2
 cmon you get so much more plushnesss for the money!
  • 12 11
 Coils require far less service than air forks. Air tends to feel bad pretty quick once the oil gets a few specks of dust in it. (Weeks) Coil on the other hand will still feel good even though the oil has turned into mud. (Year or two). Coil>air in everyway possible other than "convienence" of tuning for required weight. Coil can be just as fine tuned, but requires trying different oil levels and weights. Something most people dont know this because they believe the sticker (recommended levels, weights, PSI, etc, on their fork is a set rule. It is not.
  • 9 2
 If this was just a coil I would agree with you. It is a totally different animal though, you have the coil plus a miniaturized air spring so that you get the benefits of both coil (small bump sensitivity/increased grip) plus air spring advantages (non linear ramp in the spring rate). This is the equivalent of works level suspension seems like a bargain to me.
  • 13 2
 @WAKIdesigns: Open Bath Oil Damper brah. Far better than the charger damper. 55 RC3 EVO was the best damn single crown fork ever made, but weighed quite a bit. That can be solved with a newer light weight spring and DVO has said they will be bringing something very similar to the 55 but a lot lighter. I've been holding out for that.
  • 7 1
 @Balgaroth: I updated my PIKE with the CR Conception Coil Set...2100g ..I'll never go back 2 air
  • 3 3
 @Boardlife69: it has a miniature air spring as well as the coil. So it still has seals, and presumably still has seal drag. So how is it better? Smaller seals so less drag than a full size air spring?
  • 12 26
flag WAKIdesigns (Apr 3, 2018 at 12:45) (Below Threshold)
 @Boardlife69: open bath, oh no. Hell no. It was good in 2005 when We knew no better. RC3 Ti was divey. Not as bad as previous Marzo dampers but it just cannot compare to Fox Fit dampers from 2011 to present.
  • 31 6
 @WAKIdesigns: Dude what the f*ck are you talking about?

Some of the shit you say is literally baseless.
  • 5 0
 @Boardlife69: yea the coil will maintain a great feel and feel better just off the go, but you should still change the oil out in at least a year to keep from scoring the stanchions, that being said I love the coil feel and this is a rad set up to get some ramp in the end of the stroke I'd say worth the money to me
  • 10 11
 @nvranka: I have only owned these forks, so please...
  • 2 0
 @Boardlife69: that's what has me interested too. The onyx SC will be the new 55 I hope. There is nothing else that makes me think about swapping my 2015 fox 36. It works really well. I certainly won't be spending this amount of cash to convert to coil, even if it does extend service intervals to a year or two.
  • 2 1
 @wakidesigns

Yes, the rc3 Evo (i owned one) its a divey fork, but isn't open bath fault. It's just a really bad damper.

Dvo emerald (my current fork) stay high in travel, have strong damping (way better than my fox rc2) and still a open bath fork.
  • 3 3
 @WAKIdesigns: Please don't comment when you have no idea what you're talking about. The Push cart DOES NOT need to be tuned.
  • 2 2
 @nvranka: He has no idea what he's talking about
  • 6 3
 @mtbjuky: I meant that Charger cartridge would work better if it was tuned by PUSH. Good night
  • 6 1
 @WAKIdesigns: The 55 didnt dive if it was set up right. You have to remember back in those days 1 out of 3 forks came from the factory with oil in them. (I'm looking at you RS) The 55 called for 7.5 weight, go up to 10 weight, add 1 or 2 ml more than required then you could back off the preload, no dive, oil volume ramp up, god this is making me horney, I want my 55 back, or a new one. (I'm looking at you DVO).
  • 1 2
 @pedrosalas7: Like I said, much more simple, 1/3 of the price, lighter than air spring. Exists for 90% of the forks on the market, if it doesn't yet you send your fork and he will make it for your fork. So sure it's you can't control end stroke like the push but that's with 99% of coil spring setup and in this case you also get the weight advantage of air spring, the tracking and begin stroke of spring.

On top of that your comment on going with softer spring for more comfort would probably only result in the fork diving a lot until it gets to the air spring. To which you will tell me you can correct that with compression tuning, to which I'll tell you the same for the CR Conception solution as a good shim stack setup (in his own cartridge for exemple) will sort this out with HSC tuning.

You're most welcome I saved you 200$ or spend the same and have an excellent cartridge instead of stock rubbish found in most forks Wink @pedrosalas7: Like I said, much more simple, 1/3 of the price, lighter than air spring. Exists for 90% of the forks on the market, if it doesn't yet you send your fork and he will make it for your fork. So sure it's you can't control end stroke like the push but that's with 99% of coil spring setup and in this case you also get the weight advantage of air spring, the tracking and begin stroke of spring.

On top of that your comment on going with softer spring for more comfort would probably only result in the fork diving a lot until it gets to the air spring. To which you will tell me you can correct that with compression tuning, to which I'll tell you the same for the CR Conception solution as a good shim stack setup (in his own cartridge for exemple) will sort this out with HSC tuning.

You're most welcome I saved you 200$ or spend the same and have an excellent cartridge instead of stock rubbish found in most forks Wink
  • 1 3
 @Boardlife69: I had 44 RC3 Ti and all I remember is how it dived under braking on steeps. Great for big hits sure. I bought it for my HT, and the guy told me to service it as the last oil change was a year before, but after 3 rides I just sold it further. No way to get X-Firm springs for it in 2012-13, whatever it was. Got a Sector which I could set hard as fk. Damping was sht but at least it was holding up.
  • 2 0
 @WAKIdesigns: How would you quantify this ratio?
  • 1 0
 @Airfreak: No air spring to service and no air spring-related problems to resolve.
  • 1 0
 @downhillin4life: I might be due, then. I’be been hammering it for a good six months and all I do is let the bike sit upside down every now and then to let some oil soak into the dust wipers. Fork still feels awesome.
  • 1 2
 @JBSDesigns: erm, by how much grip I get and how sketchy it feels when pressing on brakes or on G-outs? I had Fox 36RC2 Van and it felt like it rides better than 2007 Lyrik I had before. Little I knew how good it was. Then I got 2016 Lyrik and it felt like I need to choose either stability or grip. Son considering you are Norwegian we ride in very similar terrain, even though you obviously have more altitude difference. Trails surfaces are very similar. Everything is fine in dry but in wet when I hit a steep filled with roots and rocks, some occasional mud (and that's normal across Scandinavia, pitch of the trail tends to be relatively dramatic) then I have to choose between grip and stability. So in wet i setup the bike for grip. I let off 10 PSI. One click off the compression, one off rebound. i didn't need to do anything on 36 Van, just stuff in harder spring for bike park.

Exact same observations are shared by Bike Radar testers in latest comparison 36 vs Lyrik.
  • 3 0
 For someone whose bike came with a fork that they like quite a bit that they want to push over the edge to the next step, the upgrade makes a lot of sense. At 160lbs my 2017 160mm Lyrik RC's chassis on my Guerrilla Gravity Shred Dogg (145 rear/160mm front) is plenty stiff for me, so I went with the ACS-3 for improved small bump sensitivity. It delivered way over my expectations and I'm riding with my LSC halfway damped without any stiction to speak of. Think activating your fork with just your fingertips pressing down on the bars...this thing grips.

With the Charger 1 damper paired with the Lyrik's original air spring I was only running a few clicks of LSC damping before in an effort to get better chatter/small bump sensitivity, but it didn't make climbing or berm-railing very efficient or supportive, and I like to leave my suspension alone as much as possible while riding (I'll firm the LSC for jump tracks and such).

As a consumer building a bike from the ground up, this kit vs a purpose-built coil fork isn't a good buy. As someone with an existing bike and fork, this kit has me begging for a coil in the rear now. I'm stoked as hell to go back to Windrock DH park after getting this upgrade tuned.
  • 1 0
 @WAKIdesigns: small bump compliance on my 2016 36 29er is garbage compared to my last 2014 pike in 26"
  • 1 0
 @nvranka: @WAKIdesigns:

The non Evo 55 RC3's were divey. The later generation 2013/2014 solved that problem with a upgraded damper and slightly higher spring rate.

I own both and the 2013/2014 RC3 Ti Evo V.2 is vastly superior to the 2010 55 RC3 Ti.
  • 2 1
 @eshew: I didn’t have the evo. It was the white one with silver stanchions. Amazing grip, no doubts about it, not as good as Shiver SC, but on steeps it was raising the hair on the back of my head. A feature that all open bath marzocchis had, that I haven’t experienced with any other fork was th big hit performance. You hucked it to flat and it felt like a big portion of energy got dissipated. High speed compression damping in my 66 RC2X was just insane. Never experienced it afterwards.
  • 1 1
 @allenfstar: my 2016 36 wasn't great either for small bump. Awesome on big hits but felt I couldn't set up for both.
Got the mrp kit with tunable negative chamber and it's made the difference. Couldn't recommended enough, loads more grip and plenty of support. I can't stand a divey fork
  • 33 1
 @mikekazimer - Can you elaborate on this review a little more? You don't really compare it to a stock fork at all. What does the coil do better? What does it do worse? What did you like or dislike compared to a stock fork? Thanks!
  • 4 5
 Coil has improved small bump compliance and tunable bottom out. It is very difficult to get the mid-travel support, and if you do get it you often bump the spring rate up and then reduce the small bump compliance benefit. Weight is noticeable different for the 36. Not sure it's worth it. Buy a GRIP fork and do some airspring mods and it's light, performs well and can't be beat.
  • 8 0
 @dualsuspensiondave agree, @mikekazimer, more detail in the review would be good. OK, better suppleness and traction, more weight. Though how does it jump. It the air spring progressive enough to be poppy? Increased brake dive? How does it pedal? How does it climb compared to a goat?
  • 4 1
 what i love about coils is how consistent they feel. when you are doing a descent that is 2500 vertical foot, I find that the air loses a little something as you go down due to heating and whatnot
  • 1 0
 @Mojo348: this is my exact question. I opted for a rear coil for the traction, it is less poppy, but worth it. I’d like to hear how this would effect the fork.
  • 8 1
 @Purpledragonslayer, the ACS3 does feel slightly less poppy, but that air sprung bottom out device helps keep it from blowing through all its travel when you're really pushing into it. The difference between this and the stock configuration of the fork wasn't drastic enough that I had to alter my riding style - I could still hit jumps and pop over obstacles just as comfortably as before.

The main difference is in that initial stroke, where the coil spring makes the fork feel more compliant, more responsive to obstacles of all size. That's what was providing all of that traction that let me take stupid lines in the pouring rain. The coil is better at taking the edge of trail chatter.

What's it do worse? Not much - there's a little less mid-stroke support, and racer-types may need to go up a spring rate to get that sporty feel, but it's a good option if you're looking for a plush, grippy feel from your fork.
  • 9 0
 I have one in my 160mm 2018 36 RC2. Basically it has better small bump compliance. Here in so cal we get a lot of chatter and some trails have bad braking bumps. It helps smooth that out. One thing I notice is on really fast braking bumps I get less vision blur. I ride in socal so basically everything is rock hard hardpack covered in dust and sand. So the trails overall are much harsher than what I've ridden on the east cost or like Colorado, or Norcal or Tahoe.

The other area I find it is good in is in really technical rock gardens--ones where you cant just plow through but you have to make fairly sharp turns. There is a trail I ride with a steep rocky, bumpy, drop to a sharp left turn thats off camber sandy on rock. It's slippery. The fork tracks through that better and I can more easily make the turn. It's a section a lot of people walk or go a into the runout on.

Really those are the two scenarios I notice the difference the most. It added about .75lbs to the fork. The break in on the Push dust wipers seems to be for real. Felt bad at first but it has gotten WAY better.

If I lived in Tahoe for instance, I probably wouldn't get an ACS-3.

The air spring doens't engage until like the last 1/3d of travel so it doesn't really affect the poppyness of the fork or anything like that on small stuff.
  • 3 0
 @mikekazimer: Have you ridden the Canecreek Helm coil fork? If so ho do you feel this fork with the Push coil conversion compares? Does the Push air bump stop offer that little bit more tune ability over the Helm? In other words if you already have a Pike and are thinking coil are you better off with the conversion kit or selling the Pike and getting a Helm or equivalent coil shock??
  • 1 0
 @Prh: I wander what the weight difference would be with the conversion kit on a fox 36 vs helm fork.
  • 2 1
 @mikekazimer: you should check out CR conception cartridge with integrated coil. Same price, lighter setup than a stock air fork, semi open-bath with shim stack done to your liking. Much better way to spend 300$ in my opinion as you can buy a Yari for exemple and make it a beast. Whereas the push spring kit will only work with already high end forks which makes the price go through the roof.
  • 1 0
 Be interesting to compare a Fox36 with push coil vs mrp ramp
  • 3 0
 @Balgaroth: I'm glad that your happy with your CR kit. I've followed him on social media for a long time and he has a very cool setup. Please note that our kit is also available for the Yari, so it's not just for "high end" forks.
  • 2 0
 @PUSH: The great thing with your kit is the added end of stroke control allowing to go with softer coil rate for better tracking. But without a good cartridge behing I can't imagine a good mid stroke management. A Yari for instance would dive like mad, you'd bump up LSC but you can't control your HSC you end up with a really harsh fork and no traction. On the other hand if you have a good cartridge with it then it would make sens to me. Either way interesting design, definitely over price for me to consider it.
  • 2 0
 @enduroFactory: just installed the mrp kit in my float 36 fit4. I'll post a review once I've got it tuned and got a few rides on it.

I will say, just from the set up, it's not for the set it and forget it type and it takes a little while to get the spring set up proper for sag and negative chamber
  • 1 0
 @allenfstar: I'm on fox36 Float andreani piston kit & mrp ramp, I've found i run HSC quite open use ramp clicks as needed most the time that's 3>5.
Slower speeds it's ok, at pace it's totally sublime. One oddity since mrp ramp fitted feels faster rebound on normal setting.
  • 1 0
 @enduroFactory: I got my spring set today and also noticed the rebound seemed quicker I was running it only one click from full open and now it's way fast.
  • 1 0
 @litany: Thanks for chiming in on your experience with this! I live in Aliso and have been wondering if this would help for the conditions you mentioned. I'm currently experimenting with different tire pressures, but that won't completely solve for all of the issues.
  • 36 3
 Can't hear the thud over the sram brake howl.
  • 15 0
 This howl has caused me a large amount of duress and I too am now howling to counteract this howling in the video.
  • 18 0
 These look so great but TF Tuned (UK Importer) have them priced at $561.15 (£399)! How is this acceptable?
  • 10 2
 VAT? Fix that with Brexit?
  • 1 0
 @bh21: Google thinks it's £276.66 excluding VAT, with VAT it's £331.99 which means that British consumers are losing out on about £70. I expect the markup will be even higher here in Switzerland...
  • 1 0
 @korev: add import duty plus charge for processing from DHL or whoever ships, it works out the same.
  • 12 1
 I was super happy with my fox 36, then I got a coil shock and felt my fork was now undergunned. So I committed to this ACS3 and it’s been amazing. Small bump all the way to brake bump sensitivity has been amazing. Mid stroke support is also better. I’m using less travel overall but my ride is more plush with better traction. I didn’t become an amazing rider or start KOMing every trail all of a sudden, but I would recommend this 10/10 and would do it again on my next bike.
  • 3 0
 Having ridden Fox 36 VAN RC2 FIT and RC4 coil shock since 2011 model year I have never been unhappy. Basically I skipped the whole weight weenie air trend and sticked to my 2014 36 VAN over the years. Looks like history has gone full circle and back to good ol' coil. Cannot help thinking I missed nothing.
  • 1 0
 @bh21: my 2019 trek slash is already 36lb with cushcore installed. i guess i should jump on the ACS3 conversion train and add a few more grams, eh?
  • 5 0
 Looks great, but the price in the UK is insane. You can get this or a.n other coil conversion and a damper upgrade (fast or avy) and still be left with some spare beer tokens. Push can't really be blamed for that, but it does it make it a far less enticing upgrade if you're on this side of the Atlantic.
  • 5 1
 Been riding coil sprung forks on dirt and street bikes for 30 years and just got back into mountain biking after many years away. It was easy setting up the fork and shock with the proper sag on my 2016 stumpjumper with the Revelation/Fox CTD combo. It took longer to then differentiate between the effect of the air ramp up and the damping and tune it better. While the air fork isn't bad, it definitely follows the ground differently than a coil fork, especially on rebound at the top of the stroke. I also notice that the damping on fork and shock is way soft and not adjustable much.

You can have fancy high dollar suspension with great tolerances, but having crappy valving is critical. In the dirt bike world, very few riders spend money on Ohlins or other suspension when revalving and re-springing the OEM stuff is a much better use of money. Instead of buying a Pike/Fox, etc with valving that would still not be great, I had Avalanche install their SSS shock setup (and soon I'll install their SSS open bath fork setup). My shock is amazing now. Wish I could convert my Revelation to a coil spring with the SSS damping.

I still prefer the fork/shock spring to set the ride height and the damping and internals control the compression and rebound, rather than having the progressiveness of an air spring confuse the situation.

There's basically only one air fork in the motorcycle world that has staying power (KTM's AER setup) because it is simple to set up and still performs very close to a coil fork. However, many people are still converting it back to coil because it works a little better overall. In a few years it will likely gain more acceptance as they iron out the differences.
  • 4 0
 You can get good damping in mrP ribbon coil as well...
  • 4 1
 @Lagr1980: MRP will have 'good' damping, whereas Avalanche will give you 'great' damping built for you.
  • 3 0
 @chrisrobin: true. I'll let the pros have great damping. I probably cannot tell from them anyways. My ribbon coil is the shit as is.
  • 1 0
 @Lagr1980: Swapping to an entirely different fork is a waste of time and money when it's the internals that need attention. If I was building a bike up from a frame, then it'd be different.
  • 6 0
 I've just got a sexy black Helm Coil for my new bike build. Always preferred coil forks, back as far as the Pace RC40 fighter fork I still have in the attic.
  • 5 2
 Can someone explain to me why youd want to take an air fork and make it coil? Ive been riding for like 10 years. Ive just always been on air forks. With these air forks having so many adjustable options to fit every rider to the finest detail, why a coil?
  • 5 0
 I can be gentle at the beginning of the stroke but also it won't matter if I ram it in really hard. At the bottom it will feel nice and firm without a harsh stop. You're right with the fitting issues though, but once you find your preference there is no turning back.
  • 6 1
 As the article points out, small bump compliance is better with a coil. Air forks try to mimic the linear rate of the coil as well. However coils do have the tendency to bottom out harshly which it looks like Push tried to fix with the air bump stop. Besides weight, I'd prefer a coil fork, I can set it and forget it instead of making sure its at the exact psi I need every ride.
  • 2 0
 Okay, makes sense now. Thank you, you two!
  • 9 0
 Moar grip. Moar mid stroke support.
  • 4 0
 @Airfreak: Part of what would appeal to me about a coil is that it wouldn't change in its characteristics when it gets crazy hot (running laps at the bike park, epic long descents, what have you). But then you'd still have the damper oil getting hot and changing viscosity - probably a bigger effect. And air shocks have gotten awfully good at dealing with that sort of thing (just like they've also gotten pretty damn good at small bump compliance).

The Lyrik/Pike/36/34 are so damn good now, and they've come down to reasonable pricing. Even the second tier forks (Yari, etc.) are amazing (easily the equal of their first tier products from a few years ago). I'm a set/forget type of rider, don't fettle too much with settings. On that front, the coil appeals - but then again, I don't really need to do much regarding air spring pressure either.

Between the price tag and the subtle performance differences/advantages, this seems to be a niche product.
  • 5 0
 Best thing to do is always to ride a bike with a coil shock and/or fork and you will very quickly understand/feel the differences...very plush and a lot of support and traction.
  • 3 0
 @g-42: I agree definitely a niche product. If it was $100 less I would definitely entertain it more. I debated between this upgrade for awhile for my pike. Ended up buying a used pike with avalanche damper for slightly more cost than this. Still wish I could have gone coil but this setup should definitely be a bigger upgrade than changing out to this coil upgrade.
  • 4 0
 to run an air system you also need very tight seals to not leak the air ( looking at you ohlins) and with a coil there isn't crazy pressure to contain (very tight = friction) and there is usually more force required to get things moving or changing directions hence small bump compliance/sensitivity is increased(why they also include new seals), and also if your shutting a couple thousand feet of vertical there is a change in barometric pressure (ever see a bag of chips at a 10,000ft? if it hasn't already popped).

I've been very pleased with pike/lyrik forks for years. I put on a coil rear shock on and suddenly I'm considering this conversion for my lyrik.. I'm going to try the new 2019 air spring ($50) when it comes out before I do the conversion to coil.
  • 4 0
 Easiest way to explain the different feel between air and coil springs.... Coil feels like you just lowered your tire pressure by about five psi. Erases trail chatter. Actually when you first ride a properly dialed coil sprung bike you will look at your tires to make sure they are holding air. Gives you that stuck to the ground, gooey, goodness. Blast through the chunk at mach speed and still see the trail. Unless you are racing uphill, or have buff trails, coil is a no-brainer choice for me.
  • 2 0
 Think of it this way..."Ive been running a post for 10yrs, why in the hell would i ever get a dropper'? Like that...
  • 6 0
 $389 USD Eek I’m going to have to sell a kidney for that. I’ll pass!!!!
  • 16 0
 That would be a great deal on a kidney, I'll take two!
  • 5 0
 Wow you must have a shite diet if thats all your Kidneys are worth
  • 3 0
 Still riding my 2006 36 van rc2 and still enjoying it ,well changed the the crowns twice ,and going for the third,but still it is amazing how well it performs,simple and you can tuned a bit with the high and low speeds ,it may lack the fine tune of air but ....I leave that to the real pros ,please fox start making them again but with more springs to choose,and fix that cluck that the spring makes when the sleeve of the spring goes down or up on the spring cause it’s hard to put that in the middle of the spring ,but yes spring all the time it just doesn’t have that little resistance in the begging of the stroke like air forks have it’s just better
  • 4 0
 I like it. Maybe I will buy this kit when the time of not sold out will come. It is like my fifth web site check from the announcement aaaaaaannd, sold out.
  • 4 0
 Only the 170mm kits are sold out. We should have them available in 30 days.
  • 3 2
 @PUSH: hey guys. Exactly that is the height of my fork. Guess I will check it for the sixth time in 30 days. ????
  • 5 0
 why hasn't anyone made a progressively wound spring for these yet? it makes no sense....
  • 10 1
 Because modern forks are too short. The travel/free length/inside diameter ratio doesn't allow it.
  • 3 3
 @PUSH: "doesn't allow for it" meaning, in an economically viable manner, right? because I have R/C car shocks with progressively wound springs, and they are less than 2" long. lol
  • 15 1
 @conoat: No you're misunderstanding...no amount of money can get it done. Inside the fork tube we have 302mm of length and 34mm of inside diameter. The spring has to have a minimum of 180mm of travel and enough coils so that it doesn't fail/break. This springs are already stressed to the maximum.

Also, there is a huge difference in spring rate and travel between a MTB fork and an RC car.
  • 2 0
 @PUSH: never would I thought mtb coil and rc car coil be in the same sentence on pinkbike
  • 1 0
 @PUSH: can you make them for a boxxer or other DH fork?
  • 2 0
 @Kitejumping: boxxer team are spring forks . . . . . . .
  • 1 0
 @MX298: dual rate spring
  • 6 2
 Sell your current fork, take that $400 this thing costs and get a Cane Creek Helm coil fork. Baddest Coil fork on the planet hands down...
  • 11 1
 Or an MrP ribbon
  • 4 1
 Shame they don’t provide a hard plastic insert to go insert the Stanction for the spring to rub against so it won’t scratch the inside of stanction. This way you could convert back to air if you wanted to.
  • 21 0
 We did try that, but unfortunately there's not enough space. The insert was so thin that it would get destroyed over time.
  • 3 0
 @PUSH: yeah that would be a potential problem. I suppose it would have to be smalller diameter springs as well. Cheers for replying
  • 2 0
 I've got the kit in my Lyrik 160-- the thing is, nobody who switches to this kit wants to go back haha, so it's really not necessary.
  • 3 1
 Speaking from experience here in the Rocky Mountains, Push makes the best suspension products out there. When I rode the 11.6 shock here, I literally could not believe it. Amazing products and I'm going to get the ACS3 conversion for my 36 as well. Air shocks are great for when you want a lighter trail bike but you just can't beat the performance of these coil shocks/forks on a hard charging enduro/am bike. Keep up the good work Push Industries!!
  • 2 0
 I'm not a Princess who notices the pea in the mattress but I put this kit on my Pike and I was very happy with the feel. Everyone is talking about "small bump" but what I really noticed was how well it handled repetitive hits. It just feels better over everything, and actually seems to hold up the front end better than the air spring. I think it costs too much, but coming from the hot rod world I laugh at the cost of bike parts. I'm so impressed that now I'm having dirty thoughts about a coil on the back.
  • 3 1
 Lads if you want a coil fork just buy an ohlins rxf36 and you will never need to look back.

Why people buy a brand new fox 36 for like £1100 and then throw a 300 doller coil in it is stupid and makes zero sense.

That's my 2 cents worth

Ps am biased i run full ohlins coils on my slash.
  • 2 0
 i've had one for about 6 months now. In a Fox 36. Why did i get it? Didnt like the feel of the air no matter how i set it up. Why didnt i sell it and buy a coil as new new? Didnt feel like giving away the fork that came on my bike - and possibly having to fart around with a new hub / wheel build / spacers blah blah blah.
What do i like about it? Never having to wonder "is my pressure right? Does it need a little more?" etc etc.
Set. And. Forget.
Truth be told i could probably drop a spring rate for an even more supple ride but i do like it as is. And also enjoy having a little more weight (we are talking grams, people) up front as well.
My next fork will be a coil out of the box. And even if Fox start making them again, it wont be one of theirs.
  • 5 0
 Get me a coil conversion kit for a Bluto when we can talk.
  • 5 1
 I would think switching to a Manitou Mastodon with a good shimmed damper would be a bigger improvement - doesn't the Bluto have a motion control damper?
  • 4 1
 C'mon @PUSH make it cheaper and take over the world?! Or at least send a discount voucher for current ElevenSix owners, please!?
  • 1 0
 It is good that coil sprung suspension gets the appreciation it deserves so that suspension manufacturers can charge what it's worth. I got a 85mm travel coil sprung fork for my bike late 2006 (I wrinkeled the downtube so I didn't dare to run anything longer) and I loved the way it rode. Unfortunately I also kept bottoming out. When I eventually replaced the frame, I increased travel to 100mm. Still kept bottoming though. Eventually as the coils started to suffer from coil binding, they became a bit noisy too. I think the progressive end stop is a nice one for these later forks. Many brands at the time quit selling coil sprung forks because they were expensive to make (and to stock all the different springs) and they still couldn't charge them for what they were worth because people gravitated towards air sprung. And yeah, for me too something more progressive eventually turned out to be better too. I think Marzocchi had a clever workaround with a stock coil spring in one leg and air assist in the other. But yeah now that coil sprung forks are being appreciate again, manufacturers can make them as good as they can be and charge proper money to do so sustainably. I like this.

It does seem like RS fork owners are getting loads of options for their springs now. Which is nice considering these are often OEM forks. RS updated their air spring, Vorsprung has their Luftkappe and now Push has the coil sprung conversion. Would be interesting to see a direct comparison between the three.
  • 1 0
 @PUSH Any plans to introduce this kit for the DVO Diamond? Have you tried? The air spring is in a self contained cartridge, so removing it to utilize your coil conversion would not harm the ability to go back to the air spring.
  • 3 0
 Dpa pike/lyrics owners rejoice. Can finally get the dam thing to absorb something smaller than a baby's head without buying a new fork
  • 1 0
 I modified my pike (with a little help) boxxer spring shaft asembly cut down and rethreaded, I can't remember the exact length but when I service my forks I will check, and a cut down lyrik coil spring (Or 36 or any other roughly 160-180mm coil fork) and you have what I call the poxxer, so far it's killer but I'm keen to get hold of a yari/lyrik and make a 170mm version, as the top out spring allows about 10mm of extension past max travel which means at 160mm the pike charger damper is almost topping out. Haven't looked into damper upgrades yet but with a firm lyrik spring I have been running a lot of compression to stop it diving on really steep trails under hard braking
  • 1 0
 I weigh 160 with riding gear, etc. are you 160 with or without gear? I am using the orange spring and feel it is a little soft and would like to try the blue spring but don't want to spend the extra cash after the initial investment, especially if it doesn't work out. Do you have any thoughts? I am not using any preload and running 25psi in the bump stop. Thanks
  • 1 0
 MRP Ribbon Coil. It's already got the upgrade Smile Been riding one 6 months, and compared to the Ribbon Air, Pike Air and 36 Air, it's no comparison. I rank them thus: Ribbon Coil 10 out 10 small bump plushness. Pike Air 7/10. Fox 36 Air 6/10. Ribbon Air 6/10. I bet this Push conversion would rank 10 out 10 too.
  • 1 0
 Hey Mike,
R.E. rattle - I had the same problem with mine.
the spring is the culprit - if you pull the bottom out control all together and run the stock air cap instead (obvs with no air added) it'll do the same.
Its because the spring is designed for the Pike also, so slightly smaller dia.
If you put 2 new spring isolators on the spring top & bottom that will quieten it up lovely.
Gimme a shout at TF Tuned - I can hook you up.
  • 1 0
 Anyone who's got this kit from an EU source (not directly from Push), could you confirm that a spring is included.

A few of the places I've seen give options for travel, but not for spring rate. And if it does come standard, what colour do you get?

Cheers
  • 3 0
 Is there an option for the 180 mm Lyrik? I could not find it in the article. Thanks!
  • 5 0
 Unfortunately not. 170mm is the most you can fit due to the free length available for manufacturing the springs.
  • 4 1
 If anyone wants to try coil I will trade you my SR Suntour XCT straight up for your air spring fork!
  • 1 0
 :'D
  • 1 0
 @mikekazimer said he installed more shrink wrap over the coil to help quieten it. I need some for my Marz 55 Evo Ti - anyone know where you can get shrink wrap off the shelf to use for this?
  • 4 0
 Pretty much any hardware store should have some - it's usually in the electrical department.
  • 1 0
 It's often called heat shrink, usually you can get it at the local electrical supplies store. WESCO or similar will stock it
  • 4 0
 The top cap is etched with frickin’ laser beams!
  • 4 0
 Put this on my Fox 36 and man what a difference, awesome product!!!!
  • 1 2
 In a good way or a bad way? you need to be clear.
  • 1 0
 @indotrails: he said awesome product. so you can assume it was "good".
  • 1 1
 I was pushing my good old Marzocchi 55 RC3 in the trails last weekend and even if the spring is pretty stiff it felt like it was diving a lot when I went slowly down the small hills. Also I notice it is much heavier that I would like. The original titanium springs were too weak, so now I am using another brand. Now I feel like getting a Fox fork and and upgrade!
  • 5 4
 To be fair, I always had, "shitty" coil sprung forks on my bikes until I was like 15, and their small bump compliance was better. That looks really good.
  • 15 2
 To be faaaaaiiiiiiirrrrrrr
  • 9 4
 @Kramz I'm never so sure about what people mean when they talk about "small bump compliance". What kind of small bumps are we talking about ? Braking bumps ? Roots ? Pine cones ? Dead squirrels ? Rock garden ?
  • 1 11
flag sdken (Apr 3, 2018 at 8:28) (Below Threshold)
 @zede: Small bump compliance is just marketing. Some vendors like JensonUSA markets Fox 5-piece shock bushings/hardware for better small bump compliance. Although I can't tell a difference.
  • 5 0
 @zede: generally people are referring to smaller roots/rocks. When I talk about small bump compliance, I'm usually talking about how my fork reacts to bumps smaller than 3 inches tall.
  • 15 2
 @zede: The rate of resistance of a coil spring increases proportionally to the distance it is compressed, so the resistance for the initial bit of compression is minimal, making the fork easily deflect over small bumps. There are fewer seals after the ACS-3 conversion, so there is also less friction to overcome, making it that much more compliant. The linear increase in the force required to compress the spring also provides more mid-stroke support than an air spring, so you actually get more support in the middle of the travel.

My Fox 36 RC2 was night and day better after I did the conversion and I made gains in cornering and jumping while also feeling less fatigued after long rides. It's the real deal.
  • 5 0
 @Marcencinitas: isn't that the opposite of hookes law? Or maybe I've misunderstood what you mean. Either way, I'm going to get one of these kits once the 170mm comes into stock.
  • 5 0
 @kiddlivid: as an engineeeerrrrr
  • 1 0
 @zede: All depends on your speed and the size of your balls Wink
  • 6 1
 @sdken: if you think small bump compliance is marketing, you've either never used a good fork before, or you've somehow never used a bad fork before
  • 3 1
 @kiddlivid: Too few people get this reference.
  • 1 1
 @cueTIP:

They'll figure it out.
  • 3 0
 @cueTIP: I don't get this reference because I have a low IQ
  • 3 5
 @xeren: I've used good and bad forks, custom valved, and all. However, I switch suspension parts so much that investing in one of these, knowing that I'll probably get rid of it next year isn't worth it to me... Forks these days are pretty damn good right out of the box, considering what they are doing with their air techs (Fox Evol, RS Debonair, DVO OTT, MRP etc etc). Yes Coil is totally sweet, but I wouldn't hang onto my coil Totem forever (which I still love btw)

Small bump compliance is marketing but highly subjective so it works, it does get thrown around a lot though. I'm now waiting for tire companies to start using it to market their tires - (which is true, depending on tire compound & pressure, definitely helps with small bumps) Wink
  • 2 1
 @sdken: so you admit that you haven't used a bad fork in such a long time that you don't remember what bad small bump compliance feels like.

it's not marketing, it's a feature of good forks. if a suspension maker using the fact that their fork has a good quality is marketing, well then i guess everything is marketing, and now the term has lost all meaning
  • 1 3
 @xeren: Sure, give the fork extra air and go for a trail ride and use about half it's travel and there goes your small bump compliance. Look at the Race Face Next R new handle bars on their website, pretty sure they just market those for better "small bump compliance" as well. Nothing against all those vendors though, just marketing at it's best.
  • 2 0
 @sdken: so your argument is that if you deliberately set up a fork wrong to remove its small bump compliance altogether, it won't have small bump compliance?

are you trying to say that all forks have SBC? yes, all forks have some. but only good forks that are set up well have good SBC. you'll know when you suddenly stop thinking about your fork when you're riding because it's smoothing things out perfectly. I guess you haven't gotten there yet. maybe one day.
  • 1 0
 @unclesomebody: I’m only experienced in Murphy’s law, so I probably got some things wrong, but I was trying to explain that while coils are described as having a linear spring curve , that doesn’t mean that it takes the same amount of force to compress across the length of its travel.
  • 2 0
 I've been happy with mine, just wish there was something to make the pike damper better that they offered in conjunction.
  • 3 0
 Not cheap but it feels like a coil bro!
  • 7 4
 If you’ve got the money this could be a rebounding success
  • 2 2
 I have no doubt it's awesome. Several of my friends have them. I'm a coil guy, but was converted to air forks with the advent of @vorsprung Luftkappe delivered to my door for $85usd
  • 1 0
 I can't wait to try my bike with the new kit in it. It looks like maybe in June though when all the snow melts. F off winter.
  • 1 0
 Still a bummer that there is no 180 mm version for a fox 36. That would be perfect for all the new "freeriders" that are around now. I would love it in my propain spindrift!
  • 3 2
 Why did the “thud” issue happen in the first place? Did PUSH explain the reason?
  • 5 2
 Kind of explained here - the culprit seemed to be the air bump stop hitting top of the lower shaft. There's a small bit of rubber on the bottom of the bump stop that's supposed to keep things quiet, but it wasn't working as intended. Push sent me a replacement Air Bump Stop, which had a thicker piece of rubber in place, along with what seemed to be more negative pressure.
  • 5 4
 @Racer951: I read that but that didn’t explain why he got sent bad parts that didn’t work right out of the box! Not hating on PUSH just want to know why! If it’s not an issue then why mention it in the article!
  • 1 1
 @rivercitycycles: it seems it may happen in certain forks in which push sends out the other part. It doesn’t sound like it’s stock and may or may not happen in certain forks
  • 1 0
 @rivercitycycles: Sounds like the first piece of rubber on the bump stop was too small to eliminate the thud, so they remedied it with bigger rubber.
  • 7 1
 @rivercitycycles: It was just a defective rubber bumper that was replaced. These things sometimes happen and when they do we take care of the customer. We sent Pinkbike an off the shelf kit just as the customer would receive it.
  • 2 0
 @PUSH: I’m not doubting your customer service! In fact, PUSH has top notch CS and have always done right with me.
  • 2 0
 Flashbacks of Darren and Stan at Eibach
  • 3 0
 good4commute
  • 1 0
 To PUSH,

Will this work with a Lyrik Dual air 160/130mm? If yes, I am very interested.
  • 2 0
 Yes.
  • 1 0
 @PUSH: would this work on a 180/150mm dual position Lyrik?
  • 2 0
 367 grams ! So heavy!
Can't we make a spring from air?
  • 1 0
 Once the kit is installed do I still need to put air in the fork? How much?
  • 1 1
 Surely they should just provide the better part that stops the loud noise it makes as standard in the kit..... Instead of only offering it to people who complain.
  • 3 2
 If it was £100 less i would buy one. Too much for me though.
  • 1 1
 Wouldn't put it on my XC bike, but can't quite beat that gush gush on the downs.
  • 5 6
 I'd strongly recommend riding the new fox forks with evol air springs before committing to this...
  • 2 3
 I was just about to comment the same thing. Moving onto the 2018 fox 36 i feel it is just as good as a coil fork. Also, i forget who it is doing it, but isnt there a company whos fork allows you to adjust the negative spring to give more suppleness?
  • 3 1
 @doe222: MRP lets you adjust negative air pressure.
  • 2 2
 MRP Suspension in regards to filling the negative air side @doe222 . The performance will most likely deteriorate quickly until serviced. Then a short period of a super plush fork before back to harshville. Also temperature change, elevation change, etc won't effect the coil like it would an air spring. However, I DO NOT HAVE A 2018 36. So there's that.
  • 1 1
 could it really be that easy ? almost sounds too good to be true
  • 6 1
 Forks are very modular in their makeup. So you can, for example, get the nicer damper and turn your Yari into a Lyrik if/when your damper shits the bed (or if you got the Yari on an OEM build and just want to upgrade). The air spring is just a simple module - not surprising that it's easy to replace it with a coil module. Shocks would be a different gig, since they're smaller and more intricate - but the basic form factor of a fork with those big fat stanchions make for a wide open playing field.
  • 1 0
 @g-42: Yes put a charger in a Yari , better , maybe coil spring next
  • 2 2
 Bike components and parts prices getting absurd day by day.
  • 1 1
 Do you really want a 5 pound fork.............
Below threshold threads are hidden

Post a Comment



Copyright © 2000 - 2019. Pinkbike.com. All rights reserved.
dv56 0.067233
Mobile Version of Website