Raaw Announces Madonna V2 with Updated Frame Design & Geometry

Jan 14, 2020
by Ruben Torenbeek  
PRESS RELEASE: Raaw Mountain Bikes

The first Madonna was launched in 2017 and started the journey of Raaw. Since then we’ve been very privileged to meet many riders and share endless kilometres of trails. It’s been an amazing experience so far.

As it goes in life things evolve and change, we gather experience and constantly aim to improve. The Madonna V2 is the result of all the riding, observing and chin-scratching we have done over the past two years.

Raaw Madonna V2
• 29" wheels
• Travel front/ back: 170mm (180) / 160mm
• External cables, threaded BB
• 6066 aluminium
• Double sealed pivots
• Available end of February
• Black and Raw color options
• Frame kits from 2.290 Euro (incl VAT) or $2137 USD (excl VAT)


Geometry

The Madonna V2 adds a size small, upping the family to four sizes. Medium has grown to 455mm reach. Large and extra-large also gain some length. The steps between the four sizes are now evenly distributed with 25mm reach steps between sizes and 15mm head tube length steps. The four sizes feature three different seat tube angles to maintain a very balanced and centered seated position that still leaves some room for the upper body to move.

The geometry numbers are now based around a 170mm travel fork. The option of 180mm travel up front will also fit the Madonna V2 like a dream, but would alter the geometry slightly.

With the Madonna V2 we’ve reinforced what the first Madonna was initially designed for. While being an excellent climber the focus still remains on downhill performance. The head angle is slackened to 64.5˚ and accompanied by a 44mm offset fork. The reach and stack numbers have grown giving the bike an even more planted character.




Dropout Inserts

We use different chain stay lengths between frame sizes because we believe it’s very important to have balance between the front and rear of the bike. But we also appreciate that riders have their own preferences. Therefore, we’ve designed the dropouts with inserts. The different frame sizes come with growing chain stay lengths following what we think fits best. But we also offer additional inserts in our shop so you can change and experiment with different chain stay lengths.




Rocker 60 & Rocker 65

The suspension of the Madonna V2 is designed around two different rocker links, the Rocker 60 and the Rocker 65. Both rocker links generate 160mm of travel at the rear wheel, each with just over 20% of progression. But the differentiating factor is the shock stroke. The Rocker 60 uses 60mm of stroke on the shock to generate 160mm of travel at the rear wheel. The Rocker 65 uses 65mm of stroke to produce the 160mm of travel. This results in a higher leverage ratio for the Rocker 60 that is best suited for riders up to 90kg and a lower leverage ratio for the Rocker 65 that is best for riders over 90kg.

Riders on the lighter end of the scale benefit from the Rocker 60 with more mechanical leverage that helps the damping and adds to the small bump sensitivity. The Rocker 65 enables heavier riders to run a lower air pressure or spring rate and happy damping for the shock.

The different stroke lengths on the shock are fixed internally but based around the same shock. A 205 x 60 shock can be modified to 205 x 65 and vice versa. But this needs to be done directly by FOX.

The Rocker 65 (left) is best for rider over 90 kg, the Rocker 65 (right) is best for rider up to 90 kg

Design

The refined top tube design reaffirms our core direction at Raaw, where functionality and durability are highest priorities. The straight top tube makes for increased bottle cage space and helps save weight.

Two fresh gussets are used to guarantee smooth transitions between tubes in key areas.

Comparing to the previous Madonna, the weight of the Madonna V2 has reduced by 150g. This is down to the new top tube design, allowing for an extended thinner tube section, and by adding the Super Leggero AL7075 hardware as standard.



Frame Protection

The Madonna V2 features a new down tube protector. The protector is made from soft 5mm thick rubber and can simply be stuck to the frame. It covers the full width of the down tube and extends over the bottom bracket weld.

A new chain stay protector is also made from soft rubber and features a ribbed pattern to silence chain-slap. The ribs are exaggerated towards the front and cover every single bit of chain stay that would otherwise be exposed to the chain. The chain stay protector can also simply be stuck to the frame.

The inside of the right seat stay is also protected with a pre-cut silicon piece.


Gear Storage

The Madonna V2 features an external gear storage solution, allowing different options for the rider. Two bottle cage bosses under the top tube accept mounts from accessory brands, like Wolf Tooth, offering straps and bags for personalized storage.

A bottle cage mount is standard on all sizes. Size small and medium can fit a 500 ml bottle, size large and extra-large have plenty of space for any bottle. Even beer.


Main Pivot

Updated main pivot caps eliminate any potential creaky noises and ensure a quiet bike ride after ride. The main pivot nut evolves and uses the Shimano Bottom Bracket tool interface for tightening.

The Madonna V2 avoids beating around the bush and comes standard with a 203mm brake mount on all sizes. 180mm brake mounts are also available, if that’s what you prefer.




The Madonna V2 up in the mountains of Champery

The best conditions!

The trails in Morgins, Switzerland, deliver the good stuff

Berms like bathtubs


For more information click here.




MENTIONS: @ShapeRideShoot




208 Comments

  • 67 1
 So many things to love about this bike (rocker 65 for heavy riders overall), but for my everyday riding, I can live with way less travel (F/R).
I'g strongly consider a 160/140 (F/R) version.
Still, so much to love.
  • 14 0
 Same here. I was hoping for a less travel version of the Madonna since it's release. Just love the style and the ideas behind it.
  • 6 0
 Same for me!
I love this bike and the design principles but for the trails I have available 150 (160)F / 140 rear is about right.
RAAW, ANY chance of a shorter travel version in the future?
  • 10 0
 Mike Levy shoulda went for this.
  • 56 0
 @NorthernIron: working on it! But not planned for the near future. Big travel for now Smile
  • 20 0
 So nice to see a bike where the team have thought about all the important details, rather than the graphics... CS length varies with rider size: check. STA varies with rider size: check. Shock length varies with rider weight: check (genius). Bottle and roll tool storage: double check. Neat external, rock proof cable routing: check. Sturdy big-ass bearings: check. I'm guessing a shorter travel version could be (another) rocker away...
  • 11 5
 @mountainsofsussex: sadly most a lot of people who ride bikes now *cough* punters care more about plastic frames & flash paint jobs. People who want bikes like this are in the minority
  • 12 0
 I'd love a 140/130 650B version of this
  • 6 2
 Dream bike is one with "too much" travel that pedals like it's "under-biked". That's why I ordered the new Enduro. \m/
Cheers to design evolution. This bike looks sick too though....... for a fraction of the cost too..... Blank Stare
  • 1 0
 @Woody25: YES. or even a 150mm each end.
  • 6 1
 Buy this frame
Buy Offset bushings for the lower shock mount
Buy a DVO Topaz 2 Shock and reduce the travel to what you prefer via those special spacers (not volume spacers but stroke limiters)
-> identical geometry at sag, eg 140mm back, good uphill position
  • 2 6
flag stumphumper92 (Jan 14, 2020 at 6:55) (Below Threshold)
 a 150/130 would be tight butthole too!
  • 2 1
 Look into the forbidden Druid.
  • 3 0
 Look into the new Pygas coming out of South Africa. The Hyrax (140mm rear) and the Slakline (160mm rear) look very similar in overall numbers and sturdy build quality.
  • 1 0
 @NorthernIron: Thisssss
  • 1 0
 @chyu: he likes shorter travel
  • 3 0
 And I dream about a DH bike from @RAAWMountainBikes ! Smile
  • 2 0
 @zyoungson: I guess a minority is fine for a small company like this. I presume there isn't a huge tooling cost to pay back on a fairly simple aluminium frame.
  • 2 0
 @MatthewCarpenter: what would happen with the bb height?
  • 1 0
 Yes
  • 4 0
 The link options to adjust leverage (I think 3 would be better) is what every manufacturer should be doing. Highly progressive bikes feel shit for light riders, as do linear for heavier guys.
  • 33 1
 Gorgeous bike
  • 5 55
flag chasejj (Jan 14, 2020 at 9:31) (Below Threshold)
 Cool bike indeed. Nice numbers, but they gotta change the name -Madonna? Named after a skank like that?
What's the next model? The CardiB?
  • 25 2
 @chasejj: @chasejj: Madonna (from medieval Italian ma donna, meaning "my lady") most commonly refers to: Mary, mother of Jesus, a religious figure in Christianity and Islam.

It's a name referencing the symbol of the ultimate woman and/or bike... very fitting if you ask me.

But yes, most uninformed Americans might simply think of the old pop star.
  • 23 0
 @chasejj: It's called about Madonna della Guardia. Famous Trail in Finale Ligure, Italy. EWS Stage few years ago and the kind of terrain it's aimed for.
  • 3 0
 @islandforlife: @islandforlife: woah there don't loop all of us American's together for one American's ignorance...
  • 1 1
 @stumphumper92: Haha, ya, realized I did that after I submitted and couldn't adjust the comment. cheers.
  • 1 2
 @islandforlife: -52? Really?My plan for total neg prop dominance is succeeding. Pinkbike comments never disappoint.
  • 20 2
 Not sure if it’s the rawness or the attention to the details, maybe both! Amazing bike
  • 14 1
 This is the ONLY FSR and perhaps only EU bike that I would consider buying. In terms of construction, overall design approach and brand story, RAAW competes with Banshee in my brain-circus, which I had been thinking no brand will achieve. Simply beautiful, a product worth of staring at.
  • 4 2
 Yep, both are up there with Knolly as well.
  • 9 0
 @islandforlife: raaw manufacturers in the same factory as knolly...and grim donut
  • 3 2
 @islandforlife: if Knolley had the geo and features then sure, but last I checked that's a NO...
  • 5 0
 @phalley: Genio ftw! Best welds in the biz
  • 4 1
 @stiingya:
2020 Knolly Warden
1. Stout, meticulously detailed, best in the biz aluminum frame, w/ storage or spot for Di2 built-in under the frame protection (built in the same factory as RAWW bikes).
2. Top notch suspension system
3. 160 R / 160 or 170 F
4. Geo size L: Reach = 500, WB = 1251, STA = 77, HTA = 64.75 (64.25 w/ 170)
5. RAWW has adjustable stroke/shock... Knolly has adjustable geo/progression

Wheel-size is different... 27.5 for Knolly, 29 for RAWW... but that's personal preference and Knolly is currently slowly revamping their entire line, will probably have a longer travel 29'r next year. Or get the same features, quality and specs in the shorter travel 29r (135/150 or 160) in the Fugitive LT.
  • 1 0
 @phalley: I was actually wondering about that! And ya, in that Grim Donut vid when they're touring the factory you can see some blue and orange Knolly Fugitive frames hanging.
  • 1 0
 @phalley: I said the same thing when I saw the welds
  • 3 1
 @islandforlife: Which is irrelevant since they don't make a Warden 29er. Great that Knolly's revamping their whole line. But the Fugitive LT was only available last summer? The large LT = 76/66, or 75.25/65.25 reach=477 WB = 1218 135mm R/ geo based on 150mm F. That's NOT progressive geo. Geo/chainstay not adjusted by size, shocks/leverage not adjusted by size, doesn't have the same storage ability. (you aren't really trying to say someones gonna flip their bike upside and unscrew a Di2 plate to get to their multi tool are you?) I didn't see anything about progression changing when you adjust the geometry, so that comment does not seem to be true.

I'm sure it's a great bike, some people rave about their suspension, but compared to the RAAW MAV2 it's a whole different animal. Also those multiple tiny pivots VS the large main pivot, frame aesthetics, Knolly's always gonna have that odd offset seat post due to their linkage. But at least that gives them space for a front derailleur mount...?

And also, super boost can kiss my ass...

I stand by my comment. The Warden might have better geo but it still lacks some features of the RAAW. (and has tiny wheels) Smile
  • 1 1
 @stiingya: I'm sure the linkage could be made with a normal seatpost. The offset seatpost design is just horrible if you ask me, both looks wise and XL sizing effective seat tube angle wise.
  • 7 2
 @islandforlife: Up there with Knolly?! I mean...Knolly's might ride okay but hot damn are they ugly. Pontiac Aztec level proportions on Knolly's bikes (coincidentally their bikes also look like they came from the early 2000s). This RAAW on the other hand is HOT. Porsche 911 level proportions here. Classic lines and lovely details like the huge bearings and hollow main pivot. Looks even better with the straight top tube, although the kinked top tube looked pretty good. This is certainly quite a bit lighter and/or stronger though.
  • 1 0
 @stiingya: Not saying either bike is better, the Madonna looks like a killer bike, but the Knolly Fugitive is a killer bike and I have no doubt the Warden will be as well. Fugitive's geometry is actually progressive, just dosen't seem like it anymore. Madonna's leverage only adjusted if you spec the linkage by weight, Knolly's is more progressive in the slack setting (may not say it on the site, but it's been stated many times by employees and riders). Ya, fair point the storage under the guard isn't that easy to access, but works for a tube with multi-tool stored elsewhere.

Pivots are only small on ow stress locations, otherwise, though not a large as the Madonna (overkill for the marketing?) they turn on titanium pivots with dual row angular contact bearings. Offset seatpost allows zero issues with long droppers with long insertions at all frame sizes.

As for 157 spacing... everyone is entitled to their own opinion. For me, after riding one for a year, selling it and demoing many many bikes... I won't go back to a bike without it.

Anyway, both great bikes that rip hard and are super durable... great choices to have!!
  • 1 0
 @Primoz: I wonder if they can? At least not without coming up with a new idea...? (which is totally possible!) Look at their frames over the years and they always have that slacker offset post? And then now that seat post angles are getting steeper it gives there frames the look of a "gap" between back wheel and seat tube? More obvious on the aluminum frames. Anyway, it's just an aesthetic thing as long as the rear center doesn't get too long. (and longer rear ends are more in vogue now anyway!)
  • 1 0
 @islandforlife: I do see one mention in one review that it gets "a bit more progressive in the slack mode". But for only one mention and that it's not coming from Knolly makes me think either it was a testers opinion OR it's just not a very noticeable change??? (possible my google skills missed more reviews of their more progressive slack mode? But... pics or it didn't happen! Smile )

Totally admit that a tube in the battery compartment is a genius "hack", but accessing something behind 5 bolts is not a storage "feature".

Admit that Knollys titanium hardware and angular contact bearing might be a match in quality/longevity, etc. even though smaller? But generally speaking having larger and less pivots is better. (but no way can I prove that so I'll let that go...)

The offset seatpost thing is just aesthetics and mostly irrelevant. Some Knolly sizes/builds are pretty sweet looking, but sometimes they just look "off", mostly as STA's get steeper than there is that "gap"? Aesthetically the RAAWMAV2 might be a little simple these days, but I think those clean lines are part of why it looks so good! Now I'd ride an ugly bike that was better... But if you can ride a sweet looking bike that is better than that = win!

Yes the MAV2 is only adjusted "if" you spec one rocker or the other. But that is a feature nobody else I've heard of offering... An OE optional rocker link to tune their suspension for heavier/harder hitting riders..? Aftermarket has done this. Compatible rocker links to change travel has been done. But for OE and an option at purchase, not just charging you more money for a later upgrade? That is new to me? and AWESOME! This is like the dream of about 50% of Sentinel riders...

At any rate I'd say that for a 120mm bike the Fugitive was "up to date" - modern geo. I would not really say it was "progressive" for a 2019 release? Plenty of other 120 29ers had already been there. For whatever reason Knolly came to market with a short travel 29er trail bike at the same time everybody else was coming to market with new long travel 29ers...?

The Fugitive LT was a great idea to bring a longer travel 29er to market quickly! BUT, that mostly same geo from the 120mm bike on a 135/150-160 bike is certainly not progressive and might not even be considered "up to date" compared to bikes that were already around.

157 is fine as long as the designer can keep the stays narrow enough. But also don't think it's necessary outside of DH? Granted that is a thought experiment as I've never done a back to back to see what 157 would offer. However I've been burned by proprietary and changing standards and so I'm always going to be wary of the two...

In the end though the whole discussion is kind of moot. (which didn't stop me from spending an hour writing this... Smile ) Knolly; at this time, does not offer a comparable bike to the RAAWMAV2. I'm sure they will, and I'm sure it will be a good bike... but just because they make bikes in the same factory doesn't mean much?

Watch, tonight on PB... Aluminum Knolly Warden 29er just released... Smile
  • 1 0
 @stiingya: Haha, good chat... still disagree with some, agree with others. I will say the Fugitive LT's rear travel numbers don't do the bike justice... after demoing multiple bikes, the Fugitive felt better than most bikes with more travel. Anyway Knolly does take it's time, which is why the bikes are so well engineered, the suspension system works so well and bikes just feel "right" when you ride them. But ya, pretty sure we'll see a true long travel 29'r from them next. I think being from the same factory just means, both companies prioritize high quality production and weld quality over cost. There are other factories that will build you something similar for less... but you get what you pay for. So good on RAWW and Knolly for using Genio.

As for 157... I as well, wondered "why bother?". Then I rode the Fugitive for an extended period and during this time didn't even really notice the difference too much. It wasn't until I then demo'd a bunch of other burly bikes (Santa Cruz Megatower, etc), that I did notice a difference, and now I can't go back. You should read Knolly's explanation... which I know can be explained away as marketing BS, but if you know Noel at all, you know he's not one to bullshit anyone (having a beer with him on Friday), he's an engineering guy first and at heart and his numbers and data are not overblown. It would really have made a lot of sense for the industry as a whole to just move from 142 straight to 157 and all bikes would have been on the same standard (DH, Trail, Enduro, etc...) - www.knollybikes.com/engineering
  • 1 0
 @stiingya: Oh forgot... and ya, not sure why they don't publicize the fact the progression changes but it does, I'll have to ask Noel. I ran a smaller spacer in slack mode... it's talked about in some of the mtbr threads where Noel answers quite a few questions himself.

Also worth reading a couple of the interviews Noel has done... offers some perspective on the company, their philosophy and why their such a great company to support beyond the bikes being so good.

www.pinkbike.com/news/behind-the-bike-knollys-new-fugitive.html
nsmb.com/articles/knolly-founder-noel-buckley-interview (this one's a little older)
  • 1 0
 @islandforlife: Never read the 2nd link, and only scanned the PB article previously. (it's one of the ones I searched for info on the more progressive link) Of which, both of these articles feature a lot of discussion of the Fugitive when it was brand new. So it really doesn't make sense that in all of that discussion about the new bike that such a feature wouldn't get a mention...? That is some X-files stuff there. (I want to believe... queue the synth/whistle music)

In the NSMB article he says a carbon fugitive would be available in 8 months? Wonder what's up with that. Then he also says he went to 157 to get shorter rear stays. Even he bows out of the "stronger wheel" argument. Also mentions how the slack offset forward seat tube is key to building a 29er for clearance.

Very interesting reading about his thoughts and experiences and the hurdles to go through making mountain bikes in another country, especially when your a smaller company. I can see how his brand has built such a following, reading through some of the comments has the kind of dedication that reminds me of Turner back in the day. (wonder how Big S and others using a similar suspension concepts got around his 4by4 patent?)

At any rate, yes good chat!
  • 16 2
 Raaw Donut
  • 10 2
 Grim Madonna
  • 4 6
 @vemegen: RAAW like a Virgin Madonna!
  • 12 0
 Orded mine first thing this morning! Bring on delivery!
  • 1 0
 Lucky!
  • 2 2
 ORDER!
  • 12 2
 looks like a... a fucking epic bike.
  • 7 1
 This looks amazing. Any possibility of running it as a mullet? I'm a bit on the short side and my concern with any long travel 29" bike is buzzing my arse on the rear tyre on the steep stuff.
Also, are these coil friendly and can they be purchased without a shock?
  • 13 0
 Thanks! You can, but it would alter the geometry quite a bit. The bb would end up being very low, we recommend 29 front and back. Yes, we offer coil and air options from Fox and also offer the frame without shock. We've got a section on our website explaining the suspension design, the two different rocker links and also shock choice.
  • 12 4
 how about attaching wooden blocks to your pedals?
  • 9 2
 @RAAWMountainBikes: Pls. release a 27.5 for this model. I'm not tall to fit for the 29er.
  • 1 18
flag metong (Jan 14, 2020 at 2:34) (Below Threshold)
 @RAAWMountainBikes: external cables routes ????
  • 30 0
 @metong: yes '!!!!'
  • 1 0
 @RAAWMountainBikes: I guess you raise the BB by running inverted offset shock hardware, but would need to do some serious maths to see if the geo was still ok.

Regardless, this looks like a really great bike with tons of well thought out details.
  • 3 1
 @RAAWMountainBikes: what about a flip chip on V3 like the scott ransom? Let you run 29, 650b and mullet?
Honestly one of the reasons why I bought said bike. Would be ace to get some more cable management on the frame for shock levers too. Honestly would swap my ransom frame for a Raaw if it did this.
  • 5 0
 @drmantistobogganmd: Thanks for the feedback. 27 on the back is interesting, but we prefer a more dedicated design. Not saying that options are bad, it's just that 29 fits so well. We offer cable guide parts for 4 cables, in case you want a remote on the shock, so that's an option.
  • 2 5
 @RAAWMountainBikes: make a 150mm hardtail Wink
  • 1 0
 @RAAWMountainBikes: Nice one on the guides. I just hate running a 29 in the back when I am in the alps and hitting steep stuff.
But I run a 29 in the rear mostly at home when I am on flatter stuff and just general trail riding an climbing.
  • 2 0
 @RAAWMountainBikes:

What about a fr 160/150 + r140mm 29er?
  • 5 0
 @tobiusmaximum: What for? So many exist already. And aluminium hardtails suck, better off a steel one. You`re british, you should know that Wink
  • 1 0
 @drmantistobogganmd: It looks like they are using guides similar to these: www.paragonmachineworks.com/frame-building-parts/cable-stops-guides/quadruple.html

So if you get a frame you could likely swap out to whatever guides you needed if you change setup.
  • 1 0
 @clamps81: with trunnion upper and proprietary lower shock mount it doesn´t look promising.
  • 1 1
 @softsteel: how very racist of you! Wink
  • 2 0
 @softsteel: You cheese eating surrender monkey.
  • 1 0
 @Mondbiker: yeah now I'm home and had a chance to watch the videos and spend some time on the site it seems that may not work.

A shame really, but I guess it's better to try and do one thing really well than try and compromise by introducing more flip chips etc, especially as they are a smaller company.

Still love the look of it though, just wish I was taller!
  • 1 1
 @RAAWMountainBikes: I LOVE IT!!!! Keyboard warriors all upset with a question. Good luck Raaw...you Raawk!
  • 13 4
 No 57° head angle, no 82° seat tube angle, no 500mm reach.....WTF is this?
  • 1 0
 Yesterday’s news.
  • 9 0
 I'd be curious to see the Raaw Madonna and the Privateer 161 on a test field.
  • 1 0
 It seems to me that the price has come down and it may be related to the Privateer 161 retail. They look very similar, but one was double the price.
  • 2 0
 @qreative-bicycle, 2nd this. Both look prime

@jaame, to be fair Raaw looks like it is a nicer frame set with some more features. Privateer is a no nonsense build, big fan of the concept tho & will most likely be picking one up for my next rig.
  • 1 0
 @zyoungson: I shortlisted it but then I bought a Capra the other day. The mulletability was the clincher. You never know until you go, right?
  • 1 0
 @jaame: You could mullet Privateer just fine with single offset bushing.
  • 3 0
 @Mondbiker: Cant imagine an offset bushing would stay put for very long if used the opposite way
  • 1 0
 @zyoungson: It does no probs, there is next to no rotation happening there and clamping force is more than sufficient.
  • 1 0
 @Mondbiker: I always wondered about that. I figured it would eventually turn around and then you’d run into contact issues. Interesting to know it can be done though.
  • 1 0
 @jaame: Give it a go of you fancy, I highly doubt contact issues would occur with 1 or 2mm shorter shock i2i lenght but it´s better to be safe than sorry.
  • 1 0
 @Mondbiker: It's too late mate. My Capra will be here this week hopefully and all I need to do is slap the 27er in the back and set the shock in the high position.
  • 1 0
 I really wish that one of these brands could offer an XXL front triangle option with a 525mm reach. Steep seat tubes cut through that cockpit size and if you’re, say, 6’4” these bikes get small real fast. It would be nice to have an option that’s not Geometron.
  • 1 0
 @alexsin: 75mm stem?
  • 5 0
 This is literally the bike I've been looking for, geometry wise its perfect, as a 6' 5" foot tall guy (194cm) the XL would be a good fit Travel wise it's bang on as I do a lot freeride & trail rider plus I weight about 95kg. Love the fact it's a 29er as well, I tend to find lots of bike company opt for 160mm travel on their 29er enduros which kinda puts me off as I am quite heavy. Good work Ruben

More build options would be nice, as the stock builds are a little out of my range.
  • 4 0
 go frame only and build up a cheaper spec. I'd say the xt spec is brilliant parts wise and value.
  • 1 0
 @Jblack89: Yeah all-round good value, frame only could be an option
  • 1 0
 Check out the Last Glen, also an excellent bike for tall riders, I am 6ft4 and have thier xxl.
  • 1 0
 Hey question. I'm not an uber rider but am 6-4 tall guy (lean 190lbs). How are you getting along with these super long wheelbases when it comes to everyday riding? I'm pretty stable on a 150mm travel Fox 36 XL 29er. If buying new frame now, I'd be a bit concerned about the cons that come with all that extra wheelbase when I'm not on super sketchy DH....tho I can't say I have ridden a bunch of models (this is more bike than I need usually). I think its prob great for shorter guys that now ride a wheelbase similar to what I have now, tho the XL sizes are long and the corners/switchbacks don't get any wider for us tall dudes. Curious what you'd think.
  • 1 0
 @Svinyard: I’m 6’6” on a 535 reach bike with a 1340 wheelbase and it’s not an issue on Shore trails except on a couple of notable exceptions where I have to be very very precise. Otherwise it’s nice to finally a bike with proper balance characteristics front-rear to my center of gravity.
  • 1 0
 @alexsin: that's a big bike on some gnarly trails. Sounds like it working great, tho geez it seems like every Shore edit I see has LOTS of "very very pricese-ness" going on lol.

Its it really just all good with next to no draw backs? I always wonder if geo changes are truly fixing "flawed" Geo where the pros vastly outweigh the cons...or if its more of a give-and-take. Sounds like your experience is more of the former. Thanks man
  • 7 2
 If you show me a nimble, a bit FR oriented 27,5 version of this beauty with similar travel I'm all yours. It looks perfect! Simple, form followed function, wise tech solutions, design choices without gimmicks. Impressive!
  • 9 1
 wow
  • 7 0
 Raaw-raaw-raaw-raa-ah-aaww!
  • 1 2
 Bloodlust for the win !
  • 2 0
 Roma-roma-ma!
  • 5 0
 What's this? No bend in the toptube? No 'belly'. And still room for a bottlecage? How is this possible?
/sarc
  • 3 0
 Excuse me while I start collecting cans along the roadside. Damn!!! one fine looking machine , the V1 caught my eye. The V2 has stepped that up a notch. Well done , time to start hoarding my change .
  • 6 1
 please bring a 27.5 version !
  • 3 0
 Im in the "make a shorter travel version and call me interested" camp. Amazing looking bike, unfortunately my trails aren't amazing
  • 1 0
 Look at the "Glen" from Last, which is also a German based brand. This should fill your needs.
  • 1 0
 @LuDH: Oh, I've seen that. What a beut'!
  • 1 0
 @jesse-effing-edwards: I just acquired a LAST Glen, Raw finished, with 160mm front and 140 rear.
13.8kg, perfect fit for agressive AM/EN rides! More in my gallery.
  • 4 0
 Ruben knows what I'm looking for. Size L to me asap. :-)
  • 3 0
 Make it 2
  • 1 0
 @pakleni: three!
  • 3 0
 thats nice.

agree would be looking at a 160/140 frame next but thats nice!
  • 3 1
 Great job @RAAWMountainBikes !
It also looks nice.

I love to see small and courageous companies grow.

Maybe one day a handy and ripping 27 RAAW ? Smile
  • 4 3
 A lot to like, but that price!
You're seriously trying to steer buyers away from Nicolai?
Same money, same material, similar geometry (albeit 2 sizes up), less adjustability, but one is made in Germany, one isn't
  • 9 2
 Except, that one's been frozen in time for the past 20 years with its design, and the other one looks mint.
  • 3 1
 @fluider: mmmmm you mean the G1 that came out last year?
  • 3 0
 @IllestT: I mean any Nicolai, in general. I consider Nicolai frames generally as visually and proportionaly unpleasant to my way of seeing things. They've built some brand identity out of the way they've probably have to make their frames, because make it always in Germany was always higher priority for them than other things. And their 'identity' they're still grabbing from bike to bike, from year to year. Like a weird self-purpose exhibition of welds and machining.
People always disliked me for saying this :-).
  • 1 0
 They aren´t the same material but other than that I agree, RAAW is nice bike and all but there is no comparison at this price point.
  • 2 0
 Typo in the Rocker pic description fyi...

"The Rocker 65 (left) is best for rider over 90 kg, the Rocker 65 (right) is best for rider up to 90 kg"
  • 2 0
 Is the 340mm bottom bracket height just the height with the 180 fork? The BB height when pedaling is the only complaint i've seen in any review about the bike.
  • 3 0
 These guys need to release a short travel bike and call it the DOGG (or DAWG)
  • 3 0
 Geometry is in the database for comparison purposes...
geometrygeeks.bike/bike/raaw-madonna-v2-2020
  • 3 0
 I don't normally comment on the looks of a bike, but this is drop dead gorgeous. Beautiful bike guys.
  • 3 3
 I’m sure it’s an amazing bike but in my opinion in 2020 a bike in this price should come with an interior cable routing . Yeah, functionality of exterior routing, Blah blah blah... how often do you really change those cables? Very rarely. Let me ride a bike with a cable-free look.
  • 2 1
 I disagree. Interior routing means I never want to replace my housing and it's harder to get a really good bleed. External makes it so much easier.
  • 1 0
 @phalley: Wha a nonsense! The oil goes inside the cable and you use a syringe to push an oil from one end and another syringe to pull oil from the other end. What does it matter if the cable runs inside the frame or it’s attached to the frame from the outside?? I did change the outer gear cable on my bike even if it’s an internal routing and It was done easily!
  • 4 1
 And I thought the v1 was cool...
  • 2 0
 Do you think I could fit a loaf of Soreen in that main pivot. Mmmm, tasty ride snack.
  • 2 0
 My next bike fo sho !... just 3 months more and I´m ready

Congrats Ruben!
  • 1 0
 Updated version looks awesome. I’m a little bummed they got rid of their pretty ingenious storage on the V1 but more bikes should have bosses for storage like this.
  • 1 0
 Anyone between 6'2-6'3" (~189-190cm) on one of these? Seems like I'm more likely to be on an XL, but I'm near the border. Have people felt more of an urge to size up or down?
  • 2 0
 XL. Friend of me with 1.85 feels just fine on it.
  • 1 0
 @patugly: Thanks! I was leaning in that direction, but the extra reach and slightly broader recommended height range of the V2 made me think.
  • 1 0
 XL for sure. I'm 6'1" and have and XL Murmur with 515 reach at 76 STA.
  • 1 0
 27.5 wheel on back Would only drop bb by about 10mm could you not work out a chip for that?
Still waiting for an e-stay version though!
  • 2 0
 How did you come to that number out of curiosity?
  • 1 0
 @Mondbiker: Swapped out rear wheel!
  • 1 0
 @aljoburr: On this exact bike? Because I calculated something slightly below 13mm BB height change so was interested how accurate it was.
  • 1 0
 Trunion mount on the shock unfortunately. Last I checked, Fox wasn’t selling replacements if you damaged it e.g. bottoming out.
  • 2 0
 Does that main pivot use headset angular contact bearings?
  • 6 0
 Thanks for asking, the bearings are regular non-angular but, full complement bearings.
  • 9 0
 @RAAWMountainBikes: Properly oversized for the task at hand i might say.

I was drooling at the details just now: Main pivot is not too low as in some other 4bar horst link designs, the tunable chainstay length,protection in the correct places and different wight oriented rocker link and bearings on every single pivot.

Then I visited the website and looked at the hardware page. Nice Smile

Congratulations for the thouroughly thought out and executed bike!
  • 3 0
 @pcbsdusr: Thank you so much!
  • 1 0
 @pcbsdusr: Yup. After long time, finally some FSR with properly sized pivots. That got me, as well.
  • 1 0
 Greatly made bike, it looks brilliant. The BB drop is a little to big for me though, I have enough pedal strikes at 25mm drop. Bugger.
  • 2 0
 Grim Donut AR (Actually Rideable) edition?
  • 2 0
 Looks like an error with the "actual seat tube angle" on the L and XL
  • 3 0
 Good find, yes, our mistake. Should be 74 for the actual angle on L and XL.
  • 2 0
 I like the "no nonsense" approach a lot.

Would a Fox X2 fit too?
  • 4 0
 Yes, it's also an option
  • 2 0
 Gorgeous frame Nuf said!
  • 1 0
 We have the Madonna, when do we get the shorter travel version... the Kylie Smile The bike looks amazing btw. great job.
  • 2 0
 Best looking bike out there!
  • 2 0
 All that talk of stroke length is really making my chain grow.
  • 1 0
 I have no need for a 170/160 mtb, but if I didn't, that is one good-looking bike! Looks like aluminum is back en vogue!
  • 2 1
 So because RS does not have a fork with 44 offset, would you recommend 42 or 46?
  • 2 0
 RS doesn´t offer 46mm offset 29er fork. 44mm is short offset from fox, 42mm is equivalent from RS.
  • 2 1
 I'd love to 'get into the groove' with that bike!

*Official start of the pun sub-thread hopefully

And.......GO!.......
  • 1 0
 Looks just about perfect. If I hadn't just gotten ahold of a Capra LTD last Fall, this would be on order right now.
  • 1 0
 This was how i imagined the V3 Banshee should have looked like, cleaner lines faster looking silhouette.
  • 1 0
 Looks eerily like an improved version of my old Turner RFX.... where do I sign me up ???
  • 2 0
 Compatible with dual crown forks?
  • 2 0
 Different strokes for different folks!
  • 3 1
 legit..
  • 1 1
 How come the seat tube angle changes in the small and medium and not in the large or xl?
  • 5 0
 The same angle works for both large and xl, but m and s benefit from a little slacker seat tube angle.
  • 1 0
 @RAAWMountainBikes:
Ah I was reading it as the first was unsaged and the second was sagged and couldn’t work out why the large and xl was the same, my bad.
  • 15 14
 Nice but, wrong wheel size for me
  • 15 3
 If Courdurier can smash on a 29 you can too! She's like 5'
  • 2 16
flag nojzilla (Jan 14, 2020 at 7:02) (Below Threshold)
 @cole-inman: who?
  • 2 0
 Sold
  • 2 3
 The overview video shows riders walking their bikes uphill quite a bit. I'm guessing not a great climbing bike? Otherwise it looks amazing!
  • 4 0
 Enduro Mag just reviewed it. They said it was a very good climber for an enduro bike and was their second favorite bike in their 17 bike test (behind only the 2x expensive S Works Enduro).
  • 2 3
 For the same price of the frame, you have a complete bike YT Capra Base in 27.7 alloy:

us.yt-industries.com/detail/index/sArticle/2340/sCategory/260
  • 2 0
 But Capra chainstays break Frown
  • 5 1
 But then you have a capra..
  • 3 0
 The base Capra is an amazing deal. If you only have 2K and need a big bike, it's hard to beat.

That being said, if you're buying complete, you need to buy the top of the line Capra to have the same level component spec as the Raaw and it's actually more expensive (though its carbon frame leaves it .7 kg lighter). And despite the lighter weight, it pedals worse than the Raaw and is less playful, so I'm not sure it matters.
  • 1 0
 People buying YT are not looking at this bike, just saying ...

In the biz, they call your argument a "straw man", because like straw, it won't stand up, and anyone looking at it will know that it's not a "real boy".
  • 1 0
 Actual seat tube angle
S: 71
M: 72.5
L: 78.5
XL: 78.5

is that right??
  • 1 0
 No, look on the website: raawmtb.com/pages/madonna-v2

size virtual actual
S 77 71
M 77.6 72.5
L 78.2 74
XL 78.2 74
  • 1 0
 Damn I love this bike...next new bike no doubt.
  • 1 0
 This is one gorgeous looking bike.
  • 1 0
 *Sings* "Like a virgin..." *Sly Smile* #Like #WANT
  • 1 0
 Just a beautifully thought out design
  • 1 0
 seat angle looks too slack...
  • 1 0
 2 year warranty?!!! Ain t buy-in it!
  • 1 0
 yeah, good thanks Smile
  • 2 2
 A Raaw hardtail would be sweet.
  • 2 2
 What about a 27.5 option, would love to see that
  • 1 1
 What happens if I go 160 mm front?
  • 1 0
 uh baby i like it RAAW
  • 1 1
 Hnnng
  • 1 4
 Why do manufacturers use BB tightening systems on their linkages? I don't want to carry a BB tool with me on every ride.
  • 2 2
 Just be lucky you didn't buy a scott like me and have a frame where even the stem and seatpost bolts are torque. Now I need to carry and additional park tool with me. I dont think it has the T-30 needed for the main shock pivot anyway.
  • 6 0
 @drmantistobogganmd:

Change the bolts?
  • 2 0
 @jlawie: Not off the shelf stuff dude. I did change the stem and seat post clamp though.
  • 22 0
 does your main pivot work loose every ride?
  • 4 0
 I'm pretty sure the logic is, you can tighten it a lot more due to bigger diameter threads, so it's not gonna come loose and you don't need the tool on a ride.
  • 4 0
 Think of the up side, then you can tighten your BB on a ride aswell
  • 2 0
 @drmantistobogganmd: is it so bad to just carry a multitool with a T30? In return you get a bolt that is far less likely to strip. I'd love all bolts to be replaced with Torx...
  • 3 0
 @Mac1987: this. I've got a park tool torx multitool, if I was running sram over shimano there's a chance I'd only need that, torx should have superceded and eliminated hex by now.
  • 2 3
 hnnnnnnnnngg
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