RockShox Lyrik - Review

Apr 25, 2016
by Mike Kazimer  
When RockShox unveiled their new Lyrik fork last summer, they didn't make any efforts to downplay the fact that it was, in essence, a beefed up version of their much-lauded Pike. After all, when you've already created one of the best performing suspension forks on the market, it only makes sense to build off that platform rather than starting from scratch.

There are internal and external differences between the two, but both forks are air-sprung and rely on RockShox's Charger damper, a closed system that uses an expanding rubber bladder to deal with the fluid that's displaced when the fork compresses.


Lyrik RCT3 Details
• Intended use: all-mountain, enduro
• Travel: 160 (tested), 170, 180mm
• Air-sprung, Charger damper
• Damper adjustments: low-speed compression, rebound
• Low-speed compression tuneable in open mode
• Stanchions: 35mm
• Axle size: 15 x 100mm or 15 x 110mm
• Weight: 2005 grams (4.42 lb)
• RCT3 Solo Air MSRP: $1030 USD
www.rockshox.com, @SramMedia

The Lyrik is available for 27.5" and 29" wheels with up to 180mm of travel. Other options include the ability to choose between RockShox's Solo Air or Dual Position Air spring, and either 15x100mm or 15x110mm Boost spacing.
RockShox Lyrik review


How is the Lyrik Different Than the Pike?

More travel options: The longest travel 27.5” Pike has 160mm of travel while the Lyrik is available with up to 180mm of travel.

Thicker stanchion walls: Both forks share the same 35mm stanchion diameter, but thicker tubing is used for the Lyrik to add additional stiffness.

More negative spring volume: In order to create a more supple initial stroke, RockShox increased the negative air spring volume.

Thicker arch: The arch that connects the two legs is 3.5mm thicker than the Pike's, another measure that was taken to increase stiffness.

Torque Cap compatible: All versions of the Lyrik are compatible with hubs using SRAM's Torque Caps, the oversized end caps designed to increase the amount of contact between the hub and the fork legs. There are Torque Cap compatible models of the Pike, but only on models with 15x110mm Boost spacing.

Weight: The Lyrik weighs approximately 150 grams (.33 lb) more than the Pike when comparing the 27.5” versions with 160mm of travel.


RockShox Lyrik review
There are three main low-speed compression settings - open, pedal, and lock, with 15 clicks of additional adjustment for the open setting.
RockShox Lyrik review
An arch that's 3.5mm taller than the Pike's gives the Lyrik additional stiffness.


Setup

If you're familiar with setting up a Pike, getting the Lyrik dialed in will feel extremely familiar. The air pressure guide is located on the left leg for easy reference, and sag gradients are printed on the fork leg. Once the air pressure is set, it's simply a matter of dialing in the amount of rebound and low-speed compression damping to suit your personal preferences. The larger low-speed compression dial has three positions: open, pedal, and lock (lock isn't a full lock out, but it does make the fork very firm for long fire road approaches), and the smaller dial on top has 15 clicks that are used to fine tune the amount of low-speed compression damping in the fully open position.

It's also possible to add or subtract Bottomless Tokens to adjust the amount of end stroke ramp up, a simple procedure that only requires removing the air spring-side top cap (make sure to let the air out first) and then threading on or unscrewing a token as needed. The 160mm Lyrik comes stock with two tokens, which worked well for my needs.

Internally, it's possible to alter the configuration of the rebound damper's shim stack if a softer or firmer rebound tune is needed. RockShox suggests doing this if riders find themselves at the far end of the range of adjustments, either a click or two from fully open or fully closed.



2016 RockShox Lyrik
The Torque Cap dropout does mean wheel installation can take a second or two longer when running a non-Torque Cap hub due to the extra room around the end caps.
2016 RockShox Lyrik
Tokens can be used to alter the way the fork feels as it nears the end of its travel. More tokens = more ramp up, fewer tokens = a more linear feel.


Performance

I've never had any complaints about the stiffness of the Pike (and I still don't), but the extra solidity of the Lyrik is noticeable out on the trail, especially on rougher sections where the terrain is constantly pushing and pulling on the fork, trying to knock it off line. The extra stiffness doesn't smack you over the head, but in a back-to-back comparison, it's immediately apparent, even when the fork is run on a non-Torque Cap equipped wheel, which is how I had it set up for most of the test period. Now, it is possible to create a fork that's too stiff, creating unwanted harshness that leads to sore hands and arm pump, but that's not the case with the Lyrik. Even on long descents full of holes and jarring roots sections it never felt like there was any unwanted feedback being transmitted through the chassis.

The Lyrik does feel plusher than the Pike at the beginning of its travel, likely due to that increased negative spring volume, and it takes noticeably less effort to move the fork through the first 20mm or so of its stroke. The extra suppleness helps filter out the high-speed chatter and creates a fork that has very, very good small bump sensitivity.

The rest of the fork's travel is well managed, with the excellent mid-stroke support that put the Charger damper on the map in the first place, and the easily-tuned ramp-up before bottom out. When the Lyrik does reach the end of the travel there's a subtle 'thwunk;' just enough to let you know that you used every last millimeter, but without ever being harsh or jarring.

Adrian Marcoux photo
Photo: Adrian Marcoux

How does the Lyrik compare to the Fox 36, its most obvious competitor? The performance offered by both forks is remarkably similar, and while they each have their own unique feel, the end result is the same - they offer reliable, predictable, and smooth bump absorption. If you'd asked me a few months ago, I would have given the Lyrik the edge as far as small bump sensitivity goes, but after spending time on Fox's updated 2017 FIT 4 damper that's no longer the case, and the two competitors are neck-and-neck once again. Fox does have the advantage when it comes to external features - the 36 is available with a damper that allows for both high-speed and low-speed compression to be adjusted independently, and they also offer a version with convertible dropouts that allow riders to run either a 15mm or 20mm thru-axle. At the end of the day, choosing one over the other will come down to what features you value the most, since both forks leave little to be desired out on the trail.


Issues

After six months of regular usage, a good portion of it in cold, muddy conditions, the Lyrik is still ticking right along without any creaks or leaks. Pulling the lowers for a quick clean and fluid change (a procedure that takes less than 30 minutes) revealed that everything was in good working condition, without any undue wear. When it comes to their suspension forks, simplicity is one of RockShox's strong suits – from setup to maintenance they've done a good job of making products that flat-out work, and don't need a degree in mechanical engineering and fluid dynamics to understand.

The Lyrik's performance and durability have been completely trouble free, and I have no complaints in that department. I do have one feature that's on my wishlist, and that's an air bleed valve that would allow the air that builds up in the lowers to be released with the push of a button, something similar to what's found on the Fox 40. After repeated long runs the fork can begin to feel overinflated, and it becomes harder to get through the last portion of its travel. Currently, the easiest thing to do is carefully slide a zip tie between the stanchion and the dust wiper to let out that trapped air. It's a simple procedure, and this issue occurs with forks from other companies as well, but a little valve would be a much more refined solution than a plastic zip tie.



Pinkbike's Take

bigquotesWhen the new Lyrik was first unveiled there were some riders who bemoaned the fact that it wasn't radically different than the Pike. Where was the Totem 2.0? I'd say those concerns are unfounded - the Lyrik handily fills the space in RockShox's lineup between the Pike and the BoXXer, a tough yet versatile fork that works well on everything from all-mountain rigs to mini-DH bikes.

After my initial time on the Lyrik the only unanswered questions were related to durability, and after months of hard usage it's passed that test with flying colors. A plush-yet-supportive on trail feel, plenty of stiffness, and a hassle-free setup all add up to a fork that's ideally suited for today's hard-charging riders.
- Mike Kazimer



Visit the high-res gallery for more images.




201 Comments

  • + 101
 Would really like to see a test on the 170/180mm options, see how it compares to a boxxer
  • + 67
 Or the 180mm options from say fox or sr suntour. With more and more companies making park-specific bikes and others making "super enduro" bikes, knowing how these products match up in performance vs. price would be very very nice.
  • + 91
 Talked to craig at avalanche. Good little tip he gave. Get a decent used yari (same chassis as lyrik) and throw his open bath cartridge and you've got a stout fork with amazing internals at a decent price Wink
  • + 25
 I have been on the 170 lyric for a bit over a month. I debated for a bit on going back to the trusty pike or trying the lyric.

All I can say right now... It was an awesome decision so far.

I'll update you in 6 weeks when my broken foot heals. (The Break unrelated to the forks performance)
  • + 7
 @diggerandrider: my son kept blowing out charger dampers so got a couple of Avalanche damper pikes. Now just have to deal with sucking air past the air piston when the fork tube flexes !
  • + 5
 @diggerandrider: speaking of the Yari, how does its damper rank up to the Charger?

I currently have one but I only have a 140mm Pike to compare to and it's on a hardtail..
  • + 28
 @bonkywonky: It's a motion control damper, so it's certainly well proven tech, just not as controlled as a charger damper due to it being an emulsion type damper, so the oil can foam up and give inconsistent damping on hard workouts, whereas the charger stays more composed because no air mixes with the damping oil.
  • + 6
 @NorthcountyAM: cheers. Ive got a banshee rune. Considering a 180/170 fork for park days
  • + 7
 @Kiwiplague: quality comment mate
  • + 0
 @Kiwiplague: cheers mate. Might be worth it to upgrade the damper then.
  • + 3
 Rockshox the best bang for the buck since the 90's. Iv rode them for over 25 years without any failures. Please bring back the TOTEM.
  • + 4
 I would like to know the difference between orange and grey token.
  • + 3
 @chyu: Size. The Pike ID is slightly larger than the Lyrik. So the Orange Token is a little bit bigger and won't work in the Lyrik, but the grey will work in both. I believe Rockshox has said they will only be supplying the Grey from here on out.
  • + 4
 @diggerandrider:

Did the same in germany. 400 Euro special price for new yari and got from m suspensiontech his lyrik open bath cartridge without stupid bladder.
Now i ve got a robust reliable even better working lyrik with 180mm for My Summer days in leogang and so on for less than 700 bucks :-D
  • + 1
 @Kiwiplague: the Avalanche damper is a emulsion type damper, we had chargers fail and could never get a rebuilt ones to feel the same. The fork leg hold a lot more oil the motion control design, we have never found the damping to be inconsistent and they don't break.
  • + 1
 @rmgoff1: got a new bike with a Pike in the last week, gray tokens.

Also, this was a boxed build kit from the factory, so it was probably sitting on the shelf for a while, so it would seem gray only has been going on for a while.
  • - 5
flag aidanbrown559 (Apr 26, 2016 at 7:56) (Below Threshold)
 but the real question is who noticed the tires that match the rims? #SRAMtires
  • + 6
 @aidanbrown559:
E13 wheels and tires Wink
  • - 4
flag nismo325 (Apr 26, 2016 at 9:25) (Below Threshold)
 @MX298: i've run a avalanche cartridges in my boxxers before and the open bath setups definitely have a less consistent feel than new bladder systems. They are plush and easy to service but as your really get into rough stuff all that oil is just flying around and gathering air.
  • + 0
 @Kiwiplague: any idea if Charger dampers come in different sizes between the Pikes and Lyriks? I was thinking to swith dampers between the two forks if possible..
  • + 2
 @OzMike: I got the 160mm lyrik on my rune and its a match made in heaven.
  • + 0
 @bonkywonky: the internal diameters of the stanchions are different, so you won't be able mix and match.
  • + 0
 Awesome fork, mega options and world class cutomer service. RS making all the right moves.
  • + 0
 @OzMike: I run it at 170 always with the dropouts in the steep position, ends up being the same HA as the 160 in neutral with a higher bb by about 3/16"
  • + 0
 @Kiwiplague: Yes the internal diameter of the stanchion is different but the Charger damper assy. is the same for the Pike and the Lyrik.
  • + 60
 Solid review Mike. Direct comparison to the Pike and the 36, covered the bases and no extra b.s.
  • + 10
 Yeah , last year's Lyrik vs next year's 36, when's the 2018 stuff coming out ? lol
  • + 2
 So true, we are not looking for a Fox 36 98.7% vs Lyrik 97.1%... go buy the fox because its 1.6% better.

Just give us three sentences that acknowledges the competitions specs and help us decide. More reviews like this will drive more traffic to pinkbike.
  • - 23
flag pinnityafairy (Apr 26, 2016 at 5:28) (Below Threshold)
 @mcbiscuit: FUX SUCKS
  • + 3
 @pigman65: Fair comparison, though, because the internals to a 2017 Lyrik should be the same as this one.

Unless RS has a revised charger coming, but I don't think that's happening.
  • + 5
 @groghunter: Yeah i appreciate that, i just love the way the bike industry releases it's products.
I spoke to Mojo yesterday, no 2016 forks left, the 17's are coming next month, so my 15's are like obsolete Smile
  • + 1
 @mcbiscuit: Yes, Fox Float 36 RC2 gets the nod because RC2 adjustability, 20x110 DH Hub capable and LIGHTER!!!
  • + 29
 still upset they didnt go 37mm stanctions and 20mm thru axel. otherwise, I feel the lyrik makes the pike obselete, .33lbs penalty for better small bump and stiffness anyday.
  • + 6
 Unless you're a real plastic weight weenie... or want 140mm travel
  • + 9
 @TFreeman: or 26"4LYFE BRO!!
  • + 4
 If you haven't maxed out the number of air tokens In the pike, there is no plushness advantage to the lyrik. As for stiffness, I'd rather have a lighter fork if not really abusing the pike. If charging hard and constantly flexing a pike, then a lyrik makes sense. It isn't like one is better than the other. They offer options that are optimal depending on usage.
  • + 2
 @MmmBones: Yes 26wurx
  • + 4
 @dfiler: Indeed. I'm no weight weenie, but for my 160 lb self, the stiffness difference is going to be negligible, so why not get a little weight savings instead?
  • + 0
 @dfiler fox 36.
  • + 1
 @dfiler: If you are maxing out the tokens, you are making your fork extremely progressive. So there would be an advantage to the Lyrik. I do agree that the fewer tokens you need, the less likely you are to feel the difference, but I don't think it works just as you describe it.
  • + 1
 @trialsracer: The decreased air chamber size is what makes the Lyrik progressive and subtle over small bumps without bottoming on drops. Point being, If you haven't decreased the Pike's chamber to the smallest possible size, there isn't an advantage to the Lyrik in that regard.
  • + 1
 @dfiler: Ah I assumed there was a difference in the particular tuning of the internals, where the fork would be tuned to manage the travel differently based on the stock air volume. What you are saying definitely makes sense though.
  • + 2
 @dfiler: Legs on the lyrik lowers are longer, it has a larger negative spring chamber which is what makes it more plush, after trying them no way was I getting a new bike with a pike on it. Fyi for anyone bombing through the review.
  • + 1
 @wildcatwilly: The point was, if you're looking for plushness but haven't maxed the adjustment of your current fork, try adjusting the current fork first. For example, my pike was a horrible fork before adding air tokens to decrease the air chamber size and thus make it more progressive. I had to keep the pressure high to avoid bottoming out and that eliminated all plushness. Adding tokens made it tuned to my riding and terrain and made it an incredibly plush fork. The difference is huge, even bigger than switching to another fork.
  • + 0
 @dfiler: Valid point, but you claimed the Lyrik has NO advantage in plushness, and even set up too soft with heavy brake dive, I didn't think the Pike was quite as plush, though thinking about it I would guess crown stiffness would affect bushing alignment, and I do ride to a point of flexing, though I can't make out why someone who is not needs 160mm of travel. Plus every reviewer refers to it as the mini boxxer rather than the big pike, and I'm pretty sure they all tune with tokens on setup. IMO this fork is underrated because it is lumped in with the Pike (the differences on paper are subtle) when it is superior on dirt.
  • + 29
 Nice comparison against a 36. Helpful for people on the fence.
  • + 5
 Hopefully it will be a normal thing now. Comparing two closest competitors for readers to see which has the edge.
  • + 4
 I have a lyric 180rct3 dual air and and a pike rc160 solo air and have had a fox36 rc2 180 float(2012) and fox36 float rc2 160 and a fox 40 coil rc2 and the lyric is more supple in the initial travel than the fox(air) and the pike solo air, it seems to have less flex than the fox 180, but not as stiff as the 40 ( not surprising) closer to the fox 36 160 just more of a coil like feel to the travel, even more plush than the pike, the charger is tuned closer to boxxer, so basically a mini boxxer!
  • + 2
 I'd go for 36 180 because you can change travel with spacers while in Lyrik you need these ridiculous pistons... Who on earth came up with such a stupid idea to make a groove in the sidewall of the inner leg for pressure equalizing. Jesus Rock Shox... Unfortunately in Europe 36 180 comes at a price of Pike and Lyrik combined, so Lyrik for me that is.
  • + 14
 @WAKIdesigns: exactly that buddy. I'd rather get a 36 but they are just so bloody expensive. You'd think the legs were actual gold
  • + 2
 @jaame: the fox ones are more expensive, but the larger diference is that any product of rockshox you can find online, or even on a shop if you know them well enogh with a big discount, as fox it isn't that way ,you can only find deals on OEM product or last year product.

But if i'm not mistaken the fox (kashima ones) are built in the USA and not China/Taiwan like the rockshox, and if you desassemble a pike/lyrik or a 36/34 you see the diference in material quality, even if they both feel good on the trail


me personaly i have a pike, but only because when i was building my bike i didn't have the extra 400 and something for a 36, otherwise that's what i would have instead
  • + 5
 @tiagomano: i'd really like to see an article with factual information describing who does what where and how. I've just been to headquarters of Sweden's biggest clothing brands and talked to the boss. It's hard not to go to such an amazing, creative place, feeling the size of the world, being so close to the top of Earth's food chain and not leave intoxicated. Soon after, in building next door I saw The True Cost movie about slavish clotjing manufacture and I am fkd up to this moment. One thing comes up all the time, the pressure to drive the cost down. Not in high end segments of any kinds of markets, but low- to mid-end consumption fkng everything. Buying into idea that things get so cheap that lucury can become affordable by magic of the free market.

I'd fkng want to know how it works in bike industry. Probably better than in cothing, but I'm eager to know. Because if getting a 200$ alu rim leaves everyone happy, then I am happy to pay that than fkng up millions of people for carbon rim at 80$.

Rant over. I am just fkd up. Believe me or not but the boss has 666 in his telephone number. It's so much bigger than me.

Back to subject. The only thing that wonders me with Fox 36 is that it costs on par with Öhlins which is made in Sweden where wages ate double than US
  • + 6
 @tiagomano: Fox is all made in Taiwan. I believe even the dampers are now made in Taiwan, not just the chassis.

The reason is because they want to maintain exclusivity and rockshox are going for the flooding approach.

I like the 36 and it is a bit better quality than any rockshox fork I've seen. Not twice as good though. To be honest, it's the gold colour i like. I was planning to get a marzocchi 350 with brown legs until they went tits up.
  • + 1
 Sorry just to clarify my second paragraph. I mean Fox is not discounted because they want to maintain exclusivity. Waki's ohlins comment is good evidence of that actually. Of course that stuff costs more than Fox to manufacture.
  • - 1
 @jaame: maybe now it is all in taiwan, but a short time ago i saw somewere that the kasshima level were made in the us, probably only the assemble and build the dampers or coating the kashima.
but even if they are all made in taiwan the quality is inforced by who ever is there to quality control them , and the matirials used.
i've had problems with a fox 34 but only neer the end of it's warranty, wich probably to a person who only rides at the weekend would never had that(i ride a lot) , my 40 , dhxrc4 and float x never had problems, as for my pike and monarch plus debonair i had problem's way to many times, the fork was replaced 6 rides old for a blown damper, them a few months later the crown sterring became loose making noises and feeling wrong, the monarch had a blown rebound damper and leaked oil for 2 times. theyr product work's good, but it's to be replaced not that many rides after, as fox will last longer,and maybe that's what you pay extra for.
and at leat in Portugal , Fox warranty service is way bether than rock shox
  • + 2
 @jaame: fox wan'ts to mantain it's premium brand status ofering bether quality
rockshox wan'ts to sell to everybody, even if they are compromising a bit the quality

ohlins is proving them self on the market, they can charge premium price to a certain point, but at some price the offer and demande does not match
  • + 3
 @tiagomano: I've personally never owned anything by fox, purely because of the price. I've had a lot of problems with a monarch plus, needing multiple rebuilds in the first six months. Everything else I've had from rs has been faultless, except for needing too frequent lowers services.

Most unreliable fork I've had was a marzo 55, but it also had the best action when working.
  • + 1
 Do you do your own service?
  • + 1
 @properp: on the pike i change the lower's oil like once every two month's damoer service (and consumabels changed) as well ad the monarch are sent to service
Only started doing something with the pike
  • + 6
 @tiagomano: Based on my experience, if you are the type who likes to upgrade every season or two, you're better off going with Rockshox because you'll save a ton of money and have pretty much the same performance as a Fox. However if you intend to hang on to your gear for 4+ years you should just fork (huhuh) out the extra for the Fox because your RS fork will be spending more and more time at the LBS waiting for parts as time goes on. I've owned 5 Fox forks and many many more RS forks in my riding history, and the difference in reliability is incredible. I've NEVER had an issue with a Fox fork that required disassembly. Conversely, i've never owned an RS fork that DIDN'T have such an issue. That said, I currently have a Pike RCT3 and love it, when it works.
  • + 1
 @TheRaven: if you don't ride much i agree with you if you ride normaly at the weekends and litle more
I ride a lot on my bikr as i do a full national enduro season and some other races. As 2 to 3 times a week and on holidays more,so i had a lot of time only riding my road bike because i had my bike with the suspension on warranty or servicing,and i am valuing more and more about the relaibility. This was my first rs product (had a tora on a hardtail but even that had problems) and even liking the performance the qualoty leaves something to desier.
I Am planing to trade bike on end of the year,and if the budget lets will be fox 36 rc2 and float x2 air on the back. More ajustments and quality has to be more expensive
  • + 2
 It's been said already here and I just wish to remind everyone that Rockshox holds the majority of high end OEM market in it's hand, they simply produce much more units of every single fork type. There may be a couple of 32 and 34 forks out there in bikes of brands like Norco or Giant, but they are nothing compared to sheer volume of bikes equipped with murdered black RS. How many 36 RC2 you see? Rebas, Revs, Pikes and Lyriks are EVERYWHERE from SC and Spesh to Kona and YT. Online stores get their hands on OEM surplus production while there is only Fox aftermarket stuff to buy for resale.

So I would not say that prices are indicative in terms of quality. Also, as much as I would prefer 36 or even Öhlins over my Lyrik, I am fully aware 24/7 that it is a first world problem. I'd be probably happy with Durolux if they gave me one for free. Unlike Bos Deville where I would not fancy waiting for a few seals for 4 months.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: I'm not seeing how OEM marketshare has anything to do with price or quality. In many markets, sure. But it has been proven over and over again that in the MTB world, they will charge whatever they can get for their product, and it has also been proven that they can charge ALOT. That said, do you really believe that if RS priced the Pike like the 34, that they would sell as many Pikes as they do now?
  • + 2
 @WAKIdesigns: Durolux . . . . . Really? My son can't keep an RS shock or fork on his bike for a month with needing repair. Fox forks are very good but the X2 air we have has been in for seals already. They turned it around in a couple of days, no questions asked. NICE. But for the DH bikes we are running Ohlins shocks and they are the best! You get what you pay for!
  • - 1
 @Raven - yes if you produce 5 times as much forks as Fox then you not only get a better price at the factory per unit. You also run into inevitable OEM market dedicated surplus which you gladly sell to online discount stores at prices similar to what you sell to bike makers. That results with the price up to 30% lower than MSRP only to begin with and can get even lower on sale. Now Fox does not sell OEM stuff to online stores in Europe as faras I am concerned. So price is no good indicator of quality when comparing top offerings between each other. Now of Pike costed as much as 34 then I'd still go for Pike, the situationwould be different if we talked about 32/34 and Revelation, then I'd go Fox with a smile on my face. If Lyrik costed 1200€ instead of 800, then I'd go for 36 180 at 1400.

@MX298 - I have small kids, effectively I don't ride at all. Durolux would be just fine. Let's talk in 4 years.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: OEM marketshare is also not rigidly coupled to sales or production. You assume that if a company sells more units, it must be able to get them made cheaper. This holds true for simple devices, but not complex ones like pretty much anything on a mountain bike.

Also, if not for the significantly lower price, you wouldn't see me with a Rockshox ANYTHING. At the prices they charge, they are competitive. But they just would not be able to survive at Fox price levels.
  • + 0
 @TheRaven: I would chose a charger damper equipped RS fork over every single Fox fork that has no RC2 unit in it. Give me RC2, even if it was tech from 2011 packaged into 650/ 29 chassis and I can swallow 10% higher price. I do liked 2011 36 RC2 more than 2013 Pike. But 30% at that price levels is a no no, for me. I also heard stories of mechanics talking about creaking Fox CSU's throughout the whole range through several years.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: As an owner of a Charger damper, I would trade it for a FIT4 anyday. FIT4 doesn't explode at regular intervals. Plus the Pike is absolutely notorious for creaking CSUs. Fortunately that's the ONE issue that my Pike has not yet given me.
  • - 1
 @jaame: Fox Forks and Shocks are made and tested in Watsonville California, USA.
  • + 1
 @SteveDekker: which ones? A note on source of information would be welcome. A bit too many misunderstandings and conspiracy theories flying around while company employee can cut the bullsht rather quickly... Unless confusion is in the best interest of the company.
  • + 2
 @WAKIdesigns: All of them, but they of course source so many materials and parts from overseas, I don't know if they can still slap the Made in USA sticker on all of them anymore. Lawyers! They have a huge facility, everything stll made to order. I lived in the Bay area for 15 years and have known many fox employees. In fact I applied for a job there once but I didn't get it. Thats when I became a customer for life!
If you go to the fox website you can find manufacturing positions all in Cali.
  • + 2
 @WAKIdesigns: actually the rfx 34 is made in Taiwan because of the magnesium castings are different to anything öhlins has made inhouse before. All the shocks are made in sweden though.
  • + 1
 @feeblesmith: so basically if I buy a cartridge to my Lyrik, it will be as Swedish as it gets?
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: I know a guy who works at Fox in Taiwan. I'm pretty sure all their chassis, at the bare minimum, are made in Taiwan, just like everyone else. It's not a problem, they make awesome stuff.
  • + 2
 @jaame and @SteveDekker - I wrote an innocent comment about DT Swiss manufacturing once. A DT dude popped in with a clarifying comment and it was the end of story (unless he was lying, but I don't think it goes to such extents in biking world) Industry needs to pop in sometimes not limit themselves to "inside factory" or "from the top" articles.
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: exactly. I was told by a bloke who actually works in a bike factory, a few years ago, that on a big production run carbon works out cheaper than aluminium. So many times I've been ridiculed over repeating that, but never by anyone who actually works in a factory with actual figures. Just one person who actually knows could disprove that with a few numbers but so far it's never happened. It leads me to believe it is true. Or perhaps people who work in bike factories are so sick of bikes they would rather eat shit than go on pinkbike for fun in their spare time.
  • + 0
 @jaame: confusion is a powerful tool in public relations. However companies like Hope, CK, Enve or Orange seem to have little to hide. or maybe little to show. See? Big Grin
  • + 1
 @WAKIdesigns: when I think about it, you could compare the price of, just as an example, light bicycle rims to mavic. The metal ones are more expensive, but they would also argue they are better. So I believe cheap carbon is cheaper than expensive aluminium. Cheap is not necessarily good, but how do you know the frame you're buying is good carbon or cheap shit? I'm not paying light bicycle rims are shit, but they are carbon and they are cheap. It seems there is still this idea that he it's carbon it must be good.
  • - 2
 @TheRaven: You have never ridden a Fox that hard then, my friend.... Even the 40s, which I will say at least feel great (I HATE fox air forks, but that's just me, or maybe I've ridden a bunch of lemons), end up with some sort of issue requiring them to be pulled apart before the next day of riding. I saw this with 5 different forks (2 36s and 3 40s) last season. In that time, I watched Boxxers, Pikes, an MRP and even dorados get beat on, and aside from usual oil and seal changes, none of those forks had issues
  • + 2
 @trialsracer: "hard" riding is subjective. I've personally picked up the pieces that resulted from "hard" riding on Boxxers more than once.

Besides, it's irrelevant. I'm currently riding a Pike that has been a maintenance nightmare, and previously had a Lyrik that was almost as bad. So would you venture to say that i'm riding the RS forks hard but being nice to the Fox forks?
  • + 1
 @TheRaven: haha point taken. I would say maybe you have had the opposite experience as me; I got the good RS you should have gotten, and you got the good foxs!

Maybe it's condition dependent or something, but the general consensus around my riding circles has been that fox can feel great (point of contention), but in general they require more maintenance than a RS. I will say that I have ridden old fox forks that felt pretty "meh", had wear on the stanchions, and beat on them harder than they should have been, and they held up fine. If they sold for the same price as their competitors, I would probably think more of them. I have just never, ever walked away from a fox thinking, "wow you definitely get what you pay for". Same with Magura brakes (except hs33s of course)
  • + 4
 @trialsracer: Conversely, the only place I personally have ever encountered riders who would take a RS fork over a Fox at equivalent price is the internet. Sure there are plenty of Pikes on my local trails, but every one of them is there because it's much cheaper than a 34, or was OEM spec. I have an RCT3 on my trail bike, and again, it's there because I got a great deal on it. Regardless, it will be replaced by a 34 next winter. General consensus in my riding circles for my entire riding life has been if you want a "mount and forget" fork, you want a Fox. If you can't afford a Fox, then RS is what you get.

Different experiences for sure.
  • + 0
 @TheRaven: I have heard this about any of the coil sprung fox's, but never their air forks. With the Kashima coat, you definitely CANNOT mount and forget; forget to do your seals in time and it'll rub all of that precious stuff off.

I'm no RS fan or anything; when I was younger, I always took the Fox when I could. RS have consistently proven themselves to me, (and Fox has let me down) which is why I am so surprised by your comments.

It just always seems like Fox makes finicky air forks and shocks. Not saying they are like Marzocchi or anything (nightmares with those forks), just that they need constant tuning and attention.

If I could buy any fork though, it would be the MRP stage. I can't justify replacing my Pike, but the Stage I have ridden was fantastic and the owner (a pro DHer who notoriously destroys parts; self labeled "fat kid" riding style, over the front, plowing) loves it.

Wanna buy my 150mm 34? It's a 29er, needs a rebuild, but I'll give you a great deal hahaha.
  • + 1
 @trialsracer: Yeah again, that has not been my experience. I pull apart and clean all my forks every winter, only replacing seals if needed, and have not had any issues at all with the Kashima coat.

Just as for me, Fox has more than proven it's worth to me, and RS has proven consistently to be high maintenance.

About your 34 - what year? Factory? I have a 2014 29er Pike RCT3 i'd love to give up!
  • + 26
 The Fox 36 has longer service intervals 20mm axle,bigger Stanchions and lighter weight.
  • + 6
 What I understand about the Fox 36 is that you can change the travel by making a few relatively minor adjustments (e.g. change the 160mm to 180mm if you plan a holiday to the Alps etc). The Fox 36 has two versions, one that can have travel 140-160mm and one that can have travel 160-180mm.

www.ridefox.com/help.php?m=bike&id=576
  • + 10
 not to mention all three wheel sizes and high speed compression adjustment. The fox 36 really is the most versatile line of forks available, by a long shot too.
  • + 30
 Rockshox is like beer. Every year its pretty good. Fox is like wine. Some years it rains too much and the grapes go bad. Both get you drunk though.
  • + 5
 @acali: Couldn't described better.
  • + 7
 Have to commend Fox on the way they have dealt with the 15mm & 20mm axle problem. Nice execution because i have no reason to have a 15mm hub if i need to use my All Mtn wheelset on the DH bike in a pinch. Really, 6" to 8" wheels should be swappable bike to bike as the disicplines are so close.
  • - 2
 I'd still rather have a 15mm axle without hub bearings that are paper thin over a bigger axle with bearings that last a week.
  • + 1
 @tim-from-pa: in theory... then you ride them and they're never that impressive (do they get full travel from their forks yet...?). I will say that properly tuned, the 36 coils feel pretty good. They just need more maintenance (despite what fox says about service intervals) than RS
  • + 21
 I want a Totem 2.0
  • + 22
 Yeah cmon those graphics were to die for!
  • - 15
flag MaxDeutsch (Apr 25, 2016 at 21:38) (Below Threshold)
 noseheavy 2.0
just lower a boxxer 2.0
do you really want one? 2.0
  • + 10
 @MaxDeutsch: Totem is the new Marzocchi, and just like with Sam Hill and Stevie Smith - one does simply not criticize it without getting negpropped into oblivion.
  • + 3
 THE BEST SINGLE CROWN BIG HIT FORK EVER MADE. EVER EVER EVER. Bring that rock gobbler back.
  • + 1
 @properp: yes apart from 2008 Marzocchi worthy bushing play, stiction, heavy weight and every single 2-step version failing. Considering that 1lbs lighter Lyrik had 170mm of travel and was free from all above issues, and current Lyrik being almost 2lbs lighter, current Boxxer Team weighning the same, with better damper and air-spring, not mentioning Fox 36, developed in 2006, yes apart from all that, Totem was fkng amazing. I think it's been the stickers that were making up for all these minor issues. And I had a 2005, 170 66 RC as well as 2006 RC2X, that never failed me so sorry but Totem was some larvae of something that never happened.
  • + 3
 Never liked the Totem, but my 2008 66 is still running on a friend's bike! It makes me happy Smile
  • + 14
 I'm still pissed about the fact that it has a 15mm axle... Who the f*ck is going to put a fork with a 15mm axle on their dh bike with dh wheels? Oh sweet gotta buy a stupid hub that won't match the rear, and did I mention no 26? Just because it has 180mm of travel doesn't mean it's a freeride fork. I'm gonna go buy a metric
  • + 6
 It's soooo Enduroooo.
  • + 3
 The 20mm Axle in the Lyrik RC2DH work so well, and is so stiff… I don't see why they didn't adapt that to Lyrik AND Pike. probably some new retarded "standard" like BOOOOOOST
  • + 12
 No 26", but there is a 29" for a free ride specific fork? That might just be one of the dumbest things rock shox could have done. A 180 mm free ride bike is like the ultimate 26er for jumping and having fun. I really don't understand the hate for 26, I've ridden both recently (transition patrol and trek slash 26) and bought the 6er cause in my opinion it's still a better, more fun and playful bike. Please don't force me to re-make that decision bike industry.
  • + 6
 You have hit the nail on the head. And that is why we build 26'ers.
  • + 2
 I don't think there is any "hate" for 26. Especially in the rider community, pretty much no one is against 26" wheels. Everyone has either decided not to buy the new hype and stick with 26, or just suck it up and buy 27.5 because that's what's going to be available from here on out and it's at least as good as 26.
  • + 13
 New Lyrik? Now that's music to my ears.
  • + 15
 They should spec this on the Specialized Rhyme
  • + 8
 @nvonf: at first i was like naw then i was like awww
  • + 13
 no 20mm fail
  • + 19
 Or 26 option, double fail for me personally!
  • + 4
 And no straight steerer. Triple fail!
  • + 2
 @dglobulator: for the record, I'm using a 180 lyrik (27.5) on my Session Park (26" wheels) and its all good. The A2C is basically the same as a Boxxer so it works out just fine. In addition if you get the dual position you can knock the front end down a little as well. Just throwing it out there ...
  • + 4
 @t1maglio: Nice. For all those who aren't aware, you can run 26 wheels in a 27.5 fork. The AC is not much different.
  • + 2
 @t1maglio: that's interesting buddy, i was wondering whether that was possible or not. Unfortunately for me 160 is the max I can go to so probably won't work for me. Good call though!
  • + 1
 @Peregrinebikes:correct but A2C is about 10mm taller and the offset is increased so the effect on handling is less than ideal in most cases
  • + 1
 @MmmBones: 568 to 572, 4mm (26" boxxer vs 27.5 Lyrik). You are correct to believe there is an offset difference as well, but I don't know what that is. To be honest I hate flop from slacked out front ends and my bike feels fine. Point being, you can run it on a bike you'd normally run a triple clamp on ... or a 36 180.
  • + 10
 The small bump on this fork iIfelt is better then the FiT4 which I had. Mike is right it is down to personal preference. I sold the Fox for the Lyrik and never looked back.
  • - 4
flag POWsLAYER (Apr 25, 2016 at 22:07) (Below Threshold)
 @vsong how long did you ride the fox? out of the box feel on RockShox is pretty much as good as it gets, while most fox products take about 10 hours to ride in and start to feel proper with each service or being fresh out of the box. my experience anyway.
  • + 9
 @POWsLAYER: I rode the Fox for 3 months on 2 different bikes. I couldn't get the initial beginning stroke I get from the Lyrik. I wrote a review here: www.vitalmtb.com/product/guide/Forks,33/RockShox/Lyrik-RCT3,17121#product-reviews/2363/expand
  • + 3
 With the 36's you just have to ride faster! Smile
  • + 9
 I really liked that he compared it to the Fox 36 and didn't avoid the kashima coated elephant in the room like most reviewers. Solid Review.
  • + 10
 Where's the 20mm axle!!! 20 mill fronts are where's it's at!
  • + 15
 At fox
  • + 3
 @MX298: ... and X-fusion. And so are 26" version, high/low compression, 20 mm axle and neutralizing valves. I'd definitely take a Metric over a Lyrik or a 36.
  • + 9
 Stopped reading after 15x110 Smile
  • + 7
 I'd get this if it was 20mm.
  • + 3
 Look at this dropout, you can drill it!
  • + 3
 As far as I am aware, if air is building up in the fork lowers of Lyriks or Pikes you need a warranty claim not a zip tie. Sounds like the air rod in this set is dodgy, leaking air from the chamber to the legs, this is certainly a known issue with Pikes.
  • + 5
 Just bought a bike with one today, glad to not be gut punched with a poor review!
  • + 2
 Having ran 2 sets of Lyriks and 2 sets of Pikes, I'm sorely tempted to go back to the Lyrik. The Pikes just don't feel as beefy through very rough stuff. Big meaty rock gardens feel much better on Lyriks. With such a small weight penalty I think a fork swap is very imminent!
  • + 4
 Missed a chance to bring the Metric in for comparison as well . . . As that has valves for letting pressure build up out. Instead of mentioning the DH fork that has it.
  • + 6
 Thicker and longer... who'd have guessed it's better Frown
  • + 1
 Did the Charger Damper upgrade in my 26" 170mm Lyrik RC2DH. AWESOME. The best that fork has ever felt. I don't wish I had anything smaller for trail riding, and i'm not looking for anything bigger for the park type stuff... Pretty happy guy right here.

www.sram.com/rockshox/products/lyrik-26-charger-damper-upgrade-kit
  • + 1
 I agree with @OzMike in the sense that seeing a comparison and how each fork may play out well in different environments/riding styles (park use, trail, free ride, DH racing, etc.) I know I am going to be on the verge of making the decision if I should upgrade to a lyric 160 or just go to a boxxer and have it adjusted to 180 mm. Ever since Specialized applied the boxxer 180 on their enduro evo model, I have been really intrigued. Additionally with what @bigbear mentioned, a comparison with Fox's 2016 line-up would be awesome too.
  • + 2
 I have a 170 lyric mounted on my personal all mountain and a 160 pike on my hardtail. I think the lyric blows the pike out of the water. But I also like unnecessarily stiff components
  • + 14
 Said the Vicar to the tart
  • + 4
 Push ElevenSix review coming soon as well? I think I spy one on the test sled...
  • + 4
 @seaskimmer, good eye, and yes, a review is in the works.
  • + 4
 4 tokens 115 psi and blows my pikes away.
  • + 1
 How much do you weigh mate? (If you don't mind me asking!!) I'm running my 170 lyrik with 3 tokens and 95psi (I weight 90kg)
  • + 3
 @kes2903: 160mm lyrik, 120kg
  • + 3
 Anyone have experience in lowering the Lyrik to 150mm? can you point me in the right direction?
  • + 12
 Cut the Air rod
  • + 14
 Yeah, probably don't cut that
  • + 2
 Air shafts are available, lowered mine to 130mm for my evil following
  • + 1
 You can lower from 160-150 with a spacer. If you are lowering from 170 or 180 you need to replace a rod
  • + 3
 Is the travel adjustable?
Or do you have to fit a completely different spring and damper cartridge?
  • + 1
 Why does one need a zip tie to let the air out as described? Why can't one just let the air out through the main air valve (which is used to adjust pressure)? Is this pressure being built up in a different compartment?
  • + 2
 Yep he's talking about the air building up in the fork lowers not the air spring. Different chamber.
  • + 1
 @spudlord: OK, thanks!
  • + 1
 Maybe they can install an air release valve with a hose that goes to the brakes? You can use that surplus air to help bleed your Avid brakes that no doubt need a bleed after such a demanding ride!
  • + 1
 Would love to know how the 180mm version compare to similar offering from Fox and X-fusion.. Surely the added length must make a difference in stiffness..
  • + 0
 One question remained: does it worth to lower it down to 110 mm to use it for dirt jumping or leave the lyric out of trails? I wonder why not to try this because of the thickness of the lyric. any tips?
  • + 0
 heavier than the pike, no 26 option, no HSC adjustment, if you are after a 160mm fork why bother with it over the pike. Most people that will own the fork won't know the difference.
  • + 1
 fits 26 27.7 29 x15mm
  • - 2
 @properp: only comes in 27.5 and 29 sizes.
  • - 1
 @cstishenko: not the same fork
  • + 1
 @poah: hmm weird. Same seals, tube diameters, and damper. OH! The 26" Lyrik has a 20mm axle Smile

With the Charger damper in the RC2DH 170mm Lyrik, it feels like MONEY.

Boom - immediate 26" option.
  • + 0
 still not the same fork. the RC2DH is the older chassis. I have no need for 20mm axle forks
  • + 2
 @poah: YOU were the one bitching about no 26" option. If you want a 26" option, buy the RC2DH and Charger it. It's simple. It's as smooth or smoother than a Pike, while being much stiffer and taking the big hits better. I believe the downside of the 26" RC2DH is weight.

You might have no need for 20mm, but after operating both axles on the Pike and the Lyrik RC2DH - I have no idea why they didn't stay 20mm. The 20mm just feels more solid and connected when done up tight.
  • + 1
 I have the dual position 180/150 and it matches perfectly with my Megatrail! The bikes feels great on 180 can't wait to test it out in Angel Fire.
  • + 3
 Just registered a successful try comment function
  • + 3
 How would the Lyric compare to the Xfusion Metric hlr?
  • + 1
 No 26' option? Thank you yet again for discarding all the thousands of riders that still have good 26' frames and would like a fork update!
  • + 2
 There's a Charger damper upgrade available if you already have a 26" Lyrik. Also, your wheels will fit in the 27.5" version, you'll just end up with a slightly taller front end.
  • + 1
 @mikekazimer: If you even mention to anyone in the industry (or a bike shop) that you want to put a 650b forks in a 26' bike their face distorts in horror. More, if your front end lifts a bit your bike will be out of balance - I experienced this first hand. The only way it would work would be getting a shorter travel fork - by 10-20mm - which defeats the purpose.
I think the bike industry has gone terribly wrong and this 'obsolete' bike every year where you cannot find any parts will bite them in their backsides. People will just lose trust completely. I have! I will not spend $$$$ on a bike that will be deemed good for scrap the year after by different axle sizes, fork heights and other constantly changing 'standards'
  • + 1
 Would love to put one of those in my Reign and change the 160mm Pike to a 180mm Lyric
  • + 2
 I'll keep my 2013 20mm axle 26'er Lyrik ... thank you very much
  • + 2
 Just another forks to me...
  • + 1
 Btw how is the difference between pike RC And yari RC? ???? but not mean the name ????????
  • + 5
 Yari = budget Lyrik (ie same chassis but simpler damper)

Pike = same damper as a Lyrik but with a different air spring and chassis.
  • + 2
 I want to hear about those E13 tyres.
  • + 1
 Those and the combo with the new wider E13 wheels he's running......they look like they are producing a really nice shape to the tyre and side knobs.....look fast for the summer
  • + 2
 Fck this why is pb not covering the festseries anymore?
  • + 3
 aaaaand how about A slice of british pie? PB seems to be getting a bit too PC it seems.
  • + 3
 Cruz fest is private, they don't allow the public there. I think they make their own video and send it out to all the biking sites
  • + 1
 @dropoffsticks: thanks man. What a pity . Would love to see something from it
  • + 1
 @bonkywonky: aSoBP is a Dirt Magazine publication so they probably have some sort of exclusivity, sort of like Vital and their slideshows and Raw edits.
  • + 1
 I have the 170mm Lyrik solo air on my carbonjack and it is fantastic.
  • + 1
 I've one in 170mm on my capra and it's simply amazing
  • + 2
 Same here, 170mm on my Range, and its so good,really impressed.
  • + 1
 What tyres are on the bike here? bontrager?
  • + 2
 E13
  • + 1
 Sr Santour Durolux....nice Price!!!
  • + 1
 Where's new Totem? RockShox, do you really want to kill it?
  • + 1
 How many tokens are you guys running?
  • + 1
 I have a Yari but 3 tokens, 15 per cent sag and 2 clicks of lsc. 38mm Renthals and 1.5 cm of spacers underneath. Can't stand divy fronts as you might suspect..
  • + 1
 3 tokens, 95psi, I weigh 90kg. It's still plush as f*ck and I reckon I could easily go to 4 tokens, although I don't hit any major jumps/drops.
  • + 2
 @kes2903: Add some LSC maybe?
  • + 2
 @kes2903: tried 4 tokens but I found the fork to ramp up a bit too sudden and early in the stroke so I went back to 3 and added some air pressure.
  • - 1
 @bonkywonky: just neg propped you by mistake, sorry!
  • + 0
 Trash... or just new pike.
  • + 1
 Meh :\
  • + 1
 Different FROM

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