Shimano Announces Affordable Deore M6000 Group and a Wide Range SLX Option

Feb 22, 2017
by Richard Cunningham  
Shimano 2017


Shimano's latest press release reminds us that, as much as we would all like to own a ten thousand dollar trail bike, many avid riders, and some first-time mountain bikers will be hitting the trails this season aboard far more modest steeds. The new M6000-level Deore component ensemble is targeted at the entry-level enthusiasts and cash strapped shredders who would much prefer XTR, but have not yet purchased a winning lottery ticket.

Shimano 2017
Clutch-type rear derailleur in long and mid-cage options.

Highlights of the new group are a clutch type Shadow plus rear derailleur, a four-arm XTR style crank spider, Centerlock brake rotors and hubs, and while the Servo-Wave brake levers and ICE-compatible calipers are modeled very close to the ergonomically pleasant XT and XTR stoppers, you'll have to pony up for the finned brake pads, because they are not standard fare.

Shimano 2017
Mid-length levers and servo-wave actuation.
Shimano 2017
The 6000 calipers accept XTR finned brake pads.

Shimano 2017
Choose a two or three-ring crankset with XTR styling.

Equally newsworthy was what was not included in the press release: No eleven speed for M6000, so it won't be cross-compatible with its pricier siblings. The basic Deore will remain a ten-speed transmission, and there is no mention of a one-by (single chainring) option. Instead, M6000 customers can choose from a number of two and three-chainring cranksets (no surprise there) paired with a new wide-range 11 by 42-tooth cassette, or Shimano's longstanding 11 by 32, 34, or 36-tooth cassettes. To assist OEM customers, Shimano will offer front changers with every possible cable and clamping arrangement.
Shimano 2017
Side-swing front mech for the entry level Deore group.

Shimano Deore M6000




Shimano 2017

SLX One-By and a Wide-Range Cassette

On the heels of the M6000 Deore ensemble, came the announcement that an SLX-level one-by drivetrain has finally been approved for production, and with an eleven--speed, 11 x 46-tooth, wide-range cassette - both of which will be released this Spring. The affordable one-by transmission, big-boy cassette and the concurrent release of XT-level wheelsets with Boost axle spacing reflect a large-scale adjustment in the Japanese parts maker's range, presumably, to pull alongside SRAM in the OEM market and to ensure that those customers have the proper tools to outfit mid-priced performance mountain bikes with tip-to-toe Shimano componentry.

Shimano Deore M7000



Entry Level Trail Pedal

Shimano also added an SPD Trail pedal to its range that is reportedly priced to match the M6000 ensemble. The PDED500 pedal once again, puts one of Shimano's most-wanted products into the hands of entry-level riders. Expect to see the 500-level pedals on demo fleets world wide. No price was available at the time of the press release.
Shimano 2017



Boost Wheelsets

Wheels have gradually become a staple product for Shimano and, while wide rims are still on the horizon, to keep in step, their wheel range is now available in Boost-width as well as standard-width axles. Two new 29” and 27.5” Deore XT wheelsets have wider axle options - a 110x15mm e-thru front- and a 148x12mm rear-axle spacing. Shimano says that the new wheelsets increase stiffness. Also new are rear thru axle hubs (AX-MT700 and AX-MT500) with smaller housings and lighter weights that feature greater clearance for frames and brake calipers.


Shimano Deore M8000
Shimano 2017


MENTIONS: @shimano



Author Info:
RichardCunningham avatar

Member since Mar 23, 2011
974 articles

209 Comments
  • 208 2
 Well freaking done Shimano!
  • 44 1
 Wheely well done!
  • 33 1
 Fuc*@$( good times coming. You don't have to spend lot of money to have a decent and capable mtb rig
  • 9 5
 @AdamOdh: That's right.. I'm using Shimano Alivio M4000 with Deore M615 brakes. No problems
  • 21 0
 @Tier1Voodoo: agreed those Deore brakes are solid.
  • 3 11
flag FabienTT (Feb 22, 2017 at 9:53) (Below Threshold)
 Hell yeah, that was a very good move Shimano; though, I'm waiting for YT cycles and Canyon to match this prices with their bikes and make this "fancy" commerce even more competitive.
Sram I'm waiting for an even affordable Sram GX.
  • 28 4
 @FabienTT: Sram has had a group set cheaper then the GX called the NX and it's been out for over a year now and it's cheaper then the new M6000 group.
  • 7 13
flag blackthorne (Feb 22, 2017 at 10:27) (Below Threshold)
 The reign of sram 1x with jacked up prices is finally over!
  • 4 14
flag hardyk (Feb 22, 2017 at 14:53) (Below Threshold)
 exept for the hubs, this is pure shit.
  • 3 1
 @FabienTT: Isn't it SRAM NX.
  • 75 6
 Those Deore brakes will be the absolute bargain of this line up. They're basically identical to XTR without the bling finish and lever adjustments. The weight difference should be negligible.
  • 21 8
 I have the current Deore, XTs and Sram Guides RS. Out of all 3 I prefer Deore for the feel. XTs feel more powerful but modulation isn't as good. To top that SLX crankset is absolutely beatiful. Finish on XTRs wears out rather quickly. I just wish their cassettes were 100g lighter and hopefully they are free of that derailling problem. The latest XTR 9001 11-40 cassette is free of that issue but the first XT 11-42 was terrible.
  • 5 2
 @WAKIdesigns: I feel 785 are more owerful but modulable than m8000
  • 9 2
 I have Deore brakes, XT and XTR, and nothing comes close to the XTR in terms of power! Still don't understand why Shimano don't do a XTR cassette with more range than 40-11...
  • 9 35
flag Brdjanin (Feb 22, 2017 at 0:30) (Below Threshold)
 @WAKIdesigns: Bitch please.
  • 13 23
flag Brdjanin (Feb 22, 2017 at 0:35) (Below Threshold)
 @gbcarmona: XT has more stopping power than XTR, XTR is just lighter...
  • 19 1
 @gbcarmona: Think the XTR 1-40 range is aimed at racers whom are fit enough not to need the bigger sprockets. Same with the road dura-ace cassettes, they are smaller range too.
  • 6 2
 @jamesbriancrilly: yeah, I know what you mean but when compared with SRAM, Shimano were always behind. Just makes loads of people buy after market sprockets like the OneUp!
  • 2 1
 @Brdjanin: my experience tells me otherwise. Never tried anything more powerful than XTR on one finger! They do need TLC occasionally and I've had a warranty replacement on one tho!
  • 2 1
 Good modulation can be achieved by switching rotor styles. I found my 785's really grabby, so I put on KCNC rotors and now they are perfect! Less rotor surface, less grabby, but with 785's there is still tons of power too Big Grin
  • 5 1
 @gbcarmona: Like James said, XTR is for weight conscious and performance-oriented riders. If you're in good shape and riding a light bike 32 up front to 11-40 out back is plenty of range and if you really struggle you could always switch to a 28 or 30 up front.
  • 1 1
 @WAKIdesigns: All you need is someone else's chain ring like a One-up or Wolf Tooth to correct the chain line issue.
  • 4 3
 @Brdjanin: XTR trails vs. XT are almost identical in stopping power but XTR trails have better modulation and just are a scant lighter.

XTR vs XT they are even in stopping power but obviously the XTR is going to be much lighter. There is a difference when comparing XTR Trail vs XTR.
  • 3 4
 @jamesbriancrilly: Just harden up and push the gear!
Save some weight on the dinner plate cassette and ridiculous length of chain!
  • 1 3
 @WAKIdesigns: So eagle it is then!
  • 2 0
 @tom666: that ratio wouldnt be for performamce... dropping down on the front justifies your top speed
  • 6 8
 all you guys talking about stopping power and Hope is over here leaned back like.......... "ha! sup?"

(full disclosure: i have XTs on my trail bike and they're perfectly good performers and a great deal for the money haha)
  • 4 0
 @Sweatypants: What about the Trickstuff brakes? Smile When only passenger vehicle levels of mechanical advantage will do.
  • 7 0
 @WaterBear: haha... waiting for Brembo RCS19 brake masters and P4 calipers on mtbs.
  • 2 1
 @tom666: @tom666: Sure but I like to use my bike for extended ups and downs. 32-11 isn't enough speed on some DH sections. Personally I went for a 34t ring and 11-46 sunrace cassette w/ XT 11sp derailluer.
  • 1 0
 @WAKIdesigns: I had that issue with a 11-42 XT cassette and chain. I have a One Up 30 tooth oval which is offset in a bit from the stock Race Face chainline. But when I replaced the chain and cassette last fall it went away. Same XT cassette model but XTR chain. I don't get it?
  • 1 0
 @tom666: yeah I understand but at least a 42 would be good! I ride Peaks and Lakes mainly and with a 32 upfront sometimes is a bit of pain on those long climbs...but at least you get up to the top faster! Haha
  • 1 0
 @gbcarmona: Lakes are steep. Shimano offer up 11-46 for the XT - so if you're after more range that's a killer option. I think the XTR is intended to be super light XC and Enduro race kit, used by people who are looking to minimise weight and have the legs to turn it those gears. If that's not you either get doing some squats and getting fit, or just go for XT I think.
  • 2 0
 @Someoldfart: when we doing any 1x in the shop I've always spec XTR Chains as they shift smoother.
  • 2 1
 i have tried both and sorry but i disagree, xtr brakes perform much better (especially when going downhill)
  • 1 0
 @robhill: "Just harden up and push the gear!"

So work out for three months to avoid adding 80g to your 1900g wheelset and 2000g of tire? Seems kinda obsessive to me. I mean i'm a big proponent of staying in shape but this is kind of extreme.
  • 1 0
 @tom666: ditch 10 and 11 speed...go back to 9 speed XT or Deore and rock a Sunrace CSM990 11-40T with an oval 32T chainring. Incompatible with XO...I tried. Invest the money you save into canned goods and ammo for the zombie apocalypse.
  • 49 5
 Let's see how long it is before we can buy this stuff for less than wholesale on jenson... Because shimano seems to be such a great benefit to the local shops lately.
  • 27 2
 Haha, I'm glad someone beat me to this.

It's an interesting strategy, isn't it? Shimano is banking on their brand recognition to basically go direct to consumer, which has merit. On the flip side, in our shop at least, we've stopped stocking most of their products in the past 6-8 months because of these online issues. If a business -any business- can't make margin on something, they won't (re: can't) sell it. So Sram/Hope/Formula have been brake recommendations. RaceFace for cranks and chainrings, etc, etc. I don't suspect them to take notice of this over night, but it will be interesting in another 5+ years. For that matter, in 5 years time the LBS will probably look a lot different too!
  • 58 1
 I'm pretty sure Shimano's biggest concern is OEM spec, not supporting the LBS
  • 34 2
 @mikealive: The while situation is a s@£tstorm where the person getting the rawest deal, regardless of what anyone in the industry says, is the end user.

We end users are faced with the unfortunate choice of taking advice from an LBS who, as you point out above, will end up having to offer recommemdations based on margin over user need or value for money, or taking a punt on components with positive online reviews.

As a rider with a workshop full of 26 rims and non-boosted frames and forks the industry has shown itself for what it is to me over the past 5 years; a bunch of people searching for monetized innovation and no more.

And you guys in the LBS get done over whichever way you rub it. Good luck Mike!
  • 9 2
 @orientdave: My thought exactly. You undermine yourself when you recommend product based on profit instead of merit. It's the reason I would never ask advice of a Television salesperson, I surely wouldn't expect this in a bike shop.
  • 35 2
 @mikealive: You recommended Formula?? No wonder people shop online...
  • 2 3
 @SonofBovril: If I bought a bike that already had shimano on it, why would I be interested in going to a shop to buy it again given it's the same or equal level of parts? As having a part in a smaller LBS it sucks that a company would give the finger to us. It drives the value down of the brand, not just the parts themselves. It also makes it harder for the shops to be involved with the community when people say they can't trust the shops just because they feel screwed by the price. It's great that we can go online and order stuff for cheap, but a lot of us are willing to give it our best shot to keep people coming in the shops just to keep existing.
  • 23 1
 @bikerdodd: I know some very successful bike shops and some that struggle. The difference is one type excels in customer service needs and truthful, expert advice. For that reason they sell bikes, maintenance/repairs and parts too. The other type sits around crying about margins on parts like somebody owes them something just for being there.
  • 12 0
 @DARKSTAR63: To add to that, knowing your market, & where profit margins are to be found: Here in Tucson, for instance, not selling road bikes is a death knell, but really, the bike shops that seem to do best everywhere I've been, are the ones that treat the high-end road & MTB as halo product, but make their bread & butter profits on $300-$500 hybrids & entry level bikes.

I get that it's not glamorous to sell hybrids, but they seem to sell in quantities that make MTBs & road bikes pale in comparison.
  • 1 0
 @SonofBovril: and also making sure CRC is well stocked.
  • 1 0
 Funny, I ignored pricing...........UNTIL. MSRP pshhhhhh
  • 4 0
 @orientdave: @orientdave: I think what @mikealive is speaking to is that if Shimano is available online for less than wholesale then shops are less inclined to purchase it for their inventory because at that point you are losing money. to battle this We have purchased stuff for our shop from CRC and Bike-Discount. Cheaper than wholesale for us and we can compete somewhat with online only stores. In the end, we at the LBS's are here for our communities (at least some of us) but if there is no money being made we will not exist.
End users must also do their due diligence on their potential purchases. We can, and do, help guide decisions based upon experience and knowledge, but our overall goal is to make sure you get the right bike, component, or accessory that is right for you.
At least that is my view.
  • 5 0
 @mikealive: My bike store told me I could find a better deal on what I was looking for online. They have 3 or 4 service guys working most of the time when I go in there. I think they are the most succesful store in town because they offer sound advice and make a good portion of their money on service.
  • 13 1
 @bishopsmike You had me laughing with that one! I was just rattling brakes off the top of my head that weren't Shimano. Only one Formula taker in the past 6 months, and that was by his specific request. And guess what? They were/are a huge PITA! Big Grin You're right, we should be boo'd if we were recommending Formula brakes.. heh.

@iantmcg @DARKSTAR63 @orientdave It seems to me that any time the topic of 'support your LBS' comes up, the responses are divided into 2 camps essentially: Camp 1 is I don't owe the LBS anything for existing/my LBS sucks/they are jerks/I buy it cheaper online -OR- Camp 2: I support my LBS because they are rad people/are involved in the community/are knowledgeable/are friendly/do good work, etc. There just isn't much in between. So in what I'm sure will be an exercise in futility, let me clarify a few things:
1) All local bike shops are not created equal. I absolutely agree, if the shop you have access to sucks, don't support them. I wouldn't either.
2) We aren't recommending *against* Shimano at my shop, we are just stocking less of their stuff--when the SLX 1x stuff came out we upgraded a lot of drivetrains for people. But like @road-n-dirt mentioned, when Johnny Customer can buy Shimano brakes online for less than dealer wholesale, we're not going to stock that item. I don't see this as tricky or dishonest, it's just common sense. How or why should we expect a person to pay us 50% more for an item they can just buy online? We don't expect them to do so just because we exist. Sram makes a good brake in the Guide series, Sram has great customer service (waaay better than Shimano 9/10 times) so we have no issue recommending that product. If someone asks about Deore brakes? Of course I tell them they are good! Best bang for the buck brake imo. The owner of the shop has even told people that they can get them cheaper online--some buy online and come back and have us set them up, some see the value in supporting a local business that supports their hobby and go ahead and buy from us despite the higher price. I'd say neither way is wrong.
3) If you are already knowledgeable about bikes and can usually find your answers online, I'm sure it's easy to see little value in a bike shop. But, ever think about the people who want a bike who don't live and breath this stuff? THAT'S who the LBS is important to. That guy who comes in and tells me he hasn't ridden a MTB since 2001 and wants to get back into it now that his kids are old enough to wipe their own arses. You think he has any idea where to even begin? Based on my experiences, the answer is no. And guess what.. at least 3-4 times a year that customer goes on to be super stoked on riding, finds friends and comradery at the LBS, shows up to trail work days, etc. You can't buy that kind of stuff on Jensen or CRC. So maybe the old heads in the sport have sorted it all out for themselves, but there are still people who benefit from a good LBS being present.
4) I prefer to spend my money at local businesses whenever possible. I expect items to cost a bit more when doing so, and I'm fine with that--I understand that Mom-n-Pop doesn't have the buying power of Nashbar or Home Depot, etc. But I know that Mom-n-Pop are residents of my community, spend at least some of their money here, own a home here, and pay taxes here. Chain Reaction obviously does not. I've never seen the guys from Nashbar show up to a dig day, ya know? If a person only places value in getting something for the cheapest possible price, local businesses will lose every time. Do I, and will I still shop online? Sure. But I also understand the importance of shopping local--if a person doesn't see that as vital to the health of a community, I don't know what else I can say.

And specifically to @orientdave, trust me, every time a new standard rolls out every single person in our shop throws their hands up like 'You can't be serious!'. We all ride too, and we get it. --Our head mechanic just now, as of 2017 has moved on from his 26" bike.. we've always been of the opinion that if you're having fun on it, keep riding it! Some industry changes absolutely appear as money grabs, I agree. I rolled my eyes when Boost came out--but seeing what can be done with it I'm on board now. It's typically a 'time will tell' situation, and unfortunately the end user is always stuck footing the bill for industry experimentation. For what it's worth, it seems like the industry is starting to listen to the feedback and all these "money driven innovations" are starting to slow down a bit. I think they took notice when people started sitting on their wallets due to concerns about buying a bike with standards that will be outdated in 2 seasons. In that regard, I'm hopeful for the future.
  • 1 1
 @mikealive: LBS should have higher prices to have margins and offer time to market solutions. If I need a part quickly, I'm willing to pay a premium to the LBS and get back on the trail. Further, if I need service (never) the LBS is ready to meet that need. Online: Price is lower but takes a few days to receive part. Some folks have no desire to work on their own bike. LBS if for them. So the model is already in place. With regards to new bikes, same thing is happening today, some prefer online, some prefer LBS. Hopefully for the LBS this model does not get entirely shifted to the order on line, pick up at LBS model as I think the LBS will suffer if this is the case.
  • 3 1
 @mikealive: Some good points about the LBS situation. Unfortunately my right-down-the-street awesome LBS has closed up and now the closest good one is almost a half hour drive.

I understand the dilemma that bike shops face now but this is simply one of those situations where shops will have to evolve or perish. The future is in service...rather than being a retail shop with a mechanic or two, the LBS needs to become a completely equipped full-service "garage" with a parts desk. There can certainly be a showroom with some display models but most bikes will have to be ordered, and for this to work, brands will have to expand their demo fleet in order to make more frequent visits so that customers can test ride. The ideal location will no longer be main st, it will be right at the trail center.

It would also help if we could get brutally honest reviews on sites like PB but that's unlikely to happen simply due to the way things work.
  • 1 1
 @TheRaven: Those are all great ideas! Maybe we can have Rob Roskopp stop by and set the sag for you on your Santa Cruz too! lol.

I've heard the 'evolve or die' argument a lot, and sure, it has some merit--all businesses must remain flexible enough to cater to current market demands. But the things you suggest are waaay outside the scope of the 'average' bike shop. I'm speaking in terms of investment, overhead, etc. A super garage and a warehouse full of parts? Ok, now you need space to store all of that stuff, but still need to be in a location convenient for people--no one wants to, or always has the means to get across town for you to fix their tire (flat fixes are a huge amount of our walk in traffic). So your rent will likely go up due to increased square footage needs. Even with the extra space, you can't possibly have the room to store, or more importantly, the purchasing power to buy in bulk quantities to get the prices down to the levels of those online giants you are competing against. "Evolve or die" shouts are heard again when the inevitable suggestion comes of 'just build an online retail website, silly'. But to do that you'll need to invest up-front for someone to build it, more money with no guaranteed return--heck, just last year Price Point shut the doors on their online operations... but the super garage/parts center in Bellingham is supposed to compete? I hope you have a rich uncle, because you'll have a hard time coming up with such a mountain of investment capital to get all these things rolling...
And you must keep in mind that all of this is for what most people in the U.S. consider a *hobby*...so whereas if your car needs repair or maintenance, it is absolutely a priority. If you can't afford to fix your bike? Meh, you just don't ride for a while. That is the difference between a bike shop and say, Auto Zone, Napa, O'Reilly's, etc.

In terms of a showroom with displays and an ordering system--what motivates a customer to want to wait for a bike to be ordered? Is this system going to somehow bring the retail cost of bikes down for them? Would you spend 5k on a bike without ever having sat on it? How about those $600 commuter or around town bikes? I don't know all the answers to these questions. I do know that for those brands doing direct-to-consumer selling now, that in order for their warranties to be honored the bike must be assembled by a professional shop. I've already seen shops start charging $300 for this service instead of the usual $60-100. So there's your 'evolve or die' at work I guess.. Much like building a shop at a trail head, many of your suggestions are woefully optimistic without bringing the reality of the situation into it. Not every trail system is Moab, Whistler, etc. You want to build a bike shop 30 minutes outside of town at the trail head? So are people driving 30 minutes to your super garage to have their bikes serviced? Boy, heck of a business model you have there...
  • 33 0
 Shimano is killing it on the value side of the spectrum, while SRAM seems to be becoming increasingly Gucci.
  • 8 0
 Which feels like the world has gone crazy, if you were a rider in the late 90s/early 00s. Half the reason SRAM got so big was people like me buying SRAM because Shimano was so ridiculously expensive. Especially with how fragile derailleurs were in those days, replacement was common & you needed a reasonably priced option.
  • 10 4
 First off I'm not a sram fan boy (bikes with shimano and sram both) Each have their great points. But Sram does make the NX group that is a good price. I don't understand why people always compare Sram eagle to deore and slx. Makes no sense st all.
  • 6 2
 @sunringlerider: NX retails for about $300, you can get an XT groupset for about 50 dollars more...
XT is the equivalent of X1, NX would probably be the equivalent of Deore.
  • 3 0
 @bridgermurray: Ya and this group for about $290. So my point of Sram being Gucci is pointless. If XT is $50 more why would you ever buy SLX or Deore?
  • 4 0
 @bridgermurray: I've seen tons of people use XT over x01. I've probably never seen someone spec a bike with x1. In the cheap but good quality department, XT is the champ
  • 1 0
 @pigit77: @pigit77: I see tons of siezed XT or SLX derraileurs with worn clutch they don't work and feel shit, almost every other client coming to shop has their Shimano derraileur clutch switch in off possition and when asked why they answer cause it doesn't shift other way...
  • 2 0
 @groghunter: YES I still have trouble coming to terms with this. SRAM was always the clunky budget option for those who couldn't afford the "quality Shimano drivetrains". Now you can buy XT cheaper than SRAMs SLX-equivalent. Nuts.

@b-wicked: Over 18 years of riding and literally hundreds of derailleurs (i'm a hobbyist mechanic too), I have NEVER seen what you describe. You must live in a really backwards place.
  • 1 1
 @TheRaven: I'm not a hobbyist, servicing bikes for local shops since 2004, if Sram had problems with to weak clutch that unscrew loose itself and that you could tighten on 2.0 models, that were solved by just installing a pin that hold the screw in place but took away the possibility to adjust it. Shimano in their system have another flaw a lot of derraileurs have problems already new when adjusting them on lower gears with clutch on, yes you can adjust the force of clutch but anyway it gets worse when you using product, especially in bad climate they get stuck seized and don't function like they should. Sram 1x11 product work much more stable. Also Shimano make shifters have too tiny movement when changing gears what sure is ok on road bikes but not suitable on offroad use.
  • 1 0
 @b-wicked: Um...I don't even...again, 18 years, hundreds of derailleurs, and i've had basically the exact opposite experience. Shimano derailleurs have been pretty much flawless, and SRAM derailleurs have been inconsistent and high-maintenance.

"Too tiny movement"? Sounds like you are inventing things to complain about.
  • 1 0
 @TheRaven: both have pros and cons...clutches and NW chainrings cover up some of the trouble Shimano deraillers have had over the years. Remember those videos of deraillers on youtube? Shimanos were bouncing around wildly making the chain look like a double dutch jump rope while the sram did what it was supposed to be doing...without a clutch. I once went an entire season without having to adjust my XO derailler once. Shimanos do have greater adjustment and can fit larger cogs like Sunrace 11-40 9 speed cassettes.
  • 29 2
 Finally a ten-speed 11-42T cassette from Shimano, but i wish it had come out earlier and at higher level...
  • 13 0
 100% agree. It's about 3 years (or seasons) I ride a 11-42 (Thanks One Up). At the time Shimano said the jump between gears was too bad to be acceptable. Obviously not anymore. It's so surprising to see how late they are compared to their customers' expectations.
  • 9 0
 Agreed. I would be buying one straight away but for the fact that it will probably destroy my hope alloy freehub. A double alloy spidered version I.e. Xt would be a great product. The demand is there as sunrace and praxis have shown.
  • 8 0
 I don't think we'll se a higher level version, because SLX and higher are all 11-speed now. My guess is that they didn't release one earlier because it would have hurt 11-speed sales.
  • 1 0
 Yep, that casette is exactly what's going on the mint 08 Stumpjumper hardtail that I just picked up for peanuts. 26# = nice bikes for cheap!
  • 6 0
 Shimano are usually last to bring out something considered new. Look at their dropper post. They wait and see how others fail and make sure theirs won't fail in the same way. They pay close attention to the climbing percentage between each gear and when it comes to gears, they don't want to be the company coming out of the gate hot with a half designed product. It hurts initial sales but it ends up being(usually) a more reliable product.
  • 5 2
 @EnduroManiac: The "jump between gears" argument pissed me off so much because their 1x11 cassettes have nearly the same spacing as a modified 1x10 wide range cassette. Nonsense. They just knew that if they offered it, it would undercut their business for 1x11... which is silly because all of those people wanting to go 1x just got adapters or bought Sunrace cassettes.
  • 3 0
 @scotty1212: Don't get me wrong, I'm rather a Shimano than a SRAM guy. Now thinking a little forward, and being innovative does not mean you can't be reliable.
Moreover, adding gear range is not what I would call being (technically) innovative. Every third year or so, they add up a cog to the cassette... Wow, revolution!
I (personally) don't need 12 gears as I am rarely limited by my 11-42 range and never bothered by the ratio gap between gears. This is all personal preference I believe, but you won't see any eagle like cassette on my bike any time soon. Unless maybe on a 29er as it's otherwise too exposed to my taste.
  • 3 3
 @bikekrieg: exactly- no one cares about small steps between gears, we want range. and if shimano had come out with a wide range 10 speed XT, no one would have bothered going to 11 speed.
  • 1 5
flag inverted180 (Feb 22, 2017 at 11:17) (Below Threshold)
 @scotty1212: Jesus christ....have you not looked at their XT 11sp 11-46 cassette? 11-46
11-13-15-17-19-21-24-28-32-37-46 ... a 9t jump on the final cog. crap.
  • 3 1
 @xeren: a lot of truth to that statement. e-13 has an XD driven 9-42t 10speed cassette now. If it wasnt so damn expensive I would have went that route vs. upgrading to 11speed 11-46
  • 3 0
 Sunrace 11-40 and 11-42 are available for two years and 2x3 cogs are on AL carriers like XT. I'm using their 11-40 on one of my bikes and after one season I don't notice change in shifting quality and wear compare to XT.
  • 1 2
 @gaoyiyang maybe i'm blind but where is this 10 speed 11-46 your talking about? i just see a SLX 11 speed 11-46 casset...
  • 1 1
 If you guys value pedal efficiency, you would appreciate what Shimano does. They pretty much set the playing field. They've been doing it longer than anyone else. The change in your cadence is smaller when the gears are closer. Imagine a set of stairs. The smaller the step is, the smoother the transition. The larger the step, the harder it is to make the step. If you can increase the amount of steps taken to get to a certain height, you can achieve a taller set of stairs while still being easy to climb.

@inverted180 I'm a bicycle technician that actually uses that cassette so yes, I'm well aware of that cassette. It sounds like you don't understand gear ratios. A difference at the smaller side of the drivetrain is more dramatic than the taller side. A 2 tooth difference from 11-13 and say 37-39 are completely different percentages.

It's a safe bet to assume that Shimano has done their homework on this stuff.
  • 2 1
 @scotty1212: well aware that large steps lead to less smooth changes. i'm okay with that. i'm not a road biker. i'll take wide range and light weight over smaller steps. i seriously want an 11-42T 8 speed cassette. would probably weigh under 300g and still have all the range i need
  • 1 0
 @scotty1212: oh, and i wouldn't have to use a 4x saint shifter to get sloppily all the way across the cassette. shifting would be much more exact
  • 3 1
 I'm with @xeren on this one with regard to cadence. It doesn't matter to the majority of MTB. With regard to range and less gears, I'm looking at the SRAM EX1 group since you can now purchase aftermarket. 8 speeds with good range. And made for mopeds (ebikes) so should be durable...
  • 1 1
 @TheFunkyMonkey: Cadence is mostly for cross-country guys when it comes to mountain biking. There's a lot of trails near me where you climb the cassette like crazy due to the terrain. I can see why you guys don't care for it but, I doubt that a drivetrain that has a bigger allowance for percentages would work very well. If you've ever seen the derailleur go into the tallest gear, It doesn't inspire a lot of confidence that it would translate well in the trail but it works well enough for me.

Another good one is if you have ever used or seen a mega-range shimano cassette. Watching the derailleur climb that beast, you would think the derailleur was going to snap right off.
  • 2 1
 @scotty1212: Yep - perfectly clear what cadence is all about. I stand behind my original comment which is the majority of mountain bikers do not care about cadence. I bet there are avid MTB that don't even know what cadence is...
  • 3 2
 @scotty1212: a 9t jump on the final cog. Again crap. I know what Im talking about. Ypu can work out the percentages but 32-37 is 5t and 37-47 is 9t difference. Thats just the last 3 cogs. Shimano basically took there 11-42 cassette and took off the 42t and added a 46t.

Shimaino 11-46
11-13-15-17-19-21-24-28-32-37-46

Shimano 11-42
11-13-15-17-19-21-24-28-32-37-42

Sunrace 11-46
11-13-15-18-21-
-24-28-32-36-40-46

Now tell me mr.technician... which cassette is a better 11-46?
  • 4 0
 I vote for a 10 speed 11-42T XT cassette!
  • 1 0
 @TheFunkyMonkey: Yeah I wouldn't mind a wide-range 8-speed cassette too. Not sure about the EX1 though; I REALLY don't like the price Razz and I don't like the big jumps across the middle of the cassette which is where I want closer ratios for trail work. I'm thinking about b*stardising a 34T megarange - drop one of the smallest 2 and add a 40/42 at the top for the steeper climbs.

I imagine a clutch mech would be best though, and I gather most seem to use a different cable pull ratio from the pre-clutch days - does anyone know if there is a clutch mech which works with either SRAM 1:1 or older Shimano 1:2 shifters?
  • 5 2
 @inverted180: Well, if you feel you know more than Shimano, by all means. You are clearly the master. I'm not here to argue. You came off as arrogant with your first comment and are clearly argumentative.

Judging by your copy and pasting, it looks like Shimano prefers to have an added step in the faster side of the cassette and Sunrace prefers it closer to the climbing side. Regardless, both have the same range. The last gear being so tall is pretty much just a bailout gear anyway. I'd still put my money on XT, but that's just my preference.

Just an FYI as well, The 11-42 is for 2x or 3x set-ups and the 11-46 is for 1x.
  • 2 0
 @xeren: Yeah, wide range and low numbers of gears is what I want too! I need a couple low gears for climbing, a couple middle ones and then the high ones for fast descents
  • 1 1
 To explain in detail a little more and to bring cadence back up, cadence in the taller side of the cassette is the most sparadic. To have a 24% difference there, mathematically, is a bigger difference than the sun race cassette.

You're correct there. Realistically though, you would notice the larger percentage change in the smaller side of the cassette than the larger side. I find I play in the middle cassette more than one of the sides so I prefer having small steps in the middle.
  • 1 0
 @scotty1212: sorry to come off argumentative, if anything it is just frustration at Shimano for poor execution on the 11-46 cassette. And I think my argument is very valid.
  • 1 0
 @nismo325: i said 10 speed 11-42T, not 46T.
  • 15 1
 Hopefully crc will be stocking the deore stuff at their usual bargain discounted prices
  • 9 0
 I don't get the blurb about the pedals. "The PDED500 pedal once again, puts one of Shimano's most-wanted products into the hands of entry-level riders."

Don't entry and all other level riders just buy PD-M530s? They're a 500 series product and only about $40 brand new....
  • 4 0
 Exactly my thought, my bike isn't so budget running full XT M8000 11 speed yet i still run M530 pedals since XT trail pedals are only about 50g lighter, no different in function and cost about £60 while i got M530s for £20 and have used and abused them for over 2 years without any issues, still solid as a rock, means i have a pair on all my bikes (apart from DH) so no need to swap pedals over like i would have to if i had one expensive pair of pedals.
  • 5 0
 @maglor: I'm pretty sure my M530s are made of adamantium. I've bashed them on so many rocks they might as well be considered pickaxes. But they just keep going, no complaints, no maintenance needed.
  • 13 2
 Great that there is no 11* Deore option - so we won't see any of these cheaper but high priced Santacruz with a XT-Deore mixed drivetrain o_O...
  • 4 0
 Sadly not true, because Shimano still make oem 10speed XT mechs. So bikes can be labelled as "Shimano XT" but that can just mean the mech
  • 13 2
 Now this is a story all about how My life got flipped turned upside down.....
  • 12 4
 "many avid riders, and some first-time mountain bikers will be hitting the trails this season aboard far more modest steeds". I'm sorry but not even first-time mountain bikers should be riding with avids.
  • 7 0
 It's Festivus for the rest-uv-us!!! Which is appropriate because the pinkbike comment section has been an "open airing of grievances" since its inception.
  • 1 0
 just need Vandelay Industries to get into the MTB scene
  • 6 0
 I have Deore M615 brakes and absolutely love them. No real performance difference between the oh-so-holy XT. Also been top notch satisfied with the M7000 drivetrain- which by the way looks beautiful imho
  • 4 0
 What happened to your gravity groups shimano? Surely some of the improvements in m9000 could benefit Saint, & ZEE? Especially since most of us were happy to trade a little more weight for increased durability on AM bikes?

If you wanna split off DH racing & keep it 10 speed, I won't argue, but there's for sure a market for burlier 11 speed components, get to it.
  • 1 0
 We have heard from Shimano for years That they were going to upgrade their DH (saint) line and still nothing. Almost every pro that's not a Shimano sponsored racer uses DH XO 7 speed. They don't seem able to react to changing standards?
  • 5 0
 Article says no 1x option

Article picture show 1x crankset (the album the pics are in also show more images of 1 x Deore crank)

I am confuzzled :S
  • 6 0
 The "1x crankset" picture is a actually a 2x, the bigger chain ring is just hiding the smaller one. If you look closely you'll see a 36-26 lazer-marked on the chain-ring and on the other pic il the album you see the second smaller chain-ring.
  • 2 1
 My question is this... Why can't there be a 1x setup in Deore? Obviously it won't the as lightweight and fine-tuned as the more expensive siblings, but at the same time surely less parts will bring down the price?

Why are 1x's so expensive to begin with?
  • 7 1
 @Spark24: There can be...Deore Crank, Deore Derailleur, SLX Cassette, SLX Shifter, SLX Chain. that's like a $12 price increase to go 1x. That said, you can go full SLX for like another $10, so that's probably why Shimano didn't bother with a 1x Deore. Deore is going on the budget bikes who's riders are largely not even aware that 1x is a thing.
  • 6 0
 @Spark24: just don't buy the front mech and shifter, and remove the small ring, done, been running 1x9 deore for three years and works perfectly with the only adjustments being 4mm of spacers on the chainring to keep it quiet in the top half the cassette, and to improve backpedaling.
  • 2 0
 @TheRaven @ashyjay sure I get conversion thing.. but that's not really what I'm asking... I want to know why 1x can't be standard from budget up? What is it that is making it pricier to begin with? Surely adding another ring to the Deore cassette and click to the Deore shifter isn't that expensive?
  • 3 0
 @Spark24: That's one of the ridiculous things about 1x. It's laughable that removing two parts from the standard drivetrain has made it MORE expensive, but that's what has happened. You can see the brands protecting 1x as the "premium" product by not offering it in the lower tiers, or just taking much longer to offer it in the lower tiers.

Marketing aside, you can easily make 1x anything yourself. The new Deore 10-speed cassette offers plenty of range for the vast majority of riders. Just remove the rings from the crank, add a N/W, and disregard the front shifter.
  • 6 0
 @Spark24: I'd say it's because Shimano thinks deore groupset is an entry level tech for people starting mountain-biking, for who 1x drive-trains are not suited. Because when you start mountain-biking you don't know what gear range you need for your kind riding. It would end up with people being disappointed/giving up for having to spend time and money buying and testing several chain-rings to find the one that suits best their riding. And without this testing phase there would be loads of people out there spinning their legs like a mad hamster to follow there friends or having to push there bike because they run out of gears in every climb. Because of that a 2x or 3x is far more suited for a ready to ride out of the box mtb. And has ashyjay says no one stops you from not installing a front mech and getting rid of there second ring to go 1x.
  • 1 0
 @TheRaven: How about this...most high end bikes don't have the front derailleur mount and rear end chainline design, so no low end 2x or 3x will go on them. Most bargain basement bikes have 2x and 3x because the rear end is designed for that chainline. They are drawing the line and for good reason.
  • 1 0
 @barrysbikes: So then just make that "low end 2x or 3x" a 1x. Really there's no problem here. The vast majority of the bikes that the "3x for life yo!" crowd ride will continue to support front derailleurs. The "bigger" bikes that are so popular here are ridden by guys that are happy to go 1x even with it's shortcomings.
  • 1 0
 @jseranne: You are correct sir!

Thanks
  • 1 0
 @jseranne: That does certainly make sense and I can say that I went through that phase myself years ago... but again why is there this substantial hike in price? And surely the amount of demo riding one can do these days you'd be able to ride before you buy and see what feels best? and surely it would be cheaper to just upsize the front chain ring than to change an entire drivetrain as you get fitter?
  • 5 2
 Hmmm. I prefer Shimano to SRAM, but they are constantly behind so I haven't been on Shimano for years. Last Shimano Drivetrain was an XTR/XT/SLX frankestein, thanks Specialized! Now I'm on SRAM Eagle and GX because Shimano doesn't have anything comparable to Eagle and XT 1x was not out yet when I got the GX.

I do see this as a good option for entry level bikes, but personally wouldn't buy anything below SLX as I prefer 1x.
  • 2 0
 "Wide rims are still on the horizon" It feels like Shimano does not pay attention to the Mountain Bike Industry at all, they are very reactive vs proactive. Correct me if I'm wrong but they don't seem to innovate anything, just make cheaper versions of others products once proven in the field. They were late to the party on 1X drive trains, their hubs, even the xtr, can't compete with high end, high engagement hubs. All that being said I think they make the best brakes in the business.
  • 7 3
 Shimano deserves more credit than that. They invented SIS, trigger shifting, clutch derailleurs, electric shifting, hollowtech cranks and the list goes on and on. When engineers instead of bros and marketing people design stuff it takes time to get it right. Shimano will not do lots of the things SRAM does because it's bad engineering, it' s as simple as that.
  • 1 0
 @mountain-life: You are right they do deserve more credit than I gave them. I used to be all Shimano until the creation of 1X11. Then when Shimano caught up I tried XT 11 speed and felt it was engineered very poorly. I have read countless reviews of people experiencing the same issue I did where the chain shifts 5+ gears when you back pedal in the climbing gears. This results in having to get off the bike and pedal the gears back in place. I have yet to experience a single issue with my XX1 drive trains so for me personally I would have to disagree that Shimano coming late to the party was to get things right. I have met a couple of SRAM engineers in Chicago and they were far from bro's, very smart guys over there.
  • 2 0
 @mountain-life: shimano didn't invent electric shifting, mavic did it like 20 years ago and campy did it 3 years before di2.
  • 4 1
 @jgreermalkin: The japanese corporations do business differently than american companies. When it comes to the stockmarket and how they run their companies, they look way longer term than US firms....they are more patient. To us, they don't move fast enough, to them, they take their time to TRY and get it right. Do they get it right every time...NO, but they are on a different timeline. It does make it hard for us to nail down SRAM vs Shimanio and which parts to go with because they both never get things released at the same time so we can fairly compare them to make the best choice for our current situation...too many pro and cons to deal with.
  • 1 0
 @barrysbikes: I kind of see your point. As a business process consultant that has worked both in US and Japanese manufacturing I'm not sure I agree that all Japanese companies work this way. I have never been on the ground at Shimano so I cant speak from experience, sound like you have. That being said my original statement was about wider rims, a product that does not require years of engineering. And you are correct that Sram and Shimano release things on different time tables, Shimano seems to be 2 years behind Sram, Examples would include 11speed, 12speed, wider rims and dropper seat posts.
  • 5 0
 SRAM pushing that Gripshift crap on us for ages... I still haven't forgiven them for that
  • 1 0
 @MuddyFoxCourierComp: Ha! Yeah that was pretty unforgivable. I was all Shimano until the creation of 1X11.
  • 2 1
 @jgreermalkin: Shimano goes through a much more rigorous proving process than SRAM. That's why Shimano is always late. The flip side to this is that you don't have to worry about quirks and issues with the new product you are buying unlike SRAM. Shimano stuff works, period. SRAM gives you the cutting edge innovation, but you may have to live with some problems.

Also, companies like OneUp have pretty much given us the best of both worlds. Their expansion kits give you the SRAM tech with the Shimano reliability. I'm using their Shark setup right now...so I have a cassette with Eagle's range, X1's price, and Shimano-quality shifting and reliability. It is heavy, but i'd be a moron to complain about a 90g heavier cassette when my rear tire is almost 1200g.
  • 2 0
 @TheRaven: 2-3 years ago I would have agreed with you on Shimano producing a higher quality product. Personally I have not had a single issue with SRAM 1X11 and after months of issue with Shimano 1X11 I basically threw the drive train away. Do you have evidence to back your claim that Shimano goes through a more rigorous proving process than SRAM? With many years of manufacturing process experience I can tell you that there are many factors that can lead to a longer production process and many of them have nothing to do with testing and refining.

I also have experience with One UP components and while I love the ability to expand your range at a fraction of the cost of a new one shifting is compromised. I have experienced it personally and I think every review I have read said the same thing.
  • 6 1
 I thought the SLX was already available in 1x11 ?
  • 8 0
 It is. But now they have a SLX 11-46 cassette.
  • 2 0
 Running deore brakes with ICE pads on my rig, tons of bike park laps and 3-5 rides a week, these brakes are amazing value and I couldn't justify spending more considering how happy I have been with them.
  • 1 0
 1x10 just Got better but I'd still say SLX 1x11 is a great step into 11speed! Then once the chain and cassette wear out, SRAM GX steps in, clean shifting with shimano feel.

Oh Brakes XT for price and power or XTR levers with Saint callipers.
I've got Hope V4s
Just saying ????
  • 2 1
 Shimano bike sales declined 17.4% in 2016 and I don't see this group doing much to turn that around. OEM's will cherry-pick the good bits and spec a third-party 1X crank wherever possible.
  • 1 0
 I see less and less bikes with Shimano too.
  • 4 1
 SLX cassette looks good but i wonder how much cheaper it will be than a 11-46 XT cassette.
  • 1 0
 That was my exact thought.
  • 2 0
 I wonder if reality is reality...
  • 2 0
 Or how much does it weigh?
  • 2 1
 It probably won't be but shops will push the price of the xt cassette to keep a price differential. I'm sure it happened with Sram when they started introducing 1x11 groupsets below xx1
  • 3 0
 Are Deore cranks still "D" section?
Or are they properly hollow like SLX, XT etc?
  • 2 0
 Still wonder why cant get gears to work without that thing hanging of rear hub Or maybe it cant be done better, Or maybe it can
  • 1 1
 Shimano makes great kit. Trade restrictions, disparate currencies and whether there is VAT help determine what you are going to pay. For a minute in time americanos are a click away from cheaper than wholesale. CRC ships free there is no import duty on parts and such up to $800. The dollar is strong. US prices dropped. Jensen and the like are have to compete so you win out. Shops got better prices to an extent ........SRAM prices in the US are carefully managed at corporate. They also think a 10 tooth cog is a good idea.
  • 5 2
 Shops do NOT get better prices... they get fucked. They can buy shimano cheaper on Jenson then they can wholesale. That's just fucked.
  • 1 0
 @bikekrieg: differnce between Shimano USA and Shimano Europe!
  • 3 0
 No no no, this won't do: I would rather pay $420 for a cassette............./s
  • 3 0
 Great to see Shimano finally remodel the deore lineup!
  • 4 1
 Shimano Deore: el indestructible.
  • 2 0
 Hate to gripe but if you are already putting this into a spreadsheet, can you include a total row?
  • 4 1
 Good stuff for reasonable cost.
  • 6 2
 Shimano for president
  • 4 1
 ...of Ontario, to lower our hydro bills >:/
  • 4 1
 so approx 290$ for a complete drivetain ? Gonna love shimano
  • 3 0
 But but how many grams does it all weigh?
  • 7 0
 If weight is a concern for you, Deore is not your drivetrain. Deore is for those for whom value is the one and only concern. Getting a quality drivetrain for as cheap as absolutely possible. If you want the cheapest reasonably light drivetrain, I would think XT would be your ticket.
  • 4 2
 Deore is a good looking woman with a fat body. Rides great but sometimes that weight can be a little bit awkward to handle, and is not as smooth to move because of her pullies.
  • 1 0
 I know what Deore is and use some of the components...however I do like KNOWING what the differences are between different levels etc. which helps the decision process.
  • 1 0
 @zephxiii: i'm betting the deore cassette will be lighter than the XT 11 speed cassette, simply because it has 1 fewer cog. but shimano won't publish that, we'll have to wait until someone actually weighs it
  • 1 0
 Did I miss the part where they discussed backward compatibility? Is the new deor rear derailleur and cassette compatible with my old shimano 10 speed shifters?
  • 3 0
 Shimano is good for biking! Price and quality bar none!
  • 2 0
 Now i have no excusse to not build NS Eccentric this year.
  • 4 3
 The thought of running a front derailleur & shifter stresses me out. Everything should be 1 by now #konmari
  • 2 1
 Climate change and Shimano keeping Deore in 10 speed: The world as we know it no longer exists. The gears war is over!
  • 1 0
 Waiting for new Saint and Zee. And I'm sure the new Zee crank will be the same as M6000.
  • 3 1
 Make Shimano Great Again
  • 5 0
 They do that by themselves every few years... interesting...
  • 5 6
 Wow new 2x10 and 3x10 groupsets!!!!

Have i just jumped back in time 10 years?

If SRAM launched this today they would be getting a total roasting Big Grin
  • 4 0
 lol . But, well if Shimano decided to kill 2x and 3x people would still complain, saying that the industry doesn't think about the users and only about trends and it is limiting options. I like the fact that you can still go 1x whatever if you want to, just change the a rings;D
  • 6 0
 @t-stoff: There are still a ton of 2x and 3x riders out there. SRAM decided to give up on them so they all ride Shimano now.

I for the life of me cannot see what the problem with offering more options is. Maybe someone can explain this to me?
  • 3 0
 @TheRaven: I've done lots of expensive upgrades but I (still) ride 2x10 on my FS, 2x11 on my road, and 3x8 on my 97 zaskar ! I did the math for both ratios and investment and it didn't presented me any significant advantage apart from the part search fun.

That's it!
  • 2 0
 @t-stoff: Despite the marketing that tells us that 1x is simpler, lighter, cheaper and more reliable...it's really only simpler. I've been running 1x for two seasons now and I don't find it any more reliable (I never had any real problems with front derailleurs), it's not lighter (the big cassettes more than make up the weight of the front derailleur and shifter), and it's definitely not cheaper. I use it simply because it makes for less parts and less widgets to operate while riding.
  • 4 0
 @TheRaven: This, so much this... All the weight weenie stuff is somewhat questionable, especially with those huge cassettes on the rear wheel, increasing unsprung weight at the far end of the rear triangle. But damn, that simplicity is nice.

It used to be that you couldn't really shift under power, so you didn't lose much with a front derailleur. That's how it was when I first got into the sport in the 90s - if you were trying to get into a lower gear while powering up an incline, you'd bork your rear derailleur, so you had to look ahead and anticipate the proper gear to use and stick with it. Meaning there was not that much extra hassle involved in making it a front derailleur shift and dropping to granny - and given the small range on cassettes back then, you desperately needed that range. Now, rear derailleurs will let you get away with murder - that and disc brakes, more than suspension really, were the biggest revelations to me when I get back into the sport in circa 2010.

Whether 1x10 or 1x11 - a modern cassette has a shit ton of range. Enough for most people. And despite the heavier cassette (compared with say 10sp xtr from just before the 1x11 revolution), it's still reasonable. And all that weight stuff is outweighed, for most users, by the simplicity, and the fact that they can access almost all of that range while under power, so there's a lot less interruption to flow, having to get off the bike because you didn't clear a steep section you didn't properly anticipate, etc. It's just more user friendly, and more fun.

11sp 11-46 SLX is here now - sweet. Same old driver, slightly bigger/heavier cassette, same reliable and durable derailleur performance. Meanwhile, the lower end SRAM groups have gotten pretty damn good as well. We all moan about how bikes have become super expensive - but if you look at the $3,000 and just below price bracket, you now get solid bikes with components that you'd upgrade only if you're looking for bling or light weight, not for usability. SLX brakes are beefy and reliable enough for me on Galbraith at 230# - that's impressive, especially given the prices on those. Drive trains that perform well for years, even in gritty mud, also impressive. The only real shortcomings of those bikes these days is hubs (my Kona's stock hub was replaced twice under warranty, with a serious upgrade the second time around because they didn't want me coming back again and again).
  • 2 0
 @g-42: Even on weight though, 100g extra at the rear axle is not going to have a noticeable effect when said bike has 1000g armored sidewall tires mounted. Anyone who claims otherwise is kidding themselves.
  • 2 0
 @TheRaven: definitely!
  • 1 0
 @g-42: "...and the fact that they can access almost all of that range while under power, so there's a lot less interruption to flow, having to get off the bike because you didn't clear a steep section you didn't properly anticipate, etc. It's just more user friendly, and more fun."

That's the only reasonable and valid argument that will eventually make me convert to 1x.
Yap, most of the "new users" can choose between slow process of learning how to shift and do it effortlessly, or just go to 1x. I've noticed that some of my friends that started riding a couple of years ago still struggle with this magic art of shifting, so I can understand them, for me it's just natural, but I understand those limitations in terms of simplicity and shifting under power. Well, we'll see! I've read a post from a guy who instead of going 1x he went 2x Di2. It's much more expensive but it solves the simplicity issue;D
  • 1 0
 Sealed bearings in their wheels yet?
  • 1 0
 Now there is ABSOLUTELY no excuse to go 1x
  • 2 1
 467grams for a cassete.... ouch!!
  • 1 0
 which cassette?
  • 3 6
 Deore line up looks good but the cranks are outdated. No direct mount? No 1x version? No thanks. Wake up Shimano, times are changing.

I do hope that the new Deore line would introduce a new 10 speed wide range cassette, since the SunRace one doesn't shift too smooth and all the other options are super expensive. A mid level wide range 10 speed cassette is what's missing on the market currently. Al though I have my doubts if Shimano will make one because the Deore line doesn't have a 1x option.
  • 6 0
 I somehow missed the Deore 11-42 cassette part. Stoked to see that! Will replace my SunRace cassette with this one for sure. Thanks for this one Shimano!
  • 9 1
 Remove 2 chainrings and you are left with one? Its been like this since forever, dont fix it if it aint broke Big Grin Also srams direct mount is certainly patented... Btw: I'm running '06 m760 XT cranks on my '15 bike, they weight 607g compared to 603g of m8000...
  • 5 0
 @winko:
" srams direct mount is certainly patented..."

Source? There are plenty of other companies that have direct mount.
  • 1 0
 @winko: Does that work with these cranks, removing the granny? I run 2004 LX cranks (actually the left crank is newer) and have been using these as 2x for well over a decade (with a bash ring in the position of where the large ring used to be). A couple of months ago I decided I wanted to run an oval ring so I removed both rings, the front mech and put the oval ring on. But then I got afraid that if my chain would drop to the inside, it would get mangled between the bare mounts of where the granny used to be. I currently don't have a chain guide, no clutch rear mech and don't have prior experience with these narrow-wide chainrings. So I put the granny back on. So that's what I have now, a granny without a front mech. Just sitting there idle as a safety net Wink . But how bad is that anyway? Even this steel granny weights next to nothing and the dirt it accumulates does no harm. So maybe that's what Shimano thought too. Introducing another option raises costs (inventory etc.) more than just adding that small steel granny.

I was surprised to see the triple crankset. They probably need it for the trekking bikes.
  • 2 0
 @IamZOSO: Well seems like I was wrong with that one, there is no mention of chainring direct mount as TM technology/standard on srams webpage and others (checked RF) are indeed using it so I might be wrong. On the other hand shimano has always been conservative with changing standards like that (although the M8000 has unique chainring mount so...). Still dont see them jumping to setup their competition developed, especially because they did not yet bury the front mech Smile There are clear advantages of DM though, in my opinion just not big enough to change cranks/drivetrain.

@vinay I removed the granny, put on NW chainring and I'm good to go. While the chain dropped occasionally on rough terrain it never got stuck between frame and granyring mounts... This was old zee mech, now on M8000 I've had no issues. Probably also depends on the frame and space available in there... I can perfectly understand why leaving the granny is harmless precaution, those extra grams can save a lot of nerves if chain gets stuck there but with my setup I don't need it. Deore is used on wide range of bikes from trekking to relatively cheap mtbs which still run 2/3x8/9/10 systems so its cheaper for them to design one crank for all
  • 1 0
 @Mattin: does the sunrace cassette suck?
  • 1 0
 @markar: saying that it sucks would be exaggerated, it works okay but the shifts are not as smooth as I'd like them to be. Makes my GX drive train shift like a (properly set up, but still) Altus. The shifts are quite noisy also. But at the same price can't expect anything more than a low-budget cassette for its price. I'd give The performance a 6 out of 10. Can't complain because of the price and no other option; I was still happy SunRace made this one. But the Deore cassette should definitely make a noticeable difference and with this new cassette on the market I wouldn't recommend the SunRace anymore (assuming the new Deore cassette shifts like it does on the old 11-36 Deore cassettes).
  • 1 0
 @Mattin: thanks that's what I've heard, I bought one and returned it
  • 2 1
 @winko: Riding a triple with a N/W ring in the middle position is NOT the same. The Q-factor on triple Shimano cranks is a whole cm wider than on 1x Shimano cranks. Also the chain line is a slightly bit different, but mainly the Q-factor is a big difference. So no thanks, I'll rather choose a 1x specific crankset.
  • 1 0
 @markar: You're welcome. Your choice to switch to Deore should be much better Smile
  • 2 0
 @Mattin: I'm a few months late on this, but will correct your gross inaccuracy for the benefit of any future readers.

The Q factor on Shimano triple cranks is no different than the Q factor on the 1X cranks.

All the XT and SLX cranks from Shimano have identical Q factor (~176mm) regardless of their 1X/2X/3X version. I'm reading the X dimensions directly from Shimano's Technical Information document.

There is some variability among the XTR cranks ( the Trail versions are slightly less Q than XT/SLX, and the Race versions are lesser still) but again, the Q factors are IDENTICAL on the 1X and 2X versions of the respective models.
  • 1 0
 @Inertiaman: I'm sorry, just checked again and you're right. No idea how I found the 10mm in difference, I do really remember seeing it somewhere, but I guess I must have compared the wrong cranks then...
  • 3 3
 Late to the 11 spd party. Does shimano 11-46 fit on a regular cassette body?
  • 7 0
 Yes.
  • 1 0
 great! thanks Steven
  • 1 0
 That jump to the 46t cog on the SLX cassette!
  • 2 1
 I for one think 1x is actually a backwards step
#Triple4lyf
  • 1 0
 Great that Shimano offers choices to the rider!
  • 1 0
 SO PERFECT !! Thanks !! SRAM can go home with their failing products
  • 2 1
 Thanks Shimano... you're still second best!
  • 1 0
 Deore is smart looking. looks more than its price
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