Shimano's New XT Di2 Drivetrain Can Shift Automatically & While Coasting, But Only For eBikes
Shimano has announced two new Di2 electronic groupsets that can shift gear automatically based on rider speed and cadence, and can also shift (both manually and automatically) while the rider is coasting. The groupsets are e-bike specific and only work with new drive units which Shimano are also announcing today.
The all-new XT Di2 and CUES Di2 drivetrains have three shifting modes:
● Full Manual Shifting
● Full Manual Shifting with FREE SHIFT (which can shift manually while coasting)
● Automatic Shifting While Pedaling and While Coasting with AUTO SHIFT WITH MANUAL OVERRIDE (shifts automatically while pedalling or coasting, unless overridden by the rider)
Auto Shift is exactly what it sounds like - the system will shift for you as you pedal to keep you at the optimum cadence for the speed. It's basically an automatic gearbox for your e-bike. The manual override part should be fairly self-explanatory too; you can use the shifter to stop the computer from changing gear for you or to shift into a different gear at will.
Free Shift uses the e-bike motor to shift gears while coasting. The chainring can spin without you turning the cranks, so the derailleur can shift into a different gear during a descent. Of course, this only works while the bike is moving and the system won't power you forward without you pedalling. Combining this with the Auto Shift feature means the system can keep you in the right gear for the speed you're travelling without you having to pedal or touch the shifter, so in theory, whenever you decide to pedal the bike is already in the perfect gear.
The key to the system is the integration of the motor and drivetrain, which share the same battery and communicate via wires. Among other things, this ensures the motor turns the chainring at the right speed and at the right time for the derailleur to change gears properly. The cadence and speed sensors integral to any ebike drive unit make automatic shifting possible.
The system isn't wireless.
While the system isn't wireless like SRAM AXS, the derailleur shares the main e-bike battery's power so there's no external battery hanging off the derailleur and only one charging port to worry about.
The groupsets
XT Di2 will be offered in two tiers: XT Di2 HYPERGLIDE+ (12-speed with a 10-51t cassette) or XT Di2 LINKGLIDE (11-speed with an 11-50t cassette).
There will also be a lower-end Di2 e-bike drivetrain with similar features in 11- or 10-speed flavours called CUES Di2, which appears to be aimed at commuter bikes only.
Shimano Cues offers many of the same features at a lower price point but seems to be aimed at commuting and not e-MTB.
The new EP6 drive unit.
Motors and compatability
The XT and Cues Di2 drivetrains are not compatible with existing motors. Shimano have also developed the EP801 drive unit (an update on EP8 ) which can communicate with the Di2 derailleurs, along with a new EP6 motor which will offer similar features at a lower price point. Both motors provide 85Nm peak torque and a continuous 250 W output, but while the EP801 mootor weighs a claimed 2.7 Kg, the EP6 is 3 Kg.
Both are compatible with Shimano XT Di2 HYPERGLIDE+, XT Di2 LINKGLIDE, CUES Di2, internal Hub Gears Di2 specification and mechanical drivetrains. So in other words, the new motors will work with older Di2 or mechanical drivetrains, but the new Di2 drivetrains only work with the new motors.
Pricing & availability
Shimano say that XT Di2, CUES Di2, and EP6/EP801 drive units will be available on complete bikes from late spring / summer 2023.
As for pricing, Shimano says "these components will only be available as part of complete bike builds and therefore we do not plan to provide pricing for individual parts or groupsets at this time." We've also been told that we won't be able to get our hands on one until Spring 2023. Shimano is releasing this news early because some bikes will be seen at Eurobike with the system installed.
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m.youtube.com/watch?v=B--Bh9jCJxQ , it’s unfortunate time has moved on and anyone can now go to the drag strip in their model 3
There is no need to be a stubborn child and act like you can only enjoy one thing in life.
Ps I do ride fully rigid with canti brakes. Some tech makes sense but most is just shit.
My other bike is a 2008 Gary Fisher Rig single speed with an 80mm fox. I commute every day on it. The fully rigid is for steep wild rocky trails here in Japan.
Its apples to apples about the subject of ebikes and the direction of their marketing. My personal opinions and lifestyle have nothing to do with it, I was just being clear to your argumentative ass since you care so much about what I'm doing apparently.
But hey, soon enough maybe bikes will follow the subscription model and you can pay monthly for your shifting, and have a little screen that can play you an ad every time you get on your bike.
I’m not an e-bike pundit, but I think we all get wrapped up in our little “pinker” community and forget we are prolly the smallest market share when it comes to bikes.
On my way to work today, I said out loud, watching someone struggle to get going from a stoplight, “it should make sense if these things auto shifted, or had something like a CVT”
Funny to log in and see this article
There is a huge market for this kind of stuff. You would be blown away to see how many ~170mm travel e-enduros have basically full fenders around here. One of the most asked questions when people buy these tanks is: "can you put a kickstand on this?"
Granted, a lot of this is due to bike leasing funded by employers. A lot of people get a gigantic budget and think because they occasionally ride on dirt paths, that they "need" a mountain bike.
Generally speaking also the same people that wear out the 10/11/12t cogs in 100km or less. The record so far was chain slippage after a grand total of 27km.
Like I said, we think we are the target market, and I’m pretty sure we aren’t.
Have a great pedal day.
Seems madness to put all that torque through a low spec 12 speed drivetrain. Madness unless you're an the FD at SRAM, rubbing your hands together at the doubling of the already doubled profits.
Two weeks ago I spotted an e-enduro with such a big saddle bag that it would have it the fender when lowering the dropper post.
This wasn't even a cas of Jobrad, the guy was too old, so he paid his own money for that abomination.
"BuT aUtOMatIc iS FasTEr"
My wife has the Bosch on her Giant and no problems in 4 years. I am not convinced on the Shimano motor (it only happened to me once) but since my friend and riding buddy had the same issue, I am just wondering when the next crap-ou8t will occur.
That space is for water bottles.
brose deeeeeeeefinitely cannot say that, and hell, even Bosch fail at a higher rate.
E7000, first EP8 were the dogs dinner. the new EP8 and EP8rs are bullet proof
Additionally mechanisms that have already been used for ages are servicable by more shops/mechanics, partly even by you or me.
Now adding a gearbox means one more part can break that I most definetly can't fix and the local shop might not be able to fix.
There are many reasons why you don't see ebikes with gearboxes. Some might be because the industry wants you to have better time on your bike with the least amount of downtime but most come down to money!
Development costs money and might not work in the end. Establishing new standarts costs money and might not be worth it! Shit is hard!
See this is where autonomous cars need to come in and we can make the most of our analogue bikes ; )
The allure for me was never getting uphill easier—it was being able to go farther and explore more. And do laps on the local DH trails without shuttling with a gas guzzling truck.
When I see people in Ontario flatlands using them to just go-fast when they can just get a workout instead, and when I hear that Norco only brought E-bikes to Sea Otter Canada (in Ontario) and the Trek representative lamenting that he would send out more demos if he had more E-bikes... It just makes me want to shake my head at the weakness in the hearts, minds, souls and legs of our local population.
"the system won't power you forward without you pedalling"... Only with stock software. Unless I'm missing something, it clearly has that capability and is only a hack away from becoming a full-on motorbike, yet is still sold as a bicycle.
Just like it's technically illegal to speed on a motorcycle, and those bikes are easily physically able to. Shit, it's way easy to break the law, and turn a car or motorbike into a legit weapon, in most countries, but we don't see location based speed limiters anywhere (that I know of).
"Intended use" is a thing, and a few people might illegally modify pedal-assist e-bikes to be throttle powered, but it's tiny minority doing the illegal things. Just like it's small minority of people taking their sport bikes to 150 mph on public roads (that aren't the Autobahn).
It's not for me or a large section of the cycling community, but there is a lucrative market for people who want the fanciest things on a subscription.
Just look at the rise of leasing cars.
as for me, I work on my own bike, and buy a new bike about every 10 years. so its a no from me dawg.
There is a 0% chance that an e bike will last 10 years.
I'm starting to see e biking as an entirely new sport for a new market.
It's not the biking that we all grew up with though.
Found it - www.thedrive.com/news/bmw-is-charging-a-subscription-fee-for-heated-seats-again
Basically they added a freewheel to the crank and blocked the rear hubs freewheel by zip-tying the cassette to the hub.
Therefore the chain is always moving when the bike is moving and you can shift whenever you want. Doesn't work automatically though.
But the Auto-shift feature seems like a chain-wear nightmare. Repeated upshifting under the load of an e bike motor on a steep climb as shown in the video has got to be one of the quickest ways to wear out a chain. Also seems like this could increase the chances of chain damage from shifting under load in some situations.
What would be helpful for e bikes is a system in the motor that would automatically decrease the pedal load while the derailleur is shifting, but I don't see that designed into this system.
The article does not specify what cadence the shifting is based around or whether that is adjustable or not. E bikes usually work more efficiently at a higher cadence so I'm curious how they've set it up.
"This is my derailleur. There are many others like it, but this one is mine. My derailleur is my best friend. It is my life. I must master it as I must master my life. Without me, my derailleur is useless. Without my derailleur, I am useless. I must shift my derailleur true. I must shift straighter than my riding buddies, who are trying to out-Strava me. I must shift them before they shift me. I will. Before God I swear this creed: my derailleur and myself are defenders of my drivetrain. We are the masters of our trail. We are the saviors of my life. So be it, until there is no mis-shift, but peace. Amen."
But thanks for the condescending tone youth, made me chuckle.
There wasn't a single point where my comment was "condescending". Oversensitive much? But thanks for condescendingly calling me a "youth", made me chuckle. Or should I be flattered? I mean, I know I'm in great shape for my age.
When you talk about "eeb sales" you also seem to deliberately forget that we're talking about emtbs here, not "eebs" in general. I am aware of how well e-commuters and e-folding bikes sell. They start cheaper and justifying the expense is different when it's transportation instead of a hobby. I can assure you that emtbs specifically are most definitely not over 50% of what most bike shops around the world sell. No category of mtb is.
The shop where I work (just 1 of 13 and online) will happily prove you wrong in just 1 day (even before hybrid sales). All £1500+, often in pairs and we are not unique in that stat. Contrary to your opinion, big and well run bike shops can easily do it.
FYI my shop is out of town and is a destination so we don't have big commuter segment. Our customers travel (from all over the UK) to shop with us. Whether that's by chance or deliberate.
We don't sell cheap eebs (like city stores, Halfords et al), but we do also sell a lot of sub £1k bikes (across all non E segments)
But this thread is about emtbs.
Dude. Your shop is in the UK. What's so hard to understand in the simple fact that the UK is not representative of the majority of the world? Not only that, your shop is "a destination" and clearly specializes in the performance/mtb segments, which makes it even more of an outlier globally. How is any of that proving me wrong? To the contrary, you have just literally proven all my points for me.
No where does it mention that these new drivetrains are emtb only. It does however state that CUES appears to be aimed at the commuter market.
So please do explain why this makes it all emtb only.
My shops specialises in selling bikes (all of them), regardless of your assumptions and whilst our market is different to the US/Canada, its pretty representative of Europe. The industry is small and its does talk... the only notable differences are in inner-city shops, but even the bigger of those are pretty similar.
Where did I say anything about US/Canada? They are just as non-representative of the majority of the world as the UK is. No, the UK market is not representative of Europe, let alone global markets. The UK is the 6th economy in the world. There are lots of European countries with an average monthly salary of less than 1000 EUR and in a number of them it's below 500 EUR. And that is Europe, not even scratching the surface of the actual GLOBAL markets.
You keep going on about the world and global markets and then and soon as I mention somewhere other than the UK you say it doesn't count.
There are lots of places in the world where the average monthly salary is far less than that even, so maybe you just need to be writing into the Daily Mail about all of this because you don't seem to be having the same conversation.
I never said "it doesn't count". Or quote where I did? I said those outliers don't sway the global proportions of sales between mtb categories. Also you had clearly assumed I was thinking about US and Canada, so I just corrected that. And maybe tried to hint to you that non-English speaking countries do, indeed, exist
I have no idea what you're talking about with that whole Daily Mail thing. I've never read it so maybe I'm missing some context? I mean, yes of course there are countries with lower incomes than that. That's the whole point. That's why, contrary to the comment I originally replied to, emtbs do not globally outsell basic XC bikes by volume and will not for the foreseeable future.
On the other side, the mobility side that is, people REALLY want this kind of stuff. Here in Germany (and other parts of Europe) the bicycle isn't so much seen as a hobby, but a viable alternative means of transportation. The E-Bike is just an extension of that. It's allowed people who don't really want to put in a big effort to get across town, people getting older or those who don't want to show up sweaty to work to get back on two wheels again. Many of these don't and never really did understand shifting, or just don't want to. The market is there and Shimano knows their audience.
Shit, they made a whole new acronym* for the commuter line. This is definitely aimed toward a specific audience, and it's not really MTB. They probably only made an XT version so it will get raced (Mick Hannah was spotted racing with it, or a prototype, recently) and get some exposure to the tech. But the CUES version will be the real money-maker, with the transportation applications being a much bigger market than eMTB, even in the US where bike transit is way less common than the rest of the world.
*(is CUES actually an acronym? Really not sure since there are SO MANY ALL CAPS NAMES in this thing!)
Who would downvote the truth?
(rhetorical question, we all know what the viagra-bikers who downvoted this looks like)
Linkglide is supposedly more of the same, but I've yet to see that stuff in person.
Plus Shimano, and many many reviewers, including here, have been telling us that HG+ (and LG) shifts amazingly and non-destructively in both directions even under power, so that powered shift blip will probably be miniscule, just enough to take the full 85 Nm load from the motor out of the system while the shift happens.
"Analog bike"
"Acoustic bikes"
"Muscular bikes"
And my favourite: "retro motorless bikes"
They already have a name, guys. And they are called bicycles, or bikes.
SRAM at least sells you a whole new AXS derailleur if you bend/brake the cage. Shit aswell, but better then a whole new bike...
It doesn't really take all that much thought processing power to realize that one piece of the system will not work without the rest of of the system. So why would you want to buy 1 piece?
They just released the newest Di2 knowing full well that tube in tube (point to point) internal routing is not only a thing, it's THE thing on modern bikes and has been for the last 6+ years making a centralized battery stored in a seat tube useless.
This tech will presumably make an ebike feel like that too? It will effectively turn it into a single speed that always has the right ratio, whether you're coming out of a berm at 30mph and need to sprint, or realise there's a mahoosive drop ahead of you and you are only doing 5mph.
For choppers like me who sometimes find themselves in the wrong gear at a critical moment, this could be pretty cool - I'll be interested to read the reviews (and then not buy it because I'm tight).
Just finally start making parts that are also usable as a 115 kg guy instead of a 75-80 kg guy. Those ten kg of a e-bike are usually not the problem but the size range of people. If someone is 2m tall he just is heavier and this has more effect than 10 kg more on the bike ffs.
Keeping those OEMs happy by keeping cheap HG-only rear hubs alive.
Or does it go in the bin and you have to buy another for 1000gbp?
www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMhXOOuoVR4
Quo vadis cycling???
-SRAM, probably
What even is this?
Available in your lbs in 2026 (maybe).