Sneak Peek: Fox Prototype Air Shock

Feb 22, 2015
by Richard Cunningham  

Pinkbike was riding with a prominent Fox employee recently and noticed that his shock was unlabeled and completely different looking than any trailbike shock that the pioneer suspension maker has made in recent times. As usual, we could not get detailed information about the internals, but some morsels of information did slip through. The new shock has a more rounded head, presumably to make room for air volume and different fluid circuits. Reportedly, the internals have been in development since these shocks were photographed, being tested at the 2013 DH World Championships.

bigquotesThe enlarged section near the base of the air can no-doubt houses a higher-volume, longer-stroke version of the in-line negative spring that Fox debuted with its original Float shock design.

The enlarged section near the base of the air can no-doubt houses a higher-volume, longer-stroke version of the in-line negative spring that Fox debuted with its original Float shock design. The advantage of a longer-travel negative spring is a smoother transition from the initial shock spring pressure into the mid-stroke. The proto shocks FOX were testing at the 2013 Worlds also had long-stroke negative spring bulges in their air cans. At least one other suspension designer is in agreement with Fox. Vorsprung Suspension recently released an aftermarket air can for Float shocks that features an upgraded negative spring.
Fox prototype Float shock 2015
Fox is on the move. Reportedly, this prototype announces the beginning of a series of fundamental changes in their suspension range.

FOX prototype RAD DH shock
Test shocks from the Pietermaritzburg, South Africa, World Champs have the same bulge for the negative spring as the one in the Fox spy-shot. Check out the hand-printed names.

Fox prototype Float shock 2015
The Fox proto on the left, compared with the current Float shock shows just how much the two differ in appearance. The small bump near the lower end of the Float's air can marks the end of its negative spring's effective stroke and where the air bypasses the internal piston to equalize the static pressure of the negative and positive springs.

The negative spring balances an air spring's static pressure, causing the initial spring rate to start very low, similar to a coil-type spring. The longer the stroke of the negative spring, the smoother the handoff becomes as the pressure falls off of to zero on the negative side and the suspension is completely supported by the main "positive side" of the air can. This is the purpose of the long-stroke coil-type negative spring that Fox developed for the air-sprung RAD 40 DH fork

Hints were made that the future direction of Fox's fork and shock development will include internal trickery that first appeared on the 2015 36 fork - which suggests that the compression circuits of future Float shocks will have a much more seamless feel between their small and large bump performance.
Smart minds think alike. Vorsprung's aftermarket Corset air can on a Fox Float-X shock.

Of course, much of the above is speculation, but a parking lot evaluation revealed that Fox's Float prototype was, as reviewers so often remark, "buttery smooth." Traditionally, Fox springs new technology at the Sea Otter Classic, so we'll keep the lens caps off of our cameras and be ready to shoot the pre-production versions if the opportunity presents itself.

View larger and additional images in the tech gallery.

MENTIONS: @foxracingshox, @VorsprungSuspension

Author Info:
RichardCunningham avatar

Member since Mar 23, 2011
974 articles

  • 331 8
  • 223 5
 Trying to think of a witty comment, but nothing springs to mind.
  • 203 3
 Atleast you made a solid rebound...
  • 102 12
 Well that rattled my aircan.
  • 191 3
 clearly you dont think well under pressure
  • 147 4
 it dampens my thoughts.
  • 129 2
 I don't want to judge. Different strokes for different folks.
  • 133 2
 looks like Fox may have something up its sleeve
  • 32 297
flag Lilshredman (Feb 20, 2015 at 18:43) (Below Threshold)
 What did the Fox Say?
  • 162 2
 This string of puns is making me sag.
  • 69 4
 Airheads !
  • 70 6
 I'm actually bouncing with happiness.
  • 79 3
 I can't seal my excitement!
  • 49 3
 Can it will ya.
  • 90 3
 Last time Eyelet fox get my hopes up.
  • 51 5
 Lets hope the price of FoxShox doesn't put anymore pressure in my bank account!
  • 51 2
 You just need a little less compression on your wallet.
  • 40 5
 I'm pretty pumped for it
  • 91 3
 I hope you've saved up enough kashima.
  • 11 54
flag B650wagon (Feb 20, 2015 at 19:35) (Below Threshold)
  • 35 1
 I love big cans. Wink
  • 49 3
 All of these fox prototypes are getting me and my arteries so pumped I might blow a seal and have a stroke
  • 29 2
 talk about your wallet bottoming out, sheesh
  • 26 4
 This Spring at the Sea Otter.
  • 10 2
 Well I am just gonna have to bulge and leave a comment.
  • 12 2
 this is soo compressing
  • 24 2
 Have we bottomed out with these puns!
  • 6 46
flag hoshi (Feb 20, 2015 at 23:27) (Below Threshold)
 and now make it as good looking as the RS debon air...
  • 16 2
 i feel shafted
  • 15 2
 the pressure to write a pun is getting too much
  • 5 9
flag ADhGuy (Feb 21, 2015 at 2:03) (Below Threshold)
 Oil these puns is making me hard
  • 1 23
flag RedBurn (Feb 21, 2015 at 3:28) (Below Threshold)
 Olie oil
  • 8 19
flag aly-14 (Feb 21, 2015 at 3:31) (Below Threshold)
 Surely these have all topped out now
  • 13 2
 you know what ever floats your float...
  • 12 4
 Hopefully I can help these puns rebound
  • 7 2
 You're really trying to push it there Sam...
  • 6 4
  • 7 3
 I usually don't like puns, but still eyelet myself make one...
  • 5 5
 Don't sound so shocked.
  • 5 2
 I would give my kingdom for a Horst. I mean it's RAD and all, but I'm not sure this one Float my boat and pushes all my valves.
  • 5 2
 Of Corset they had to do it
  • 6 2
 I wonder how long these prototypes will be floating around
  • 3 13
flag B650wagon (Feb 21, 2015 at 10:16) (Below Threshold)
 RAD - Ripped And Duplicated
  • 6 2
 Its the new air to the shock throne
  • 7 5
 Its got me cavitating with excitement
  • 5 6
 new cans always affect the stroke the shaft.
  • 5 1
 I hope we can all see eye to eye on this new tech.
  • 2 22
flag fatenduro (Feb 21, 2015 at 14:11) (Below Threshold)
 I seriously canned believe all these puns are about an air chamber. Pretty soon someone's going to ride one and say "Ah put dis shock on me ol'26er an now it's a kashimachine. Ah jus float ovah de competition, an win all the races." Then some marketing dude will spring on making a fatbike only version.
  • 4 8
flag its-sam (Feb 21, 2015 at 14:15) (Below Threshold)
 Okay you cutie
  • 12 2
 The photo of the that Float X with the corset on gave me de-bonair.
  • 3 5
 so smooth I canned believe it's not butter.
  • 5 1
 I think the negative for outweighs the positive in the beginning.
  • 3 1
 This is a punishing thread.
  • 3 1
 They're really trying to out-fox the competition.
  • 2 1
 this thread is pushing my stroke longer
  • 2 0
 If I get a higher-volume income, I will spring for this.
  • 5 0
 I am leaking fluid just thinking about its curves.
  • 1 0
 such a negative spring season coming if I don't get one of these...
  • 5 6
 Spring ding ding ding dingy dingy ding. That's that the fox says. I LOVE DOWNVOTES!!!!!!
  • 2 1
 These last posts have really been dampening the feel of the quality puns on pinkbike.
  • 2 2
 Plush, it looks like fox is really upping the pressure.
  • 3 9
flag enduroelite (Feb 23, 2015 at 11:05) (Below Threshold)
 I was all RAMPED UP to RETURN with a a joke but I was kinda SLOW ON THE REBOUND, I hope this one CAN STACKS UP to the best without putting a DAMPER their next big HIT.....
  • 7 0
 ^^^^^ too much going on there.
  • 53 3
 Damn, those shocks from the 2003 DH World Champs look pretty advanced. How come it's been 12 years and they're still at the prototype stage?
  • 5 4
 It's a typo, it should read 2013.
  • 21 3
 Incase you were confused ^^
  • 10 15
flag fracasnoxteam (Feb 21, 2015 at 2:17) (Below Threshold)
 Seriously?! just a clue: how old was manon in 2003?
  • 48 6
 Meanwhile Vorsprung has put their product into production, one that probably still works better and will be cheaper than this fox item. Classic.
  • 60 1
 i like how this is posted just a day or two after vorsprung.
  • 113 4
 It's almost like someone at fox saw the Vorsprung press release and says "holy f*ck boys, better throw up some pics of a prototype so we don't look too stupid here"
  • 32 1
 ..and get our boy RC on it… MTB Action move here.
  • 9 3
 Vorsprung FTW.
  • 8 2
 In the end it does kinda suck for vorsprung because no matter how well it performs more people will just shell out the cash for the new fox shock. And I think it's a bit early to make assumptions about which will perform better, especially since you've tried niether.
  • 23 22
 Vorsprung's release had nothing to do with the Fox piece. I saw it while I was working on the shock story and added it in. The Corset can adds cred to the Fox project and vice versa - and its a win for Fox owners, because they can get the better spring curve without buying a new shock. I'm fairly certain that the inside bits of the new shock are going to reshuffle the deck. Time will tell.
  • 7 1
 If the RS Debonair Canister is any indication, the fox optimized canister will be priced around $100 ish. So really its going to come down less to price and more down to which has the better tune. Once people start buying bikes that come with the optimized cans, the impetus for buying a Vorsprung will go down since the benefits will be marginal vs the substantial benefits to be had now for replacing your current straight walled can. Varsprung is like OneUp, filling a niche that is unfortunately inevitably going to close as the OEM products catch up. In the case of Varsprung they have until 2016 Fox product launch and then the market dries up. Sure, some portion of those with a bike 2016 will look to get the benefits of a optimized canister and choose varsprung can over the Fox can, but that is a market that will shrink not grow.

The most important thing for Varsprung will be to see if they have a substantially better design than the Fox design. If so, they will capture the market for after market optimized cans for legacy shocks with unoptimized cans and maybe even have a market for customers looking to get better optimized cans for their shocks already equipped with stock optimized cans. But if the diff is negligible, then Varsprung sprung won't have long term sustainability.
  • 6 0
 I think if I had invested in a 2015 Fox Float-X, the Vorsprung would be more appealing than a full upgrade in 2016.
  • 4 1
 For more "hardcore"/ informed riders than it will be about performance/price, but your run of the mill biker looking for a suspension upgrade will go name brand. That's just how it is, it's not necessarily a bad thing. You have to keep in mind a lot of the bike community doesn't read Pinkbike or even know about air canister upgrades and tech stuff like that.
  • 2 0
 @freestyIAM I agree with what you are saying, I do think the demand for the vorsprung can will go down, however they have been in business long before this release with tuning peoples suspension. I do not think they have to worry very much about dying out..
  • 5 0
 Vorsprungs bread and butter is full suspension service in the a Whistler Village. They do have cool engineering projects occasionally, the Corset being one of them.
  • 7 4
 I like how Fox brings out a completely new shock every two or so years and they still don't even get close to the performance of an age old BOS shock..
  • 1 1
 RC, will the vorsprungs can spring curve make a noticeable difference apart from the initial stiction bit, seem like putting a spacer in will archives similer results but mayby you can use a lower pressure for same sag (my guess would have been higher pressure) 150 bucks seem a bit much 100 maby...
  • 1 1
 @Xyphota sorry, i wasn't aware of all the other things Varsprung is involved in. This article was the first i'd heard of them. I guess the more concervative statement would be to say that optimized cans as a product offering from Varsprung might not have long term sustainability.
  • 4 0
 @robaussie99 @airmiller44

I agree with you. Really strange timing. It seems like vorsprung steal the exclusivity of what was gonna be a novelty of the year for Fox and Pinkbike post in urge some old and some already leaked pictures in order to recall that fox will produce this kind of parts too.
There is nothing really new in this "News". It looks more like a reminder that fox has this technology too.
But I will be curious to know the rational behind these quickly following releases.
Maybe Fox pressured pinkbike in a way or another to cancel the Vorsprung effect, because this is not an official press release from Fox, and I don't think that Fox will precipitate their official release timing because of that.
  • 6 1
 Exactly a press release for corsair, then a day later a spy shot and bogus story about a shock that isn't out and may never be out. Seems fox called in a favor. Big business sucks.
  • 2 2
 Airmiller, what makes you think that this shock will never come out?! I can 98% guarentee it will. And you cant blame fox for wanting to self promote.
  • 4 3
 It's a prototype and that is that there could be 20 different variations. A production piece was just unveiled days ago then spy shots. You don't see the politics?
  • 5 0
 Amazing, simultaneously PB adds credence to an idea that a small company has already released while undercutting that same small company with a "spy shot" of what is to come from the large manufacturer's product that was improved upon. I suppose it's the nature of the game, but PB couldn't give Vorsprung another day or two of unmolested time to enjoy their idea making it to market?
  • 1 0
 Airmiller I see the politics but you can't blame fox for promoting their stuff. And it's in Proto but their air shocks desperatly needs a revamp so this will undoubtedly come to market soon.
  • 2 1
 Photoshopped Fox aircan? just kidding btw.
  • 5 1
 RC is the spin doctor saving the fox bacon, the Mr. Wolf of the situation.
  • 3 6
 Jesus, i have been edited and tey erased that i said : the biggest trick the devil ever pulled was making you believe he does not exist. And i said rc brings a lot of insight but also has that talent. Who is RC?!?
  • 7 0
 I blame fox for making a product that need other companies refinements, then calls in favors to bully them out to give them more time to come up with something. Two days is a joke it's purely a "spy shot" how those work is fox still has to ok this photo to be used by Pinkbike or else lose endorsements etc etc. my point is it's obvious politics and it sucks it's even in biking. I'm not daft obviously they make shocks and can release whatever they want. But Richards silly defense is a paid for opinion to rebuttle corset
  • 1 1
 In that case every company should be shamed because there wip allways be ways to refine products ex avalanche cartridges.
  • 5 1
 Fox still doesn't have a dh air shock. They are behind man.
  • 2 2
 What does that have to do with this? And it's a good possibility that they will announce one at sea otter.
  • 1 1
 The simple fact that they are stated above.... Are you arguing with yourself here?
  • 2 1
 No I'm not. Read my post. Im just confused why you brought that up since it was off topic. They are behind and I was simply saying that they will soon release one (most likely).
  • 3 2
 and thats a good reason I don't ride fox
  • 24 1
 @RichardCunningham How much does it cost to keep Fox's post at the top of the news page vs Vorspring 20+ articles/ads near the bottom?
  • 2 0
 Way to go Fox. Only a year behind Sram.
  • 6 0
 @crohnsy just what i was thinking
  • 3 0
 "But I will be curious to know the rational behind these quickly following releases."

I agree..... this has the whiff of cronyism. At least PB name-checked Vorsprung in the article though. It will be interesting to know if there's a patent issue here. I wonder if Vorsprung have patented their product? Not sure where that would land Fox.
  • 3 0
 Even with the announcement of the new "buttery smooth" shock tech from FOX on the way, it doesn't mean many folks are going to wait for it to hit the market and pay big bucks to upgrade. For example, my current Fox shock (Float CTD) is in great shape and I'm confident that, with the addition of a Vorsprung air-sleeve, I'll be able attain similar performance from my current unit as the next gen Fox shock.

Although I could be wrong as I am basing my theory on the info of which RC provided above - that is I don't see much difference in what the Vorsprung does vs. the prototype Fox.
  • 5 2
 Cronsy ^^^ Readers, like you make that determination. The most read stories stay at the top of the list longer. PB editors write our stories like reptiles lay eggs - once they are under the sand, we move on.
  • 40 4
 "Buttery smooth" is right up there with "climbs like a goat".
  • 2 0
 f'n word.
  • 23 0
 -23 today. My butter is not smooth.
  • 35 4
 "completely different looking than any trailbike shock that the pioneer suspension maker has made in recent times."

Pioneer….is that why my float feels like a leaf spring?
  • 10 26
flag minus8 (Feb 20, 2015 at 19:41) (Below Threshold)
 No, that's because you didn't service it/set it up properly/return it when it failed; 'cause mine works beautifully.
  • 12 25
flag Enduro27 (Feb 20, 2015 at 20:55) (Below Threshold)
 Your an idiot and you got lucky, most ctds are crap
  • 64 0
 @Enduro27 Protip: When insulting someone, take care to use the right "You're", so you don't look completely retarded.
  • 2 1
 I guess I'm lucky. My Fox CTD is buttery smooth.. but ctd lever almost don't work, lol. Just makes too little difference and I can go DH in climb mode. Came as OEM for my Merida One-Sixty.
  • 1 1
 I'm sure the float performs differently, on different bikes with distinct leverage curves, and also depends a lot on rider weight. The Large tune on my Giant trance is severely underdamped in descend so as to be unusable, and way over damped in trail. I can't even complain about how not smooth the damper is or isn't because i've never really gotten to experience it. And i'm 175 pounds which is pretty average.

@Legalaze something is wrong with your shock then. The CTD lever on my bike makes a dramatic deferent, trail is very firm and climb is pretty much solid. If it feels good though i guess it doesn't matter lol.
  • 6 2
 I'm an idiot because I got lucky and my shock works? Your logic is sound, I'll give you that.
  • 3 2
 Maybe not, but your comment was a bit off the mark. There is virtually no setup options to cure an underdamped float. Set spring pressure, rebound and ride. Besides that all you can do is add volume spacers. My guess is you're either very light for the frame size you're on or have a bike with a very progressive suspension curve.
  • 5 4
 Floats are notorious for being underdamped but there's a big difference between being underdamped and being comparable to a leaf spring.
  • 3 2
 Sounds like your is one with a warranty issue, in climb mode there should be nearly no movement apart from big Impacts.
  • 2 3
 @minus8 it might have been an exaggeration, but only slightly. The 2014 float fork was just as bad, at least for my weight. The shock at least gets a custom tune though so i expect more.
  • 1 0
 In climb mode i'd say mine doesn't take all that big of an impact to get it to move. I always thought it broke free a bit easily.
  • 2 1
 @friendlyfoe LOL, all this mouthing off and looking at your bike you don't even ride with Factory series forks or shock! Funnily enough it just so happens that you have the same opinion of the forks you don't own as what every other Rockshox fanboy has.

Boom, done.
  • 28 3

  • 27 11
 Fox Engineer says:

Quick! Paint it all flat black and no decals!!! Otherwise, people might figure out that it looks exactly like every other rear bicycle air shock that has ever been made since the beginning of time
  • 19 1
 Funny the Corset was just posted a day or two ago and now theres a response.
  • 1 2
 That's what I thought too. Only, the reply was actually (sadly) expected! Yeah, it's cool that Corset does what they do, but in reality, how many people are really going to care enough to buy a $150 can??? (I hope I'm wrong!)

The market of bikers who would spend money on, or care about, these improved air cans is probably reading pinkbike. The percentage of people who know about these cans, and who would like to buy one, and who do NOT work in a bike shop (not paying retail), is crazy low. I'm just imagining my bike shop stocking a few $150 air cans... It's not that big of a deal to 99% of bikers. Sorry. There's too much else to worry about.

That's not to say I wouldn't love to see these new air cans coming OEM on bikes that need them!!!! It's cool to think that any bike can be made to feel supple and smooth....
  • 1 0
 SPOT ON "nuttypoolog"; As an owner of a Rockshox Monarch RT3, I upgraded to a debonair can (corset equivelant) for the $115.00 through my lbs. Thats only because I knew about it, researched the +/-'s and wanted more small bump compliance while still maintaining some good huck stability with my 165mm rear travel Scott. If I was not a PB reader and avid allmtn and FR junkie, I would be naive to this exposure and be like the majority (95%) biking community. My only beneift from this niche technology creep would have been if I bought a new rig with this as a considerabley overpriced shock.

We often forget as avid/devoted riders that many a rider does not care what the small specifics in suspension, let alone gears, tires etc do to make a difference in riding. Most are either focused on; does it look shiny and cool? or, will it survive a season of hucks, drops and torture that I put it through.
  • 18 3
 Always love reading the posts here because they are always extreme. "Brand X is complete crap and brand Y is hand assembled by angels"... or similar. Your Fox underdamped? Ever thought of trying a different weight oil? Get off the couch and work on your equipment. Trade your computer for some tools perhaps.
  • 15 0
 nice to see this advertorial being kept at the top but the other post has disappeared off the bottom
  • 10 0
 Agreed, I've never noticed an article kept at the top like this, and honestly I'm kinda tired of seeing it. It's quite annoying, and I'm going to support vorsprung suspension and buy their air can now.
  • 15 1
 Hmm not sensing a lot of love for fox here,maybe it's a good thing I decided to stick with RS.
  • 8 4
 Stick with RS if that's what came on your bike, maybe. Buy a RS or Fox as an aftermarket improvement, no. Buy a Cane Creek. They're not even in the same ball park.
  • 10 5
 Eh, i'd never buy a cc with their crappy reliability.

Have a sid dual air and monarch rct3 on my 100mm bike. Love that setup.

Had a float 32 rl and float rp2 fox shock on my 100mm bike before that and it was crap. Couldnt get more than 70% travel unless it was undersprung.

Have a 160mm float 34 on my trance and a ctd evo shock. The fork is much better than the float 32 and I've got it dialed. I actually like this fork a lot. The shock isn't terrible. It seems better than my older one but it's usable and i don't feel like it holds me back.

I'd be interested in an air can at the $100 mark, but more than that i don't think it is worth spending the money
  • 15 4
 Oh and: "Fox is on the move. Reportedly, this prototype announces the beginning of a series of fundamental changes in their suspension range"
Does that mean it was all crap before? Or why would you have to make "fundamental changes"? Seriously, do it once, but do it right.
  • 2 0
 My guess is that they will start using some more carbon on their forks, since they recently acquired Easton.
  • 4 0
 Maybe. I can't wait for a fork with carbon on it, whoever comes up with that idea will probably say something like: revolutionary, stiffer, lighter, better blablabla.... but at the end we had that 20 years ago. I had one of those Specialized branded RockShox Judys, they called it FutureShox or something. It worked very well!!!
  • 2 0
 Wasn't there a Revelation or something with a carbon crown just a few years ago? I could be wrong but I remember seeing it on a bike reviewed by NSMB.
  • 2 0
 The rockshox Sid XX and Revelation XX both have a carbon crown and steerer tube. It seems like it's only a matter of time before Fox adds some carbon to their lineup.
  • 2 0
 hasn't the RV1 carbon everywhere?
  • 2 0
 @skeen95 I could see fox taking a very long time to start using carbon. They're very conservative and move like an iceberg when it comes to new technology. Look how long they ran the boost valve design for, now they're hype new prototype rad shock is essentially a canecreek double barrel(not a bad thing just 8 years late to the punch).
  • 1 1
 More money in the mx scene for them than the pedal powered side. SO, yes it will be a slow creep down from the MX side.
  • 2 0
 It's their atv, snow machines and trucks stuff that make them money. Nobody runs fox stuff in MX.
  • 17 6
 How much will I have to service this?
  • 65 4
 Every 1 minute. You'll be stopping mid ride on ta trail, pulling wrenches out of your left pocket and slick honey out of your right pocket and giving this baby some love.
  • 10 2
 I actually laughed out loud at this
  • 7 0
 "Pinkbike was riding with a prominent Fox employee recently and noticed that his shock was unlabeled and completely different looking than any trailbike shock that the pioneer suspension maker has made in recent times"

looks the same as their normal float shocks but with a corset on.

would be interesting to know how recent but the meta data has been stripped from the photos so we don't know if the picture was quickly taken due to Vorsprung Suspension press release Wink
  • 10 0
 So this is the reason the Fox rep was having a dig at Steve (VorsprungSuspension).
  • 9 1
 nothing new here - they published the name (evol) and better pics and details 5 !!! month ago on these :
  • 4 1
 Thanks for sharing that. Hilarious that RC was in the comments saying how this and the vorsprung release were in no way related.
  • 11 0
 Another prototype...
  • 12 0
 I agree. Fox needs to put these RAD products into production. Rockshox has a larger negative air spring in the debonair for a year now. They are wasting their time "sneaking" us these proto pictures. I love Fox but damn they need to pick up the pace before they lose more customers.
  • 5 2
 To be fair... How long was the charger boxxer in the proto stage?
  • 9 3
 I have to say I wouldn't piss on Fox suspension if it was on fire. Over priced, underperforming, over complicated and unreliable. There are loads of great suspension out there that cost considerably less, perform better and are much more reliable and without all the bullshit. Again they are behind Rockshox when it comes to their suspension....Pike...Debonair...and now they are in panic mode. Yes yes yes I am fully aware that I am now going to get the negative props...being them on please the more the better!
  • 5 0
 As negative air springs now are becoming the standard with rear shocks, will there be a fundamental change in linkage design?
I noticed that the slightly falling rate in the first 30% of travel do not match very well with the Debonair in my Spectral - an issue that is more apparent, the heavier the rider is. With ~200lbs I easily top out the recommended maximum pressure of 350psi on the shock, when I want to ride with less than 25% sag.

I think there are many suspension designs, that will have similar problems with a negative air spring of the size of the Debonair or the new FOX prototype.
  • 2 0
 Great observation.

Leverage ratios should change between a medium and XL bike to account for the heavier rider weight as spring rate alone isn't sufficient.

Also leverage rate should be linear/falling (falling is actually progressive on a correct rate graph where the X axis is the vertical wheel travel and the Y axis is the instantaneous ratio) as this produces predictable feel and suspension tuning. This is the problem with your Spectral (otherwise a great bike) and many other designs.
  • 5 0
 Pinkbike was riding with a prominent Fox employee recently and noticed that his shock was unlabeled and completely different looking than any trailbike shock that the pioneer suspension maker has made in recent times.

Like that was accident lol, you/Fox must think we zip up at the back.
  • 2 0
 Excellent, more prototypes we never arrive to customers... Fox is like microsoft, sell unfinished products and later sell the upgrades with another names... happened with all CTD products, Talas and apparently the story continues...
  • 4 2
 If they got rid of CTD like they did with the new 36's it could b a gd shock but no doubt fox will charge a fortune say it needs serviced once a month and charge u £300 to service it
  • 4 2
 I really like my Trek Remedy Reaktiv shock. It truly is pretty smooth. Will be demoing other shocks next month so I'll be able to review it more but it's by far better than a standard ctd float.
  • 5 1
 Perhaps thier answer to the Debonair can.
  • 24 1
 If they take that long to answer they are going to lose the argument.
  • 4 0
 Yes, thank you: it's the Debonair, not Vorsprung, that comes to mind. Come on RC you know this.
  • 8 4
 Fox shocks are plain rubbish. There I said it
  • 2 1
 All fox suspension is crap. Except their coil shocks which are decent.
  • 1 0
 From what I've read of the comments on here I don't think these are gonna sell well! And with so many full bikes coming with rs dampers things seemed to be pretty tough for fox at the mo. What went wrong?
  • 5 0
 2013 is what went wrong...
  • 3 0
 The sooner they get rid of that CTD crap the better. I want to throw mine away.
  • 2 0
 These got still CTD
  • 5 2
 Right. And what was the reason again why I should buy Fox products?
  • 3 0
 A day or two after the Vorsprung release, what an unusual coincidence.
  • 2 0
 I was 3 days ago at Fox Factory Germany and saw all the 2016 shocks. This technology will be called EVOL = Extra Volume
  • 3 1
 Pay the most money, and you get to keep your ad/article at the top of the page.
  • 4 2
 Haters gonna hate, I'd try it.
  • 2 1
 New air spring, but what about the damper? An evolution of the evolution CTD?
  • 3 1
 I haven't seen that much LOCKOUT since the 2012-2013 NHL season!!
  • 4 2
 'Pioneer suspension maker'. Are you serious
  • 2 0
 I think they are going to call it EVOL.
  • 2 1
 Fox must be paying a nice little sum to keep this post at the top of the Pinkbike page for a couple of days
  • 1 0
 Knowing fox, 'hand printing' will appear as an extra. £60+ for a dyslexic technician and a bottle of tipex.
  • 4 3
 Is the Evolution series a bad product?..
  • 2 0
 its the base product line from Fox. The dampers from this line use an open bath system which can suffer from susp fluid emulsification which lead to inconsistent damping. The higher end factory forks come with the bladder controlled Fit dampers which separates the fluid from the air in the system and prevents emulsification (internal floating pistons can also present emulsification but generally have more stiction because of an added seal.)
  • 1 0
 I just realized that i answered that question for fox evo forks and not the evo shocks as you probably wanted to know about. As far as i can tell, the fox evo line of shocks doesn't come with the black 3 position finer tuning knob for compression and doesn't have Kashima coating. The difference between a evo fox float shock and a factory one is much smaller than the diff between a fox float 34 evo and the factory version.
  • 1 0
 I'd say the difference is similar for the rear also, at least from the bikes I've ridden. The Evolution dampers really are garbage. The rebound circuits are completely different with the Evolution version being basic, ineffective and really cheap to manufacture. I think they are OK if you are an extremely timid and or lightweight rider.
  • 2 0
 If you were previously using a Thudbuster at the back and a Girven Flex Stem up front the Fox Evolution stuff will seem quite good.
  • 1 0
 are you asking about fork or shock? need more details to correctly answer your question
  • 1 0
 @eggsandb - nailed it!
  • 1 0
 well it feels really stiff, I can't tune it up right. too low pressure, it dives while braking and the rear bobs way to much, even with low pressure the rear shock never reaches it's bottom for 1/2", the fork, dives while braking, and with more air, feels really hard my wrists hurt... I had entry level Xfusion before and Rock Shox Revelation dual air, much better.
  • 1 0
 Yes what you have experienced is completely normal. They are so bad that I consider it almost impossible to progress your riding ability using Fox Evolution suspension.
  • 1 0
 Thanks you for leaking Fox
  • 1 0
 Thank you for leaking Fox
  • 1 0
 Anyone see the new Fox Dh Air shock on Aaron Gwin's Bike?
  • 3 6
 The 2015 Fox Float CTD on my Tracer 275c is so smooth. I can't imagine what else could make it better. I agree, Fox needs to start trickling down this tech asap.
  • 1 2
 Just go buy a monarch debonair
  • 30 32
 I am sure it will still be another terrible fox product
  • 10 4
 I see your bike has a Fox fork and rear shock....just sayin. (picture is stamped 2008 so maybe you now have BOS?)
  • 6 24
flag boostin (Feb 20, 2015 at 18:14) (Below Threshold)
 Yes that was many years ago before I learned of the manitou evolver air shock!
  • 19 10
 I have recently decided to stop buying fox products. While I enjoy them and I think they are great. Their refusal to share information or allow their customers or even local bike shops to rebuild some of their products on their own is insane to me. Rockshox seems to support customers in this type of situation, supplying them with manuals and DIY videos. Fox refuses and then asks you to pay half the price of the shock brand new to have it rebuilt every year.
  • 6 3
 Not trying to disagree with the reviewer intentionally... But the new shock looks Exactly like the old one with a redesigned air can.
  • 21 3
 A corset air can to be exact
  • 1 4
 Hopefully this shock works or it's just full of air.
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