Spotted: Ohlins RXF 38 Fork

 with 17mm thru axle

 @weezyb:
And 114.999998mm axle length.

 It’s better than 38mm stanchions... watch this: youtu.be/lS-VzI2JbrI

 @WAKIdesigns:

WakI: Should have gone 2” directly

Ohlins: We planned to roll that out in 2022 to make the 1.8" obsolete. #newstandardevery2years #bicycles.

LOL

 Its on an E-Bike. I stopped reading when I saw that

 @WAKIdesigns:
But how do I fit the new fork onto my 1996 Klein Mantra? Is the fork compatible with my softride suspension stem? LOL

www.pinkbike.com/news/1996-klein-mantra-pro-now-that-was-a-bike.html

 I vote we put a 4" steerer, no wait make that metric 100mm steerer, on the outside of the head tube. Replaces the knock block too. Screw it - let's get rid of steering altogether. No bearings, no creaking, and straight lines are faster anyway.

 @WAKIdesigns: haha ???? you're the best

 @seraph I couldn't agree more.

Give me a dual crown 1 1/8" any day over a single crown with a bigger steerer.

 @Three6ty: Well more power to you. Though if you care enough to comment, this will probably be what you "need" on your non-e-bike in 2 years.

 I could not be more pleased that this is top comment.

 @islandforlife: It also has 38 mm stanchions, though...

 I don't think we should go all the way to 2". 50mm would be better, since we've recently been jumping from imperial to metric on more and more components. The headtube is already metric on the inside. Is the steerer tube the last bastion of the imperial system on a mountain bike? I think there is one other remaining... but what is it?

 Oh I forgot about 9/16" pedal spindles. So there are two others apart from steerer tubes.

 @jaame: tires and rims?

 What if Fox does not want to eliminate all Flex?
Maybe they think some Flex is needed in the Fork to get a good ride feeling. But if the Stanchion and Lowers flex to each other, they cant move freely into each other, which ends in poor suspension performance. Since they want good suspension performance the only part for flex is the head tube.

But i still think they should change something that the Forks dont allways start to be noisy after only a few rides.

 @Cspringsrider: I was thinking 22.2mm handlebars. Tyres and rims are already measured in mm according to ETRTO, but yes I wonder what the 559/584/622 translate to in inches. And what does “700c” actually mean?

 @PAmtbiker: which makes sense if you beef up the csu interface.

 @WAKIdesigns: Boxxer 2565g, Fox 38 (tapered) 2180g. Difference = 385g - I'm sure the bigger HT, headset and 1.8" steered are going to take a big chunk out of this difference. If cost was no object I would take a Boxxer.m which is a 200mm fork cf a 180mm fork. The smart play by RS would be to release a 180mm Enduro Boxxer to compete with the 38.

 @jaame: seat post sizes are still imperial

 @jaame: 559mm=22in 584mm=23in 622mm=24.5in
So there are no 26in, 27.5in nor 29in wheels.
I believe 700c means 700mm overall diameter of wheel with rim and tire of a certain size (probably ~2in) and the c is for a certain range of inner rim width.

 @fartymarty: You can get a 180mm Boxxer already.

 @mark3: bloody hell. The more I think about it, the more there are! What the heck is 30.9mm in inches? 1 1/16 or something?

Legacy measurements run deep, I’ll lay to that.

 @jaame: I meant the width of the tire lol sorry for not being specific

 Oh right. I never look at those to be honest, I look at the etrto size in millimetres because the widths in inches vary from manufacturer to manufacturer.

 @Three6ty: Yep. Starting watching the video, and saw the Wanna Be motorcycle and stopped.

 Vorsprung mentioned about Fox should do increase from 1.5inch instead if ovalized the tube in their Fox 38 breakdown video last month.

 I don't know man, I have trashed at least one CSU per year for the last 5 years with lengthy warranty /replacement costing me tons of riding time. Not sure 1.8" is the way to go though. Maybe we should just accept double crown forks as the new standard in enduro/freeride?

 youtu.be/lS-VzI2JbrI

 But it’s 28.99% stiffer for those times when you’re riding a blue trail with underpressured tires, too much suspension sag, 35mm carbon bars that are vertically compliant yet horizontally stiff and you’re laying down 186 watts.

 @chris6-6-6: ^^^ always the one guy that says "I trash 3 xyzs every year." LOL. Whether it be forks, tires, frames, rims, bars....You ARE the man!

 @Paddock22: don't forget warranty does not apply if you wear anything other than 510s

 It’s not about snapping. The joint between your steerer and crown is weak and that’s where all the flex comes from using a bigger steerer tube helps but won’t really do much. Light weight duel crowns are the answer.

 @thenotoriousmic: oooor you could make it to tighter tolerance, learn technique to fit it properly and then put plug from the bottom so steerer tube itself cannot flex. But yes creating new standard is better as always when your sales are getting lower then needed.

 @MTBLegend92: Damn you must smoke smoke this fella Pierron you legend.

 @Mondbiker: you’re just going to end up with a massive steerer tube with a huge over built crown that still won’t be as stiff or as light as a duel crown. I struggle to see how you couldn’t build a lightweight boxer / 40 or a duel crown lyrik / 36 that comes in lighter and stiffer than a 38.

 @MTBLegend92: You’ve clearly never ridden a duel crown have you?

 @thenotoriousmic: I was talking about existing 1.5 standard, that it can be easily made better. I´m working on my light-ish weight DC fork though...

 @Mondbiker: What's your point, that because I'm not as fast as him I can't break inferior equipment? Amaury Pierron is 6 inches shorter than me and 40-50lbs lighter than me. I imagine for you I could at least double both those numbers, because you sound like a child.

 @MTBLegend92: Good example of a useless lightweight dual crown is the domain...

 @MTBLegend92: Well feck me running, ever heard of this Kyle Strait chap? He rides this thing called RB Rampage on this "wet noodle" and seems to be doing fairly well you legend, I guess you have 40-50lbs on him also lol. Maybe you should ease up on the donuts?

 @Mondbiker: I’m not expert but you’d need a lot more crown / steerer overlap and I think tyre clearance is the current limiting factor.

 @thenotoriousmic: on some forks insertion depth is good enough as it is now, for some reason certin companies just don´t want to think too much about what they do with it. Look up Vorsprung vid on 38, it´s ridiculous when they produce omg so ground braking oval steerer tube only to press it in crooked lol. When you can achieve better result for less money and maybe even improve quality of the joint. Example of good engineering vs marketing BS www.intend-bc.com/products/fork-tuning/stiffler

 @Monster-G: I think you’re getting confused. The domain was the old boxxer RC with steel stantions. It was super heavy even back then. The steel stantions though were super slippery and noticeably more supple than the boxer rc with its alu stantions. So hardly useless.

 @Mondbiker: What's it like being dumb enough to believe a sponsored athlete would publicly complain about the product he's being paid lots of money to use?

 @MTBLegend92: What´s it like spewing ridiculously dumb shit on the internet?

 @WAKIdesigns: im Not dure but i think Dual crowns have a straight 1” steerer so I genuinely think there’s more to this whole stiffness story. Clearly the dual crowns are stiffer because they have more surface area that gets clamped. Also when did some flex become a bad thing? Why do we want our bars to flex, our wheels to flex, our chainstays to flex, our grips to flex, but nooo the fork can’t flex one mm or you’ll instantly be unable to ride.

 @philmtb99: it´s more about where and in what direction they flex. And what that flex results in.

 @WAKIdesigns: it's so true

 @MTBLegend92: 20 years ago I met 2 Yankees in Chamonix like you very tall and fit and we had a blast on our thecnical terrain.. They were official tester for Shimano. Because they were talented and heavy.

 @philmtb99: 1 1/8th straight steer tubes or tapered not 1"

 @thenotoriousmic: those weren't the only choices and I happen to have a domain sitting in the corner. The weight doesn't change, the landing isn't always so supple. I tend to think the constant is the issue that cannot be controlled by my riding. I can however change the fork... So in my case I have a useless Domain sitting in a box. Sorry diff of opinion. Give me an 888 any day.

 it is in fact. the steerer is far more flexy than the whole chassi of a 36 or a 38 mm fork.

 What is the weight of a 38 in comparison to the lightest Boxxer anyway?

 @MTBLegend92: I TRUST that a linkage fork would be the answer.

 @chris6-6-6: If still going single crown, it's better to go further on the actual integration between steerer and crown. This offcourse gets in thee way of the axle to crown distance. Another good point in favor of 35mm stanchions double crown fork.

 @philmtb99: it’s not a nice feeling riding hitting stuff on steep terrain and feeling your fork flex under you, it’s honeswhat I miss most from my ex downhill bikes. I had a 380 that had a tapered headtube btw.

 Single crown forks are flexy as shit and it largely comes down to the tiny steerer tube. Your options to improve are to beef up the steerer and CSU, or go dual crown

 @Mondbiker: Actually on the contrary, you need market share first before you release a new standard. Reality is, from an engineering standpoint, its a good idea. Like it or not, this was inevitable. People complained when they introduced the first tapered steer tube. Eventually everybody will get over it, and complain about the next standard. It probably happened with disc brakes too. "What? New standard?!?!? My cantilever brakes work just fine thank you!!!". Does anybody make those anymore? Product innovation is just the inevitability. Its really just a visciois cycle. Products get better, people find the limits, products evolve to adapt, and people find the limits again... this just keeps going.

 @jomacba: Yes, people still make cantilever brakes, both real and V.

 @jomacba: the good part about this as someone pointed out above is that a 56mm head tube will take a 1.8 fork with an external cup.

 @werics: It was somewhat of a rhetorical question. The point was they are essentially obsolete, and I doubt anybody would even consider them over a proper hydraulic disc brake.
What I'm getting at, is there is constant updated, changes, and new standards. People continue to get bent out of shape (Which is futile) and eventually we all just accept it, just to get bent out of shape on the next one. I'm sure 1.5-1-1/8 steer tubes aren't going anywhere, just as strait 1-1/8 aren't either, but nobody can deny that this is a logical fix to remedy a weak point in the structure of a single crown fork.
Not only would it allow the fork to become undeniably lighter and stiffer, especially compared to a dual crown fork, it would open up options to further refine the CSU. People are so quick to point out the flaws in products (especially suspention) that they fail to step back and really see how incredible suspention really is. In fact, maybe just over 5 years ago, you could almost consider suspention to be archaic.
Take into consideration that we are just now scratching the surface of what's possible.

 @jomacba: True suspension is getting better all the time, however its taking a Fing long time motorcycles have had super suspension for over 20years and cost less than a decked out Enduro bicycle.

We had to endure elastomers, cartridges, and silly shit that did not work and a real design engineer would laugh at.

I know sometimes progress is slow, but there is no excuse for a shitty design that has to be modded out of the box to work properly, If a tiny company can figure out what is wrong with a fork and make a part to correct it, what does that say for the company. And I am not talking race level performance just plain work.

 @jaame: yes, and with ec56 and deeper crown insertion you end up with messed up geometry (typically +10mm for cup and ca 5mm for crown) or less travel than before. With DC fork you can have more travel with same geometry and/or you can actually adjust the geometry as you please, free of charge in 5minutes and most importantly you have much stronger fork that doesn´t rely on single crown/steerer junction that more often than not isn ´t designed/manufactured well enough. Weight penalty is non existent when you compare boxxer to 29er 38 fork, 29 boxxer weight some 150g more ,lyrik lowers with axle are roughly 150g lighter than boxxers so it would literally be the same weight if the lowers were interchangable. shorter travel DC fork designed from scratch could also use shorter damper/ air spring so another few grams to save there. And then there is another topic of stiffer stem interface that is always mounted straight...

 @lake-st: you are absolutely right, the issue is people are still willing to pay silly money to buy product that is designed to be obsolete by next year. How long did fox ignore complaints about creaking crowns till they (supposedly) fixed the issue? What about damper tunes that are more often than not wrong for the application? Why most tuners can get this shit right and multi million dollars corporations f*ck this up and people still gladly handle them their money? Kashima effect? Is it really that simple?

 @Mondbiker: yes. The D.C. approach is well worth the development. I thought the boxxer and Lyrik lowers were the same to be honest. Armed with this information, I think RS should definitely make a D.C. enduro fork to replace the Lyrik.

 @Mondbiker: exactly what I’ve been saying. Also taking into account how little direct mount stems weigh and reduced steerer length. I struggle to see how you couldn’t make a duel crown lyric / 36 as light as a 38.

 @kleinblake: Agree that single crowns are flexy as shit, especially for an e bike. Even my Boxxer feels a little flexy on my 50 pound e bike. it's an improvement over single crown but I hate the restricted turning radius. If I were designing it I would do a tapered 1.5 to 1.8 streeter tube for single crowns. Would love to see somebody make a 190 mm single crown fork for e bikes.

The complaints about new standards for e bikes are understandable because it is an inconvenience. But the fact of the matter is that e bikes need new standards because they are heavier and put more stress on some parts. And many of the e bike options are great for big guys or people who want to make their bike stronger.

 @DoubleCrownAddict: how much do you weight dude

 @Uchwmdr: I have a buddy whose only way into mt biking was ebike. He was a solid 350 when he got his e bike. So understandably ebike manufactures need to consider heavier riders. Btw I think he is riding 4 to 5 times a week and down 50 pounds since November. So that is the perfect use for an ebike. He is now considering a regular pedal bike for his next purchase.

 @fabwizard: at this weight it is explainable why he finds single crown forks flexy

 @Uchwmdr: 160kg is probably double what most bikes are expected to carry! Wow!

 @thenotoriousmic: the stems are not that light, there is plenty conventional stems out there that are lighter than 99% of DM stems but they flex the steerer tube with modern wide handlebars, especially if one is running a lot of stem spacers. I think they could leave lyrik in the lineup with travels up to lets say 150mm for 29 and 170 for 27.5, above that there could be DC fork.

 @jaame: sadly they aren´t same, I don´t know if they did it purposely or just a result of trying to improve steering radius on new boxxer... Still, it would be pretty cheap for them to make different crowns with lyrik stanchion spacing.

 @lake-st: motorcycles also have been developed since the 20s. and don't have to worry about weight until the past 5 years when KTM made everything out of plastic.

 @lake-st: I can't disagree with your statement, but I can add point of view. First of all we need to recognize that the dynamics of mountain bike suspention is much more complicated than that of motorsport. I say this because you have a constant significant variable that you cannot calculate for at point of engineering and manufacturing. That is of course, rider weight, style, and ability. A 160lb elite downhill racer will not create the same forces or loads that an intermediate rider would at the same weight. Now create varying weights, and you have a huge differential. Let's now include the bike, an XL frame on a 6' rider (Assuming an XL would be the same across all manufacturers, which its not) would have a much differant effect on suspention than if thatbrider was on a L or even a M frame. Reach, HA, CS length, and suspention kinematics all have a profound impact on weight transfer, and how thebrider would need to manipulate the bike. Now, I'm not saying motorsport does not have these variables, but you have to consider that the vehicle itself makes up a much larger percentile of mass. Now consider that off road vs on road had drastically differant dynamics as well.


Secondly, you need to think about financial return. Every manufacturer (especially major players) have shareholders that expect a return on their investment. Corporate company's divy out budgets for each department for. One of those departments are design and engineering. One flaw could be the result of lack of budget.

Third, one major thing to consider is company perspective. Just as people have pointed out their dislike for the new fox 38 due to the csu design with the elliptical steer tube; That was ultimately fox's answer to an issue they had experienced without introducing a new standard. While maybe not without flaws, you can see the company is moving forward in identifying development challenges, and applying new techniques to remedy such challenges.

As we proceed through the eras of product evolvment, we will also see more and more challenges arise. As each challenge comes our way, there will be remedys to mitigate such challenges.
While this is no excuse for poor craftsmanship, or faulty products; It does however shine light on why and how flaws come to light. Especially when your manufacturing products in high volume in a semi controlled environment.

Once again, there needs to be a target price for the end consumer, and overhead such as development costs, manufacturing, marketing, logistics, profit, and retail costs all have to fall within the MSRP.
I'm sure if you had unlimited funding, you could eliminate every and all issues, but nobody does and nobody will.

 @DoubleCrownAddict: The Boxxer has a restricted turning radius because most of the offset is in the lowers rather than the crown. If this was switched around it would become less of a problem. My Dorado has more than enough clearance to handle tight uphill switchbacks.

 @SintraFreeride: flip whips won’t be an option but I’ve never had an issue with the turning circle on a boxxer or any other duel crown fork.

 @jomacba: i love the 38 and absolutely aim to own one!!!

 @thenotoriousmic: The old boxxer wasn't great on slow tight switchbacks, haven't tried the new one.

 @foggnm: LMAO...Always that 1 guy... LOL

 @MTBLegend92: dont believe anything u hear.. n anything is possible.. some guys will still be honest even with being sponsored... Not everyone is changed by money sir!!!

 @kleinblake: Ahhh not exactly... dual crowns have 2 Clamps not 1 thats why called DUAL.. that absolutely makes it stiffer then single.. ALso most good dual crown forks com with 40mm stanchions.. thats where ur gonna get most flex is tween stanchions by wheel/Hub area.. this is not complicated stuff...just sayin

 @jomacba: GOTTa say this is such great comment... sooo true... its never ending it seems LOL

 @lake-st: This is as well a very true statement ..def pisses me off that Dirt bikes have had insanely good suspensions for many many yrs and u can get a track ready brand new 250 or 450 4stroke monster with pro racing level Ohlin's suspension and High performance brakes with a FREAKIN ENGINE for less then a DH or enduro or Trail or even freakin MINT XC bike rn... A top of line DH,Enduro gonna be min 8g and u can def easily spend 10-14g on a high end MTB bike rn... Its Absolutely Ludacris

 @fabwizard: Sorry but hes not gonna go back to pedal bikes LOL

 I question the need for this too, but wasn’t that also the response to the “new” 1.5” tapered steerer when it came out?

 @DrPete: Yes... yes it was.

 @Richt2000 Good point. I'd also add, things that are lower-maintenance and don't require special tools.

 Their products are fairly reliable, aside from the STX22, so not sure what you're referring to. Also, they came in very quickly with the greatly-improved RXF EVO compared to the original.

 Useless and annoying? Most likely.

 Hopefully

 As posted above. Yes helps people who are not as fit as you get into the sport. Honestly I hate ebikes on mt bike trails. I say give them more power and stick them with the dirt bikes. But I have seen how they work as a gateway drug for people who could never get a bike down the road let alone up fromme. Six months later he is shopping for a real bike.

 New marz 58 only 1 1/8. I checked for my v10.2

 @Cspringsrider: great find!! It seems they are sold out...maybe something will pop up in buy sell. Thanks!

 @Speedgoat9: chain reaction has the red ones in stock. New they run $1000. I have been trying to find a takeoff but they just came out last year. I was going to make a v10.2 27.5 front 26 rear mullet should be good

 @Cspringsrider: almost every DC fork out there uses straight 1-1/8 stereer tubes.

 @Mondbiker: I think its great that they are. I just wanted somthing with 40mm lowers for my heavy weight. Not alot of options out there for 40mm forks and I don't want to spend more than necessary on a bike thats 14 yrs old