SRAM Eagle - Deutsche Ingenieurskunst

Jan 28, 2017
by SRAM  

Hast du dich auch schon immer gefragt, wie aus einem ganz normalen Ort ein „Zentrum“ für etwas wird? Warum sich die Besten einer Disziplin immer wieder an ganz bestimmten geografischen Orten treffen? Liegt es am Essen oder sogar am Wasser? Oder liegt es eher daran, dass es einige wenige Innovationen von ein paar außergewöhnlichen Erfindern oder Athleten schaffen, die Fantasie von Leuten mit einer ähnlichen Leidenschaft in diesem Bereich anzuregen, bis daraus eine richtige Bewegung entsteht.

SRAM Eagle - German engineering art
SRAM Eagle - German engineering art

In diesen Büros denken sich Produktmanager und Ingenieure laufend neue Antriebskonzepte aus.

Der Mountainbike-Sport hat seine Epizentren der Spitzenleistung – Orte wo der Begriff “Fortschritt” wirklich etwas bedeutet. Die Mountainbike-Produktentwicklung besitzt ebenfalls solche Hotspots. Nur wenige haben eine interessantere Geschichte und reicheres Erbe als Schweinfurt in Deutschland.

SRAM Eagle - German engineering art
SRAM Eagle - German engineering art

SRAM Eagle - German engineering art
SRAM Eagle - German engineering art
Jahrelange Erfahrung in der Bearbeitung und gute, alte Maschinen ergänzen sich mit SRAMs hochmodernen Fertigungs-Technologien.

SRAM Eagle - German engineering art

Die Pioniere aus Schweinfurt waren von hier aus, im Herzen Deutschlands, verantwortlich für das erste Präzisions-Kugellager, die erste Kugellagernabe, den ersten Freilauf und jetzt für SRAM Eagle™, den SRAM 1x™ Antrieb, der das Potential für Mountainbike-Antriebe neu bestimmt.

SRAM Eagle - German engineering art
Die Abteilung für den Bau von Prototypen bei SRAM. Jedes Werkzeug ist an seinem Platz, kein einziger Metallspan oder Öltropfen ist auf dem Fußboden zu entdecken.

SRAM Eagle - German engineering art
SRAM Eagle - German engineering art
SRAM Eagle - German engineering art

Die Komponenten müssen nach einer computergestützten Datenanalyse nicht nur die Vorgaben für Belastbarkeit und Haltbarkeit erfüllen, sondern ebenso ein möglichst geringes Gewicht aufweisen.

Für SRAM ist Eagle™ gleichzeitig eine Philosophie und ein Produkt. Es ist fest verwurzelt in dem grundlegenden Gefühl von Freiheit, die du beim Radfahren spürst und wird in den Schweinfurter SRAM Büros von talentierten Ingenieurteams vorangetrieben. Hier setzt deutsche Ingenieurskunst die stolze Tradition fort und ist rechtmäßiger Erbe der Schweinfurter Fahrrad-Antriebsentwicklung, mit dem Auftrag, Eagle™ zum dem innovativen Komponenten-System zu machen, das dich weiter, schneller und länger mit deutlich weniger Stress bringt.

SRAM.com


MENTIONS: @SramMedia




102 Comments

  • 27 0
 feels weird reading german on pinkbike
  • 26 1
 feels weird reading german on pinkbike
  • 3 0
 same here
  • 6 0
 I thought it was only visible for us in Germany and an alternative English version for English countries, odd. Big Grin
  • 11 0
 Yeah, but it's just some PR written BS tho. No useful information.
  • 16 0
 Krautschrutzman mortzkugelritz SRAM Eagle machtret kraftsch !
  • 17 2
 Deutsch auf Pinkbike zu lesen is irgendwie komisch.
  • 11 0
 Now we've seen Eagles Engineers...c'mon Shimano,show us your XTR Samurai's.
  • 3 3
 they totally suck because they just have 11 gears and bury their heads in shame. everything below 12 gears is unridable. and there are no eagles in japan (which is a lie).
  • 8 0
 Der Text ist schrecklich. Entschuldigung. Vielleicht liegt es daran, dass ich im Englischen die feinen Nuancen nicht erkenne. Auf jeden Fall tönt das hier nach Marketing Blabla von irgend einem Schreibtischhengst (m/f) der oder die noch nie auf einem Bike gesessen geschweige denn an einer richtigen Fräsmaschine gestanden hat.
Amüsant ist es trotzdem. Beim lesen habe ich mir immer vorgestellt es sei ein Lied von RAMMSTEIN! Jawohl Schnitzel! \m/
  • 3 0
 FYI: This is the first time I've read a german article on Pinkbike.
Plus it's a really, really bad translation. Looks like the work of an intern.
  • 1 0
 aw crap, I replied to the wrong comment. sorry.//
verdammt, hab beim falschen Kommentar geantwortet, mein Fehler. Sorry.
  • 2 0
 Der Artikel ist eine Pressemitteilung von SRAM. Was erwartest du da Smile
  • 1 0
 Ja endlich ein deutschsprachiger Kommentar, Gott sei es gedankt!
  • 11 1
 feels weird reading german on pinkbike
  • 10 0
 Noch komischer liest sich wenn alle deutschsprachigen hier Englisch schreiben...
  • 19 13
 I as a German am more than fed up with the mantra of German Engeneering-Art (Ingenieurskunst?).
Innovation and Ideas are not an exclusive nation-bound privilege. This is a totally esoteric way of legitimating nationalism, almost in every case lacking any proof. Maybe I wouldn´t react so sensitive if the text would have been written in english, so everybody can spit out his/her opinion on it. And if the text wouldn´t have been published in a time of overheating nationalism especially in germany, especially with this kind of arguments.
  • 8 6
 nice! f*ck nationalism

but i dont agree with"especially in germany". DT is winning and suceeding in every way... even in beeing nationalstic.
  • 4 4
 @bOObdesign: yeah, you´re absolutely right - nationalism is no exclusively german thing at all.
And for the neg props guys -
There may even be some connections between brands and countries like Hope and England, DT and Switzerland and Germany and Nicolai for example. They all may even have some distinct characteristics, but here it sounds more like someone´s pointing out that some typically german engeneering is crucial for the product quality - as if the good german engineers have been missed out a bit.
And in this "being missed out-attitude" they are promoting the "location factor germany" in a strangely patriotic way which I find a bit disturbing if not dangerous.
  • 9 2
 @philmn: its' quite ironic how people (especially Germans and Austrians themselves) struggle with accomplishments and positive attribution such as "German Engeneering". How can it be that "Innovation and Ideas are not an exclusive nation-bound privilege" but on the contrary nationalism is. How came it is impossible to read and interpret “German Engeneering” without referring to it as being nationalistic?
  • 3 8
flag philmn (Jan 28, 2017 at 10:32) (Below Threshold)
 @Cirest:
Germans don´t struggle with accomplishments more than others. But some germans think it´s stupid to link an accomplishment to the nationality. What do you gain from that? Maybe you can say: "my life sucks, but at least I am a german, we have the best engineering and soccer team out there". And what is ironic about this?

the second thing you pointed out -
if you carefully read my post I didn´t say "german specific nationalism" but "nationalism overheating everywhere and especially in Germany". The word especially is quantitative and has nothing to do with something like a "german speciality".
So the contradiction you seem to find is purely sophistic.
Nationalism is overheating out of empirically visible reasons like some big newspapers, facebook trolls and AfD - a right wing party using these exact, identical phrases in their slogans everyday.
Of course the term especially may be a bit too strong, when you look at France, UK, US, CH, Poland, Hungary - an endless list.

You third question is sophistic as well,
the phrase "German Engeneering" is inherently nationalist, how can it NOT be the case? Especially when you link it to some quality you will get nowhere else because it´s german. That´s absolutely the direction of the text.
And if you are really picky - what exactly is so german about the engineering here? The know how, the tradition, the clean floor? Spongy marketing bulls**t wth an esoteric note.
  • 2 1
 @Cirest: its not ironic, its because of obvious reasons. some people (very sad, i cannot say all) are aware of history and try to avoid mistakes that have already been made.
  • 8 0
 How is it stupid? Is labeling a certain wall or the origins of black powder as “Chinese” stupid? Is it stupid to acknowledge ancient Greek philosophy as Greek philosophy? To me correct information is never stupid ...
  • 7 0
 @bOObdesign: Fun Fact I: Labeling products as German was originally brought up in GB in the Merchandise Marks Act 1887 because cheap product with bad quality got imported to GB and they wanted to label them. Later during the two world wars, labeling products as "made in Germany" was an act of economic warfare by GB...... but i guess you knew that Wink
  • 1 6
flag philmn (Jan 28, 2017 at 11:54) (Below Threshold)
 @Cirest: This kind of "information" is never correct. Black powder is not exclusively chinese. The arabs made it at the same time. The chinese wall is no wall. It was a state forcing its people to build a fragmented network of buildings referred to as "the wall" with dozens of kilometers of nothing between them. To constitute and maintain the souvereighnity of the chinese state against forces. There is no specific chinese quality in this.
Greek philosophy as such w o u l d n´t e x i s t without the influences from the library of alexandria.
What you call correct information is just a normal scientific simplification to not over-complicate things, in the best case a marketing gag written backwards. When used as tool for information-exchange, it may be ok, if used as argument it is flat out ideology. Ideology is deliberately misused information, so by definition stupid.
  • 7 1
 @philmn:
> But some germans think it´s stupid to link an accomplishment to the nationality.

WTF dude... Leftist overload...WTF does nationality have to do with a marketing slogan? German engineering is not a mantra, but a recognition of a good engineering school and a strong industry. People of different nations work in the industry of this country. Seriously... As an immigrant, I'm fed up with people who look really hard for nationalistic problems and find them in the weirdest of places...
  • 2 6
flag philmn (Jan 28, 2017 at 12:22) (Below Threshold)
 @Skinnyman: do you really think its crazy to see nationalism in the act of putting an article about the greatness of german engineering in german language on an international, english speaking community-website?
WTF does nationality have to do with a marketing slogan? That´s exactly the question. Why is nationality a marketing slogan?
Like I said - nationalism is going crazy everywhere, Trump, Höcke, Brexit and in this climate someone uses arguments with nationalistic connotations for m a r k e t i n g. The only guys that find that at least questionable are being criticized.
What I am absolutely fed up with are people that have nothing better to do than criticizing critic as such as soon as it gets near their patriotic common sense.
and btw. as an immigrant you´re not immune against the accusation of argumenting nationalist.
  • 2 5
 @Cirest: there is a difference between adding the origin as information ("greek philosophy" specifies "philosophy") and adding the origin for marketing reasons.
i even can find using it for marketing reasons okay, when it means: you are in germany, this product is made in germany -> no great distance -> small CO2 footprint.
BUT when using it in terms of: german engineering is better than engineering in other countries.
its f*cked up, even if it is "not intentionally" nationalistic, because it is the same language that is/was used and understood by nazis and other mofos.
if you use those words, you are keeping that shit alive. it doesnt matter when and how it was used for the first time. it does matter what it means now.
  • 2 0
 philmn: as you are referring to "Arabs" and to the library of "Alexandra" I think you see that labeling makes sense.^^
  • 1 1
 @Cirest: Yeah, if it was about labelling. But it is not. It is about mistaking a label for a fact.
You see/sell something and put a label on it, then you claim the label as a result of its nature. Which is again the very definition of ideology. Backwards written history.
Of course "arabs" is a stupid label, too. But it´s a bit different, when somebody´s using it to point out the complexity of things instead of breaking them down, isn´t it?
  • 13 3
 Deutsche Ingernieurskunst mit nationalismus in Verbindung zu setzten halt ich ja für totalen Quatsch.
  • 5 0
 @bOObdesign: don't worry. their best engineers are expats. Big Grin
  • 1 7
flag philmn (Jan 28, 2017 at 13:53) (Below Threshold)
 @leopaul: du kannst dir ja mal die afd-parteiflugblätter oder ein paar reden dieser damen und herren anschauen. die halten das für eine hervorragende idee.
  • 1 2
 @leopaul: und wenns quatsch ist, es sollte wenigstens eine diskussion wert sein, "heutzutage", anstatt es einfach durchzuwinken.
  • 3 3
 @leopaul: schön dass der Schweizer sowas schreibt. Absolut lächerlich. Ich hoffe jeder, der hier von Nationalismus schreibt wenn es um deutsche Ingenieurskunst geht, lehnt jegliche Vorteile ab, die er selbst daraus zieht. Was ein lächerlich verlogener, heuchlerischer Scheisshaufen. Hand hoch, wer von den Bahnhofsklstschern hier ist aktiv in der Förderung von Multi kulti? Und wer reißt nur große Sprüche?
  • 2 6
flag philmn (Jan 28, 2017 at 14:52) (Below Threshold)
 @Muckal: hey! glad to welcome the first real pinstripe nazi-talk in the pinkbike-community! of course D3-pinstripe
  • 2 3
 @Muckal: why do you feel so small and useless?
  • 8 1
 Cut the bullshit with your nationalism crap, you're being ridiculous. Germans have a right to be proud of their country, too... that has absolutely NOTHING to do with nationalism. There are a few nationalists in every country, but the group that stands out the most in Germany is DEFINITELY the aggressive left wing. Everywhere I go I only find radical left-wing scribbling... in public toilets, in Universities, on the walls of private buildings in the city, just fucking everywhere. Those idiots need to be punched in the face.
  • 8 0
 @philmn: um Verwirrungen zu vermeiden. Ich bin in Deutschland geboren und hab 20 Jahre da gelebt.
ich habe mir das Wahlprogramm der AfD durchgelesen für ne Hausarbeit an Demokratie Kritik, aber nur weil es extreme gibt, heißt das doch nicht das man nicht mehr stolz auf sein Land und auf das was die deutschen erreicht haben. Deutsche Ingenieurskunst existiert. Daher ist der deutsche Automarkt mit führend weltweit.
  • 2 0
 @Muckal: bin in Deutschland geboren und aufgewachsen ...
  • 5 0
 @philmn: Of course I am not immune against the accusations. Noone is.

>do you really think its crazy to see nationalism in the act of putting an article about the greatness of german engineering in german language on an international, english speaking community-website?

Yes, I do think it is crazy. First of, the article is only visible in german speaking countries. Pinkbike publishes localized content for quite some time. The article is not about the greatness of german engineering. The article just acknowledges the fact that a corporation has picked a location in Germany for its engineering department because of the availability of skilled people, good production and logistic base, as a home to the largest european market and whatever other reasons. Is SRAM nationalistic for not opening divisions in every other country? Do they imply that Germany is somehow better than Angola?

For me personally a slogan like Engineered/Made in Germany says that by purchasing a product I am supporting the local economy and possibly reducing my CO2 footprint by some fraction. I do not see why a german citizen would not be interested in the success of the german economy.

>WTF does nationality have to do with a marketing slogan? That´s exactly the question. Why is nationality a marketing slogan?

Would you rather buy medicine that was made in Zimbabwe or in Germany?
  • 3 0
 @bOObdesign: >BUT when using it in terms of: german engineering is better than engineering in other countries.
its f*cked up

1) Where exactly does it say in the article that german engineering is better than engineering in other countries?
2) Do you think the state of engineering industry in Belize is the same as in Germany?
  • 2 1
 @bOObdesign: I don't, why would I?
  • 2 0
 @philmn: how is my post fascist. Please explain.
  • 1 5
flag philmn (Jan 29, 2017 at 0:27) (Below Threshold)
 @Muckal: hey, seit wann gibt es denn national-spezifischne content in pinkbike? aber is schon witzig, egal wo man hinschaut, sobald irgendjemand an diesem nationastolz auch nur minimal herumrührt drehen ein paar leute automatisch komplett durch. ich steig hier aus.
  • 2 3
 @Muckal: Um das vielleicht noch mal etwas zusammenzufassen - es gibt eine ganze Menge über dieses Nationalding zu sagen. Und es ist nicht unpolitisch so einen Artikel in der Diktion wie heir zu posten. Jetz ist mein Post vielleicht für manche auf der über-sensiblen Seite, andere mögen das anders sehen.

Aber wenn dann die Antworten kommen, ist es entweder haarsträubender unsinn oder die echt aggresive Patriotenkeule. Der gesamte Tenor ist "das Hinterfragen an sich ist schon die ganze Frechheit". Die meisten Leute, die hier schreiben, wollen nicht diskutieren, sie wollen das Unterlassen jeglicher Diskussion über diese Themen erzwingen, das finde ich absolut gefährlich. Lieber in mal zu viel als ein mal zu wenig.
  • 2 5
 @mazze: we had over 1000 registered right-wing attacks on refugee-shelters last year, 790 in 2015. real attacks on real people. Maybe they should have written on toilet doors, then everybody would go crazy about it.
  • 5 0
 @philmn: so being proud of your country is equal to burning down refugee-shelters?
  • 1 3
 @leopaul: you didn't read the comment i replied on.
  • 6 0
 @philmn: Why do you ignore my questions then? Is it because I'm an immigrant? That's nationalist! /s
I forgot to mention the reason why I brought up my background in the first place: in my home country I've been called a nationalist/nazi/fascist for merely speaking my native language, which also happens to be the official language of the country. If you want the same thing to happen in Germany and you'd like to become a foreigner here, please feel free to carry on. But in my opinion you do not fight radical right with radical left.

So yeah, I'd really appreciate a few answers to those very simple questions above.
  • 2 2
 @Skinnyman: hey skinnyman,
I don´t ignore your questions, because you´re an immigrant, but because - absolutely regardless what I or boobdesign write - it's gettin an automatic shitstorm. so it is pointless to reply on most of the comments. I am very interested in this conversation, but definately somwhere else but in the middle of a manic shitstorm.
btw I still don´t really see where the "radical left" is in questioning more or less questionable things, just because it is the holy common sense.
  • 4 0
 @philmn: There was an "/s" at the end of the sentence, meaning sarcasm. I do not see how my questions are a shitstorm. I was genuinely interested in understanding your point of view. Oh well, a lack of response is a response as well.
  • 1 0
 @Skinnyman: it is obvious that i didn´t mean you in special regarding the shitstorm. feel free to send me a pm if you want to discuss. otherwise i think, i will have to go to therapy at @wakidesigns ^^
  • 2 1
 @philmn: lassen wir das hier. Wir werden ja alle sehen zu was die momentane Politik führt.
  • 2 4
 @Skinnyman: 1) "Sram Eagle | German Engineered" pretty much does imply that statement. it might not imply strongly and no one said it is a super nationalistic commercial. but, looking at the current wave of nationalism and Muckal's comment, it seemed worth criticising it because the wide use of such phrases is pretty much a step towards accepted racism (if it is used intentionally or not, doesnt change the message it carries)

2) i dont know much about belize but i guess there are better facilities in germany to engineer good stuff. but it does obviously make more sense to compare germany to equally rich industrial countries... japan, usa, france, uk, canada, ....

it might be that no one of you or your friends or colleagues is so sensitive when it comes to nationalism. but that doesnt mean its BS. There is no right to be proud of your country.
you must only be proud of what you did.

and if you worked hard for getting german engineering to be outstanding... then just divide the pride into the number of germans working in industry and be 0,00000000000013% proud. unsless that sounds stupid to you and you choose to search for more personal achievments to be proud of.

@leopaul dass der deutsche automarkt weltweit führend wäre glaubt man hauptsächlich in deutschland. frag doch mal jemanden aus frankreich, aus schweden, aus japan, aus amerika, aus italien, aus korea....
in vielen ländern haben deuschte autos noch einen gewissen ruf, weil für lange zeit die teuren großen autos fast nur aus deutschland kamen.

@Muckal "aktiv in der Förderung von Multi kulti?" makes me pretty sure you are scared of loosing your "proud because im german" label and the wealth you get because you are born somewhere. go read some books
  • 9 1
 @philmn: it's sad to see that in 2017 we still have to see sht like that. The connotations of the expression in the toitle are not necessarily used in a bad meaning. Brits and Americans use their nationalistic bollocks for the use of marketing all the time. Intense or Enve and their made in US. I saw two dudes from Enve standing up and singing national anthem when Gwin won as if the saw Jesus freaking Christ, really so much stuff to be so proud of. Indoctrinated poor fkrs. What else is this blin praise for Hope? Loud hubs with crappy freehub bodies falling into the dirt whenever you take off a wheel on thru axle system. Overcomplicated stupid expensive cranks, pedals with crappy shape and pins. But no, everyone has to praise the proudly made in UK. The difference between Deutche ingenieurkunst and proudly made in UK is who lost the war. And the only stupid thing about it is someone feeling embarrassed for hearing such term. Brits don't feel embarassd when someone mentions history of some cotton company that grew cotton in India under Imperial times. Americans have no problems putting graphics relating to bombers
That were doing carpet bombing of Germany killing hunderds of thousands of civilians with pure intention of killing them not always strategic targets. Some idiots have no problem with using communist graphics. Red Army - oh how fkng cool.

I love this subject Razz
  • 7 1
 @philmn: Well, it is a good thing we know those numbers about how many right wing attacks on refugees we had in 2015 exactly. It means that statistics are working. The thing is, you can't say the same thing about the criminal acts of refugees nor about the actual number of refugees (that is in fact unknown), because we are actively being lied to. Why I know this? Because I am not a sheep that believes the medial tenor of "refugees aren't any more criminal than Germans". Crime was up by 50percent in 2015 and the only correlation is the refugees. Also, my girlfriend is a police officer and I know a lot of stuff that is not being made public only to ensure that the populations' acceptance is not compromised.
To be absolutely clear and this is something everybody knows: we had over 1000 attacks on women in just one single night of 2015 (Silvester 16). Which means that the number of attacks by right wing nationalists in a whole YEAR equals the number of attacks by immigrants in one single (albeit special) 24h DAY.
To ensure public safety at Silvester 16/17, the police had to send over 1700 policeforces to the city center of cologne for the first time in the German history ever. Those officers are people that would otherwise enjoy the holiday with their families or friends - and such force was never necessary ever before.
Now let's do some math here:
We have over 2 million refugees (a lot of them unregistered) living in Germany, about 20% are already allowed to bring their families (that is 3-10pers) which makes at least another 1.6 million (400.000*4 family members) and there are still 500.000 new refugees expected to come (per year) for the next couple of years, while merkel was talking about 1.5 mil for the whole European Union in her official speech.
To go some more into detail: We have around 15million Germans in the age of 20-35 right now (official statistic), around 4million thereof are former migrants (official statistic). With refugees (who are mostly males between 17 and 35) this very number will at least rise to 20 million by the next 3 years and this is simple mathematics. The ratio will then be near 1:1 German to Migrant in the cohort of 20-35ear olds and again this is just simple math. This number does not account for the higher fertilityrate of the migrants whatsoever, which is however an undeniable fact. Given that integration needs as much as two generations for migrants to adapt and fails in a significant amount of cases (see parallel societies), it is very likely that German inhabitants with German roots are a demographic minority (and will ever be from then on due to fertility divergence) as soon as the baby-boomer generation has died off.
So I guess it is about time that people wake up and realize that this is not the way how integration works.

And let me remind you, this is not some right wing talk, but is solely based on scientific facts that you can go and reassure yourself with at anytime, provided you know how to do it.
Considering the current policy regarding this topic, I can only understand why people are afraid and seek radicalism. On the other hand I can't possibly grasp why refugees that are being adequately supplied and come here to live in safety are having such an immense negative impact on the populations overall sense of security. It just doesn't add up.
  • 2 8
flag bOObdesign (Jan 29, 2017 at 5:04) (Below Threshold)
 @mazze: scientifical facts provided by your girlfriend that prove beeing a nazi is alright... cool
  • 2 6
flag philmn (Jan 29, 2017 at 5:13) (Below Threshold)
 @mazze: it is a shame that this discussion had to take this direction, there is so much wrong about what you sait, from the numbers, over the questionable sources for these numbers to the conclusions.

I hate to say it, but

we

don´t

go

there, mazze

it goes far too wide into the desinformation direction and totally off topic. Leave the discussing to skinnyman, who is the only one that at least has some solid arguments.
  • 6 1
 @philmn: Ah ok so my arguments are wrong and that is basically your argument?
Those were official numbers provided by Statistisches Bundesamt and Eurostat, not by my girlfriend. And she is certainly not a nazi you f*cking retard. And neither am I. I am an Economist, however, and I bet I therefore have a lot more knowledge on the topic than you do. Try me.
Btw. the direction of this discussion is what you and boobdesign single handedly pointed it towards, by associating nationalism with the term 'deutsche Ingenieurskunst' and bringing up right wing extremists attacking refugees. Take responsibility for it and stop shaming the direction.
  • 6 1
 @mazze: how about instead of evangelizing everybody you post some links to actual Scientific studies on:

Crime (origins, main causes why people engage in crimes, demographies, tendencies)
THEN Crime statistics
Culture clash
Integration strategies in Europe
Ghettos
History of immigration
History of middle East
Current power structure in Middle East
History of recent conflicts in middle East
Current conflict in Syria (local and external actors)

And then encourage them to read all that, and let them think for themselves... because all I see is some stupid sht I can read on Facebook. Biased either by stupid nationalists or stupid lefties and hippies
  • 4 0
 Also I encourage everyone to appreciate how far we've moved as humanity. Vikings were starving and had issues with civil war, so the emigrated to England... I guess that was kind of a different "refugee" crisis
  • 3 3
 @WAKIdesigns: I don't follow a political agenda on pinkbike, that is why I don't feel obligated to educate people on scientific research. I am only putting things in perspective. You are free to use Eurostat. On a side note: unlike you I don't even have a Facebook account.
It is a well known fact that Germany is nowadays the country with the least national pride in the world, because prevailing view in Germany is, that we are not allowed to have something like pride after all the wrongdoing in the second world war. So, nationalism is NOWADAYS certainly not a problem that is particularly huge in Germany compared to the rest of the world.
Also I am not reasoning about power structure in middle east but about german demographics. Two absolutely different topics.
  • 2 1
 @bOObdesign:
>BUT when using it in terms of: german engineering is better than engineering in other countries.
its f*cked up
>i dont know much about belize but i guess there are better facilities in germany to engineer good stuff.

*mic drop*
  • 2 3
 @mazze: no, basically what I said was

we don´t go there

desinformation, off topic (how does that even relate to the original post?).
This is not the place for discussing the whole refugee thing. My initial idea was to question something nearly everyone thinks is common sense and a value by itself, because it´s not. And if it is, then, why? Waving a flag and selling a product.
Strictly related to the topic here. M a y b e I´m wrong and it´s not that bad, we can leave that to the discussion.

You can go trolling the whole mainstream media up and down with your (full on mainstream-)ideas and find a lot of lookalikes.
  • 2 0
 @Skinnyman: "*mic drop*"

*mic drop*
i suggest you read the whole answer next time
  • 3 1
 @bOObdesign: >it seemed worth criticising it because the wide use of such phrases is pretty much a step towards accepted racism

Do you suggest we ban the word "german"? If you were in charge of coming up with a title for an article that should highlight the fact that a product is being developed in a home country of a reader who cares about where his money go and trusts the quality of a product manufactured there, what would be your title?
Is this option good enough? Sram Eagle | German Engineered but not in a nationalistic or fascist way just like it's engineered in a country with no reference to national pride or history or refugees or animals or climate change or the recent wave of racism.
  • 1 1
 @bOObdesign: >i suggest you read the whole answer next time

Please elaborate. I read the whole answer. What did I miss?
  • 2 0
 @Skinnyman: itdoesn´t have to do anything with P.C.
nobody said, that this is facist to say "german engineering". but out of infinite possibilities they chose this one.

in parallel the afd is making the "protection of the german engineering art" a central leverage of their propaganda and everybody knows that.

you can say what you want, it is NOT solely a geographical information.
as you see in most comments it is combined with arkwardly intense feelings. Playing with these feelings ist a questionable thing and at least worth a discussion - what chrashed here in an awful way.

the problem is that most people don´t even want a discussion about that. to be honest it is an imprudence that i have to justify myself for starting a discussion at all.
  • 6 0
 @philmn: > in parallel the afd is making the "protection of the german engineering art" a central leverage of their propaganda and everybody knows that.

I could not care less about afd. Will you stop riding your bike if afd starts protecting bike paths? I'll repeat: for me personally far left ideas do not make more sense only because of the presence of far right absurdity.

> you can say what you want, it is NOT solely a geographical information.

Again, I personally could not even imagine you can make a connection between a phrase "German Engineering" and fascism. I have never in my life had even a shade of such a thought. Here I am - a person, for which it was only a geographical information.

> the problem is that most people don´t even want a discussion about that.

The discussion has to make sense. Finding a link between a marketing slogan and racism does not make one for me. Should we exterminate all the german shepherds? Is that dog somehow better than other dogs? Is that dog racist?
  • 2 2
 @philmn: simple question for once:

Do you have a job?
  • 1 2
 @Skinnyman: i think u just havent understood anything i said. if you would pick the information of more than 1 sentence (maybe 2 next time) and put those informations together into one.... you would probably understand.

@Muckal: wow, u seem to be a cheap caricature of a Klemmnazi

doesnt really make sense to argue with people u cant argue with
  • 2 0
 @bOObdesign: you are free to argue with me instead, but you obviously choose not to because you seem to feel like you can't win the argument. And I assume you are correct in that.

@philmn you are still complaining that this is not the place to discuss refugees and - although you are absolutely right - YOU are the only one who brought this very topic up in this discussion. Oh the irony! You are literally destroying yourself here with your fingerpointing. And while you refuse to argue with me, you still feel righteous about openly calling me, @Muckal or my girlfriend a nazi.
  • 1 0
 @bOObdesign: I am genuinely interested in understanding your opinion. Please, instead of repeating multiple times how I don't read your comments just copy paste the text you have in mind. Where did I make I mistake? What did I miss?
  • 3 0
 @bOObdesign:

Show me that fascist line i posted. I'm really interested. Like the others that you accuse of somethin without any proof.
Do you know the difference between nationalism, racism and fascism?
  • 1 0
 @Skinnyman:
"there is a difference between adding the origin as information ("greek philosophy" specifies "philosophy") and adding the origin for marketing reasons.
i even can find using it for marketing reasons okay, when it means: you are in germany, this product is made in germany -> no great distance -> small CO2 footprint.
BUT when using it in terms of: german engineering is better than engineering in other countries.
its f*cked up, even if it is "not intentionally" nationalistic, because it is the same language that is/was used and understood by nazis and other mofos.
if you use those words, you are keeping that shit alive. it doesnt matter when and how it was used for the first time. it does matter what it means now"

"1) i dont know much about belize but i guess there are better facilities in germany to engineer good stuff. but it does obviously make more sense to compare germany to equally rich industrial countries... japan, usa, france, uk, canada, .... "

"Sram Eagle | German Engineering" does not mean: its engineered in a first world industrial country instead of a 3rd world country with low tech level.
it means its engineered in famous germany, the country that engineers better than other first world industrial countries...

and that is first of all not true.
and its rightish language and should be handled with care. ... especially now
  • 4 0
 @bOObdesign: ummm, the issue is that I'd rather have a German car than an American one... and defo more than an Italian one... quite a bloody lot of energy efficient devices used in buildings all over Europe are made in Germany. Just like many energy efficient building systems. So there is some water in it. However when it comes to drive trains hummm... yea it's bollocks. I for one have no fricking clue how much R&D sht is made by Sram in US and how much is done in Germany. And I don't give a flying sht. You have to admit, "German engineering" is a very subtle marketing pitch compared to Monster Energy girls. The latter actually does insult my tiny intellect. If my wife came to me and said she's out for a weekend with some French or Spanish dude, I would not object. I would be shattered though if he was English Texan, or Dutch. Or Belize.

WHat I am trying to say is, some stuff is just an okay indicator. Even though it's not always true. For instance I have an observation about German sense of humor. I haven' yet met someone who would fit the stereotype. However I did meet maaaany people from England (I am being specific about a part of UK) who are fkng dull like Yorkshire pudding. Can't take a joke, can't spot a sarcasm, never ever.
  • 1 1
 @WAKIdesigns: "it might not imply strongly and no one said it is a super nationalistic commercial. but, looking at the current wave of nationalism and Muckal's comment, it seemed worth criticising it because the wide use of such phrases is pretty much a step towards accepted racism (if it is used intentionally or not, doesnt change the message it carries)"
  • 2 0
 @bOObdesign:
Here's my issue: first you say that "when using it in terms of: german engineering is better than engineering in other countries. its f*cked up" but then you say that engineering industry in Germany is better than in Belize. You have effectively made a comparison. Do I get you right that it is only f*cked up to compare Germany to other industrial countries? Who compiles the list of countries you can compare Germany to then? Is the process of comparison nationalistic and fascist? Because comparisons happen all the time all over the world. You yourself make thousands of comparisons a day and you pick and choose people and things. So far I understand you in a way that everything is equal and you'd be a nazi for saying something is better than something else.

>even if it is "not intentionally" nationalistic, because it is the same language that is/was used and understood by nazis and other mofos.

Nazis also understand German and English and a lot of other languages. Shall we invent a new language and forbid nazis to speak it? I am not familiar with a nazi-specific vocabulary and I find it fascist to forbid the usage of particular words only because they have been used by some bad guys.

>"Sram Eagle | German Engineering" does not mean: its engineered in a first world industrial country instead of a 3rd world country with low tech level.

How do you know what it means? Maybe that was exactly the intention? I work in an engineering industry and let me tell you: it is a hard work to bring business to Germany because of high costs. It is very difficult to compete on a global scene nowadays. Corporation has to have some serious reasons to keep a department here. I'd expect you to shout out loud "YAY German Engineering!" because those guys pay taxes, but somehow that's racist and nazi and fascist.

>and its rightish language and should be handled with care. ... especially now

I think that what should be handled with care is randomly calling people nazis. It just looks stupid, sorry.
  • 2 0
 @bOObdesign: you are wrong! German Engineering is not a term that was formed in present time, but in Germanys' history. Germany is in fact famous for its ingenuity and innovations, so the term German Engineering or land of Engineers is nothing but well-deserved heritage. And yes, while knowledge and technology are becoming more and more equal all over the world, the term might lose some of it's glory - but luckily there are still a lot of niches where Germany is the absolute spearhead in technologic leadership. And instead of criticising this, you could very well just be proud and happy about it. If it was any different, there would not be chinese and US investors trying to buy German technology companies for billions of Dollars every year.

Why is it such a bad thing for you, that Germany has not only a history of violence and hatred, but also a heritage of productivity and ingenuity? Is it destroying your radical-leftist view of your homeland?

What should be handled with care in times like this, is that you are actively trying to destroy one of the very few positive attributes of German culture. And that you are calling anything and everyone a nazi without any fundamental basis. You still owe some of us an apology for that.
  • 1 0
 @WAKIdesigns: man, what has gotten into you? You are making way too much sense today... it's creeping me out. One might even say you seem happy ^^ did you find a new love or something? lol
  • 1 0
 @mazze: No I read through some stuff here and I can see that I deal with decent smart people having a civilized discussion... It's a pleasure to be here Big Grin
  • 1 3
 it really isnt a good conversation imo.
i dont want to invest any more of my time.

me and philmn never said the ad was very nationalistic. we simply were pointing out that there is a nationalistic message in it. a message we both dont like. the reasons were pointed out several times.

i didnt call everyone a nazi.

i called Muckal "a cheap caricature of a Klemmnazi" and said "scientifical facts provided by your girlfriend that prove beeing a nazi is alright... cool" after mazze posted his huge pegida text.

i really disagree with u guys.
things arent as easy and clear as you wish and think they are. and there is no natural law that makes right what feels good for u personally.
ciao
  • 2 2
 @bOObdesign: >it really isnt a good conversation imo.

You have started it.

>me and philmn never said the ad was very nationalistic. we simply were pointing out that there is a nationalistic message in it. the reasons were pointed out several times.

You could not elaborate on the reasons. You do not answer very simple questions. You know who does not answer very simple questions and ignores opinions of other people? That's right: nazis.

>i didnt call everyone a nazi.

You are the one who introduced this word into the discussion, sorry. You seem to have an obsession over it.

>after mazze posted his huge pegida text

Please stop seeing politics everywhere. Pegida also uses internet, just like you. Are you a nazi because of that? I would like to see a discussion of facts and opinions without a connection to a particular political party. If there is a particular fact or a logical dependency, it does not stop to become a fact or a logical dependency if pegida uses it. Or do you disagree?

>i really disagree with u guys.

It is you right to disagree. But if you have nothing to respond with, then please look some info up to use it as solid arguments. "i really disagree" is not an argument.

It is very impolite to accuse someone of being nationalistic and to finish a chat with generic ridiculous stuff like "things arent as easy and clear as you wish and think they are". Am I somehow intellectually inferior to you? That's nationalistic. If not, feel free to let me know what is it that is not so easy and clear.

>and there is no natural law that makes right what feels good for u personally.

That is why I would like to see facts and logic in the discussion. They are unambiguously understood by all parties of a discussion. Why do you accuse me of labeling something I feel good about as 'right'? Why do you only accuse people, seriously?
  • 2 1
 @philmn ppl like you are the reason i hate my country. pc cuck. this must be your personal hell: www.youtube.com/watch?v=zl8IbgxfYEI
  • 1 0
 And some of you guys have issues with overusing the term "German Engineering":

dirtmountainbike.com/features/interviews/jim-colegrove-treks-inimitable-master.html

No other country on Earth does such a hullabaloo out of their nationalism. They probably beat North Korea...
  • 6 0
 does this mean in a parallel pinkbike universe people in north korea are reading content in their language that we can't see?
  • 1 0
 In North Korea Pinkbike has got different topics too...
  • 4 0
 Only reason this showed up for me is cos I'm in Switzerland visiting CERN. Cool to know pb caters to different languages. Being able to speak German it was also nice to put that to practice, nice one PB : salute:
  • 3 0
 FYI: This is the first time I've read a german article on Pinkbike.
Plus it's a really, really bad translation. Looks like the work of an intern.
  • 4 0
 Strange.. I'm currently in NZ and my computer as well as the browser are setup in english and even then I can see this german article.. and it feels strange reading german articles on pinkbike..
  • 1 0
 Grüezi Wohl!
  • 4 0
 Wenn das nur in deutschsprachigen Ländern auf Deutsch sichtbar ist, warum in aller Welt schreibt ihr Deutschsprachigen in euren Posts Englisch???
  • 3 0
 Posting in German would be too nationalist Wink
  • 1 0
 Am I the only one thinking that "traditional" drivetrains are oldschool af? In my opinion, companies should seek to develop gearboxes as the ones from Pinion etc. The advantages are obvious: There's no chain, no casette and no chainring that can be worn out, when a belt (is it the right word?) is beeing used. These things are able to last 10.000km and more. No parts are affected by mud and sand, the gearbox itself needs almost no maintenance, the bikes would be quite as hell. The development of such systems hand in hand with those who build the bikes would mean a true step forward. Everything else is just an attempt to find a new way to put an old product on the market in a new, "cooler" shape.
  • 3 0
 Feels weird reading Germans arguing about Germans arguing about Germany on pinkbike
  • 3 1
 That is extremely heart warming. I thought only Polish people deeply enjoyed shittin into their own soup...
  • 3 0
 Feels weird reading Germans arguing about Germany in pinkbike
  • 1 0
 Imagine some article praising some component for being made in the USA. Imagine the shitstorm and the discussion then...
  • 1 0
 No there would not be such shitstorm, people would put their hands to their chests and start singing...
  • 2 0
 holy cow what a crazy conversation going down over here haha
  • 2 4
 Eagle looks pretty ugly on a bike!

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