Video: The Line That Won The Men's Race At Maribor World Cup DH 2021

66 Comments

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AntN (Aug 16, 2021 at 2:37)

Loris tried to tell everyone Gregs secrets line however, "drrrrep berffff derjunk derdunk guggger gug er gug er onunfff" got lost in translation.

mtbmaniatv FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 6:04)

Thats totally effed but am laughing so good

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bkm303 (Aug 16, 2021 at 7:49)

Lol as soon as he finished green I turned to my wife and said "this post-race interview is gonna be awesome... bap! bap! gugugugugupop!"

But then the interviewer decided to just be a massive downer the whole time

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BMXJJ327 (Aug 16, 2021 at 8:54)

@bkm303: The interviewer was terrible!

Interviewer: "Hey I know you just won but just a reminder you can't win the overall title. How does that make you feel?"

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jmusuperman FL (Aug 15, 2021 at 21:31)

Would love to see a video of the "theoretical fastest line" for the race. What *could* the theoretical fastest time have been given the fastest segments of the track. Seems feasible. Also a video where Cathro talks about what he thought the fastest line was and what it turned out to be... right or wrong. What was Cathro's theoretical best time versus the green sectors from Red Bull's live feed? Let's nerd out!

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AntN (Aug 15, 2021 at 21:40)

An edit of each of the fastest sections into one 'super run'

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Jacquers (Aug 15, 2021 at 21:45)

That would be interesting. Kinda difficult without footage of the full track / run though. Coulanges did something in that unbroadcasted section that most of the others weren't able to do. It would have been great to see that section.

husstler (Aug 15, 2021 at 22:42)

The Nerding Out articles kind of does that but not with video. The best split times get added up to give an idea of what the fastest time could have been if someone hit every section green. They call it the Perfect Lap

pasteque51 FL (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:20)

Impossible to do it if you don't know the lines speed entrance. Comparing 2 lines in a section can be interesting but from one rider to an other the speed will never be the same

AntN (Aug 16, 2021 at 0:09)

@pasteque51: good call, one sections fastest maybe leading into the next 'wrong' making not the fastest. A perfect run (of combined best sections) probably isn't possible....

pasteque51 FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 7:44)

@AntN: yes it is, watch Pierron in les Gets

fukachu (Aug 18, 2021 at 0:16)

@Jacquers: Agreed, I was watching it on replay but basically until Loic came down he found about 1 second on everyone in the bottom sections. It was unreal.

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bulletbassman (Aug 16, 2021 at 4:45)

Emtb racing should just be trials guy racing up wc courses

mtbmaniatv FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 6:09)

Absolutely haha!

fiftypercentsure (Aug 16, 2021 at 19:21)

Cool on a closed course and at the same time a nightmare on your local trail.

Ebikers riding up the downhill line ("impossible climb!") is already a problem on my local trail.

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hurmikak (Aug 16, 2021 at 1:17)

My daughter races in canoe slalom (20-23 gates) and she says she has to remember the course 100% (including all the waves, currents, rocks etc) to succeed. She can remember even the courses that she raced a year ago.

I imagine that the PRO DH racers can do the same - they can remember all the features of the track, all the rocks, possible lines etc and process everything in a real time in insane speed. I am pretty sure this is impressive.

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browner (Aug 16, 2021 at 1:42)

I can remember every root of a jump line we built as kids when I was 13 - all bikers have this to some extent

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on-the-move (Aug 16, 2021 at 1:46)

Listen to Sam Hill on Gypsy podcast, he talks about how he used to be able to set a stop watch and go through a run in his head and get the same times he was getting on the course.

betsie (Aug 16, 2021 at 2:20)

Then for racing add in the changing light conditions. With the light at the weekend, imagine having to rely on your memory entering dark woods from bright sunshine at flat out speed, the dappled light is probably even worse as nothing looks like it is. That is some commitment. I don't know how they do it!

steezysam FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 6:02)

@TobiasHandcock: that's wild

IanJF (Aug 16, 2021 at 8:51)

Definitely the difference between Pros and schmos like me. Even when on a track I've ridden dozens of times, I still forget where I am during a run. How Pros can walk and ride a track a few times and remember it is amazing to me.

pyromaniac FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 12:10)

Rode with a DH guy a few years back on trails he did not know, but I did. His knowledge of the trails from just one run was unbelievable. He told me about rocks and roots in detail that I did not even see.

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Prestige (Aug 16, 2021 at 4:52)

Would also like to know what did Coulanges do in sectors 9-10. That seemed to defeat 90% of other racers.

Jvhowube FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 7:37)

I kept trying to figure out if that was the part with the left hander with the giant bombhole, or farther down. But yeah, I too would like to know where he made this time, and if it was track conditions deteriorating or that he's just a wild man.

Will-narayan (Aug 16, 2021 at 9:40)

@Jvhowube: Was it wild or on the contrary "just" a 100% composed run from top to bottom ?
Maybe he saved some stamina on the 1st half (while still going pretty fast) and had enough left at the bottom ?
But yeah that would be interesting.

Also I think the title of this article is incorrect. Vergier had 1,5 second over everybody else, so he may still have won even with a different line in the rock garden.

mitochris FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 11:59)

If you go tho the replay on red bull, at 1:00.15 they have the virtual gap up to Wilson, and suddenly it jumps by 12m advantage to Coulanges. I know the virtual gap thing is not very good, but it seems that coming out of that corner, and maybe the off-camber before is we’re he made out the time, all riders lost to him there.

Will-narayan (Aug 16, 2021 at 15:47)

@mitochris: Ah yeah indeed, as per the nerding out article, him and Suarez did something special there.

on-the-move (Aug 16, 2021 at 1:19)

Great to see Greg looking so stoked after his result, well done. He had a really nice line inside that huge bomb hole on the left hander in the live feed, surfing on the deep dust faster than most could rail the turn.

dolface (Aug 16, 2021 at 7:02)

I noticed that, and Loris took a similar line (although not quite as inside as Greg IIRC);

jase111171 (Aug 15, 2021 at 22:02)

Riding an e bike UP the track,like pretty much everywhere in the UK.

nicfugere (Aug 16, 2021 at 10:43)

Nice analysis ! Its interesting to see that Minaar's huge experience is actually giving him an edge over the other less experimented racers. That being said, the young guns are rising fast these years

bikesandbeers (Aug 16, 2021 at 13:46)

Great to see Minaar pull that off. Never underestimate experience and hard work. "Hard work is what makes risk-taking possible. You cant do one without the other" Malcolm Gladwell. Young guns take note!

Philt32 (Aug 17, 2021 at 2:46)

A few years ago when I was road racing mc’s, I could close my eyes and ‘ride’ through a circuit and get within 3-5 seconds of my laptime, can I do it on 100m of trail I’ve ridden 70+ times, can I fcuk, amazed by these riders

xTwoSnakesx FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 0:50)

Anyone else think this was gonna be about the inside line Wyn mentioned to Vergier?

dakine69 (Aug 16, 2021 at 2:04)

I would send it all the way down

vinay FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 2:33)

Even if you'd have had the guts and the precision, you likely wouldn't have had the speed entering the section.Yes I see the emoji, just meant to say that if the rubble can be gapped, you'll indeed have riders who are actually going to try that. Gee Atherton comes to mind. Would actually be interesting to, once the race is done, have a guy like Akrigg have a go. He may not necessarily be the quickest but he may have help Cathro with the definition of "creative line choice".

me2menow (Aug 17, 2021 at 13:24)

Thank you guys so much for not spoiling the results. That was such a nail biting race to watch

Philt32 (Aug 17, 2021 at 2:41)

Really enjoyed the detail, great presenting and explanations

jgainey (Aug 16, 2021 at 11:31)

The Number plate is why he won..... #crujones33 #Rad

PACNW-MTB (Aug 16, 2021 at 17:41)

I'd be a WC DH racer if it weren't for my shit memory...

oevets4130 FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 14:32)

That's not what won the race. One, and two had their shirts pinned tighter than anyone else, and tucked in. Thats what won the race.

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thedirtyburritto (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:04)

Came for some French Line comments......they must be behind the paywall.

zyoungson (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:56)

How did you get around it?

thedirtyburritto (Aug 16, 2021 at 0:10)

3 french guys who cant take a joke have read this comment.

Below threshold threads are hidden

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Thebluelion (Aug 15, 2021 at 21:03)

This brings up an interesting question about ethics of recording practice runs, Minnaar identified an innovative line and presumably should have been allowed to benefit from it in the main run until it was there for all to see. I know it's not enforceable with the million people about on practice days and it's obviously not certain if Vergier even saw Minnaar's run. Just something to think about. After all tactics are very closely guarded in other sports.

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conoat (Aug 15, 2021 at 21:13)

naw. there's zero difference ethically, between someone witnessing it and someone witnessing it and recording it. the only way to keep your line choice a secret is to not run the exact line you're going to use until your race run.

Thebluelion (Aug 15, 2021 at 21:42)

@conoat: I don't disagree, but there are several issues with just witnessing vs recording, it's unlikely that you'll be present for all of the competitor runs and it's hard to communicate line choice verbally. Witnessing the entire run is also physically impossible in most DH tracks. All of these issues are mitigated to a certain extent by video, which would allow detailed comparison of line choices along the entire track

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winko (Aug 15, 2021 at 22:57)

@Thebluelion: Isnt that what Peaty basically does for syndicate? But if you watch last year Cathros video from Lousa you'd see that he also helps Jamie Edmondson with some line choices so overall I still see DH racing as friendly competition where most of people want others to do well!

11 1

kleinblake (Aug 15, 2021 at 22:59)

Minnaar had that line earlier in the year when he gapped over the pole and he didn’t reveal it until his race run. These dudes know how it works if they want something to stay secret.

jaame (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:17)

@kleinblake: only one way to keep a secret

rich-2000 (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:26)

all the major race trams have spotters on the course and radio this stuff back up to the top of the mountain anyway.

Although I’ve read before that the privateers and smaller teams do watch the cathro stuff!

19 1

egb81 FL (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:41)

@jaame: I'm not sure killing everyone else is very ethical though.

jaame (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:41)

@egb81: I was meaning don't tell anyone

14 0

egb81 FL (Aug 15, 2021 at 23:44)

@jaame: of course you were *nudge nudge, wink wink*

Mugen FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 0:46)

All part of DH racing I would say, back when Gwin was way above the rest of the field he would do slow runs the first day, pick up speed the second, and only test his crazy lines the day of the race so they couldn't be stolen.

on-the-move (Aug 16, 2021 at 1:15)

@winko: I bet Loris stops in practice and twists Peaty's arm lines every race too haha

conoat (Aug 16, 2021 at 1:16)

@Thebluelion: there still is zero ethical issue

Thebluelion (Aug 16, 2021 at 1:24)

@conoat: Already said I don't disagree, just thought it was an interesting hypothetical to think about

justanotherusername (Aug 16, 2021 at 2:24)

I raised this a while ago and got slammed for suggesting filming may give away hard earned gains made my creative line choice or allow unfair advantage, especially to teams that can afford to put guys out there and collect footage and essentially data.

Very different to watching yourself, riders have riding to do so easier to avoid trying a new line when you can see other riders hanging around and wait till they leave - more difficult when someone is standing there filming all day.

Watching someone ride a line over and over from footage is very different from someone trying to describe it or you witnessing it once.

Sam Hill used to get up super early to get quiet runs in and be very secretive over line choice, no chance with a load of people hanging around filming.

Personally I don’t see how it could be stopped, but 100% any comparative analysis like this shouldn’t be public until after the race - just like Ben has done so no complaint from me there.

betsie (Aug 16, 2021 at 2:25)

DH is about, track walk, practicing a track many times, watching other riders, having scouts up the hill, watching go-pro footage etc etc. Then everyone going as fast as they can within their abilities in 1 run on race day. - Dh is very calculated.

Enduro is about 1 practice lap of the track, recording on gopro, watching go-pro back,90%+ of the track is your choice, then racing several tracks in 2 days, mostly from memory with potentially very changing conditions. - Enduro is very raw and requires a great memory.

Its why both formats of gravity racing are so appealing.

justanotherusername (Aug 16, 2021 at 6:10)

@betsie: DH isn’t as calculated as you make out though, multiple lines, changing track conditions over the day due to use, weather conditions etc etc - it isn’t like circuit racing where you can learn a track, it’s braking / turn in points and watch endless identical footage.

One of the reasons DH and mtb is exciting is it’s unpredictability - to me at least.

betsie (Aug 16, 2021 at 13:22)

@justanotherusername: I was just guessing about Dh from doing over 70 Dh races.
You try and predict what is going to change, watch the weather etc etc. Well, I do anyway. Unless it's the likes of Fort William which is pretty much the same run to run. It's probably the roughest it's been just now too.
I have done a couple of enduros too, but prefer Dh when fit.

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andypandyuk (Aug 16, 2021 at 0:31)

Gwin would have won if he was there

suspended-flesh FL (Aug 16, 2021 at 13:27)

....and the Rapture in coming...

brianpark FL Editor (Aug 17, 2021 at 14:31)

I'm sorry that nobody can identify sass on the internet.

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yakimonti (Aug 16, 2021 at 8:45)

Pretty clickbaity title? to make the uninformed think a world cup DH is won on ONE line? disrespectful to the riders. We as viewers see a total of what, 30 seconds of a 3.5 minute track.