The Pinkbike Podcast: Episode 72 - Hey Outers!

Jul 23, 2021
by Mike Levy  
Pinkbike Podcast
Art by Taj Mihelich

The Pinkbike podcast has always been a little bit of therapy for us—a place where we can chat about things casually and answer some questions, and that's never been more true than for episode #72. Today's discussion is all about us being acquired by Outside and what that means for the future of Pinkbike. We discuss how things might look like down the road, read some mean comments, and talk about why we're cautiously optimistic about all this.

For the people who like to skip ahead, the discussion about Outside starts around the 24-minute mark.

bigquotesA small update. Since we recorded this we've been working with the Outside folks and can confirm a few more things. Commenting isn't going anywhere—in fact they are looking at adding comments to other Outside titles too. User-generated content from the community, brands, and athletes won't ever be put behind a paywall. And in general, the strategy will be to find things to add to incentivize membership.Brian Park

July 23rd, 2021

Fear, loathing, and the future of Pinkbike.

Featuring a rotating cast of the editorial team and other guests, the Pinkbike podcast is a weekly update on all the latest stories from around the world of mountain biking, as well as some frank discussion about tech, racing, and everything in between.

This Episode Presented by Bontrager

Bontrager just released an all-new SE6 tire–their most aggressive trail tire to date, along with completely revamped SE5 and XR5 tires, both with all-new tread designs. They offer a complete line-up of MTB tires with treads and casing options all lined up in a simple naming convention that makes it easy to find the right tire for where and how you ride.

Previous Pinkbike Podcasts
Episode 1 - Why Are Bikes So Expensive?
Episode 2 - Where the Hell is the Grim Donut?
Episode 3 - Pond Beaver Tech
Episode 4 - Why is Every Bike a Trail Bike?
Episode 5 - Can You Trust Bike Reviews?
Episode 6 - Over Biked Or Under Biked?
Episode 7 - Wild Project Bikes
Episode 8 - Do We Need an Even Larger Wheel Size?
Episode 9 - Why Are We Doing a Cross-Country Field Test?
Episode 10 - Getting Nerdy About Bike Setup
Episode 11 - Are We Going Racing This Year?
Episode 12 - What's the Future of Bike Shops?
Episode 13 - Are Bikes Too Regular Now?
Episode 14 - What Bikes Would Pinkbike Editors Buy?
Episode 15 - What's Holding Mountain Biking Back?
Episode 16 - Who's Your Mountain Biking Hero?
Episode 17 - XC Field Test Insider
Episode 18 - Electronics on your Mountain Bike: Good or Bad?
Episode 19 - The Hardtail Episode
Episode 20 - MTB Conspiracy Theories
Episode 21 - Stuff We Were Wrong About
Episode 22 - Does Your Riding Style Match Your Personality?
Episode 23 - Grim Donut 2 is Live!
Episode 24 - Why Even Buy a DH Bike?
Episode 25 - Fall Field Test Preview
Episode 26 - The Three Most Important Mountain Bikes
Episode 27 - The World Champs Special
Episode 28 - All About Women's Bikes
Episode 29 - Freeride or Die
Episode 30 - Would You Rather?
Episode 31 - Wet Weather Riding Tips & Tricks
Episode 32 - What Needs to Change in the Bike Industry?
Episode 33 - Behind the Scenes at Pinkbike Academy
Episode 34 - Grilling Levy About Field Test Trail Bikes (and His Bonspiel)
Episode 35 - Story Time - Stranger Than Fiction
Episode 36 - Grilling Kazimer about Field Test Enduro Bikes
Episode 37 - The 2020 Privateer Season with Ben Cathro
Episode 38 - Editors Defend Their 2020 Best-Of Picks
Episode 39 - Predicting the Future of Mountain Biking
Episode 40 - The Pinkbike Awards!
Episode 41 - Racing Rumours and Team Changes
Episode 42 - Mountain Biking's Guilty Pleasures
Episode 43 - Dangerholm's Wildest Custom Mountain Bikes
Episode 44 - Mountain Bike Suspension Decoded
Episode 45 - What Makes a Good Riding Buddy
Episode 46 - The RockShox Zeb vs Fox 38 Deep Dive
Episode 47 - High Pivot Bikes: The Good, The Bad, and The Why?
Episode 48 - Rides That Went Horribly Wrong... & Why That Made Them So Good
Episode 49 - What's the Best DH Bike?
Episode 50 - Are Bikes Actually Getting Less Expensive? (Value Bike Field Test Preview)
Episode 51 - Should MTB Media Post Spy Shots?
Episode 52 - Our Most Embarrassing MTB Moments
Episode 53 - Should Climbers Still Have the Right of Way?
Episode 54 - Best and Worst MTB Product Marketing
Episode 55 - Big Dumb Rides & Staying Motivated
Episode 56 - What Were the Most Important Inventions in Mountain Biking?
Episode 57 - What Were the Best (and Worst) Trends in Mountain Biking?
Episode 58 - Debunking Mountain Biking's Biggest Myths
Episode 59 - Value Bike Field Trip Surprises & Spoilers
Episode 60 - What Kind of Mountain Biker Do You Want to Be?
Episode 61 - Athlete Pay, Lycra, Equality and More from the State of the Sport Survey
Episode 62 - Editor Preferences and Why They Matter
Episode 63 - Our Best (And Worst) Bike Buying Advice
Episode 64 - Who's On Your MTB Mount Rushmore?
Episode 65 - The Hardtail Episode
Episode 66 - The Best and Worst of Repairing Bikes
Episode 67 - The Story of Mountain Biking's Most Interesting Man: Richard Cunningham
Episode 68 - Who Are Mountain Biking's Unsung Heroes?
Episode 69 - The Good, Bad, and Strange Bikes We've Owned - Part 1
Episode 70 - The Good, Bad, and Strange Bikes We've Owned - Part 2
Episode 71 - The Story of Mountain Biking's Most Interesting Man: Richard Cunningham - A Pinkbike Podcast Special, Part 2

Author Info:
mikelevy avatar

Member since Oct 18, 2005
2,032 articles

  • 135 3
 I do not like Outside. Like, at all.

But there’s really no point in getting too upset about it as users until something actually happens. Also, need to cut Brian and those guys some slack … they didn’t have anything to do with the sale, and they owe it to themselves and their careers to be optimistic about the transition. What do we want from them, and what else would we expect them to do?
  • 64 0
 "But I'm angry NOW!" (-Homer Simpson)
  • 30 0
 I used to be with ‘it’, but then they changed what ‘it’ was. Now what I’m with isn’t ‘it’ anymore and what’s ‘it’ seems weird and scary.
  • 61 0
 Honestly, I’m not mad at anyone. I just know that big company’s destroy the small things I love. I’m not fearful of the Mikes doing shit that is awful, I’m afraid that Outside will do shit that is awful to the Mikes.
  • 7 5
 Yep what's done is done. Pb, with or without paywall will slowly fade as the pb people who made it grow stop caring as they no longer benefit from making enjoyable content.
  • 25 1
 But.... we were pretty brutal. Brutal to Brian in particular. In reality he's probably stuck in the very shitty situation of trying to put a positive spin on a corporate sellout to a company know for incredibly terrible clickbaity content. That's not a great position to be in. Brian, I apologize for making that joke about you needing a red baseball cap and an orange spray tan (because you want to build a paywall). Sorry about that, it was a below the belt joke.
  • 26 0
 @kcy4130: I mean, I'm right here and still care. I'm betting on no fade, but I'm also biased...
  • 7 0
 @kcy4130: that's a pretty negative outlook....I got the opposite from the podcast, same sandbox but bigger (more $$ to throw around). Hoping the analogy to Santa Cruz is accurate. Looking forward to grim donut 2
  • 25 5
 you do not like OUTSIDE. so you say.
try it! try it! and you may.
try it and you may, I say.

Sam! if you let me be,
I will try OUTSIDE. you will see.

(... and he tries OUTSIDE...)

say! I like OUTSIDE!
I do! I like it, Sam-I-am!
and I will read it in a boat.
and I will read it with a goat...
and I will read it in the rain.
and in the dark. and on a train.
and in a car. and in a tree.
it is so good, so good, you see!
so I will read it in a box.
and I will read it with a fox.
and I will read it in a house.
and I will read it with a mouse.
and I will read it here and there.
say! I will read it anywhere!
I do so like OUTSIDE!
thank you! thank you, Sam I am.
  • 23 8
 I think some of the PB staff should consider setting up their own media outlet as a cooperative. Which is actually pretty much how PB has run to date and the main reason it is so awesome and unique. The reality is that websites cost basically nothing and the PB content providers and community add ALL of the value. The acquisition of PB will result in extractive, profit maximisation of the platform. This means maximum advertising, maximum subscriptions and, once revenue is maximised, the minimum costs. This acquisition might result in people keeping their jobs today, but they will lose them in 2-3 years to younger, less experienced people prepared to churn out similar but inferior content for less money. The investors here have no interest in the long term evolution of the sport or mountain biking beyond the profit it can generate. There has to be a better way to organise yourselves.
  • 10 3
 @SATN-XC: They made some good points in the podcast. First, the media landscape is tough these days — you gotta find ways to make it happen and get paid. Also — and this is very important and absolutely crucial — every business has to keep growing, or die. Newspapers are having their asses handed to them. Why? Run by a bunch of old school publishers who didn’t see it coming and didn’t adapt. They were 100 percent right there — you have to keep growing.

They all have the right attitude in seeing this as an opportunity rather than a setback or impending doom. The easiest way to get your ass kicked out the door is to have a poor attitude. That said, I don’t think anyone here is putting up a front and pretending. I think they’re all genuinely optimistic here. That’s good. If we are all a part of this community, I think it’s good to support them in that.

But yeah, changes are coming. These guys know that, even if they don’t know what. Maybe it’s stuff they’ll agree with, maybe not. Corporate needs to remember they need to be careful not piss too many of us off, or they’ll kill the golden goose. We’ll leave as quickly as we got here. But before it comes to that, we will just have to wait and see.
  • 5 0
 @taprider: I’ve tried Outside. No thanks.
  • 17 0
 honestly, my biggest concern is that with all the crazy VC funding pinkbike is going to have free monster energy drinks and haribo in the break room to keep the employees happy but Levy will OD.
  • 17 1
 @hatton, that’s a very valid concern. We probably need to get him one of those blood glucose monitors just in case.
  • 2 0
 @mikekazimer: We’ll need an AXS version tied to his climb switch.
  • 2 0
 @Altron5000: Websites cost a lot more than just hosting, after you add up gear purchases, travel, payment to the writers…. It is a small business, not just the html.
  • 6 2
 @TheR: Businesses only have to grow or die when the vultures, ahem, VCs descend on their industry looking for anything they can do to generate returns for their rich LPs. It is possible for businesses to stay small and sustainable, and these are the businesses that consumers tend to like the best. But it's only possible if investors aren't too engaged with their industry or location because once the VCs get in the important of money into one big competitor to acquire or kill all the small ones to generate that ROI. When they're done the industry and consumers are worse off, of course, but they don't give a f*ck about that.
  • 5 1
 @charliewentoutside: “Only have to grow or die when…” It doesn’t matter why. The reality is a condition exists where they better rise up and compete. You can wish it were otherwise, but it’s not.
  • 1 0
 @Unrealityshow: yeah like our chocolate!
  • 96 1
 Hopefully Outside covers therapy as part of their health insurance plan
  • 33 3
  • 2 2
  • 73 0
 Haven’t listened yet, but I’m hoping this is the announcement of Levy and Kazimer leaving to start their own site, Mikebike.
  • 1 0
  • 8 0
 Mikebike would have one hell of a YouTube following.
  • 4 0
 As a Mike myself, I approve this move.
  • 2 0
 I would join that...
  • 10 0
  • 11 0
 hey Mikers!
  • 1 0
 @Unrealityshow: this is what I'm genuinely hoping for
  • 53 2
 Couple things:

1. “Hey outers” no, absolutely not, never again.

2. “The comments were pretty mixed” nah they were pretty consistent

3. In all seriousness I’m glad y’all took this podcast to discuss and inform about the change. I’m optimistic but the realist in me has many concerns
  • 33 2
 1. Agreed but you know I'm still gonna Wink
2. There were consistently savage, but I'm trying to be positive haha
3. PB is all community, so we're gonna try to bring you along on the ride as we find out what's happening. I'm optimistic as well, especially after the podcast we just recorded with our new owner. It'll drop next week and has all sorts of information in it.
  • 10 0
 @mikelevy: 1. We know you can’t be controlled, please stay that way through this transition. Stay weird buddy!
  • 5 0
 @mikelevy: product reviews were conspicuously absent from the list of things that wouldn’t be paywalled.
  • 4 0
 There’s 3 kinds of people in the world, those who can count and those who can’t
  • 1 0
 @mgrantorser: I noticed that too. I took a look at Betabike site (also owned by Outside) and a lot of product reviews were for members only. But I've bought my last two bikes based upon @mikekazimer 's reviews, and I'll cough up for access to that. I hear what Brian is saying regarding job security and review independence too. Friends in print media have lost their jobs over the last ten years, and one, a motoring journalist, was under increasing pressure to write positive reviews so the paper didn't lose ad revenue.
  • 1 0
 @DizzyNinja: wait a second... is this joke like a paywall for people who can do simple math?
  • 4 0
 @DizzyNinja: there are 10 kinds of people. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.
  • 1 0
 @fruitsd79: I, Oh, nevermind...
  • 1 0
 @mgrantorser: Right!!!!!!?!! In all honesty i don't care about any content except the reviews. @brianpark @mikelevy @mikekazimer please don't do this. Put all the racing content including your "team" you want to start, all opinion articles, even your grim donut stuff behind the "Wall". That's the "fun" stuff you want to do any way right? Just not the reviews!
  • 20 0
 I'm curious to give this a listen to and was wondering/hoping you guys would do this episode... I have appreciated the candid discussions and additional insight the podcast provides!
  • 18 1
 Gotta keep you guys in the loop!
  • 6 0
 @rclugnut agree. Been waiting for this podcast to drop.
  • 6 0
 @mikelevy: I hope the purchase gets you guys a nice raise!
  • 15 0
 @paulwatt: More car parts on the way Wink
  • 4 0
 @mikelevy: time to start the Project Binky Levy with all your money you don't know what to do with
  • 4 1
 Carefully curated*

Not candid, lmao
  • 5 1
 @nvranka: Were we careful about not saying anything stupid? Of course. But the discussion was based on a list of bullet points, as always, not anything structured.
  • 21 0
 Outside employees of the month get the front parking space and an "I brake for paywalls' bumper sticker.
  • 16 0
 We'd sponsor this bumper sticker... lol
  • 16 0
 I'm less worried about free and more worried about what it means, in the long run, for shifts in content/accessibility. Pinkbike is no longer at the top of their control chain. I'd love to be optimistic about what that means as it will open up more resources but in the long run will likely reduce bottom up influence and adaptability. Also, Outside didn't buy it because they are lovely people who are just enthralled by the antics of those on this site and just gosh darn love bikes- they bought it because they predicted it would better their bottom line. I enjoy the site, plan on continuing to do so, but am a little less optimistic. I also won't be participating in any more surveys. Outside can pay me (us?) for that info if they want it. I sure hope all the editors and staff benefit from this as they should- PB was a great thing and they made it what it was. Whether the marionette strings continue to allow it to remain that or not is less sure IMO.
  • 1 0
 When I first started using PB I thought the polls were fun. In the last year, they seem like such an explicit data grab. The answers aren't really telling users about the community - they're telling companies about consumer habits. You're right, they can pay me for that data. Or more likely I'll just fuck with the polls and pick weird answers
  • 14 0
 loving the Ben Cathro (pay this man) "how to" video series, more of this. Additional suggestions...more field test videos (like the budget bike comparisons) but with different builds/setups (if Outside is opening its coffers to expand upon PB content, there should be money to spend here).
  • 8 0
 I have to second any and all Cathro content. There's something so relatable, genuine about Ben that I'll watch him talk about just about anything because I don't ever feel like he's trying to yank my chain. His track commentary and the ghost comparisons are amazing!
  • 6 0
 @nvranka: I mean, I'm not a super strong rider, but pretty much everyone else is... Matt Beer is a former Canadian National DH champion, Sarah Moore is a former World Cup XC racer, Christina Chappetta has a top 6 elite EWS result, Henry Quinney has the FKT of New Zealand's South Island, Alicia is a top 20 EWS racer, Tom/Kaz/Seb/Levy/Dan/etc. are all excellent riders, and Cathro of course too.

@SATN-XC @mikealive definitely have some big Cathro plans in the works. Fingers crossed!
  • 2 0
 @brianpark: Hey Brian, I saw the update on this podcast that "user generated content from the community" will not be put behind a paywall. I understand that Cathro content, reviews, PB academy, etc. probably will be, and I get it, but what about stuff like Remy Metallier's videos? Or other edits from teams/riders that are just posted on the site?
  • 16 0
 Behold, Pinkbike peasants! We, the Outside nobility, have come here to claim new territory and collect taxes!
  • 17 4
 I'm far more pissed & worried when a podcast doesn't drop for a week (even if its was about UFO's which I care nothing about) than I am Outside picked up PB. I listened to this week's podcast twice before commenting (didn't comment on the press-release), have followed PB for over a decade (tho subscribed only 2019)... and I don't really know how PB stays afloat with all of us suckin at the teat like we do, so with the demise of Bike.mag (subscribed since the beginning) I honestly don't mind subscribing. Honestly Pinkbike is better - would be supreme if there was just a monthly mag to get & hold onto vs everything sliding off into the ether !

Perspective: add up the value of bikes currently owned by just the commenters on podcast comment section and I'll bet we're looking at several $100K (US). Add up the coffee, beer, burgers, bike parts & accessories, jerseys & gear - whatever it is that's really luxury stuff - that we're all dropping mad coin on for just a day or a week and its substantial - yet we're whining that PB could be maybe subscription? OH NO, ITS THE PAYWALL!

I'd rather PB be free to the world really. Its a resource unlike any other - its my facebook & insta without all douchery & Russian propo & pandering me-me-me of those formats all in one great site & I want that to stay the same. But I'd honestly be fine to pay a tad money to keep it this way - would NOT pay money if it got douchey & corporate - and its such an integral part of my bike world, views, and thinking that Imma give the PB bro's & bra's a break, wait & see if it gets better or sucks-ass and then bitch about it or quit. Til then - just chill out & cut 'em some slack.
  • 10 0
 Thanks for the awesome comment, much appreciated. I'll do my best to keep PB as un-corporate as possible Wink
  • 2 1
 I would be happy to pay a (modest) subscription for all the amazing content. I have used the field test video’s and reviews EXTENSIVELY while researching my last few bikes.
Even better if the subscription came with a once or twice yearly photo issue that was mailed out. Nothing beats a good old glossy magazine to keep you going through the winter.
Outside has to have the infrastructure in place to make that possible???
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy: I doubt it'll be a problem. PB & you guys are badass, even w/ the UFO & bigfoot conspiracy stuff ( !) and I think that the age of social media / instant info has most uf trapped in the 2 Minutes Hate responses & grandiose commentary (self included) without thinking clearly - then having comment hangover & regret later.
  • 1 0
 @simonconde: Absolutely - and more to the point - how many of us blow $50-75 just to ride park for one day or $30-40 on beers & food after that ride but oh my f*cking god - pay that $40 for a PB (or actual magazine subscription) $20 a year for Trailforks (or whatever it may be if PB has a subscription model) and all-the-sudden PB is are sellouts? f*cking please
Correct me if I'm wrong but 99.9% of PB users have long smashed through the multi-$1000 dollar "paywall" on any single bikes we own now (not even counting the legions of bikes we've already owned) but we we bitch like babies when its $10 or even $50 to help pay the salaries & expenses of PB and the staff via a subscription? I don't get it. Even if it was $100 year thats beans - I'd do that. All of us are making coin and they should too.

My real question is why hasn't there been subscription level anything or any number or paid actions via PB for the last 10 years? I don't think it has to be the main platform for it - obviously they get paid without it - but I could think of 10-15 different paid actionable items PB could do for that hasn't been on the radar so far. All this bitching from bike riders around the globe who work FOR corporations, buy endless corporate produced product & services - the very production & shipping industries that produce & ship these bikes - is weak & petty. I have no interest in Outside Mag as a product, but I'm not particularly concerned they now own PB - as long as they don't turn it into GQ, I'm happy to chip in.
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy: just don't drop the idea of the UFO podcast please. I'll pay the paywall if necessary
  • 1 0
 @Narro2: Never! We'll have to do one at some point as they're always at the front of my mind. Did you hear about Project Galileo? Very cool and hopefully some of these traditional scientists will pull their heads out of their asses and look at the sky:
  • 13 0
 I have faith in the PB team, and Outside, that they'll keep the essence of Pinkbike intact. The community here is very special. But so is the incredible amount of work that the PB team has put in for decades. Great job and congratulations. Excited to see where you go from here!
  • 13 1
 I had no idea that Pay to Win testing was that common. As journalists first and foremost, and now ones with a big organisation at your back, I feel like that's a story you could now be telling? Time to name and shame the sites and magazines that operate that model and even more so the manufacturers that require it. Who can we trust?
  • 18 4
 Hmm, I'm not convinced that's a good idea. The media landscape is a super difficult place to live, and I know how hard other people are working just to get by and create original content. While I'm not a fan of pay-to-play (or win, of course), it's simply the point that things have gotten to. Also, Pinkbike has made all sorts of mistakes in the past and I don't think it's my/our place to shit on what other people are doing. We've been super fortunate to learn along the way Smile That said, I'd like to see those pay-to-play reviews be more transparent, ie "This brand advertises, hence we have to review their bike."
  • 21 0
 @mikelevy: I'm not convinced it's a good idea either.. but isn't that what makes it fun..!

Seriously though, assuming we agree we don't want the industry to be like that, how does it ever change? The smaller publications/sites are stuck, there's now a system in place where the manufacturers are interfering with their neutrality, but the general bike buying public doesn't know, so there's no pressure to change?

But, if somebody called out a bike manufacturer and said "Brand Z pays to have its bikes win reviews", well, that brand would be off my list forever, because that's 100% scummy and any company that operates like that, well that's not a company I'd want to be trying to make a warranty claim with. Companies work super hard for their reputations, feels like nobody would want to be called out on that.

So, then maybe the manufacturers stop doing it, the smaller sites are no longer being pressured and ultimately the consumers get better bikes sooner, because sites are able to recommend the best bike and other manufacturers have to raise their game?

But, it seems like the only way for this change to happen is for an organisation who's well backed enough to not be beholden to the advertisers' dime to take the massive LED lightbar of doom and shine it in some dark corners of the bike industry?

That's just my thoughts anyway, it all comes from a place of love for both pinkbike and our fantastic sport!
  • 3 0
 @Woody25: so much yes
  • 4 2
 @mikelevy: All I want is to read the Specialized Status review Smile
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy: thankyou
  • 3 0
 @mikelevy: That’s one side of it, but coversely there are bunches of folks (and not all dentists) getting scammed to buy bikes based on unethical reviews.
  • 2 0
 i think a lot of these problems stem from influencers in social media. I mainly heard of such behaviour in the PC/Tech world. Companies are picking up on this trend too, some are expecting great reviews, others trying to dictate what you can talk about.

Hardware unboxed, a smaller australian yt tech review channel had 2 companies trying to basicly blackmail them for a positive review. But they made it public and created a full blown shitstorm for nVidia and LG, who backed down eventually.

From the companies pov i kind of understand it, if you have no moral or integrity. Low investment, noncritical "review" = add.
Compare that with a real review, where other products are compared, or worse, a tester like Levy would moan about the needed lockout lever... Big Grin

I guess my point is, you should not bow to the pressure of said companies, if you value your integrity and have respect for the readers / buyers. But i also understand why this might be more difficult in an industry where everybody knows everybody. What other people do doesn't really concern me, but companies that act that way should be called out.

@mikelevy admitting that it's the point things have gotten to is disheartening tbh
Does this mean we can't trust pb reviews?
  • 4 1
 @whoopsy: not sure what you mean about trusting PB reviews. None of ours are pay to play/win, our full time tech editors have no other industry affiliations, and we do our best to be as objective as possible. For sure we all have conscious and unconscious biases, friendships in the industry, etc., so we definitely encourage people to take ALL reviews with a grain of salt. We talked about it a bunch in one of our first podcasts:
  • 2 0
 @whoopsy: in certain cases, I just look at who the customers are (who pays the bills) and who is the product for sale (who is getting stuff for free). It would help if professional review sites had a bit of transparency in this regard (independent accounting breaking down sources of revenue as a start). The whole “trust us” has unfortunately been abused in the industry to the point that it is meaningless.

“Influencer” is just a common misspelling of “shill”.
  • 5 2
 @brianpark: So if that's really the case, ball up and call out the cheaters, otherwise, you're just part of the problem.
  • 1 0
i wasn't insinuating that pbs reviews are bought, just worried it might go that way in the future. Glad to hear thats not going to happen

And of course, i always compare reviews from multiple sources if i have a real intention of buying sth.

(that said, kazimer is pretty much my guy here Big Grin )
  • 2 0
 @brianpark: I know at this point you can say that and I have always appreciated that about PB. I love that you will have new resources and look forward to seeing what you do with them. As my Dad always told me- "nothing is free" and one of my questions around the future landscape of PB will be that now you will have "corporate oversite" that you didn't before. Let's say Outside, not PB, creates a sweet partnership with lets say Specialized or Trek or Giant etc. and says "hey guys, so this is a big opportunity ($$$$) for us and if you can help us keep this relationship it will mean more money for the field tests each year and next year we have made an agreement to do the field tests from the Specialized test track and you all get new Specialized bikes..." I just think these things get harder now to manage. All the best and looking forward to continue to support... at least until I see what the paywall scheme looks like... and potentially still after that...because "nothing is free" and especially not good things.
  • 9 0
 Always enjoy the peeks behind the curtain. Looking forward to growth, we heard from Brian what he'd like to see in a year, and in a comment somewhere about going to races, but what about Levy and Kaz? What do each of you want to see in a year and what more long term thing would be exciting for you to see that may have been written off as a pipe dream in the past?
  • 24 0
 I've been very happy with how our Field Tests have been going, and I'm excited to keep making them even better. Obviously, more Grim Donut-like projects would be fun, and I'm overdue for some video battles with Levy, but overall there's not one massive change that I'd like to see. We've got a really strong crew of editors right now, and I'm optimistic we can keep making really good content in the months and years to come.
  • 25 0
 I'm also stoked with how things are going right now, especially as the editorial team is growing and we're introducing new characters like Henry Quinney and Matt Beer. We just wrapped up filming for the next Field Test and those guys killed it.

I'd like to see Grim Donut V2 (currently in the works), get back to some Kaz vs. Levy content, and more podcasts. I love podcasts. We're also working on a new video studio and there's a chance we'll get some serious test lab equipment.
  • 23 0
 I’d like to do more investigations and analysis personally. For example, I’m incredibly proud of the ground and stories we broke on the State of the Sport Survey but truthfully when we’re measured against page views alone it makes it hard to justify investing that much work into it or something like it again
  • 8 1
 @jamessmurthwaite, @mikelevy, @mikekazimer:

I'm loving hearing the plans.

I love the field tests, and all of the regular reviews as well. Its what keeps me coming back.

But I really like the idea of getting scientific about things that kind of have a "general consensus" among the community (or at least its a commonly repeated phrase).

Like... what affect does chainstay length changes/differences make on otherwise very similar/identical bikes (Commencal Meta TR, compared to the Privateer 141 for instance)? Especially for different sizes/skills of riders. Is there a preference/trend?

The brake rotor size debate. Larger front? Larger rear? Same size? Setup the same bike with an array of rotor sizes, and give opinions on feel, and as much data as possible (temps, glazing/overheating effects, etc).

With the whole idea for that sort of article being to give people some data/reasoning to use as a framework to develop their own preferences for their riding style and terrain. Instead of just repeating things they've seen online, or heard their buddy say.
  • 4 0
 @jamessmurthwaite: Shame on me for leaving you out of the question, thanks for chiming in!
  • 3 0
 @ocnlogan: I'll second everything here, perhaps some of this will come with the lab that was eluded to?
  • 2 0
 @ocnlogan: I'd like to see more on the relationship between the reach:CS and femur:tibia ratios, not to mention the bar width/inter-nipple distance paradigm.
  • 2 0
 @jamessmurthwaite: it was great work - but if you’re looking for views i think it suffered from the Star Wars/Disney purchase and the over saturation of content in a short period of time.
  • 3 0
 Its been said before but I'll repeat. The field tests are great, but limited. Hopefully with more resources you can test more bikes but even still with so many options its hard to relate without some sort of cornerstone. Like a bike I have ridden so I can say, well I know what that rides like and they say bike X climbs better. Something between the top gear lap time and the old chili peppers so that it was easier for us to quantify how "good" or "bad" a bike is at a thing.
  • 8 0
 @dudegetabike: For sure, always looking to improve. This time around we had a bunch of enduro bikes and brought the '19 Specialized Enduro to compare them all to.
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy: I hope you meant 2020 Enduro ( which I bought based on your field test )
  • 1 0
 @Colinofthewoods: Doh! Yup, I meant 2020.
  • 3 0
 @jamessmurthwaite: The survey you guys did was a great piece of journalism and jobs like that shouldn't be measured simply in terms of ad clicks.
More than anything else PB has put out, it's cemented the site's reputation as the MTB content outlet "of note", and as a (sometimes) serious and impartial source of info.
That kind of influence with the industry, athletes and readers is impossible to buy and I hope @brianpark has already got you thinking about next year's survey. Perhaps an anonymous survey of brand managers, etc. to unpick some of the issues and myths around the industry?
I don't know if it adds any weight to my feedback, but I was a news journalist for many years and was impressed with the ambition and execution behind that survey.
  • 8 0
 I'm surprised that the Pinkbike team is surprised users aren't happy about this acquisition. Something that is currently free and that many of us use daily will come at some sort of a cost in the future. The "capital to improve content and therefore you should be happy" line is pretty weak.

I get that it's a company and they can (and should) do what is best for the owners, employees, etc. but Pinkbike has billed itself as a mountain bike community and generates content, in part, from that community so it feels like a community resource that just sold to a giant, distant, faceless corporation.
  • 13 0
 Brian, James, and Kaz weren't surprised (as per this podcast) but I'll admit I was a bit taken aback by the sheer volume of comments. Then I thought about it for a minute realized how big this community is and how much we all care - the concern makes complete sense and I hope we alleviated some of that in this episode. Definitely let me know when we turn into a giant, distant faceless corporation, though! I don't think that's ever going to happen Smile
  • 5 13
flag valleytroll (Jul 23, 2021 at 14:27) (Below Threshold)
 @mikelevy: it happened
  • 10 3
 I still hear people complaining about the TF subscription, I'm pretty sure most of those people are still using it free without too many issues. I'd argue that TF is better than it was when it was free. Change is inevitable, I think it's at least worth a look at what the paid platform will look like.
  • 2 0
 TF was pretty garbage at first. But the UI has gotten better this year. Still plenty of improvements to be made but I'm a lot happier with it in 2021 than in 2019/20.
  • 3 0
 TF provides maps and trails (similar to other app's on the market) depending on area you ride either have good or bad coverage;
People who complain about Outside - it is about outside content itself, either paid or free like:

'Ski pole toilet plunger, you did not know you need it'
  • 5 0
 Im amazed TF was free for so long, its the best and easily worth $20-$30 per year or whatever pittance they charge.
  • 11 0
 I have an inny, can I still listen and comment?
  • 11 0
 “Hey Outers!”

  • 8 0
 Don't let the haters get to you guys. They are just vocal because they love something and they are afraid of losing it. Keep being passionate about what you do and the community will follow.
  • 6 0
 Great podcast as usual. It gave good insight into how you guys feel and what your hopes are. I'm bummed a Canadian creation that was really cool got bought up by an American behemoth, as that never seems to end well. I really hope you guys get a big raise so you can afford to live well in one of the most expensive places in the world.
  • 8 0
 @mikelevy keep up the good work on raw and unfiltered opinions. The world does not need more things smoothed over for easier consumption.
  • 8 2
 Seriously. Explain the math. Pinkbike now has to pay its staff, pay outsides staff, and pay outsides shareholders. I’d argue there isn’t much room to grow their user base. Either pinkbike content will get worse, more expensive, or much more likely, both.
  • 6 1
 Lol that’s not how this works. The outside staff already have jobs dude. Why would pinkbike need to pay them?
  • 1 0
 @lefthandohvhater: Pinkbike will be Outside's second largest community base (right after Outside Magazine itself). You think all the other smaller titles will subsidize PB? Outside bought PB, because they think they can make money off it, probably they thought it was mismanaged and a little bit of management and business model changes can bring in the $.
  • 6 1
 I hope there isn't a paywall but I'm going to keep coming to PB as long as the content is similar to what it's been and as long as I'm not priced out of it. Aside from liking that I don't pay for PB now, I also hope that Outside doesn't influence the content and make it more like Outside Magazine, which I would barely ever glance at if it were free as it seems like it's a vehicle for advertisers and something trying to be important.

PB is awesome because it's run by people who love goofing around in the woods on bikes, and is focused on talking about goofing around in the woods on bikes (I'm stealing some of your words). Keep it that simple and it will be an escape, just like biking is an escape. Even when you're all totally wrong in your views and reviews, I enjoy reading and especially enjoy the podcast. Now get back to talking about bikes instead of the online media business. Thanks for all you do.
  • 7 2
 My biggest piss off is the work that has gone into trail forks, and now pinkbike has profited from what was originally a crowd sourced community project. That stings a lot to think that data from the backs of all the volunteers into line someones pocket and the thought of all the sensitive trails and ride log data to be available to a subscriber fucking sucks full stop. Party foul and karma sucks.
  • 5 0
 I think I sit at the opposite end of all the people who are scared of the looming paywall. About a year or so ago I was watching videos by Christina and Ben and on top of all the other great content I was thinking this is so good I would be prepared to pay for it. Then a couple of months later I was browsing the merch page and realised you could pay for it, so I did. It is about the same as a magazine subscription and every great original PB video or feature I watch/read/listen to, I think proudly "I helped pay for that' and not just by consuming advertising.

If it all turns to crap, I'll stop paying and go elsewhere. Also I'm not one for bad mouthing people generally, but if Outside do screw it up I'll probably be on here cursing them and their mothers. Until then I'm gonna ride my bike and enjoy the PB content (and maybe a few other things) - life can be f*£@*$g awesome if you let it!
  • 4 0
 Glad you all feel some stability improvements are coming from having a bigger owner. I hope they let you do your thing and support you. I like you all and I hope that Outside understands that your writing and actual voices are what keep some of us coming back.
  • 4 0
 Good luck. I've been through two acquisitions as a consultant. Both times, there were promises that not much would change and people would benefit. I gave it a chance but left (in both cases) within several months when those promises turned out to be lies...big lies. Predictably, it was all about the bottom line. I've heard the same story from so many friends in different industries. Maybe this will work out differently for PB. In the end, if it doesn't, I'll have one less thing that'll take up time in my busy life.
  • 3 0
 Been through several Buy Outs, Mergers and a Hostile Takeover. None of them turned out well so forgive my skepticism. Do you remember that BS about "Moving the Cheese" they trotted out in the '90's? At least they didn't churn that bald faced lie back out.

I'll stick around around for a bit, partly out of hope, and partly out of morbid curiosity. We'll see.
  • 5 1
 I am open to a Paywall as long as the Quality and Quantity of the content increases dramatically. I am not saying is bad right now, i am just trying to say that there is always opportunities to be improve content.

I honestly think the Grim Donut is a good direction on innovation for the website, both intros of the 2 videos are topnotch quality, every time i see them i feel like watching something out of Netflix, and if we are to pay it needs to be one whole 10 episode season per year. Not just 2 episodes every blue moon.

Also a series like Drive to Survive for the DHWC Season, then one or 2 years latter add the XC or viceversa. That one in conjunction with Redbull would be a totally winning formula.

If Pinkbike is in that direction I will definitely pay, not Netflix or Disney+ levels of $$$ but I would pay something.
  • 4 0
 I just feel like someone should say even though there were thousands of negative comments a lot of us (pinkers, outers, bikers, mikers) didn't comment and are happy to see pinkbike growing and supported!

Good job to Brian and the other earthlings at pinkbike!
  • 1 0
 I seem to remember many of the positive comments got a LOT of upvotes too.
  • 7 0
 Listening... Readying sausage fingers....
  • 6 3
 Why is the bike world so against change. If you’ve been around long enough you will have seen a lot of changes come and go. Jesus, the first time I saw a v brake I thought they’d never catch on and that my onza h20 cantis where way better………. Stuff always changes and things always move on.
  • 2 0
 I think the bike world is also against when things are the same* ('looks like a session'), maybe they're just pro being angry.

* Except DJ bikes, which all look the same and no one seems to mind**.

** possibly DJ riders smoke more pot.
  • 3 0
 You take the blue pill or the red pill. One keeps the outside overlords happy, the other comes with a severance package. Great for the founders hopefully they got a big paycheck. My concern is we've been drinking at the local micro brewery and it just got bought by Coors. They promise to make the beer the same but just a matter of time before it gets turned into Coors. Hope I am wrong.
  • 5 1
 It's kind of ironic, because I would have been willing to subscribe to pinkbike before they sold out (assuming you would benefit from some kind of increase of a service rendered). Certainly not now.
  • 3 0
 I dont know how many people i speak for, but i would be more ok with a subscription or paywall if i knew the money went to pinkbike and not outside. If pinkbike came out and said, "hey we need more money", id be ok with that. Its the fact that ill have to give my money to a business i dont like to access the content i enjoy.
  • 5 2
 Juat listened to the podcast. For what it's worth...
1. I'd take a paywall over commercial influence on content any day. I'm not sure why the paywall is the story.
2. A media company buying another media company is significantly less troublesome than a media company buying a portion of one of our elite level competitions. No one seemed that fussed about that (I guess the paywall word wasnt used)
3. I'm surprised the Amaury story dodnt make it into the news section. There was some discussion a few months ago about pinkbike supporting minority groups in mountain biking. One of the biggest names in our sport putting cornrows on his hair and then using the n word is a big deal. The negative comments on that article are, frankly, more important than the negative comments on the Outside article.
  • 3 0
 @Bobadeebob the Pierron news broke after we recorded the podcast but we’ll for sure be covering it next episode.
  • 1 0
 I'm with you on item 1. I can think of one other MTB media outlet whose content has leaned heavily towards selling merch and a high portion of video content with obvious product endorsements over the last couple of years, and I would have rather a paywall than that.
  • 3 0
 I want to be positive, but go over to Rock and Ice for example, and try to read a review (all are behind the paywall). On Outside .com you can read "reviews" but they are just vehicles for Outside to include affiliate links to sell stuff. I want to give PB a chance under Outside, but I have seen how Outside/Pocket Media treated all their other acquisitions and it's hard to believe PB is big enough to get treated any differently than all the other titles swept up recently.
  • 3 0
 I would like to know what will happen with the Trailforks pro memberships? I signed up during the period that would be $17.99/yr for life. I certainly hope this stays the same for those of us that signed up during that period, OR gets cheaper. Thanks
  • 5 0
 Opinion based question: Will we ever see USD single crowns become a more common option?
  • 6 0
 Unlikely - the Marzocchi RAC and RockShox's RS1 didn't stick around very long... They sure do look neat, though.
  • 2 0
 I'm sad to see the acquisition, but only because I look at PB and CT as the LEADERS of the bike media world. Outside will bring capital and more exposure, sure, but I come to PB/CT for the content provided, because it's already the best.
  • 7 1
 We're aiming for that not to change, aside from more of that content Smile
  • 3 0
 @mikelevy: I'd be more enthused if PB/CT acquired Outside. Not the other way around. I'll hang around to see where this goes.
  • 6 3
 “ User generated content from the community, brands, and athletes”

So the adverts from the marketing departments / sponsored riders will stay free but not the actual content on the website
  • 4 0
 User generated content is all good and fine, but a big part why I go to pb are reviews and the nerding out about bikes. If those are behind a paywall I’m out.
  • 2 0
 I subscribe to outside+. It is not worth it, their platform is hard to navigate and their perks are meaningless. They give you manufactures discounts for 10-20% when a die hard MTBer knows where to get 40-50% off.
I hope the staff at PB can help them get it sorted.

The reason I check PB everyday is for their content. They have a lot compared to other sites. If PB goes to a subscription service I will pay but the content will have to go up even more.
  • 2 0
 Hi Pinkbike team. Just as when reading our bikes, we stick our neck out and take a risk to feel alive and evolve. Pinkbike needs to do the same. When I became a pinky it was for the gear reviews and articles. This s still a reason for visiting Pinkbike but the primary reason now when i think of it is for the personalities working there (you). I am not going anywhere....
  • 2 0
 I think one thing that amped up the negative feelings about all of this was how unexpected it was.

As far as I can tell, there are a few general categories of enthusiast media out there. There are the ones that are obviously hobbies/side gigs for people who have other sources to pay the bills. There are others that already charge subscriptions or otherwise get funding directly from their followers. Some are a marketing arms of retailers, like what Revzilla does in the motorcycle world. Most of the rest fall into this weird "How can they keep the lights on and keep putting out this kind of work?" type of entities where it's obvious that one day they will either need to sell to an outfit like Outside or fold. When that happens, my reaction is much less emotional. Of course it was going to happen one day.

With Pinkbike though, things did seem different. It appeared that is was one of the rare ones that was able build a successful business as an independent entity. It has the perfect mix of being both a media source and, well, a social media platform that appeared to be valuable enough to advertisers that they could make it in the online media game. It was the one that was hiring the talent that other places couldn't afford to pay and the ones buying other bike websites or launching services like Trailforks. I think the shock of learning that it was Pinkbike of all websites that had gotten hoovered up buy a larger business that really set people off.

All that corporate speak in that Bicycle Retailer story didn't help anything either.
  • 2 0
 QUESTION: So Bernard Kerr wins his third Rebull Hardline. I'd call that pretty dominant. I'd also call hardline the hardest timed MTB event in the world. Why Aren't guys like Kerr and Fairclough as dominant in UCI world cup DH events? Obviously there are some massive features at hardline that dont exist anywhere else in racing. Should the UCI world cup move more in that direction where for a lot of guys its a challenge to get down this ABSOLUTELY WILD course. Or does the the super precise detail of hunting for 10ths over a plethora of line choices make for better racing? I like seeing the best in the world pushed to their absolute riding limits. But maybe Hardline is as much spectacle as race What are your thoughts?
  • 1 0
 I get the reasons for the pay wall but I'm not totally convinced that ad content will be reduced if one is put in place. Every company says that does this says ad content will be reduced and then eventually changes their tune saying membership dues can't cover the costs. And I understand this isn't the staff at pinkbikes choice, but would be done by Outside. Curiously waiting to see what happens, but I have my doubts. Hopefully if there is a paywall it will be worth it.
  • 2 1
 My only real issue with Outside acquiring pinkbike is that I just have to believe there was a cheaper way for them to learn how to properly mount Manitou forks, and one that wouldn't involve ultimately turning pinkbike into just another corporate web rag... but that's business I guess.
  • 1 0
 I'm not a huge fan of media consolidation. Eventually there will be a dip that leads to synergistic redundancies, but in the meantime I'm happy for the security that this brings you all and look forward to more interesting content. Also, like most people that ride bikes I'm pretty cheap, I would most likely pay a reasonable amount for content from PB
  • 2 1
 I might pay for a subscription if PB can take more of an active effort to enhance the Buy & Sell forum to protect buyers and sellers.

I'd like to see vids of you guys breaking down, servicing, & rebuilding test components, as well as some more hacks.

I hope you all get raises and elevate your jobs / roles so that it becomes a truly sustainable lifestyle career. I've
gone through 2 M&A's in 2 years, and changed FT employers 4
times before that, and each time it helped me financially. Capitalism is not such a terrible thing if one is ethical and smart about it.

Good luck to you all @ PB. Now fix my fantasy teams so win some cool $h1z
  • 1 0
 No need to get mad at Pinkbike, and no need from Pinkbike to ask people to stay water down their comments. This is 2021, for better and for worse, and the sale to Outside is something that happens to businesses everywhere everyday.

It's also in part a business decision made to help Pinkbike's employees get better work condition it seems, which is totally understandable. But the passionate reader's comments are also understandable and represent those people's authentic feelings, coming straight from the heart. If you want to take the pulse of your readership, it might be harsh sometimes, but there it is. Both sides are covered in the comments though, especially on today's posts. All ages and all kinds of people comment, this is a snapshot of your community right now.

People who don't want to pay can get still get their reviews and entertainment fix at many free places if they want. Even if "pay to play" reviews exist elsewhere, it's easy to gather info from multiple sources and still find the real reviews and fine details on forums, by asking other users, etc. If people want to pay for the future "exclusive" content to come on Pinkbike (everything that's not user, team or athlete-made content it seems), good for them, but sorry, I won't.

To add to the end of this podcast's analogy, in the 90's/early 2000s, I used to buy 1-2 bike magazines for 5-10$/month (BikeMag, DirtRag or MBAction). Now I pay 50$/month for my subscription to internet, and like 30$ more for my cell phone data, which is how I get my mtb information these days (not including Netflix and other entertainment sources). It's like a huge 80$/month magazine subscription(s) filled with ads everywhere, people tracking and gathering my data to sell it to companies, places to buy parts, etc. I won't pay an additional 5-10$/month for each website's subscription on top of that, sorry. Back in the days there were like 3-5 magazines, now there's millions of websites. No way I can pay a subscription to all of the ones I like.

All in all, it's sad to see this happen, but it was bound to happen. Long live Pinkbike and I'll still come back to check the free stuff from time to time. Sincerely, good luck with the future endeavours and al the best to the team!

P.S.: Thanks for the podcast episodes, they're a great listen and keep em coming (for free if you can)!
  • 1 0
 I won’t pay for content behind the paywall. I’m not mad about it and many people will. I used to read the magazines in the store till people stopped me. I don’t pay for the nyt or the post etc and I get better news and content anyway. Essentially I’ll just waste less time reading/watching about 90% of the products I’m not going to buy. I’m not mad though and I wish y’all well. Too many content creators that I can check out for just watching an ad. Things change and some people will pay for content and some won’t.
  • 4 0
 Please for the love of everything keep the Pinkbike Academy free...

or I’ll HAVE to pay for the subscription
  • 1 0
 I actually managed to miss the original article, so the pod was the first I heard about this!
I'm genuinely concerned, but am also willing to pay for ADDITIONAL content.
It may be a dirty word here, but I really like how GCN have added their premium content (which I have subscribed to and cancelled and then subscribed again), but kept what gave them the platform originally. Oddly, I'm not really a fan of their mtb content tbh.

PB, please don't keep all the stuff that created this opportunity (gear reviews mainly!) Behind a paywall and loose that audience that created the site as it is. They will quickly move elsewhere and suddenly there's a downward spiral
  • 1 0
 I just hope the PB staff are getting noticeable increases to how much money they take home, because I’m sure they deserve more than they get… but if that’s not the case, it would be impossible to be anything but unhappy about the situation.
  • 1 0
 Good listen... I look at your sister publication, Beta MTB.. About half of what I want to read goes up behind a paywall...But, they do leave most of the Bible of Bike Tests free.. Gotta bait the hook.. But, until I see things change, I'll keep coming by daily. I will admit, I was starting to wonder if the podcast was the first victim for a second there..

Maybe this additional staffing will get my resume considered now... One can hope... If that happens, you will hear me say " Subscribe for additional content " on a regular basis..
  • 1 0
 Bikes-related question: what's the very least you all could spend on a new rig and be totally happy/content? I was stoked watching the value bike tests, (I've only ever ridden a hardtail and have been saving to switch to dat full squish lyfe) but noted you were all pretty dissatisfied with the brakes and inconsistent fork performance on the value bikes. Would you get a value bike and pay to upgrade brakes/poor gear or just save a little longer and go up another $ bracket?

Good luck with the transition y'all! If it really sucks I guess I'll just spend more time out on my bike and less time on my phone looking at pb.
  • 1 0
 Question: I'm teaching myself how to build wheels. Now I'm pondering what kind of spokes should I pick for my next wheelset. Which spoke type offers the best weight/strength ratio? Does the riding discipline affect the selection? My riding is between light trail and mild enduro.
  • 1 0
 I mean if things like PB academy end up behind a paywall, I couldn't care less

My concern is that the reviews will become glossy and pointless. I don't want to see a PB gear addition, like I do every time I'm in the airport and see an Outside magazine. None of the "5 outdoor cameras reviewed and rated" where the bottom line is "I'm paid to say that they are all great. They are all great. One model became sentient and is currently working on Skynet, but its great, 4.5 out of 5 stars"

I wanna keep reading about the weird shit that @mikelevy does, the reviews where @mikekazimer makes me realize that I shouldn't be looking at this part or bike, or how Yoan Barrelli should leave Guerrilla Gravity and join Team Hortons. I wanna watch a field test event where a bike is called out for being crap, or behind the times.
  • 3 2
 Can yall discuss how quickly a large swath of the PB community exposed their subtle and not so subtle racism on that Amaury Pierron article???? We talk about barriers of entry in the sport all the time, and I think the micro-aggressions of mtb's mostly white community present a larger barrier for non-white people than we assume. Pretty disgusted by people jumping to justify/defend slavery on pink bike............
  • 3 0
 That was posted after we recorded the previous episode, but we'll for sure chat about it in this week's podcast.
  • 2 1
 @Atribecalledyamans : full agree with you there.
  • 1 0
 On another subject, love what you guys do, nothing is for free in this world so not so worried about paying something to get access to good content should that happen. As for podcast subject, maybe controversial but would be interested to hear a podcast on what qualifies someone as a bike tester? Don’t mean this in a negative way at all but have ridden with some testers who are super skilled riders but also some that are far less accomplished. When I read reviews of bikes I lean more towards where I think the test riders can really push the bikes but perhaps also getting a less experienced view is also great for beginners to relate too….?? How does it work?
  • 1 0
 Just wondering what happens to bikes or products where Pinkbike gives a 'first impressions' review, and says 'Stay tuned for a full review coming soon', and we never hear anything about it again? For example, the EXT Era fork...
  • 1 0
 Pretty sure that one is coming soon!
  • 1 0
 When the outside thing was originally announced, I can't remember if I commented or just upvoted other people's positive comments .... still, if you counting # of comments on the good/bad side, here's one from me. I'm relatively new to MTB (3yrs), and even newer to Pinkbike (~2 years), and I'm fine with it all. Yeah, I can picture how some things might go badly (for the content and for PB staff jobs), but [a] I don't see why I should get angry about it in advance, I don't see why you owe ME anything, and [c] it's your organization and you can do what you like with it. I'll hope for teh best for everyone.

Beyond empathy and objective arguments, the comments under the original press release tell us (newsflash!!) that some people just act like jerks on the internet.
  • 4 0
 7,000 feet in dense smoke?! save yourself, the eBike coverage can wait
  • 7 0
 18,000 feet! My lungs are pretty good with smoke tbh haha
  • 3 1
 @mikelevy: Undoubtedly - But with this kind of smoke, the only thing getting f*cked is your health. Burning wood at low temperatures releases some pretty carcinogenic chemicals.
  • 2 1
 @Nygaard: you haven't hung out around a camp fire....while simultaneously scaling a large mountain? You haven't lived.
  • 2 0
 @Nygaard: Yeah but it is free range, organic, hormone and pesticide free smoke....some folks will pay extra for that shit.
  • 2 0
 @mikelevy: but what KIND of smoke...? Not likely forest fire smoke Big Grin
  • 2 1
 When are you guys going to review the Commencal Clash? I am surprised you guys haven't yet with all the major changes they made to it this year, I wonder if next year's model will be high pivot with an idler?
  • 1 1
 I wish you guys good luck. I think Brian saying people are scared is incorrect. Users are upset or frustrated based on different perceptions of what mtb is and what Pinkbike may become. Scared no.

From a British (European?) perspective I don’t see great incentives from outside+ or a desire from the new owners that my profile be part of the user base
  • 6 6
 First, product reviews were conspicuously absent from the no pay wall comment. Second, I’d you think being penned by a hedge fund will make reviews less biased a have a bridge to sell you. Lastly @mikelevy, you have on several occasions defended reviews in the comments when I or others have suggested your sram or Santa Cruz reviews were Pay-for-win. Lastly, @Canadaaka, what happened to Trailforks will always be free, Anne the baked in data harvesting is just for trail advocacy?

I hope everyone got paid. I probably would have done the same in your shoes. But stop pretending this isn’t what it is. Pinkbike sold out to get paid pure and simple. At least have the decency to admit it to the community who have made this site what it is today.
  • 1 0
 who cares who runs things? as long as we can hear Levy prattling on about his mini, we are all set!! but seriously - if we can hear the podcast chat keep going - YES KEEP IT UP YOU GUYS ARE GREAT!
  • 4 1
 Hopefully outside will pay for PB staff tattoos.
  • 4 0
 I hope so too. I still have room for lots more.
  • 5 2
 so when is the PB clearance sale...need some souvenirs from the good days
  • 1 0
 What happened to VOD and POD? Are they coming back? Gone for good? Did I miss the article about this? Quite the long standing feature of pb to remove without a word about it
  • 2 0
 Just think about where your money is going if you subscribe, right into VC pockets.
  • 1 0
 Serious question here. Why has there been little to no coverage on BC/Canadian racing? Disappointed to see more hardline POVs than race results.
  • 1 0
 Canadian website or not, our focus is more global these days and it's difficult to have someone everywhere. Why didn't we cover the Brazilian national champs or the Polish national champs? I'm sure there are some amazing athletes and results there, but it's the same reason Smile In a perfect world, we'd have photo epics for all of those events - I would love that - but it's just not realistic.
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 @mikelevy it only took until you called us outers... that we realized we were pinkers all along :')
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 Can you name the "pay to play" outlets?
  • 4 4
 Pinkbike Wink
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 @MikeyMT: *Pinkbike after vc purchase.
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 JFC its a joke people.
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 Is Outside making them use the winky-smiley emoji? Classic Outside.
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 I have an 'Inny'.... 'Outies' scare me.
  • 3 2
 I'm good with the paywall if it means they stop blowing sram and specialized.
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 @mikelevy I especially like the part where you said you hoped you had e-levy-ated some of the concern!
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 Methinks they doth protest too much.
  • 1 3
 Remember when Trailforks changed to a Subscription model?

Remember some of us wondered why it wasn't and advertising model?

Remember some of us said the change was a dick move.

Remember some of you said "relax, pay up and shut up?"

Paywall time. Pay up and shut up.
  • 1 1
 Will Levy's raise finally give him enough money to buy a real car, or will he be stuck with that old rust bucket?
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 When you own a car like that it isnt coz you cant afford a boring-ass SUV its xoz you appreciate motoriing and you want a bit different.

Have you ever cornered a proper Mini?
Depends why you want a car, soccer mum SUV or make every commute a blast even at 40km/h
  • 1 0
 I love Levy’s mini. I couldn’t handle the impracticality and unreliability but that car is just fun
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 @Rubber-Buccaneer: Yup, and I'm sure it's not free to do all the work on it, gotta pay for the passion some how.
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 @valleytroll: whoosh
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 First paywall and Il be heading outside.
  • 3 6
 Haha had to make a podcast to justify yourselves.
Can ya ask cathro to move over to vital or is he in for a bigger pay check too?
All the good stuff will be behind a paywall. Pinkbike will lose viewers for this and you know it’s coming so why bother? To go to the next level and get paid more money. This sucks big time man
  • 2 2
 Hard lessons in monopoly capitalism are coming for us all unless we build other economic/social structures.
  • 1 0
 Uh, Levy ate my concerns?
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 We’ve been Outed.
  • 2 4
 It's not surprising that the commenters got so upset. The majority of mountain bikers are just as fragile and sensitive as road bikers.
  • 5 0
 I'm pretty sure the type of bike someone rides doesn't determine how upset they might be about something or other Wink
  • 1 0
 @mikelevy: All cyclists are fragile Wink
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 Hey *redacted*
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