Nerding Out: The Smallest Winning Margins in World Cup Downhill from 1997 to 2020

Jan 31, 2021

by Ed Spratt

Greg Minnaar had a strong race today to finish just over 2 seconds out of the medals.

After looking back at the largest winning margins in World Cup DH last year, we thought it would be interesting to go back through the history books at some of the smallest winning margins. Check out who managed to pull ahead by less than a second and take the top step of the podium from 1997 to 2019 below.

We have started at the 1997 season because race result data is not fully accurate or complete for the seasons from 1993 to 1996.

Unlike in our biggest winning margins article, which saw ACC dominate the list, the top ten smallest winning margins sees a wide variety of names. Only Steve Peat makes the list more than once with his wins in Vallnord 2009, Canberra 2009 and Mont-Sainte-Anne 2003. Interestingly the smallest winning margin for World Cup DH since 1997 comes in at a tie with both Fabien Barel and Chris Kovarik scraping wins but only 0.1 seconds.T hat's right Kovarik has both one of the smallest and largest winning margins in World Cup history.

Looking at winning margin percentages, it is once again very close at the top with Fabien Barel and Chris Kovarik joined by Steve Peat. Chris Kovarik comes just ahead with the smallest margin of 0.06%. The most recent addition to the smallest winning percentages is Loris Vergier's tight win at Maribor last year.

Whereas in our biggest winning margins article ACC stormed ahead with a huge 23 victories of over five seconds she falls behind quite a few riders in this list with only five wins of under one second. The rider coming out on top this time is Greg Minnaar who has won 12 of his 22 World Cup wins with a margin of under a second. Minnaar is closely followed by Loic Bruni on nine wins and Steve Peat at eight.

Next up we decided to break down the data by which venues have produced the closest racing over the years and surprisingly it is the longest course on the circuit Mont-Sainte Anne that comes out tops with 15 races coming in at under one-second difference. While it is one of the long-standing venues it is interesting that a longer courses can produce some of the tightest racing. Following Mont-Sainte-Anne is another classic venue of Maribor that has produced nine close races and tied in third are the bikepark tracks of Leogang and Lenzerheide where you might expect tighter racing.

Looking at a breakdown of the racing by year it is interesting that there is no overall pattern with some periods producing closer racing and other years having only a couple of tight races. The one thing that stood out to us was 2018 and 2019 producing a huge nine races each that fell within one second. This trend was interrupetd in 2020 but could we see it return this year if the full season of racing goes ahead?

Want to dig into the data? We've listed all the closest races since 1997 below:

1997

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Bas De Bever

Elite Men
Stellenbosch
1997 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.54 seconds
- 0.18%

Tomas Misser

Elite Men
Massanutten
1997 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.89 seconds
- 0.33%

1998

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Cédric Gracia

Elite Men
Nevegal
1998 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.55 seconds
- 0.15%

Anne-Caroline Chausson

Elite Women
Siera Nevada
1998 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.94 seconds
- 0.30%

1999

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Les Gets
1999 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.16 seconds
- 0.05%

Shaun Palmer

Elite Men
Big Bear Lake
1999 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.12 seconds
- 0.05%

2000

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Anne-Caroline Chausson

Elite Women
Les Gets
2000 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.66 seconds
- 0.34%

Nicolas Vouilloz

Elite Men
Cortina d'Ampezzo
2000 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.36 seconds
- 0.18%

Fabien Barel

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2000 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.82 seconds
- 0.28%

Missy Giove

Elite Women
Mont Sainte Anne
2000 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.92 seconds
- 0.28%

Nicolas Vouilloz

Elite Men
Arai Mountain
2000 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.06 seconds
- 0.02%

Nicolas Vouilloz

Elite Men
Kaprun
2000 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.18 seconds
- 0.05%

Myles Rockwell

Elite Men
Sierra Nevada
2000 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.58 seconds
- 0.25%

2001

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Maribor
2001 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.44 seconds
- 0.25%

Fabien Barel

Elite Men
Grouse Mountain
2001 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.01 seconds
- 0.009%

Mickael Pascal

Elite Men
Durango
2001 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.48 seconds
- 0.22%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Kaprun
2001 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.89 seconds
- 0.24%

2002

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Chris Kovarik

Elite Men
Maribor
2002 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.01 seconds
- 0.006%

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Telluride
2002 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.15 seconds
- 0.12%

Anne-Caroline Chausson

Elite Women
Telluride
2002 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.50 seconds
- 0.35%

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Les Gets
2002 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.58 seconds
- 0.26%

Nicolas Vouilloz

Elite Men
Kaprun
2002 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.54 seconds
- 0.18%

2003

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Nathan Rennie

Elite Men
Alpe d'Huez
2003 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.60 seconds
- 0.31%

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2003 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.06 seconds
- 0.06%

Fionn Griffiths

Elite Women
Mont Sainte Anne
2003 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.11 seconds
- 0.09%

Ivan Oulego Moreno

Elite Men
Grouse Mountain
2003 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.35 seconds
- 0.28%

Fionn Griffiths

Elite Women
Grouse Mountain
2003 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.63 seconds
- 0.46%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Lugano
2003 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.92 seconds
- 0.33%

2004

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Tracy Moseley

Elite Women
Les Deux Alpes
2004 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.14 seconds
- 0.06%

Gee Atherton

Elite Men
Schladming
2004 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.77 seconds
- 0.32%

Marielle Saner

Elite Women
Schladming
2004 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.93 seconds
- 0.34%

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2004 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.86 seconds
- 0.5%

Fabien Barel

Elite Women
Lovigno
2004 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.85 seconds
- 0.34%

Fabien Barel

Elite Men
Les Gets
2004 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.58 seconds
- 0.36%

2005

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Sabrina Jonnier

Elite Women
Vigo
2005 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.41 seconds
- 0.23%

Anne-Caroline Chausson

Elite Women
Schladming
2005 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.24 seconds
- 0.08%

Fabien Barel

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2005 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.52 seconds
- 0.17%

Tracy Moseley

Elite Women
Mont Sainte Anne
2005 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.55 seconds
- 0.16%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Angel Fire
2005 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.22 seconds
- 0.08%

Tracy Moseley

Elite Women
Fort William
2005 World Cup Round 8

Winning Margin:
- 0.92 seconds
- 0.3%

Fabien Barel

Elite Men
Livigno
2005 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.77 seconds
- 0.33%

Anne-Caroline Chausson

Elite Women
Livigno
2005 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.37 seconds
- 0.14%

2006

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Mick Hannah

Elite Men
Vigo
2006 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.86 seconds
- 0.6%

Tracy Moseley

Elite Women
Willingen
2006 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.28 seconds
- 0.2%

Chris Kovarik

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2006 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.32 seconds
- 0.11%

Matti Lehikoinen

Elite Men
Balneário Camboriú
2006 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.09 seconds
- 0.07%

Rachel Atherton

Elite Women
Balneário Camboriú
2006 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.72 seconds
- 0.45%

Sabrina Jonnier

Elite Women
Schladming
2006 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.41 seconds
- 0.15%

2007

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Sam Hill

Elite Men
Fort William
2007 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.64 seconds
- 0.22%

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2008

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Sabrina Jonnier

Elite Women
Maribor
2008 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.18 seconds
- 0.09%

Gee Atherton

Elite Men
Vallnord
2008 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.31 seconds
- 0.2%

2009

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Vallnord
2009 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.020 seconds
- 0.01%

Fabien Barel

Elite Men
Maribor
2009 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.710 seconds
- 0.39%

Sabrina Jonnier

Elite Women
Maribor
2009 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.310 seconds
- 0.14%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Bromont
2009 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.460 seconds
- 0.30%

Tracy Moseley

Elite Women
Schladming
2009 World Cup Round 8

Winning Margin:
- 0.840 seconds
- 0.29%

Steve Peat

Elite Men
Canberra
2009 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.050 seconds
- 0.03%

2010

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Maribor
2010 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.250 seconds
- 0.12%

Gee Atherton

Elite Men
Fort William
2010 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.480 seconds
- 0.17%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Leogang
2010 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.74 seconds
- 0.3%

Gee Atherton

Elite Men
Windham
2010 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.370 seconds
- 0.25%

2011

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Aaron Gwin

Elite Men
Pietermaritzburg
2011 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.241 seconds
- 0.1%

Tracy Moseley

Elite Women
Pietermaritzburg
2011 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.288 seconds
- 0.1%

Aaron Gwin

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2011 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.465 seconds
- 0.17%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
La Bresse
2011 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.459 seconds
- 0.35%

Myriam Nicole

Elite Women
Val Di Sole
2011 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.809 seconds
- 0.35%

2012

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Pietermaritzburg
2012 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.632 seconds
- 0.27%

Tracey Hannah

Elite Men
Pietermaritzburg
2012 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.949 seconds
- 0.35%

Aaron Gwin

Elite Men
Fort William
2012 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.834 seconds
- 0.29%

Aaron Gwin

Elite Men
Windham
2012 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.958 seconds
- 0.65%

Rachel Atherton

Elite Women
Windham
2012 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.262 seconds (2:52.062 // 2:52.324)172.062
- 0.15%

Brook MacDonald

Elite Men
Val d'Isere
2012 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.495 seconds (2:19.478 // 2:19.973)139.478
- 0.35%

Steve Smith

Elite Men
Hafjell
2012 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.400 seconds
- 0.19%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Leogang
2012 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.581 seconds (3:21.790 // 3:22.371)201.79
- 0.29%

2013

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Steve Smith

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2013 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.904 seconds
- 0.38%

Emmeline Ragot

Elite Women
Leogang
2013 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.502 seconds
- 0.22%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Pietermaritzburg
2013 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.396 seconds
- 0.17%

2014

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Manon Carpenter

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2014 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.724 seconds
- 0.25%

Sam Hill

Elite Men
Meribel
2014 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.366 seconds
- 0.5%

Gee Atherton

Elite Men
Hafjell
2014 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.407 seconds
- 0.2%

Manon Carpenter

Elite Women
Hafjell
2014 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.088 seconds
- 0.04%

2015

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Aaron Gwin

Elite Men
Leogang
2015 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.045 seconds
- 0.02%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Lenzerheide
2015 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.960 seconds
- 0.53%

Josh Bryceland

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2015 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.200 seconds
- 0.08%

2016

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Cairns
2016 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.493 seconds
- 0.24%

Danny Hart

Elite Men
Lenzerheide
2016 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.096 seconds
- 0.05%

Rachel Atherton

Elite Women
Lenzerheide
2016 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.707 seconds
- 0.33%

Danny Hart

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2016 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.669 seconds
- 0.28%

2017

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Tahnée Seagrave

Elite Women
Leogang
2017 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.693 seconds
- 0.32%

Troy Brosnan

Elite Men
Vallnord
2017 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.220 seconds
- 0.09%

Greg Minnaar

Elite Men
Lenzerheide
2017 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.162 seconds
- 0.09%

Myriam Nicole

Elite Women
Lenzerheide
2017 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.512 seconds
- 0.25%

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Cairns
2017 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.339 seconds
- 0.16%

Miranda Miller

Elite Women
Cairns
2017 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.097 seconds
- 0.04%

2018

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Aaron Gwin

Elite Men
Losinj
2018 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.798 seconds
- 0.57%

Amaury Pierron

Elite Men
Fort William
2018 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.270 seconds
- 0.1%

Amaury Pierron

Elite Men
Leogang
2018 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.508 seconds
- 0.27%

Rachel Atherton

Elite Women
Leogang
2018 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.638 seconds
- 0.45%

Amaury Pierron

Elite Men
Val Di Sole
2018 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.524 seconds
- 0.24%

Tahnée Seagrave

Elite Women
Val Di Sole
2018 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.123 seconds
- 0.05%

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2018 World Cup Round 6

Winning Margin:
- 0.321 seconds
- 0.13%

Rachel Atherton

Elite Women
La Bresse
2018 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.638 seconds
- 0.37%

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Lenzerheide
2018 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.213 seconds
- 0.12%

2019

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Maribor
2019 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.404 seconds
- 0.23%

Tahnée Seagrave

Elite Women
Maribor
2019 World Cup Round 1

Winning Margin:
- 0.855 seconds
- 0.42%

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Leogang
2019 World Cup Round 3

Winning Margin:
- 0.324 seconds
- 0.17%

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Vallnord
2019 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.423 seconds
- 0.17%

Tracey Hannah

Elite Women
Les Gets
2019 World Cup Round 5

Winning Margin:
- 0.677 seconds
- 0.33%

Amaury Pierron

Elite Men
Lenzerheide
2019 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.951 seconds
- 0.56%

Marine Cabirou

Elite Women
Lenzerheide
2019 World Cup Round 7

Winning Margin:
- 0.264 seconds
- 0.12%

Danny Hart

Elite Men
Snowshoe
2019 World Cup Round 8

Winning Margin:
- 0.656 seconds
- 0.36%

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Mont Sainte Anne
2018 World Champs

Winning Margin:
- 0.581 seconds
- 0.24%

2020

Winning Margins Under 1 Seconds

Loris Vergier

Elite Men
Maribor
2020 World Cup Round 2

Winning Margin:
- 0.057 seconds
- 0.03%

Loïc Bruni

Elite Men
Lousa
2020 World Cup Round 4

Winning Margin:
- 0.170 seconds
- 0.07%

Posted In:
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edspratt
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81 Comments

79 0

betobi (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:51)

It tells you something not to find Mr. Sam Hill on top off one off those lists . . . :-)

7 10

aer0 FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 11:15)

tells me he races enduro now.... LOL. Joking, what you are getting at

24 1

jgainey (Jan 31, 2021 at 11:45)

@aer0: I think he is saying he genrally wins big, not by hundreds of a second.

12 0

betsie (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:58)

@jgainey: Says Sam won by less than a second twice, but RnR shows Sams winning margins as (13 WC wins).

3.08, 5.51, 2.33, 5.14, 1.33, **0.36**, 1.26, 3.04, 2.70, 1.24, 1.69, 6.75, 8.17 seconds.

So only once below 1 second. Which one is right, RootsandRain or the chart above (chart 3)?

18 0

jptothetree (Jan 31, 2021 at 14:44)

Now we need a list of riders with wins of 5+ seconds.

betsie (Jan 31, 2021 at 15:22)

@jptothetree: That would be in interesting list. Not just 5s but a percentage win too as 5s on a 3 min track is much more impressive than a 5s win on a 4:30 track.

8.17s from Hill is impressive stuff.

jgainey (Jan 31, 2021 at 17:12)

@jptothetree: Gwin, Hart, Hill, R. Atherton come to mind immediately.

jptothetree (Jan 31, 2021 at 19:38)

@betsie: Good point.

rootsandrain (Feb 1, 2021 at 5:54)

@betsie: You missed one - you've filtered to only show World Cups, but he beat Barel by 0.64 at FW World Champs in 2007.

Happy to help!

betsie (Feb 1, 2021 at 6:32)

@rootsandrain: Thank you

Didnt think about champs, always think of them as different as the entrance criteria is different.

heavyp FL (Feb 1, 2021 at 12:32)

Ivan Oulego Moreno, who ?

15 0

ompete (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:17)

Crazy to think that in a blink of an eye you're winner or second place, one tiny mistake is all it takes, but it's usually the same ' aliens' at the top in general, DH is awesome!

11 2

mybaben (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:31)

Those tiny margins suck!! I was so pissed when Minnaar lost the second race last season by a stupid tiny margin. It would have been so epic for him to win two days in a row!

nozes (Feb 1, 2021 at 1:57)

Why is a tiny margin stupid?
If he and Loic raced side by side probably Loic would have won by two bike lenghts or more (someone can do that math).
If you think in that terms it doesn't sound like a little margin.

sino428 (Feb 1, 2021 at 5:24)

@nozes: probably not two bike lengths. Would likely be more like 2-3 feet.

nozes (Feb 1, 2021 at 6:14)

@sino428: Probably,yes.
In order to measure it properly we need the exact lenght of the track.

dthomp325 (Feb 1, 2021 at 6:38)

@sino428: at 30mph through the finish chute 0.17 seconds would be a 7.5 foot difference. 5 foot difference at 20mph.

mybaben (Feb 1, 2021 at 9:01)

@nozes: A fair win is a fair win. I give Loic the win. Frustrating is a better word. Frustrating to see the GOAT lose by such a chump margin when he almost had it.

solidautomech FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:42)

This makes the World Cup seasons of 2018 and 2019 look like the closest racing of all the years with 2020 down near the bottom because it only had four races. Maybe one more stat that shows which years had the closest racing relative to the number of races held so we can get a better idea of how close the racing was each year.

Sasquatchumus (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:15)

Yep, and the results are skewed in the same way for individual riders. It's not surprising that Greg Minnaar has had the most close wins, because he's had the most overall wins.

The-Foiling-Optimist (Jan 31, 2021 at 16:00)

@Sasquatchumus: Yes exactly this. I can't believe they didn't normalize by total win number for each athlete. They talk about nerding out but it's more like chickening out. Of some math.

Iamwarthog FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 19:06)

@sino428 the size of a riders bike makes no difference. The timer starts when the timing chip crosses the sensor at the start line, and stops when the timing chip crosses the finish line. As long as the timing chip is on a fixed point on the bike, the distance between the start/finish will be the same for the chip.

sino428 (Jan 31, 2021 at 19:42)

Yea I think you are right about that.

Phill-R (Jan 31, 2021 at 11:01)

Races won by less than 100th of a second should be a tie for 1st but the points should go to the winner of 2 out of 3 rock, paper, scissors.

GRAV-Intense-Racing-Canada (Jan 31, 2021 at 11:20)

Cool that Karver has the smallest winning margin AND largest winning margin on his resume.

yuroshek (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:23)

Didn’t Troy beat out Neko for Jr Worlds by like .004 or something like that?

snl1200 FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 19:48)

Was expecting to see a list of riders who have lost out by under a second and fully expected Brosnan to sit at the top. I remember a season where riders I really liked were winning I couldn't help but feel gutted for Troy.

dthomp325 (Feb 1, 2021 at 6:43)

Do they publish specs on accuracy of the timing equipment? Some of these results like .01 and .05 are probably pushing the accuracy limits of a beam or wireless detector. At that point (below .100) it should probably be considered a tie.

Muckal (Feb 1, 2021 at 22:02)

Exactly my thoughts! Does anybody know the specs of the equipment?

johnnyboydh FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 14:41)

You couldn't go back one more year to one of the best finishes of all time? Napalm missing out in his first Worlds to Voullioz by like .018!

RBalicious FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 18:40)

2014 - Winning margins under 1 second.... not so sure this one is correct

Sam Hill
Elite Women
Meribel
2014 World Cup Round 7

Muckal (Feb 1, 2021 at 22:01)

Maybe he identified as a woman that day?

TekNullIOG (Jan 31, 2021 at 19:59)

I had no idea there was a race at Grouse! Crazy!
I wish Grouse ran its chairlift for riding. (or Seymour, or Cypress)

WayneParsons (Feb 1, 2021 at 3:22)

There were races there from 2001-2003, XC, DS and DH, but one year there was only XC.

neimbc (Jan 31, 2021 at 15:02)

It would have been cool to put who got eeked out into second place by those margins too!

thg80 (Jan 31, 2021 at 22:54)

I just realized that Greg Minaar (also) competed in the elite-women category back in 2015. How come?

thg80 (Feb 2, 2021 at 20:51)

Oh, the article has been edited.

CarbonShmarbon FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:28)

This is, unquestionably, nerding out.

Rhymer (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:23)

I'd like to see who was missing out on these narrow wins.

combee (Jan 31, 2021 at 14:22)

“Ask any racer. Any real racer. It don't matter if you win by an inch or a mile. Winning's winning."

nickgarrison (Feb 1, 2021 at 4:52)

Did you seriously just quote Dominic Toretto? Lol

AntN (Jan 31, 2021 at 15:20)

I think you'll find the unit of measurement for such events is "Bees Dicks"

jgottya1 (Jan 31, 2021 at 21:23)

Hopefully PB has this as a Slackbot quick link in Slack. Very useful info for lunchtime bets!!

privateer-wheels (Jan 31, 2021 at 21:39)

Just give me the data dump. Dates, names, places, and times. I bet there are piles of cool stories in the data.

On-oneAnders (Feb 1, 2021 at 2:32)

Hafjell has been some real close racing. BRING IT BACK

Thirty3 (Jan 31, 2021 at 10:09)

Too many numbers for this guy. A bike review would be better

jeremy3220 FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 10:16)

Would be interesting to see this broken down by dry vs wet conditions.

Bobadeebob (Jan 31, 2021 at 11:24)

So how come everyone keeps telling me racing is getting tighter?

Chayce (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:15)

I lost out on a podium spot by 0.01 of a sec. Worst feeling ever.

rockyflowtbay (Jan 31, 2021 at 15:07)

Kovarik with the largest and smalllest winning margin. Interesting.

cypress-mtb-club (Jan 31, 2021 at 15:54)

Ok... now my eyes are tired. Kewl data to chew on.

mxmtb (Jan 31, 2021 at 18:23)

Fabian didn’t win grouse !!!!!!!

Black mark on racing thanks to the UCI

mxmtb (Jan 31, 2021 at 18:24)

I recant wrong race

Miguelangel780 (Jan 31, 2021 at 23:52)

where is rachel atherton ?

Schlumo (Feb 1, 2021 at 1:58)

a shame, so many locations that are no longer in the calendar today

sargey2003 (Feb 1, 2021 at 3:52)

I'd like to know who has the most second places by less than 1 second

slayersxc17 (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:17)

How fast did I beat everyone to the first comment?

mi-bike (Jan 31, 2021 at 14:38)

Definitely *not* the smallest winning margin.

CDT77 (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:28)

"nerding out" indeed. Yet here I am... I'll show myself out.

brodoyouevenbike (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:27)

Hmmm how are 3 bars representing 0.01% different sizes?

edspratt FL Editor (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:41)

It looks like the graph has rounded up the times of Chris Kovarik and Fabien Barel. Chris Kovarik should be at 0.006% and Fabien Barel 0.009%.

Below threshold threads are hidden

5 17

sino428 (Jan 31, 2021 at 9:55)

I sometimes think that DH racing should do away with timing down to 100th of a second. It seems ridiculous to judge a race that starts at the top of a mountain and covers that much ground by such tight tolerances. Based on the speeds of a DH race, 100th of a second is around 5cm of distance. judging these races by less that the width of a tire seems crazy.

I get the idea that fastest time should win but there is precedent for not simply being as precise as possible. Competitive swimming does not time down to 1000th of a second (even though the technology allows it) because the pools themselves can’t even be built to that tight of a tolerance. Variations of a few centimeters from lane to lane can happen just due to changes in the temperatures of the air and water. That’s why you see a lot of ties in swimming.

I would argue that biking should do that same and only go to 1/10th of a second. Much like lane length cant be guaranteed in swimming, course conditions in DH can vary as well. When talking 100th of a second a wind gust could easily cost a rider a race or a few spots on the leader board (or help them). Is that fair? I personally would rather see a ties if two riders put in a great race than see one loose by .03 seconds.

C4coach (Jan 31, 2021 at 10:20)

So even with all the data above you would simply dispose of this and have all the races in the articles ties? Is there a facepalm switch here somewhere?

sino428 (Jan 31, 2021 at 10:39)

@C4coach: all the races? No not all the races. Did you even look at all that data above? Moving away from 100ths of a second would have resulted in a tie for the win in probably about 5 races.

jaame (Jan 31, 2021 at 10:42)

I have to say this is something I had never thought about and I agree with you. It would be cool to see draws. A lot of sports have them. Imagine three people getting in the top step, all getting the 200 points. More wins means more exposure for the sponsors. More people can claim race wins in their career stats. Why they don’t already do that is a question.
I can certainly see it being popular with the riders over a season of WC racing. Perhaps less so at the world champs.

sino428 (Jan 31, 2021 at 11:47)

@jaame: I don't even think it would ever come to that. Just looking at the stats here going by 10th vs 100th of a second would only have ever resulted in a handful of ties for wins, let alone 3 way ties. I think something like that would still be super rare, but none the less pretty cool. I think if I was a rider I would rather run the risk of having to share the title of World Champ than run the risk of finishing second by 100th of a second. Like you said wins are wins. I don't think sponors (or riders) would care that much if they were shared once in a while.

robway (Jan 31, 2021 at 11:50)

So what happens when you have tie?

cloverleaf (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:12)

I'm guessing someone isn't a racer here...

sino428 (Jan 31, 2021 at 12:40)

@robway: When you have a tie there is a tie. This is not uncommon in other sports. If there were say a tie for first at World Champs two riders would be awarded gold medals and there would be no silver medal awarded.

commental (Jan 31, 2021 at 13:05)

@sino428: Maybe we should just make it to the nearest second, it'd be fairer that way. Or maybe just scrap the podium and give everyone a medal for competing. As for riders not caring that much about getting the win, did you not see Amaury Pierron's face when he missed out on the overall in 2019?

jaame (Jan 31, 2021 at 13:18)

There was a case at the Olympics in the men’s 50m freestyle swimming. A guy I think called Rob Hall won the gold at two consecutive games. One was a 0.01 second victory and one was a dead heat. Two gold medals with a combined winning margin of 0.01 seconds.

sino428 (Jan 31, 2021 at 13:59)

@commental: Yea sure lets juts make it about participation trophies!! Thats not a ridiculous stretch of this argument of anything.

I never said riders would not care about a win? I said that most riders would rather share a win (because its a win to their name) than lose out on one by 1/100th of a second. Such small margins just seem ridiculous. Like I said, 1/100th equates to a few centimeters of distance. Considering a riders timing chip is mounted to their fork, you could conceivably have differences of a few 1/100ths just based on the size of a riders bike. Look up the geos for a V10 for example, the front center length difference between a size medium and an XL is almost 6cm meaning the guy who is riding a larger bike could clock in a couple 100ths faster just because his fork stick out further. That to me is ridiculous and has nothing to do with who put in that best ride.

enduroswag FL (Jan 31, 2021 at 14:09)

He's right, we should measure in square mcdonald's per football field!

commental (Jan 31, 2021 at 14:27)

@sino428: Riders at that level want to win, not draw. Joint World Champion hasn't got the same ring to it

sino428 (Jan 31, 2021 at 14:37)

@commental: Well you'd have to ask them to know for sure, but I would tend to disagree. Like @jaame pointed out, more "wins" means more exposure for the riders and their sponsors, which could likely mean more $$$ for such riders. I personally don't think the riders, sponsors, or fans would give a shit if there was a tie. Like I said it happens in many other sports. No one considers those gold medal wins that were ties as anything less than gold medals for those athletes.

commental (Jan 31, 2021 at 15:30)

@sino428: Just because there are draws in other sports doesn't mean the competitors involved don't want to win outright, my guess is they do, assuming you haven't asked them of course. Ask Steve Peat if he'd have minded drawing in Canberra. I've read enough interviews with these guys to know they want to win. They want to be the best, the fastest. They wouldn't get to this level without that mentality.

jaame (Jan 31, 2021 at 23:39)

@commental: I think most riders would welcome it. Also I think fans would be happy to see two guys on the top step. Imagine your two favourite riders both winning a race and getting the 200 points. Imagine getting that in your fantasy league team. It wouldn’t happen very often, but it would add excitement when it did. And it wouldn’t be a draw, it would be a double win. It would go done on the results sheet as a W next to both names, not a conditional W.

commental (Feb 1, 2021 at 0:58)

@jaame: I think if you reckon Steve Peat would've been cool about sharing that World Champs win, you're dreaming. Anyway, I can't be bothered to keep scrolling all the way down here to debate this below threshold opinion, just saying.

BenPea (Feb 1, 2021 at 1:50)

There are enough problems without solutions to not have to invent solutions to problems that don't exist.

jaame (Feb 1, 2021 at 8:50)

@commental: If this happened, Steve Peat may well have had more than one world champs win. Would he be opposed to that? Unlikely.

jaame (Feb 1, 2021 at 8:52)

@commental: It's not a shared win. It's a win. It's like, if I can win a hundred quid, or have myself win a hundred quid and you win a hundred quid also, I would take that second option as long as it's not a case of me getting two hundy if I'm the only winner. If I had to split it I would be against it... but if it was a win/win that would be preferable. There wouldn't be just one trophy that got cut in half, and a split of the prize money. It would be two first places. What's not to like?