Video: CathroVision Track Walk - Fort William DH World Cup 2019

May 31, 2019
by Ben Cathro  

Scotland has lived up to its reputation and put on a banquet of moisture and rocks for racers this weekend. Ben Cathro takes a look at the track and checks out the new Cannondale DH bike.


MENTIONS: @ben-cathro



54 Comments

  • + 49
 I can't believe the level of insight and rider access Cathie is getting. This is the best thing on PB
  • + 6
 The rider interviews are getting better and better - they really added to this episode (if that's what you call it...).

Red Bull sign him up!
  • + 48
 Cathrovision is my gossip girl
  • - 8
flag shredright (May 31, 2019 at 2:32) (Below Threshold)
 Please don't try to bum her/him.
  • + 39
 Cannondale. Talk nerdy to me. I want it deep.
  • + 8
 More Cannondale tech! “Just like a fork, one spring leg, one damper leg”
  • + 19
 Every body should be paying attention to what Cannondale is trying to do. The challenge has always been with a single coil over or air spring damper is both work best with there own unique leverage curve. Data acquisition will be even more important now to make the most out of it. Without it setups will get way out of wack quickly.
  • + 19
 At 16:04 Finn saying he gets a lot more grip with the Maxxis haha
  • + 2
 Could Cannondale not just use a linear rate linkage with progressively wound spring to achieve the same goal?
  • + 5
 @TrueScotsman: Creating progressive rate coil springs with specific load curve is easy said than done. Than changing that curve for the riders personal preferences and at how many different average rates and you will end up with an unlimited number of combinations.
  • + 4
 @dhrracer: Why do you say that progressive coil springs are easier said than done?
I'm not familiar with the state of the art in bike coil mnfr, however I am familiar with other simple mass manufacturing and the gem that is a CNC wire forming machine.

Its interesting to think about. Isolated damping leverage is not represented in progressive-coil only solution. In pursuing that: are there ways to modify a damping curve without a separate linkage system?
Wonder if a compressible disk with holes for oil-pass thru that dilate under high velocity would do it?

Back on thread topic:
I'm not ruling this bike out by any stretch; however, given Cannondale's other flagship suspension product is a single stanchion fork, it makes you wonder how much marketing and engineering handshake over the product specifications.
  • + 2
 @henrybsick: It is not hard to produce a progressive rate coil spring but to get the curve to be what you want with the beginning and ending rate where you want it in the envelope available is. Than to produce all the combos that would be requested because of every riders differences in preferences. There are many ways to skin a cat. Some might do a better job but are very difficult to pull off. As with any thing when you are trying to squeeze out that last 10% it might take 100% more effort. Will C-Dale ever go into production with it is a big question. They do have a history of pushing the limits. This is not the first time they have gone down this road. I would say out of the larger MFG's C-Dale has probably been the one that works the farthest out side of the norms.
  • + 3
 @henrybsick: “a compressible disk with holes for oil-pass thru that dilate under high velocity would do it ?”
Brilliant! Had a laugh at that. ;-)
  • + 2
 @dhrracer: well put on the difficulties of using a progressive rate spring. Also, it would still effect the damper the same way, as the softer initial spring rate would compress faster than the harder end rate therefore creating the same variation in damper shaft velocity that they're trying to avoid.
  • + 0
 @henrybsick: you really nailed it with your comment. I also tend to be fairly skeptical with the approach when thinking of the Cannondale Lefty fork
  • + 1
 @henrybsick: a genuine progressive rate coil Spring must have variable wire thickness through the length of the Spring. I've never seen an actual progressive rate MTB Spring. There are lots of claimed progressive springs, but merely putting a few turns closer together doesn't make it progressive - the rate comes from the wire thickness and length of wire in the spring.
As to separating Spring and damper, race cars and bikes don't do this, and it would seem super difficult to tune. You will move from an over damped Spring to under damped through its travel. Desirable? I couldn't see why. I hope we learn more from Cannondale techs.
  • + 1
 @Earlysport: You could also very the mean diameter as well as a combo of two different rate springs stacked. You are correct pitch angle is a result of the total amount of material used and free length. There is also a point where too much pitch leading into very little or no pitch will cause the material go from torsional forces to acting as a lever. As long as we are only referring to a given modulus.
  • + 18
 I would love to see that in depth video talking about what's going on with the Cannondale!
  • + 1
 Would love to see more on it too.
  • + 15
 Thanks for the tip on Matt Walker cathro. Fantasy team updated #healingvibes
  • + 2
 I'm like a freaking curse. I put Luca Shaw on my team just prior to last race, then he finds out he has a broken collar bone. Yesterday morning, I put Matt Walker on my team and this comes out. I'm going to quit DH Fantasy to keep from hurting any more riders.
  • + 6
 @Hogfly: Add Gwin’s bike thief to your team. Let’s use your powers for good.
  • + 2
 @DGThree: I liked Gwin's take on the theft. I actually said something similar when Lenosky's bikes were stolen. REEB hadn't had that much publicity in... ever... probably.
  • + 12
 Nice catch on the tire Finn... Wouldn't want to make give those non Spec tires any extra credit
  • + 10
 @cathro - Yes, can you do a more in-depth Cannondale tech geek out.
  • + 2
 Please let it be! Moar nerding is needed for the people, well me at least
  • + 8
 64 spring and damper options on the Canondale, while over at Intense, Gwin cannot decide between L & XL
  • + 2
 He decided on large weeks ago lol
  • + 4
 @yzedf: haha, I was more poking fun at Canondale. I hum and ha over my sag
  • + 4
 When I first watched his reports I thought ‘who is this oddball trying to create a YouTube channel. How wrong was I, he is fantastic and his insight is amazing. He deserves to be a part of the full coverage for Red Bull. While Rob W and Claudio can do commentary we need Mr C to explain tech to the viewers
  • + 2
 Claudio can do commentary? If that's what you want to call it...
  • + 2
 These bikes have 2 shocks. Most bikes only have one.. does this mean its better?
Well, its one better. Most bikes bottom out on 1 shock.. where do you go from there? Where?
If we need that extra push off the cliff, you know what we do... On more shock.
  • + 2
 To be fair that was about my level of understanding! Long live Spinal Tap!
  • + 6
 "Well, that's above my pay grade"
  • + 4
 Not enough rain or midges here, I'm going to Fort William today.
  • + 2
 Lucky basterd - have fun
  • + 1
 How does it manage to rain so much up there?! I live in Wales, not far south, and it’s been gorgeous today. Bone dry dusty tracks, well tidy. Jocks must be rain dancing.
  • + 1
 “not far south”

Isn’t it?!
  • + 3
 Ah, been waiting all week for a dose of Cathro.
  • + 3
 I love me some Cathrovision!
  • + 3
 Really insightful trackwalk. And I like the Cathrovision logo.
  • + 1
 Love Wynn Tv but Ben's version is way more informative. Great insight into the DH scene.
  • + 0
 The Cannondale guy really struggled in trying to explain the benefits of their wonky shock. Not sure I see the benefits or the results on that contraption but time will tell
  • + 1
 @cannondale: let’s combine the air spring and damper on the lefty fork and split them on the shock. Alright....great idea
  • + 2
 GB autocorrect + mobile = Cathie. Sorry Cathro
  • + 2
 MTB shocks are so bad that now we need two of them? : )
  • + 3
 Keep in mind that when the term shock is used that really only refers to it being a damper. A shock can also be the mounting location for the spring "coil over". What we traditionally have on the rear of a bike. There are not two shocks the device that the spring is mounted to has no damping control. However the bike can be ran with a traditional fully functioning coil over shock. Think about a car that the spring is not mounted over the damper. An in depth interview would be interesting but it really is not all that complicated. They are just trying to create a system where shock shaft speed is only influenced by the impact forces that are created by the tire to ground/obstacle not a changing leverage rate.
  • + 1
 @dhrracer: thx for the explanation. I honestly never thought about vehicle suspension as anything other than a single coil over and damper.
  • + 2
 Go Cathro!
  • + 1
 nice DHF on finn's new demo Wink
  • + 2
 Nerd me up buttercup
  • - 1
 Nice hat.
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