Video: Marin's Alpine Trail Enduro Bike is Now Available in Carbon

Dec 10, 2020
by James Smurthwaite  
Views: 7,185    Faves: 4    Comments: 0


The Marin Alpine Trail, which was released during our Pond Beaver coverage in September, has now been made in carbon.

The frame is a literal carbon copy of its aluminium counterpart with the same 150mm rear travel matched with a 160mm fork, and the same MultiTrac, four-bar suspension system. The geometry is identical too with a 63.5° headtube angle, 78° seat tube angle, a 480mm reach in size L and the same aluminum 430mm chainstays.
Alpine Trail Details

• Wheel size: 29"
• Carbon front triangle, aluminium rear triangle
• Travel: 150mm rear / 160mm fork
• 63.5° head angle
• 430mm chainstays
• Sizes: S-XL
• Price: $3,189 - $4,099 USD
marinbikes.com


27.11.20. Marin Bikes Alpine Trail 2 Carbon. Rider Matt Jones. PIC Andy Lloyd www.andylloyd.photography
Photos: Andy Lloyd.

Marin claims the change to carbon makes this the strongest and stiffest Alpine Trail to date and there's also a claimed weight saving of 1.5kg over the Alpine Trail XR in size Large.

27.11.20. Marin Bikes Alpine Trail 2 Carbon. Rider Matt Jones. PIC Andy Lloyd www.andylloyd.photography
27.11.20. Marin Bikes Alpine Trail 2 Carbon. Rider Matt Jones. PIC Andy Lloyd www.andylloyd.photography

Geometry


Builds


There are two carbon builds available at this time and a frame only option. The Alpine Trail Carbon 1 comes with a RockShox Yari RC fork Deluxe Select+ shock. The drivetrain is Shimano Deore 12 speed with FSA Comet crankset and Shimano also provides the MT420 4-piston brakes. Maxxis Assegai 29 x 2.5” tires sit on Marin rims with Shimano hubs. Price: $3,189 USD / $4,199CAD / £3,045 / €3,659.


Moving up a price bracket, Alpine Trail Carbon 2 instead gets suspension from Fox with a 38 Performance fork and DPX2 shock. You also move up the Shimano range and get a mix of SLX and XT drivetrain components, an FSA GRadient crankset and SLX level brakes. Price: $4,099USD / $5,499CAD / £3,995 / €4,699.

The Alpine Trail Carbon models will be available in early 2021, more info, here.


160 Comments

  • 159 3
 Marin killin' it this year!
  • 1 0
 Marin be like in 2016, we need direction and inspiration , some dude said head to the UK- 4 years later we are all thankful
  • 123 8
 Hats off to Marin for using female talent on their launch video. Well spec’d bikes are great too at prices that don’t make me have to consider a second mortgage. Just really happy about what they are doing right now as brand.
  • 3 2
 Anybody know what the song is in that video?
  • 12 29
flag Thirty3 (Dec 10, 2020 at 9:20) (Below Threshold)
 Why hats off?
  • 7 1
 @aelazenby: It's a piano piece performed by photographer Victor Lucas
  • 7 0
 You have a house?
  • 27 2
 @Thirty3: Let me google that for you

hats off to

hats off (to someone)

A phrase used to express congratulations to someone. (The removal of one's hat is typically a gesture of respect.)

Hats off to you for getting the big promotion!
A: "I managed to get the highest number of sales this quarter!" B: "Wow, hats off! That's not easy to do!"
  • 13 0
 If you don't follow Martha on the Insta you should, her content is great and every post makes you 100% want to go out and ride. Martha and her crew are always just having a blast, lots of laughing and crashing, great riding and general fun times on bikes.
  • 2 1
 @MarinBikes: Officially his title is Sound Scientist and Photographer Victor Lucas
  • 9 0
 Marin just schooled so many brands on making a video. Nice work!
  • 2 24
flag notphaedrus (Dec 10, 2020 at 14:01) (Below Threshold)
 Hats off..? For pretty much ditching their unique style of bikes and copying the mid pack trend? It could have been one of ten brands in this promo. Big band going for three money. Again.
  • 1 21
flag notphaedrus (Dec 10, 2020 at 14:06) (Below Threshold)
 And 430mm chain stays? Come on, this isn't 2015!
  • 1 0
 @DaFreerider44: amazing the things you can afford outside the industry
  • 1 0
 It's ma'am
  • 64 1
 Can we talk about the fact that the frame is only $2100?! That's cheaper than a lot of newer aluminum bikes coming out.
  • 17 0
 True, but for another G you get a full bike to sell parts off making it even less. Amazing
  • 4 0
 It’s a good price, but keep in mind the back end is alloy; for apples to apples GG & some other brands also offer half carbon frames at a similar price point. Fezzari & Bird both have full carbon frames at this price point.
  • 6 2
 @ninjatarian: I'll give Marin some credit here: I'd rather have a half-carbon frame that's lighters than a full carbon frame that isn't. In the case of GG (which I own) the majority of the weight is in the front triangle, but they still shed .6lbs off their aluminum models. A carbon rear end might save another .4lbs, but at what expense?

The Bird Aether 9C is full carbon, but in a Large frame size actually weighs the same as a GG.(2840g without shock).

I don't think Fezzari's in a similar format (130-160mm) are any lighter despite their full-carbon construction.

So Marin has a done a real good job of shedding a decent amount of weight (3.3lbs) from their alloy model without sacrificing the durability of the rear end.
  • 3 0
 @PHeller: That implies aluminum is intrinsically more durable than carbon. You sure about that?

People have such strange ideas about durability. I just as often hear someone recommending carbon for greater durability as aluminum for the same reason, even on the same component.
  • 3 0
 @PHeller: One more thing: Check your weight reduction number. The "1.5 kg" stat is compared to the XR version, so some of that weight difference comes from the "trail" category air shock vs. coil shock.
  • 4 0
 Course it weights as much as some aluminum bikes coming out... Smile Smile Smile JKN! but so far their carbon frames have been a good bit heavier than other carbon frames.

Still, good price on a good frame no matter what it's made of IMO.
  • 3 0
 @stiingya: "Still, good price on a good frame no matter what it's made of IMO."

Exactly. If the weight, features, performance, durability, and price check out, it doesn't matter what it's made from.
  • 37 0
 this should be marinating in the minds of anyone on a non-sworks budget looking for a new enduro sled
  • 3 41
flag Jshemuel (Dec 10, 2020 at 8:39) (Below Threshold)
 150mm travel bike counts as enduro now?
  • 29 0
 @Jshemuel: Anything counts as enduro if you want it to - I used to race enduro on a 130mm trail bike. I mean it's got a 38 on the front, what more do you want?
  • 14 2
 @Jshemuel: anything can be an enduro bike if you use it like one. Companies want to make you believe you need the all new 170mm travel 29er race machine but if your name isn't Jesse Melamed, you'll be more than ok with a 150mm rear travel bike
  • 7 0
 @ratedgg13: fair nuff
  • 8 0
 @Jshemuel: Your point is fair but I don't know and don't really care. They say enduro in the article title, so I figured it was safe. =)
Also, I am sure anyone on an SB150 would argue that it is definitely an enduro bike.
  • 5 1
 @twonsarelli- You'd have to be a 90 yo Mariner with marinara for brains to not see what you did there....
  • 4 0
 @Jshemuel: Didn't you know 90% of Enduro bike are 150mm/160mm?
  • 3 0
 @jamessmurthwaite @brianpark

The review here specifies a Fox Performance 38, the Marin site specifies a Fox 38 Performance Elite. Can one of you confirm with @MarinBikes? If it is in fact a Performance Elite and the bike is still $5k CDN thats an awesome deal! I blew up an image of the damper dial but couldnt make it out Thanks!!
  • 3 0
 Yeah, I think it would be Marin or the Ripmo AF on my budget recommendation list.
  • 1 0
 @Xlr8n: I'm still marinating to make sense of it all.
  • 2 0
 @whambat: I'd give some serious thought to Fezzari if you ride someplace hot. I was torn between a few different options for a new whip, with Fezzari's La Sal Peak and the Ripmo AF at the top. In the end, the ability to carry THREE water bottles on the Fezzari did it for me. I can now ride totally packless for ~two hours even on the hottest days.
  • 2 0
 @lastminutetech: it is in fact spaced with a performance “elite” with the grip 2 damper
  • 2 0
 @lastminutetech: yeah, it’s performance-elite. @factory_cip (Marin MTB product Mgr) specs the performance elite on the top end models. He’s a smart dude with over a decade in the industry plus he’s an absolute shredder so he’s smart about where to invest the money for the most “bang for the buck” for the consumers.
  • 1 0
 @metalmike: thanks! This bike has a lot of numbers close to my 153 just with a slacker HA...Makes me think I should cancel my order for my Meta AM29
  • 1 0
 @Jshemuel: pivot switchblade, ibis ripmo, alchemy arktos. Three examples off the top of my head all in the EWS with less than 150
  • 1 0
 @Flanman5: good call
  • 32 0
 Kinda love that weird marketing video! So entertaining.
  • 7 0
 Totally agree one of the best non cliche videos I seen in awhile.
  • 5 0
 Very clever video!
  • 2 0
 was gonna write the same, very well made and quite refreshing!
  • 23 0
 Marin is crushing it lately! But i want to say to every company releasing new bikes in the future please please please start putting seat post insertion lengths on your geo charts. It’s such an underrated spec to know ????????
  • 1 0
 It’s ridiculous when companies like specialized post short seat tube lengths that are the basis of there whole “S” sizing but there dropper post are far from being able to be to accommodate even the droppers they are specced with
  • 17 0
 Thanks for calling it an slx/xt mix and not an xt drivetrain just because the derailleur is xt.
  • 13 0
 I've been lucky enough to get 5 rides in already on the Alpine Trail Carbon 2 (shop owner: got super lucky with an early shipment). Geometry is so good. I never imagined 63.5 degrees could still work so well for tight stuff or climbs - the magic of 78 degree seat tubes. Spec for price is nuts. Suspension worked really nicely - great small bump, mid support, ramp up for no harsh bottom outs. The details are where the massive value is on this bike: Assegai DD rear/exo+ front - it is as if Marin knows how people spec custom builds. Grip 2 damped 38 is beautiful. The DPX2 might have been the nicest feeling rear shock I've played with yet - and I just came off a bunch of time on an X2. Dropper needs to be longer - but at least the frame will allow almost all sized riders to run pretty long droppers.
  • 1 0
 Was this the secret bike?
  • 4 0
 @husstler: haha! it was indeed... while it was in transit I got a call basically saying it was on the way and to keep it off any social media or public mention until today.
  • 2 0
 @Bike-Bros what size are you riding?. I am a bit weary of bikes with very long reach and wheelbase numbers in size XL that they retain super short chainstays.

It seems to be working just fine on the new wreckoning, but the new meta got some criticism for it.
Brands that have been pushing this long and slack numbers for a while, like geometron and pole, spec their bikes with massively longer chainstays.
  • 5 1
 @psicoizaguirre: I'm 6'1" and rode a size large. I'm right on the cusp between L and XL and questioned my decision until I got onto the trail then was quite happy with the fit of a large (480 reach). I was glad that Marin didn't do size specific chainstays as I really like the feel of a short rear end (a key highlight the first time I glanced at the geo chart when this was first presented to bike shop owners months ago). I can imagine that someone a fair bit taller may experience some things about the short rear end & 515 Reach on an XL that I can't anticipate. The 78 seat angle helps make the short rear end a non-concern on climbs.
  • 1 0
 Cool, will you have a 'demo' available in 2021? Never got out to try out the Rift Zone this summer but I think the 150mm travel might be a better fit based on riding an Optic in August.
  • 1 0
 @leftypumpkin: The one I spent the last week beating up will get personalized a bit but I'll lend it out to people. Supply may become an issue (no surprise there). When we initially placed orders I was under the impression we'd have 6 or 7 of these in by October... and we just got this one... the bicycle supply chain is pretty broken right now. I'm hoping we see more by early 2021.
Did you find the Optic to little suspension? That is a bike I really appreciate, largely because it is so similar to the Rift Zone which I thoroughly enjoyed (my RZ Carbon 2 is getting put back into stock mode soon to sell)
  • 1 0
 @Bike-Bros: Only one ride on an Optic (rented from 22X), we did a Ranger/Snakes/Bobcat/Strange Brew loop that night, so nothing gnarly in terms of chunk. The run down Snakes was pretty nice, was able to get playful and found once I got used to the geometry and size it was an easy bike to ride. On Strange Brew I definitely found the limits of rear travel, to the point that I flatted the rear tire near the bottom - this from a guy that rides an old 26'r with a 135mm Lefty up front, so I'm pretty familiar with how choppy Strange Brew can get at speed.
  • 1 0
 @Bike-Bros: What is the weight on your size large? Did you ever weigh the frame on it's own? That price for the carbon frame is great! I'm considering buying carbon frame only and taking my parts from my Ripmo AF. Cheers!
  • 1 0
 @Bike-Bros:
What is the weight of this new bike?
  • 20 5
 Sick! I just want a 27.5 version, or Mullet Frown
  • 11 2
 I can't believe the manufacturers have taken this long to get mullets out.
  • 22 0
 @Adamrideshisbike: It takes a while to grow the back out.
  • 4 4
 Stop being a wuss
  • 1 0
 I had a short carpark ride on the alu version, the bb is nice and low, so it actually feels more like a 27.5 than a lot of 29er bikes. Obvs not in the air though.
  • 15 1
 I will always choose the well spec'd Alloy over cheaper Carbon build!
  • 7 0
 Then check out their Alpine XR build its killer
  • 3 0
 The top spec carbon is only $500 USD more than the top spec alloy. And has better fork and brakes, in addition to carbon. I'm usually pro-high spec alloy too but for that kind of price difference the carbon seems like a no-brainer here.
  • 1 0
 Just choose the carbon frame only and move all your parts over form your last well spec'd bike. Best of both options.
  • 7 0
 'Marin's Relatively Inexpensive Alpine Trail All-Mountain Bike with a Carbon Mainframe May Soon Be Available in Limited Quantities'
  • 9 0
 For the first time in 25 years, Im thinking about buying a Marin!
  • 7 0
 Looks unlike the Marin Wolf Ridge. That is a good thing.
  • 4 0
 I wonder if the Wolf Ridge and its suspension system was abandoned by Marin? Seems to have disappeared from their website. That was quite a hypey bike for a while. But I never saw one in the wild.
  • 1 0
 @lugan1: Not sure. Don't think is sold well. It probably ride well, but just quite ugly.
  • 1 0
 @lugan1: I’ve got the Mount Vision 9 (same suspension platform in 27.5) - weird looking but sooooo sick. The Naild React is everything they’ve said it would be.
However I’d rather be on a 29 so I’m selling the MV9 and getting the ATc 2 as soon as available
  • 5 0
 This bike is gorgeous
Still don’t understand how Marin manages to make beautiful bikes like this one , and some serious ugly other ones
  • 2 0
 Not only Marin, plenty of other brands are slow to figure out that lowering and straightening the toptube looks and rides better (for most people), seems like it has taken forever
  • 3 0
 Room for water bottle: Check (oh wait TWO!)
Modern Geo: Check
Reasonably priced: Check

Need more bikes like this with this type of thinking. Getting guys into the game at a reasonable price and although I'm just as much as a fan of the best and lightest and newest and coolest, this thing is attainable and looks to be extremely capable.
  • 5 0
 Can we start calling the bikes with carbon front and alum rear carbon mullet please.
  • 2 0
 I don't know how can 3,189$ become 3,659€. 3,189$ at the current exchange rate are something like 2650€. It's a whopping 1000€ more than the dollar amount! It's not just this bikes, is for everything mtb related. I really can't understand!
  • 3 0
 Taxes?
  • 2 0
 @raph11: I was thinking importation fees, but even European brands do the same, if you look, for example, at the price of the occam m10, it's 5399$, that at would be 4450€ circa, but in Europe is sold at 4999€. So yes, maybe the EU taxation system is VERY different from the american one.
  • 5 0
 @Marcignano: The EU tax system is very different. The EU prices generally contain 20% VAT, while the US prices don't include any taxes as sales tax is state/locally determined.

I think this bike is still relatively cheaper in the US, but it's a lot closer than it would seem because of tax and price reporting differences.
  • 5 0
 'Now available'..so its in stock?
  • 1 0
 Very much doubt that. The AL versions that were released 2-3 months ago are still pretty much nonexistent.
  • 1 0
 The Carbon 1 doesn't cost 3.345€ though. According to their website it's 3.659€.

The former would be a fairly decent price, while the latter isn't as attractive in comparison to bikes like the new Canyon Spectral 29 IMO...
  • 6 0
 Thanks for spotting that - it's updated now
  • 5 0
 Great video, really creative.Thank you Marin.
  • 4 0
 Kudos to all involved in that video! A creative and very enjoyable lil ditty.
  • 1 0
 Glad to hear it, cheers!
  • 3 0
 This is disgusting value, great job Marin. Great looking bike and real good spec (looks at Pivot XT build name lololol)

Truly for the people.
  • 3 3
 I think these have the best geometry out of any frame out there at the moment for true enduro riding. Tonnes of bb drop, super short seat tubes, loads of reach and a proper head angle. Just a shame their paint schemes aren’t up to speed
  • 6 8
 too bad that geometry isn ´t about front triangle only...
  • 2 6
flag landscapeben (Dec 10, 2020 at 8:20) (Below Threshold)
 @Mondbiker: Only half carbon too...
  • 3 1
 @landscapeben: Most bikes are only half.
  • 1 0
 duplicate post. sorry
  • 3 0
 That looks pretty damn good, and two water bottle mounts! Geometry looks dialed.
  • 4 0
 Give us a alloy frame kit plz
  • 5 1
 At that price point - why? This frame is a smoking deal.
  • 8 0
 @CircusMaximus: Because aluminum would be an even better deal and not everyone has 2k to spend on a frame.
  • 4 2
 The aluminium versions seem to have the same specs, but are $700 cheaper. You've got to really want a plastic front triangle! With aluminium back end...
  • 4 0
 I don’t get what performance gain people think they are getting for the money. I’ve had the same bike in both carbon and aluminum and couldn’t feel the difference in weight or damping characteristics. I’d rather keep the $700.
  • 1 0
 Better fork and brakes on the carbon, so not entirely the same. Alu model gets the better rear shock though (on the XR).
  • 1 0
 After some questionable aesthetics on the rift zone carbon, this bike is much better looking. If I had the skills to use that much travel, this bike would be on the short list.
  • 3 0
 Pre ordered an Alpine Trail XR, (in June) the high end aluminium version, should be mine by next week... can’t wait !
  • 3 0
 Shame NIkki Whiles was not in the video too....
  • 1 0
 So good to see....hardly any of us need a 10k race tuned sled....buy a bike that is reasonably priced and works for you...well done Marin
  • 3 0
 Loved that video and the prices are really good too.
  • 1 0
 Can you run it with 27.5 wheels? If not, is there a 27.5 version in the works? Been looking at Nukeproof reactor, but this looks prettier.
  • 1 0
 How much does the Alpine Trail Carbon 2 weight? I would like to compare this to the Commie Meta TR 29.
Hidden bike secrets yet again.
  • 3 0
 Building mine with MICROSHIFT ADVENT X
  • 2 0
 Don't think Martha read all of the script before agreeing...
takes bucket of water like a trooper Smile
  • 2 0
 by ek that looks nice and a really fun bike....
  • 2 0
 Looks like a Process 153?
  • 7 0
 Yeah, but like $2000 cad cheaper.
  • 2 0
 yes is does only way slacker. 153 owner here. The 153 HA is is 66... its a great snappy bike but would be better at the 63.5 HA like the Alpine. CS is close at 430 vs 425 and reach (M) is 455 vs 450 on the 153.
  • 3 0
 Looks like a Norco Sight
  • 1 1
 Just missing the size-specific chainstays and seat tube angles. If Marin embraced fully size-specific geo, I would buy today. Awesome build for the money.
  • 1 0
 @haen: well you know, those things and suspension pivots in the right places. Can't argue with Marin's value proposition, but not sure why anyone is doing low single pivot these days.
  • 2 2
 I was really impressed by this until I saw that the XL has a 430mm seat tube, That will rule it out for the majority of tall riders, even with long dropper posts!
  • 2 0
 What do u mean by that? U could always get 200mm dropper
  • 3 0
 @LukaszLew: I have a 210mm one up on a 510mm seat tube that is still not slammed. That same post in a 430mm seat tube would not meet the minimum insertion!
  • 1 0
 @BigmanTrials Mind if I ask how tall you are? I was hoping to put a 210 on this bike in a size L. I'm 6'0".
  • 2 0
 @carmstrong: I am 6ft4, I am sure for someone 6ft it would be OK.
  • 1 0
 I feel like Marin actually listen to consumers when building their bikes!! Great job, Keep killing it!
  • 2 0
 What? This is 1.5kgs lighter than their alloy frame? Wow that is yuge.
  • 1 0
 Why is the geo chart so Lo-res? It's just some numbers... it shouldn't be fuzzy.
  • 1 0
 More and more the grim donut is going to be a production bike. 150 and 63.5 ??
  • 2 0
 Super nice with a great price...I'm a buyer.
  • 1 0
 Waiting for my Alpine Trail XR to show up. Supposed to have arrive this week. Pushed into January now.
  • 2 0
 Bummer about that chainstay length.
  • 1 0
 This actually looks like a great bike! Similar numbers to my Commencal Meta AM (of which i love) Well done guys/gals!
  • 1 0
 finally ! beautiful simple bike Smile
  • 3 4
 Used to work for a Marin dealer - beware of their cheddar-ish (cheesy soft!) rims, fiddly small parts (cable ports, etc), and glacial warranty process...
  • 7 0
 I can assure you these rims are not cheddar-ish. I've ridden the same on my Rift Zone 3 and beat the hell out of them. They're heavy but so am I (230lbs)l. This bike is UNTOUCHED on the market of store bought bikes. Hell - even the direct to consumer brands have shot up. Show me another carbon enduro bike with a 38 up front and slx/xt kit for 4k. WELL DONE MARIN!
  • 1 2
 @joeyjop: I hope your experience represents the norm and not a fluke. Maybe they've changed their manufacturing since I had to fix the shitpot bikes they made in the past
  • 4 3
 Not a four-bar suspension.
  • 3 2
 Try researching a bit more. It is not a Horst link, but MultiTrac is indeed a 4-bar suspension system. What most don't realize is that VPP, Lawill, DW and many other common designs are all 4-bar suspension systems. Shortening the links or moving pivot placement to seatstay or chainstay does not change the number of linkages (or bars) used to control leverage and drive the shock. I'm fairly confident the Marin engineers are aware of what they're designing and aren't making any false claims.
  • 5 0
 @grizzlyatom: sorry, @just6979 is right... it's technically a 3 bar but actually a link activated single pivot; nothing wrong with single pivots.
  • 4 0
 @grizzlyatom: It's a linkage driven single pivot. Only one pivot between the rear axle and the frame, so @just6979 is correct in that it's not a real four bar suspension.
  • 1 2
 @mikeyorange: You guys are all so new-school. Linkage names are not given solely according to axle path, but rather how the rear wheel modulates the shock. I'm well aware that the MultiTrac is a linkage-driven single pivot, but it is also a 4-bar system. A faux-bar is still a 4-bar, just not in relation to the axle path. Again, let's give Marin credit for calling this a 4-bar, I believe they know what they are doing. This is the oldest and most correct description of suspension linkages I could find:

www.mtobikes.com/four_bar_linkage/index.html
  • 1 2
 @k-n-i-x-o-n: Count the number of pivots between the frame and the shock. 1) Main pivot, 2) seatstay pivot, 3) rear rocker pivot, 4) center rocker pivot. There are four pivots, just like on a Horst or DW or VPP. The 4-bar name is not in reference to axle path but rather the linkage between the frame and the shock.
  • 1 0
 The frame is the 4th bar
  • 2 0
 @grizzlyatom: actually, a true four bar linkage knows where the wheel is at all times. It knows this because it knows where it isn't. By subtracting where it is from where it isn't, or where it isn't from where it is (whichever is greater), it obtains a difference, or deviation. The linkage subsystem uses deviations to generate corrective commands to drive the wheel from a position where it is to a position where it isn't, and arriving at a position where it wasn't, it now is. Consequently, the position where it is, is now the position that it wasn't, and it follows that the position that it was, is now the position that it isn't.

In the event that the position that it is in is not the position that it wasn't, the system has acquired a variation, the variation being the difference between where it is, and where it wasn't. If variation is considered to be a significant factor, it too may be corrected by the linkage. However, the linkage must also know where it was.

The wheel guidance linkage scenario works as follows. Because a variation has modified some of the information the linkage has obtained, it is not sure just where it is. However, it is sure where it isn't, within reason, and it knows where it was. It now subtracts where it should be from where it wasn't, or vice-versa, and by differentiating this from the algebraic sum of where it shouldn't be, and where it was, it is able to obtain the deviation and its variation, which is called error.
  • 3 0
 @grizzlyatom: it's not "new school", it's being clear. Four-bar has always meant a system where the axle path is described by a four-element pantograph. There are axle paths such a system can provide that are impossible with a single-pivot, no matter how many linkages control the leverage.

There are only 2 variables that control wheel path in a single-pivot: main pivot location and swing arm length. There are 8 in a four-bar: each pivot location and the length of each bar\arm.

If you want to get real picky, they should have called this a single-pivot bell-crank (1st class lever) driven design, since a single-pivot with a 2nd or 3rd class lever (think Canyon Spectral or Cannondale Jekyll) changes the leverage in a different way because of how those linkages move their own pivots.

Yes, maybe it's just semantics, but details are important in engineering, and talking about suspension design fits that bill.
  • 3 0
 @grizzlyatom: "The 4-bar name is not in reference to axle path but rather the linkage between the frame and the shock."

Never been true.
  • 2 0
 @grizzlyatom: From that MTO page, just look at the Rocky Mountain example in the faux-bar section: you could keep adding linkages to drive the shock ad infinum, but that wouldn't make it a 6-bar, or 8-bar, or 100 bar. The wheel, the contact patch, will still only ever be located on a simple arc. What would you call those old designs where the seat-stay was basically a fork? A three-bar (swing-arm, shock/seat-stay, seat-tube)? Nope, it's still a single pivot, though direct-driven, like all Oranges or the OG SC Heckler.

Four-bar has _always_ referred to how the axle/hub is located, regardless of the how the shock is actually driven.

This thread is not about which is better or worse, just trying to be clear, because knowledge is power. I actually like (and have owned and ridden, along with a DW-link) both single-pivot with falling anti-squat that starts just under 100% around sag, and horst-link with a lower but more consistent anti-squat. Both give awesome traction that I like. but there are small things for each that are also preferential: a single pivot is often intuitively predictable as far as where the wheel will be, and the horst can (but doesn't have to) maintain that anti-squat through most of the travel along with very minimal chain growth. Both are good, and yet the feel of both can be modified drastically via the system that drives the shock.
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 Kudos to marin, making it affordable for the people.
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 The "in it to pin it" drawing with the coffee cup! Haha.
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 New Konas are looking great......... I'll see myself out
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 Nitpicking maybe, but MaxxGrip rear and MaxxTerra front tyres? Odd.
  • 2 3
 Looks like a trek session.
  • 2 3
 You mean 1/2 Carbon.
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