Commencal Supreme SX - 180mm All-Mountain Bike With HPP Suspension System

Jul 19, 2017 at 9:06
by COMMENCAL bicycles  
Commencal Supreme SX

Commencal says that they have been working on this one for well over a year, and it's hard to believe that photos aren't plastered on the interweb, considering that the prototype, with its HPP high-pivot swingarm and anti-chain-growth roller guide has been on the trails since the Meta AM V4.2 and Supreme DH V4.2 were released. Commencal's HPP rear suspension has already proven itself on the World Cup DH circuit, and now, the bomb-hole eating high-pivot configuration has been adapted to create a 180-millimeter-travel chassis that is much more gravity capable than the Andorran brand's Meta V4 range. Commencal posts the $3,699 USD Supreme SX as an enduro machine in their "official" white paper, but then goes on a rant about how it was actually made to go as big as possible at the bike park, or sail down your local zone's most extreme lines. Oh, and apparently, it's a decent climber too. Check out the official press release below. – RC

bigquotesIn a world where performance and competition often take over, at Commencal we still believe in fun!

We love climbing on our bikes but what we really want is to send it big on the way down. We’re not talking about race lines here, we’re talking about big lines, the ones that require "balls" as we like to say!

For those who want to ride harder and also for those who think that having fun is more important than a fast time, the Supreme SX is for you, it is for us."
Yoann Barelli



HPP System

Commencal Supreme SX

The first prototypes with a high pivot point (HPP) were developed on an enduro platform with 160mm of travel. There are numerous advantages to such a system such as optimized wheel path, reduced kickback, and anti-squat for better pedaling.

Let’s start with wheel path. When the bike is not moving it’s difficult to differentiate how the HPP will affect the suspension but in action, it’s a different story. The rear wheel moves backward and what better tool is there to absorb hits?

This rearward axle path extends the chainstay length, bringing more stability and grip. It’s simple and effective. To counter the influence of the chain, there is an idler positioned near the main pivot, which eliminates harmful kickback. The suspension is then not affected by the chain at all.


Commencal Supreme SX


Geometry

Commencal Supreme SX


Commencal Supreme SX


The Range

Commencal Supreme SX

Commencal Supreme SX
Supreme SX Black
Travel: 180mm
Fork: RockShox Lyrik RCT3 180mm
Shock: RockShox Super Deluxe RC3 230 x 65
Crank: SRAM Descendant 32t
Rear Mech: SRAM GX 11-speed
Brakes: SRAM Guide RE 200mm/200mm

Prices:
Europe – 3,699 €

United States – $3,699

Canada – $4,799



Commencal Supreme SX

Commencal Supreme SX
Supreme SX Orange
Travel: 180mm
Fork: RockShox Lyrik RCT3 180mm
Shock: RockShox Super Deluxe RC3 230 x 65
Crank: SRAM Descendant 32t
Rear Mech: SRAM GX 11-speed
Brakes: SRAM Guide RE 200mm/200mm

Prices:
Europe – 3,699 €

United States – $3,699

Canada – $4,799


271 Comments

  • + 253
 It's official, freeride is back baby! Now we need a shootout between the sx, nomad, firebird, balance, slayer, enduro, foes mixer, spindrift, and whatever else is sitting in the nonsense "superenduro" (aka freeride) 170/180mm travel bracket.

It's like freeride bikes are back but now that we care how they pedal we cal them super enduros which is a bit silly.
  • + 30
 Super Enduro, MegaDuro, AdventureDuro, I just wish I had more trails around me that warranted such a fun bike. My 150mm is too perfect for where I live to upsize, but it would be nice to have a monster truck!
  • + 12
 My first "AM" bike was a Bottlerocket: Me & plenty of other guys I knew used them even for XC trails. Pedaled pretty damn well, though obviously not as good as modern stuff.

Oh, & don't forget Devinci: Spartan had DH-like handling & 165mm of travel before any of those bikes were available in their current configuration. & there's a new one coming out in the next couple months. All the team riders are already on it.
  • + 25
 And the Knolly Delirium, the Radon Swoop 170 and the Whyte G-170 Smile
  • + 45
 I think it's time to bust out the jean shorts and bucket helmets folks! Freeride ain't dead, it just took a break!!
  • + 51
 It's as if the the cycle industry is circular?
  • + 11
 @Lookinforit: Especially at Comencal... They've got this, the Supreme DH, & the Furious... more gravity bikes of this caliber under one roof than any other 5 brands combined, or damn near.
  • + 1
 I knew I was forgetting a few! Thanks. @Christopop:
  • + 6
 Exactly!! People used to pedal anything with a decent suspension platform, dh bike or not. Like those who'd pedal up on heavy 2005 giant faiths, norco shores, and knolly deliriums. And thanks for throwing the spartan into the mix. @groghunter:
  • + 17
 I ride my 160 bike with 180 fork since four rides and... I like it... I also did at least 6000ft climbing in last 3 days, ah yes DH tyres. Trail riding is for pussies!
  • + 2
 @WAKIdesigns: I like your style. I've really enjoyed the 180 Lyric and DH oriented setup on my Rune. It isn't the most spry climber but that's not what's fun anyways.
  • + 1
 @HamsterPants: start digging ur trails
  • + 5
 @groghunter: BOTTLEROCKET FTW! I still have mine. I ordered it with a hammerschmidt. I even did the 2013 Big Mountain Enduro Durango race (55miles over both days). It's all in pieces but I've got a coil front and coil rear for it. Basically saving it for my kid.
  • + 1
 @jmd2drsrbtrrthn4: Pretty much the only bike I really regret selling.
  • + 1
 and hey they will probably bring back the 20x110 as superboost standard to go with these new superenduro bikes
  • + 5
 @ejopdahl: Yes! I was in this range! 2007 Giant Reign....Just getting a new bike now after 10 years, jeeez...Reign w 26ers served me well pedaling and pointing! Freeride never died, just was hiding in the woods.
  • + 1
 i've been rockin the Supreme FR (previous version of i guess what this now is) for a few years now with a Float 40 on it. i like these bikes and i want this one for an update now.
  • + 1
 @groghunter: I have one gathering dust in the basement if you ever feel like you need one back in your life.
  • + 3
 @WAKIdesigns: Been at this "Enduro" thing for a long time according to current trends. Haha. Marketing terms change, riding styles don't. At least they make more bikes now like ones we used to have to build ourselves.

www.pinkbike.com/photo/1216671
  • + 6
 @groghunter: Don't forget the Capra was released in 2014 with a 170/170 set up, and is still going strong today
  • + 3
 @adrennan: 20 mm has always been 110 spacing.
  • + 0
 @RimCyclery: but 110 has not always been 20
we had 20x110 in the freeride days (and dj forks)
then 15x100
we brought back 110 with 15x110 boost
i feel like i heard something about 20x110 with different rotor offset for super boost
  • + 31
 I use to have 180 mm now I'm at 150mm. Wife hasn't noticed.
  • + 7
 @Cronarkom: did you also go from 20mm diameter to 15mm?
  • + 3
 You forgot the Kona process 167, its in 650b for 2018 tho
  • + 5
 intense uzzi
  • + 1
 Broduro
  • + 2
 @Kimbers: I thought 2016 was the last year of Process 167? But Kona did say geometry wouldn't work with 650b wheels on the 167.
  • + 4
 @mitchbike: dude, I'm currently riding a 2008 Reign X2. I love it and I keep up just fine with my friends on their modern trail bikes
  • + 5
 @NickB01: rocking my Capra: 180 mm Fox 36, 170 super progresive Float X2, 64.5 HA /, 75 SA. Only downside it's the smaller reach for a large but otherwise I still can't find something that can make me regret my purchase.
  • + 6
 ill save them the trouble, delirium wins.
  • + 1
 Cube fritzz, intense uzzi
  • + 1
 @bogdanc: True, but at least they can actually go round a corner! I'm not digging the super long reach's these days, guess I'm just old fashioned that way...
  • + 2
 Polygon Square One EX9
  • + 2
 Can't leave the Canfield Banance out of the mix!
  • + 2
 @Lookinforit: They're called Jorts!

We can all list off a half dozen bikes over 160mm travel from yesteryear
  • + 3
 @WAKIdesigns: Trail riding... depends where .
Try East Coast .
  • + 3
 @ejopdahl: And Santa Cruz VP Free!
  • + 5
 @Kimbers:
should have called it the stinky number 2
  • + 2
 agree! just be sure to include the Liteville 601 mk 4, as it is the best in the bunch and will probably win said shootout by a country mile!
  • + 1
 @AlpineNate: process has a new design for 2018, funnily enough looks like a slash
  • + 2
 @Christopop: Transition Suppressor!
  • + 5
 Has Pinkbike ever given us a showdown before of multiple bikes? Back to back comparisons is what I want to see!
  • + 2
 @Kimbers: Wow, you're not wrong...
  • + 5
 @medardlefevre: same feeling with my "old" 2008 Rocky mountain Slayer....This bike was avant-gardist at its release and I keep on enjoying its great qualities such as the LC2R rear suspension for instance. Mounted with a 170mm RS Lyric RC2DH it gets a bit slacker, and as I only weight 65kg/70 equiped, this bike is my ripper for France's bike parks and mountains' single tracks.... and I won't buy a brand new frame unless it breaks.
I love my Slayer :-)

PS: be chic, be cool: don't buy carbon bikes please.
French kiss from Mother Earth ;-)
  • + 1
 @Crankmiester: still not as much fun as the Canfield The One.
  • + 1
 Scott Voltage FR710
  • + 4
 @Franzzz: I have my buddies Slayer from around that time in my garage right now. He did the same as you with a Lyrik. He and I ride our local single track and then hit the bike park too. I know modern bikes are impressive, but we love our old bikes. They simply make us happy.
  • + 2
 @AlpineNate: I like Kona, but oftentimes they say stuff like that just because they didn't want to put the R&D dollars into making it work, or they're too stubborn to change. Just look at the older Stabs and Stinkys with that stupid floating brake arm thing to reduce brake jack. Could have just moved on to a new layout like the Process years before then but didn't. Yeah, we know tried and true is good, but there is a point where tried and true becomes lazy.
  • + 1
 Transition TR250 is another one
  • + 3
 @Franzzz: overforked and overshocked '05 Reign still destroying the tech trails around Grenoble. Old bikes for old dudes!!
  • + 1
 @Christopop: And Knolly Chilcotin. With Fox 36 front, rear 160 Smile
  • + 1
 Cannondale Jekyll is in that new thing "super enduro", I got one and I love it!
  • + 2
 Does Canondale still call it "over mountain?"
  • + 1
 @SeanC1: hahahahaha nop! now is regular Mountain/Enduro,but is more like freeride kind of bike.
  • + 2
 @homerjm: get real, Jekyll lost everything while dropping from the Dyad platform
  • + 1
 @bogdanc: this new bike is really good IMO. The new suspension design works well,the bike is easy to ride fast compared to old Jekyll. It is very comfortable and roomy,I feel at home very quick.
Rear suspension is very active and way easy to dial than old Dyad.
  • + 1
 Voltage
  • + 45
 Why do you make me open my wallet like this for every bike you release
  • - 40
flag viatch (Jul 19, 2017 at 13:25) (Below Threshold)
 that chain wrap(minimum 60 degrees) is attrocious !
  • + 64
 For when you want your comment to be seen by a lot of people, but it has nothing to do with the original comment.
  • + 26
 Yoann lol, looks more like Gohan from Dragon Ball Z. What? I have kids!
Seriously though bike looks pretty sweet.
  • + 1
 I thought that was Brian Lopez.
  • + 3
 Just what I was about to post- goo.gl/images/M1VBWT
I think Yoann should have these made into T shirts for his fandom- or at least stickers for his bikes and tag hotel rooms...
  • + 1
 I wouldn't be surprised if that was deliberate. Look at his hair!
  • + 20
 Yes. These are the bikes we need. 180mm+ of travel, single crown, slack, pedalable, burly, customizeable. The one bike.
  • + 3
 The fabled one bike. They are slowly making a comeback. Except this time the bike industry has the experience and the technology to really pull it off.
  • + 67
 @ejopdahl: The 'One Bike' is a myth, Once you've got that 160-180 do it all bike you'll want a hardtail for local tooling about, then a BMX for practicing jumps, the a short travel FS because the other bike makes too many trails feel 'dead', then a DH bike since you're opnly riding the 180mm bike on lift days anyway so may as well have a DH bike, then an...
  • + 13
 This isn't a quiver killer at all, this is a DH bike for people who aren't shuttling/using lifts
  • + 2
 @ejopdahl: What do you mean slowly? We've had Enduro-type rigs for years. Light, good climbing, great descending bikes in all wheel and tire sizes. This is more the return of freeride in an improved form. Either way another cool option. Especially at a reasonable price.
  • + 4
 For some people 160mm travel isn't enough to handle everything they do on a bike. My ideal do it all bike is just burlier / more travel than others'. @alexsin:
  • + 2
 @Fix-the-Spade: The bike I cannot ride to the spot and then have fun down the hill is a toy not a bike. True, I love my hardtail for dirt jumps, my FS for the mountains and I'll probably buy a DH rig one day - but all of them must have enough versatility not to restrict me when I'm on one.

Btw - ALL MOUNTAIN is back! Big Grin
  • + 2
 @Fix-the-Spade: haha, nailed it!
  • + 2
 @Simon87: Oh, like a Banshee Rune? I like my low settings 64.5 HA, high settings 65.5 HA (;
Oh, and drops outs are replaceable, so what gives about new standards?
  • + 5
 My wallet says there's only one bike, and this fits the bill of "all-around". @Fix-the-Spade:
  • + 2
 @david-kooi: Banshee Rune is a sweet bike and a lot of these 170-180mm weapons do make sense for the one bike bike....but something will always be compromised somewhere, leaving you wondering what your next purchase should be to enjoy your local terrain to its fullest.

If you could afford this brand new Supreme SX, why not buy a used DH bike and smaller trail bike and cover more bases to maximise their individual potential
  • + 1
 @Simon87: Because if you like to pedal to the top of DH tracks then both bikes will suck.
  • + 1
 @Fix-the-Spade: This sounds like my garage...freeride bike, single speed 29'er, fixie for around town, and shopping for a fs trail bike. It never ends...
  • + 4
 @AZRyder: My wallet says that too, yet somehow there are still five bikes in my garage.
  • + 1
 buit my one bike recently...2010 yeti 303rdh, has full length seat tube so i can raise seat to pedal up, cant get enough of my totem coil, and ccdb coil gives me enough pedal platform.
  • + 1
 @Fix-the-Spade: yes, bikes are addictive...
  • + 17
 Finally a Commencal with some decent reach and stack in XL. This would make an awesome Freeride 2.0/park bike, especially at that price, leaving some room for a big fork upgrade.
  • + 3
 my thoughts as well. Longest reach Commy yet
  • + 1
 Such a beast! Love it. Would be my next bike!
  • + 2
 The reach has exploded!

Also, why the hpp should be good for this bike (a benefit that's not needed with the DH) : on climbs the sag is more 45% than 30%, putting that rearward going wheel far enough back where it belongs!
  • + 12
 so are they saying that this can climb?
  • + 7
 Not necessarily. They're saying it has low pedal kickback. In order to climb well you want it to have high anti-squat throughout travel.

I'm not saying it *doesn't* pedal well, I'm saying you need more information to know whether it does or not. They need to give you the AS graphs.
  • + 9
 Went back to check the seat angle...realised it actually might climb (until you stand up) but mainly that the geometry is mental. Does that say 425mm chainstays!? When everyone is so focussed on 'balanced' geometry and speed this thing apparently says 'f*ck it' in a classic Commencal style. I like it. Let's go bike parking.
  • + 17
 @ThomDawson: once you are at sag the chainstays will be longer than most bikes because of pivot location.
  • - 4
flag mudmandhbrazil (Jul 19, 2017 at 13:39) (Below Threshold)
 I don't think it will climb well
  • + 10
 Cane Creek with Climb switch...
  • + 2
 @MmmBones: I did wonder. Any idea how much growth the chainstays have at sag?
  • + 2
 @WAKIdesigns: Thay do metric shox now? RS makes Metric coils with "lock-out"
  • + 16
 No it cannot climb if it doesn't have a rider.
  • + 1
 @ThomDawson: I would speculate it "grows" about 20mm
  • + 2
 @MmmBones: I thought closer to 10mm or less. Somebody pls help us out here.
  • + 1
 Just throw a remote lockout on it
  • + 7
 @ThomDawson: When everyone else is saying balance, Commencal is saying WHEELIES! ALL OF THE WHEELIES! I bet it climbs just fine and with the high pivot it'll get a bit longer at sag.
  • + 3
 @ThomDawson: with that HPP the chainstay will be a lot longer when riding at sag
  • + 1
 At least, we already know that the Supreme V4 is 100% anti-squat, so we can expect the same with this one.
  • + 6
 @Fix-the-Spade: yeah man! And that's pretty much what I'm saying as well. I'm tired of all the 'perfect' geometry stuff, longer and longer bikes...meh. I just wanna spend as much time as possible on the back wheel and trying to fly. A stupid long and slack bike with a BB scraping along the floor won't make me any faster for the 1 or 2 races I do a year, and the rest of the time i don't wanna be glued to the trail. Long live freeride I guess?
  • + 1
 @kleinblake: I need some numbers here. Pls. Could always go full freeride 0% sag I suppose...;-)
  • + 2
 @MmmBones: you maybe already know this but I don't take much notice of DH bike geometry...the v4.2 DH has a growth of 25mm at sag (a lot more than I thought, and hoped for..)
On the V4.2 DH the chainstays are the same 425mm static and 450mm at 30% sag.
My guess is the chainstays grow a little lower than that on the SX so you're probably right. But I hope it's less than 20mm! And if anyone knows pls tell me so I can stop guessing.
  • + 2
 I guess because of the idler pulley it will have a lot of drag when you get the power down. on DH bikes it doesn't matter too much, but I wouldn't like it on any other bike. I remember the day I got rid of my chainguide and how awesome and easy the bike pedaled afterwards! And having the pulley on the upper side makes it even worse than on a chainguide...
  • + 1
 @jzPV: Having ridden high pivot trail bikes, it's surprisingly not noticeable. Feels very close to a standard drivetrain and on short rides I couldn't tell.
  • + 2
 Nomad 4 killer. Seriously there is a strong chance I would've just ordered this instead of a G16 had I known it was coming. Haha
  • + 0
 @WaterBear: or, now hear me out. This will sound crazy, but instead of the AS graph, you could RIDE it!
  • + 2
 @ThomDawson: The DH version of the HPP suspension has a short cage DH derailleur, so chain growth should be minimal..
  • + 1
 @RichardCunningham: The Supreme DH also comes with a lower guide which significantly reduces chain growth.

The high pivot bike that I am currently building has what I'm estimating to be slightly higher growth than this, and can only just function with a long cage XT and 11-42 cassette. With a lower guide in the right place the chain growth is reduced to near zero through most of the cassette range.

You'd be silly to not run a lower guide on this, if only to stop the clutch in the derailleur wearing out often.
  • + 4
 @ThomDawson:

I did a quick and dirty model of the SX in some bike cad software based on the photos, though it'll be fairly accurate for basic measurements. You're looking at a chainstay length of about 445mm at 30% sag.
  • + 3
 The suspension is quite supportive at around 100% AS in the lower gears, say bigger than 30t on the cassette. It'll give a trail-bike-like feel at the pedals when you're climbing.

The AS drops right off in the higher gears, and it'll pedal like a DH bike when you're up to speed.

This does illustrate the issue with trail bikes of this design - pedalling performance varies hugely across the cassette. Though for a long travel freeride-ish bike, you could argue that it's very well suited.

I am worried about the size of the idler - it looks fairly small, I'd like to know how many teeth it has. It will rumble a bit.
  • + 2
 @AgrAde: good work dude! I had come to the same number (though through some even quicker and dirtier means so I'm glad somebody did it properly XD.
Now do you or anyone know what a 'typical' 160mm travel bike chainstay length look like at sag? Just how much more chainstay growth does the high pivot create is what I'm wondering. Thanks again @AgrAde
  • + 3
 @ThomDawson:

I recently drew up the new Intense Tracer, again fairly roughly, from a photo. The geometry isn't accurate, I was more just interested in how their long-linked VPP behaved. Anyway, it'll be fairly representative of any normal drivetrain bike.

The chainstays start at 432.0mm, at 30% travel they are at 436.2, are at their longest at ~45% travel at 436.8 and at full travel shorten to 427.3. This is the horizontal chainstay length only - ie if you held the front triangle in place and measured only the horizontal distance between the bb and rear axle. Again, NOT accurate to the actual tracer but reasonably representative of most bikes I'd say.
  • + 1
 @AgrAde: exactly the info I was after. Many thanks :-)
  • + 1
 @AgrAde: done any Maestro modelling? Seems like chainstay growth may be more of a factor with Giants given the lower linkage path. My fossilized Reign (small) starts out at 440 before i even sit on it...
  • + 0
 No worries Thom. Nah, Maestro doesn't have a lot of chainstay growth at all. I expect your reign doesn't get a whole lot longer than 440 but it will shorten a lot after sag.
  • + 1
 @AgrAde: interesting. I'd literally never thought about this before. Might get out the tape measure and deflate the shock to check. Nowt better to do while my ankle grows back... cheers
  • + 0
 @BenPea: Just found this:
imgur.com/a/uzDrf

The horizontal direction is greatly magnified, but it shows the trance moving less rearward and more forward than the single pivot remedy.

The fork lines seem to be on a different scale that isn't shown?
  • + 2
 @AgrAde:
If you have a Sram rear mech chain growth is less an issue, but with "stiffer" shimano rear mech, the SX will break the cages. I had the issue with a jedi, I had to lighten the clutch to avoid buying cages everytime I landed a bit too far.
  • + 2
 @faul: Yeah, on the other hand the X-horizon SRAM derailleurs rely on correct chain length to place the upper jockey wheel in the right place to feed the chain on to the cassette, and with lots of chain growth it's going to pull that upper jockey wheel quite far down, away from where it's supposed to be. I'd be interested to know if it affects chain retention.

The shimano derailleurs have the upper jockey wheel much closer to the cage pivot so it doesn't move near as much as the chain is pulled tighter, but they have that tighter clutch which wears more and can break.

I'd like to know what's best. I guess I'd choose possibly compromised performance over breaking the thing though!
  • + 1
 @AgrAde: wicked thanks. Is horizontal distance more relevant that actual distance?
  • + 1
 @BenPea: It's just one way of thinking about it really. I think for normal drivetrain bikes their actual length at 0% sag describes them fine (what geo charts normally show), you don't really need to think too much into it. And high pivot bikes can't really be compared apples-to-apples but knowing how their horizontal length changes through the travel is useful to get an idea of how they behave, particularly from sag to mid-travel.
  • + 1
 @AgrAde: i get you, because it's only with high pivots that the variation through the travel is actually big enough to be significant. I guess with a bike that needs to be nimbler, i.e. anything that isn't dh/hardcore fr, this parameter could be an issue in terms of agility...
Good work, professor!
  • + 1
 @WaterBear: Thankfully, the news is mainly good regarding AS for this bike. See mrblackmorescorner.blogspot.com.au/2017/07/commencal-supreme-sx-2018.html
  • + 8
 Also addressing this to Max Commencal build this bike in a 29er with 160mm of rear travel and I'll buy another of your bikes although frame & shock only I just bought a AM V4.2 just over 2 months ago but 29er with a HPP would be my ultimate bike the HPP design is truly the best all around suspension set-up there is for bicycles & and this will all be proven out as move forward from this date others follow the lead of Mr Max Commencal the greatest bike builder of our time!
  • + 3
 All of this! Add in a sub 65˚ HTA angle.
  • + 1
 @gonecoastal: Take a look at the head tube profile. Top end being the same diameter as the bottom it should be able take a 2 degree angleset easily.
  • + 3
 @Fastfish11 : Max is the great business man, the great bike builder is Nicolas Ménard.
  • + 2
 @jollyXroger: The specs in Commencal website say it's IS top headset so unless they provide an in-house angleset like for the DH 4.2, aftermarket won't be possible...was thinking about that since for the bike park I'd rather go for a 63.5º-64º and this is now a serious contender for what I thought to be my next bike Nicolai G16 which has a 63.5.
  • + 1
 @P-Munari: Yes, I see. That's a bummer. Maybe Works Components can make you a custom one. Drop them a message.
  • + 1
 @P-Munari: Mojo G-16 is even slacker. Run the longer shock version for 175mm rear travel, add an angle reducing headset and offset bushings if you must. You'd be around 60* HTA
  • + 7
 Unless they include a lower chain guide pulley (which shouldn't be too hard as they included ISCG tabs which currrently aren't occupied) the chain should grow quite a lot when the suspension compresses, shouldn't it? Now they have a long cage rear mech that probably makes up for that but as most of these modern rear mechs come with a clutch mechanism, wouldn't that hamper the suspension action? I think that ARBR bike got quite some stick for this.

I'm suprised no one got sad because of the lack of bottle mounts. This is PB, right?
  • + 3
 one thing is crazy about the chain position it only grabs 1/4 of the chairing. weird even with N/W chairing looks like it gonna fall of
  • - 1
 Yeah, it'll see a heap of chain growth if not run with a lower guide. I'm not really sure why they haven't included one, I wouldn't want to ride the bike without it.
  • + 0
 Made a rough model of the bike in some cad software. Derailleur will move around less than expected, still way more than a standard drivetrain bike, and I'd recommend a lower guide to anyone buying it.
  • + 7
 There needs to be atleast one comment complaining about Commencal still using Pressfit bbs, so here you go. Other than that, bike looks fun.
  • + 2
 Problems with PF BBs seem to mainly arise due to tolerance issues. The SRAM PF BB in my Meta V4 is going strong and creak-free after more than a year of riding, so Commencal must be doing it right.
  • + 1
 Or I got lucky and got a frame within tight tolerance. But I guess what I'm saying that pressfit does not equal guaranteed crap.
  • + 2
 @DMal: I am not a fan of press fit bb's but we have a few around and never had a problem with them. In fact they seem to last longer then gpx' or bb92's.
  • + 2
 @DMal: or a "more than a year of riding" is not long enough to tell about its durability... come back after 2-3 years and then I'll accept it Wink But my PF started giving noises after 3 months, I'm even missing my squared BB now...
  • + 1
 @brooce: fair point. But I seem to kill the bearings on any bb, whether pressfit or threaded, after a season or so. The fact that the bb on my Meta is still running well is nothing short of a miracle to me.
  • + 1
 Yep I think it's tolerances etc, I've never had issues with PF on different bikes (original PF going strong in my 3y old (only bike) spectral).

And clearance... Cf meta HT cromo. The CS couldn't be where they are with threaded
  • + 9
 Yoann looks like the Wolverine.Sick bike too.
  • + 11
 And Son Goku
  • - 1
 more like the hulk without green colour
  • + 3
 Will we see Cecile on this monster at the next round or maybe Mr Barelli as it seems silly to take her off her now perfectly dialed Meta V4.2 or how about Rampage? A single crown fork at Rampage maybe as we saying freeride right?
  • + 5
 I uh...I don't see a water bottle holder...clearly this isn't a real Enduro bike.
  • + 2
 Already have the V4 supreme on a medium with a headset adjuster to make the reach 398mm. Best bike I've ever had and already had v1 and v2 versions. So pretty much I believe this one will be a killer. Wish though that Commencal would have at least a decent after sales customer service. Their service suck so no way I will ever buy anything from them.
  • + 2
 Freeride Lite... My bike is 170mm front, 165mm rear. Coil shock and the only carbon bit are the bars. Bang on 30lbs. The Freeride renaissance is nearly complete, just need a few 650B coil single crown forks...
  • + 1
 Those freeride guys had balls, and imagination, and talent! You never knew what was going to happen next in a freeride video.
  • + 4
 My daughter saw that picture and said, "he farted." I would have to agree with her assessment.
hmmmmm.....bikes.
  • + 4
 Someone should do something about that pic of Hulk. He's scaring the kids away.
  • + 1
 OK, super, BUT: a "funny" detail for us, funny europeans:
This wonderful bike costs 3699USD and 4799CAND which respectively gives 3128EUR and 3300EUR.
The price for Europe is 3699EUR.
I live in Toulouse, France, 1h30 from pyrenees mountains and 2h30 or less from Andorra, Commençal's nest.
Does it means that I have to move to North America to buy a cheaper Commençal bicycle? Smile
  • + 6
 VAT.
  • + 4
 Just pick it up at their spot in Andorra. Local Pickup gets 10% off Wink
  • + 1
 Does anybody know how much energy do you lose in the extra pulley? Or is this meant to be an almost purely dh rig were you dont care about efficiency of he drive. I might be dumb, but I have never noticed anything like pedal kickback (I allways thought it's a kinda hoax for the internet forum bashers) on my bike (150mm). So all in all I don't se much need for a complicated design.
  • + 1
 The energy though idler is a good question. Can we get a real answer to this?
  • + 1
 @getsomesy: Well, your derailleur has 2 of those. And the combined efficiency of that, the chainrings and the cassette is about 95-97%. So adding one idler pulley you probably lose another percent point.
  • + 4
 @zonoskar: There is one BIG difference of those in the derailleurs. This pulley is transfers all your pedaling power. So you need much better bearings. But also you loose efficiency when bending a loaded chain.
  • + 3
 Kickback is a thing, particularly noticeable when braking or when pedalling over bumps. If you haven't ridden a bike with good pedal support and low kickback then I wouldn't criticise, the performance is real. The idler isn't as noticeable as you'd think, I couldn't tell the difference in efficiency on short rides, and on longer rides the more active, more bump compliant, less kickbacky suspension meant I was less fatigued than on a normal bike. So I couldn't care less about a percent or two loss through the drivetrain.
  • + 0
 @getsomesy: just had the dh version of it in the stand at work and you had quite some drag of the pulley wheel
  • + 4
 My next bike is a Banshee Darkside, now this might give me options.
Does it play nice with a DC fork?
  • + 1
 It better well! A lowered 40 FLOAT would be neat on this bike. Also a FOX/Shimano build too.
  • + 1
 If it's anything like my Supreme FR it's basically a slightly shorter travel DH bike you still can't pedal up hill. Better thought of as a DH bike for tight technical trails.
  • + 1
 Did anyone forget the Foes FXR. I am also running 650B on my Norco Truax yes they do fit with out scrubbing. But it's about time they came out with more park worthy bikes that can be your goto bike for everything.
  • + 0
 Who cares if it "climbs"? It only needs to climb well enough to get to the top. Which it will do. There is only one and I mean only one reason to climb a hill. That is to go back down! If you want to sprint up a hill then get yourself an ultra light carbon XC climbing thingy, and throw on your spandex. This isn't for that type of riding. I love it!
  • + 1
 This bike looks so sick. My only observation that no one here mentioned is the fact that these are SRAM GX 11spd... If the bike hasn't been released yet, why don't they slap the all-new GX Eagle 12spd?
  • + 1
 Looks like an awesome park bike. I wonder if this is rated for a dual crown? It'll be interesting to see if more people buy this or the new Furious more?
  • + 1
 I have a 2011 specialized sx trail. 180mm front and rear. Ok its 26", can i still play? Its one of the funnest bikes ive ever owned. Prob will keep it forever if it lets me!
  • + 1
 Finally some longer reach numbers for Commencal, hopefully their other models follow as well. Reach and pressfit BB were the only things keeping me away.
  • + 1
 I feel like the next step is just slapping triple crown forks on bikes like these. We are so close to downhill bikes that can pedal to the top.
  • + 3
 Parity USD-EUR, europeans get f* once again?
  • + 3
 USD prices usually don't include taxes (which vary from state to state). So you'll probably have to add 15-20% to the USD price.
  • + 7
 @Ploutre: divide that in half.....but yes
  • + 3
 VATs in Europe are around 20%. In US the sales tax is between 5 and 10%. So prices are pretty much the same as the US price does not includes the sales tax.
  • + 2
 @Ploutre: not in tax free New Hampshire
  • + 4
 @Bertleman: Or tax free Oregon Smile Oh wait, already forgot about the $15 new-bike tax :/
  • + 1
 Might be a misprint. The exchange rate at the EUR price would be around $4500 or so. Could be wrong, but I mean, I like it and I have s*** luck.
  • + 3
 looks like a e-motor will slide right in there... har har
  • + 3
 freeride never went anywhere... posers came and went.
  • + 1
 It's sweet that free rides back. And at this price it's a great buy for sure. Too bad the intense uzzi is no longer ma
  • + 1
 Please tell us the chainstay length at sag point and full compression for this bike and the supreme 4.2
  • + 1
 Finally some decent reach and seat tube numbers from commencal. Probably too much bike for me though.
  • + 3
 Looks like an Evil...
  • + 1
 Sick bike. That's a deal for $3700. I still can't afford it but great deal.
  • + 1
 Rear der cable routing looks atrocious! redundancy in the line up... just ride a furious
  • + 1
 Bring back the Scapegoat, DB! And add it to the mix of 180mm travel bikes...
  • + 1
 Okay, I've criticized commencal in the past but I'm eating my hat on this one. This bike is amazing looking.
  • + 1
 Still rocking my 2010 Trek Scratch 8. 170 / 170mm at both ends and I can pedal it.
  • + 1
 great park concept -not a quiver killer , needs a short travel 29er as wingman
  • + 1
 I have no idea if it's a turd or a terror...i just want that damn thing biologically and without reason!!!!
  • + 2
 If it goes up at all I will buy it.
  • + 2
 This bike is giving Nomad 4 a good run for its money.
  • + 1
 Wouldn't the lack of chain-wrap around the cassette lead to increased wear?
  • + 1
 Links in article don't work @pinkbike I'm going to take a wild guess though... PF BB @commence ? Sucks
  • + 2
 TUTU Tuesday on a Wednesday!!!!!!!!!
  • + 4
 Tutu Tues... wait...
  • + 1
 steroids are synthetic variations of the male sex hormone testosterone
  • + 1
 180mm trailbikes are where its at! Banshee Darkside!!!
  • + 1
 Here I am still riding a 26" Darkside from 2015..
  • + 1
 You have to shell out when it's time for a new chain
  • + 1
 Not a lot of chain wrap on that chain ring. Yikes
  • + 1
 Great price for the RS top components Hope to see 29er like dh commencal
  • + 1
 Maybe a gearbox is just around the corner...
  • + 2
 It does seem like you could squeeze a box under that suspension set-up, but I doubt we'll see it happen. Frame is already standing at a 4kg light (15kg for the whole bike, probably size M at that). Max Commencal is dead set against using carbon fibre as a frame building material.

Even Rob Metz of Zerode didn't carry this design from prototype to the final product. Taniwha being very simple in design (no fancy linkages) is also not very light by today's standards.

Back to Commencal, Pinion gearbox would shoot the price through the roof and Commencal are keepin' it real (their top spec bike is sub €4500), price-wise. Gearbox will remain a niche thing for a foreseeable future.
  • + 3
 Some time ago I asked them on a french forum.
They tried some gearboxes but weren't happy with current offers.

I think we need a less expensive gearboxe before seeing Commençal with it.
  • + 1
 Double 200mm rotors - Nice!
  • - 1
 I read that as HPV suspension. That chain path looks ridiculous but glad that DH suspension is becoming more pedal/trail friendly.
  • + 2
 Looks so good!
  • + 1
 Nice build for the money, especially the real deal fork. Thanks.
  • + 1
 safe to say the freeride bike has returned.
  • + 1
 That is a serious Mortal Kombat pose right there...
  • + 2
 straight in my basket
  • + 2
 what is this :o !!!!
  • + 1
 Never mind that Yoann looks like a bad guy from Dragon Ball Z. Gym much?
  • + 1
 Great, now I have to buy 2 chains
  • + 1
 Ok, just need the bike park and I'm in!!!
  • - 2
 Oh man. That is a good lookin bike. That said my meta am v4.2 handled crabapple hits no problem, so I don't know if you really need that much more unless you're tryin to do x-ups at loosefest.
  • + 2
 With that logic I am not sure whether your meta isn't too big for what you do since BMX racers hit sht not much smaller than Crabapple bits on their little bikes Wink
  • + 0
 @WAKIdesigns:

Touché, but also kinda proves my point. Who is hitting shit much bigger than that, and actually pedaling to it?

Just seems like a bike that very few people would actually put to its full use.
  • + 1
 @Longroadtonowhere: I personally do not feel guilt of owning a big bike. Also I would love someone to explain me why 160-180 is too big while DH bikes are cool...
  • + 3
 @Longroadtonowhere:

One difference is that an overshoot with your trail bike on crabapple will destroy you, your bike or both. On a bigger bike that overshoot is less likely to end in tears.

The other difference is that rough trails do exist, and you need more suspension for rough trails. Freeride isn't just smooth jumps.
  • + 0
 same exact concept as the new antidote darkmatter??
  • + 0
 Some bs when describing Hpp.
  • + 0
 I donj't like Commencal. I want this bike.
  • - 1
 BALFA !!!! ...now make one without all that Sram crap and I'd be all over it
  • + 2
 No doubt! They already make a Fox edition Meta am V4.2, maybe soon?
  • + 1
 Bike looks sick
  • + 1
 What a beast!!!
  • + 1
 still look like BALFA
  • - 2
 Seat tube is still too long in relation to top tube lenght. Stop designing sizes to fit a T-Rex, please.
  • + 0
 Why no carbon?
  • + 1
 Environmental viewpoints
  • - 1
 why not just buy a supreme 4.2 ???
  • + 5
 Because it can (barely, but still) climb! It's a good bike for certain places. For example, I live near Cypress Mountain in Vancouver, and a lot of the trails are proper DH trails. However, a lot of people can't get shuttled up, and the climb is too long to be worth it on a DH bike. This is perfect for that because it can make it up the road climb and can rip the trail!
  • + 2
 @AydinR: and Commencal and Barelli are now based in Squamish :-)
  • + 1
 @AydinR: you mean gnarlier than any other dh trails lol
  • - 3
 XC officially dead
  • - 3
 Where is the E Bike version?!!!
  • + 6
 Hopefully on in some e bike site and never here
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