Press Release: Introducing the Canfield Brothers' Balance

Sep 16, 2014 at 13:39
by Canfield Brothers  

Views: 57,917    Faves: 515    Comments: 50


Canfield Brothers' Balance

The original Balance, released in 2006, was known as one of the first true mini-DH bikes. While our second generation Balance is aimed more for all mountain use, it still retains our original Balance’s aggressive heritage. The goal with the new version was to produce one of the most efficient pedaling bikes in its class, while giving it the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating, DH performance. Designed around 27.5” wheels, the geo was also configured to also run 26′s.

After 10 years of development, we are proud to announce the 2015 Canfield Brothers Balance is in stock and shipping now.

The new version of the Balance is one of the most efficient pedaling enduro bikes in it s class while maintaining the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance.

The original Balance released in 2006 was known as one of the first true mini DH bikes. While our 2nd generation Balance is aimed more for all mountain use it still retains our original Balance s aggressive heritage. The goal with the new version was to produce one of the most efficient pedaling bikes in it s class while giving it the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance. Designed around 27.5 wheels however the geo was configured to also allow the use of 26 s.

Features
● Patent pending Canfield Balance Formula Suspension
● 160mm travel
● 27.5” and 26” compatible
● 66° head angle, (27.5” with a 160mm Pike)
● 16.75” chainstay
● Front derailleur compatible
● 142x12mm rear spacing
● RockShox Maxle included
● Colors: anodized black or brushed with six different link color options
● Frame weight: 7.5lbs without shock
● Sizes: S, M, L, XL
● Price: $2100 US, (frame and Cane Creek DB Air CS)
● Frame and fork/wheel/crank and pedal packages available

Frame Details

Constructed from 6061 aluminum, the Balance features a tapered headtube, 73mm bottom bracket shell, ISCG tabs, 142 x 12mm rear dropouts and stealth dropper routing. Oversized, 15mm pivots and Enduro Max bearings are incorporated for low maintenance, even in the wettest of environments. Stout tubing was used to to ensure the frame is strong, stiff and ready for hard charging.

Available in anodized black or brushed finishes, with six different link colors.

The original Balance released in 2006 was known as one of the first true mini DH bikes. While our 2nd generation Balance is aimed more for all mountain use it still retains our original Balance s aggressive heritage. The goal with the new version was to produce one of the most efficient pedaling bikes in it s class while giving it the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance. Designed around 27.5 wheels however the geo was configured to also allow the use of 26 s.

The new version of the Balance is one of the most efficient pedaling enduro bikes in it s class while maintaining the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance.

The original Balance released in 2006 was known as one of the first true mini DH bikes. While our 2nd generation Balance is aimed more for all mountain use it still retains our original Balance s aggressive heritage. The goal with the new version was to produce one of the most efficient pedaling bikes in it s class while giving it the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance. Designed around 27.5 wheels however the geo was configured to also allow the use of 26 s.

Suspension Design

Over the last 15 years we have been refining parallel link suspension designs. In 2006 we had an incredible feeling 6” bike, the original Balance, but the subtleties of perfect pedaling were not quite dialed. In 2008 we introduced the next evolution, The One, with a “magical” pedaling feel. Combined with 8" of travel, it was a bump eating machine that pedaled as well as bikes with half its travel.

Seven years later, with a patent pending, our goal with the Balance was to create a super efficient pedaling, 160mm platform, with massive bump eating performance. Utilizing a vertical wheel path, the Balance has a consistent feel, no matter where you are in the travel. A smooth, even, progression rate provides a supple feel off the top, mid stroke support and ramp up at the end to prevent harsh bottom outs. To aid in its pedaling characteristics, we tightened the moving virtual pivots around the chainring to neutralize the forces from the suspension, allowing for maximum power transfer to the drivetrain. Lastly, the instant center moves down through travel eliminating pedal kick, a trait that is prevalent in many bikes in this genre.

Trevor Parsons getting sideways on the Canfield Brothers Balance. Photo Credit - Reilshift Media

The new version of the Balance is one of the most efficient pedaling enduro bikes in it s class while maintaining the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance.

Geometry

Canfield Brothers Balance 27.5 Geo

Canfield Brothers Balance 26 Geo

Special thanks to ReilShift Media for the helping us on this project – Reilly Kintzele, Dakota Huntley and most of all, Trevor Parsons for throwing down on our Balance!

The new version of the Balance is one of the most efficient pedaling enduro bikes in it s class while maintaining the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance.

The new version of the Balance is one of the most efficient pedaling enduro bikes in it s class while maintaining the classic Canfield Brothers bump eating DH performance.


Please see canfieldbrothers.com for more details.
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197 Comments

  • + 99
 As he dissapears in to the fog so does the balance of my bank account!
  • - 87
flag FlowMasterO (Sep 17, 2014 at 3:23) (Below Threshold)
 I commented here so i will be at the top and people will see what I have to say.
  • - 31
flag HardtailHucker03 (Sep 17, 2014 at 5:34) (Below Threshold)
 looks kinda like an SX trail
  • + 5
 Looks like a sweet bike!
  • + 13
 Tempting for sure, but I wonder how this could have possibly been in development for 10 years. Any ideas they had back then surely didn't involve today's geometry or 650b wheels...
  • - 2
 2006-2014 isn't 10 years.
  • + 9
 And you can "develop" things without releasing them ya brainiac
  • + 1
 oh! didnt see that. sorry.
  • - 6
flag Silliker269 (Sep 17, 2014 at 8:50) (Below Threshold)
 Whoa wait now, 7.5 lbs without the shock and still $2,500 Canada .. I will be spending my money elsewhere, Thanks
  • + 10
 @maxombardy - We have been working on and refining this suspension design since 2004.
  • + 34
 If you want to sell me a bike, and convince me you suspension layout is the best you can get I want to see the bike get smashed to hell of the nastiest rock gardens around. Not being pumped on a bike park.
  • + 39
 did you watch the same video? That was my favorite video of the year so far, amazing riding, diversity in riding terrain and excellent cinematography. Freakin sick, made riding that bike look like so much fun. Good Job Canfield!
  • + 30
 Obviously you haven't seen Remy destroy whistler
  • + 15
 Whistler absolutely destroys bikes dude. 5 to10 laps a day getting trashed over a whole season if it lasts in Whistler Park it will probably last anywhere.
  • - 16
flag gizmofreeride (Sep 17, 2014 at 3:37) (Below Threshold)
 and no side-shot of the suspension layout... great way to sell a bike that was developed for 10 years...
  • + 11
 A. Riding whistler means tons of brake bumps which takes an active suspension design frint and rear to make comfortable.
B. He hit Duane (sp) which is huge, especially on an all mountain bike (atleast imo)
  • + 2
 @ Domo-
Says someone who's been there. Holes in the berms that would swallow a Volkswagen... I actually Jr to pick up a new bike as my 6,5" is still getting rebuilt from last visit a month ago!
  • + 12
 also, their suspension design IS the best
  • + 5
 good job from the brothers even if there might be a light weight competition these days. In the end it is about how a bike rides and works for a long time. So thumbs up for this bike. I like the look.
for those who haven't seen Remy riding wild on an AM bike...
www.pinkbike.com/video/373442
  • + 4
 @ gizmofreeride - Head over to canfieldbrothers.com/frames/balance , You find the side profile image you are looking for.
  • - 6
flag JemMcP (Sep 17, 2014 at 9:08) (Below Threshold)
 As much as I don't want to buy the new Yeti, their edit's are sick smashing the bike through rough lumpy rock gardens. Prime.
  • + 8
 So...your purchases are directly controlled by cool videos.... got it. Wow.
  • - 3
 I buy my bikes after I've test ridden them mate, just as everyone else does. It was more a comment on the marketing style the majority of companies are using now a days. It just makes an interesting comparison.
  • + 4
 The thing is , smooth , bermed flow trails are exactly what 75 % of people ride who buy these do it all/mini-dh/enduro bikes , from what I see at the trail centres and bike parks is people on enduro bikes riding blue trails all day long.
  • + 6
 JemMcP I'm Just sitting here wondering if you've ever been to Whistler, The North Shore, or the Pacific Northwest and checked out our trails? Let me reassure you, the trails this bike was made to deal with aren't tame by any stretch of the word. A lot of the stuff in the video might look medium sized, but its not…and the tech stuff in whistler is punishing to say the least.
  • + 10
 @theedon ....ty

anyone who watched that video and thought that the trail was tame has spent way too much time on their couch eating cheetos and watching red bull rampage. That trail had some sick smooth corners that got shredded! however the jumps were huge for an AM bike and there were some chunky sections he absolutely blasted through. Its funny how tough people get behind the keyboard. its like watching my washed up uncle complain about Aaron Rodgers arm strength during Sunday football. watch the video again.
  • + 3
 Did you not realise that was Whistler the second half lol? And hitting the Garbo zone too!
  • + 5
 I just had the privilege of riding the 2015 Balance with the 27.5 wheel set the other day. The trail I rode was Dark Hollow in Brian Head, UT. If you know it, you will understand just how gnarly this trail is. suited for a full DH bike, with huge loose rocks, scree fields and off camber roots. I had planned to ride my specialized demo but had a chance to ride this beast. It was fast as hell, soaked up the big hits like a sponge and I was able to peddle and accelerate through parts of the trail that my demo couldn't have. I'm sold on this rig, anyone want to buy a 2012 Demo?
  • + 2
 @mnmaverick Were you able to test it out going uphill? Decent climber?
  • + 3
 @zutroy There was a good climb right out of the parking lot with about a mile of rolling single track before you drop in. I was more than happy with the climbing ability. Nearly non existent peddle bob and the larger wheel set I cruised right up, flipped the switch on the cane creek to DH and dropped in.
  • + 0
 Guys not trying to say that the riding you do is tame, we've all ridden in different places and it varies massively from town to town let alone continent. Again, my first comment was more of a remark on the style of edit rather than the terrain. Lot's of fast flowly style jumps and hips, apposed to the slow-mo style rear wheel tracking over huge rocks, Clay Porter style. @Dabomb684 the second half was a lot more like it in fairness!
  • + 2
 There was a good climb right out of the parking lot with about a mile of rolling single track before you drop in. I was more than happy with the climbing ability. Nearly non existent peddle bob and the larger wheel set I cruised right up, flipped the switch on the cane creek to DH and dropped in.
  • + 3
 I second domo kun i ve been to whistler twice ; trail like a line dirt merchant and freight train are not rock garden but damn they Will get out the most of your bike and yourself
  • + 6
 @JemMcP, we were unable to film a lot of the gnarly features up in the garbonzo zone because the fog was so thick. Plus we only had one day in the park, so we wanted to focus on features that it would more than likely be mostly used for, but also tried to add a few of the gnarlier features showing what it was capable of (such as the very last stunt). Lastly, we tried to stay away from slo-mo, we wanted the downhill to look as fast as possible!
  • + 3
 simply awesome video and incredible riding. makes me want to get out there and ride! good job canfield.
  • + 2
 @KillingtonVT Thanks for the link! That's what i was missing from the article. Definitely a looker for me in the future!
  • + 2
 @ladderbiller17 Really appreciate your reply mate. Loved the last shot, rolling off into the fog is a genius way to end the piece, love it!
  • + 23
 A 160mm All-Mountain bike that pedals well, whilst leaning more towards aggressive handling. And they only mention the "E" word in reference to the bearings. For that Canfield, you have my utmost respect. Big Grin
  • + 17
 I think 26"/650B compatible frames are the way to go. This way people can decide what works best for them. I wonder however if they achieved that without sacrificing frame geometry for some of the sizes.
  • + 2
 If more companies can make bikes with adjustable chainstay lengths, BB heights, and head angles (like the Scott Gambler, albeit a DH bike) then we could see more frames built this way that accept both without causing issues for each wheel size.
  • - 1
 There seems to be a real tradeoff, though: this bike only has 2.4mm of BB drop with 27.5 wheels. Purpose built 27.5" bikes usually have 10mm or more. It seems a shame to get a 27.5 & not get one of the main benefits, as that 10mm+ of BB drop has made a huge difference in the 27.5s I've ridden. (I haven't really liked the ones I've ridden that didn't have the drop. They felt more wagonwheelish.)

This bike was on a very short list for my next bike until I saw the BB drop.
  • - 4
flag shuwukong (Sep 17, 2014 at 8:12) (Below Threshold)
 One problem with 26"/ 650B compatible bikes is that reach is not adjustable, and thats one important measurement that I look at before I buy, so such bike actually favors 27.5" more
Another thing is that increases stack to fit 650B wheels (but somehow some manufacturer managed to keep the stack height the same)
  • + 4
 @groghunter - I have to apologize as I made an error on the chart. The BB height on our Balance demo builds with Maxxis 2.4 HR2's, an external Cane Creek 40 series headset and 160mm Pike is 13.75", (349mm). This is a BB drop of 8mm, not the 2.4mm listed in the chart. (You are correct, a 2.4 BB drop would be SCAREY high. ) The chart can be found here - www.pinkbike.com/photo/11430094
  • + 5
 well well well, back on the short list... Rest assured I'll tell my buddy who had written the balance off for the same reason.
  • + 16
 Cool. I'd like to see a shootout between this, the Banshee Rune, and the Nomad.
  • + 2
 Seconded.
  • + 0
 Third...ed
  • + 6
 Yes please , throw the Norco Range in there for fun too
  • + 3
 YES and a chilcotin, nomads are to expensive. I might actually be able to make a decision then :-)
  • + 3
 I'm sold on the rune for the 12x150 dropout option. How many other AM bikes do you see with that?
  • + 3
 We really do need a proper shootout on these rigs, which one is the best/fastest .. the single bike review's these days don't really help because they are all good bikes, but which one is the best. The closest thing I have found on last years bikes is on enduro mtb
  • + 1
 A shootout would be rad! Chuck some intern on 3+ bikes for a 30 second section of trail and time him!
  • + 1
 Shoot outs theoretically are good, but in reality, the biggest advertiser is favored more often than not. Disregardless, why trust someone else's opinion that could be different to yours for a plethora of different reasons.
  • + 1
 That's why you get 5-10 guys to test each bike, but yeah I agree money can be involved behind the scenes fairly easily
  • + 13
 beauty!! good job on the dbl link bike with 16.75 cs. the big companies just don't get it
  • + 9
 Complete bikes can be had in the 30 lbs. range without trying too hard. The bike as shown is 31 lbs. with a good mix of TOUGH gravity parts! We will have many build examples under 30 lbs. Light enough to be agile, but also reliable! Great video Trevor and ReilShift!!! Pure class~~
  • + 8
 All the people on here who are putting down Canfield have obviously never ridden one of their bikes. Canfield Brothers have a dedicated fan base because these bikes are some of the best on the market and their customer service is second to none.
  • + 6
 Bikes like this are gonna make DH bikes obselete... I guarantee 99% of us who watched that video cant ride like that with a full DH sled... So makes one think what the use in having a big rig when getting the right skills is more important... at least you can climb with these!
  • + 11
 As long as their are real DH tracks and real DH races, there will always be the need for real DH bikes. You'll never see this bike raced on a steep, technical DH track.
  • - 2
 Whistler isnt real DH, it s enduro !
  • + 6
 These bikes in my view are akin to hot hatches... You can use them everyday yet still have fun when neccessary... Not a track day toy with one purpose alone... I agree with you yes on World Cup level they have their place... But realistically how many people are racing that kinda terrain every weekend and need that kind of squish... PB has said so themselves... They review mid-travels more than anything else coz thats what people are buying... These bikes are doing to DH what the 27.5 did to the 26... It's just more subtle... and lets be honest... there is only one place where 200mm+ travel is gonna make a real difference and thats when you smash into a hardcore rock garden... everywhere else is fair game provided your technique is up to scratch... GTI vs Catherham Seven... look at the sales figures and that will answer the question..
  • + 3
 No doubt that this category is bigger than DH, plus I totally agree that this style of bike is completely suitable for really aggressive trail riding or bike park laps. More single-crown, pedally bikes will be sold compared to dual-crown DH bikes since they are more applicable. But they won't render DH bikes obsolete since there is a need (as you also noted) for 200mm of travel but equally important is a need for slacker geometry, low BB, long wheel base etc. A 66° head tube angle doesn't bode well on steep tech.
  • + 16
 more people buy KFC or McDonalds than go to proper restaurants. Doesn't mean KFC and McDonalds are better...
  • - 3
 dh bikes can pedal with the right rider just like 160 bikes can do dh with the right rider... There is no better feeling then passing XC riders on climbs on a 40lb bike
  • + 8
 DH is both a type of bike and also a style of riding. The feeling you get railing runs on a long-legged DH bike is a unique experience and no park or enduro bike will ever replace that. Never mind the fact that you will just simply last longer and get in more runs on a DH sled vs a park bike in real downhill conditions. Oh, and DH bikes are cool...don't discount cool factor for driving sales. DH rigs aren't going anywhere.
  • + 3
 Dh bikes look more desirable a lot of the time. It's a bit like buying a supercar rather than a bog standard Porche - they are equally fun on a track (the Porche more so arguably) but the supercar is sexier.
  • + 3
 that depends on the tracks you ride. I wouldn't call a 66 degree head angle fun on a really steep track, or a fast wide open track. I wouldnt call 160mm travel fun when you are plowing rock gdns all day long.
  • + 2
 I ride an mk1 nomad and I have to say it handles everything. But it also has a 67 degree head angle, which makes steep technical stuff very uncomfortable. I've ridden bike parks and it's awesome for the smoother stuff at whistler, Aline/fade to black/dirt merchant etc. get to Canadian open and your wishing for more travel up front and slacker. This bike seems like simply another rendition of something like the older nomad with one degree head angle difference.
  • + 1
 Once again, it comes down to which type of tracks you ride the most. If you ride really rough dh but still want to pedal up there will always be a compromise whether it's on the ups or the downs.
  • + 6
 After waiting for 3 months for this first production run, I finally got my balance frame yesterday. The build quality js absolutely top notch, the hard anno black with orange linkage is my dream color combo! But enough of the present...why did I buy this bike.

I met the Canfield clan, brothers, Sean and Vin, on the boat to a local island gravity hot spot and immediately knew these guys believe in riding, believe in making the best product, and are all around positive community members. Two weeks later I got to demo the balance after riding a Jekyll,sight, range, Bronson, and Mach 6. What caught my attention about the Balance, was the playfulness of the short chain stays, the stiffness of the rear triangle, and the confidence the bike inspired overall. I quickly made an appointment to demo the same bike at Galbraith where we rode for 6 hours and covered anything from EVo-unemployment line-atomic dog (twice) to unknown loamy beauty. The bike made me smile. It made me laugh. It made me scream. The suspension climbs like a Jekyll in the 95mm mode, descends like a nomad, and somehow makes 2 stroke sounds....I immediately sold my ktm to fund my own Balance. I don't regret a thing.

Haters can hate, just ride it and make your decisions off of that. Thanks Canfields. This bike is a dream.
  • + 9
 I'm sure the bike is fine...but that rider! Powerful precision...no drama...quite Awesome Dude!
  • + 2
 Agree - incredible riding in that edit.
  • + 5
 I've had an hour or two on a pre-production version of this bike and it was stunning. I had ridden a 6-10 other new bikes that day and this one easily felt the most comfortable and confidence inspiring out of the gates.

I don't think it'll make you a "better" rider, but after 5 minutes on it, I dropped the biggest ladder I've done to date without hesitation.
  • + 1
 What other bikes did you demo? Would this bike be light enough for cross country? There aren't too many steep climbs where I am at, but I still need something that climbs.
  • + 4
 @digitalsoul I rode a Pivot Mach 6, a Norco Sight, Norco Range, Rocky Mountain Altitude, Santa Cruz Bronson.

I guess it depends on how you define "cross country". Since you are looking at a 160mm trail bike build by downhillers. Take it on the Colorado Trail? Nope. Would I have this as my only bike? Yeah. I would. Would I take it on a 6k ft day? Yeah.

Everything climbs. Like a fat pair of powder skis, the question is often "how much extra are you willing to work on the way up for more fun on the way down?"
  • + 7
 Finally a 2 wheel size compatible, awesome looking bike that you don't have to sell a kidney for..
  • + 2
 Banshee Spitfire?
  • + 2
 Or Banshee Rune v2 if you want to stick with 160mm of travel.
  • + 0
 All 27.5 frames are 26" compatible, but you have to install a longer travel fork to combat the bottom bracket being too low and pedals scraping the ground. That is why the 26" option shows it using a 170mm fork, to get the longer axle to crown height needed in order to make the bike ridable.
  • + 3
 Except they're not because of a difference in rear axle height and seatstay/chainstay length. The Banshees have different dropouts for the different wheel sizes.
  • + 2
 Yes the Banshee does have different dopouts, but the Balance doesn't. The Balance was designed around 27.5" wheels, but the option to run 26" is there because any 27.5" bike can be run with 26" wheels. The bb is lower on the 26" geo for the balance which is the difference between the wheel size as well as the longer fork. It's not like there wouldn't be enough tire clearance going from 27.5 to 26" wheels.
  • + 2
 Having seen both, I think the Balance is a nicer looking bike than either Banshee(design and finnish wise). And rides awesome. Banshees are still nice. I'd get the Balance but.
  • + 3
 This type of design, with the frame pivot locations close together and similar length links, I believe to be superior for a 'fun' bike, I made an attempt to design a bike myself and ended up with a very similar system, it has a high enough 'virtual pivot' that sits just above or on the chain line helping to resist pedal bob through chain tension, but had a near static virtual pivot and very little mechanical inefficiency in the linkage (what most mainstream brands are using to create a good pedaler). Which creates a nice natural suspension movement akin to a basic single pivot albeit with slightly more ramp up throughout when the shock is attached to the top link in this design. It also does an ok job at preventing brake jack.

Ultimately the system should be as fun and predictable to ride as, say, and Orange Alpine, but with improved pedalling and braking (anyone who's owned an Orange knows how predictable and fun they are).
  • + 6
 Can these guys make a bike that is not awesome? Well done Canfield, the bike looks sick!
  • + 7
 So if I buy this bike, I can bike like him?
  • + 3
 The video is wild....!! Love it,
However, 7.5 lbs without shock.....??
'The goal with the new version was to produce one of the most efficient pedalling bikes in it's class' Really? The frame without shock is almost the same weight as a V10 with a steel coil.....
  • + 6
 Just thinking the same thing. The video is great. And that frame looks awesome, but that is real damn heavy.
  • + 17
 I've got one - one of, if not the first in the UK! It feels heavy picking up just the frame, but once built up (to me) it feels spot on, plus, riding it I havent noticed any extra 'weight'.

Also, please notice the price difference and intentions: to get the same quality bike, but much lighter it would have cost big bucks (after all, pinkbikes favourite joke right now is just how many kidneys you'd have to sell to buy a V10). Yet going for a similiar priced option, although lighter, wouldnt have been as durable.

That was my logic, and my opinion, take it as you will! I'll whack up a user ride report tomorrow (big ride today) to give some actual feedback on the frame! Happy riding
  • - 28
flag bikecustomizer (Sep 17, 2014 at 3:27) (Below Threshold)
 Hm...15 years of researching...OMG...
What's special in this suspension design ? I didn't see any. The BB is placed at the and of the front triangle. That's enough to understand the rear susp will compress under pedalling forces.
Or please, describe, what special is made to cheat the mother nature, because actually the pics are made so no one could really see how the susp parts are placed behind the front chainring and etc.

The most pedal efficient full susp bike is made by Mongoose - FreeDrive suspension (Teocali, Bootr, Pinnr, Nugget etc ) and GT - AOS (sterted from 2014y models) suspension. These are actually the same design in slightly different implementations.
Here we have the rear susp do not move when you pedaling even really hard because the pedalling force vector is pointed counter suspension moving vector. That is possible because of the BB placed at the lever link not directly at the front triangle.
Oh, and don't talk about the BB moves behind - this bull**it is already boring, because when you stay on the pedals the front moves forward and that is good.

Travel 8" ?
Whell Mongoose Boot'r and Pinn'r has 210mm of rear travel.
And seems it is not the maximum for this design. But is it necessarily to have more ?

Other designs which use the BB placed at the end point of front triangle are generally meanse the same FOR PEDALLING: whereever the shock placed or whatever the links are made like - when you press the pedal the BB with the front triangle moves down relative to rear susp frame.
Thus you need some "brain" in the shock to distinguish pedal force to block it or suspension force to let it go. There are such shocks. But they all are compromise solution.
  • + 10
 Definitely some "brain" is needed here...
  • + 10
 Hey bikecustomizer, how's being an armchair engineer going for you?
  • + 15
 bikecustomizer needs to learn more about suspension and less about hype before making such comments... ***shakes greasy KFC chicken wing at screen inanely***
  • + 5
 Mmmmmmm. KFC......
  • + 3
 What's our vector, Victor?
  • - 7
flag bikecustomizer (Sep 17, 2014 at 6:23) (Below Threshold)
 @ bishopsmike
Yes, some more "brain" would be good for you and others to explain at least a tiny thing.

Can anyone of you, oh the greatest engineers, explain kindly BUT SERIOUSLY and technically, without stupidity and blah blah what's special in this suspension ? (And any other of the same kind)
Obviously - no any thing.
And if I'm wrong - why ? Describe please.
...if you are all so highly educated in susoensions, as you think.

@ madm3chanic
So It would be nice, please, explain what you are know what I don't, what special in this what's weong in others.
Go on. I really want to know.


Actually, I see the trend: whatever a "fresh" bike design or frame just appears at the Pinkbike rapidly the crowd appears and cries - "IT IS SUPERB! GREAT! I WANT IT! REALLY GENIUOS! I WANT IT" and so on.
Funny Smile
  • + 3
 It's not special. Every suspension bike is exactly the same, they just use different stickers. Shhh - it's a secret.
  • + 5
 this thing is $900 less expensive than the new carbon nomad frame with no shock, but only 1.3lbs (590g) heavier. not that heavy at all.
  • + 10
 This dude needs another redbull and a hooked-on-phonics book. oh an the Canfield is sick, superb, great, i want it, its really genius, and i want it again.
  • + 4
 I'm guessing the extra pound or two buys some durability when ACTUALLY using it as a mini-DH. There was some long term test I read a while back on random 6x6 bike...."best bike ever...I never miss my DH...this thing is fun and more than capable...pedal up and down, especially DH trails too...I LOVE it" ...dude gets to Sun Peaks and breaks the ass end off on day 1 ...HAHAHAHA
  • - 2
 Ehh... I would guess that the nomad is just as strong (if not stronger) than the canfield.
  • + 1
 Bikecustomizer..I suggest you either test a canfield bike for yourself or at least look into their suspension system a little deeper before you make such unfounded assumptions..I think once you do you will see what sets these bikes apart. I have not personally ridden a balance yet but I have owned a Jedi for the last 4 years and I haven't found another bike on the market that rides like it does. Honestly.. once you own a Canfield it's hard to switch to another brand..
  • + 3
 @bikecustomizer- maybe, you noob, because i have been making full sus bike frames for 15 years and know the insane amount of effort, dollars and man hours involved in making a suspension platform actually good.
you armchair engineers read some retarded comments about rising rates, stiffness and pedal bob and think you actually know something about suspension, but im gonna give you a massive slap in the face and say you know next to nothing. you probably ride a bike with an air shock im willing to bet.
you say what makes this platform special- i have no idea at all. and i dont pretend to know, because i did not spend the thousands and thousands of hours dialing it over the same tracks, day in day out, over many prototypes over successive years, changing a pivot point 10mm to the left at a cost of thousands of dollars. i have done that for my own frames tho, and im willing to bet my left nut that canfield did that too.
what i do know is that the build quality looks fantastic, and visually it appears to be a fantastic frame worthy of the pages of PB. that alone is worthy of our admiration, because again, little outspoken armchair engineers such as yourself have no idea the kind of effort it takes to make a machine to this kind of quality, consistently.

go away troll, learn life before you try to school it
  • - 5
flag bikecustomizer (Sep 18, 2014 at 5:08) (Below Threshold)
 @madm3chanic
"you say what makes this platform special- i have no idea at all."
So what are you talking about ?
Obviously again just blah blah.
"changing a pivot point 10mm to the left at a cost of thousands of dollars"
Hahahah! And seems you will do that for next a hundred years for your special frames.

"But im gonna give you a massive slap in the face."
You'd better take an easy, kid.

@BeerGuzlinFool
The same blah blah stuff from you also, man.

Listen, guys, you seems like only WRITERS not readers.
Read what i wrote carefully.
I wrote about the PEDAL EFFICIENCY of this suspension FRAME DESIGN.
Look carefully to the 3D images of the frame at the Canfield webpage. If you have a good imagination you will understand just obvious thing: pressing the pedal the BB will move down-forward relative to wheel axle pivot point.
And the only thing that can make something against it is the SHOCK. So it must be some "brain" inside the shock to distinguish between the pedaling force( when the crank is in it's forward stroking sector ) and the hit to the rear wheel.
It is usually the compromise. And one can dial the shock's shim stack or pivot placment a 100 years resulting in 0.1% better pedaling efficiency, but the problem of loosing energy under pedal strok will persist because of such susp frame design.

Doctor, you сure in wrong place Smile

If you have something special to explain, please do it in tech terms, normal words, without an blind agression and rudeness.
But no one still did.
Ok. I wait, I'm really interested what's special in it. May be something inside frame tubes ? Or the clever dude in the shock ?
Seems the reason is beyond Smile

I'm not going to fight or troll this bike or this company or other company. Just see nothing new and special.
Good bike, however, not so good price IMHO.
That's all, folks. Take an easy.
  • - 4
flag bikecustomizer (Sep 18, 2014 at 5:16) (Below Threshold)
 That Cane Creek BD shock is very nice and so expensive.
The Balance generally is very well bike. There is no doubt it is well dh machine.
But about the pedal efficiency of the FRAME design - common, it's making me giggling. The pedal efficiency of that frame design is nothing special. Only the shock can do it's job and add something to make it better.

Vertical rear wheel movement ? Old news.
And what does it mean VERTICAL when you heading down the hill ? Seems purpendicullary to the surface - I'm scared to ride such bike in the steep descent trails.
Ideally the rear wheel should move backward-up to kinda wrap(or slip or flow around -whatever word you like) the obstacle when you moving FORWARD.
Especially when heading down the steep descent hill.
The so called "vertical" movement is simply the maximum that can be achived in such designes where the BB is at the front triangle and the rear susp moves apart.
That's why it is so promoted. Several other companies has that "vertical" movement of the susp.
It is better than forward-up movement.
But it is worse than backward-up movement.

Just see nothing new and special.
Good bike, however, not so good price IMHO.
  • + 5
 @ bikecustizertool, you need a schoolin, noob.

your idea that "pressing down on the BB moves the BB down-forward" is ignorant to say the least.

you are completely disregarding the force transferred thru the chain, and the effect that can have on the rear wheel. if you put the pivot point (or in the case of this bike, the instant virtual center) above the chain, when you "push the pedal down on the BB" your BB can jump sharply upwards as your pedal stroke is in the apex of its revolution. are you telling me you know where the instant center of this platform is, thru all its stages of travel? i think not. how about its pedal feedback profile? and what does its compression gradient look like Einstein? these are the factors that dictate what you perceive to be "pedal efficiency", which incidentally is a completely unquantifiable expression that people like yourself that know very little about suspension theory bandy about like this years enduro trends.

once again, you know absolutely nothing and you are out of your depth terribly. for you to make statements like "its nothing special" is just plain ignorant. it may be amazing, it may be shit, you have no idea.

ill quite happily "take an easy" once fools like yourself leave my little world.
  • + 4
 Maybe if bikecustomizer throws in a few more pseudo-engineering terms in his posts people might think he actually knows anything about frame design.
  • + 3
 What's wrong with air shocks???
  • + 1
 Air shocks are affected by heat more than coil shocks, so when you go hard on descents air shocks tend to lose some performance.
  • + 3
 All shocks function by turning kinetic energy (motion) in thermal energy (heat) by forcing fluid through little holes.

Generally speaking the more fluid in a shock, the longer it takes to heat up the fluid to the point of thinning and fading.

Xc shocks like a fox float use a tiny amount of fluid, and fade pretty quick. dh shocks like a vivid ccdb use the same amount of oil in the coil and air versions and neither really have fade issues.

The only down side to air shocks is having additional seal which can add friction to the initial movement of the shock. These seals are getting super dialed and smooth, so anyone who has ridden a pike fork, vivid air, or ccdba will generally tell you that that they are super smooth.
  • + 2
 bikecustomizer, your passion for the URT with floating BBs is justifiable(just you didn't quite do it), as the design has some merit(rearward axle path), but it does have some things some people don't appreciate, and moving BB is one, linkage with riders weight on it another.. I like the look of the High pivot Enduro GT(whatever it's called again), I'd rather see it with an idler and no moving BB to achieve pretty close to the same effect using whatever dialed in anti squat is desired with idler placement.
Canfield are renowned for the rearward axle path bikes. More-so than pretty much any other brand, so maybe do some research there. The Balance is their least rearward axle path bike. With better rolling 650b wheels and a desire for simplicity, public acceptance, pedaling efficiency, shock technology, suspension design and intended usage, they've obviously come to the conclusion this is the best BALANCE of compromise to use for this bikes intended use.
  • - 3
 @NoSkidMarks
Where did you find me talking about URT ?
GT AOS is not URT, you're wrong.
"I like the look of the High pivot Enduro GT(whatever it's called again)"
What does it mean CALLED AGAIN ? Previously till 2014 there was I-Drive and it is just totally different suspension design and approach.
Now they make AOS, it is really the same of Mongoose FreeDrive with some improvements.
It really do the job, rear part moves backwrad-up eating bumps like crazy.
And it is not a high pivot or low pivot like one can find at the suspensions with the BB placed at the front triangle.
It is wrong to describe AOS or FreeDrive with the characteristics of conventional susp where the BB is placed at the front triangle.
BB moves slightly backward RELATIVE to the FRONT TRIANGLE.
But you stay on the pedals, you move with BB, so relative to you it's not moving. Isn't it good to move the weight backward when heading down the hill or jumping ?
Sitting on the saddle the moving of the BB is not even noticable as like as standing on the pedals.
When pedalling everything stays still like hardtail frame. What to need more ?
  • - 2
 Also the chain is never overtightened or overloosened in this suspension.
...No any pedal bobs or other issues, what are you talking about ?
I can't really understand why the people like you try to invent the problems that not really exist in FreeDrive or AOS.
I have Mongoose Teocali, ride everything I want and can, there is no any issues you talk about.
And the pedal efficiency is just like hardtail. No difference at all. Without any expensive shocks or other "propedal brain" stuff.
There is no need in shock lockout here!
Also there is no any issues with the linkage, my weight 85kg, I dropped 1.5m on this bike.
The pivots are 10mm solid steel, bearings 28x10x8
GT made AOS even with 15mm diameter linkage pivots. It's more than enough.

People used to old suspension designs are affraid of something new and unusual tend to invent a virtual problems making the elephant from the bug.
Other people, like Madm3chanic, maddly know everything about the suspensions. That's why they're not able to invent new things and make a breakthrough.
Seems the guys from GT and Mongoose do not know everything about the suspensions, thus they were able to make the most pedal friendly suspension design.
  • - 2
 You mentioned "Enduro GT", seems to point that it not suits for DH, right ?
Well, I agree that AOS with 130mm-140mm is not enough for some really big drops about 5m.
But look at mongoose Pinn't or Boot'r, it is a sick DH machine, FreeDrive susp there has 210mm of rear travel.
I saw the guys in 2014 Whistler DH ridding Mongoose.
Other example is Chriss Ackrigg doing crazy things riding his Teocali.

But it is not the point.
The essense is that I never told the Canfield Balance is BAD bike.
I asked what is new and special in their SUSPENSION FRAME DESIGN (appart from shock) ?
Still did not receive the answer, besides just rudeness, mad pseudo engineeirng bull..it from the guys that did not konw theirself (as they wrote it) and who just trying to make things complicated hazing the essence.
And also I still presume the pedalling efficiency is not the best.
The Giant has already a couple of years ago designed the suspension that very pedal friendly (as they told) and where the BB is on the front triangle and rear frame moving vertically.
Who else...well, what about Spec Demo 8 susp desing ? Isn't it also very pedal friendly and veritcally moving ?
And so on.
So, what is new here apart from others? Just good DH bike for acceptable money.
I agree, the Canfield try to make things more acceptable for people - yes, it really so, comparing the $2100 for this bike to $2500...$4000...$9000 for some others.
  • + 0
 But I only doubted about the pedal efficiency and novelty of their susp frame design and linkage (apart from shock).
There is the simple question:
- will this suspension frame design work just the same pedal friendly and bump eating with MUCH SIMPLER than Cane Creek DB shock (like long DH springer kinda Fox vanilla or other ) ?
I'm very doubt it will.
On the other hand:
- will one feel the difference in pedaling efficiency if to substitute the CaneCreek DB shock just with the rigid steel stick (or totally frimly lock the shock)?
I presume - yes.

And of course, I'm interested to try and test and compare it. No doubt.
  • + 4
 my god you are without doubt the biggest nob i have ever encountered here on PB. why do you continue to alienate yourself from everyone on PB by calling out users like noskidmarks that actually have a bit of life experience and don't ride cheap teenager's bikes like Teocali's, and by continually making stupid and unfouded statements time after time.
just go away mate, you are a [penis] and nobody wants to hear your stupid opinions. you really have to face facts that when someone demonstrates that when you can not back up your silly childish opinions, you need to back down and take it on the chin. i feel you are missing some very basic concepts about suspension design in your narrow minded pursuit of some other designs, and a very limited understanding of what you perceive as a "brain" design in a shock (unless of course you're talking about telemetry, but i see no evidence to suggest you even know what that means).

you are a hipster lightweight punching in the heavys here mate, just know when to stay down.
  • + 1
 @madm3chanic
Oh, you still alive !? I'm surprised, cause you seemed were at the insult stage.
Look, pivoted creature, seems like your really purple-mad in your little all-suspension world.
Who in healthy mind will accept you seriously after this madness you're writnig ?
Your posts full of sh..t to fog the essense.

That not me who continue to alienate myself but you who continues to pour rudeness on me and others.
Your posts have no any usefull thing about the essense of my questions and doubts.
Why do you start writing @me and still do ? No one reads you, dude Smile
  • + 1
 i pour rudeness on you "and others"? so who are these others onto whom i pour rudeness? no, it is entirely yourself. but if i offend, i apologise.

please justify your arguments using actual quantifiable terms, not pseudo-science and opinion. then you will have submitted a comment worth reading!

please, i invite you to the stage; justify a single one of your claims using actual science, and i will continue the conversation old chap! if not, i will leave you in the hole that you have so neatly dug yourself.

and please, i implore you, use proper english! its hard to debate your senselessness when you cannot write in received dictation.
  • + 1
 @madm3chanic

"you are completely disregarding the force transferred thru the chain, and the effect that can have on the rear wheel. "

You claim me completely disregarding but it is you who admit that nonsence, I do not even admit it.
And then you derive the bullsh..t from your nonsence adressing it to me.
You're really mad.
The force is transfered through the chain everytime you push the pedal. So I imply it everytime when talking about pedal pushing.
Because for me it is nonsence when the real (not futue prototype)bike that no have a chain or the force is not transfered somehow through it.
And you seems know the situations when the force is not transfered through the chain under the pedal push ?
Very interesting really.
  • + 1
 "if you put the pivot point (or in the case of this bike, the instant virtual center) above the chain, when you "push the pedal down on the BB" your BB can jump sharply upwards as your pedal stroke is in the apex of its revolution."


Yes, you are right, this is the problrem of such designs. That's why the pivots are placed low.
Tell me please, where did you see and what design you are particulary describing ?
What does it mean "if to put the pivot point above the chain..." who do that ????
Canfield in Balance design do it ? No. It is low pivoted.
So what are you talking about ? and why ?

"when you "push the pedal down on the BB" your BB can jump "
CAN JUMP....Hmm and also CAN NOT, right ?
So will it ? When? Why ? What if can not ? Under what circumstances ?

One more time: what design you are particullary talk of ?

Dude, what do you trying to do here, I can't understand ?

I made the simple statements about this design: the design is no innovative as for me, the pedalling efficiency is not the best.
That's all.
But the overal bike is well.
So why you call me a troll ????

And you fogged the things with unnecessary "IF TO PUT" and "CAN"
Everyone knew long ago what can be "if to put..." without you, no matter you think about people here are noobs or other bad words.
I call this design not new "as is", already implied all the pivot puts and virtual "can_s".

And the last but not the least:
so you think the AOS and FreeDrive is of a wrong pivot placement cheap crapy designs that has a pedal bobs, BB jumps upwards and unfriendly pedalling ?

If yes - you just an idiot.
  • + 1
 @madm3chanic
" i pour rudeness on you "and others"? so who are these others onto whom i pour rudeness? no, it is entirely yourself. but if i offend, i apologise."

What a light simple man you are: one time just poured rudeness, just the other time appologized!
Very simple! Of course why not! there is no any responsibility here!
Well done!

But you must to do something more than just write "I APPOLOGIZE" to me accept your appologizes and not a one time but for every single bad word used towards me.
Because it is you who startde this unpleasent things to write here in my adress.

And you
  • + 1
 @madm3chanic
Man, you are fantastically impudent fellow!

2 days ago you officialy has written:
"you say what makes this platform special- i have no idea at all. and i dont pretend to know..."

After that you wrote so much in my adress HAVING NO IDEA AT ALL about that suspension, but pretending you do!

So who you are ?

And as for me I just see nothing new and innovate in this design, doubt it is best pedal friendly - that's all.

I'm not obliged to justify any argument to you after all that. You are blank place for me.

I'm end on this.
You can write whatever you want trying to proove you know everything about suspensions.
  • + 0
 no sir, i do not know everything, far from it, but i certainly know much more than you ever will. i find it ironic in the extreme for you to call me a simple man, in that you are clearly suffering from a distinct lack of intelligence. it even appears that you cannot identify basic sarcasm.

and come now, lets not take my words out of context. you know as well as i that when i stated i have no idea at all, i was referring to how nice it felt to ride, not the fundamentals behind a short-link 4-bar (what you probably know as a VPP) suspension platform. or perhaps you did not even realise this bike is indeed a short link 4-bar?

it somewhat surprises me that you choose to end this debate; after all of your "rebuttals" i thought you would not be bright enough to realise when you are clearly making yourself out to have no knowledgeable opinion whatsoever.

in the interest of maintaining an intelligent debate, would you like me to prove to you the concept of positive bottom bracket displacement upon pedaling? because if you believe it to be impossible, you are sorely misinformed, child

once again, you have made the claim that "pedaling efficiency is not the best" of this bike; so now i implore you- define for me what it is that you conceive as "pedaling efficiency", and explain to me how you arrived at the conclusion that in this frame, it is "not the best"?
  • + 3
 Chill you two. I think there's a lot being lost in translation here. Loose the angst and try to share some knowledge.
Bikecustomizer. GT RTS, SUNN Radical, GT IT, Lahar, many others share the suspension design of the GT Enduro bike(I'm talking about the high pivot one, I can't recall it's name, as I tried to say before). Accept with the new GT, the BB is on the linage.
I love my Mongoose EC 4X, one of the most fun bikes I've ever owned.
The big travel mongooses feel boring and non plush though IMO.
Without seeing the wheel path, leverage curves, anti squat etc, it's not really worth commenting on the Balance having nothing new suspension wise. There's no need to have a totally new design when small tweeks can change an existing style design a great deal and change the bikes balance of compromise a lot to favor something different.
I referred to the GT and Mongoose as URTs in Jest, they are the closest design to an URT, but yes, they're different.
You have made some interesting points, it's hard to see some through your English though(no offense meant).
  • + 1
 @NoSkidMarks
Yep, I agree, becaues English is not my native language. Sorry for mistakes, but I just try to describe my thoughts in my words not complicating the essence.
Nevertheless, seems you're understanding me, isn't it ?
I'm not any angry at all Smile Because it's just a bikes, nothing more.
Ok, now I see GT RTS and others.Yep, absolutely agree - it is high pivot design. Just obviously.
But new GT AOS is just another story. It is even NOT the same as I-Drive. And it is the same as FreeDrive of Mongoose and Schwinn Rocket Comp.(Oh yeah! Cheap crap! of course! don't buy! etc.)

Mongoose EC 4X ? Oh, dude, seems like you as me also riding teenage cheap crap bike Smile Or mine Teocali is crapier ? hahahah Smile just joking Smile

About boring and non plush...well, what if try another better shock ? I can't say it is boring for me or non plush. Depends of weight and air preassure.
Where one could get the wheel path, leverage curves, anti squat etc. when there are no any info on this particular suspension design even at official web page ? Smile
The only what is allowed are pics and 3D images that shows nothing special in susp frame linkage design and many text about how beautiful it is.
Well, I don't beleive the words.

" There's no need to have a totally new design when small tweeks can change an existing style design ....."
Here I should disagree a little: If it eats tremendous money=energy, time then one should be self warned - am I doing rightway ? if the solution is so hard achived or there is no solution in this current system seems like it needs to make a stepout from the system or leave it to completely different solution at another level, that free of base problems of the previous system and takes radically less efforts ?
Hope you understand that English Smile

Yep, they are close VISUALLY but are different.
May be the same with the Balance: looks the same as many.
But, damn, why do not to show what is special and different ?
  • + 1
 Are we talking about the GT Force?
You missed my point about GT RTS, SUNN Radical, GT IT, Lahar, many others, They're not just also high pivots, they share the same linkage desgin accept the new Force has the riders weight on a semi unsprung part of the suspension.
I owned Teocalis. Very boring un plush bike. Might be the shock, but other bikes felt better with same shock.
Companies don't print all data probably because E engineers that get a diagnostic wrong can mislead potential customers easily.
  • + 1
 @NoSkidMarks
If we talk about GT Force it has the "I-Drive" susp and it is not the same as Angle Optimized Susp(AOS)
The "AOS" is the newest GT's suspension design. But it is the same as FreeDrive of Mongoose, just look Smile
And the BB is on the link-lever also.

Am I missing something... You have Mongoose EC 4X, you told love it. It has the same FreeDrive susp as Teocali.
So why then Teocali is unplush and very boring ? But if you think so, it is your decision.
Might be not only the shock but also the fork and rider weight/shock setup.
I like mine, at least at this time.

By the way, I've looked through the Canfield web site and found several interesting things Wink
-JEDI frame(very interesting) and it's description
-and the shock tuning positions images for Balance, particulary Low Speed Comp string: Supple to Pedal Efficiency Wink
  • + 2
 Force is AOS. My first Google item www.youtube.com/watch?v=lZhSLXAUtRI
Mongoose 4X is basically a plush hardtail, it's great at that ;-) Teocalis suspension is docile and lifeless feeling, same with Booters I've ridden, guessing because you're standing on a moving part. They're feel nimble, but that's about it.
Do a test on either GT with about the same travel and a Canfield Balance, report back then, otherwise your statements are relying on your engineering skills and our diagnosis of your English translating.
AOS is not the best suspension design for everything and everyone, no suspension design is. The Balance may well be a better Balance. From my experiences on it and Mongooses, I'd quite confidently say it is for most things. Keen to ride a Force, but I think it'll reaffirm my Mongoose findings, hopefully better though.
I think this conversation is over, we've all made our points, we're just rambling now.
Balance is an awesome little bike.
  • + 1
 @ NoSkidMarks
Yep, you're right. 2014 Force is AOS now.
But in 2013 it was I-Drive: www.gtbicycles.com/usa_en/force-1-0
The Fury is I-Drive still.

Mongoose EC 4X is the same suspension that Teocali, isn't it ?
Then how can the Teocali be lifeless and the EC 4X not ?

DOCILE AND LIFELESS...may be I'm missing something but the word "DOCILE" means "easily taught"...and LIFELESS seems like not so easily taught. Smile

The Boot'r and Pinn'r alos has the same susp DESIGN as EC 4X, Teocali.
I'm talking only about the DESIGN apart from shock.
What fork and shock were on your Teo and EC 4X ?

I agree with "guessing because you're standing on a moving part." Yes, but the pedalling efficiency is superb. And I like it very much because I ride more kinda not DH than DH.
I think just the plushness and supple is not the main goal. And I can live with the style of working of FreeDrive Teocali, because I' pedalling much. It has enough plush for me.

JEDI Canfield is much better than Balance. It has 3" backward moving and 8" of upward. And other things.

Zerode is just the best seems.
Just look and read at their site - it just confirm my thoughts and words.

But the Balance is good, of course. I never tell contrary.
  • + 1
 "Mongoose EC 4X is the same suspension that Teocali, isn't it ?
Then how can the Teocali be lifeless and the EC 4X not ?"
Yes. But as a hardtail style bike(sub 4 inch travel) it is good, as I said. For a trail bike, most want Pedaling and plushness. Can't recall what shocks. 4X has a tiny rockshox in it.

"I think just the plushness and supple is not the main goal. And I can live with the style of working of FreeDrive Teocali, because I' pedalling much. It has enough plush for me."
The Balances target cliental I don't think are focussed mainly on riding up. It's made by guys passionate about DH, one of the Canfield Brothers goes in Red Bull Rampage. They've made it more pedal friendly, but it's not an XC bike ;-)

"JEDI Canfield is much better than Balance. It has 3" backward moving and 8" of upward. And other things."
Better for what? It's a DH bike. Balance is as the name suggests ;-)

I have a Zerode, it's great. Would like to try a Jedi.
Everyone loves their Balance because it's awesome fun. Ride one and see. If non fun stuff like riding up is your main focus then stick with the Goose and maybe see a doctor or dominatrix ;-)
Let this die now. You have proved your dislike is because you are more focussed on pedaling, pretty safe to say others reading this in future aren't like minded with you,so don't taint it for them aye.
  • + 2
 @NoSkidMarks
...Dominatrix !?!?!?!? OH MY GOD, NO!!!!
...Gone to buy the Canfield Balance.
Smile
  • + 1
 So you should buy the Balance ;-) Seems your GT love for it's pedalabilty is heavily lost when comparing the equivalent GT(160mm) to the Balance. The GT Sanction as reported by this very website needs a shock lockout to have any sort of climbing capabilities. and is very much built the same as the Balance Geo and speed/fun wise, the GT even moreso DH orientated and probably less maneuverable at anything but DH speeds and then still probably not any better than the balance at speed.
The Balance seems the better Balance, spreading it's purpose further than either of the equivalent GTS.
  • + 5
 Good god that dude is a good rider. Makes it look so fun and so easy. Makes the bike look perfect. I want one.
  • + 6
 Thanks iscariot! (excuse my lame username, its been awhile) And thank you everybody else for the positive comments! We had a blast filming this and are extremely happy to see people getting stoked on it
  • + 4
 Welcome to Bellingham, bros! Glad to have you all around. Love my DH Tough Canfield hoops. BTW that's a hell of a moto on the step up on P.T.!
  • + 2
 @vw4ever! - Thanks man! Yeah, Trevor sent that set up for sure!!!
  • + 4
 I may have got the wrong end of the stick, but how can it have a vertical wheel path and also have the instant centre move down through the travel?
  • + 1
 that is a bloody good point.
  • + 2
 If the instant center moves down through an arc (rather than straight down) it could give you a vertical axle path.
  • + 1
 I don't think it can, if the instant centre moves forward a long way and only down a smidge then the path might be close to vertical, but I don't think you'd see much benefit in terms of eliminating pedal kick as the axle path would be incredibly close to what it would be with a true vertical path. I must say that I am not a bike designer so could be way off the mark.
  • + 1
 yes, it most certainly can. the point is that when they say "vertical" they also mean "vertical and forward a bit, like an arc", not literally straight vertical. it kinda sounds like arguing semantics, but a wheel can move generally upwards on a swingarm and have an instant center wherever it damn well feels like be it up, down, forward or backwards compared to where it started from.
remember the concept of "instant center" refers to the center of rotation at any given point of its compression, so that point can change considerably at any stage of the suspension's movement.
  • + 1
 what you are saying is that the wheel travels generally upwards? that doesn't really set it apart from any other rear sus design out there.

By Canfield specifying "vertical" it does kinda suggest that the wheel moves straight upwards, which would require that the IC either moves upwards too, or is an extremely long way in front of the front axle. They however suggest it moves downwards. I still agree with Ad-j, this is a bit strange....
  • + 1
 yeah if it was moving literally straight up it would have to move the IC up wit it, but the only way for it to move straight up was if it had a pair of rails or cylenders like a front fork attached above it somewhere in the air behind the riders head, and no pivot point at all if you get me. the comment "vertical" is kinda misleading if you take it literally.
  • + 5
 These guys make awesome bikes!
  • + 3
 I have the old balance, and it definitely didn't feel overly heavy. It's definitely more confidence inspiring, and this one seems to retain that trait.
  • + 4
 Ill give you a dollar if u can find a bad review of 2011 and above canfiled one.
  • + 2
 Admittedly i'm not much of a fan of Whistler edits anymore... Because they're to damn much of them (especially on a line and dirt merchant) but I have to say this video was very impressive
  • + 3
 The NSMB guys have a ride review. Seems like it works well even on a long xc style loop.. nsmb.com/canfield-balance-2015
  • + 1
 @mnmaverick @mountainyj had a great time riding with Lance on his BALANCE on Flying Monkey and King Kong yesterday here at Rampage. Best word to describe his riding on both of Virgin's gnarliest trails? UN-INTIMIDATED
  • + 4
 26' compatible! good job Canfield
  • + 4
 Best head tube badge in the buisness.
  • + 1
 @sshredder - Thanks man!
  • + 5
 Tasty looking bike!
  • - 5
flag wolf-amongst-lambs (Sep 17, 2014 at 5:08) (Below Threshold)
 I commented here so everyone can see what I have to say before they see what FlowMasterO has to say
  • + 4
 great stuff, like the 26" compability
  • + 3
 Now all we NEED is a review. Canfield is just one of those brands that intrigue me, they always have.
  • + 4
 NSMB Launched their review this morning: nsmb.com/canfield-balance-2015
  • + 5
 damn dat sexy
  • + 4
 Bitchin'...
  • + 3
 Looks nice! Good job Canfield bros!
  • + 3
 Hope to see em out at rampage! Maybe a demo for a fellow camper Smile
  • + 1
 Yes sir! I have one for you.
  • + 3
 Im still loving my "the one" frame.
  • + 3
 if i rode full sus, it would be an option, but ill stick to my hardtail Smile
  • + 2
 awesome bike, awesome rider!
  • + 2
 Shows well that WHISTLER is ENDURO !
  • + 1
 Waaaannnnttt Will have to see how kona sorts me out frame wise. Otherwise this is near the top of the list!
  • - 2
 I never understand when companys say "10 years in develpment". I mean, no wonder it was that long, if you think about how many changes to tech have happened in that time. Geometry alone has changed loads over the last 5 years, a 160mm bike now days is super slack, and the 27.5 wheels? They have only really been established for a year or two. So, no shit it took ten years, because you dragged your ass so long, you must have basically started from scracth every 2 to 3 years due to trend changes!
  • + 1
 ..........
  • + 1
 whats the song? sorry if its already been answered
  • + 2
 7.5lbs w/o shock?!! Ouch
  • + 1
 Anybody reading comments this for down? Look at the proto type cranks.
  • + 2
 No longer protos. Just got me some 155's and I'm nobody special. Stiff as, well... something really, really stiff.
  • + 2
 16yr old at a peep show.
  • + 1
 Sweet if i could use a boxxer on it!
  • + 1
 the day they go carbon...
  • - 3
 Its just to little too late sure it looks to be a great bike and if they released it 4 years ago more people might have taken notice. But as it sits today the 160mm market is packed full of cheaper lighter bikes ... I didnt see the warranty on it but if its not lifetime (as some of the other bikes have) then they can take their durability claims back home
  • + 1
 Seriously? Who wants a bike that's half a turd lighter that may fail and then your bikeless for possibly months while a warranty replacement gets sorted or denied. I'd rather a bike built to last than one built to gain sales from a silly light weight. Any bike can be built light enough now that components are so light.
Ride one man, if you still give a damn about not having the lightest bike bragging rights, then don't buy one. If you realize fun, speed or Confidence offer you more, get the Balance.
My mate has one, couldn't be happier, hitting stuff he wasn't before on his first ride, hadn't even played with shock or forks much yet. and faster.
  • + 0
 well if other bikes are lighter and stronger and cheaper then........ Something being heavy doesn't mean its automatically stronger. This bike isnt doing anything new or different which isn't bad but pardon me for my lack of excitement. the 160 market is flooded so no one is going to drop balloons or throw a parade for mini DH bike that has nothing note worthy to say about it. glad your friend is enjoying his new bike that instantaneously made him a faster and more skilled rider. I have nothing against heavy bikes. I have a bunch of them mostly cause they are cheap. go to the classifieds ad you can see That overbuilt 6 and 7 inch bikes are a dime a dozen. Im not saying they are not fun, I have a blast on mine. But when I think about spending 2 grand on a mini dh frame my eyes begin to roll. once again lighter cheaper stronger bikes are out there but im glad your friend Is having fun thats all its about anyways
  • + 1
 They ride really nice. If someone rides one, I can imagine they're not going to be too phased by having to spend the amount you need to on smaller production run bikes. Weight is hype, yes lighter is better, but bikes are light enough anyway. It's not that big a deal. There's lots of overbuilt bikes in classifieds because they've not broken. My mate doesn't share any of your concerns, he has one and is super keen on it. Go buy a Giant buddy, can't go wrong there. Or ride a Canfield and see if it is worth ditching your worries for.
  • + 1
 Looks sweet. Geo numbers setup as a 26" would be nice.
  • + 1
 I would sell my current bike to buy that one.
  • + 2
 Nice gloves :-)
  • + 1
 I had an 06
  • + 1
 Gimme now!
  • + 1
 Bike! Sex!
  • + 1
 I like it! A lot!!!
  • - 2
 so shit!!!
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